#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Living In Thailand Forum >  >  > Health, Fitness and Hospitals in Thailand >  >  Everything low carb diet

## Hampsha

Have you tried this diet? Seems to be some potential benefits.



Here are a couple of videos about research related to the Low Carbohydrate diet / Ketogenic diet.

Researchers in Canada have done research on mice that seems to show that LC prevents cancer in mice.






An audio conversation with a different researcher who found that a ketogenic diet has some benefits for animals suffering from epileptic siezures.

----------


## sabang

Carbohydrates are such a big part of our diet because it is the cheapest way to keep our collective bellies full, and keep our worker bees dutifully producing- nothing to do with optimal nutrition. We indeed have way too many carb's in our diet, we also mix them quite regularly in the same meal, which is a no-no (eg go to the local macca's, and have a value meal with fries _and_ bread. The burger bun has added sugar too, as does the coke you wash it down with). The body has to raise it's acidity level to digest it all. Result- diabetes, obesity, cancer, joint problems etc.

The low carb diet is a bit of a misnomer in one respect, because it doesn't get to source. The real thing is to emphasize an alkaline or low acidity diet- which of necessity means 'low carbs' compared to the standard diet. Most of us grew up blaming animal fat for obesity- notice the obsession with low fat meats etc in the west. Actually carbs are much more to blame for this epidemic.

Pretty good website here to incorporate a set of 'principles' in your diet. Incorporate them in full though, and you'll be eating like a cross between Gandhi and a rabbit.

pH Miracle: Alkaline Health, Diet, and Nutritional Supplements like greens drink and water ionizers for weight loss, diabetes, cancer, and improved health.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

These friggin experts change there mind by the day on what is good for the body.

Everyone is different. If you have shit genes you will die young regardless

----------


## sabang

> These friggin experts change there mind by the day on what is good for the body.


It sure doesn't help that the 'food pyramid' we were brought up with was a fraud, foisted on schools by the big food combines like Nabisco etc. The new 'plate' thing is a fraud too, albeit less so. Then again, 'Big Food' has to keep untold millions of worker bees sustained and producing- a long way from their sources of nutrition, cheaply, and of course make money doing it. Our diets changed with industrialisation and the vast rural/ urban population shifts that were entailed, plus of course refrigeration. Neither does it help with these fad diets, like Atkins.

But there are simple truths attached to nutrition and ones physiology that are not fads, and have mostly been around a long time- even if people don't actually know why these 'truisms' exist. Things like 'eat your veges', balanced diet, and don't have too many sweet things.

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> But there are simple truths attached to nutrition and ones physiology that are not fads, and have mostly been around a long time- even if people don't actually know why these 'truisms' exist. Things like 'eat your veges', balanced diet, and don't have too many sweet things.


I've been saying it for years (though, not practising it sadly) that the best food for us is dead animal and dead vegetable. Anything that comes from a 'manufacturer' is shit.

On a similar note, I was reading about a detox diet and it seemed like a good idea. Fuck, I'm hungry and could murder a cheese sarnie.  :Sad:

----------


## Hampsha

From that site Sabang...

"Dr. Robert O. Young's New Biology, most simply stated, is that the over-acidification of the body is the single underlying cause of all disease. 

In contrast, the old biology, based on the work of Louis Pasteur in the late 1800s, stems from the idea that disease comes from germs which invade the body from the outside. Dr. Young has found that when the body is in healthy alkaline balance, germs are unable to get a foothold. 


*Think of Your Body as a Fish Tank.*

Think of the importance of maintaining the integrity of the internal fluids of the body that we "swim" in daily. 

Imagine the fish in this tank are your cells and organ systems bathed in fluids, which transport food and remove wastes. Now imagine we back up a car and put the tailpipe up against the air intake filter that supplies the oxygen for the water in the tank instead of a quality water machine. The water becomes filled with carbon monoxide, lowering the alkaline pH, creating an acidic pH environment, and threatening the health of the "fish," your cells and organs. 

What if we throw in too much food or the wrong kind of food (acid-producing food like *dairy*, sugar, and *animal protein*) and the fish are unable to consume or digest it all, and it starts to decompose and putrefy? Toxic acid waste and chemicals build up as the food breaks down, creating more acidic byproducts, altering the optimum alkaline pH of the water.

Basically, this is a small example of what we may be doing to our internal fluids every day. We are fouling them with pollution, smoking, drugs, excessive intake of food, over-consumption of acid-forming foods, and any number of transgressions which compromise the delicate balance of our internal alkaline fluids. "

Some of their foods seem towards the LC area if not in it.


It's an interesting thing to consider. It's defintely not in the mainstream media. The fishbowl idea catches your attention if ever raised fish. Water quality in a bowl is such a big issue. Some might think you just put the fish in the water and they'll live foerver.


I've always thought the body to be like either a river or canal. If you move the river water is fairly clean and if you don't it turns green. Water is important as is avoiding toxins. 

-------------------------

On a different topic but connected to general health, I watched a low carb video by a woman who was an athlete in the past and was heavy then. Now's she's thin and keeps her weight off only by watching her carbs and food intake. One thing she brought up was the idea that running is never done in nature for fun. It's only done to escape preditors or to catch food. The body knows this. The same goes for excessive exertion. it's just not normal. When this happens your body kicks in with hunger. Lately I hear more and more that exercise just makes you hungry. No doubt that some is needed in our chair-bound work world but excessive exercise might not be a solution.

----------


## Hampsha

"Of course, everybody is different - but most of us should aim to eat 75-80% alkaline foods and a maximum of 20-25% acid forming foods."



Here are just a few from each type of food. They definitely don't want people to eat fats and proteins from animals.


Alkaline foods:

*VEGETABLES*
Asparagus
Artichokes
Cabbage
Lettuce
Onion
Cauliflower
Radish
Swede
Lambs Lettuce
Peas
Courgette
Red Cabbage
Leeks
Watercress
Spinach
Turnip
Chives
Carrot
Green Beans
Beetroot
Garlic
Celery
Grases (wheat, straw, barley, dog, kamut, etc.) Cucumber
Brocco



Acidic Foods
*MEATS*
Pork
Lamb
Beef
Chicken
Turkey
Custaceans
Other Seafood (apart from occasional oily fish such as salmon)


A link to the page from where this comes.
http://www.phmiracleliving.com/t-approach.aspx

----------


## ceburat

> "Of course, everybody is different - but most of us should aim to eat 75-80% alkaline foods and a maximum of 20-25% acid forming foods."
> 
> 
> 
> Here are just a few from each type of food. They definitely don't want people to eat fats and proteins from animals.
> 
> 
> Alkaline foods:
> 
> ...



I am diabetic and have heart problems.  I am on a diet very much like this one and for the first time in my life I am actually loosing weight.  I went to the link and copied the list of foods. My wife who is as bad as my diabetes doctor wants to review the list and compare it to what I eat. LOL I think I am in trouble.  On the Acid Foods side of the list I eat a lot of Fruits and Seeds & nuts.  As my wife was reading the list she said to me, "No more cashew nuts for you." This is a great thread. More of us should take it more seriously.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> Dr. Young has found that when the body is in healthy alkaline balance, germs are unable to get a foothold.


Bollocks, if you dont get infections then your body will not build up any resistance

you are as good as your genes.

look at all the poor little kids who have never left the hospital with leukaemia and all sorts

----------


## sabaii sabaii

if your parents lived to a grand age, then you have a good chance of doing so too.

On the other hand if both parents died young, then you might as well live life to the max

----------


## sabaii sabaii

Sorry to put a dampener on the thread, sorry to read of your plight too Ceburat, i wish you well

All of this is easy for me to say because i am in good health. 

Ignore me ok and enjoy the thread

----------


## Hampsha

An interesting story about a guy who seriously changed his fat fat self into incredible health. 

Before



After


The link to the story and pics

The Unconquerable Dave | Mark's Daily Apple

----------


## sabang

For the 'casual' health conscious like myself, heres three simple rules that will make a difference-
1- Eliminate added sugar from your diet, as far as possible. Refined sugar is nothing but an insidious, addictive, low grade poison. If you've got kids, try and keep them from becoming addicted. If you live in Thailand, Lord help ya.
2- Only one complex carb per meal. That means Rice *Or* noodles with Asian, spuds *Or* bread *Or* pasta with western food. Remember that bloated feeling, after a few pints and all that, off to the local Ali's for a madras, a vindaloo (with spuds), some tandoori- with pilau rice and nan bread, of course. Start it off with an aloo gobi too (spuds). Remember that bloated, slightly bilious feeling feeling afterwards? If your digestive system could speak to you, you sure wouldn't enjoy it.
3- Veges,veges, veges. As your body weans itself off it's sugar addiction, you will probably find yourself enjoying veg more. I did anyway. There is nothing healthier than raw fresh veges.

Don't stress out though, trying to follow these rules to the letter. Thats another big killer.  :Smile:

----------


## Hampsha

A great video from the early 80s on sugar in our diet. Lots of interesting facts which I never seemed to hear of way back when. It's just amazing that this story didn't get more attention. For those interested this flash back won't be a waste of time. I guess this is early 80s but sometimes it looks earlier. Very clear video from that time.


part 1 of 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OcH9K_RvYk
part 2 of 6


...part 3 of 6


part 4 of 6


part 5 of 6


part 6 of 6

----------


## Hampsha

A few more...






Another health guy who believes in Low carb





A long University of California video on the problem of fructose/sugar. At one point in the clip, the scientist in this claims giving sugar to your kid is as bad as giving them alcohol in terms of liver damage. He also labels sugar as a toxin which he explains through science in his presentation.





The final clip is the same guy in the first clip giving a talk at Google, Inc. Some odd facts that come up in this one which caught my attention were that in the 1960s the Japanese were consuming the same amount of sugar in the 1960s as Americans were in the 1860s. That isn't the case today. Another note was that Japanese women in Japan have something like a 2% breast cancer rate yet the rate for Japanese women who live in the states is more like 22%.  Really the whole video is enlightening  if you are new to the issue of low carb eating verses the typical carb diets most people eat.

----------


## Bruno

good thread this...

I am very astute at what I feed my body. I simply see food as a source of fuel to get me through the day. I do have the odd sugar hit now and then, but most of the time I simply waltz past dunkin doughnuts without a second glance...

----------


## Bruno

> On the Acid Foods side of the list I eat a lot of Fruits and Seeds & nuts. As my wife was reading the list she said to me, "No more cashew nuts for you


Sorry for asking ceburat, but it was my understanding that fruits and nuts, and especially seeds, were good for you?

As long as these are the plain, unsalted variety of course  ::chitown:: 

I think we could all use a little help sometime when it comes to our diets. So just as an example to throw up here I will break down what I ate throughout the day:

7am: Oats with semi-skimmed milk with a banana for breakfast. A teaspoon of honey for flavouring on top 
10am: two pieces of wholewheat toast with marmalade
10.15am: cup of tea
1pm: wholewheat tuna/salad sandwhich and a strawberry yogurt
4pm: a protein shake
5:30pm: salmon, broccoli, and new potatoes 
8pm: cup of tea 

This is an average days food intake for me. To be fair, I should of replaced the two pieces of toast with some fruit, but hey, I never said I was perfect.

----------


## BigRed

^ I take it you don't agree with anything this thread is about then?

----------


## Hampsha

Yep. Thread has different ideas going in it. Readers should figure it out. Bruno, you diet looks pretty go from my standpoint. I've never been able to eat that well. I don't think Low Carb is the solution for all. It just seems to work well for some people. Others are perfectly fit on other diets. Whatever you can live with and whatever works for you is my view. 

I do feel that the sugar/fructose that is pumped into everything to make things sweeter is a worldwide problem no matter what diet you are on. It's ruining kids health. There is definitely something wrong these days when so many people are fat and diabetic. 



On the sidelines, somewhere in that Sugar Trap movie they show the amount of sugar in common products in the US at that time. I grew up on this crap and I am shocked that this info didn't get out..

From the movie...

Lucky Charms cereal  - 54% sugar
Hershey's Chocolate bar - 51%
Cherry Flavored Jello - 82%
Shake and Bake Barbecue mix - 50%

The most shocking was

CoffeeMate Non-Dairy Creamer - 65% sugar!


Just didn't think there was that much in average products.

----------


## rickschoppers

> For the 'casual' health conscious like myself, heres three simple rules that will make a difference-
> 1- Eliminate added sugar from your diet, as far as possible. Refined sugar is nothing but an insidious, addictive, low grade poison. If you've got kids, try and keep them from becoming addicted. If you live in Thailand, Lord help ya.
> 2- Only one complex carb per meal. That means Rice *Or* noodles with Asian, spuds *Or* bread *Or* pasta with western food. Remember that bloated feeling, after a few pints and all that, off to the local Ali's for a madras, a vindaloo (with spuds), some tandoori- with pilau rice and nan bread, of course. Start it off with an aloo gobi too (spuds). Remember that bloated, slightly bilious feeling feeling afterwards? If your digestive system could speak to you, you sure wouldn't enjoy it.
> 3- Veges,veges, veges. As your body weans itself off it's sugar addiction, you will probably find yourself enjoying veg more. I did anyway. There is nothing healthier than raw fresh veges.
> 
> Don't stress out though, trying to follow these rules to the letter. Thats another big killer.


Sound advice Sabang. You have outlined a pretty good diet to not only lose weight, but it is also pretty good for most of the disease states. I try not to eat any sugar, but sometimes allow myself to indulge.
Cutting out carbs will also help you loose weight. It is similar to the old Adkin's Diet or the newer South Beach Diet. I have tried them all , but found that keeping  my sugar intake low along with few carbs, other than rice, along with eating lots of fruits and veges works the best. Too much time spent on figuring out all these diets is not healthy as you stated and better to see what works for you. Your body is the best barometer for what foods to eat, and I am not talking about junk food.

----------


## Bruno

> CoffeeMate Non-Dairy Creamer - 65% sugar!





> CoffeeMate Non-Dairy Creamer - 65% sugar!


Bloody hell! those things should come with a health warning with a picture of some poor blokes rotting teeth or massive gut on the side of the packet. 

5 years down the line, somewhere, somehow, all this will have to be addressed at the source (the manufactures) because, as Hampsha pointed out, the amount of diabetics and obese out and what their doing to the health care systems in their respected countries is nothing short of self inflicted suicide...

I personally can't stand the sight of an obese person. I think they are just a bunch of lazy B******* who need to lace up their shoes and do a few laps once in a while.

----------


## Bruno



----------


## natalie8

I only saw this thread for the first time now.




> The low carb diet is a bit of a misnomer in one respect, because it doesn't get to source. The real thing is to emphasize an alkaline or low acidity diet- which of necessity means 'low carbs' compared to the standard diet. Most of us grew up blaming animal fat for obesity- notice the obsession with low fat meats etc in the west. Actually carbs are much more to blame for this epidemic.


My view exactly. I would have posted this if you hadn't. there is tons of info on line regarding how damaging sugar is, in its processed forms. It's a serious addiction for many people too and very difficult to get off of if you don't have the education or the willpower to teach yourself.

Interesting that it's from a Canadian source. I guess the government is getting worried about the free aka tax funded system becoming overrun with cancer patients.

Every so often, you see things come up in Canada in regards to health. There has always been obesity and overweight in Canada, at least in Ottawa, where I'm from. It used to be that obese and overwight people could get all their health needs for free, thanks to taxpayers.

Things like walkers and wheelchairs to carry their huge bodies, ramps in their houses, free treatments, medications, surgeries until one day the government figured out that they are depleting the system.

So the gov't started all these get fit and eat right programs. I really can't say if they've worked, but hopefully there's been some progress. After obesity and overweight, the big disease of the day was diabetes.

Etc, etc. Cancer is big business and big money for the drug companies. This is unfortunately still the ruler in these situations. I was bashed by kingwilly on TFP's thread about his father having the flesh eating bacteria because I suggested that, *along with his medications*,  he drinks a lot of water, avoids sugar, and uses manuka honey.

All that KW saw was the manuka honey and he attacked me because it's not something that most doctors would recommend. This is to go along with what Marmite said about eating what nature gives us.




> I've been saying it for years (though, not practising it sadly) that the best food for us is dead animal and dead vegetable. Anything that comes from a 'manufacturer' is shit.  On a similar note, I was reading about a detox diet and it seemed like a good idea.


I tend to do a detox about every three months. It's difficult and challenging, but well worth it.

----------


## DrAndy

xxxxx




> *Do carbohydrates make you fat?*
> 
> 
> Eating too much will lead to weight gain, regardless of what foods you get your energy from. Yet while low carb diets have had much publicity, gram for gram carbohydrates contain less calories than fat, protein and alcohol:1g carbohydrate contains 3.75 calories.1g protein contains 4 calories.1g fat contains 9 calories.1g alcohol contains 7 calories.Sugar and starch are found in both healthy and 'unhealthy' foods, so the type of carbohydrates you eat is important for your wellbeing.Many foods high in sugar (cakes, pastries, chocolate) are also high in fat or prepared with fat (chips, roast potatoes, sandwiches).Starchy foods, such as wholegrain bread, pasta etc, are rich in fibre, which is essential for digestive health and helps control appetite so you don't feel hungry


the last bit is important, eating those complex carbohydrates is good for you, whilst the simple carbs are just pure energy without any benefit (in our society)

----------


## Humbert

Life without pasta? Unimaginable.

----------


## hanswurst

low carb is in my opinion the most effective diet form to burn serious fat and i have more than 8years experience in bodybuilding and nutrition.
its just very difficult to follow in thailand as they put in everything sugar here and there are no low-carb products in thailand.

----------


## rickschoppers

^
Just eat more veges and fruit along with cutting back on any carbs. I find that food in the US has much more sugar than what the Thais can add. I do like to cut the carbs and keep all sugar to a minimum but do eat my lady's food and still am able to lose weight.
Oh yeah, cut out the beer which is probably the hardest thing to do in Thailand.

----------


## Hampsha

Rick, just curious about rice, do you eat a lot of it? 


Even though I started this thread I have yet to commit to LC. I know it works in terms of weightloss but I have yet to do it for more than three months. The most I've lost is about 10 kilos. In general while on it, I feel calmer and have more willpower. I drink loads of water while on it which is a good thing too. I eat much more green veggies on it than I would eating Thai or western foods. I can say that LC got me off coffees with sugar. I choose coffee without sugar no matter what diet I eat these days.

----------


## Jesus Jones

All you need is a good intake of EFAs, zinc and plenty of probiotics.  These diets are bollocks and more often than not the subject tends to put more weight on at a later date.

Exercise

----------


## rickschoppers

^^
My thinking is that the rice in Thailand is a "good" carb and the bad ones consist of bread, pizza and pasta. I love pasta, so that was the hardest to quit or cut back. I think eating rice every day is not a bad thing. I used to have a personal friend that was a body builder and trainer of international lifters and his diet consisted of chicken and rice with plenty of water. If you have lost 10 kilos, that is a decent loss. I would continue since the body will plateau for awhile and then you will lose more.

----------


## ENT

I  try to stick to mono dieting, where i will snack frequently on small portions of either veg, fruit, meat, fish or dairy products, little or no mixing.

Carbs best eaten separately from proteins.

Raw fruit, veges and nuts as opposed to cooked or preserved.
With my false teeth, nuts and some fruits and veges are a bit tough and uncomfortable to chew, but a blender works.

Little or no processed foods.
No fast foods, takeaways or SODA!!

Added vits a b c d e, esp c., lots of water.

Stick to higher protein levels, always.

When necessary, I'll carb up with added vitc and water and steam through a high stress period of activity with loads of energy to spare, really feel good.

Plenty of time off .


Don't stick masochistically to the above regime.
Have the odd burger, ice cream or soda.
Have a drink of alcohol.
Mix a little sometimes.

Coffee is a great drug, so is tea or chocolate, use wisely.

Keep physically flexible, exercise lightly, daily
Keep mentally active and alert.

Try to see the humour in the whole shit scape you see.
Smile at others.

Laugh a lot.
Love all, it hurts sometimes, but worth it.
I'm a very fit, healthy and active pensioner with grand kids and that's been my diet for years
 :Smile:

----------


## rickschoppers

Not bad ENT. ::chitown::

----------


## ENT

^Thanks Ricks

It works well.
There are few other refinements to the system, it is twitchable.

For instance balanced p/h through balancing salt/sugar to water ratio at say;                                      1tspn salt to 1 flat tbspn sugar in 1 litre water,  Sipped frequently daily.

Alternatively,use lime/lemon juice or vit c (ascorbic acid) in water with glucose, or better yet, fructose, diabetes safe sugar.

The ascorbate may be more, or less alkaline or acid, (sodium or potassium) ascorbate.
Sugar is acid, salt alkaline.

Check and vary the daily mix you need by alternating alkaline(sodium) bases, as in salt or sodium ascorbate powder. only un-buffered ascorbate, no calcium, is best. Buffered is ok.

Use small quantities as indicated only.
3litres of above max daily.

You know it's working because of a heightened energy level and calm well being.
feels good and comfortable in every way.
Sort of nothing ,basic feeling.

No "high"s, so no lows.
Other things for that.

Balanced p/h, mobile, flexible physical and mental system
High protein, low carb low processed clean food
Vit C is key.

----------


## rickschoppers

If it works for you, that is the most important thing. Your overall nutrition plan looks sound and I may adopt a couple of your thoughts if that is OK.

----------


## Hampsha

I'm no die-hard Low-carb-or-nothing person. The best thing about LC is that by doing it you instantly get rid of all the processed foods. I can't see myself succeeding on Atkins or any specific diet longterm, so I would guess that I'll work my way into something that is generally more low carb and hopefully full of more old-fashioned home-cooked natural foods. Most of the meal foods we love were made long ago before the invention of all the additives and processing and long before sugar was so easy to come by. I guess I just would like to be eating more like in those days. It may be something like ENT says. I would like the occasional treat, too. For now, I am just finding my way. I've never been a devout believer in anything so it's going to take some time. I do believe that whether we choose to change or not often times the changes comes anyways.

----------


## ENT

EFAs  as pointed out by JJ above are essential for longevity.

Probiotics as in acidophilus yoghurt and cheeses and other fermented foods, all aid in processing our food intake without depleting vital digetive enezymes that we manufacture in the liver.

Acidophilus yoghurt is great for those who fart a lot, the result of undigested proteins fermenting in the large intestine.

Remedy.

Start consuming large quantities of said yoghurt daily (about a litre a day at one time,not little dribs), allowing the stuff to flush through your intestines to reach the larger intestine to an extent undigested.

Then the bioforms in the yoghurt get to work on the undigested proteins in the lower intestine, removing the gas source and reducing flatulence almost at once. Clean shit.

Quickly, you become fart free!

Halleluja!
 :Smile:

----------


## ENT

^ Ricks
Cool bro.

----------


## natalie8

> My thinking is that the rice in Thailand is a "good" carb and the bad ones consist of bread, pizza and pasta.


What you need to look at is hte glycemic index. Anything processed, like breads or pastas have a higher glycemic index. In regards to rice, Thai Jasmine rice has a very high glycemic index while basmati rice has a lower glycemic index. Brown rice has a lower glycemic index too.

ENT has given great pointers regarding mixing and taking probiotics. I don't think I've ever seen probiotics in Thailand, so the yougurt thing is good. This would have to be with plain unsweetened yogurt.

----------


## ENT

^ Yup.

----------


## ENT

Cook any probiotic and it doesn't work, same as yeasts and vitamin c

----------


## pkspirate

yes low carb works. i do it every couple of years for a few months to shed the cow now fat  :Smile:

----------


## rickschoppers

I am a big fan of yogurt as well. Lots of good stuff on this thread, thanks guys.

----------


## Hampsha

Just a clip about Bill Clinton eating a vegan diet. Might be interesting to some.

----------


## natalie8

Hampsha, I had heard about that. One ideology that I follow is the blood type diet. I'm O+ which is the oldest blood type and we should have high protein and avoid grains such as wheat and corn, and dairy. You see so many people with gluten and dairy sensitivities or allergies, and sure enough, they're type O.

Type O seems to be the most varied type, with a mix of meats such as beef and lamb, lots of fish and seafood, many fruits and veggies, and herbs and spices allowed.

Type A's should be vegetarian. I can't remember the rules for B, but AB is a happy balance.

----------


## Lorenzo

> Just a clip about Bill Clinton eating a vegan diet. Might be interesting to some.


Saw this show on CNN, was titled "The Last Heart Attack" and it was excellent. Have been following most of their recommendations for a month. Here are the books for that diet:



Have not bought into the no fish yet...

----------


## DrAndy

Most diets may work if you stick to them but most diets are not possible over long periods. Usually, someone who has lost weight will quickly regain it

so, for a normal lifestyle, try to cut down on sugars and fats, eat plenty of veggies and fruits

if you calorie intake is less than you burn, then you will stay slim

whatever you eat

----------


## Hampsha

> I'm O+ which is the oldest blood type and we should have high protein and avoid grains such as wheat and corn, and dairy.


I'm O+, too. I should try 100% wheat,corn and daiiry free for 6 months to see what happens. My biggest problem is the milk I put in coffee every morning. To give that up, I would have to give up the coffee.

----------


## Hampsha

Looks great, Lorenzo. One thing I have learned is if you can't cook, you will never succeed long-term. I can't cook! No matter LC or veggie, I am very limited. My mom was a great cook but growing up, I only learned to make sandwiches, hotdogs and hamburgers. I can also make Spaghetti. Pretty much everything I make is unhealthy. Someday, I would like to take a cooking course.

----------


## Lorenzo

^ I have been cooking for 25 years, better and better every year. Just like a diet .. small steps.. never too late to start. 

Had this Lentil soup tonight.  Threw in a few extra veggies AROY!!






The babe in this vid is a hottie  :Smile:

----------


## natalie8

Lorenzo, that looks really nice. I like your placemat too.  :Smile:  Hampsha, you shuold checl on the net for easy recipes or quick recipes. There are lots of things you could cook in the oven which are easy and healty. Things like roast beef, lamb, chicken, fish.

Also, you should invest in a nice grill pan. You can grill meats, fish and veggies on it.

Here's a good site for beginner cooks: Beginner Cook Recipes - Food.com

----------


## Hampsha

Thanks for the link Natalie. I like the look of that soup. It would take some time for me to build up a kitchen here in Thailand. As it is, I don't have access to the western or imported stuff. So starting off everything would have an Asian touch to it. Here on TD I've seen some great stuff in the food section. I know all veggie foods can be delicious without sugar at all. I've had my share here in there in life on occasion. I can't say I have ever really tried veggie food out here in Thailand though. I'm sure BKK and the other tourist areas has some. One thing I'd like to get away from is the rice.

----------


## natalie8

What you could do is get a nice, large, good name toaster oven. You could then make nice one dish meals in it. With all the nice fresh meats and veggies in Thailand, you could have a good variety. I know about the Asian slant on everything, but that's OK.

You could do Asian style dishes in it. If you like fish, you could put it in foil, add lemongrass, chili, garlic and lime and you're all set. You could also make nice salads with any veggies, really. Just add a bit of olice oil and apple cider vinegar. I'm pretty sure you can get that all over Thailand.

----------


## Lorenzo

> Lorenzo, that looks really nice. I like your placemat too.


lol

that placemat is over 20 years old, still has the old USSR borders

----------


## natalie8

:-D It's a keepsake, then.

----------


## DrAndy

^ probably quite low in calories too

----------


## Hampsha

> toaster oven.


I've got one. I have made decent pizza in it but never tried cooking a fish. I'll have to give that a try to see how it comes out.

----------


## elofmark

hI, is this possible if we eat sweet so we would say sweet, but if we talk about about sugar, ya it's sweet but creating a disease as well....

----------


## ENT

> hI, is this possible if we eat sweet so we would say sweet, but if we talk about about sugar, ya it's sweet but creating a disease as well....



Best sugar you can eat is fructose.

Fructose:
 It's fruit sugar, found in all fruits and honey.

It is a diabetic friendly sugar.

Totally insulin digestible!

WAKE UP!!!!!
 :tieme:

----------


## Hampsha

ENT did you watch this? It's all about Fructose. This guy definitely doesn't agree with you.

----------


## sabang

> Best sugar you can eat is fructose.


Fail. 

The sugars found naturally in fruits and vege's are fine. There are several natural sugars.
HFCS- High fructose corn syrup- is a killer, it's worse than added sucrose.

----------


## Takeovers

> The sugars found naturally in fruits and vege's are fine.


That unfortunately is not correct.

The fructose found in fruit and especially in honey is the same as in corn syrup. You cannot assume they work differently in the body. However I would agree you are less likely to get too much of it in natural products unless you consume a lot of honey.

----------


## sabang

> That unfortunately is not correct.


OK, be pedantic. The _quantities_ you get from the ingestion of natural foods are fine.
A can of Coke contains close to one tablespoon of HFCS. That is really, really bad.
Honey is not a substitute for sugar btw, neither is it a health food. It's just another sugar.

----------


## Takeovers

> OK, be pedantic.


OK, I was. :Smile: 




> The quantities you get from the ingestion of natural foods are fine.


My statement too, with the exception of honey. With honey you can easily get to problematic levels. Problematic for some, for many others not. But you don't know in which group you are.




> Honey is not a substitute for sugar


But some use it that way or recommend it as a "healthy" replacement for sugar.




> neither is it a health food. It's just another sugar.


Another sugar, containing a lot of fructose. Yet many see it as health food. And it may be in special cases, I believe.

----------


## BigRed

Fruits are full of sugar because they have been selectively bred that way and fruit juice is even worse, yet they are both promoted as a healthy option.

----------


## sabang

Most fruit juices have added sugar unfortunately.

----------


## ENT

> Originally Posted by ENT
> 
> Best sugar you can eat is fructose.
> 
> 
> Fail. 
> 
> The sugars found naturally in fruits and vege's are fine. There are several natural sugars.
> HFCS- High fructose corn syrup- is a killer, it's worse than added sucrose.


Wrong.

Depends how much you habitually use.
If you normally have a lot of added sugar in your diet, you'll get sick, same as too much carbs in any form.

Fructose is the main sugar of fruit.
It is the sugar in honey.

Eaten in those forms it is harmless.
Concentrated doses of any sugar, especially over-refined sugars, causes enzyme depletion, your liver has to overwork to cope.

You can safely burn off sugars through working it off as in physical exercises or any stressful action, study, etc.

Fructose stands pretty much along with glucose, lactose and maltose in energy value, but does not screw up the insulin level in the body, esp as in the case of sucrose.
Recommended for diabetics.

----------


## Takeovers

> Recommended for diabetics.


One of the many outdated myths about food and diets.


*Clues seen to how fructose may promote diabetes*

Reuters article

----------


## ENT

> ENT did you watch this? It's all about Fructose. This guy definitely doesn't agree with you.


The guy is talking horse shit.

The main reason Asians screw up on Western high refined carb and dairy products is because they do not usually have a gene necessary to assimilate the stuff.
Same as Pacifica people.

Result is obesity and diabetes.

Japs eat fruit, nothing harmful in the stuff, lots of fructose.

S American populations who originally cultivated corn ended up with caries, lots, their teeth were shot full of holes from high acid content corn starch/sugars.

Sure, corn syrup is high in sucrose and fructose, both having an acid effect.

Bio-engineered corn syrup as an additive in processed foods is difficult to digest and assimilate for anyone.

Sugar cane, on the other hand is high in sucrose and eaten raw does not produce caries.

Unprocessed, raw food is normally ok.
The complex chemical changes it undergoes in processing can cause food to become toxic.

Eat fresh, natural, organic raw foods and you'll be fine.

----------


## Hampsha

Believing in something is better than not. Personally, you haven't convinced me, but I think faith and commitment leads down many roads towards good health. It's the people like me who are non-believers and un-commited in their actions who will truly suffer bad health.

Anyways, if you are interested in other info/ opinions on Lustig. He's not against all fruit by the way.

Happy Healthy Long Life: Dr. Robert H. Lustig and the Bitter Truth About Sugar - It's the Driving Force Behind Obesity, Type-2 Diabetes, Hypertension, Small Dense LDL Cholesterol and the List Goes On. What's the Cure?

Robert H. Lustig, MD Biography / UCSF Center for Obesity Assessment, Study&Treatment (COAST)

----------


## ENT

^A non believer?
How dare you!

Welcome to the club mate.

I don't believe anything either.   :Smile: 

Faith or trust in something is a different issue, though.

Confidence in the effect of some course of action or another is necessary just to get results.
Such confidence is more than belief, it is based on reason.

Belief is for those who do not know.

Good luck mate.

----------


## Hampsha

Thanks, ENT. Same to you.

----------


## DrAndy

it is only a killer if you eat too much and you are a fat bastard

----------


## Hampsha

Another low carb clip (from another thread) Nothing really new in this but it might be interesting to some.

----------


## Hampsha

Another Dr on the topic. Mostly LCHF -Low Carb High Fat

----------


## Hampsha

Another one...

----------


## DrAndy

load of bollox

just a couple of quacks trying to jump on the bandwagon

----------


## FarangRed

Exactly my sentiment^ you really need to get of your arse and burn them carbs off. a good ride on the bike in the morning work up a good sweat and detox at the same time

----------


## Takeovers

I would like to clarify my personal positon a bit. I don't talk about extreme diets like the low carb Atkin Diet where carbs are extremely reduced. 

Any long term healthy diet needs to be balanced between fat, protein and carbs. That balance has been shifted in the direction of carbs by the anti-fat fad. It should be shifted back a little in the direction of fat.

----------


## DrAndy

^ exercise is good, everyone needs it to be healthy

being fit is an essential to a healthy life

but that has little or nothing to do with losing weight, unless you combine your exercise with a good diet, a diet that does not starve you but contains a reasonable balance of all the minerals and vitamins necessary

cutting out crap food, and also reducing your fat and sugar intake will help you maintain a proper weight, or even let you lose some (hopefully, even if you don't lose a lot of weight, the fat you have will be replaced by muscle)

----------


## livelife

> These friggin experts change there mind by the day on what is good for the body.
> 
> Everyone is different. If you have shit genes you will die young regardless


To certain degree, yes. For example if you were born with a life altering medical condition. Aside from that, you are in complete control of your health. The diseases that plague the world has virtually nothing to do with genetics but rather lifestyle. 

In term's of low carb diets. They are arguably the most effective for weight loss. They also are fantastic options for people with metabolic syndrome. 

However, there is nothing wrong with carbs providing you are keeping your intake within a reasonable range. I really don't think the macronutrient content matters. What matters is eating real food, staying active, minimizing stress and for the most part just being happy and enjoying life. That plays alot more of a role then people think. 

When I say real food, I mean food that wasnt manufactured in a lab, isnt processed junk thats loaded with a ton of additives. Thailand for the most part does alot of things VERY well when it comes to diet. They eat alot of real food, the ones I know don't wake up and feed their kids pop tarts and cocoa puffs. They feed them something like "johk gai" which is like rice porridge but with chicken and often times a couple of eggs. Not ideal but far better than what most people would get back in the West. Thai's also eat alot of vegetables, fruit and they aren't afraid to eat organ meats such as liver. Organ meats believe it or not are very nutrient dense foods, far more nutritious than the muscle meats we so commonly eat in the West. 

The problem with Thai food is they cook with garbage vegetable oils and they do eat alot of sugar, alot of it from unnatural sources.

Wow, I kind of went off-topic there.  :Sorry1:

----------


## Hampsha

Thai food is closer to unprocessed food. They do like Knorr tossed in all their cooking. The food has got to be loaded with chemicals from stuff like knorr. MSG is big in some Thai food, too.






If you cook it yourself, you can control it. You get a lot of other stuff in food at shops like whatever has been burnt to the pan that happens to come off during your meal. Plus there are pesticides and other things that get in your food every once in a while: bugs, dust, pesticides?, rat's mess from the night before while they prowled the closed shop. Cooking yourself is much more guaranteed but if you live up in the countryside you might get a gust of wind that throws some dust into your creation.

----------


## livelife

yeah thats true. Thai's love to add some artificial flavourings into some of their food. MSG being one of them. They key is to really not eat at restaurants. Doesn't matter where in the world you are. 

Cook at home, its healthier and cheaper.

----------


## livelife

> Most diets may work if you stick to them but most diets are not possible over long periods. Usually, someone who has lost weight will quickly regain it
> 
> so, for a normal lifestyle, try to cut down on sugars and fats, eat plenty of veggies and fruits
> 
> if you calorie intake is less than you burn, then you will stay slim
> 
> whatever you eat


Came across this now. Good post. 

Most diet's, a huge majority of them in fact are not sustainable. The one's who place an emphasis on calorie counting/restriction you should run the other way. Calories do a play a role in body weight regulation but a very minor one. The key is to eat nutritionally dense food, and avoid processed food along with limiting sugar intake.

Fat is completely fine though providing it is fat from natural sources as opposed to the heaps of trans fats people consume from many of the foods we eat today.

----------


## Hampsha



----------


## Hampsha

Some more...









The following link is to Mark's Daily apple and his 'Primal Blueprint' for living which is based on the way he believes our ancestors lived.

The Primal Blueprint | Mark's Daily Apple


It's pretty sensible and simple.

----------


## Hampsha

The videos are on youtube. If youtube is slow, there's not much you can do about it but wait. The link goes to Mark'sDailyApple, a website. It doesn't have videos. Once in a while the site's down for maintenance. It could be that it's getting too many hits and the server is overloaded or something like that, too.

----------


## Hampsha

Just something related. Watch out for those colas!


*39g                                         65g                                       108g*


Some more breakdowns of sugar in foods at this link. You'll have to click on the food type below the picture.
Sugar Stacks - How Much Sugar Is in That?




Big gulp 32 oz (28 oz coke 4 oz ice)  =  91 grams sugar
Big gulp 44 oz (38 oz coke 6 oz ice)  = 128 grams sugar



Yikes! Sugar death!

----------


## Imminent

Here's a page on 'The man who ate 25 eggs a day' for 15 years. 

Health Correlator: The man who ate 25 eggs per day: What does this case really tell us?

And here's the New England Journal of Medicine's actual report and research on the man. There's no error in the link it just shows that for whatever reason. It takes you to the New England Journal of Medicine site.


MMS: Error

Guess eggs aren't so bad for you.

----------


## AntRobertson

> Fat is completely fine though providing it is fat from natural sources as opposed to the heaps of trans fats people consume from many of the foods we eat today.


Bang on. Fats are an essential part of a healthy diet, just so long as they're the right type.

----------


## Smug Farang Bore

Some interesting stuff on this thread.

About one third of the month I eat well, swim and go to the gym.

Err it's the other two thirds are well mmm utter shite. Beer, bad diet and bad sleep patterns. :mid:

----------


## barbaro

^^^^^^^

Hampsha,

I downlaoded the book on "why people are fat" or something like that by Taubes and will be reading it soon.

I'm reading it, not because of 40 lbs. over-weight, but because I'm interested in this topic.

Thanks for the thread and posts.

----------


## alitongkat

> Some interesting stuff on this thread.
> 
> About one third of the month I eat well, swim and go to the gym.
> 
> Err it's *the other two thirds are well mmm utter shite*. Beer, bad diet and bad sleep patterns.


typical for parasite infection...

----------


## Smug Farang Bore

What the good third or the bad?

----------


## alitongkat

parasites live in cycles, worst probably breeding, have it tested

----------


## Smug Farang Bore

Test what?

Just done my blood pressure - 137/84



 ::chitown::

----------


## Imminent

Here's a long clip (basically 6 hours) which has some really interesting stuff on healthy eating. So many interesting ideas in this.

----------


## ENT

> Test what?
> 
> Just done my blood pressure - 137/84


Several blood and stool tests will let you know.

----------


## Anatidaephobia

Ketogenic diet works very well - it's easy to implement, and easy to maintain.

I lost 45 lbs in 60-70 days 3 years ago using a ketogenic diet.

It's a very effective means to lose pure fat in a good amount time.

----------


## Anatidaephobia

> parasites live in cycles, worst probably breeding, have it tested


Man, he doesn't give up on his fluoride crapping parasites.

----------


## ENT

Any no-carb diet works well, eat all the meat and cheese and eggs you like. Added porridge and nuts, lentils etc are not carb free, but contribute essential vitamins and minerals.

----------


## Anatidaephobia

^ He's an expert on anything and everything, isn't he?

----------


## alitongkat

possible, though not on diets...  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## Anatidaephobia

How would you know, considering all your statements are questionable and unsupported.

----------


## Imminent

A blogger's site with some videos on health of the body and mind. It also includes a short story on the blogger himself who lost a load on Paleo dieting.

Paleo Man

----------


## Anatidaephobia

This makes sense. Paleos were thin and ripped.

They also died around their late 20s.

:-)

----------


## FlyFree

I never had a problem with health, weight or energy. Until I came to Thailand and my diet had to change.

Not being interested in myself but preferring to explore what's 'out there', I just went with what I enjoyed. That was mostly fatty red meat, full cream dairy, some white bread (not much) and a bit of spuds or, once in a while, rice. Veggies rarely. Fruit even rarer. Pies, btw, are made with meat.

Lots and lots of coffee.

I watched the explosion of 'the next thing that's bad for you, buy our low-fat processed crap' with irritation. Never converted to any of it, it tastes like shit. Add to that my belief that education doesn't equal intelligence, my suspicion that 'studies' were rigged to support corp sales and my knowledge that my body will tell me if I'm fucking up.

Fortunately I have little respect for 90% of scientists and medical clowns' intelligence. This has been borne out by too many years experience.

Maybe it's the carbs. Maybe that's why everybody seems so fuckin dumb these days.



Anyways. My daughter has serious health and weight problems and I need opinions of people who have scratched around in the dietary/health world for awhile before I advise her to drop all the low-fat healthy poisons she's been sold on by these low-lifes out to make a buck.


Before I came across this HFLC stuff I've always said if we want to eat correctly it's pretty simple; look at what your body has evolved with. Before agriculture.


What do you think of this character. At least what he has is experience on his side? He's not a 20/30's something snot-nosed wannabe.

Unfortunately it's a long vid. Watch or not, I'd still appreciate your opinion.

There seems to be some movement in this direction, but movements gave us carbs, real brain food  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 




Dr. Miller is professor of surgery, cardiothoracic division, Univ. Washington.

----------


## DrAndy

> Anyways. My daughter has serious health and weight problems and I need opinions of people who have scratched around in the dietary/health world for awhile before I advise her to drop all the low-fat healthy poisons she's been sold on by these low-lifes out to make a buck.   Before I came across this HFLC stuff I've always said if we want to eat correctly it's pretty simple; look at what your body has evolved with. Before agriculture.


that guy is just another lowlife out to make a buck, don't be fooled by the suit

and yes, don't buy special low fat products as half of them are rubbish

just eat good fresh food, lots of fresh veggies, fruits, good quality rice (brown is best), good bread, fresh fish, meat on occasion 

as you said, our body was designed a long time before we became civilised, so we are omnivorous, but meat was not an everyday thing

if overweight, try to eat less fat and cut right down on sugars, esp processed ones

----------


## FlyFree

> but meat was not an everyday thing
> 
> if overweight, try to eat less fat
> 
> that guy is just another lowlife out to make a buck, don't be fooled by the suit


"Dr. Miller is professor of surgery, cardiothoracic division, Univ. Washington."

Perhaps. But then, his reasoning sounds more thoughtful, not just mere regurgitation of conventional 'wisdom'.  :Smile: 

Good point about not being an everyday thing. However, when available it would have been eat all you can as quick as possible. Fat I disagree with, including the whole cholesterol issue. Veggies are irrelevant IMHO. Mostly available since agriculture.

I have not ever been following any of this debate though I am aware of most of it in broad terms. But the last few days I've come across what seems to be a turnaround on the whole fat/cholesterol/arteries/heart issue. From various quarters, respected by the community, if not by me....

I must say though, that intuitively the statements people make about fat 'clogging up your arteries' makes me grin. Carb brains?

----------


## FlyFree

From what I gather on a quick search the whole saturated fats dogma is rooted in a Keys study, followed by US Congress making their usual sage decisions based on it, followed by an obesity explosion.

Problem is, Keys appears to have dropped all but 6 countries out of data collected from 22 countries to reach his conclusion. If so, he's a low-life.







And thus started the fat-is-bad ideology.

----------


## natalie8

> Anyways. My daughter has serious health and weight problems and I need opinions of people who have scratched around in the dietary/health world for awhile before I advise her to drop all the low-fat healthy poisons she's been sold on by these low-lifes out to make a buck.


How old is your daughter? You mentioned low fat and cholesterol. I'll tackle one thing at a time and add others. One thing that I have cut down on a lot is gluten, mainly wheat and rye products. If you or she live in Thailand, this is easy to do. May people can't process gluten, and gluten is a modern day ingredient. In the old days, bread was whole grain, but with all the processing now, it's a completely different entity.

Low fat foods are another bone of contention. If fat is removed from a food, it needs to be replaced with something else to give the product flavour and to make it satisfying. I'll use yogurt as an example. When the fat is removed or reduced, it is usually replaced with sugar or other sweeteners. Your body needs fat for energy and to feel satisfied.

High fructose corn syrup and artificial sweeteners are a huge danger to us too and they actually make you gain fat because they turn off the receptors in the liver that say we are satisfied. Avoid them like the plague.

If your daughter likes chocolate (what girl or woman doesn't?), get her to switch to dark chocolate. Yes, it still has sugar, but it has less of it and it has lots of antioxidants.

You mentioned cholesterol. I saw an episode of Dr. Oz last week where he had two guests on his show proving that the opposite is true. Here's the link: 



The other info can be found on line too. I hope this helps.

----------


## FlyFree

Thanks Natalie, but she's been on that type of bandwagon for many years. Nothing helps.

What I'm specifically interested in is if anyone has done more research than the precious little I've done on the subject of high fat low carb diet, and what seems to be now being accepted by many that cholesterol is not the problem in heart disease.

She has been living in a low fat 'healthy' diet environment for many years, as her stepfather has had a few bypasses, all which helped zilch. He passed away a couple of months ago from heart failure.

----------


## natalie8

Oh! I knew I was forgetting something. Has she been tested for food allergies or intolerances? That could have a big impact.

----------


## FlyFree

She's been tested for everything including whether she's swallowed the kitchen sink.

She's constantly ill, no energy, muscle pains, you name it she's got it.

mid twenties.


My personal opinion is her environment. The health-focused, can't eat anything semi paranoic environment.

And lack of fat.

----------


## FlyFree

A link to a transcript of the vid if anyone's interested to scan through it.

Enjoy Saturated Fats, They’re Good for You! by Donald W. Miller, Jr., MD

Dr. Miller is professor of surgery, cardiothoracic division, Univ. Washington.


I'm not trying to spam the thread, I'm just hoping for some info before I mess my daughters life up more than it already is.

----------


## BigRed

There's a wealth of information on low carb diets: 
Wheat Belly by William Davis MD is arguably the most extreme, then you move through the Paleo (Caveman) movement, Primal, see Mark Sissons and his web site Marks Daily Apple, to the more mainstream Atkins diet.

----------


## BigRed

This is a link to some RSS feeds that you can wade through and select the ones you like: Google Reader - "Health" via colin

This one might be a better format if you use google reader: 
http://www.google.com/reader/public/...8/label/Health

----------


## DrAndy

> I must say though, that intuitively the statements people make about fat 'clogging up your arteries' makes me grin. Carb brains?


I don't think anybody has claimed it is fat that clogs peoples' arteries

Arterial plaque blocks them and the strategy is to avoid the build up of that plaque





> Plaque that accumulates on the inner walls of your arteries is made  from various substances that circulate in your blood. These include  calcium, fat, cholesterol,  cellular waste, and fibrin, a material involved in blood clotting. In  response to plaque buildup, cells in your artery walls multiply and  secrete additional substances that can worsen the state of clogged  arteries.
>      As plaque deposits grow, a condition called atherosclerosis results. This condition causes the arteries to narrow and harden.
>      Although experts don’t know for sure what starts atherosclerosis, the process seems to stem from damage to the arterial wall.

----------


## AntRobertson

The problem with all this diet stuff is that anybody can use Google to find some information/person/figure-head/talking-head that's going to say something that agrees with what they already thought.

Food is fuel for your body, that's it. Put in clean fuel and it functions more efficiently, don't and it won't. It's not rocket science. Pretty simple really.

----------


## DrAndy

Water is the best thing since sliced bread, according to this:

It is popular in Japan today to drink water  immediately after waking up every morning. Furthermore, scientific tests  have proven its value. We publish below a description of use of water  for our readers. For old and serious  diseases as well as modern illnesses the water treatment had been found  successful by a Japanese medical society as a 100% cure for the  following diseases:

 Headache, body ache, heart system,  arthritis, fast heart beat, epilepsy, excess fatness, bronchitis asthma,  TB, meningitis, kidney and urine diseases, vomiting, gastritis,  diarrhea, piles, diabetes, constipation, all eye diseases, womb, cancer  and menstrual disorders, ear nose and throat diseases.

 METHOD OF TREATMENT
 1. As you wake up in the morning before brushing teeth, drink 4 x 160ml glasses of water

 2. Brush and clean the mouth but do not eat or drink anything for 45 minute

 3.. After 45 minutes you may eat and drink as normal.

 4. After 15 minutes of breakfast, lunch and dinner do not eat or drink anything for 2 hours

 5. Those who are old or sick and are unable to drink 4 glasses of water  at the beginning may commence by taking little water and gradually  increase it to 4 glasses per day.

 6. The above method of treatment will cure diseases of the sick and others can enjoy a healthy life.

 The following list gives the number of days of treatment required to cure/control/reduce main diseases:
 1. High Blood Pressure (30 days)
 2. Gastric (10 days)
 3. Diabetes (30 days)
 4. Constipation (10 days)
 5. Cancer (180 days)
 6. TB (90 days)
 7. Arthritis patients should follow the above treatment only for 3 days in the 1st week, and from 2nd week onwards – daily..

 This treatment method has no side effects, however at the commencement of treatment you may have to urinate a few times.
 It is better if we continue this and make this procedure as a routine  work in our life. Drink Water and Stay healthy and Active.

 This  makes sense .. The Chinese and Japanese drink hot tea with their meals  not cold water. Maybe it is time we adopt their drinking habit while  eating!!! Nothing to lose, everything to gain...

 For those who like to drink cold water, this article is applicable to you.
 It is nice to have a cup of cold drink after a meal. However, the cold  water will solidify the oily stuff that you have just consumed. It will  slow down the digestion.

 Once this 'sludge' reacts with the  acid, it will break down and be absorbed by the intestine faster than  the solid food. It will line the intestine.
 Very soon, this will turn into fats and lead to cancer. It is best to drink hot soup or warm water after a meal.

 A serious note about heart attacks:

 · Women should know that not every heart attack symptom is going to be the left arm hurting,
 · Be aware of intense pain in the jaw line.
 · You may never have the first chest pain during the course of a heart attack.
 · Nausea and intense sweating are also common symptoms.
 · 60% of people who have a heart attack while they are asleep do not wake up.
 · Pain in the jaw can wake you from a sound sleep. Let's be careful and  be aware. The more we know, the better chance we could survive...
 A  cardiologist says if everyone who gets this mail sends it to everyone  they know, you can be sure that we'll save at least one life.
 Please be a true friend and send this article to all your friends you care about.

 PLEASE DON'T IGNORE SHARE IT. THIS MIGHT SAVE SOMEONE'S LIFE.

----------


## FlyFree

And every body wonders why I keep saying education cannot instill intelligence. We truly have a carb brained population now.




Risks: More Red Meat, More Mortality
By NICHOLAS BAKALAR
Published: March 12, 2012


The analysis, published online Monday in Archives of Internal Medicine, used data from two studies that involved 121,342 men and women who filled out questionnaires about health and diet from 1980 through 2006. There were 23,926 deaths in the group, including 5,910 from cardiovascular disease and 9,464 from cancer.


http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/he...f=general&_r=0



Harvard, nogal.

Which of course immediately prompts our respected medical clowns to post such trash as this.





Now as in the Keys 'research' that fucked everything up for more than 50 years, it is patent bullshit, Harvard or not.

Associations drawn willy-nilly to support pre-conceived notions.


This says it best.

'Study' analysed.

Red meat & mortality & the usual bad science
Written by Zoë on March 13, 2012 - 110 Comments
Categories: Media comments, Research

Red meat & mortality & the usual bad science


And some truth.



Science, Pseudoscience, Nutritional Epidemiology, and Meat


But for many years to come all and sundry will be refering to the Harvard 'study'.

----------


## barbaro

I hope the OP's daughter can find out the _cause(s)_ of her condition.  

As for the low carb w/ high fat diet being good or bad, and saturated fat etc.,

We still see constant studies, doctors, and medical researchers that disagree.

It seems the jury is still out.  

I still find this topic very interesting.




> 1. As you wake up in the morning before brushing teeth, drink 4 x 160ml glasses of water


Dr. Andy, can you show me the link/source for this?

I am not challenging you, just curious.

Also, I usually drink at least 1.5 liters after waking up (slowly but steadily) over the course of 30 minutes, and I drink 5 liters of water per day.

----------


## Imminent

Here's a bit from the Wheatbelly doctor, William Davis. 





Not really 100% low carb.  The Gabriel Method leads to healthier eating which seems more low carb. It's not a diet but more about self-awareness and positiive thinking. Some of it might be a bit spiritual but for some of us that might be what is needed. If you do give it a chance, you'll probably find some value in it. It seems to be really connected with Aussies although the creator is an American.

----------


## Radius

Something from March. Two doctors with two different views on nutrition debate. 


UAB - Atkins Diet vs. China Study




> In this corner, the author of The China Study, a bestselling book on  nutrition which touts a plant-based, high carbohydrate/low protein diet  for overall health and cancer prevention. In the other corner, co-author  of New Atkins for a New You, an updated version of the high fat/low  carb Atkins diet. The two square off at a public debate on the campus of  the University of Alabama at Birmingham (UAB) on Wednesday, March 27, 2013.
> 
> T. Colin Campbell, Ph.D., wrote The China Study in 2005. A professor emeritus at Cornell University,  Campbell was the director of the China-Oxford-Cornell study on diet and  disease in the 1980s. The book chronicles his findings about diet and  health from his career in basic science. While not calling himself a  vegetarian or vegan, Campbell supports a whole-food, plant-based, low  protein/low fat diet.
>  Eric Westman, M.D., has conducted clinical trials regarding the  Atkins diet, made famous by Robert Atkins in 1972. The Atkins diet,  sometimes called the antithesis of the China Study, suggests that lower  consumption of carbohydrate and higher consumption of fat leads to  better cardiovascular health. Westman is a physician specializing in  obesity medicine and associate professor of internal medicine at Duke University.
> 
> 
> The public debate between Campbell and Westman, High vs. Low Carbohydrate Diets for Cancer Control and Overall Health,will take place from 5-6:30 p.m. March 27 at the UAB Alumni House, 1001 13th Street South. It is presented by the UAB Center for Palliative and Supportive Care and the UAB Comprehensive Cancer Center.  The event is made possible through a gift by Deane Corliss and the  Corliss family. Corliss was a member of the UAB Center for Palliative  Care Community Advisory Board. This public forum is an outstanding way to mark March as National  Nutrition Month in an educational and engaging way, said Wendy  Demark-Wahnefried, Ph.D., R.D., a professor in the UAB Department of Nutrition Sciences andassociate  director for cancer prevention and control in the UAB Comprehensive  Cancer Center. Drs. Campbell and Westman are two of the leading figures  in the country in the study of diet, nutrition and health.
> 
>  Campbell has worked as a senior science adviser to the American Institute for Cancer Research and  sits on the advisory board of the Physicians Committee for Responsible  Medicine. He is known in particular for research, derived in part from  the China Project, which appears to link the consumption of animal  protein with the development of cancer and heart disease.
> ...

----------


## Goodwill

An article on the benefits Low carb dieting. It appears LC offers to lower blood pressure. The article is from a few years back but it might be interesting to those who suffer high blood pressure.

-

Low-Carb Diet Lowers Blood Pressure

 By Jennifer  Warner
WebMD Health News
 Reviewed by Louise  Chang, MD

Jan. 25, 2010 -- A low-carbohydrate diet may have health benefits that go beyond weight loss.

A new study shows that a low-carbohydrate diet was equally good as the weight loss drug orlistat (the active
ingredient in Alli and Xenical) at helping overweight and obese people lose weight, but people who followed the
low-carb diet also experienced a healthy drop in their blood pressure levels.

"I expected the weight loss to be considerable with both therapies but we were surprised to see blood pressure
improve so much more with the low-carbohydrate diet than with orlistat," researcher William S. Yancy, Jr., MD,
an associate professor of medicine at Duke University Medical Center, says in a news release. "If people have
high blood pressure and a weight problem, a low-carbohydrate diet might be a better option than a weight loss
medication."

Researchers say studies have already shown that the two weight loss methods are effective at promoting weight
loss, but it's the first time the health effects of each have been
compared head to head.

"It's important to know you can try a diet instead of medication and get the same weight loss results with fewer
costs and potentially fewer side effects," Yancy says.

*Low-Carb Lowers Blood Pressure*

In the study, published in the _Archives of Internal Medicine_, 146 obese or overweight adults were randomly
divided into two groups. Many of the participants also had chronic health problems, such as high blood pressure
or diabetes.

The first group was advised to follow a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet  consisting of less than 20 grams of
carbohydrates per day, and the second group received the weight loss drug orlistat three times a day, plus
counseling in following a low-fat diet (less than 30% of daily calories from fat) at group meetings over 48 weeks.

The results showed weight loss was similar in the two groups. The low-carb diet group lost an average of 9.5%
of their body weight and the orlistat group lost an average of 8.5%. Both weight loss methods were also not
significantly different at improving cholesterol and glucose levels.

But when researchers looked at changes in blood pressure, they found nearly half of those who followed the
low-carbohydrate group had their blood pressure medication decreased or discontinued during the study,
compared to only 21% of those in the orlistat group.

Overall, systolic (the top number in a blood pressure reading) dropped an average of 5.9 points among the
low-carb diet group, compared with an increase of 1.5 points in the orlistat group.

Researchers say weight loss itself typically produces a healthy reduction in blood pressure, but it appears that
a low-carbohydrate diet has an additional blood pressure-lowering effect that merits further study.


-

----------


## Goodwill

Looks like Gary Taubes initiative is going to get some funding from a wealthy hedge fund manager who is retiring and wants to give away billions.  Might help sort out the low fat - low carb controversy in the coming years? Who knows. Well, here's the Wall Street Journal's story...

The New Science Behind Philanthropy | WSJ.Money Summer 2013 - WSJ.com


Same story through Yahoo...

The New Science of Giving - Yahoo! Finance


-

The Taubes organization...

NuSI

The Nutrition Science Initiative  NuSI (pronounced new see) is a  non-profit organization, technically a 501(c)(3). Its purpose  is to  facilitate and fund rigorous, well-controlled experiments targeted at  resolving unambiguously many of the outstanding nutrition controversies   to answer the question definitively of what constitutes a healthy diet.


NuSI is unencumbered by bureaucracy or by an obligation to do anything  other than find the truth. We can move quickly and efficiently to  execute a novel plan: harness the talents of the best scientists in the  field and channel their skills into one concerted effort to generate  reliable knowledge, once and for all, on the nature of a healthy diet.   The time is now.

----------


## youneverknow

DietDoctor.com is a pro-low carbohydrate way of eating doctor.

Diet Doctor - Real food for your health

----------


## youneverknow

Insulin, the Obesity Epidemic and a Giant German Baby | DietDoctor.com




The obesity epidemic starts early in life: Germany has a new record  for heaviest baby: 13,5 pound Jasleen. She was delivered without the  help of a C-section.*Huffington Post:* Baby Jasleen, Born At 13.47 Pounds, Is Germanys Heaviest Baby Born Vaginally*CNN:* Oh baby! Mother gives birth to 13-pound girl in GermanyThe  cause of heavy babies is often maternal obesity and gestational  diabetes  conditions with abnormally high insulin levels. Insulin is a  fat-storing growth hormone that does not just affect the mother but also  the unborn child. The mother to Jasleen, not surprisingly, had  gestational diabetes.
The most common cause of abnormally high  insulin levels resulting in obesity and diabetes (and heavy babies) is  eating excess carbs.
The smartest way to avoid these things is to avoid eating excess carbs. Why? A low-carb diet is an effective way to lower insulin levels. And normalizing the fat-storing hormone insulin tends to normalize weight for most people (and any present unborn babies).
So heres another reason to do low carb: You wont have to deliver a 13,5 pound baby.

----------


## natalie8

The mother delivered naturally?! The article mentions that she had gestational diabetes, but she is not overweight. She looks like a typically petite Asian woman. This can prove that one doesn't need to be overweight to be prone to diabetes. I wonder if the child's health can be brought back easily.

----------


## youneverknow

I once caught something on NHK from Tokyo which mentioned that Japanese get diabetes at a much lower BMI than Europeans. It has something to do with having such a specific diet for so long which is different from European's whose diet has seen much more diversity. Europeans put on the weight then get diabetes. Thailand is out of control these days with all the sugar so its future can't be that good. I see plenty of morbidly obese Thais around who seem to have been born that way. Not sure it if is a sign on the changing times.

----------


## barbaro

Has anyone seen *"Fat Head?"*

It is a well-done documentary and covered many topics.

It is based on studies and also what our grandmothers knew.  If you eat lots of bread and white stuff you get fat.

The current USDA pyramid is a programmed insulin spike that leads to obesity (in addition to high fructose corn syrup).

----------


## youneverknow

Great film Barbaro but not specifically a low carb film. It was more of a rant against Morgan Spurlock going off on McDonald's. Personally, I think that kids are affected a lot by their mothers carb intake along with chemical intake and every new generation's bodies are much more reactive to carb intake so its harder for them to stay fit. We are not living in a natural world anymore. Most don't eat anything near a natural diet so it's a constant struggle. To prove this you would have to go generations studying changes in children. I think somewhere back I heard that the children of smokers have a higher chance of getting cancer than their parents do if they smoke and their children will have even a higher chance. It might be similar to the idea that I am pushing. Just my thoughts on it. I still like the movie Fat head just the same as it does make some good points about food.

----------


## barbaro

^ Yes, youneverknow,

"Fat Head" spend a lot of time critiquing Morton Sperlock's "Super Size Me" and seems that Sperlock bullshitted us.  He added calories to hit the 5K, and never provided a food log diary to the many journalists and others who have asked to see it, even though he would have had to do one to keep track of meals and caloric intake.

Sperlock pulled a con.  But "Fat Head" is not defender of Micky-Ds, just pointing out the of the myths and over-blown media attention.

The coveage of the "lipid hypothesis" was interesting as well as the rest of the doc.

Yes, we do nt eat natural foods anymore.  And you noting the increasing carb intae and our mothers....that is very interesting.

----------


## youneverknow

Lately, I'm swaying to the idea that fat people are actually starving for vitamins and other nutrition. Overweight people get plenty of empty calories so they are not starving for calories. It's just specific nutrients and vitamins. Most of the food we get these days is processed and made from a lot of the same ingredients. It's also not fresh which means certain things are lost. They say by adding certain nutrients along to your regular diet you can change that 'starvation' and the cravings will slowly disappear. Another focus has been on the Omega-3 Omega-6 ratio. I guess in nature we take in much more omega-3 which is supposedly important for some internal processes. I would guess I am super-low in omega-3 intake. It's hard to follow all this stuff. I know there are healthy people who eat junk food and are just fine but for many it just can't be done. Some of us have screwed up metabolisms due to a lifetime of processed foods. It's not easy eating well if you don't have a full kitchen and access to a broad variety of foods as in the western supermarkets. Thailand has loads of fresh veggies but figuring out what nutritional value they have can be difficult. I think the route really is a path of awareness but not extremes. I've tried low carb a few times but have never been able to stick to it. It can be done but I think in the end you will probably end up eating less fats and proteins and more veggies. Plus everyday exercise takes a person to the healthiest weight.

----------


## barbaro

> Lately, I'm swaying to the idea that fat people are actually starving for vitamins and other nutrition. Overweight people get plenty of empty calories so they are not starving for calories. It's just specific nutrients and vitamins. Most of the food we get these days is processed and made from a lot of the same ingredients. It's also not fresh which means certain things are lost. They say by adding certain nutrients along to your regular diet you can change that 'starvation' and the cravings will slowly disappear.


It seems obesity is a complex condition.  There have been a few theories from an obesity gene to HFC proliferation in foods since 1975, to the massive increase in sugar consumption.  And yes, most food is processed and the wheat we eat is not the same as the wheat our grandparents ate.  Sedentary lifestyle. And yes, empty calories. 




> ....I've tried low carb a few times but have never been able to stick to it. It can be done but I think in the end you will probably end up eating less fats and proteins and more veggies. Plus everyday exercise takes a person to the healthiest weight.


I am now cutting down on carbs. No drastic, but avoiding them.  I don't count down to the exact amount but I am going from roughly 20 per day up to 80 and a 100.  I am avoiding high glycemic foods which I usually do.

----------


## youneverknow

> I am going from roughly 20 per day up to 80 and a 100.


So you're increasing carb intake a bit?






Another video from the Australian science program _Catalyst_, on ABC.

*Toxic Sugar?* 










Here's a pretty good page on what's happening in supermarkets...


*The World Is Fucking Insane*: *Exploring aisles 9-13 at my local supermarket.*


https://medium.com/health-the-future/918b3d08f21f

----------


## barbaro

> Originally Posted by barbaro
> 
> 
>   I am going from roughly 20 per day up to 80 and a 100.
> 
> 
> So you're increasing carb intake a bit?


YNK,

I should have clarified more. I am varying the intake.  Up and down.  Yesterday was a low carb day and today will also be low.

But if I want to eat 3 slices of pizza (tomorrow for example, I will).

----------


## donald36

I lose weight on low carbs and make sure any carbs I eat are in the morning with the least at night ,cant say i enjoy it but once a year for about a month keeps my weight right and no alcohol sadly

----------


## Sumbitch

The typical body builder diet is high in protein and fiber and low in carbohydrates and fat. Would you consider a body builder to prolly have got it right? (Minus the steroids, testosterone supplements and HGH, of course.) Why or why not?

I don't mention the exercise, which is obviously a major component of a body builder's lifestyle, because I have yet to hear of one who puts that first: nutrition always comes first.

----------


## alitongkat

bodybuilders in the first place want to build up muscles, thats why they prefer proteins over carbs, its not for "health" or balancing-reasons...

they go into a wanted "imbalance", by switching on things (with or without supplements), what of course has also some (unwanted) side effects...
thats why they have to - rather sooner than later - "counteract" a lot with hormones and stuff...

----------


## Little Chuchok

The Paleo Diet | Dr. Loren Cordain, Founder of the Paleo Diet Movement

This is how we should be eating IMO.

----------


## alitongkat

*P A L E O* ... from link above:




> *Eat:*
> 
> Grass-produced meatsFish/seafoodFresh fruits and veggiesEggsNuts and seedsHealthful oils (Olive, walnut, flaxseed, macadamia, avocado, coconut)
> 
> *Don’t eat:*
> 
> Cereal grainsLegumes (including peanuts)DairyRefined sugarPotatoesProcessed foodsSaltRefined vegetable oils (listed in _The Paleo Diet Cookbook_ and _The Paleo Diet for Athletes_)

----------


## youneverknow

Paleo makes sense but the Paleo of today isn't reality. Some of the foods just don't exist in the same climates. Also, you could expect that Europeans went for a large part of the year without any fruit, veggies, or grains. Winter must have been all meat for the most part. Late Spring through the fall would have offered the other stuff. All the spices for foods were almost non existent. A lot or most of the meats probably weren't even cooked when eaten.

----------


## alitongkat

winter was all potatoes...  :Smile:   ...yummy...


youneverknow, are you saying, that europeans might have lived "healthier" - previous generations ?

thats b.s. ... they lived very unhealthy - compared to our standards...
no much was really fresh, it wasnt balanced, in winter no vegetables and so on...

its "doctors" and other bullshitters that want us to believe, that our diet is "unhealthy", our lifestyle is unhealthy...
its not true... 
neither lifestyle nor diet have ever been so "healthy"...
so rich, so various, so plenty...

----------


## youneverknow

I'm not saying they were healthier but who knows. When you look at wild animals, aren't they healthy? Are humans really incapable of living with nature like the rest of the beasts? All animals get sick at some point but generally aren't most wild animals healthy? As for Paleo that people are doing today, it's probably the best choice there is for a lot of people but people can't really believe that they are eating anywhere near humans from 10,000 years ago.

----------


## alitongkat

we are the healthiest of all humans ever...
never have people been that old and that fit for so long...

when you want to live "healthy", then leave the shit out of your system...
antibiotics, vaccinations, anti-depressants...

there are other natural treatments, not only herbs, but meditation and even huldas zapper...
herbs and meditation are *proven*, already for a looooong time for their effectiveness, huldas zapper (just as an example of something much ridiculed) is about to follow soon... similar devices show much success already...
dont think, because the arseholes in white are laughing and ridiculuing such things, it doesnt work... doctors are really not very bright in the head... 

i also thought its b.s.... but when you dig into, you will find, that it makes SENSE... its LOGICAL from a medical point of view that huldas zapper "works" on various conditions... and its shocking, that these "things" havent been looked into much earlier and much more intense...

healthy living in our time is living without damaging medicine (as much as possible)...

----------


## Takeovers

> winter was all potatoes...   ...yummy...
> 
> 
> youneverknow, are you saying, that europeans might have lived "healthier" - previous generations ?
> 
> thats b.s. ... they lived very unhealthy - compared to our standards...
> no much was really fresh, it wasnt balanced, in winter no vegetables and so on...
> 
> its "doctors" and other bullshitters that want us to believe, that our diet is "unhealthy", our lifestyle is unhealthy...
> ...


I absolutely agree, people were never healthier. Our only problem is in your last word - plenty.

We eat too much. But admitting that would mean to admit that it is really our own fault, if we have problems with our diet. So much easier to blame the Big Food Companies. :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## Takeovers

> When you look at wild animals, aren't they healthy?


Yes of course. For the simple reason, as soon as they are not they die.

----------


## terry57

Ive got Type 2 Diabetes and to the diabetic its all about counting Carbs.

I was referred to a dietician when diagnosed and she filled me in on the drill.

For me its meals of consisting of 40 % carbs in any one sitting. Not hard to do at all when tuned in on how to read Carbs.

Especially easy to maintain in Thailand with all the fresh stir fried Veg around.

I'm not perfect on that figure but not bad as my diet has always been good.

If one is a fat fuk eating shit its a different story.

----------


## tmifune

> Ketogenic diet works very well - it's easy to implement, and easy to maintain.
> 
> I lost 45 lbs in 60-70 days 3 years ago using a ketogenic diet.
> 
> It's a very effective means to lose pure fat in a good amount time.


  I know its a late reply to your post. But had to say, that I lost 30 lbs in 48 days doing the Ketogenic diet. Man its a relief to be rid of that disgusting belt stretching pot!!! :Smile:

----------


## Sumbitch

> bodybuilders in the first place want to build up muscles, thats why they prefer proteins over carbs, its not for "health" or balancing-reasons...
> 
> they go into a wanted "imbalance", by switching on things (with or without supplements), what of course has also some (unwanted) side effects...
> thats why they have to - rather sooner than later - "counteract" a lot with hormones and stuff...




That's a bodybuilder. What he had to say about nutrition (from Wikipedia): 


> LaLanne blamed overly processed foods for many health problems. For most of his life, he advocated primarily a meat and vegetable diet; eating meat three times per day with eggs and fruit in morning and many servings of vegetables in afternoon and evening. [19] In his later years, he appears to advocate a mostly meatless diet but which included fish (see Pescetarianism),[20][21] and took vitamin supplements


That's pretty much what I described as a bodybuilder's diet. His feats: 



> _(As reported on Jack LaLanne's website)_ These accounts are not necessarily entirely accurate descriptions of what LaLanne actually did. See the 1974 Alcatraz Island to Fisherman's Wharf swim (below) for an illustration of the difference between the website account and objective reporting of the same event.[_citation needed_]*1954 (age 40):* swam the entire 8,981 feet (2,737 m) length of the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco, under water, with 140 pounds (64 kg; 10 st) of air tanks and other equipment strapped to his body; a world record.[33]*1955 (age 41):* swam from Alcatraz Island to Fisherman's Wharf in San Francisco while handcuffed. When interviewed afterwards he was quoted as saying that the worst thing about the ordeal was being handcuffed, which significantly reduced his chance to do a jumping jack.[_citation needed_]*1956 (age 42):* set what was claimed as a world record of 1,033 push-ups in 23 minutes on _You Asked For It_,[34] a television program hosted by Art Baker.*1957 (age 43):* swam the Golden Gate channel while towing a 2,500-pound (1,100 kg; 180 st) cabin cruiser. The swift ocean currents turned this one-mile (1.6 km) swim into a swimming distance of 6.5 miles (10.5 km).[33]*1958 (age 44):* maneuvered a paddleboard nonstop from Farallon Islands to the San Francisco shore. The 30-mile (48 km) trip took 9.5 hours.[_citation needed_]*1959 (age 45):* did 1,000 jumping jacks and 1,000 chin-ups in 1 hour, 22 minutes, to promote _The Jack LaLanne Show_ going nationwide. LaLanne said this was the most difficult of his stunts, but only because the skin on his hands started ripping off during the chin-ups. He felt he couldn't stop because it would be seen as a public failure.[33]*1974 (age 60):* For the second time, he swam from Alcatraz Island to Fisherman's Wharf. Again, he was handcuffed, but this time he was also shackled and towed a 1,000-pound (450 kg; 71 st) boat. At least that's according to his website. However, according to an account of this event published the day after it occurred in the Los Angeles Times, written by Philip Hager, a Times staff writer, LaLanne was neither handcuffed nor shackled if each of those terms has the unconventional meaning of "tightly binding the wrists or ankles together with a pair of metal fasteners" although that's not how handcuffs or shackles work. Hager says that LaLanne "had his hands and feet bound with cords that allowed minimal freedom". But "minimal" clearly did not mean "no" freedom, since elsewhere in the article Hager describes LaLanne's method of propulsion through the water as "half-breast-stroke, half-dog paddle" which is how you swim with your hands tied.[_citation needed_]*1975 (age 61):* Repeating his performance of 21 years earlier, he again swam the entire length of the Golden Gate Bridge, underwater and handcuffed, but this time he was shackled and towed a 1,000-pound (450 kg; 71 st) boat.[_citation needed_]*1976 (age 62):* To commemorate the "Spirit of '76", United States Bicentennial, he swam one mile (1.6 km) in Long Beach Harbor. He was handcuffed and shackled, and he towed 13 boats (representing the 13 original colonies) containing 76 people.[35]*1979 (age 65):* towed 65 boats in Lake Ashinoko, near Tokyo, Japan. He was handcuffed and shackled, and the boats were filled with 6,500 pounds (2,900 kg; 460 st) of Louisiana Pacific wood pulp.[36]*1980 (age 66):* towed 10 boats in North Miami, Florida. The boats carried 77 people, and he towed them for over one mile (1.6 km) in less than one hour.[_citation needed_]*1984 (age 70):* handcuffed, shackled, and fighting strong winds and currents, he towed 70 rowboats, one with several guests, from the Queen's Way Bridge in the Long Beach Harbor to the _Queen Mary_, 1 mile.[37]


Age at death: 96. RIP

----------


## barbaro

^ and look what happened to Jack LaLanne: _he's dead._

----------


## youneverknow

Another low carb story...

Finally Achieving My Greatest Unattained Goal | Robin Nixon: Top-selling author & publisher



.

----------


## barbaro

^ Very good article. 

Thanks.

----------


## youneverknow

Thumbs up for lowcarb in big Swedish study comparing diets : LC Research/Media Forum : Active Low-Carber Forums

"This very interesting article gives a summary of a study made by a  Swedish govenmental organisation. The leading experts in Sweden have  been working for years analysing thousands of studies done mosrtly  during the last ten years. The conclusion is that lowcarb is the most  effective diet for weightloss and that it is completely safe and should  be in the list of diets that are recommended by the medical profession.

The article is in Swedish. I have run it through Google translate and fixed it up a little:" - lowcarber forum poster

Svenska Dagbladet 2013-09-23
By Henrik Ennart

Experts: LCHF the most effective regimen

There is no proven increased risk of cardiovascular disease by strict  low carbohydrate diet. LCHF diet is also most effective for a six month  term to lose weight for people with obesity. It shows a new SBU report  which is expected to result carb offered as one of several default  options in health care.

Hardly anyone has been able to escape the recent big fat war between  representatives of low carbohydrate diets and school medicine message  about the benefits of a low fat diet .

After two and a half years of work today unveiled the Swedish Council on  Medical technology Assessment , SBU, a major review of the research in  trying to find answers to the question of how the various dietary  guidelines can help obese people to lose weight .

A wide selection of the country's leading experts have analyzed  thousands of studies which a large part of the past ten years. The  controversial result is in more than one way a prestige victory for the  contested low carbohydrate diet .


• Low carbohydrate diets , even the strict , giving greater weight loss  at six months for persons with obesity, compared with low fat diet.

• This is done without the researchers pinpointed some negative effects on blood lipids while the weight remains lower.

• There is no whatsoever evidence that low carbohydrate diet would increase the risk of heart disease.

• There is no evidence that even low-carbohydrate diet high in saturated  fat would lead to increased risk of heart disease. As the research base  is limited in this respect , according to the SBU, yet be cause for  some caution with too much saturated fat.

- The most important result I think, is that we have not found any  evidence of increased health risks as a result of low carbohydrate diets  , says Jonas Lindblom , Project Manager at SBU.

He points out that this has been a recurrent concern . As recently as  last summer, several professors went out and warned that a worsening of  cardiac health among younger women could be due to carb - diet. Other  researchers responded to this with rather relating it with changes in  smoking behavior in this group.

- We did not find any support in the research for low carbohydrate diet  would lead to poor heart health or increased mortality, says Jonas  Lindblom.

SBU does not usually give any own dietary recommendations .

- However, a reasonable interpretation of our report should be to  healthcare in the future also offer low carbohydrate diet as an option  for patients with obesity, says Jonas Lindblom.

In the longer term effect on weight seems to wane and differences from  other diets blurred. One probable explanation is that adherence declines  with time .

A likely consequence of the SBU report is that health care in the future  more active will offer low-carbohydrate diet for the obese patients who  so desire for short-term weight reduction.

SBU report relates to effects on persons with obesity, with a BMI over  30 , mainly in respect of weight , but also health. The review does not  apply to links between food and health in the general population .

All different investigated diets leads to decreased weight , which  motivates a wide range of variants of the dietary guidelines. Advice on  strict low carbohydrate diet has so far been very rare in healthcare.

The benefits in the short term, both the moderate low carbohydrate diet  with a carbohydrate intake below 40 percent of the total energy intake ,  and strict low carbohydrate diet where carbohydrate intake provides  more than 20 percent of the total energy.

The strict low carbohydrate diet also leads , according to the analysis ,  in the short term to improved glucose levels for people with obesity  and diabetes, and to marginally decreased triglycerides.

In the long run there are no differences in efficacy between weight loss  tips on strict and moderate carbohydrate diet , low-fat diets , high  protein diet , Mediterranean diet , diet with a low glycemic load diet  or a high proportion of monounsaturated fats. Advice on higher intake of  dairy products or reduced intake of sugary drinks can also lead to  weight loss.

SBU also notes that there are still major gaps in knowledge , and that  the long term effects in individuals with obesity are better documented  for the Mediterranean diet than other diets , including low fat and  lowcarb diet.


The article in Swedish from which this was taken...

http://www.svd.se/nyheter/inrikes/ex...en_8541310.svd

----------


## Sumbitch

^I don't have a beef a with a low-carb diet, my beef is with a the LCHF diet (low carb, high fat). I see nothing healthy in substituting high fat for other healthy alternatives. Those alternatives should be high protein foods, such as eggs--especially whites--fish, tofu, chicken and turkey breast and any other lean meat product. Another important food choice is high fiber food. People confuse high fiber foods with high carb foods: they are not the same. What you want to avoid are the starchy veggies and fruits high in sugar: those are the beasts that are also high in carbs. Beets, peas, potatoes, sweet potatoes, corn are high in starch. The non-starchy , high fiber veggies include avocados, beans, asparagus, spinach, cauliflower, cucumber, leafy greens. And, as it turns out, fruit that's highest in carbs is also highest in sugar and fruit lowest in sugar is highest in fiber and low in carbs. Those include blackberries, rhubarb, strawberries, melon, papaya. peaches, blueberries. And healthy fats don't need to be avoided: for example, extra virgin olive oil as a salad dressing. Many nuts and seeds are also high in fat. And avoid processed foods. But fats should not be the focus of a healthy diet, imnsmfho.

----------


## natalie8

> I don't have a beef a with a low-carb diet


Pun intended?  :Smile:

----------


## Sumbitch

> Pun intended?


Yes. Fact is, I can't eat red meat. But in the spirit of full disclosure I wikied "red meat": 


> The debate is mainly one of semantics as nutritionists consider all meat from mammals to be "red meat" while this is not the case in other fields such as husbandry, biology, genetics, physiology, etc.[_citation needed_]


So I guess I'm not lyin'. Here in LOS, though, it's pretty hard to avoid pork, ain't it? But, jeez louise, you ever been past a pig farm? That's damn near enough to put u off your feed, I'm tellin' ya'.  :spam2:

----------


## Retro

Credit Suisse: The Global Sugar Epidemic - Business Insider


A new study from Wall Street bank Credit Suisse exposes the "dietary  impact of 'sugar and sweeteners' and their role in the ongoing health  debate surrounding obesity and diabetes." The accompanying video visualizes the sorry state of sugar consumption.



 The harrowing effect of sugar consumption on American waistlines  isn't necessarily new news, but Credit Suisse does an excellent job of  breaking down just how out of control it has gotten (especially in the  U.S., where they had to literally adjust the y-axis of one of their charts so that U.S. soda consumption could be mapped).

 We grabbed some screenshots from Credit Suisse's video to break it down.

Credit Suisse: The Global Sugar Epidemic - Business Insider


American Soda Consumption A Huge Outlier - Business Insider

----------


## barbaro

Myth 1: saturated fats and cholesterol cause heart disease.
Myth 2: cholesterol clogs arteries and you'll live longer if you lower your cholesterol.

We've been misled:
1) by food companies who say we should eat a diet of low fat foods.
2) by drug companies who say we have to lower our cholesterol with medication.
3) by our government which has come up with guidelines for food and cholesterol that are not justified by the science.

If any of you are taking statins, this lecture will surprise you. Statins adversely affect the brain, especially Lipitor, it is the worst of all (causes memory loss).

----------


## ENT

^ A good video, and I agree entirely with the content.
                                                                                                                  I've stuck to a low carb diet over the past year when I gave up smoking tobacco.

I really did start to balloon initially on quitting nicotine, until I stopped 95% of my previous carb intake, then I gradually eased down to my ideal BMI weight after about 6 months.

I eat all the meat and fish, eggs, cheeses, butter, milk yoghurt I like and round it all off with plenty of vegetables, raw or steamed, but rarely potatoes or any starchy veges.

I also eat a good load of onions, garlic etc daily, it most certainly keeps the LDL cholesterol levels down, I can only pinch around half an inch or so of midriff left or right, a good indicator of how much LDL created fat you're carrying.

I drink home brewed stout as my alcohol hit, no more of that crap SO2 preserved wine, and nary a drop of spirits unless I have a shot or two of whisky at family get togethers.

Sleeping off excess weight also works, coupled with a high dairy foods diet, no need for strenuous exercise.

I walk lots, run a bit, stretch and roll my body around and do Aikido or Tai Chi exercises to keep up flexibility, circulation and mobility.

Other than an occasional joint, I don't take any chemicals or drugs, and positively AVOID fluorides.

I wouldn't in a screaming fit take any commercial chemical cures.

There are many herbs available to cure ALL ills.

----------


## Retro

Some interesting videos from Australia.

----------


## Retro

Some interesting charts on fat intake and health for those interested.


Our 'War' On Fat Was A Huge Mistake [GRAPHS] - Business Insider

----------


## barbaro

Thanks for the last two posts, Retro.

Very informative!

----------


## Retro

*
10 Myths Within The Low-Carb Community
*
http://authoritynutrition.com/10-my...carb-community/

November 19, 2013  by Kris Gunnars 


Low-carb diets are awesome.

The research is clear that they can reverse many common, serious diseases.

This includes obesity, type 2 diabetes, metabolic syndrome and a few others.

Collectively, these are the biggest health problems in the world.

That being said, Ive noticed a problem that has been growing steadily over the past few years in the low-carb community.

A lot of dogma seems to be getting accepted and many myths that are NOT supported by science have gained foothold.

This is a consequence of a phenomenon called group thinking, which is  common in nutrition circles and can lead to a distorted view of the  science.

This is a big problem, because dogmatic and extremist views will not help the low-carb diet gain acceptance.

They will simply scare intelligent people away and put them in a  defensive mode instead of making them willing to observe the arguments  objectively.

Plus dogmatic, unscientific views are what got us into this terrible  public health mess in the first place. Lets not make that same mistake  again.
*
1. Low-Carb is The Best Diet For Everyone*

Low-carb diets are super healthy.

The studies consistently show that they cause more weight loss and  improve most risk factors for disease more than the failed low-fat diet  that is still being pushed by nutrition organizations all over the world  (1, 2, 3).

That being said, low-carb is not appropriate for everyone.

Were all different and what works for one person may not work for the next.

I know many people who have given low-carb an honest shot and didnt  like it, either because they didnt get the results they expected or  they simply didnt feel good.

For others, low-carb can be downright detrimental.

This includes people who are physically active, especially athletes who  do a lot of anaerobic work. These individuals need a lot more carbs than  people who are sedentary.

We should be mindful of the fact that other people have different needs  and different preferences. Different strokes for different folks.

*2. Carbs Are Inherently Fattening*

Sugar and refined carbs are bad, pretty much everyone agrees on that.

But vilifying all carbs based on that is kind of like vilifying all fats  because of the harmful effects of trans fats and vegetable oils.

The truth is not all carbs are fattening. It depends completely on the context and the type of food they are in.

For carbs to be fattening, they need to be refined and put into a  package that is highly palatable and encourages overconsumption.

A great example is potatoes. On their own, they are not very exciting.  They have fiber, a low energy density and you will most likely feel full  pretty quickly.

On the other hand, potato chips, deep fried in corn oil, with salt and  pepper and maybe even a dipping sauce now youve got a highly fattening  food that is easy to overconsume.

Many populations around the world have maintained good health on a  high-carb diet with real, unprocessed foods, including the Kitavans and  Asian rice eaters.

*3. Carrots, Fruits and Potatoes Are Unhealthy Because of The Carbs*

Ive seen many real, traditional foods demonized by low-carbers because of the carb content.

This includes foods like fruits, whole potatoes and carrots.

True it is essential to limit these foods on a very low-carb, ketogenic  diet. But this does not mean that there is anything wrong with those  foods.

People often tend to see things in black and white. Either a food is bad or good.

But the truth is that in nutrition, everything depends on the context and healthy is a relative term.

For a person eating a Western junk food diet, replacing some junk food  with a few pieces of fruit per day would be healthy. But for a  diabetic managing their symptoms on a ketogenic diet, the same amount of  fruit would be unhealthy.

In my opinion, low-carb zealots trolling the web scaring people away  from whole foods like carrots and fruits, without any regard to context,  are no better than militant vegans spreading fear mongering about meat  and eggs.

*4. A Low-Carb Diet Should Always be Ketogenic*

A ketogenic diet is a very low-carb diet, usually under 50 grams of  carbs per day, with a very high fat intake (60-85% of calories).

Ketosis can be a highly beneficial metabolic state, especially for  people with certain diseases like diabetes, metabolic syndrome, epilepsy  or obesity (4, 5, 6).

But this really is not the only way to do a low carb diet.

Low-carb can be anything up to 100-150 grams of carbs per day, perhaps even more.

Within this range, there is easily room for several pieces of fruit per  day and even small amounts of whole, starchy foods like potatoes.

Even though a very low-carb / ketogenic diet may be the most effective  for quick weight loss and several disease states, this is not  appropriate for everyone.

I know of a lot of people who didnt feel good in ketosis, but when they  added in a few fruits (still low-carb) they suddenly started feeling  awesome.
*
5. All Carbohydrates Are Sugar*

Saying that all carbs are broken down into sugar is true, but misleading.

Technically, the word sugar includes various simple sugars like glucose, fructose and galactose.

Yes, starches like grains and potatoes do get broken down into glucose in the digestive tract, which raises blood sugar levels.

To a diabetic, it is true that starches turn into sugar and raise the sugars in the blood.

But to other people, who are not chemists, the word sugar implies the white, unhealthy granular stuff sucrose.

Telling people that all carbs turn into sugar is misleading. It makes  people think that there is no difference between a potato and a candy  bar.

Whereas table sugar contains half glucose, half fructose, starch is only  glucose. It is the fructose portion of sugar that is the most harmful,  starch (glucose) does NOT have the same effect (7, 8).

Trying to mislead people into believing that starches are equivalent to sugar/HFCS is dishonest.
*
6. It is Impossible to Gain Weight on a Low-Carb Diet*

There are some who think that as long as carbs and insulin are low, that weight gain is impossible.

But the truth is it is very possible to gain weight on a low-carb diet.

Many low-carb foods can be fattening, especially for people who are prone to binge eating (like I used to be).

This includes cheese, nuts, peanuts and heavy cream.

It is very easy to eat a ton of calories from these foods, enough to  stall weight loss or even cause someone to start gaining weight back.

Back in my binge eating days, I used to binge on peanut butter. For a  while, I used to eat an entire jar of organic peanut butter (70% fat,  15% carbs) every evening and I gained weight like clockwork until I  stopped doing it.

Although many people can eat these foods without problems, others need  to moderate them if they want to be able to lose weight without  restricting calories.
*
7. Drinking Butter and Coconut Oil is a Good Idea*

Despite decades of anti-fat propaganda, the studies are showing that saturated fat is harmless (9, 10, 11).

There is no reason to avoid high-fat dairy products, fatty cuts of meat, coconut oil or butter. These are healthy foods.

But just because normal amounts of saturated fat are fine, it doesnt  mean that adding a ton of it to your diet is a good idea.

It is trendy these days to add a whole lot of butter and coconut oil to coffee.

I think doing this is fine in moderation. It will probably lead to a  reduced appetite, so it wont cause weight gain or anything like that.

But if youre adding 20-30-50 (or more) grams of fat to your diet every  day, then you will be eating less of other more nutritious foods instead  (like meat and veggies).

*8. Calories Dont Matter*


There is a misunderstanding among some low-carbers that calories dont matter.

Calories are a measure of energy and body fat is simply stored energy.

If our bodies take in more energy than we can burn off, we store it (usually as body fat).

If our bodies expend more energy than we take in, we use stored body fat for energy.

One of the reasons low-carb diets work so well, is that they reduce  appetite. They make people eat less calories automatically, so there is  no need for calorie counting or portion control (12, 13).

Of course, these diets also optimize the function of important metabolic  hormones like insulin, but one of the key reasons they work so well is  that people start to eat less calories without trying.

Calories count, but counting them or even being consciously aware of them is not necessary in many cases.

*9. Fiber is Mostly Irrelevant to Human Health*

Dietary fiber is indigestible carbohydrate material in foods.

Humans dont have the enzymes to digest fiber and therefore it passes through relatively unchanged.

However, fiber is not irrelevant to health, like some low carbers seem to believe.

Fiber actually gets to the bacteria in the intestine, which do have the  enzymes to digest it and can turn it into beneficial compounds, like the  fatty acid butyrate (14).

In fact, there are many studies showing that fiber, especially soluble  fiber, leads to various health benefits like weight loss and improved  cholesterol (15, 16, 17).

There are many different types of fiber. While some dont really do anything, others are highly beneficial for health.

*10. If Low-Carb Cures a Disease, That Must Mean That The Carbs Caused it in The First Place*

Many people who are metabolically healthy can easily maintain good health eating carbs, as long as they eat real food.

However, when someone becomes insulin resistant and obese, the metabolic rules seem to change somehow.

People who have metabolic dysfunction caused by the Western diet may need to avoid all high-carb foods.

But even though removing most carbs may be necessary to reverse a  disease, it does not mean that the carbs themselves caused the disease.

Healthy people who want to stay healthy will do just fine, even on a  higher carb diet, as long as they stick to real, unprocessed foods.

The prevention does not have to be the same as the cure.
*
Take Home Message*

Group thinking is a big problem in nutrition. People tend to pick  sides  then they only read blogs and books by people who agree with  the side they have chosen.

This is a BIG problem among vegans. They are often completely brainwashed, with a severely distorted view of the science.

But I have started to notice the same thing in the low-carb community as well.

We need to be vary of this group thinking phenomenon and always look at  the opposite argument as well. Science changes all the time and what is  true today can be proven wrong tomorrow.

So lets continue to promote the incredible life-saving benefits of low-carb diets (for the people who need them).

But lets not ignore all contrary evidence or distort the science just to get our point across. That aint cool.

If we do that, then were no better than the vegans.



.

----------


## Takeovers

> 10 Myths Within The Low-Carb Community


Best low carb post ever.

I like especially the part where it says people are different and one does not suit all.





> But let’s not ignore all contrary evidence or distort the science just to get our point across. That ain’t cool.
> 
> If we do that, then we’re no better than the vegans.


 :Smile:

----------


## Sumbitch

^ I specified my preferred low carb diet as such: *low carb* (no starchy veggies, grains),* high fiber* (consuming seeds is a good way to help increase your fiber intake without adding lots of extra carbohydrates. Interestingly, almost all the non-starchy vegetables and low-sugar fruits are the ones that are highest in both fiber and nutrients. Also wheat bran and high fiber cereals are low carb and high fiber, *high protein* (nuts are high in fiber and protein, and many are low in carbohydrates) and *low fat*. Mind this is not a weight loss diet. It's a diet designed to lose body fat, gain lean muscle mass and maintain a healthy weight.

----------


## MissTraveller

> ^I don't have a beef a with a low-carb diet, my beef is with a the LCHF diet (low carb, high fat). I see nothing healthy in substituting high fat for other healthy alternatives. Those alternatives should be high protein foods, such as eggs--especially whites--fish, tofu, chicken and turkey breast and any other lean meat product. Another important food choice is high fiber food. People confuse high fiber foods with high carb foods: they are not the same. What you want to avoid are the starchy veggies and fruits high in sugar: those are the beasts that are also high in carbs. Beets, peas, potatoes, sweet potatoes, corn are high in starch. The non-starchy , high fiber veggies include avocados, beans, asparagus, spinach, cauliflower, cucumber, leafy greens. And, as it turns out, fruit that's highest in carbs is also highest in sugar and fruit lowest in sugar is highest in fiber and low in carbs. Those include blackberries, rhubarb, strawberries, melon, papaya. peaches, blueberries. And healthy fats don't need to be avoided: for example, extra virgin olive oil as a salad dressing. Many nuts and seeds are also high in fat. And avoid processed foods. But fats should not be the focus of a healthy diet, imnsmfho.


I totally agree... although sweet potatoes have more fiber than regular potatoes and they enter your bloodstream slower than white potatoes, thus preventing the insulin spike and sugar rush that white processed foods induce. 

I agree that healthy fats are a necessity for losing weight and keeping healthy. Nuts, avocado, olive oil, and fatty fish are all good for you. 

I'm on a low carb diet, but eat healthy fats as well. I just don't eat as high in fat as the Atkins diet. Been a low carber for three months and have lost over 30 pounds. 
Eventually, I will add in a few carbohydrates like brown rice, sweet potatoes, and a few other carbs. I will try to stay away from wheat and high carb/processed/sugary carbs as much as possible. Great information on this thread! I hope add to it soon.




Great read!
http://www.businessinsider.com/13-nu...nd-fat-2013-10

----------


## AsGoodAsItGets

Here's another one from business insider on what's wrong with today's diet.

What's Wrong With The Modern Diet [CHARTS] - Business Insider




.

----------


## MissTraveller

^Excellent, thanks.

----------


## Cold Pizza

Worthy of a bump as I start my LCD today, again.

Anyone else doing this at the moment?

----------


## cyrille

> Worthy of a bump as I start my LCD today, again.


No.

I'll be taking a shit shortly. 

That doesn't mean any of your threads will be 'worthy of a bump'.

----------


## ENT

I'm on a LCD now.
Been on it for three years, and won't change it either.

Lately lost 3kg weight over the Xmas break (2 weeks) through light exercise, low carbs plus only 2 large bottles of beer a week, if that....no added sugar or salt or any junk food whatsoever.

Almost all my back fat's gone, no belly fat left to hide my abs, and my pectoral muscles have developed well, (no moobs   :Smile:  ) using a couple of 6kg dumbbells and resistance bands and push-ups.

Feeling light and strong. moving fast at training, and I'll drink a fruit and whey/milk/yoghurt smoothy with vitamins and minerals before and after the training sessions, which I just re-started yesterday.

Dinner tonight was sushi followed by fruit and a black coffee.

Aaaahhh, luxury.   :Smile:

----------


## Cold Pizza

> Originally Posted by Cold Pizza
> 
> 
> Worthy of a bump as I start my LCD today, again.
> 
> 
> No.
> 
> I'll be taking a shit shortly. 
> ...


This ain't my thread, you trolling a-hole.

You're a loser.


Still teaching, loser?

----------


## Luigi

Withoutt looking over the last 7 pages, is the best diet for losing a bit of weight and feeling a bit healthier:

Low carb.
Low Sugar.
Bit of exercise

?

----------


## ENT

^ All of the above plus fruit and veges, nuts and grains.  Vitamins and minerals.                                                                                                                                                                                     Live yoghurt, milk, eggs, cheese, small fish will see you right for essential amino acids......and less alcohol, which'll put lbs on ya  faster and sneakier than a hoor slips her pants off.

You _can_, if you wish, eat meat for protein, which has less than nuts have, the fat turns to sugar as all foods do, but it's the exercise that sends it off circulating on a process of feeding, reviving and rejuvenating the body, because it's cholesterol, sugars/starches/carbs and enzymes that make up the building blocks.

Eat what you like, *sometimes*, occasionally,* not habitually*, the odd pizza, burger, or gourmet dinner well enjoyed won't kill you.

Exercise is key to making all those goodies in the diet get used properly, or it'll get turned to excess LDL cholesterol, arteriosclerosis, stiff joints, muscle atrophy and weakness, breathlessness and dicky ticker....................as well as losing your marbles.

----------


## Luigi

> arteriosclerosis, stiff joints, muscle atrophy and weakness, breathlessness and dicky ticker....................as well as losing your marbles.


Damn.

I used to take various drugs in my teens just to get those side effects.  :Smile:

----------


## ENT

Weird innit?   :Smile: 

Gotta remember that when lunging up on some weed, loads of CO2, CO, ash and tar  go with the THC to cut down your O2 intake to give that initial rush of getting stoned,......hypoxia, gas will do the same.   :Smile:

----------


## Cold Pizza

*Have any members gone into Ketosis?*

https://authoritynutrition.com/7-tip...-into-ketosis/

----------


## Luigi

Me mate has. 

Sure he lost a lot of weight, but he's suffering for it.

He was all gung ho for the first 8 or 9 months. Now he's really craving a normal diet and normal life.


You'd need to be seriously desperate or motivated to stick with it for life.

----------


## Cold Pizza

> Me mate has. 
> 
> Sure he lost a lot of weight, but he's suffering for it.
> 
> He was all gung ho for the first 8 or 9 months. Now he's really craving a normal diet and normal life.
> 
> 
> You'd need to be seriously desperate or motivated to stick with it for life.


Keto is good for the short term, but unhealthy for the long-term:

75% fat
20% protein
5% carb

(More of less within a few percentage points for all).

If you actually have too much protein, this protein will be stored as glucose.

Keto is a great short term, not good at all for the medium-long term.

----------


## Luigi

Trouble seems to be that when done in the short term, you'll lose the weight, then get back to the carbs and end up binging on them as your body is craving them, then bingo. Heavier than before.

----------


## ENT

Eating 2 meals a day of oats grains nuts with yoghurt milk, cheese, fruit or fish gives me 45% carbs, 25% protein 30% fat average intake which is ideal for me.
Snack on fruits.

Along with a minimum average of half hour or so exercise per day plus 2 days of 4hrs training each a week, I'm in really good health.

No muscle loss to speak of, little fat (except around the midriff, but still at a height to waist ratio of 2:1, joints and tendons supple, due to a high gelatin/collagen (has 80% protein) intake, no arthritis, diabetes, arteriosclerosis and so on.

Better to tend towards a low carb diet with a good protein to fat ratio plus exercise.

I love my vitamins and minerals.    :Smile: 

No meds.

----------


## donald36

> *Have any members gone into Ketosis?*
> 
> https://authoritynutrition.com/7-tip...-into-ketosis/


Yes me, now in my 4th week ,I have the Adkins book and follow it strictly with less than 20 grams carb daily ,its boring, but all diets involve pain whatever the books say, you know its working by using test strips for your pee which shows up the Ketones ,also your breath stinks worse than a dog .On the plus side  its good for my liver as no  alcohol is allowed ,I shall do it for a total of 4/5 weeks and then go back to normal eating but will be more conscious of unnecessary carbs 
I am not seriously overweight just about 10 kgs and progress so far as follows 

Week 1 2.9 kilos --the books suggest about 1 kilo of this is water in the first week 
Week 2 ---1.6 kg   Week 3-- 1.8 kg ,total so far  6.3 kgs in 3 weeks 

This is not a lifestyle choice for me but a quick reset of my weight ,after perhaps 12/18 months need to look again .Its not for everyone but if you can really stick to it and that means no cheating at all, then it works and the weight comes off really quickly,  if the research is to be believed it is fat and not muscle that you are losing.
It has worked for me over 10 years so have done it 4 or 5 times --by the way exercise is a given, got to have some  
Just off to make some Braised Steak and onion --with some gravy made with the onions and some mustard it wont be so bad --couple of ounces of blue cheese to follow but no biscuits

----------


## ENT

I'm on a low carb low calorie diet, borderline ketosis I'd call it.

Exploring more ways of getting energy from intra-cellular processes, ATP, adenosine-tri-phosphate. along with water and a balance of minerals being the key molecule that is used and recycled back after energy's released, during any  of the body's processes.

Insufficient ATP leaves you low and un-motivated, as it acts as a co-enzyme, and a catalyst for vitamins found in food and produced in the gut, helping break down sugars, fats and proteins, rebuilding and repairing body tissues, and in the cell itself, repairing one's DNA, including the battered and warped old telomeres, resulting in repaired nerve damage, optimal metabolism and overall good health, so slowing down the ageing process, and diminishing that processes' symptoms, which include cancer, circulatory probs, mal;functioning or defunct glands, etc etc etc as I've pointed out earlier.

My earlier experiments in generating ATP_ in vitrio_ involved testing my brews out on myself, ingesting sufficient quantities of vitamins, minerals, herbs, bacteria to top up the brew's potential. I did this until back in 2014, I got a brew going that was a definite plus, a real _aqua vita_ of the first order, which I'd take daily with fresh fruits and vegetables and dairy products and other proteins.

The result was my replacing around 5kg of fat with 5kg of lean muscle in 5 months, a regulated program supervised by doctors and regular blood tests to make sure my liver and kidneys didn't clap out.

Exercise and lots of water, no smoking was strictly stuck to.

Now, I think I've perfected the process of increased manufacture of that "god molecule" in my body, helped on by doses of my brew which is chocker full of living cells and enzymes, mineral, vitamins proteins and a balancing amount of carbs which I'm still tweaking to get right, ...so far so good.

Needless to say no drugs or "bad" alcohol is involved, but the brew does contain some in its manufactured state, but isn't necessary as a vehicle/carrier as the lot can be dehydrated and the resultant sludge mixed with any flavour or food for ingestion, There;s no known overdose of the stuff so far.

Result today is smooth, high energy levels, increased speed and clarity of thought, to the point that I don't need a calculator for simple maths, nor a pencil and paper except to note lists of answers for further evaluation.

Add lots of good clean water, various 'teas', some daily exercise to keep toned and supple coupled with some strenuous workouts at training twice a week.

I really don't need sex, drugs and r'n'roll any more, do enjoy some from time to time, and find myself feeling extraordinarily happy for no obvious reason other than feeling really well.

Sleep longer hours at night, minimum 6 or so, sometimes up to 8 without waking up until dawn, unless I'm up and about at night busy doing something.

Don't watch TV, porn, movies or read novels, life's too full of reality, which really can be stranger than fiction, so got to keep wits sharp.

I go through autolysis, in some form constantly, my body digesting and recycling fats and proteins, rebuilding muscle bulk in waves, no added creatine or steroids, just my food and water.

No insulin, sugar, cholesterol, BP, organ or bowel problems at all. Eyesight's not got any worse than needing reading glasses sometime, only, which is puzzling.

I now have and remember wonderful dreams, stuff to ponder and think about in reflection, something I hadn't had as an increasing ly constant experience since I was half my age.

I'll still tuck into a steak and gravy with baked veges, and mustard, and so on, once in a while, really enjoy it....I can afford to.

That's what ketosis has done for me.

Keep at it Donald36, you won't regret it, it can only get better. 

Cheers.  :Smile:

----------


## cyrille

> along with water and a balance of minerals being the key molecule that is used and recycled back after energy's released, during any  of the body's processes.


Funny that...you've been recycling minerals and water...without your posts lately seeming like those of a renowned forum nutter  in any way whatsoever.

No lapses in logic. No tedious belligerence. Remarkable.

----------


## CaptainNemo

> cheese


really?!

----------


## CaptainNemo

> Weird innit?  
> 
> Gotta remember that when lunging up on some weed, loads of CO2, CO, ash and tar  go with the THC to cut down your O2 intake to give that initial rush of getting stoned,......hypoxia, gas will do the same.


What if you bake it and eat it? Chop it up and put in salad?

----------


## ENT

Bloody good idea, or simmer it gently in butter then add morning glory and mushrooms beaten up with eggs fried into an omelette or quickly scrambled for a lovely mellow start to a lazy weekend or evening.

----------


## ENT

> Originally Posted by ENT
> 
> 
> cheese
> 
> 
> really?!


Yup. 

I got a whole rant together on that point, and some issues relating to cholesterol.

Here goes;

Cheese is a powerhouse of fats and proteins, as are all dairy products.

There's been a load of misinformation in the popular media claiming that dairy products, fatty meat and eggs are bad for you because of their potential cholesterol content.

The thing is, though, the digestive process breaks all that fat and oil and converts it in the liver to glycols, then into carbohydrates then into sugars which get oxidised into Co2 through work/exercise and other bodily metabolic processes then eliminated, the excess sugars re-convert into cholesterol and stored as fat for later use when food is in short supply.                                                                                      

Too much stored will raise your LDL and triglyceride levels, combining with unassimilated calcium ending up furring up your arteries, restricting blood flow thus putting unnecessary pressure on the heart and circulatory system with all the well known consequences.




_That_ great power pump (one of three in the human body, legs being the other two) has before then _also_ undergone calcification, and woop-de-do, a stiffened up weak heart unable to cope with the pressure, its arteries clogged, potentially resulting in a coronary thrombosis, a heart attack.                                                                                                                                      

Bits of that calcified grease in the arteries break off, circulating through the blood stream until they reach the smaller capillaries at the extremities, feet, fingers and brain, causing blockages which will numb your fingers and toes and build up back pressure felt as aching legs and blocked, varicose veins, and setting the condition for deep tissue thrombosis, exacerbated by pressure under the thighs, usually, cutting off circulation causing blood to pool up, thicken and clot.                                                                                                                                          

In the brain, the pressure in the tiny clogged capillaries is experienced as headaches and wooziness, then potentially forming an embolism which can burst through over-exertion, even just standing up, a stroke.  

That's why excessive amounts of fatty foods combined with carbs and sugars is a death trap. Moderation in all things is key to a healthy diet, combined with regular daily exercise, as sitting down all day and you'll die, stand up and move around and you'll live. Just take baby steps to start with if you've been more sedentary for a while or your heart will start racing, you'll be out of breath and feel knackered even climbing up a set of stairs. Being overweight anyway and having a high BP compounds the issue, as does diabetes as energy levels are 'way ta fwk so the poor old heart won't be able to cope keeping the circulatory system going, so organ failure, usually kidneys first.

A well balanced calcium to magnesium and sodium to potassium balance is essential to keeping electrical activity of the body right, or the heart will develop arrhythmia, while kidneys will overload with calcite and urea and clap out with kidney stones. 

So a balance of calcium from dairy with magnesium from veges etc is not a bad thing, but you need as much magnesium as calcium, IMO.


Dairy has also been condemned because it contain inorganic agri-chemicals, hormones and antibiotics.

True enough, but the claimants fail to mention how the body and other processes destroy and eliminate that shite long before the stuff's absorbed from the gut. Antibiotics and hormones from dairy and commercially raised stock break down in cooking, then digestion, then in the liver and passed out via the kidneys as ineffective. The inorganic agri chemicals contained in almost all foods can only be purged out of the body with copious amounts of water and 'lock on' elements such as selenium, iodine and calcium etc.                                        

Enough anti-oxidants such Vit A, C and E, selenium and other minerals and herbs are necessary to rid your body of harmfull agri-chems and heavy metals. Chew pine barks, (various) brilliant anti-oxidants and organic catalyst aiding in boosting ATP levels and function.

Stay clean the fwk away from fluorides, in any form, the poison's in all available foods, so go seriously organic or risk turning into stone, the shite will fossilize you alive, fact.



Gotta keep the body's electrical activity right too, or the heart won't tick along at a steady rate either, arrhythmia, another potential cause of heart and circulatory problems, so get your sodium/potassium balance right.                                                                              

Get into the firm habit of breathing only through your nose, it filters the air and allows bacteria in the mouth, nose and throat to produce nitric oxide which is another heart electrics regulator, keeps arrhythmia in check, and also regulates Co2 to O2 exchange rate in the lungs
_Lobelia_ dilates the airways and blood capillaries around the micro-tubules of the lungs, aiding nitric oxide to get the lungs functioning to the optimum. Sage (_salvia_) works well with _lobelia_, causing expectoration of mucus and crap clogging the lungs.


PS.

Had a BP check earlier this evening.
BP = 115/65 
Pulse = 60

Not bad for a 71 yr young man eh?   :Smile:

----------


## Neverna

> Had a BP check earlier this evening.
> BP = 115/65 
> Pulse = 60
> 
> Not bad for a 71 yr young man eh?


Yep, not bad. My BP is about the same (115/170) but my pulse at rest is usually below 50 (48 as I post this).

----------


## ENT

That's what you get for adjusting your lifestyle and diet and leaping around all day, innit?

During training, pulse rate drops nicely at rest.

----------


## CaptainNemo

> Originally Posted by CaptainNemo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by ENT
> ...


Careful, you're giving me a stiffy.  :Very Happy: 

Give us a weekly diet schedule, and I'll give you 50p  :Very Happy: 

I am curious to see what you think is a good array of things to eat. I've got my own list... with like walnuts and basil and salmon salads, and venison with asparagus wisps, but I keep fucking it up by downing a whole bottle of malt whisky, a bottle and a half of wine, and a 6-pack - it just happens.

[belch]  :Very Happy:

----------


## Grampa

_We now know this, but it highlights how wrong the doctors and govt regulated "health recommendations" have been.

_


> *New Study Favors Fat Over Carbs*
> 
>  	                                                                                                                                                       By NICHOLAS BAKALARSEPT. 8, 2017 
> Continue reading the main story Share This Page  
> 
> 
> 
>                                              Photo                   
> 
> ...


_
_

----------


## Maanaam

> studied diet and mortality in 135,335 people between 35 and 70 years old in 18 countries, following them for an average of more than seven years.


That's quite a compelling study.

----------


## Neverna

> _We now know this, but it highlights how wrong the doctors and govt regulated "health recommendations" have been.
> 
> _
> 
> 
> 
> *New Study Favors Fat Over Carbs*
> 
>  	                                                                                                                                                       By NICHOLAS BAKALARSEPT. 8, 2017 
> ...


One would have to read the fulll report to get the whole picture (can you access that Cold Pizza/Barbaro?). From the summary in the Lancet, the NY Times headline is misleading.

This quote provided by Reuters from one of the authors of the study gives a clearer picture.




> “What we are suggesting is moderation as opposed to very low and very high intakes of fats and carbohydrates,” said Mahshid Dehghan from McMaster University in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada.
> 
> When the researchers separated people into five groups based on carbohydrate consumption, they found that people who ate the most carbohydrates were 28 percent more likely to die from any cause during the study than those who ate the least.
> 
> When people were divided into five groups based on how much fat they consumed, those who consumed the most fat - of any kind - were about 23 percent less likely to die during the study than those who ate the least. The findings were consistent no matter what type of fat was consumed.


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKCN1B92PN

----------


## Grampa

> One would have to read the fulll report to get the whole picture (can you access that Cold Pizza/Barbaro?).


If you think I am him the joke is on you

----------


## Klondyke

> When people were divided into five groups based on how much fat they consumed, those who consumed the most fat - of any kind - were about 23 percent less likely to die during the study than those who ate the least. The findings were consistent no matter what type of fat was consumed.


That's quite funny when generally known that fats contribute to a higher value of the bad cholesterol (LDL), hence, an increase of heart attack risk (just reminded by doctor at my recent check-up).

----------


## Grampa

> When people were divided into five groups based on how much fat they consumed, those who consumed the most fat - of any kind - were about 23 percent less likely to die during the study than those who ate the least. The findings were consistent no matter what type of fat was consumed.
> 			
> 		
> 
> That's quite funny when generally known that fats contribute to a higher value of the bad cholesterol (LDL), hence, an increase of heart attack risk (just reminded by doctor at my recent check-up).


1. it depends on what kind of fat (Monos are good) and equally important is,

2. not having these fats with any simple carbs.

The bloods numbers actually improve.

One of the best, backed up with ample data, and he lost 150 lbs. His blood numbers improved.

----------


## moonx

I have been low carb for just over a month. I have to say that is true i got leaner, even though i actually had extra fat to loose. But i train mrtial arts, and it felt like when it comes to workout, explosiveness, power, nothing beats a nice carb fueled muscles.

----------

