#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Thailand and Asia News >  >  > Business, Finance & Economics in Thailand >  >  Prime Minister to launch Credit Cards for northeastern farmers

## Mid

*Prime Minister to launch Credit Cards for north-eastern farmers* 
Sirinthip  Sitabutr 

BANGKOK, 29 July 2012  (NNT)  The mobile cabinet meeting in Surin during July 29-30 will focus  on development projects in eight lower north-eastern provinces. It will  also be an opportunity for the government to distribute credit cards to  farmers, one of the major campaign promises that the Pheu Thai Party  made to win the election last July. 

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra said members of the Cabinet have been  asked to make field visits ahead of the meeting and work with the  provincial governors involved as well as the private sector to ensure  smooth execution of priority development projects. The eight provinces  targeted by the Cabinet are Surin, Buriram, Si Sa Ket, Ubon Ratchathani,  Nakhon Ratchasima, Chaiyaphum, Amnat Charoen and Yasothon.  

Ms. Yingluck said the governments urgent policy is to distribute credit  cards to farmers which they can use to buy agricultural factors such as  fertilizers, plant seeds or pesticides from stores registered with the  Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives. Farmer  representatives from 19 north-eastern provinces will receive the cards at  a ceremony to be held in Surin Province.  

Meanwhile, Surins Chamber of Commerce has prepared to ask the Cabinet  to support the province with transport infrastructure, promote border  trade and develop more water sources. Mr. Kriangsak Palikupt, president  of the Surin Chamber of Commerce, said the province is famous for its  Hom Mali fragrant rice and needs to have reliable water supply.  

The province will also urge the government to support its project to  bring back local elephants roaming for money with their mahouts in major  cities. Surin is a well-known elephant habitat and organizes a yearly  elephant round-up that brings a lot of tourists.

thainews.prd.go.th

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## Fabian

What a brilliant idea.

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## Yasojack

Are these cards interest free?

The BAAC already loans the money to the farmers every year, so are the farmers not going to get cash on the loans, it seems suspect where are the farmers going to buy there products, presently they can get there stuff on credit and then pay at the harvest.

To many questions and no information.

The BAAC already has biilions of baht worth of Chanotes, and i believe its been making it harder for farmers to get loans which is not a bad thing, the loan sharks where we are have been having a field day.

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## Yasojack

BAAC to Provide Credit Cards, Debt Moratorium For Farmers - Voice TV

i read there supposed to be interest free, then read this.

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## noelbino

Did she tell them that they have to pay the money back?

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## Yasojack

Google Translate
prime Minister has launched a credit card farmers.

Pin It.

The Prime Minister presided over the opening of agricultural credit programs. With the Northeast farmers. To increase investment in agriculture. And ensure that farmers do not make monetary and fiscal discipline. The card only to purchase raw materials only.
Mr. Prime Minister, with the appearance of coming to the mill to Agricultural Cooperative Bank for Agriculture and Marketing. Wisai district. Calendar. The chairman of the launch. 'Credit card projects, farmers' representatives to the Northeast and 19 farmers by the government and credit cards Mock up farmers to farm more font with an open spot in television advertising. The farm loan programs, "ฉeai farming" and watch a demonstration of the credit card to purchase farm inputs through the terminal EDC.
Credit card for farmers. A project by the government. So that farmers can get loans with convenience. The amount for the cost of procurement of agricultural inputs such as seeds, fertilizer and herbicide, Fri evening service the plant. BAAC and Co., a smart card system, farmers' loans. Current delivered to the farmers and 39,483 tickets are available through the service shops in the area 38 of the font. Farmers to buy inputs through to 6742 and the BAAC has a policy issued to the members of the cooperative farmers and agricultural. Members of community funds. Community enterprise. The farmers generally. The plan will build on a credit card. For the purchase of all types in the future.
The format of the card. The limit of 70 percent of output to be sold. No interest will be the first 5 months after a special interest in MR was 7 percent to be paid soon. And the discount will amount to. The future expansion in other species.
The Prime Minister said the government's solution to the people in the northeast of the subject. The credit card program to solve the problem of lack of funds. This will allow people to have a career. And reduce the interest burden that will not upset the financial discipline. This card can only be purchased inputs only.
Prime Minister of the Center for complaint. Meet the farmers and all those engaged in agricultural areas of Intellectual Property applied. And visit the mill to the farmers market customers' BAAC and the briefing of the value chain (value chain) and watch a group of agricultural products, respectively.

by. Pukwipa.

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## Rural Surin

> What a brilliant idea.


Indeed.
Can't have enough access to a destructive lifestyle, can we? ::chitown::

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## Gerbil

How this will work in full:

1. Cards will be issued.
2. Farmers will use cards to buy 'agricultural goods' from the approved stores.
3. Farmers will sell 'agricultural goods' to un-approved stores at below market rates for cash.
4. Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc.
5. Farmers will ignore repayment requests.
6. BAAC will (after around a year) start sending threatening letters to Farmers.
7. Farmers will stage protests, block roads, etc. demanding a 'debt moratorium'
8. Government will give in and let them off repayments for 3-5 years - in reality those repayments will never be collected.
9. Farmers will demand more loans.

The cycle repeats.

All the above paid for by taxpayers like me (not Calgary's fictitious taxpayers)  :Sad:

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## Albert Shagnastier

> 1. Cards will be issued. 2. Farmers will use cards to buy 'agricultural goods' from the approved stores. 3. Farmers will sell 'agricultural goods' to un-approved stores at below market rates for cash. 4. Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc. 5. Farmers will ignore repayment requests. 6. BAAC will (after around a year) start sending threatening letters to Farmers. 7. Farmers will stage protests, block roads, etc. demanding a 'debt moratorium' 8. Government will give in and let them off repayments for 3-5 years - in reality those repayments will never be collected. 9. Farmers will demand more loans.


That's exactly what will most likely happen. Banks are sneaky fuckers, but no match for Thais  :Smile:

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## jamescollister

Well where I am the nearest place that takes credit cards is Tesco/Lotus and that's 70 km away. Don't think there is much need of the plastic fantastic around here. 
Only a few have bank accounts, an other ploy to get people into the western system so that tax can be got at a later date. Jim

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## Yasojack

James they all have accounts i bet, BAAC but not any money in there only there chanotes.

Think your point about Tax, could well be true.

I have been saying for sometime the Banks are going to go for the land of the farmers, in the not to distant future, if the country folks want a equal footing something they have to come to terms with.

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## BobR

Maybe they can connect the credit card's computers to the vote tabulation computers and give these Red Shirt monkeys a credit to their account balances for voting PTP.  Much more efficient and modern than passing out cash or cheap tablets.

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## Yasojack

You may find not all Farming communities are red shirts.

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## jamescollister

> James they all have accounts i bet, BAAC but not any money in there only there chanotes.
> 
> Think your point about Tax, could well be true.
> 
> I have been saying for sometime the Banks are going to go for the land of the farmers, in the not to distant future, if the country folks want a equal footing something they have to come to terms with.


No charnots out here, all land is still crown land, it will be many years before the survey people venture in to try and sort out who owns what,
Only people with bank accounts are those who have bought cars on the never never. Still very remote up this way and the longer it takes the world to find us the better I like it. Jim

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## DrB0b

> Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc.


This one regularly pops up on TD. Why is that so many people on this forum have such a chip on their shoulder about small businesses spending money on communications and transport? Seems like a good idea to me.

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## DrB0b

> Well where I am the nearest place that takes credit cards is Tesco/Lotus and that's 70 km away. Don't think there is much need of the plastic fantastic around here.


The farm credit cards aren't meant to be used in places like that. The cards can only be used at BAAC affiliates, they are not general purpose credit cards - as credit cards they can only be used to buy fuel and farm supplies. The main purpose of these cards is to help farmers break away from the extortionate interest-rates on credit granted by local suppliers of fuel and agricultural supplies. In other words, to help farmers stay out of the hands of loan sharks. The cards provide 30 days interest free credit with a fixed 7% interest rate after that. Holders will also qualify for small instant loans of up to B10,000 Baht and longer-term loans of up 70% of the anticipated value of their harvest. The card-holders will also get free life insurance.

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## harrybarracuda

Sounds like a smart way to get around Election bribery laws if you ask me.

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by jamescollister
> 
> Well where I am the nearest place that takes credit cards is Tesco/Lotus and that's 70 km away. Don't think there is much need of the plastic fantastic around here.
> 
> 
> The farm credit cards aren't meant to be used in places like that. The cards can only be used at BAAC affiliates, they are not general purpose credit cards - as credit cards they can only be used to buy fuel and farm supplies. The main purpose of these cards is to help farmers break away from the extortionate interest-rates on credit granted by local suppliers of fuel and agricultural supplies. In other words, to help farmers stay out of the hands of loan sharks. The cards provide 30 days interest free credit with a fixed 7% interest rate after that. Holders will also qualify for small instant loans of up to B10,000 Baht and longer-term loans of up 70% of the anticipated value of their harvest. The card-holders will also get free life insurance.


Wasn't saying that they were for shopping, just that outside of the bank and 7/11s cash machines there are no card readers in these parts. Think we need telephone lines first. The nearest bank is almost 30 km. 
They have assess to the farmers bank for short and longer term loans at low interests now. Giving out a plastic card, to me seems just another way of roping people into a western credit system. 
Just like the free electricity scheme, let them have free power for a few lights. Next comes the TV etc and they are hooked and the bills follow. Jim

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## Butterfly

> Why is that so many people on this forum have such a chip on their shoulder about small businesses spending money on communications and transport? Seems like a good idea to me.


nothing wrong per se if we are talking base models, but sadly, they usually are being used for models they can't afford

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## jamescollister

On another tack, I will assume that the cards will be issued through one one more banks. Now farmer Joes all over are carrying a bank card/credit card. 
Farmer rocks up with his crop to sell, today gets cash in hand. Tomorrow money is deposited in his nice shinny new credit card come bank account.  same reasons as the west went from pay packets to direct deposits, moving large amounts of cash is dangerous and costly.
Next the transaction taxes come in and as they know the income of farmer Joe, when he earns enough the 15% agriculture tax kicks in. 
One day you wake up and people paying for things in cash have gone. Jim

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## Rural Surin

> You may find not all Farming communities are red shirts.


Better chance that most farming circles aren't that politically ravaged...
Indifferent.

The perpetuated myth that the "rural rebellion" is highly active is comical at best.

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## DrB0b

> On another tack, I will assume that the cards will be issued through one one more banks.


No. They will only be issued by the Bank of Agricultural Credit and Commerce. It's already been explained to you, just three posts before, how these cards work. Do you have difficulty reading or do you just find your own fantasies utterly compelling? Look, this is a wired world, I know you have a computer, why on earth don't you actually make an effort to find out about how these cards work (none of it is secret, it's all on the net - you don't have to _assume_ anything) instead of posting your deluded, imaginary nonsense? No doubt you're going to get all upset now and claim to have been insulted but, for fucks sake, it's already been explained clearly to you and you've obviously made no effort yourself to find out how these things work.

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by jamescollister
> 
> On another tack, I will assume that the cards will be issued through one one more banks.
> 
> 
> No. They will only be issued by the Bank of Agricultural Credit and Commerce. It's already been explained to you, just three posts before, how these cards work. Do you have difficulty reading or do you just find your own fantasies utterly compelling? Look, this is a wired world, I know you have a computer, why on earth don't you actually make an effort to find out about how these cards work (none of it is secret, it's all on the net - you don't have to _assume_ anything) instead of posting your deluded, imaginary nonsense? No doubt you're going to get all upset now and claim to have been insulted but, for fucks sake, it's already been explained clearly to you and you've obviously made no effort yourself to find out how these things work.


Don't think I will get all bent out of shape over it.
I am a farmer in Thailand [ Google name ] and I have seen schemes set up by the Government over the years, all have had good sounding ideas and all where for alternative motives.
What you read on the net is PR, to believe what you read is one thing, but what the reality is is another.
By all means please respond and tell me, who you are and what dealings you in fact have with farming in Thailand, such as have attended Government/ farmer meetings etc
If  you can not I will take it you are another arm chair expert, sitting in a small room in the UK. Jim

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## Smug Farang Bore

Thais just look at credit cards as free money when it's full they move on to another way of funding their lifestyle/habits.

As for the one miiiion to a village ..

Piss up, new pic up, n mobiles.

Pay loan?. . Mai Khao Chai.

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## robuzo

> Originally Posted by Gerbil
> 
>  Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc.
> 
> 
> This one regularly pops up on TD. Why is that so many people on this forum have such a chip on their shoulder about small businesses spending money on communications and transport? Seems like a good idea to me.


Peasants look more quaint on the backs of buffaloes.

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## hazz

One of the major issues for thai farmers is their dependence on loans to buy the necessary inputs prior to harvest which I believe are after provided by the distributers of these inputs and the crop buyers at loan shark rates. There was a detailed post quite sometime ago where one of our member's described how taking loans from the local casiva mill made the difference between fairly breaking even and making a decent RTI.

This scheme has the potential to break the farmers free of these parasites and above all else disproportionally helping the smallest scale farmers most... unlike the rice pledging scheme.

But the fly is in the implementation, given the talent thai's have for subverting anything for personal gain. 

In remote areas where there are few agricultural distributers, who make their real money from interest on loans..... they are going to collude to not join the scheme and keep things the way they are.In areas where there is more competition and perhaps places where the loans are more from the product buyers than the agricultural distributors, you can be sure that the agents of the bank will ensure that there is a shortage of approvals for being able to take these cards. they will then take bribes and  the highest bidders will be allowed to take those cards, get a RTI by charging higher prices than those distributers who cannot take the cards.You are then going to have issues with the distributors who accept the cards offering 'cash back' against the cards in exchange for a percentage.

All of these issues will subvert the public motivations for issuing the cards, which is to make small scale farming more economical sustainable in the long term. There is a real risk that we will simply see tax payer money going to make rich and corrupt  people richer and bury the poorest farmers further in debt.

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## jamescollister

In reality the above article is just a Government press release, it has little in the way off facts
First BAAC is not going to give farmers credit cards, a credit provider is being looked for, they will issue the cards, provide the systems and services.
2nd farmers will need to prove their income from the previous year to qualify for a 70% credit limit on that income.. 
Rural Thailand is a cash society and thus is tax free on most cash incomes. If you want a credit  card you will need to show the bank ergo the Government how much you earned. 
I have a rubber processing company, we buy latex liquid and make sheet rubber. A value adding process and have to pay VAT, if we make enough.
Guy down the road somewhere buys latex from neighbors for cash makes sheet, sells for cash, no VAT or income tax. His buyer then sells to the next middleman in the chain for cash, again no tax. Same goes for most farm produce.
Anyone applying for this credit card will need to have a bank account of some sort and documents for sales. So the next guy up the chain will have to issue a proper receipt making the cash sale visible. Next comes the direct payment into the bank account. One more step to a western style tax system.
      I know most people consider rural Thais as all poor, but many of the smart ones earn western size incomes, but pay no taxes on these incomes.
      Even though the article says the card can only be used for farm supplies, that is only for the trial period, then the card will become a normal credit card. Jim

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## hazz

a few years ago I saw a report discussing cash in thailand. At the time, the thai government required all cash transactions involving more than 2M Baht to be reported to the government and that the government received over 20,000 reports of such transactions daily.

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## Mid

and it's rocket science to pay 3 mill in two 1.5 mill instalments ?

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## aging one

This whole thing is just silly. Its throwing money away so a farmer can have prestige and say " I have a credit card".  It could have been done so much easier by extending the same credit that exists at better terms. 

But during an election " We will give you credit cards" rang true. No bank would touch them. They are totally the under the control of the Thai government.

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## jamescollister

> This whole thing is just silly. Its throwing money away so a farmer can have prestige and say " I have a credit card".  It could have been done so much easier by extending the same credit that exists at better terms. 
> 
> But during an election " We will give you credit cards" rang true. No bank would touch them. They are totally the under the control of the Thai government.


Think there s the crunch, who will be the credit card provider, if it is to be more than a store card after a trial period and become a real credit card. Very limited number of credit card providers that can provide that service, visa or mastercard, would they be interested, BAAC under writing any loss maybe , maybe not. A debit card yes but any bank can provide that. Jim

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## beerlaodrinker

So sao na somchai can now get his lao khao fix on the never never eh

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## Rocksteady

> Maybe they can connect the credit card's computers to the vote tabulation computers and give these Red Shirt monkeys a credit to their account balances for voting PTP. Much more efficient and modern than passing out cash or cheap tablets.


 Now, this sounds more like it.  There's no such thing as a free lunch and once you have taken the government's 30 pieces of silver you might be asked to do them a favour in the future (see Marlon Brando behind his desk at the wedding party)

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## Norton

> who will be the credit card provider


Everything I've seen say's Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives (BAAC)
They have already distributed some in Chiang Mai, Udon Thani, Ayutthaya, Lopburi, and Saraburi.



> BAAC under writing any loss maybe


Yep. "BAAC president Luck Wajananawat estimates his bank's funding cost for absorbing one month's interest at 116 million baht a year."

Farm cards at zero interest | Bangkok Post: business

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## donald36

farmers to qualify must have chanotes--sad that --they have lived on the land for years --the kind government recently gave them chanotes--now they can borrow money--  happy week spending -- then lose the land and their children swell the Bangkok masses in a factory for minimal wages --good plan for the rich to take over even more of the land and hence the wealth of Thailand

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by beerlaodrinker
> 
> who will be the credit card provider
> 
> 
> Everything I've seen say's Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives (BAAC)
> They have already distributed some in Chiang Mai, Udon Thani, Ayutthaya, Lopburi, and Saraburi.
> 
> 
> ...


Think the original policy was drafted in 2009 and the BAAC was to find a provider for the credit cards, otherwise it is not in fact a credit card, but a store card which gives credit in some stores. Big job to computer link systems to 6000 authorized stores. 
If I can find the link to the original Government proposal I will post it, but the net is poor and unreliable here in the jungle. Jim  
And no jungle Jim come backs.

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## Rural Surin

> So sao na somchai can now get his lao khao fix on the never never eh


Yes. Along with the uneasy and unsettling feeling of authoritarian oligarchical control and dependency.

Drink up....!!
Ignore the fantasy.

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## nostromo

Debit card - not a credit card, payment card is a way to modern society, brings every aspect of commerce accountable. I can not see wrong in govt plan.

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## prairieboy

> How this will work in full:
> 
> 1. Cards will be issued.
> 2. Farmers will use cards to buy 'agricultural goods' from the approved stores.
> 3. Farmers will sell 'agricultural goods' to un-approved stores at below market rates for cash.
> 4. Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc.
> 5. Farmers will ignore repayment requests.
> 6. BAAC will (after around a year) start sending threatening letters to Farmers.
> 7. Farmers will stage protests, block roads, etc. demanding a 'debt moratorium'
> ...


Well put - this is my opinion also!

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## nostromo

Nice one rodent. Have another nick with all of 4 posts telling you are great. Wank*r shi*e.

You must know you are a loser. Afraid to come to real world. 
As in Strike Back (Season 2 ep 4), there was a terrorist who was whining. Section 20 chief said "you were never a soldier" shot him in head.  She is Amanda Mealing actually, also from Spooks. 






> Originally Posted by Gerbil
> 
> 
> How this will work in full:
> 
> 1. Cards will be issued.
> 2. Farmers will use cards to buy 'agricultural goods' from the approved stores.
> 3. Farmers will sell 'agricultural goods' to un-approved stores at below market rates for cash.
> 4. Farmers will use cash to buy mobile phones, motorbikes, etc.
> ...

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## jamescollister

It would seem the credit card scheme was cancelled last year and this new scheme is just a face saving attempt by the Government. Article from the Nation below.



THE NATION
 September 30, 2011  12:00 am                  *The government has cancelled its plan to issue  credit cards to farmers, claiming the Pheu Thai Party's populist promise  is too complicated for famers' debt payments.*

          	The first lot of credit cards had been promised to 5,000 farmers in  five provinces, to coincide with the start of the government's rice  mortgage scheme at the end of next week.

	Instead, plans are well advanced for lines of credit to be granted to  farmers by the Bank of Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives,  accessible through individually issued atuomated teller machine cards.  But this credit will not be available until March or April next year.

	Finance Minister Thirachai Phuvanatnaranubala said yesterday the  credit-card platform was too complicated for the payment of farmers'  debts. Proceeding with the credit cards would have involved many  requirements, such as smart cards with microchips for farmers' personal  data.

	He said the government was now considering a means of debt payment that  was familiar to farmers, under the Bank for Agriculture and  Agricultural Cooperatives (BAAC). The bank's normal practice is to allow  farmers a line of credit through an ATM card.

	"Farmers will have their own credit card [in the new form] to ensure  their credit lines by March or April next year at least, to encourage  their main-crop plantation," Thirachai said.

	Proceeding with credit cards would have cost the government about Bt1  billion. This money should be spent on other assistance measures that  will create bigger benefits, he said.

	The demise of the credit-card plan has meant that BAAC has cancelled  the bidding process by companies wishing to manage the farmers' credit  cards.

	There were 13 companies interested in the bidding. Only five firms have  submitted bids to date and only three of them are qualified.

	Thirachai said his ministry had discussed the changes with Prime  Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and Deputy Prime Minister and Com-merce  Minister Kittiratt Na-Ranong, explaining the reasons for the decision  and assuring the availability of credit for farmers in the long term.

	BAAC executive vice president Apirom Sukprasert said the bank was  considering a "closed loop" ATM card, which it used for specific  purposes and which limited the location for users. This strategy avoids  the need to comply with international-card standards. In addition, farm  shops have asked to be registered.

	On a related issue, the BAAC yesterday considered measures to prevent  corruption in the soon-to-be-launched rice-pledging scheme. Both farmers  and their rice will be seriously inspected, including an examination of  rice quality in terms of contamination and humidity, and to determine  that it is purely Thai rice and not mixed with rice from neighbouring  countries.

	These inspections will take place at warehouses of both the Public  Warehouse Organisation and the Market Organisation for Farmers.

	The bank will work as the government's arm, as a credit provider to  farmers. It is estimated that Bt410 billion will be required to support  the project. Of this, Bt90 billion will come from the BAAC and the  remaining Bt320 billion will have to be borrowed from whichever  commercial banks offer the most attractive interest rates.

	The Finance Ministry will have to allocate Bt16 billion to subsidise interest payments under the whole rice-pledging scheme.

	Thirachai said yesterday that the government might not need to spend as  much as Bt410 billion, as it planned to continue exporting the rice.  This strategy will allow the government some working capital, he said.

	The government is also planning to extend a debt moratorium to farmers  who own less than Bt500,000, for three years. This will begin tomorrow  and end on September 30, 2014. About 639,589 farmers will qualify for  the programme, with total principal of Bt77.75 billion. Good debtors  will enjoy a special offer from the |bank of life-insurance coverage of  Bt100,000. However, they will be forbidden to borrow new funds during  the period of the moratorium.

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## Thetyim

> The bank will work as the government's arm, as a credit provider to farmers. It is estimated that Bt410 billion will be required to support the project. Of this, Bt90 billion will come from the BAAC and the remaining Bt320 billion will have to be borrowed from whichever commercial banks offer the most attractive interest rates.


All this so the government can sell the rice at a loss  :mid:

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## baldrick

> Both farmers and their rice will be seriously inspected, including an examination of rice quality in terms of contamination and humidity, and to determine that it is purely Thai rice and not mixed with rice from neighbouring countries.


ah - a good govt initiative to raise employment

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## nostromo

> It would seem the credit card scheme was cancelled last year and this new scheme is just a face saving attempt by the Government. Article from the Nation below.


All you read in Nation is extremely biased yellow PAD new party politics crap (you remember the guys who wish to end democracy), except for the travel and sports sections. How about checking some facts from the Internet, BBC, CNN, CBC, Bloomberg and the other "enemies of the state, bought by Mr. T" according to PAD.

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by jamescollister
> 
> 
> It would seem the credit card scheme was cancelled last year and this new scheme is just a face saving attempt by the Government. Article from the Nation below.
> 
> 
> All you read in Nation is extremely biased yellow PAD new party politics crap (you remember the guys who wish to end democracy), except for the travel and sports sections. How about checking some facts from the Internet, BBC, CNN, CBC, Bloomberg and the other "enemies of the state, bought by Mr. T" according to PAD.


Don't really follow, unless you mean Visa, MasterCard and the few other credit card providers are conspiring to keep credit cards from Thai farmers. Jim

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## baldrick

> All you read in Nation is extremely biased yellow PAD new party politics crap


except we do not need any news paper to tell us that this idea is fcuking ludicrous and will not do what it should.

I have no issue with getting credit to farmers in need and them using to purchase farming supplies from local retailers , but this is just another scheme to attempt to line the pockets of the nepotistic scum with govt funds.

you can't trust most of these fcukers who wear a uniform in their photographic organagrams with more than 5 baht

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## nostromo

> Originally Posted by nostromo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by jamescollister
> ...


You could read your previous post. 

And the said Nation article. 

And just for you to know, Thais have quite a many credit cards. 

And there is a thread on TV (not here, this aint a place for politically correct kunts), where loser birdshit farangs from Khao San Road complain about not getting credit cards. Should you be posting there?

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by jamescollister
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by nostromo
> ...


Really have no idea what you are on about, think you are a bit strange. Khao San road and farangs with credit cards. 
Thais have  many credit cards, not so. Only Thais with jobs can have credit cards, as they can prove their income. Small farmers can not prove a yearly income.
I am a farmer here and wife nor I can get a credit card as we can not prove a yearly guaranteed income. Can buy a mil plus car on payments, but no credit card. 
Jim

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## Rural Surin

> Debit card - not a credit card, payment card is a way to modern society, brings every aspect of commerce accountable. I can not see wrong in govt plan.


But then, what if your beloved _modern_ way is incredibly destructive to society?

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## jamescollister

I will just put this in, somewhat off topic, but relevant. Out here in the badlands of the Lao/Cambodia border. Farmers can buy fertilizer, seed etc with almost no interest from the farming supply stores. They charge a fee to give it to you on credit. It is not big, some give 3 months credit free. The farmers who go to the money lenders etc have defaulted before. They are bad risks and no matter what country you come from bad risk loans costs more.
There are co ops that you can join which help poor farmers, but if you don't pay the money back, then you are out of the loop. 
Taking land as collateral in not viable here as most farm land is still crown land and even if it has charnot title it can take 7 years before the courts settle the case and no court will hand over land for a small loan on fertilizer. Waste of time and money for the creditor.
Governments all over the world bring out schemes to win votes and those schemes never materialize. Jim

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## nostromo

> Originally Posted by nostromo
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>  Originally Posted by jamescollister
> ...


Listen mate, I am not against you, actually support people in your position. I just hope you would be more source-critical and thinking about what you read in the 2 farang speaking newspapers. It is not all true. You live in this country. I live in this country. I think we both want to make everything better. And we can disagree, but in the end we want the same thing. OK?

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## chingching

dumb idea- they will get themselves up to their eyeballs in debt then lose their land and end up potless

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## jamescollister

> Originally Posted by jamescollister
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>  Originally Posted by nostromo
> ...


Fair enough, we all want a better Thailand and I more so because I have kids here. They can always leave [ born in OZ ] but this is our home. Jim

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## Rural Surin

> dumb idea- they will get themselves up to their eyeballs in debt then lose their land and end up potless


 
That's the idea.
Keep the peasantry under control and dependent.

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## Itchy

They are going to need credit cards - They'll not be selling any rice this time next year.

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## Albert Shagnastier

> Originally Posted by chingching
> 
> 
> dumb idea- they will get themselves up to their eyeballs in debt then lose their land and end up potless
> 
> 
>  
> That's the idea.
> Keep the peasantry under control and dependent.


You're not wrong there mate.

1 basic bank account that charges you nothing and a fat wedge of cash is the last situation these fuckers want to see you in  :Smile:

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## hazz

All these farmers are self employed business men and farming is their business model, fundamentally the issue is that this model does not reliably provide these businessmen with the income for the lifestyle they want. More than that their business model is not that different to that of airbus or boeing, in that each time they produce a new product or crop... it if fails the finical consequences will probably wipe them out.

Farmers need a business model that provides them with a sustainable lifestyle. 
This will never happen whilst a single failed crop can wipe them out, 

paying them above market prices and dumping their ever increasing surplus on the world market is not going to work, its not worked for europe and north america.... why would it work here? Its not going. 

Giving them loans or land that they can sell or borrow against so subsidise their lifestyles.... well thats what got the europe and especially north america in the mess they have been in over the last 4-5 years.

I don't know what the answer is, to be honest if thailand wants to maintain large number of small scale farmers I am not sure there is a way for them to sustainable make a living. I do not these credit cards, rather like the previous loans that got forgiven or the land hand outs are simply expensive populist plasters that do nothing to provide a sustainable lifestyle to most of the recipients.

Perhaps they should simply set up a welfare system and hand money out. Its likely to be cheaper than these schemes they dream up and it will directly deal with the issue.... though in a way that does not help the politicians get their rents.

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## jamescollister

Think that often the bigger picture gets lost when we talk about one scheme and not the overall system.
Thailand is going through what Europe went through in the industrial revolution, except instead of an evolution of 100s of years, to move from a rural peasant economy to an industrial one,it will be 10s of years.
A very fine line has to be followed, you can not abandon the rural poor to poverty while the urban dwellers prosper. That's a road to armed revolution, better to subsidies the poor until the city jobs are available. Then move them over to the factories etc. Their lands sold off to big farming companies.
One day you wake up and Thailand is an Asian UK. How many in the UK own farm land to return to when they lose their jobs, few. The state provides and the factory fodder waits for the next cycle of boom and bust. Jim

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## nostromo

Good post. Though Industrial revolution and all that happened, was for the best for all of us. I would not have my Samsung phone without that.

The future for many is now to move to, perhaps, that much "free range" crops without that many fertilizers.... :Smile:  that will sell for good money. 

UK agricultural sector is now about million times more competitive than continental europe, it is just that they do not get similar state subsidies - hope they will still survive - my best wishes from SE Asia. 





> Think that often the bigger picture gets lost when we talk about one scheme and not the overall system.
> Thailand is going through what Europe went through in the industrial revolution, except instead of an evolution of 100s of years, to move from a rural peasant economy to an industrial one,it will be 10s of years.
> A very fine line has to be followed, you can not abandon the rural poor to poverty while the urban dwellers prosper. That's a road to armed revolution, better to subsidies the poor until the city jobs are available. Then move them over to the factories etc. Their lands sold off to big farming companies.
> One day you wake up and Thailand is an Asian UK. How many in the UK own farm land to return to when they lose their jobs, few. The state provides and the factory fodder waits for the next cycle of boom and bust. Jim

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## Mid

*Credit cards fail to win over Thai farmers*
Hataikarn Treesuwan
Tuesday, Jul 16, 2013



*THAILAND* - Launched two years ago, the farmers' credit-card scheme in Thailand has proved to be anything but a success.

 As of June, only about 10 billion baht (S$405 million) of credit was  outstanding in the first phase from the total budget of 57 billion baht,  according to the Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives  (BAAC).

 Armean Thaupmungkung, a consultant to farmers' associations,  preferred the government rice-pledging scheme's guarantee of 15,000 baht  per tonne. Besides increasing the debt burden on farmers, the card  scheme failed because not many merchants joined, and they usually offer a  limited choice of products, he said.

 For example, 15-20-0 formula fertiliser at a participating shop in  Ayutthaya is quoted at 15,500-16,000 baht per tonne, against 15,000 baht  at other shops.

 "If the government continues this project, it should give farmers  cash credit. If farmers have to go into debt, they should have the right  to buy any brand they want at any shop," he said.

 The scheme would also be better if it was extended to cover all 13.5  million farmers instead of just 2.4 million now, he said. The government  plans to boost it to 4 million with extra benefits.

 Apirom Sukprasert, executive vice president of BAAC, still insists  that the project is worthwhile. Of the 4.5 million eligible farmers -  those enrolled in the bank's debt-restructuring scheme - the bank  planned to issue cards to 2 million in the first phase.

 Yet, the bank's records show that out of approved credit lines of  56.89 billion baht, the farmers have used only 9.96 billion baht as of  June, while participating shops numbered only 4,986 versus the 10,000  target. This month, approved credit lines exceeded 10 billion baht.

news.asiaone.com

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## leemo

> Are these cards interest free?
> 
> The BAAC already loans the money to the farmers every year, so are the farmers not going to get cash on the loans, it seems suspect where are the farmers going to buy there products, presently they can get there stuff on credit and then pay at the harvest.
> 
> To many questions and no information.
> 
> The BAAC already has biilions of baht worth of Chanotes, and i believe its been making it harder for farmers to get loans which is not a bad thing, the loan sharks where we are have been having a field day.


Doesn't matter, it'll anyway bankrupt many farmers and communities.

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