#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Farming & Gardening In Thailand >  >  Fish Farm - NOT FOR THE FAINT HEARTED

## Perota

Warning : I took these pictures in a fish farm near my home in Korat. There are not photoshopped but there are not very nice either.

The dead pigs are used to feed the top breeders. If you plan to eat fish to dinner, do not watch these pictures.

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## Stinky

Whats the problem, are you a mussie?

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## Perota

Bon Appetit !

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## Perota



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## teddy

reminds me of 'nam and the kooks who said they were women and children

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## blackgang

Oh Yes, very tasty Thai raised fresh water fish.

And there are those that say my imported salmon and Ocean cold water Cod Prime loin fillet is to expensive at 330 a kilo and only pay 100 baht a kilo for the fine fresh fish here.

If you come here to live on the cheap then you will have to eat what they do.
You can live very well here and not have to eat shit.

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## withnallstoke

Did they all die trying to do the backstroke?

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## Simon43

Definitely suicide....

Simon

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## BobR

What type of fish are they raising in those ponds?

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## dirtydog

^^Murder I reckon.
^Man eating fishies.

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## tsicar

> What type of fish are they raising in those ponds?


probably catfish.

dummies.

their fish would probably grow out faster if they simply shovelled in pigshit or chickenshit, then let the fish feed on the phytoplankton and zooplankton the "fertiliser would promote.
most thai catfish are raised on rotting chicken, and when you gut them you will still smell it.
i think that's why the thais don't often bother to gut them before cooking.

no way you would get me to eat a thai raised fish either!

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## robuzo

Farm-raised fish generally aren't too good anyway.

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## klong toey

Looks like they are making Moo Peow,and the fish are just an after thought.

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## dirtydog

Perota, get 2 of the pigs and put a plank of wood between them, the worlds most unique canoe  :Smile:

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## melvbot

> Perota, get 2 of the pigs and put a plank of wood between them, the worlds most unique canoe


Use 3 and you've got yourself a pigamaran  :Smile:

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## Fuzzy Bob

^ Don't forget your sowester








I'll get my coat

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## Thungsongsausage

I am glad i don't live in Korat...... just needs some chips

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## kingwilly

> Definitely suicide....
> 
> Simon


cant be, there is nobody pointing.

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## blackgang

> probably catfish. dummies. their fish would probably grow out faster if they simply shovelled in pigshit or chickenshit, then let the fish feed on the phytoplankton and zooplankton the "fertiliser would promote. most thai catfish are raised on rotting chicken, and when you gut them you will still smell it. i think that's why the thais don't often bother to gut them before cooking. no way you would get me to eat a thai raised fish either! __________________


Yea, Father would bring in pickup loads of Chinese cabbage that was a over stock from somewhere and rice straw and sister in law would run buckets and wheelbarrow loads of fresh cow shit from the night time pens of the cattle and they would throw this shit in the 5 Rai pond and then would harvest fish and sell in the market,

But somehow I just still buy north pacific Cod fillets for 330 a kilo when I could be eating yummy fresh Thai fish.

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## Rural Surin

> Oh Yes, very tasty Thai raised fresh water fish.
> 
> And there are those that say my imported salmon and Ocean cold water Cod Prime loin fillet is to expensive at 330 a kilo and only pay 100 baht a kilo for the fine fresh fish here.
> 
> If you come here to live on the cheap then you will have to eat what they do.
> You can live very well here and not have to eat shit.


I guess that's left up to interpretation as to what 'quality' might be, yes? Coont.

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## blackgang

> I guess that's left up to interpretation as to what 'quality' might be, yes? Coont.


You should know,, as you are not now nor have ever been in Thailand as far as I know.

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## Rural Surin

> I guess that's left up to interpretation as to what 'quality' might be, yes? Coont.
> 			
> 		
> 
> You should know,, as you are not now nor have ever been in Thailand as far as I know.


.....as far as you know. :mid:

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## kingwilly

> I guess that's left up to interpretation as to what 'quality' might be, yes? Coont.
> 			
> 		
> 
> You should know,, as you are not now nor have ever been in Thailand as far as I know.


yes, because only someone living in Thailand would be able to understand the difference in good quality fish and bad....  :Confused:

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## Nawty

swine

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## kingwilly

Comets you fuckin moron!

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## blackgang

> as far as you know


IP addy ya know,, like where is the computer you are sending from???

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## Norton

Gruesome as it is, I have no particular problem with feeding the fish pigs.  The problem is it only takes a short while before a dead pig is full of bacteria.  After eating the fish surely will have some of the bacteria in their meat.  Not a good thing for those who eat the fish.

Fish farming can and is done properly/hygienically in Thailand but as with anything, anywhere buyer beware.

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## Jesus Jones

> ^^Murder I reckon.
> ^Man eating fishies.


Total hogwash

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## blackgang

Very true, I rarely use pork from the wet market for the same reason, or from village markets especially, as they have a hog that was sick and died, they gut and skin it and chop into chunks and sell it as food.
I buy from the larger markets that buy from slaughter houses and is supposed to be Certified, but still ya never know but your chances are 99% better as Garbage hog is not something I want to cure and fuck with.
I trust no Thai supplier of food as to its purity, no more than I will trust Chinese imported shit in the food stores here,, in China I eat,, but not exported shit.

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## kingwilly

i wonder if pig fed fish are halal.... ?

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## Ukan Kizmiaz

I thought they chucked in truck loads of antibiotics to deal with the bacteria etc.......I'd prefer the bacteria!!.

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## blackgang

> i wonder if pig fed fish are halal.... ?


You could Google it,, I did

and you not to hip on grub to be such a islamic supporter in all things,

Halal - Haram Food & Drink FISH - ISLAMIC - LAWS

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## Jack meoff

Must be feckin reeking round that pond.

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## kingwilly

> ou could Google it,, I did


indeed I could have. I was actually thinking out loud rather than asking. 

much the same as I wonder if Genetically modified proteins from a pig were put into a cow would that make the cow non-halal ?

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## kingwilly

> Originally Posted by kingwilly
> 
> i wonder if pig fed fish are halal.... ?
> 
> 
> You could Google it,, I did
> 
> and you not to hip on grub to be such a islamic supporter in all things,
> 
> Halal - Haram Food & Drink FISH - ISLAMIC - LAWS


That link has NOTHING to do with pig fed fish BG


 :rofl:

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## blackgang

see what I mean, such a stupid CS. and just like the energizer rabbit, just keeps going and going and going.

More stupid  and more stupid and more stupid.....

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## kingwilly

> see what I mean, such a stupid CS. and just like the energizer rabbit, just keeps going and going and going.
> 
> More stupid  and more stupid and more stupid.....


I'll type slow so you can understand it. 

Your google must be broken, because your link contains NO INFORMATION about the question that you said it answered. 

That is do feeding fish with pig meat make them non halal

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## blackgang

They do not give a fuck what the fish eat, nor really what anyone eats really,, as long as they are hungry they can eat anything available,, but if given a choice then they are supposed to eat animals that have their throat cut and allowed to bleed to death, and certain fish with scales but not catfish.
If you has the intelligence of my Thai dog you could have read that link as I did and it does say what they can and can not eat and when it can be done, even to eating pig if that is all thats available.
But your IQ seems to be to slack to even comprehend that.

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## mojo swop top

Are you sure it isn't an experience, to see if pig really can't swim, that has gone horribly wrong?   :Smile:

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## kingwilly

> They do not give a fuck what the fish eat, nor really what anyone eats really,, as long as they are hungry they can eat anything available,, but if given a choice then they are supposed to eat animals that have their throat cut and allowed to bleed to death, and certain fish with scales but not catfish.
> If you has the intelligence of my Thai dog you could have read that link as I did and it does say what they can and can not eat and when it can be done, even to eating pig if that is all thats available.
> But your IQ seems to be to slack to even comprehend that.



No it does not.

It discusses what types of fish a muslim may eat, it DOES not mention the fish food.

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## dirtydog

^^How could it have gone horribly wrong? They have proved pigs can't swim.

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## blackgang

And,,,,,going,,,,and going ,,,,,going,,,,,,,going

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## tsicar

> Fish farming can and is done properly/hygienically in Thailand but as with anything, anywhere buyer beware.


this is NOT the case with catfish in thailand, norton.

tilapia will eat plant matter, and there is no problem with manuring ponds, as the fish will only feed on the plant matter and zooplankton and not the manure (a bit like preparing your veggie patch with manure, so no problem there),but almost all catfish in thailand are fed on rotten meat or chicken and are raised as a "by-crop", ie:
chicken/pig farm loses large number of chickens to disease and the rotten carcasses are dumped into ponds for the catfish to dispose of.
very, very few thais will raise on pellets alone, and those that do, WILL FAIL in a season or two, just as soon as their government loans run out.
reason for this is total ignorance of the "farmers" and misinformation and lack of proper training by thai ag department (plus ignorance!) as to nutritional requirement and the correct way to rear and handle the fish.
even if the ag dept was to try to educate these fools, the "village wisdom" mentality would soon put paid to any advances they made, so the info available is aimed more towards the subsistence aspect than actually rearing the fish commercially.

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## Scottish Gary

Fuck me what do they breed in that farm Piranhas

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## tsicar

> Fuck me what do they breed in that farm Piranhas


used to catch and knock off the thais' chickens when they came scratching around in my veggie patch.
straight into the catfish tank, and it looks just like a bunch of pirhanas in a feeding frenzy.
all that is left after 10 minutes or so is a skin with feathers on, a skeleton, and a donut shaped rubbery organ that the catfish won't even eat, but is regularly found in an isaan chicken curry!

i kid you not!

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## tsicar

> I thought they chucked in truck loads of antibiotics to deal with the bacteria etc.......I'd prefer the bacteria!!.


the antibiotics are too expensive.
thais won't even spring for deworming medicine for their livestock, cos they haven't figured that they will grow faster for the feed they consume if they are parasite free.
no need to worry about the antibiotics.

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## blackgang

Not surprising as Catfish everywhere are bottom feeders that clean up the bottoms of dead things, and I will not buy or eat any fresh water fish raised here in Thailand and we were in a mini business as our pond is between 5 and 7 rai and was stocked until the drought and a lot of water and fish loss.

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## sunsetter

them piggies dont look like theyre floating to me, looks like there resting on the bottom

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## withnallstoke

Really must applaud the fishfarmers on this one. They seem to have come up with a way to close the gap left in the food circle,ie:-
Eggs taste like fish because the chickens have been force fed fishmeal.
Chickens also taste of fish for the same reason.
Pork tastes like a cross between chicken and fish because the pigs eat any left over shit.
Now the fish can taste of rancid pork.

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## Nawty

> ^^How could it have gone horribly wrong? They have proved pigs can't swim.


 
I proved several years ago that pigs can fly and swim....it will be in  the book.

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## kingwilly

proved or proofed ? or pooved?

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## Nawty

whats the diff ?

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## blackgang

Again,,,,and again,,,,,and again

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## Happyman

I eat more fish than meat - BUT- I never eat farmed fish ! 
 Restaurants here nearly always serve farmed fish but if you take your own they will cook it for you at a very reasonable "Corkage" charge .

The fish I catch myself - dorado, tuna, pomfret  and spanish mackerel - are never more than a few hours old - straight from the sea and are bloody wonderful ! 
 Farmed fish always have that slightly 'muddy taste' - even the seacap that are raised in brackish ponds and then put in offshore cages to wait delivery to the market.

Snakehead are the only freshwater fish I have and then only if I have caught them myself from a stream - not one of those 'fishing parks'.

Maybe the locals don't notice the taste as they always seen to overdose them with chilli !

I don't like chilli !

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## blackgang

> dorado, tuna, pomfret and spanish mackerel - are never more than a few hours old - straight from the sea and are bloody wonderful !


I get Dorado and yellow fin tuna loins caught yesterday in Bali and shipped to me next day, very fresh and very cold on special order a week ahead from SFS,,loin makes good for char broil or sliced sashimi,, wife will eat shop bought snakehead or algae eaters that taste like mud, but will not eat the tuna cause it aint well done and dryed out.. fuckin Thai are nuts when it comes to food. 
and then the next one you see will be eating Lab or what the fuck ever they call it ,,fresh ground raw pork with hog blood gravy,, fuck a wild man.

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## English Noodles

> between 5 and 7 rai


1, 2, 3, 4, 5, *6*, 7, 8, 9, 10.  You can even use your fingers if you like.

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## blackgang

OK 3 1/2 acres asshole,, so less than an acre between the 2.

same as the difference between your IQ  (8) and the lower number of a normal IQ  (60).

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## kingwilly

> Originally Posted by blackgang
> 
> between 5 and 7 rai
> 
> 
> 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, *6*, 7, 8, 9, 10.  You can even use your fingers if you like.



 :rofl: 

pwned!

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## blackgang

> pwned!


Can you look at a pond and swear that it is exactly so many square meter in area??

well I would guess with your and Noodles combined IQ =19, that you could.

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## The Gentleman Scamp

Catfish go into a frenzy over the cheap bread the tourists throw into the klongs yet the Thais say these fish are not good enough to eat.

Odd.

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## blackgang

They like the pig flavored ones the best,, and the one feeding them rotten chickens and hogs pobly do not eat their own fish, but sell em and buy from someone else and think they are the only ones smart enough to feed diseased rotten shit to make a cheap product,,  Thai Logic thinking.

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## BBlacky

Years before Kampung Rambutan became the main South Bus Terminal for Jakarta there were a number of fish ponds, where the locals raised lele, or catfish. When I went to visit one friend of a friend he took me out to see the greedy catfish, who really are quite amusing when you tease them with bits of bread. I noticed that over the square pond there was a latticework rack leading from the edge to the middle, where a tin shed sat squarely atop the pond. It took only a moment for the dawn to dawn upon me:the local grinned and I swore I'd never eat catfish again. Hot chocolate for lunch again!

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## English Noodles

^Nice view for a poo. :Smile:

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## Thaiedward

I'm a bit bewildered over here having recently composed a message with regard to the fishfarmy thread.
The message was written over a two-hour span during which I was doing other things (cooking) but every time I checked, I was still logged-in.
Was I timed-out without having been alerted? 
I hope you have the time to answer my simple question.
Thank you for your kind attention.

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## Thaiguy

> Gruesome as it is, I have no particular problem with feeding the fish pigs. The problem is it only takes a short while before a dead pig is full of bacteria. After eating the fish surely will have some of the bacteria in their meat. Not a good thing for those who eat the fish.
> 
> Fish farming can and is done properly/hygienically in Thailand but as with anything, anywhere buyer beware.


*What's the problem , have you ever watched fish and yabbies demolishing a dead cow in a stream ? or ever tied a dead bunny up a tree hanging over a creek or river and used the maggotts that fall off into the water as burley and bait? - works good and the fish are fine.*

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## Thaiguy

> They like the pig flavored ones the best,, and the one feeding them rotten chickens and hogs pobly do not eat their own fish, but sell em and buy from someone else and think they are the only ones smart enough to feed diseased rotten shit to make a cheap product,, Thai Logic thinking.


*Hmm yes can relate to that , used to fish off north head ( Sydey Harbour) over the sewer outlet , great fishing ( gave them all away though )*

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## pone

> Originally Posted by kingwilly
> 
> pwned!
> 
> 
> Can you look at a pond and swear that it is exactly so many square meter in area??
> 
> well I would guess with your and Noodles combined IQ =19, that you could.


look on google earth if the pond is old "in half"

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## beazalbob69

If this is all it takes to turn people off of farmed fish never go to any meat farm you will turn vegatarian. What do catfish anywhere eat? Answer: anything they can. I have had Talipia from the little fish farm down the road a few times. Tasted fine to me.

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## pone

a big friend,deep sea fisherman,in st maarten (w.i)* get an heavy metal poisoning
by eating(to much) fish** living in the midle of the ocean(atlantic) and loose 50 kg in the process;as toxics build-up in fat,it was quite a near death trip...
as doctor say:fish ,not more than once a week,to let the liver eliminate the poisons,(valid for othersss intoxicants)
*carib'beer...bean?
**yellow fins/other tunas;dolfins(mani-mahi for tourists)mainly
 ::spin:: 
ONE MORE HAPPY NEW YEAR IN A WONDERFULL WORLD...

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## ozzydom

> Originally Posted by blackgang
> 
> 
> They like the pig flavored ones the best,, and the one feeding them rotten chickens and hogs pobly do not eat their own fish, but sell em and buy from someone else and think they are the only ones smart enough to feed diseased rotten shit to make a cheap product,, Thai Logic thinking.
> 
> 
> *Hmm yes can relate to that , used to fish off north head ( Sydey Harbour) over the sewer outlet , great fishing ( gave them all away though )*


Did I meet you halfway down the ropes 50 years ago Thaiguy?
ozzy

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## Belepheron

> ^Nice view for a poo.


Okay as long as the seat is high enough above the water. You don't want them catfish getting all keen for your dropping and make a mistake do you?

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## king aaron

Basically you have filtered ponds outdoors for grow-out of juveniles,  and tanks indoors housing the adult breeders. It's not difficult, but it  is quite an investment, especially if you're having to heat the pools  in the winter.

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## tsicar

> Originally Posted by Thaiguy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by blackgang
> ...


hey!
welcome, ozzy!
this part of the forum could do with some input from someone who knows about tilapia farming.
i recommended you to someone the other day, since i remembered you from tv days.
how about doing something for us about tilapia on greenwater?
hope you stick around here- can get a bit hectic at times, but mostly just real people taking the piss outta each other for fun!

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## ozzydom

> hey! welcome, ozzy! this part of the forum could do with some input from someone who knows about tilapia farming. i recommended you to someone the other day, since i remembered you from tv days. how about doing something for us about tilapia on greenwater? hope you stick around here- can get a bit hectic at times, but mostly just real people taking the piss outta each other for fun! __________________


Thanks for the kind words tsicar,will try to help where possible ,greenwater farming aint rocket science,must work as we are still in business :Smile:

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## Nawty

hmmm...TV scout....deportee....or ??  was ye not a mod over there ?

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## ozzydom

My impression is that the wrong slant has been put on the OP,s photo,s.
Firstly, most species of farmed fish are not suited to eat a carcase,ie.catfish,Pla Nin, Tab Tim etc.
Meat is certainly fed to catfish,but it is in most part chicken frames and offal which is firstly put through a mincer so that it can be swallowed in chunks and is usually parboiled, Commercial feeding is done at a rate in which the food can be eaten instantly at the surface, food left uneaten or sinking to the bottom will only contaminate a pond and make it unsuitable as a habitat.
The ponds as depicted look rancid and show no signs of surface activity which in a pond that size is most unusual.(if fish are present)
 A sign of a pond in good condition is that the surface will shine like a mirror.

With the price of pork at about 120 baht kilo and weaners going for 1200 baht each  and upwards it would be pretty foolish to toss them into a pond like that.

My guess is that either the porkers were free ranging around the pond and were poisoned by the rancid algae heavy water or died of disease in their pens and the farmer dumped them instead of burying/burning them.

Whatever the reason the operators management skills leave a lot to be desired.

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## ozzydom

> hmmm...TV scout....deportee....or ??  was ye not a mod over there ?


True Nawty, quite a while back, Tasmanians have the habit of dancing to their own tunes and not what is dictated by powers that be and that did not go down to well. :yerman:

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## tsicar

so how about the thread on greenwater, oz?
seems to me to be the viable answer for tilapia farming for many who do not want to invest too heavily, especially given the relatively high cost of feed in relation to selling price in thailand.
many expats have a pond or two and want to "dabble" a bit, without getting too technical, and end up with only the local advice to go on (and we all know what THAT means)

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## ozzydom

If you log onto Nam Sai Farms website you can access a very good paper on rearing and growing Pla Nin using the greenwater method.

 Greenwater farming is just a method of providing a habitat rich in Zooplankton and phytoplankton which is the staple food and protein source for Pla Nin.

Pla Nin are what is known as screen feeders in that they take in water and filter out the minute plankton and algea . Very much along the lines of a whale that lives on krill except that a Tilapia is not equipped with baleen in its mouth as a lot of whales are.

Firstly your pond..... Tilapia do not need a deep pond as they live mainly in the top 1/2 metre of the water column ,because light does not penetrate very deep in green water ,in any depth over about 1.5 metres the lower depths just become a stew of nitrates. More surface area and less depth suits as this is where oxygen is generated.

Phosphate is added (along with nitrogen) to produce green water) and this can be in the form of animal manure (which is harder to control because the manure has to break down to release its phosphate) or as we do ,it is achieved by adding triple superphosphate to the pond To get your initial algae growth and then added to as required.

I find that an initial dose of 15kg per rai and 5 kilo per month does the job but each pond will vary depending on depth and water quality.

The easy test is to dunk your arm down to the elbow and cock your wrist, your palm should be just visible in the gloom. Or you can make yourself up a Secchi disc 
which I will describe later.

If you baulk at paying 20-40 baht a kilo for triple superphosphate ,duck manure has probably the highest percentage of Phosphate available.
It takes about 40 ducks per rai to provide enough phosphate, the simple way is to have a few ducks living on the pond ,the problem is that they love pellet fish food.

The main reason for greenwater farming is that you are providing most of their protein in the form of the Pla Nins natural food , so we only provide supplementary food in the form of fish pellets (tests have shown that supplementary feeding only reduces the time span of getting your fish to 450 gram by one month).

So if your aim is only to provide fish for family consumption ,just maintain your pond zooplankton and phytoplankton population and you have the equivelant of
Pla Nin A La Natural.

I would advocate buying mono sex fry  and stocking at the rate one fish per sq metre of surface area to get better and faster growth. Stocking mixed sex Pla Nin comes with its own set of problems which I will advise on later.

Time to give my typing finger a rest and let you digest the story to date.

ozzy

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## DaffyDuck

Would be cheaper and more efficient to just go to the local slaughterhouse, and pick up left-overs and by product -- they are more than happy to get rid of it, and you can integrate it into the ecosystem faster.

Typically lazy and badly thought out.

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## mellow

Can't seem to find superphosphate around here.

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## ozzydom

Some fertilizer stockists do not carry triple superphosphate because of its cost ,the popular alternative is 16-20-0 fertilizer which is .....

Nitrogen (N) 16 %
Phosphate (P) 20%
Potassium  (K) 0 %

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## ozzydom

> Would be cheaper and more efficient to just go to the local slaughterhouse, and pick up left-overs and by product -- they are more than happy to get rid of it, and you can integrate it into the ecosystem faster.
> 
> Typically lazy and badly thought out.


Problem is that their are next to zero leftovers at Thai slaughterhouses,with pigs every part is used , with cattle only the boned out skull is left,and with chickens only the boned out frame is left at the big slaughterhouses and they want about 25 baht kg for those.
All organs,intestines etc are utilized here. :Smile:

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## Cenovis

> Can't seem to find superphosphate around here.


Just drink some beer and piss in your Pond, should do the trick.

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## ozzydom

There used to be a couple of chaps well informed regarding hi-density fish farming on another forum ,namely Tilapia and frikkideboer, I know who Tilapia is ,was wondering about frikki? :mid:

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## tsicar

> There used to be a couple of chaps well informed regarding hi-density fish farming on another forum ,namely Tilapia and frikkideboer, I know who Tilapia is ,was wondering about frikki?


ozzie, 
i was frikkie.
tilapia/dalton won't be posting about tilapia on here or anywhere else again.
read the other thread  and you will understand why.
very happy to see you on here, since i know you have the integrity and experience to post on the subject of aquaculture without any ulterior motives.

thanks for doing the greenwater thread, i am sure many can benefit from it.
don't think you are off the hook yet though:
i have some ideas and many questions about greenwater, or possibly production of dried algae as feed, possibly converting via the bellies of small tilapia into feed for pla-chon, which seems to me to be the perfect candidate for highly intensive culture.

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## Thaiguy

> Originally Posted by Thaiguy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by blackgang
> ...


*Good chance of that - it would be me hugging the cliff - will be in touch with a report soon I hope.*

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## ozzydom

Great memories TG,down the old manilla rope complete with 20 foot homemade rangoon cane rod and Alvey plus kit and bottletop studded sandshoes around the neck , great fishing but could never bring myself to eat them.

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## Perota

More about dead pigs

Dead pig running  :Smile: 




Dead pigs used in scientific studies of deep sea scavengers


BBC News - Dead pigs used to investigate 'dead zones'


More funny stuffs if you try a search for "dead pig scientific studies" in youtube

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## sunsetter

yeah gotta love that, highly amusing  :Smile:

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## Isee

Not seeing the humour in it myself....  :Confused:

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## sunsetter

really? well that running piggy tickles me to bits  :smiley laughing: 

oh ill have to watch it again and giggle my arse off just for you now isee  :smiley laughing:  :rofl:

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## Kurgen

Are you sure they're pigs, they remind me of Essex birds  :Smile:

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