#  >  > Travellers Tales in Thailand and Asia >  >  > Laos Forum >  >  R&R in VV

## 9999

Early this month it was visa run time again. My passport has gotten pretty full after about 30 Chiang Mai - Mae Sai runs, and pretty much exhausted all the sites Northern Thailand had to offer. It was time to get the double entry tourist visa from Vientianne.

Apart from the market towns across the Burmese border, my missus has never been out of Thailand, and very keen to join me on a visa run. I figured we'd make a little holiday of it and go somewhere outside the capital for a few days. Where else than Vang Vieng?

The plan was to drive the gruelling journey from Chiang Mai to Udon Thani, drop the ute in for a service and make our way to the border. Too easy right? Go to Udon, find the Mazda dealer, drop the car off and get a taxi or bus to Nong Kai. Well without going into detail, the whole thing was a fuck around. 

We left Chiang Mai at about 5 AM and planned to be in Laos late that arvo. One of the most stunning bits of scenery on the journey was leaving Chiang Mai driving into the sunrise below. The rest of the trip was a grind, nice scenery around Khao Yai area but didn't take many photos of the trip across Thailand.

Just want to mention again, I'm no star photographer, and a lot of the photos here are from a moving vehicle. Some of the best ones have my missus in it, and I can't let you stalking TD bastards get a glimpse, but will post some snaps around where we stayed and through Laos......

Chiang Mai sunrise.......



Due to Thais being so bad at giving / following simple directions and having no concept of time, we arrived at the border checkpoint at 7 PM. It started pissing down rain when a taxi hustler swooped on us. 600 THB to cross the border, with them helping out with the paperwork etc. and get us into Vientianne. Sold.

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## 9999

As soon as we hit Laos immigration, a massive storm hit. There was a power station right next to the checkpoint, and an alectricity tower had collapsed and killed all the electricity. Our driver, a nice bloke, after waiting over an hour or so for power to come back, convinced the immigration to do the Laos visas manually (by candle light). We were sorted and on our way to Vientianne. The driver suggested we stay at the plushest place in town, we just asked to get dropped off where all the tourists go.

The area was a street running along the river with a few streets perpendicular with guest houses, restaurants, bars etc. We hopped out and went into the first decent looking accomadation. 1800 THB per night. Fuk that. We planned to eat and drink out, sleep, get up and to the Thai embassy as early as possible. 

A few paces up we found a dingy looking place with a Laos guy standing out front playing guitar. He showed his 'air con' room for 450 THB. Worst room I've seen, but I'd been on the road over 15 hours, mostly driving, and just wanted a beer and food, the room had a bed, so we took it.

After sealing the deal the guy couldn't get the air con to work. "Sorry, my friend have key, no problem not hot now" he said, and dropped the price to 350. After he left, I fiddled a bit with the air con and found the 'on' switch. Wa-la! free air con! A small consolation for the dirtiest, most overpriced room In all my asian travels. I know of 150 THB per night fan rooms in Chiang Mai nicer than this place. It did have it's own bathroom but the water came in spurts every few seconds, so pretty much useless. Here's a few pics inside and the 'key operated' air con unti.....

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## 9999

So we left the Vientianne Hilton and went in search of food and beer. I chose a french restaurant pretty close by, it was OK, I had the beef bourganblabla and shared a vego pizza with the missus who was also very impressed with her mushroom soup. Of course, the best part was the dark Beer Lao.

The scene around this area was pretty surprising for me. I was expecting a lot of backpacker types and trendy bars aimed at young people. What I observed was a farang culture of upity NGOness. Like, there were stacks of them. Where we ate, I listened in to some yanks in shirts and pants having dinner with a crusty looking type, thanking him for the good work he'd done the past year.

As we went back to out room, it looked like the bar across the street was the place to be for these NGO types. A balanced mix of farang men and women, very well dressed, politely bidding each other fair well (it was after 10 PM) as they finished off their fancy looking cocktails.

This was NOT what I was expecting in Laos, and kept seeing it - Prados cruising around with squares with note pads observing and writing. I won't go into how much I despise these people and their little righteous culture, yank NGOs in Laos living it up being one of the most ironic things I've ever witnessed, and will keep this as a travel report.

Back to the room for a restless night's sleep and up at the crack of dawn for a pommy shower, a nice bread roll for breakfast, then off to find the Thai Embassy.

The local tuk-tuk / songtheaw / taxi mafia were ready to go. They were asking way too much for the short ride, and when I scoffed at the prices this guy pleads 'no, no, here is the price list' and pulls a list of inflated prices to all the main destinations in town. They wanted about 200 THB for a less than 10 minute ride.

No one would budge on price, being the mafia and price controlling and all, so we walked into town a bit and flagged down a real driver who charged us 50 THB.

Thinking I'd be first in line, getting to the embassy an hour before open, it was full of worn down looking farangs waiting for open. I found out from the visa 'service' hustlers that the 60 day double entry was free. Ended up paying him 1500 THB to leave passport etc with him and pick up on our way home. Too easy.

Next stop was the bus station. Found an Aussie comrade who'd commandeered a van and was footing the bill for a bit of travel with 3 local Laos city gals. Agreed to pay 700 THB to get the back 3 seats for us. Finally, leaving the hustle of city and formalities of crossing borders and getting visas, and heading for Vang Vieng, known for it's partying and readily available drugs.

Leaving Vientianne in the back of a van.....

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## Marmite the Dog

> The rest of the trip was a grind, nice scenery around Khao Yai area


No wonder you were late, you made a 1,000km detour.

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## 9999

There's some lush scenery along the less than 200km 4 hour journey, very green, and noticaeably less developed than Thailand. A lot of shit is similar to countryside Thailand, but there's something, not quite sure what it is, that tells you you are definately not in Thailand anymore.

Here's some assorted scenery and pics along the road from Vientianne to Vang Vieng...

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## 9999

> Originally Posted by 9999
> 
> The rest of the trip was a grind, nice scenery around Khao Yai area
> 
> 
> No wonder you were late, you made a 1,000km detour.


I took the most direct and fastest route. I'm talking about the area around Petchabum, Khao yai right?

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## jojo333

"My passport has gotten pretty full after about 30 Chiang Mai - Mae Sai runs,"

That is a hell of a lot of visa runs, why dont you go for longer visas?

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## 9999

Here are a few snaps of Vang Vieng. The first is the river the twon is built on the banks of. Then some street shots of the main street. It's lined with restaurant / bars that all look the same and sell the same shit. First thing we did was get a french baguette roll packed with meat and vegies for about 30 THB, and a delicious fruit shake.

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## 9999

> "My passport has gotten pretty full after about 30 Chiang Mai - Mae Sai runs,"  That is a hell of a lot of visa runs, why don’t you go for longer visas?


Did plan to earlier, but quite enjoyed going Chiang Mai to Mae Sai once a fortnight. The process is so easy at Mae Sai and the shopping is great. Also a keen interest to explore North Thailand and visa runs are a good excuse to do so.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog
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>  Originally Posted by 9999
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Nam Nao maybe? Not sure, because the quickest, most direct route doesn't go anywhere near Petchabun.

CM - Den Chai - Chat Trakan - Nakhon Thai - Loei - Nong Bua Lamphu - Udon is the most direct & quickest route and there's lots of stunning scenery to enjoy.

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## 9999

We cruised around the small town on a scooter for a bit and chose a guest house along the river. The setting is superb. Just after the river big mountains jut out of the ground creating foresty cliffs (I was corrected and informed in an earlier post that these mountains are the foothills of the Himalayas.

I wanted a place with a view, and found one, facing west directly across the river to the mountains. At 450 THB for an air can room, fitted out with nice timber, good comfo0rtable bed, decent functioning bathroom and an all round nice feel to the place, I considered it a bargain. Though you can get pretty dam decent accomodation in VV for 150 - 200 THB.

This photo is the front room of the guest house, with the same type balconies on the back side where we were, and some humble attempts at me trying to catch the sunset from our balcony.....

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## 9999

> Originally Posted by 9999
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>  Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog
> ...


OK, looking at the map I can see you're route. I went as if going to Kohn Kaen, taking a left before KK for a short cut to Udon. If I'd known taking those inner roads to Loei would be quicker, would have definately gone that way. What a chump I am, next time. Cheers for the info. 1,000 kms detour is a bit over mate, how much distance / time would I take using your route? Oh yeah, Khao Kho, the mountain road passes through this near Petchabum (not Kho Yai, thanks again for the correction).

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## 9999

Early morning from the same balcony off our room ......

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## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog
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>  Originally Posted by 9999
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And thanks for the photos & words.

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## Bower

Enjoyable read, thanks and more please.

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## 9999

After the first night, we like the place so much we decided to stay 4 nights. Didn't really do much, just explored around the place and chilled.

The first morning I went in search of Opium, which wasn't too hard to find. I sat down and ordered an opium tea (about 400 THB) and an opium joint (around 300 THB). Felt pretty good after a few hours but not wasted. I think the gear is pretty weak and ultra-expensive but I wasn't about to go looking for some outback opium den to save money. A gram from the same restaurant was 600 THB. I used the internet to find WTF to do with the black tar like substance, and found the most efficient way was to spot off foil. Next thing I know I'm curled over lighting a bit of foil from underneath, smoking the opium through a straw, looking like a real crack-head degenerate. But hey, it worked. Missus looked on in horror, she don't even touch any form of drug except a cocktail here and there, two and she's pissed. When she knew it was opium and NOT yaba (they smoke those orange pills the same way), she was cool.

Each day was pretty much the same. I'd start with an opium hit and fruit juice packed with weed just before lunch (these were 200 THB or you can get a generous sized but shitty Thai-like weed joint for the same price). This kept me pretty spaced out all day. We meandered around, did some shopping, ate good food (mainly those french bread rolls, delicious) and retired to the air con room for the hot afternoon. Night was more eating and drinking Beer Lao with a few magic mushroom pizzas in the mix, though they were pretty average, just a little buzz here and there but no hallucinations.

For our explorations we needed a map. If you ever go to VV, stay away from these guys......



Prime location on the main street. All we wanted was a basic map, they tried to sell us all sorts of inflated price tours, and after failing, wanted 400 THB for their shitty little map. Pricks wouldn't even settle for 250.

We found this guy down a side street, sold us the exact same map for 60 THB, and will also get you sorted with anything else you need...



There's not a great deal to explore anyway, though we went to this organic farm which was interesting. It was just a great place to kick back and stay a few days and get high if that's your flavour....

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## 9999

It was pretty quiet when we were there, being low season and all. The nightlife wasn't the debauchery I'd read on the internet. Most places were empty. Accomodation and food are cheap and good quality, but if you want to get wasted in this town it'll cost you. I was spending over 1500 THB per day just getting wasted, and pretty tamely at that.

Now the main attraction in VV is the river tubing. You jump on a big tube and float down the river, while bars lining the river have touts throwing out ropes and offering free whisky (cheaper than soft drink) in the hope that you'll buy some beer, food or drugs.

We didn't do the tubing, missus wasn't up for it, scared shitless of water she is. We just spent a day walking along the river and string of bars catering to the tubers. Some final snaps of the river tubing and water park area, note how empty it is...

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## BobR

Sorry but what's a prado?   When I know what it is, I'll probably know why you hate it.  Nice post, I think I might visit here sometime.

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## 9999

After a very relaxing 5 days we made our way back, were hustled onto the 'VIP' bus for way too much (400 THB each) expecting a proper coach. Ended up on some shitty old bus with a/c that didn't work, but I just slept all the way back to Vientianne, with the missus nudging me here and there for snoring too loud. Must've been all the opium in the system.

We called the visa guy who delivered as promised, to the bus station within 10 minutes, and then got his mate to taxi back to Nong Kai. The deal was 600 THB to cross the border, same deal as when we went in, but the taxi this time was much older and shittier. The guy drops us off at Laos immigration and says he can't cross the border, so now we argue about the fair. I tell him he gets paid when we cross into Thailand, but he 'cannot do' (doesn't have his shit sorted for vehicle crossing etc), and had to pay him as the crowd of taxi guys started circling me. I gave him 400 THB and spoke loudly in Thai for all to hear to call the cops or beat it out of me if you want more, and that this is about a 200 THB fair in Bangkok and Laos people don't know how to stick to a bargain, and this taxi peasent should make about 50 THB a day. Everyone backed down and I rushed for immigration and found another guy to do the border crossing for 200 THB.

1 pleasent night in Udon Thani, a city I was most impressed with, where a non-hustling tuk-tuk driver found us the perfect place for price / comfort, and a detour to Petchabum on the way back for another night. The missus was stuffed and crashed early, so I went and drank at what looked to be the local 'bar' near Big C and bought drinks for some gorgeous local girls, speaking all in Thai which was good for my learning process, ended up having a cracker of a night in Petchabum.

That's about it, two more snaps of VV riverside scenery to finish...

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## 9999

> Sorry but what's a prado? When I know what it is, I'll probably know why you hate it. Nice post, I think I might visit here sometime.


Mini Toyota Landcruiser, one of the best 4WDs ever built.

This is my 15 year old Prado back in Oz, never missed a beat been around Australia a few times. They're even smaller now.

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## Bangyai

Nice thread mate and nothing wrong with your pictures either. Be nice to know the name of that guest house you used in VV. Looks very nice.
I've driven a good part of Marmites route and found the roads good all the way.
Last time I took the route south from Den Chai, the road was like a billiard table. About the only place in Thailand where I've dared to thrash my car to its limit, even though it was only for a few brief seconds.

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## 9999

^ Cheers for the kind words. Will chase down that name for you/

 After MTD's comments on the route, I asked around a bit this arvo. He's spot on and I'm spewing I missed the trip. Will defo do again, I hear the roads are real good. When plotting my course, I assumed the roads would be crap off the main highways as I experienced trying to take short cuts through Surin, Buri Ram etc last year. Was slow going due to bad roads and all sorts of farm machinery etc slowing you down. Well the route I took was no speedway, especially after coming down from the escarpment into Isaan. Lots of congestion. 

My experience in the north is the roads are generally really good, but get worse as you head east (have driven nearly every road west of Nan). After looking at the map in detail again, I see you can drive all along the border too, which would probably be a nice drive. I've hugged the border from Mae Sai to Chiang Kong and further before cutting into Phayoa. I like to take the scenic route but in this case I just wanted to get to Laos ASAP.

Anyway the best thing about this forum is the knowledge, I've picked up heaps just by reading trips from other people, so hopefully this thread does the same for others.

Also, thanks to readers for the flood of greens for this. It is a fuck around resizing, uploading and posting all those pics, surely it can be made easier, (I already ranted about this in another thread) so it's nice to get some appreciation.

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## the dogcatcher

Nam song looks minging this time of year.
We went new year and the water was crystal clear.

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## 9999

^Was planning on a trip this month to Phayao, want to take the missus's old folks out for a few days. Been to Phayao before and stayed on a real nice place on the lake, seemed perfect to for the 'in laws', but after hearing such good things about Nam Song, might make the trip there instead.

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## Chong Boy

nice thread and pics, will have to head back to VV some time. Nice break away from Thailand when you just need to get away!

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## mtone9317

Thank you for the pictures. The place I stayed in Vientiane was the Lao Youth house 1/2 block away from the Mekong, clean, nice people, and safe. The lady owns two of them, one right on the river and one up the block. That's the one to stay in, TV in lounge...no furniture, but it's only $11 a night. Her sister is the manager. They close the door at 10pm because the kids (great) sleep in the lobby. They will let you in after   close, but you have to wake them up.  What is "arvo"

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## 9999

^ Cheers for the tip mate. 'Arvo' is Aussie for afternoon.

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## beano

I stayed at the Riverside in Vientiane last time, 500B. Excellent value.
I was a regular at the Saysana, used to be 350B but it was being renovated.

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## phomsanuk

Now that's a different trip, thanks.... :Smile:

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## Propagator

> how much distance / time would I take using your route?


 
CM to Loei using Marmites route approx 6 hrs driving
Loei to Udon abut 3 hrs
Udon to Nong Khai abou 1 hr to 1 1/2 hrs.

Roads mainly very good but some very windy when heading to Loei

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## Marmite the Dog

> Loei to Udon abut 3 hrs
> Udon to Nong Khai abou 1 hr to 1 1/2 hrs.


I'd prolly go Loei - to Nong Khai direct along the Mekong.

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## 9999

The route I took was about 10 hours driving with a heavy foot to Udon Thani. I'm with MTD for the next trip, or even follow the border / Mekong before Loei for some sight seeing.

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## Marmite the Dog

Not sure if this works/helps. It can get a bit confusing between Route 11 and Nakhon Thai.

Udon to Chiang Mai - Google Maps

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## 9999

Cheers again MTD

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## Bob63

Good info on VV, thanks

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## notanameleft

> We cruised around the small town on a scooter for a bit and chose a guest house along the river. The setting is superb. Just after the river big mountains jut out of the ground creating foresty cliffs (I was corrected and informed in an earlier post that these mountains are the foothills of the Himalayas.
> 
> I wanted a place with a view, and found one, facing west directly across the river to the mountains. At 450 THB for an air can room, fitted out with nice timber, good comfo0rtable bed, decent functioning bathroom and an all round nice feel to the place, I considered it a bargain. Though you can get pretty dam decent accomodation in VV for 150 - 200 THB.
> 
> This photo is the front room of the guest house, with the same type balconies on the back side where we were, and some humble attempts at me trying to catch the sunset from our balcony.....


I stayed here last time I went in 2008... doesn't change at all.

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## mysticpaki

Notanameleft
Where is this beautiful pic taken from?
Which city hotel and how much was it per night?
Many thanks

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## mysticpaki

999
Could you please advise the name of the hotel which is in the pic.Its in Vang Vieng yes??
Also did you have the view of the water and hills which youve taken from your hotel room???
My email is cliche61[at]hotmail.com
Thankd

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## 9999

^ Hey, just go back and read the thread, think the name is in there someone and all the details you need  :Smile:

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## mysticpaki

9999 Trang

I read your whole post twice sorry you havent mentioned the name of this beautiful guesthouse you stayed in for 450 baht with gorgeous view in VV.
Perhaps your mrs would remember.
Please do let me know 
Thanks

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## 9999

^ no worries, I'll chase down the name and post it here. Glad you like the thread, and yeah great place to stay, make sure you get a room at the back facing the river and mountains (more expensive).

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## mysticpaki

Thanks a lot
You can email me directly on cliche61[at]hotmail.com also
Regds
Eddie

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## mysticpaki

999
Still awaiting the name of the hotel :Smile:  :Smile:

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## 9999

^ No worries mate haven't forgotton, mrs forgot the name too, will chase it down though  :Wink:

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## mysticpaki

Thanks look forward to your reply as im surely going to stay here when in Vientaine.
Cheers

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## mysticpaki

Sorry in VV right???

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## mysticpaki

Still waiting lol

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## 9999

relax brother im on it

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## ossierob

Looks good....and still on the list!

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## ears

> Originally Posted by 9999
> 
> The rest of the trip was a grind, nice scenery around Khao Yai area
> 
> 
> No wonder you were late, you made a 1,000km detour.


I think he meant KhaoKor not KhaoYai

I was there on 27th Dec 2010

Camped in a tent at a resort called I think RaiJanRair, great bungalows fro accomodation ( but were full) beautiful gardens, great open air restaurant with amazing view. That time of year many thais travel to experience the cold weather and sunsets and sunrises. Very high altitude for Thailand ( 1600m??) It was the area wrere all the "communist" student insurgents hung out after the 1973 massacres. No roads up to the mountain area back in those days.

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## 9999

> Originally Posted by Propagator
> 
> Loei to Udon abut 3 hrs
> Udon to Nong Khai abou 1 hr to 1 1/2 hrs.
> 
> 
> I'd prolly go Loei - to Nong Khai direct along the Mekong.


Leaving early in the morning to do the drive again, CM to Nong Khai. Will be doing loei - Nong Khai. 

Maybe get some more pics inside Thailand, but no fun in VV this time, just hurry up and get visa - get the fuck out of Laos - meander back through the north back to CM. Vientianne blows and droving around Laos on backpack buses aint for the missus who is 6 months up the duff.

And MysticPaki mate, if you;re still around, I'll see if the name of that Guest House pops up.

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## Loy Toy

Fantastic thread mate, great pictures and info. 

Thanks for sharing.

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## 9999

Cheers LT. Thinking of going back between xmas and new years. Gotta go on a visa run about that time.

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## Vientianeboy

You are incredibly lucky that you were not picked up by the local police. This often happens in Vang Vieng.

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## 9999

^ Maybe so if you're a chump  :Smile:

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## Vientianeboy

Don't need to be a chump - that is a silly comment. A number of bar owners/restaurant owners have set up westerners before. It happens quite a lot. As I live here, I have a pretty good idea what happens.

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## 9999

You might live there but you sound pretty naive. Outside of the capital tourists smoking opium is rampant. What % do you think get stitched up? And what are the consequences? A bribe of $500 should get you out of trouble if you're stupid enough to get caught. Tell us some real examples of people you know who have been busted?

"Incredibly lucky' not to get picked up is a silly statement. Clearly the vast majority of tourists taking opium in Laos have no trouble at all. Did you get all your info from google?

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## Satonic

> You might live there but you sound pretty naive. Outside of the capital tourists smoking opium is rampant. What % do you think get stitched up? And what are the consequences? A bribe of $500 should get you out of trouble if you're stupid enough to get caught. Tell us some real examples of people you know who have been busted?
> 
> "Incredibly lucky' not to get picked up is a silly statement. Clearly the vast majority of tourists taking opium in Laos have no trouble at all. Did you get all your info from google?


Completely agree. 90% of the time I spent there I was indulging in things I shouldn't and didn't get one run in with the law.

The idiots running around openly doing stuff are gonna get caught, like anywhere.

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## 9999

Yeah, and it's pretty easy to pick your spots and with a tiny bit of street smarts find the vendors that are not in cahoots with the cops. Of the 30 or so people I spoke to doing it not one had a problem. The only guy I met with a problem was in Chiang Mai, he said got set up in VV and was held by the cops until he coughed up $500. He was the loud mouth type and was getting around a bar he'd never been to asking where to buy weed and yaba.

Best off doing it where you bought if from. You know, the places that discreetly sell it off the 'special' menu.

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## Vientianeboy

I would say a good 5% get scammed. I will tell you something - if I saw you taking illegal substances I would report you to the cops before you could blink. Drugs are illegal in Lao and there is no excuse for promoting them. Go to Xieng Khouan and have a look at the damage caused by opium. We don't need people like this in Lao.

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## 9999

^ Well you're just a square snitch then aren't you. Opium has been a way in life long before your do gooding arse got there. Obviously I would stay right the fuk away from pompous arse cunts like you. Are you one of those idiots that gets around in brand new 4WD vehicles with pens and pads and imposes your western opinion on people getting about with their lives. What a patronizing cock you are. I suppose you think you;re over there changing things for the good of mankind when you're actually making things worse. NGO types and fukers like you piss me off and Laos does not definately need them. The inflated prices they charge me for opium to support their families is more than you've ever done. So fuk off.

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## 9999

> You are incredibly lucky that you were not picked up by the local police. This often happens in Vang Vieng.





> I would say a good 5% get scammed.


So taking a 20/1 risk for a small fee is 'incredibly luck'. More like <0.5% anyway. From what authority do you speak? Have you seen the affects of Beer in Vientiane??? If it eren't for western influence rampant alcohol abuse would not be a problem. The only reason opium is illegal is to appease the wanka seppos and their war on drugs and holding a country they came in and fuked right up for aid ransom. The Laos people don't give a fuk about this law and continue to do what they have been doing for centuries. And it's their choice to make money off it from tourists.

MODS, please MKP all the posts from when the fly by night do gooding fukwit came in and destroyed a qulaity travel thread.

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## Vientianeboy

What a hoot, referring to your own thread as a "quality thread'. You are a legend in your own underpants. If you think the residents in VV don't care, I suggest you read the comments made by the owner of the Mulberry Farm
Laos, Vang Vieng tourism | Tubing hurting town and culture

No, I do not work for an NGO. I told you, I live here! Your limited vocabulary is clearly a reflection of your intelligence.

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## Satonic

I guess there is no chance in sharing a spliff with you then VBoy, that's a shame you really sound like someone I'd like to hang out with.

If your ever in Thailand there are openings for farangs to go into bars and restaurants and grass up the farang owners if they go near the fridge. You'd have a great time.

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## Vientianeboy

> I guess there is no chance in sharing a spliff with you then VBoy, that's a shame you really sound like someone I'd like to hang out with.
> 
> If your ever in Thailand there are openings for farangs to go into bars and restaurants and grass up the farang owners if they go near the fridge. You'd have a great time.


Silly analogy for obvious reasons. You just don't get it, do you? Have you been to Xieng Khouan? Have you seen the problems caused by drugs, both yaba and opium?

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## Satonic

I have been to a lot of places that have problems with drugs, I have also seen a lot more problems caused by the taxed drugs.

But that wasn't my point, I just thought its pathetic that you would run squealing to the nearest cop if you saw someone smoking a joint, drinking a mushroom shake, eating a 'special' pizza etc etc

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## Vientianeboy

Satonic, at least it is possible to have a halfway sensible discussion with you unlike with the op who really appears to a self interested twat.
There are victimless crimes which, in my opinion, are the business of the perpetrator. Buying opium means that it had to be grown somewhere. The Lao Govt is currently trying to eradicate the opium crops of the GT. Buying this encourages others to grow it. As it is largely hill tribes and Hmong who grow opium this contributes to an increasing tension between Hmong and the Lao Govt. Further Lao is an underdeveloped country. Relying on drug money should be discouraged. Do you want Lao to become another Colombia? I don't. You see, every action has a reaction . People like 9999 don't bother thinking about that when they indulge themselves. Perhaps they do and don't give a shit. Well, I live here and I do give a shit.

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## terry57

Good information 9999, last time I was in VV there where lots of tourists so you where lucky to get it Quiet. 

Great beer the Dark Lao and also the French rolls for Breaky where Tops.

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## terry57

> The Lao Govt is currently trying to eradicate the opium crops of the GT.



I think your conveniently not acknowledging that the cops are getting a nice little earner out of all those businesses in VV that sell gear and thats why the vast majority of tourists are left alone to get stoned. 

They grab one here and there just so they can say there making an effort but everybody knows its a load of wank.

Your intentions are good but the place is corrupt as fuk with the vast majority of law makers and enforcers living well of the drug smuggling and drug taking in VV.

Every visitor to VV is offered drugs so why aren't the cops enforcing the law. ? 

The answers not hard is it.

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## Satonic

> Satonic, at least it is possible to have a halfway sensible discussion with you unlike with the op who really appears to a self interested twat.
> There are victimless crimes which, in my opinion, are the business of the perpetrator. Buying opium means that it had to be grown somewhere. The Lao Govt is currently trying to eradicate the opium crops of the GT. Buying this encourages others to grow it. As it is largely hill tribes and Hmong who grow opium this contributes to an increasing tension between Hmong and the Lao Govt. Further Lao is an underdeveloped country. Relying on drug money should be discouraged. Do you want Lao to become another Colombia? I don't. You see, every action has a reaction . People like 9999 don't bother thinking about that when they indulge themselves. Perhaps they do and don't give a shit. Well, I live here and I do give a shit.



You do argue a fair point, and on the smaller scale a lot of the young backpacker like tourists that Laos attract go there specifically for the mushrooms and opium, when I owned my guest house the guys moving onto Laos that was all they would speak about.

I'd be interested in just how motivated the govt really are to eradicate the crops.

And Terry yes... dark beer Lao, less than the price of chang here for a large bottle and a great great beer.

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## 9999

Vientiane Boy is clueless. He lives there, wow, his said it like 50 times, must want a badge or something. If he's ever had a beer then he's a complete hypocrite. Thinking he's the model expat Laos people want in their country and being the opium police and thinkng it's him that determines the type of people Laos wants in their country. Typical ignorant twat. All the while taking advantage of hte local population acting as his slaves to live his luxurious lifestyle in a 3rd world country that smokes opium as an inherint part of their culture.

And if you wanted a sensible discussion you wouldn't have started off with such idiot statements VB. You're just trolling. VV has done nicely from the tourist trade and you choose the one reference that is against it to base your whole argument on.

Now go exploit the population and have a beer too, I'm sure you got plenty of mates over there to have one with. And please, tell us one more time you live there, just in case we didn't hear or pick it up from your avatar. It's so impressive, maybe you should shout it from the rooftops of the slums you lord over.

And yes, according to the vast majority of members, this is a quality travel thread. What have you contributed VB apart from findng something to troll about? You've failed to address any of my points and just keep dribbling 'drugs are bad mkay'

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## 9999

What % of opium smoke in Laos is done by foreigners? I suppose that won't get answered by the expert who wants everyone so desperately to know lives there, it wouldn't support his self-important line.

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## Vientianeboy

No doubt the police are corrupt - well some of them anyway. So are some of the local officials, which is why the owner of the Organic Farm has difficulties.
Satonic, the Lao Govt is pretty committed to getting rid of drugs. The main reason for this is not an altruistic one, but rather that foreign aid, particularly from the US is linked to this policy.

9999, as I said, you think you are a legend in your own underpants. Do you notice how when someone lacks the nous to construct a proper argument they accuse people of being trolls? Highly amusing.

I also find it amusing how you automatically assume I am a westerner.

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## 9999

When did I say you were a westerner? And yes it would be a fair assumption given the demographics of this websites. LOL I spose you're an Indonesian female.

So why have you not addressed any of my points? Do you drink beer? What affect does alcohol have on the Laos people. How long has opium been an inherint part of the culture?

I go to a country where the local people themselves offer me a product which I consume. You think this is wrong and would do anything in your power to destroy my life because of it.

And what are you doing for the betterment of Laos, to be on such a moral high horse?

BTW I've had several supporting messages saying how much of a tool you are being. That is how I judge the quality of this thread, fedback from other posters, nothing to do with my underpants you seem so obsessed about.

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## 9999

> Satonic, the Lao Govt is pretty committed to getting rid of drugs.


Wrong. The US government is. The Laos government couldn't give a shit.

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## 9999

> 9999, as I said, you think you are a legend in your own underpants. Do you notice how when someone lacks the nous to construct a proper argument they accuse people of being trolls? Highly amusing.


I consider myself a legend coz this thread has had a good amount of positive feedback. In fact the only negatives have come from you. Not a troll for constructing an argument. a troll for arguing alone in an antagonist manner without adrressing the counter arguments. This is the hallmark of a troll.

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## Vientianeboy

> Originally Posted by Vientianeboy
> 
> Satonic, the Lao Govt is pretty committed to getting rid of drugs.
> 
> 
> Wrong. The US government is. The Laos government couldn't give a shit.


And you know this because? You appear to know as much or as little as the man in the moon.
My last response to you. You know the saying "Don't wrestle with a pig. The pig loves it and you will only get dirty?"  :smiley laughing:

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## 9999

^ Still no answers to my questions. Why should I answer you. Clearly though you know very little of the country you reside and it's culture. How ignorant. If you're so concerned about this issue why don't you start a new thread on it? This whole discussion is in the wrong section. Or was your whole purpose to troll this thread?

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## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by Vientianeboy
> 
> Satonic, the Lao Govt is pretty committed to getting rid of drugs.
> 
> 
> Wrong. The US government is. The Laos government couldn't give a shit.


Correct.

The Laos government are only interested in what they can get for nothing from foreign governments so they can show the people how fucking important they are.

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## Satonic

OPIUM AND HEROIN CULTIVATION AND TRADE - World Topics | Facts and Details

Some interesting FACTS about Laos and opium.

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## Vientianeboy

> Originally Posted by 9999
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Vientianeboy
> ...


Your basis for this incredibly insightful and intelligent comment is? Just curious to know how many of the govt ministers you have spoken to to arrive at this premise.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Just curious to know how many of the govt ministers you have spoken to to arrive at this premise.


Well, obviously you've spoken to every government minister and believe everything they say, because we all know how honest and hard working they are.

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## Vientianeboy

> Originally Posted by Vientianeboy
> 
> Just curious to know how many of the govt ministers you have spoken to to arrive at this premise.
> 
> 
> Well, obviously you've spoken to every government minister and believe everything they say, because we all know how honest and hard working they are.


No I have not; Where did I say I had spoken to "all of them"? However I know 5 them and have spoken to one or two others. How many have you spoken to Marmite? The 5 I know are generally hardworking and honest; I have no doubts that just like in any country's government there are a number who are not. From which country are you? Are all your ministers honest?

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## Marmite the Dog

> From which country are you?


Philippines.




> Are all your ministers honest?


Definitely.

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## Vientianeboy

> Originally Posted by Vientianeboy
> 
> From which country are you?
> 
> 
> Philippines.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah right!  :Smile:

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## terry57

> I know 5 them and have spoken to one or two others.




Next time your having a chat ask them,

" Why do the pigs allow the selling of drugs in VV and how much of a kick back are you getting for turning a blind eye ."

VV is the equivalent of the full moon party on Koh Phan-Gan but on a much smaller scale.  

The cops there are getting a sling  for looking away same as the pigs in VV.

No use trying to not acknowledge the fact as its just the way it is because both places are corrupt as fuk.

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## Vientianeboy

"No use trying to not acknowledge the fact"

Quote: "I have no doubts that just like in any country's government there are a number who are not" (honest)
Plus I have already said that a number of police and officials are corrupt. 
Who is not acknowledging the fact?

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## SweRob

Did we ever get the name of the GH in the picture/story? Great story btw, really enjoyed the read.

As far as the drug use discussion goes, i find it funny that* VB would report the Drug user and not the Drug seller, that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.


*

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## 9999

Nah mate couldn't find it out. Easy enough to find though it runs parallel to the main street and the river, and is the closest street to the river.

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## Vientianeboy

> Did we ever get the name of the GH in the picture/story? Great story btw, really enjoyed the read.
> 
> As far as the drug use discussion goes, i find it funny that* VB would report the Drug user and not the Drug seller, that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
> 
> 
> *


Why? If there weren't users then there would not be sellers, would there?

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## Msbrenda

So luv the view from your balcony over the river  :Smile:

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## 9999

> Originally Posted by Propagator
> 
> Loei to Udon abut 3 hrs
> Udon to Nong Khai abou 1 hr to 1 1/2 hrs.
> 
> 
> I'd prolly go Loei - to Nong Khai direct along the Mekong.


MTD I'm doing this trip again next month (with revised route).

When you say 'up along the meekong' do you mean route 211? I had that eyed off as the route to take but thought it would be the 'scenic' option due to the windy road along the river. This is also the quickest route (considering I'm carrying an infant and will probably not go much over 90km/ph the whole trip)?

Cheers.

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## rebbu

Great thread, until that twat took over.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Great thread, until that twat took over.


Which one?  :Smile: 




> When you say 'up along the meekong' do you mean route 211?


Yes, north up the 201 to Chiang Khan and the along the 211 to NK. It's a piece of piss and only the occasional spot where the road has fallen into the river.

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## Phuketrichard

out of phuket 3rd of July heading to  Chaing Khong, crossing over to Laos and then onwards west than south thru Luang Prabang, Vientiane  all the way to Paxse. Beofre crossing over to Cambodia
Will start a thread when am at the border:-)

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## beerlaodrinker

> Have you seen the affects of Beer in Vientiane??


If you good punters wanna see the affects of beer in vientiane , come out on the piss with me ,

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