#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Construction in Thailand >  >  Insulating your home in Thailand

## dirtydog

Now insulation I aint an expert on, but I really hate going into peoples houses that are hotter inside than outside, ie the low end bungalows with very little space between the roof and ceiling.

So the first thing you need is as high a roof as you can afford to give you more attic space, you also need to vent the roof, either with a couple of those stainless steel spinner things which are only a couple of thousand baht each, or vents in the walls for the attic area, next up you need to insulate that area, the foil lined fiberglass are rolls are the quickest and easiest, to buy them works out at a costing of about 100baht per square meter, these you just chuck ontop of your ceiling.





Next up we shall have the old sprayed on insulation foam, this is for the more high end customer  :Smile:

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## dirtydog

The spray on foam insulation is pretty damn good, but at the price they charge is it worth it or not is a good question, I think nowadays you wont get much change out of 500baht per square meter, this is sprayed directly on the underneath of the roof tiles, some low end roof tiles you can't really expect much more than a 10 years life span, and cos this stuff is semi flexible it is a right bastard to get a roof tile up, so if your roof ever needs changing it turns out to be a major job.

In Pattaya they have 2 companies that do this spray on foam insulation and both seem pretty much the same, ie big lorry and oneday to do the job.









Next week we shall discuss insulation blocks for your walls  :Smile:

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## ChiangMai noon

I'm glad you brought this up, I have been trying to decide between insulation and more air-con.
Does the insulation actually work and keep the place nice and cool?

100 baht a sq metre sounds allright if it works.

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## Thetyim

> Does the insulation actually work and keep the place nice and cool?


Worked for me, I am happy with ours.

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## dirtydog

it works, but also I would have thought that by the very nature of insulation it would also retain heat for longer, if you don't normally use aircon I feel that all insulation will do is change the daily times of when the ceiling gets hot, ie it will take longer for it to get hot, but in the evenings would take longer to get cool.

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## ChiangMai noon

Oh...
So does that mean I should get it or not??

I only have aircon in our bedroom, the rest of the house gets terribly ot.

Starting to get cooler up here now, so i'll probably have about 8 months to think about it anyway.

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## dirtydog

Defineately chuck it on top of any aircon rooms  :Smile:

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## lom

I have that aluminium foil wrapped fiberglass on top of my ceiling, and have yet to find out if it makes much difference or not..

Thermodynamic says that hot air strives upwards, insulating the ceiling will block that.
Furthermore, material in most ceilings have a low K (heat transfer factor)
acting as insulation itself.

I find it more logical to insulate under the roof tiles to stop heat from getting into the attic. And , as DD mentioned, vent the attic.

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## friscofrankie

Attics get hot,  sun beatin down on 'em all day..  The are inthere will be hotter 'n hell.  The Thais been leavin' the ceiling in an open beam configuration with good cross vetilation up high and broad over hangs for a couple a centuries.  This works.  
Putting a vent-fan in the attic works too.  If you vent and insulate the ceiling (not the roof) think it's the best of both worlds.  Those that like aircon might get better results with this type of insulation.  
I dislike aircon and with good coss flow ventilation and broad overhangs would be comfortable.  Kinda like the heat

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## hillbilly

Something should work. Still not quiet there yet. 
My electric bill last month was B3,600. :Smile:

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## Airportwo

I got the foam spray on stuff, it does the job for sure, check the price now though - imagine being "oil" based product price will have risen substatially from 500 Baht m2
Be cheap to set up to do this, it's just two chemicals, two Bbl pumps and a mixing chamber with a spray gun on the end.

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## weescotsguy66

Try using Superblock for insulation purposes, I have 4 air-cons in a relative small house 3 bedrooms and lounge.. And my bills are only 2,000 baht

Costs 25 baht for Superblock and 7 baht for normal breeze block but in the long run it pays for Superblock

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## buadhai

> it works, but also I would have thought that by the very nature of insulation it would also retain heat for longer, if you don't normally use aircon I feel that all insulation will do is change the daily times of when the ceiling gets hot, ie it will take longer for it to get hot, but in the evenings would take longer to get cool.


Spot on. Exactly what we discovered. Insulation lowers the air con bill, but the room is actually hotter when you don't air con. But, our attic is not well ventilated which I believe would make a large difference.

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## Eliminator

Check out Cool or Cosy, it's a cellulose fibre insulation, works great and bugs can't live in it. Better than any foam or fiberglass and safer than both. It's a spray on application. Check out  http://www.buildata.com.au/coolcosy/default.htm  for more information. Just give Steven a call, nice bloke.

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## Thetyim

In Uk you can buy aerosol cans of expanding foam insulation.  I have seen it used for installing window frames and even fixing a car body to the chassis.  It is very strong.

So you could bring some over and do it yourself

I used to buy a case of it at 2 quid a can, but that was a long time ago.

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## Airportwo

I bought some here in Pattaya, 600 Baht a can - German and Fckin crap    :Mad:  what pissed me off more was I bought 6 cans of the Crap! :Sad: 




> In Uk you can buy aerosol cans of expanding foam insulation. I have seen it used for installing window frames and even fixing a car body to the chassis. It is very strong.  So you could bring some over and do it yourself  I used to buy a case of it at 2 quid a can, but that was a long time ago.

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## charlie

> Try using Superblock for insulation purposes, I have 4 air-cons in a relative small house 3 bedrooms and lounge.. And my bills are only 2,000 baht
> 
> Costs 25 baht for Superblock and 7 baht for normal breeze block but in the long run it pays for Superblock


 
are those the white non-hollowed blocks?

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## Curious George

> ...So the first thing you need is as high a roof as you can afford to give you more attic space, you also need to vent the roof, either with a couple of those stainless steel spinner things which are only a couple of thousand baht each, or vents in the walls for the attic area...





> ...Putting a vent-fan in the attic works too....


My house in Florida is over 20 years old. It has a ventilated soffit, plus gable vents. Originally, it had a powered vent on the roof. Almost every other year, I had to replace the fan motor that had 'cooked' due to the attic heat. Roofing in Florida lasts only a few years, even if guaranteed for 20 or more. The sun cooks the shingles until they curl and break apart.

I recently had my roof redone, and the roofer said he was not too pleased to keep the old power vent. His main contention was that "any hole that you cut into the roof is eventualy going to leak". He installed a ridge vent, instead.

The attic and general house temperature has improved, even though the ventilation is now only passive.  :Smile: 

I don't know whether this idea can be useful in Thailand, but it may be possible with new construction. Here is more info about ridge vents from a manufacturer:
http://www.airvent.com/homeowner/pro...dgeVents.shtml

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## Dougal

I have seen a few roofs in Thailand with a water spray system that every so often squirts water over the surface.

Although not insulation, it's purpose is the same to cool the house - but by the evaporation of the water.

Has anyone tried this and if they have have they found it effective?

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## aging one

My roof is very thick say over 1/2 inch tiles, I dont see how the water could work. But at the same time we put in a patio with these red bricks I had never seen before. They cost 7 baht apiece. The wife said they would be cool and I thought she was nuts.

Well she wasnt if you hose them down a couple of times a day they are at least 5 degrees C less than the air temperature and these bring down the overall heat on the side of our house where the patio is. Its almost like they are off the space shuttle, I really dont see how they do it. But I do like it. I had a party out there saturday and everyone was very surprised as to how cool they are.

My 16 year old dog rarely goes anywhere else since we put it in. :Smile:  

So the roof thing might well work.

Further inspection those are either 1 inch tiles or just under at 2 centimers.  

Dog will find this soon!! :Smile:

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## Airportwo

For sure this would work, but - yes quite - there are so many Butt's -
Explain them ALL to us please DD?
Cheers




> I have seen a few roofs in Thailand with a water spray system that every so often squirts water over the surface.

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## dirtydog

> Explain them ALL to us please DD?


I was hoping that someone with a bit more knowledge on the subject would explain them to all of us  :Smile:

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## lom

Well, ehum.. 

Some basics , materials first:
Compact material are usually very good thermal conductors while loose material are insulators.
Example of an extremely good conductors is glass.
Cement/brick walls and wood is half-conductors and mineral wool is an insulator..

Thick material have higher thermal storage capacity than thin material.
Thick material also introduces a delay in the heat transfer while thin material has an immediate transfer.

Major reasons for getting a hot house is heat transferred through the glass windows and heat transferred through and stored in cement/brick walls.


How to get rid of it ?

Hot air travels upwards , cold air falls down. 
So the ceiling could be made of a good conducting material , transferring heat from the room up to the attic.
But this will only work if the temperature in the attic is lower than the temperature of the room.
The problem with the attic is that it is getting a lot of heat from the roof tiles, which if they are of brick type also are good thermal magasines.

Without venting the attic there is also big chance that you get the reverse effect - heat beeing transferred from the attic via the ceiling down into the house.

The other approach is to build a good insulation layer in the ceiling.  This will stop heat coming down that way but will of course also stop room heat getting up.. An aircon will quickly take care of that though.

Better wall material like SuperBlock should help a lot. I don't have any experience of my own from them, only had a look at their website.
The K-value is 0.08 compared to 1.2 for normal red brick so they are very good insulators.
But there aint much you can do to the walls if they are already there..

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## hillbilly

> Originally Posted by Airportwo
> 
> Explain them ALL to us please DD?
> 
> 
> I was hoping that someone with a bit more knowledge on the subject would explain them to all of us


Well, I do not have the smarts to explain this subject. But, just today I was visiting a semi-floating market near BKK.. It is hard to tell by the photo but this shop uses a sprinkling system on the roof. One can see the constant patter of water hitting the river as it falls from the roof. The staff said it really keeps the inside cooler. I will say that although today was very hot, the eating area was rather cool.

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## stroller

It's called "rain", hillbilly.

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## Marmite the Dog

> My roof is very thick say over 1/2 inch tiles, I dont see how the water could work. But at the same time we put in a patio with these red bricks I had never seen before. They cost 7 baht apiece. The wife said they would be cool and I thought she was nuts.
> 
> Well she wasnt if you hose them down a couple of times a day they are at least 5 degrees C less than the air temperature and these bring down the overall heat on the side of our house where the patio is. Its almost like they are off the space shuttle, I really dont see how they do it. But I do like it. I had a party out there saturday and everyone was very surprised as to how cool they are.
> 
> My 16 year old dog rarely goes anywhere else since we put it in. 
> 
> So the roof thing might well work.
> 
> Further inspection those are either 1 inch tiles or just under at 2 centimers.  
> ...


I want those bricks on the roof patio of my new pad. I hope my contractor knows what they are.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## dirtydog

> Well she wasnt if you hose them down a couple of times a day they are at least 5 degrees C less than the air temperature and these bring down the overall heat on the side of our house where the patio is.


Note the if you hose them down bit marmers, dark colors absorb and retain heat, better off with a nice light color  :Smile:  a nice pale pink perhaps  :Smile:

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## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by aging one
> 
> Well she wasnt if you hose them down a couple of times a day they are at least 5 degrees C less than the air temperature and these bring down the overall heat on the side of our house where the patio is.
> 
> 
> Note the if you hose them down bit marmers, dark colors absorb and retain heat, better off with a nice light color  a nice pale pink perhaps


These are not normal bricks DD. They're like smooth engineering bricks. Do you know what they are? You should find out, 'cos that's what I want.  :Smile:

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## Dougal

I would guess that the bricks are the more usual clay type that absorb water. If they are given a good dousing it will take some time for the water to evaporate. Engineering bricks tend to be pretty impervious to water.

I have a wine cooler (very posh in the Dougal household) here that works on the same principle.

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## dirtydog

> Engineering bricks tend to be pretty impervious to water.


Thats probably a good idea aswell, otherwise it would destroy the wallpaper  :Smile:

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## Marmite the Dog

> I would guess that the bricks are the more usual clay type that absorb water. If they are given a good dousing it will take some time for the water to evaporate. Engineering bricks tend to be pretty impervious to water.
> 
> I have a wine cooler (very posh in the Dougal household) here that works on the same principle.


I'm sure my builder knows exactly what they are, but he's JUST BEING AN ANNOYING KNUT!!!

 :Smile:

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## Eliminator

Get some pics of the bricks and show that to your builder.

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## Whiteshiva

> Originally Posted by dirtydog
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Airportwo
> 
> ...


In purely thermodynamic terms, some of the water evaporates, and this removes heat from the surroundings.  Much like boiling water, which basically is rapid evaporation, and requires energy (electricity).

The opposite effect can be observed when moisture in the air condenses on your beer bottle.  The condensation gives off heat, which heats up your drink.  In fact, a cold drink will heat up quicker in a moist environment than in a dry environment for that very reason.

Getting back to evaporation, the water spray coolers one sees around open air restaurants and bar areas basically atomizes the water (very small droplets), giving it a huge surface area, and thus speeds evaporation.  This evaporation takes heat from the air, and voila - cold air.

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## dirtydog

> Getting back to evaporation, the water spray coolers one sees around open air restaurants and bar areas basically atomizes the water (very small droplets), giving it a huge surface area, and thus speeds evaporation. This evaporation takes heat from the air, and voila - cold air.


They are great for dry countries but here I think it is too humid for them and the evaporation process takes too long, they just seem to make you feel even more sticky.

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## Whiteshiva

> Originally Posted by Whiteshiva
> 
> Getting back to evaporation, the water spray coolers one sees around open air restaurants and bar areas basically atomizes the water (very small droplets), giving it a huge surface area, and thus speeds evaporation. This evaporation takes heat from the air, and voila - cold air.
> 
> 
> They are great for dry countries but here I think it is too humid for them and the evaporation process takes too long, they just seem to make you feel even more sticky.


I agree they work better in dry climates, but they do work here as well.  Humidity here is normally around 70-80%, so there' still room for some more water in the air  :Cool:

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## RandomChances

> Much like boiling water, which basically is rapid evaporation, and requires energy (electricity).


 Oddly the production of most electricity involves boling large ammounts of water to drive the turbines, which drive the generaters, the electricity then passes down long lenghts of electric string to peoples houses for use in boiling water at a local level.....ironic realy

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## Whiteshiva

> Originally Posted by Whiteshiva
> 
> Much like boiling water, which basically is rapid evaporation, and requires energy (electricity).
> 
> 
>  Oddly the production of most electricity involves boling large ammounts of water to drive the turbines, which drive the generaters, the electricity then passes down long lenghts of electric string to peoples houses for use in boiling water at a local level.....ironic realy


Yeah, I agree - not very efficient, but the best we have at the moment. 

Find a new way of converting heat to electricity, patent it, and you will be richer than Bill Gates in no time.

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## Sanuk Canuk

When building a slightly taller roof with light coloured surface should help. Vents at the soffits and eaves should help. Air should naturally circulate in through the soffit vents and out through the eave vents. Unless water is free spraying it on the roof may turn out to be just as expensive as AC.

In a climate like Thailand a floating roof over the structure might make sense, then the ceiling needs to be "critter tight" though as it would act as a sort of second roof.

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## Texpat

Feck, for all this trouble, why not just move to Sweden? It's pretty cool there.

I'm moving into an extra large freezer fit with a toilet, a bed and computer desk. I'll build my house around it.

 :Smile:

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## aging one

The main reason I bought my brand of aircon is that it removes the humidity from the air.  I have a hard time cooling down in a humid climate.

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## dirtydog

Here is a house being built out of superblock.

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## Butterfly

So apart from isolation, what's the advantages of these bricks over the red one ? are the walls more resistant ?

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## dirtydog

Quicker to lay, easy to cut, ie with a woodsaw, plus they are all the same size and shape :Smile:

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## aging one

What about strength DD?  You for sure couldnt use them in SF, Tokyo, or Taipei because of earthquakes it would seem.

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## lom

Superblocks are slightly stronger, check their web site for specifications.

http://www.superblock.co.th/

About being same size and shape, yes they are until the brick layer has ruined it all.. Just take a look at  the picture.. They could as well have been deformed  already in the factory instead of at the building site.

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## Butterfly

I am amazed at what Thais will do to make something that is already straight, not straight. I was teaching that guy how to not recut a piece of woods if the edge were already cut straight from the machine. He still couldn't get it.

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## lom

Well their motto is "Why do it good today when you can patch over it tomorrow"..

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## Airportwo

> What about strength DD? You for sure couldnt use them in SF, Tokyo, or Taipei because of earthquakes it would seem.


As these blocks are not load bearing strengh is immaterial? I think, is that right DD or is my understanding of building "methology in Thai" wrong?
Cheers

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## dirtydog

Nope they are not loadbearing, still need to pour your beams and everything.

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## DrAndy

The cooling effect of water can be very good, it soaks into the bricks and slowly evaporates, thus cooling the area. Some bars use a fine mist spray to keep their customers cool.

spraying it on the roof though seems a bit wasteful, even if it does help a bit. Better insulation is the way to go, and some sort of venting system. Most traditional houses in Thailand use this method.

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## Dougal

> About being same size and shape, yes they are until the brick layer has ruined it all.. Just take a look at the picture.. They could as well have been deformed already in the factory instead of at the building site.


Doesn't look too bad to me, although the overlap where the bricks have a longer run seems a bit too little. Are you looking at the lower section of bricks below the ground beam? Those have been laid in conventional concrete block as far as I can tell.

A question for DD. It looks like the builder has created a concrete frame around all the doors and windows is that the case and is that usual with this type of block?

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## Texpat

They look a lot like the standard American cinder block. Any difference?

Maybe they're a little smaller.

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## spliff

Is that a basement in the pictured "super block" house?

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## Dougal

http://www.superblockthailand.com/service.html

Everything you ever wanted to know about superblocks - very informative.

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## Boon Mee

> Quicker to lay, easy to cut, ie with a woodsaw, plus they are all the same size and shape


Tougher to make the wiring and plumbing runs though?

Which is a better bet - Q-Con (Superblock) or double-wall construction with foam insulation between the two walls?
Thanks!

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## Boon Mee

DD - what's the 'standard' or typical air gap between a double-walled block outer wall construction?  Foam, electric, toilet vents to pass thru.
Cheers,
BM

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## dirtydog

I been thinking about your previous post boon mee, still not sure how to answer that, although obviously a double block wall with insulation would be better but damn expensive.

UK the gap was 10 cms I believe, but things like toilet pipes were run down thru a false wall.

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## Dougal

> Which is a better bet - Q-Con (Superblock) or double-wall construction with foam insulation between the two walls?


I'm going to specualte on this and risk making myself look a prat.

In cold climates the intention is usually to keep heat in, and the air gap in a double wall helps this. On the basis that hot air rises and cold falls a double wall with no other insulation will be less efficient than one with foam in which is going to act like a wooly jumper.

Now in Thailand you want to keep the heat out so I postulate that a double wall with an air gap will be more efficient at doing that than one with a foam layer - my thinking being that air heated within the gap will be free to rise and vent at the top into the roof void, if at the same time vent bricks are inserted at the bottom to allow cooler air to replace the warmer.

Of course having air con might throw the whole theory out of the window so to speak.

I was toying with the idea of using the thinner 4" superblocks together with a 4" concrete block to keep the cost down. I haven't costed it see if this is cheaper than a single wall of the thicker superblock.

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## Boon Mee

Well, Dougal & DD, turns out I'm the one who's the Prat here.  Seems like I should have been talking about clay brick rather than concrete block with respect to the double-wall exterior.  Does that make more sense?
Sorry 'bout that. :Smile:

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## Boon Mee

For those who are interested, here's a thread from over in CoolThaiHouse where a poster has put a shot of how he did the air gap. Very informative although fitting the Q-con behind the Red Brick is something I've not seen before.
DD - any thoughts?
Cheers :Smile:

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## dirtydog

Any Thoughts? yep loads of them, but I got to goto work and then I am off to Chang Mai  :Smile:

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## in4zip

a good short clear read for the uninitiated  :Smile: 
http://www.school-for-champions.com/...insulation.htm

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## ChiangMai noon

> but I got to goto work and then I am off to Chang Mai


Nearly time for me to get out of Dodge, i heard Nan province was rather nice.

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## NickA

I lost two fingers in a lawnmower accident, so I can't count how many greens you've got, but I know it's more then 8, I can count to 8.

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## Dougal

> Seems like I should have been talking about clay brick rather than concrete block with respect to the double-wall exterior


BM there are three thicknesses of concrete block that I have seen, the thinnest looks the same as the red bricks but has a similar hollow to the other concrete blocks. That might be a better alternative as it would give you a type of double air gap.

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## whosyourdaddy

> Here is a house being built out of superblock.


In regards to the superblock. You will realize why it is so cheap why you try and hang a picture or an aircon unit off of it. Hate the stuff. Red bricks and mortar for me please

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## dirtydog

> You will realize why it is so cheap why you try and hang a picture or an aircon unit off of it.


I think you are thinking of "Breeze Blocks" or "Clinker Blocks", these are 3 and half baht each and are junk.

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## man with no head

Does anyone know which form of block would be best for sound insulation? Like, for example, we all know how Thais love those big massive speakers that go boom-boom. How about advice on insulating from outside sound?

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## Whiteshiva

> Does anyone know which form of block would be best for sound insulation? Like, for example, we all know how Thais love those big massive speakers that go boom-boom. How about advice on insulating from outside sound?


A pair of wire cutters on a dark night usually does the trick.....

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## Bung

Regarding cooling down an attic, I was thinking of installing an exhaust fan in my ceiling somewhere to help displace all the heat out through the vents in the eaves and draw the cool air from outside in the evenings. i have seen ones for kitchens that have a shutter so that would keep the bugs out.

In Australia, every house has vents in each corner of each room to let the hot air flow upwards and escape, i think they would be worthwhile installing and are very cheap.

Would one of those twirly things be as good or better? We don't get a lot of wind here....(Unless I have been eating farang food again!)

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## jumbo

Thanks to all for the information regarding Superblock and the pictures from John. I would like to think that I will be able to build my home out of the same blockred brick. I have seen the Superblock web site and it is quite informative. Can not wait to return from work in Brazil to start the build.
One more thing, do builders in Pattaya have accounts with builders merchants or do they pay cash as they have the products. 
Any web sites of builders merchants in Pattaya, I have had a look for Homemart but nothing found.

Many thanks, Jumbo.

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## Dougal

HomePro web site is useful for geting an idea of prices and availability although you will probably be able to get better deals on items by shopping around. And it tends to be biased towards accessories rather than the heavy stuff.

Homepro | Home is Homepro

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## dirtydog

> do builders in Pattaya have accounts with builders merchants or do they pay cash as they have the products.


Most have accounts for basic materials, we pay when we want, or when the shop thinks we owe too much.

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## Dougal

This is the only construction I have seen in Thailand where double skin cavity wall is being used as opposed to calling the hollow in the concrete blocks 'cavity wall'. Although it is not too clear in the photo the inner skin is 10cm superblock and the outer one those nasty little red bricks.

They have also used rockwool mat in the cavity which I think is a mistake, my personal unscientific view being that leaving an air gap would keep the house cooler.

These are a set of six houses and are 26million B by the way, and all sold already.

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## JASONTHAI

Hi can you put roof insulation under synthetic roof sheets, I was think of puttting a reflective sheet under the roof & also above the celling tiles would this help I will of course have eaves at each side of the roof.


Cheers
Jason

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## Dougal

> Hi can you put roof insulation under synthetic roof sheets, I was think of puttting a reflective sheet under the roof & also above the celling tiles would this help I will of course have eaves at each side of the roof.
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Jason


I don't see why not. The insulation under the roof sheet would be the silvered bubble wrap type I guess. I'm told that you can get foil backed drywall sheets. Are you planning to put ventilation in the roof (other than the eaves) to let the hot air out?

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## JASONTHAI

Hi dougle you have confussed me now, I thought that by putting eaves at each side was for ventalation is there other way to do this for roof?

Cheers

Jason

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## Dougal

Are we getting confused by nomenclature?



On a Thai house the eaves will typically extend beyond the walls by a metre. Some people will simply board up the underside of the eaves to seal them from insects and whatever getting in amaking a home in your roof. But as an option you could use vents in the eaves backed by mosquito mesh to allow the circulation of air into the roof space.

From you reply I suspect that you are thinking of the mini gable ends that project out from the roof at right angles (I don't know what the technical name is for these).

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## kerux

> But as an option you could use vents in the eaves backed by mosquito mesh to allow the circulation of air into the roof space.


Good idea.

I haven't read through the entire thread, only the first page. 

For what's it's worth, and my apologies to any who already stated this, but if I was to build in a tropical climate, in regards to cooling, I would: 

Use steel trusses. Install 'stryofoam' insulation in 2 x 8 panels on the roof under the roofing material, which would be one of the new materials that look like tile. Build long eaves that cover the sides of the house as much as feasible. 

Install at least one, maybe more, enclosed exhaust ceiling fans in the highest points of the ceiling areas. Enclosed, because they tend to be noisy if the quality is not good. Buy the best fan money can buy. 

Install an electronic control that automatically turns on the fan when temps get too hot. First one fan, then the others. 

Done right, most of the year, air condintioning won't be needed.

[btw: my grandfather, my father, myself and my son have been or are building contractors.]

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## kerux

btw 2: that 'superblock' is a great idea and I don't know why more of it isn;t being used in Thailand. I would insist on it.

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## Dougal

> new materials that look like tile.


I haven't seen these tiles for sale in Thailand. Steel trusses and overhanging eaves are pretty much standard in LOS. Styrofoam sheet I haven't seen either but rolls of foil are, or you can have foam sprayed on the underside of the roof. I plan to install rof fans in the next house I build.

Another option I have seen is to install a water spray on the roof which runs on a timer.

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## kerux

That spray on foam is well.....not my first choice, or my second.

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## Dougal

Back to an old theme.

My new house is coming on, and this week the brickies started to lay the blocks. I am using 20cm insulating blocks for all outside walls and as a very unscientific test I put the flat of my hand on the inside face of a 20cm concrete column and felt the heat and then did the same on a block laid in the wall next to it. I would say that there was a good 5c difference in the temperture of the two surfaces. The wall I tried this on was South facing and had the benefit of full sunlight for at least nine hours. 

If anyone knows where I can get a stick on surface thermometer I will try and do a more scientific test.

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## thaimat

I am in the process of planning a sound studio, here in Pattaya.  My research has led me to believe that the best sound and thermal insulation is from Insulated Concrete Forms, ICF's.  These are blocks made from Expanded PolyStyrene, EPS.  They look like styrofoam cinderblocks.  They are the form for your concrete pour, and remain in the concrete. Nothing I've read of has their sound and thermal insulation qualities, plus they are more impervious to moisture, bugs than anything else I've been able to find.  The U.S. government recommends them for building hurricane "proof" shelters.  They are not made in Thailand, sad, because the best ones are made from recycled eps.  I am have narrowed my search, on the basis of availability and costs of shipping, to 2 companies, Formtech, and Eco-Block, Formtech has a plant in Malaysia, so truck shipping should be cheap.  They also are a mfg or distributor of "Insul-deck",an eps product for ceilings and floors.  ICF's are not expensive, my costs for a 10x9x3 meter building will be under 50,000baht. Now I just have to find an architect whose eyes don't glaze over at the mention of building with ICF's, a "new" thing in Thailand.  This site is not letting me put in weblinks for these companies, so drop me a line if you want them, tho google will get you to them also. thaimat2003 at yahoo.com

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## Wallalai

> But as an option you could use vents in the eaves backed by mosquito mesh to allow the circulation of air into the roof space.


Another option is to have a lot of windows who allows a maximum air flow. Celling  3 meters  high helps also as hot air tend to ride.  My home have a lot of opened windows and high concrete cellings ang it's always very cool inside. All my neighbours are wondering why my 
living room is so cool in the hot season.  Just let the air  circulate in the house.

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## Boon Mee

> Back to an old theme.
> 
> My new house is coming on, and this week the brickies started to lay the blocks. I am using *20cm insulating blocks* for all outside walls and as a very unscientific test I put the flat of my hand on the inside face of a 20cm concrete column and felt the heat and then did the same on a block laid in the wall next to it. I would say that there was a good 5c difference in the temperture of the two surfaces. The wall I tried this on was South facing and had the benefit of full sunlight for at least nine hours.


Are these the 20cm Q-con blocks, Dougal?
Cheers...

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## Anonymous Coward

I've got a question about venting the attic space. My new house has a hipped roof so there is no room for vents other than in the soffit under the eaves. We asked about putting one of those rotating turbine vents in the roof, but were told this is an allowed as it would be "ugly".

Any other ideas or will the soffit vents at the corners be sufficient?

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## Dougal

> Are these the 20cm Q-con blocks, Dougal?


Not 'authentic' Q Con but made in the same way. My builder got them from Lopburi for 40B each.

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## Boon Mee

> Originally Posted by Boon Mee
> 
> Are these the 20cm Q-con blocks, Dougal?
> 
> 
> Not 'authentic' Q Con but made in the same way. My builder got them from Lopburi for 40B each.


How much are the 'real' ones like from the factory in Ayuttaya priced these days? (20cm).
Cheers. :Smile:

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## Dougal

> Any other ideas or will the soffit vents at the corners be sufficient?


Can you get them to raise a section of the roof to make a vent at the top. That should not involve much additional work. Not having a proper roof vent was one of the biggest mistakes we made when we specified our current cheapy bungalow. Standing on a chair and feeling the ceiling tiles is like putting your hand on a warm radiator.

I would also like to experiment with a water spray on the roof.

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## Anonymous Coward

> Can you get them to raise a section of the roof to make a vent at the top.


I'm afraid the roof is already welded in.

I may just go ahead an add a turbine vent on a less visible part of the roof after we move in.

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## dickie

> Back to an old theme.
> 
> My new house is coming on, and this week the brickies started to lay the blocks. I am using 20cm insulating blocks for all outside walls and as a very unscientific test I put the flat of my hand on the inside face of a 20cm concrete column and felt the heat and then did the same on a block laid in the wall next to it. I would say that there was a good 5c difference in the temperture of the two surfaces. The wall I tried this on was South facing and had the benefit of full sunlight for at least nine hours. 
> 
> If anyone knows where I can get a stick on surface thermometer I will try and do a more scientific test.


We built my house out of 20cm y-tong thermal bricks 3 years ago, the insultation qualties are great & keep the house lovely & cool, only make the outside walls out of these, save money & make the interior walls out of regular bricks, the high ceilings & plenty of windows also help the house keep ventilated & cool, I wouldn't bother spraying the inside of the roof with foam makes a right mess, I know a farang builder down the coast a bit who put some fancy roof tiles on a house & they were pourous, instead of replacing them he sprayed foam onto the inside of the roof, what a joke, he also has the reputation of never finishing of a job as well, no names here, better to use q-con roofing foil under the roofing tiles, works pretty well on the insulation front  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## Dougal

> better to use q-con roofing foil under the roofing tiles, works pretty well on the insulation front


I agree, we are going to use foil under the tiles and also use the foil backed plasterboard. There are a number of different types of foil for the the roof and as we this is the first time we have used it we are opting for the cheapest. The main living area is having a half cathedral roof and we are installing fans into each of two gable vents to draw out hot air - well that's the theory anyway.

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## blackgang

> Originally Posted by dickie
> 
> better to use q-con roofing foil under the roofing tiles, works pretty well on the insulation front
> 
> 
> I agree, we are going to use foil under the tiles and also use the foil backed plasterboard. There are a number of different types of foil for the the roof and as we this is the first time we have used it we are opting for the cheapest. The main living area is having a half cathedral roof and we are installing fans into each of two gable vents to draw out hot air - well that's the theory anyway.


We had the roofing material that was used when we built as I never liked it and we had a terrible idiot when we built, I used the tiles and alum. under them that will carry the air between the foil and the tiles uo to the peak and then out thru some vents [turbo style] that will be fitted to the roof ridge later when they are built, They didn't have the insulating blocks when we built, but a friend who built a couple of years ago has it and I think it is great, 
But we did have the ceilings changed from the suspended tile stuff to solid sealed sheet rock, a roof vent installed below the roof and 2 layers of 3 in. foil covered glass fiber ins., and with the aircons on they do not run much, and with windows open at night during cool nites and closed early it stays cool til long into the afternoons.
There are some pics of the new roof going on in the last few pages of the fotki like I posted.

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## dirtydog

Here is a system I haven't seen before, they are using an insulation material which seems to be much the same as a survival blanket, but the roof tile fixings seem to be made of galvanised steel, wouldn't the humidity cause a reaction between the normal steel and the galvanised?

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## Dougal

If my schoolboy physics serves me correctly any reaction will tend to transfer the galvanised material, usually zinc or a similar material, to the unplated component. The worst that is likely to happen is that the two areas around the contact will end up both thinly galvanised.

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## tango

> Originally Posted by Dougal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Boon Mee
> ...


 Here in Chiangmai on the 4th of April 2007  QCon costs 22Baht each: 20cmW x 60cmL x *7.5*cmThick.

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## Jools

Thank you for this most informative post.

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## DrAndy

I have just used foil under my roof tiles, with wood cladding under the eaves

I have a nice high ceiling and a cool room

the foil is the more expensive type, made by the Chang brand (elephant stamped!) as it is not worth using cheaper types...you get what you pay for here

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## Anonymous Coward

> you get what you pay for here


As opposed to the "first world" where you get less?

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## DrAndy

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> you get what you pay for here
> 
> 
> As opposed to the "first world" where you get less?


no, but in the 2nd and 1st worlds (!) you can buy stuff cheaper and better more reliably

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## JournalistsAreLiars

hello, do you know how much it costs to spray expanding foam on a kitchen roof. thank you.

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