#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Construction in Thailand >  >  Cooling down a Wall .

## Wasp

This is just one question .

I had a Thread in here about getting the temperature of the house down - cheaply - and it became an interesting read with many suggestions .
However this is just a simple question about cooling down one wall .

Missy .... is out in Thailand and I ... am not . 
A problem exists where one wall in particular gets slammed with sunshine all day and of course that wall becomes hot . 
The heat stays in the wall well into the evening radiating heat inwards . So she needs to put something in place to cool that wall down .

*F*rom many miles away I've said to get battens attached to that wall . Vertical battens . And then attach horizontal ( fake ) planking to the battens . Covering the entire wall .
It's not planks . It's those boards that look like compressed asbestos and have a grain pressed into them to look like wood .

*S*o my one single question is ...... do we leave it like that with a gap behind the planking ? A gap containing only air ( with an opening at the top for the hot air to escape away ) ?? 
 Or is it significantly better to put insulation materials between the 'planking' and the solid wall ?

*W*hich produces another question .... 
Whatever the consensus is ( insulation or air ) what size of gap should go there ? 
I had assumed one inch because I was thinking of one inch foam insulation panels . But maybe a bigger gap ?? 
Thicker foam  panels . Or just a wider gap with no foam insulation panels at all  ?

With appreciation .

Wasp

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## Stumpy

Hey Waspy welcome back....

Quick question, why not plant a big tree to cover the wall. It is cheap to have a big mature tree moved in if you have room. I have one wall that got beat by the afternoon sun. I planted trees that shade it enough so it cannot saturate and no more heat. 

As for air gaps, keep in mind that will definitely become home for numerous critters. Some quite annoying.

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## OhOh

> A gap containing only air ( with an 30mm opening at the top for the hot air to escape away ) ??


And a 30mm gap at the bottom to, allow air to flow in, up the gap and out at the top. I would also suggest netting top, bottom and ends, so nothing makes a home behind your "planking". Whatever size battens are available. Flush the gap out regularly to maintain the gap

I find drawing a sketch helps the "professional" Thai craftsman.  :Smile:

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## OhOh

> big tree


Big trees take years to grow. 

I fear "Missy" wants something finished this week.

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## Stumpy

> Big trees take years to grow. 
> 
> I fear "Missy" wants something finished this week.


You can get a full grown tree moved in a few days. Its surprising how cheap it is. They also have hedge type shrubs 3 to 4 meters tall. Just put them in pots in that area. 

Just an option. 

As you and I noted the air gap will house lots of creatures I suspect and nothing is worse than a big Tokay barking away.

A picture of the area proposed to cover would be helpful. :Smile:

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## OhOh

> You can get a full grown tree moved in a few days.


Yes a saw the




> a big mature tree moved


after I posted", apologies. 

He did seem to only want to discuss, a gap or insulation. :Smile:

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## Wasp

Thank you for the Replies , guys .
And Happy New Year to you .

It sounds like you are recommending the air gap rather than putting foam panels in there . But I simply had not thought about how that constructs a home for annoying or venomous ' critters ' .  Mesh netting top and bottom ....... still doesn't stop the tinier critters . 

Hmm ..... I imagine there's not a HUGE difference in coolness so perhaps I'd best go with the foam insulation panels in order to prevent the critter potential .

The trees ..... sound lovely . But it's a higher floor with a balcony that's only really a walkway. Maybe 70 cm wide . No room for any pots holding bushy cooling plant screening .

I could put up a photo but I haven't done that since Photobucket closed its free service ( the bastards ) and they ripped out all my photos so I don't know what to use to post photos now . Recommendations that work ?
Anyway the photo would only show a block wall painted blue with a single window . No overhanging shade ( well not much ).

So ....... what is your vote ?  
An air gap with vents above and below carefully netted to prevent critters ? Or the foam filling the gap ?
The trees are not a possible . Sadly .
Later maybe some ivy type things on the outside ----- or maybe not as they might become a spider heaven ??


Appreciated .


Wasp

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## NamPikToot

Wasp if she's going for a quick fix why not just do something with shade as a short term measure and then in slower time address a more permanent solution. The shade plastic, green / black with some form of knocked up metal frame could be a quick and cheap temporary solution - the trouble is if you got for  the baton route it'll probably not last.

EDIT

by more permanent i mean to face the wall off with Q Con blocks

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## Hugh Cow

> This is just one question .
> 
> I had a Thread in here about getting the temperature of the house down - cheaply - and it became an interesting read with many suggestions .
> However this is just a simple question about cooling down one wall .
> 
> 
> Missy .... is out in Thailand and I ... am not . 
> A problem exists where one wall in particular gets slammed with sunshine all day and of course that wall becomes hot . 
> The heat stays in the wall well into the evening radiating heat inwards . So she needs to put something in place to cool that wall down .
> ...


I would suggest large blinds or put a verandah or even a pergola with vines along that wall. Anything that shades the  wall from the sun will be much better than anything else. The heat absorption of an unshaded wall is roughly 5 times that of a shaded wall. If using trees you also get the benefit of transpiration. I assume your roof is insulated. The transmission through the wall will be approx (not knowing the size but assuming concrete) will be between 1 to 2 k/w. In other words if you turn on the A/C, around 1 plus kilowatts of your A/C cooling load is coming from that one wall.

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## OhOh

> carefully netted to prevent critters ?


I did suggesting flushing the gap occasionally. The timing the flushing liquid would be subject to the "critter contagion". But that would be another question.




> the photo would only show a block wall painted blue with a single window


That depends on whether your wife was at the window and what she was wearing.

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## Wasp

NamPikToot ...... thank you .

I was going for a permanent answer ..... for which I envisioned aluminium battens . They would surely last ?

The Q Cons ....... well there's only about 70 cm available as its a narrow walkway out there . The thickness of the Q Cons plus the Air Gap turns the walkway into a very very narrow ledge . If there was the space then I would certainly do the Q Cons .



W.

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## Wasp

OhOh  "I did suggesting flushing the gap occasionally. The timing the flushing liquid would be subject to the "critter contagion". But that would be another question. "

You did indeed suggest the flushing . 
I'm taking that you are inclined to the air gap without the foam panels . So I am persuaded that way right now .

W.

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## NamPikToot

> The Q Cons ....... well there's only about 70 cm available as its a narrow walkway out there . The thickness of the Q Cons plus the Air Gap turns the walkway into a very very narrow ledge . If there was the space then I would certainly do the Q Cons ..


Is the walkway able to be extended? if only by a small amount. You don't need an airgap between the Q Cons and wall just tied straight on imho and i think you can get 10-12cm ones which should probably do the job. If you can extend the path then go thicker.

Again, just wonder if you need to fix this right away, rushing a solution may give you more trouble than a temporary one and a slower time permanent fix.

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## Wasp

HughCow :  " I would suggest large blinds or put a verandah or even a pergola with vines along that wall. Anything that shades the wall from the sun will be much better than anything else.  If you turn on the A/C, around 1 plus kilowatts of your A/C cooling load is coming from that one wall. "

Thank you Hugh . I can see that Blinds would only be beneficial . Good . But I can see them being left permanently in one position and be flexing around in the occasional thunderstorm .
For the cost involved I think I might as well bang up the Battens and Boards leaving airflow gaps . Netting and Flushing .

Your words -- greatly appreciated .

Wasp

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## OhOh

It's a simple to install, cheap fix, with easily obtained materials.

Hera is a sticker to place on the bottom right hand corner.

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## Wasp

NamPikToot
" Is the walkway able to be extended? if only by a small amount. You don't need an airgap between the Q Cons and wall ." 

At some time in the future when old Granny finally kicks off and we take down her filthy wooden shack there will be lots of room . But right now there's a car's width of track which gives us no room to extend that walkway . 
there's actually plenty of space INSIDE that house and it would not be a huge intrusion to put the QCons inside and plaster over them .

Does that sound like it would do the job ?

W.

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## NamPikToot

Wasp you could put the QCon inside but you'll still have a wall outside acting as a heat sink and i assume the heat is felt on the two adjacent walls as it will transfer so whilst the Qcon may solve the inside end wall issue you may still get heating up on the two adjacent ones.

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## Wasp

"Wasp you could put the QCon inside but you'll still have a wall outside acting as a heat sink and the heat will transfer "

Yes the heat will also be in one connected wall but not so much on the other connected wall . Just a little and not a big bother .
I meant this to be a solution for two walls really but I didn't want to get complicated about that .
If I do Q Con inside do I leave a gap ?

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## NamPikToot

Wasp, if you are doing it inside and you can go 20cm thick i don't think you'd need a gap as the QCon is very effective at stopping heat transfer, thinner and i would leave a gap and vents top and bottom on the outside wall. 

If you have a few ideas ref the QCon use it may pay to take them to somewhere like an Siam Cement Group (SCG) shop and put them to them so get their ideas on what may work best.

The QCon can go up very quickly if the builder is used to using it and it cuts easily, i would just ensure the builder ties it to the existing wall properly with either wall ties and or some thin steel bar, particularly is you have an air gap.

If you go internal think about the need to relocate any electric and water. QCon is also not vert strong for hanging stuff on.

You need to get some professional advice though....I am not a builder btw just a keen amateur with experience over some years :Smile:

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## ootai

Wasp

I would think somethoing like this is what you need to shade the wall. I did it to give me shelter from the rain for my equipment but it work just as well to keep the sun off.

As for posting pictures on here it is now really quite simple compared to the old days. Just use the "Insert Image" button and select "from computer".



good to see you posting here again but where's the humour?

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## Wasp

> Wasp, if you are doing it inside and you can go 20cm thick i don't think you'd need a gap as the QCon is very effective at stopping heat transfer . 
> 
> I would just ensure the builder ties it to the existing wall properly with either wall ties and or some thin steel bar .
> 
> If you go internal think about the need to relocate any electric and water. QCon is also not vert strong for hanging stuff on.


Well NamPikToot ............. You have taken me to a decision about all this .

I'm going to tell her to go the route of Battens and Boards on the outside leaving a One inch air gap . On the Outside .
Let's see how much difference that gives . And if its not enough then we'll add 20 cm Q Cons on the inside .
Plus three fans .

It's a vast room and I like that .... but it's too big to go with a/c . Apart from the vastness of the room there are gaps to Downstairs . We would be trying to a/c a small Mall .

Thank you for the help .

That would be the end of this Thread .


Wasp

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## Wasp

> Wasp
> 
> I would think somethoing like this is what you need to shade the wall. I did it to give me shelter from the rain for my equipment but it work just as well to keep the sun off.
> 
> As for posting pictures on here it is now really quite simple compared to the old days. Just use the "Insert Image" button and select "from computer".
> 
> 
> 
> good to see you posting here again but where's the humour?



Hi oots !!

Yesterday I actually started reading your house-building thread once again . 
It's an excellent Thread .

" Where's the humour ? "
Well ..... the humour pissed off a few people and in the end their misery turned round and pissed ME off too .
It's much more difficult for me to write a serious Thread like this one . 
 But I was looking for a straightforward choice between 2 options so I behaved nicely . 

There are many many dry , factual , unhumorous and EXCELLENT Threads in this Construction zone . Yours is a very direct one . Very factual and for me its a lodestone of information with excellent photos . But I didn't ever have holes dug like you did , concrete poured and frames being built . The Indolent Brother was always more interesting to me . Plus LadyPig , LadyMango and LadyBed . 

Alas --- the story was told and then Photobucket eliminated all my photos and destroyed the whole Thread .

Crushed I am , oots .

Just a small crushed Wasp . :Frown:  :Frown: .

wasp

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## Wasp

OK .

This Thread has come swiftly to its end . I'm only posting now to say 2 things . 

1) Thank you people for your guidance . Very useful .

and 2) ...... Purely to see if I can Post a photo again after the Photobucket trauma .
So here I'm trying to Post a photo of the hot wall ( X ) and its pal round the corner ( Y ) .





Thank you again .

Wasp

It worked !

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## OhOh

^Impressive columns,  Greek marble?

My last addition is IF you go the internal Q block route in the future you could make a thermal chimney

Leave some opening in the new Q block wall, along the floor, with grills to regulate the air flow into the cavity between the two walls. The internal air will be sucked out of the room as the exterior block wall will heat the air. The air rises and escapes at the top. You will have a cooling affect on the interior room wall plus air movement inside the room as it is sucked into the cavity.

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## Klondyke

Wasp,
I have presented it here once already: In an abandoned house I bought and renovated I have covered the existing walls by outside insulation - as opposed to new extension walls by double cinder blocks with cavity (in order not to transfer the heat inside into the room).

It needs vertical battens fixed to the wall, 1 - 2 - 3cm thick - as per available foam thickness that will come in-between them. On the same battens planks of artificial wood - Shera - are screwed in. 

This made the existing single wall (by blocks) of same property as the double blocks - no heat on the inside wall felt when touching evenings after day of strong sunshine - as was the case before.

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## Wasp

Clever , OhOh .
Simple but clever .
I like it . And I'll do it . Thank you .

W.

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## Dillinger

Your main problem is the window. Stick some shutters on it.

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## ootai

Wasp
You always make the same mistake in thinking you decide when the thread is finished, you don't.

So in my opinion all you or Missy need to do is wait a little while longer and the sun will be directly overhead or heading north so that wall x is no longer going to get the direct sunshine all day. This is of course based on my assumption that wall x faces south.

If you really want to be a cheap Charlie then tell Missy to just hang 80% shade cloth from the edge of the eaves down to the floor of the balcony.
You would be very surprised how much difference there is in the temperature under shade cloth.
My shade house only has 60% on it but it is many degrees cooler than outside in the direct sunshine.

Another passing thought is to get someone to install blinds then they could be raised if you wanted the view out of the window.
I seen a guy drive past our place yesterday flogging blind that were probably 4m long.

Anyway I will cease now.
Cheers

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## Wasp

Hello Klond !!!

I did find this from you in my earlier attempt to deal with things .

You did what I was asking about ....... but you used foam behind those Shera boards . And it worked fine for you .
When I came back to it today I was musing whether it might be equally as cooling to leave an air gap rather than using the foam rectangles .

The feeling I got was to go for the air gap .
I don't mind which way we go ......... I was looking for opinion about it .

And thanks for taking the time Klond .

Wasp

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## Wasp

> Your main problem is the window. Stick some shutters on it.


Well you're right . The window does get ferociously hot too . But it cools down pretty quickly when the sun moves around the corner . It doesn't retain the heat for another 6 hours like the walls do . And its simple enough to cover them .

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## Wasp

That's what I don't like .
The ' cheap Charlie ' jibe for no reason at all .

It's ' simple fix Charlie ' having to send instruction to a cousin who is not a cousin whose work is deplorable and who just might make a difference if I ask for a ' Simple Fix ' that he can not really get wrong .

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## Dillinger

Or maybe too because theres nowhere for the heat to escape on that first floor. Heat rises and theres no air gap near the eaves... I lived in a duplex and the top floor was unbearable without aircon.

Anyway good luck with it... although the lazy fuckers should be at work in the day instead of dossing around in the bedroom :Smile:

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## HuangLao

Build in a traditional style.

Might be surprised at the advantages.

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## Klondyke

> When I came back to it today I was musing whether it might be equally as cooling to leave an air gap rather than using the foam rectangles .


Oh yes, now I know it was your problem some time ago. Yes, even an air gap instead of the foam material will help. Or yu can use other natural material if available (coconut or rice husk, straw, etc).  

I do not think any chimney system would make a difference for you. You would not have enough draft and a cool air either. 

If you insulate the wall and improve the window (a shutter) that's a maximum what you can do in case of your simple construction.  (You would not install a sophisticated a/c system from a RollsRoyce in your Fiat Uno...) 

How is the floor insulated?

Sometimes a sheet hanging in front of the wall will help a lot.

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## OhOh

^^Agree.

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## OhOh

> Or yu can use other natural material if available (coconut or rice husk, straw, etc)


Don't forget the  


> "critter contagion"





> I do not think any chimney system would make a  difference for you. You would not have enough draft and a cool air  either.


I suspect your are correct.

Anyone interested here is a research paper of a Thai experiment.

*Ventilation impact of a solar chimney on indoor temperature fluctuation and air change in a school building
*_
"The aim of this research was to investigate, experimentally, both the feasibility of a solar chimney to reduce heat gain in a house by Ž. inducing natural ventilation and the effect of openings door, window and inlet of solar chimney on the ventilation rate. 

The study was conducted using a single-room school house of approximately 25 m3 volume. The southern wall was composed of three different solar chimney configurations of 2 m2 each, whereas, the roof southern side included two similar units of 1.5 m2 each of another solar chimney configuration. Those configurations were built by using common construction materials. 

Experimental observations indicated that when the solar chimney ventilation system was in use, room temperature was near that of the ambient air, indicating a good ability of the solar chimney to reduce house’s heat gain and ensuring thermal comfort. 

The air change rate varied between 8–15. Opening the window and door is less efficient than using solar chimneys, as temperature difference between room and ambient was higher than that obtained with solar chimneys. 

q2000 Elsevier Science S.A. All rights reserved."_*

*https://people.wou.edu/~mcgladm/robo...520Chimney.pdf

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## Wasp

> Build in a traditional style.
> 
> Might be surprised at the advantages.


It WAS built in the traditional style .

Unfortunately it was the " traditional style " of the moron builder .
I wasn't there . My Bahts were sent there to represent me and Missy was doing a relatively simple conversion . Just replacing crappy wood walls with cement bricks . Taking off a corrugated tin roof and using cooler materials . 
But the 'cousin-builder' knew she had access to English ££ and just kept going . That's how she got all that extra floor upstairs and -- again in ' traditional style ' -- she would not confront him .

It's the "traditional style" of a thieving lying builder .

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## juehoe

You can erect the shading wall ot the outer edge of that balcony. So you have more distance and also a shading for the windows.

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## terry57

Get Somchai the retard to bang up a Shade covering that wall and then install a inverter A/C.

Job done Wasp dude.

Don't fook around. Cost fook all and job done

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## Klondyke

> Get Somchai the retard...


Why not to advise him a Non-Somchai who are not supposed to be "retard", some like the one who let his head blast off when looking into the cannon barrel...

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## VocalNeal

> I would suggest large blinds or put a verandah or even a pergola with vines along that wall. Anything that shades the  wall from the sun will be much better than anything else. The heat absorption of an unshaded wall is roughly 5 times that of a shaded wall. If using trees you also get the benefit of transpiration. I assume your roof is insulated. The transmission through the wall will be approx (not knowing the size but assuming concrete) will be between 1 to 2 k/w. In other words if you turn on the A/C, around 1 plus kilowatts of your A/C cooling load is coming from that one wall.


Have you considered the angle of the sun when it shines on the wall. A very short blind or awning may do the job as the angle of the sun maybe quite high. Awning sticking out will do the same as one sticking down.

Misting the wall would also work. A bit more techie but...

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## terry57

> Why not to advise him a Non-Somchai who are not supposed to be "retard", some like the one who let his head blast off when looking into the cannon barrel...



Nope,   

Cant do that, Somchai only come in two colours.

Middle of the road retarded or fookin full on Retarded.    :smiley laughing:

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## NamPikToot

Having a senior moment yesterday. Of course the quick fix is shade or awning but to fix the problem i'd go permanent and smack out the red brick infill on the walls and re-install Q Con, no need for a double skin and should be quick... relatively speaking.

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## Klondyke

> smack out the red brick infill on the walls and re-install Q Con,


Why to smack? (surely not so easy job).  It can be left within. Just to add the new cladding with a cavity...

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## NamPikToot

> Why to smack? (surely not so easy job).  It can be left within. Just to add the new cladding with a cavity...



You could KD but the concrete ring beam construction with those little red bricks which are part hollow would not take much knocking out with a sledge hammer imho, i reckon you could take the infill of those two walls out in a couple of hours and then  a could you  clear it away in a couple more, from there drill a few holes to locate 4-5mm rebar to anchor the new block and the QCon could go up in one day. Just another thought.

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## Wasp

> You can erect the shading wall ot the outer edge of that balcony. So you have more distance and also a shading for the windows.



Not a bad idea actually .
I lose a bit of 'solidity' in the sense that it will always flex more than being attached to the wall by fifty thousand screws ...... but it will cool down that walkway too .

Hmmm .................

Thank you juehoe . :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 


Wasp

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## Wasp

> Have you considered the angle of the sun when it shines on the wall. A very short blind or awning may do the job as the angle of the sun maybe quite high. Awning sticking out will do the same as one sticking down.


Maybe I should look at that . A problem is I don't want any Thais back if I can avoid them .
I'm sure there are many , many , many , many BRILLIANT Thais out there but I've only come across one and he died .
Buying Battens and Boards and Paint is something I can do myself . 
And screwing the Battens and Boards to the wall is also in my limited range of skill .
Getting up to the height of the eaves/roof ....... not so much .

 :02:  Neal .

Wasp

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## Wasp

> NamPikToot[/COLOR];4046295]Having a senior moment yesterday. Of course the quick fix is shade or awning but to fix the problem i'd go permanent and smack out the red brick infill on the walls and re-install Q Con, no need for a double skin and should be quick... relatively speaking.


That's certainly an idea but its an awful lot of work .
And mess .
I am pleased to get ideas ....... but think how much work THAT is !?!?  A day of mess to get out the old cement blocks . Another day to put in Q Cons . Mixing and hauling Cement up to the first floor . Then rendering . It's a STACK of work !!
I can certainly attach Battens and Boards in a day ....... or maybe Venetian screening . 

I've always been stopped from moving to Thailand by the thought of having nothing to do . All day . In that heat . 
And I always quite fancied setting up a workshop with a few good machines and air-conditioning . Churning out Venetian slats would be a great activity !


Wasp

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## ootai

> That's what I don't like .
> The ' cheap Charlie ' jibe for no reason at all .
> 
> It's ' simple fix Charlie ' having to send instruction to a cousin who is not a cousin whose work is deplorable and who just might make a difference if I ask for a ' Simple Fix ' that he can not really get wrong .



Wasp I think you are a little bit over sensitive, I didn't say you were a cheap Charlie but its an expression I use to define a cheap and as you put it simple solution, one that I think any rural Thai could knock up without stuffing it up.

Now today you are going along trying to upset me. I suggested an awning but today someone else mentions it and they get praise what did I get?
I also mentioned the angle of the sun t this time of the year but again someone else says about that and again praise him.
I mentioned the "simple" solution of shading and got told off but someone else mentions it and you again lavish him with praise.

I think its time I took my bat and ball and went home dragging my tail.

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## Klondyke

Mr. Wasp,
Tear down the wall...

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## terry57

> L
> 
> I've always been stopped from moving to Thailand by the thought of having nothing to do . All day . In that heat . 
> And I always quite fancied setting up a workshop with a few good machines and air-conditioning . Churning out Venetian slats would be a great activity !
> 
> 
> Wasp


No it would not Wasp Dude,

 lieland is terminally fooked and best visited for 3 months then fook of out of the shit house to Arsetralia for 3 months. Rinse and repeat.

You move here full time Bra and you will regret the day you even had that silly though.

Anyway, you have a nice day Waspy.

Rippa mate.   :Smile:

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## Wasp

> No it would not Wasp Dude,
> 
>  lieland is terminally fooked and best visited for 3 months then fook of out of the shit house to Arsetralia for 3 months. Rinse and repeat.
> 
> You move here full time Bra and you will regret the day you even had that silly though.
> 
> Anyway, you have a nice day Waspy.
> 
> Rippa mate.


I do appreciate your thoughts terencecinquantesept --- and the beautifully melodic way in which you express them . Quite poetic at times . 
But I'm getting old now . I was younger last week . And I amble into the shops and see folks around my age who are stumbling around looking like they spend their nights in a mortuary .  
I'm not at that stage but I am seriously aged now and I don't want to end up eating lasagne and salad for Lunch in the nearest Garden Centre .
Thailand --- does NOT appeal to me .
Continuing on here until Death By Apathy takes place does not appeal either .
Air-Conditioned workshop .... Growing vegetables in cooler hours ....... hot evenings with some chilled Leo ........ Love of a good woman ( I haven't actually got that but for now the neutrality of an ever-smiling idiot will have to suffice ) .
It's not a total rule-out of a prospect .

I must move on and answer a petulant ootai !

Wasp

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## Wasp

Funny ,* Klondyke* .

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## Wasp

> Wasp I think you are a little bit over sensitive, I didn't say you were a cheap Charlie
> I think its time I took my bat and ball and went home dragging my tail.


So here we go again .

The Circular tongue-lashing !!!

If I am looking at an economical way to reduce the Heat in a wall I am a " Cheap Charlie ! "

And if I object to being described by such a personal insult I am " Over-sensitive "

And if I object to " Over-sensitive " I will be " Over-Over-Sensitive " no doubt !

Wasp

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## Wasp

ootai ..... Wasp , I suggested an awning but today someone else mentions it and they get praise what did I get?

Well that was a bloody stupid idea !!
( Actually juehoe it was a very nice and appreciated idea ! )

ootai ..... Wasp ,  I also mentioned the angle of the sun at this time of the year but again someone else says about that and again you praise him .

A very nice idea from Vocalneal .
Silly from oots . Mainly because Vocalneal is not Australian .

ootai ..... I mentioned the "simple" solution of shading and got told off but someone else mentions it and you again lavish him with praise.

Not a very welcome idea from oots..... but it seems a pretty good one from NamPikToot . .
After all NamPikTootDID give me a ' Greeny !'

So take your bat and ball and shove off .


Wasp

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## terry57

> I do appreciate your thoughts terencecinquantesept --- and the beautifully melodic way in which you express them . Quite poetic at times . 
> But I'm getting old now . I was younger last week . And I amble into the shops and see folks around my age who are stumbling around looking like they spend their nights in a mortuary .  
> I'm not at that stage but I am seriously aged now and I don't want to end up eating lasagne and salad for Lunch in the nearest Garden Centre .
> Thailand --- does NOT appeal to me .
> Continuing on here until Death By Apathy takes place does not appeal either .
> Air-Conditioned workshop .... Growing vegetables in cooler hours ....... hot evenings with some chilled Leo ........ Love of a good woman ( I haven't actually got that but for now the neutrality of an ever-smiling idiot will have to suffice ) .
> It's not a total rule-out of a prospect .
> 
> I must move on and answer a petulant ootai !
> ...


Na, it don't go down that way Waspy.

You will end up drinking piss 24/7 and stroke out.

The retards will roll your bent and fuked body into the river and spend the rest of your money on Ya-Ba.

I'm warning ya Waspy dude eh. :Smile:

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## Wasp

> Na, it don't go down that way Waspy.
> 
> You will end up drinking piss 24/7 and stroke out.
> 
> The retards will roll your bent and fuked body into the river and spend the rest of your money on Ya-Ba.
> 
> I'm warning ya Waspy dude eh.


You paint a grim picture . :Eek5: 

Maybe I should move somewhere a bit cooler .

Darwin looks nice .

W.

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## VocalNeal

There is a thread on here about misting the whole thing cost around 3500 baht. 

But now I'm leaning towards the battons, insulation and exterior cladding.  No moving parts no on/off, no maintenace.

This thread is all good for thought?

Not an Aussie but have offspring there!

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## Wasp

> There is a thread on here about misting the whole thing cost around 3500 baht. 
> 
> But now I'm leaning towards the battons, insulation and exterior cladding.  No moving parts no on/off, no maintenace.


God Dammit !!!

I had decided on Battens et cetera with only air . Not insulation . Now I'm back to Foam Insulation .

OK . Battens , Foam Insulation , Covering Boards . And if more is required ...... Q Con wall behind the present wall .

Done .

End of Thread . :German: 



 :durh:   :Hmmm:

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## Pragmatic

From another forum.




> there is actually a very premium brand of reflective paaint on the market in Thailand. Yes the person was very right about high quality white paint except when it gets dirty. the paint i am refering too has a high content of reflective componenets built into it - acutally much higher than the western competitors and the cost is comparitve to high quality house paint. It can be used indoors or outdoors and can be pigmented to desiered colors(within reason) it is distributed in Thailand by the Starkool company. 024164527 ask for Joe or Ruengrit (ronreet) I have used this product on iffices here and in Dubai and have seen tremendous savings on cooling bill.


 Good luck.    :Smile: 

NRG ASIA

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## NamPikToot

Just cover the house in tin foil, you'll send the neighbours blind but at least the aliens wont know what you are up to.  :Smile:

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## HuangLao

> I've always been stopped from moving to Thailand by the thought of having nothing to do . All day . In that heat .



Oh dear....

 ::chitown::

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## Wasp

> From another forum.
> 
>  Good luck.   
> 
> NRG ASIA


Maybe just mirrors ?

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## OhOh

> f I am looking at an economical way to reduce the Heat in a wall I am a " Cheap Charlie ! "


As a previous house build went awry, I would suggest not "Cheap Charlie", but one who learns from experience and tries not to do similar in the future.




> Unfortunately it was the " traditional style " of the moron builder . I wasn't there . My Bahts were sent there to represent me and Missy was  doing a relatively simple conversion . Just replacing crappy wood walls  with cement bricks . Taking off a corrugated tin roof and using cooler  materials. But the 'cousin-builder' knew she had access to English ££ and just kept going .


Start with the cheapest option. I'm sure your "cousin/builder" will embellish it and charge you for any extras.

As for not knowing what you would do in Thailand. Maybe the Italian way, could be a guide. A few hours "toiling" in the morning, a light lunch possibly a glass of Barolo, A siesta with Missy, a stroll inspecting the abundant weeds, which may need some attention tomorrow, or the next day, or the ..... , a bowl of Missy's best cooking and an early retirement with Missy.

There are worse alternatives, digging ones camper out of the track sand in the Australian Blight.

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## Klondyke

> As for not knowing what you would do in Thailand.


An old wisdom of red Indians:



> If you do not know what to do, do nothing...

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## Hugh Cow

The problem as I see it is that all types of insulation only slows the rate of heat transmission and does not stop it. Continuous days of heat will eventually heat the whole structure and create a giant heat sink that will gradually radiate heat through the house and to the outside air during the night and reheat in the day.
 The greater the outside surface temperature of the wall the greater the heat flow. 
You need to mitigate the outside wall temperature with shading. If you dont like the idea of verandahs, trees, etc. You could try a trellis attached with spacers on the wall with a climbing vine that can tolerate heat. 
What ever you do you would be better to combine this with a flow through ventilation system in the ceiling combined with some whirlybirds on the roof which will help remove the heat radiated in to the living space from the walls to the outside. Exhaust fans in the ceiling will help cool and are much cheaper to run than air conditioning. If a 2 storey house place them above the stairwell will help eliminate the heat trap formed at the top of the stairs. If the bathroom is at on the top floor a good sized ventilation fan with a vented door will help and serve the dual purpose of helping to keep the Thai wet bathroom drier and make it possible to actually dry yourself after a shower. Whatever method you choose, let us know how well it works when you have finished. Good luck.

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## Dillinger

What I don't get is why you are always doing home improvements on that house you've built up, thats not lived in by you for a woman you are not even seeing. 

Is there a child involved here?

Sorry if that's intrusive, I just don't get  why you'd worry about cooling the sides of a house that you don't live in for a family of natives who are well accustomed to the heat :Confused:

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## Pragmatic

> I just don't get why you'd worry about cooling the sides of a house that you don't live in for a family of natives who are well accustomed to the heat


 And if there was a way to cool a wall they'd be the best at knowing how to do it.      ::chitown::

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## Stumpy

> I just don't get why you'd worry about cooling the sides of a house that you don't live in for a family of natives who are well accustomed to the heat


Well that was a question I was going to ask being he is not living in the house. Albeit he did say he was going to visit and he could not stay there if too hot. 

If its only for you Waspy for a short stay visit, just stay in a nearby hotel with Max AC. 

I am with Dil and Prag, Thai folk will figure out how to cool it down and if not, they just work around it with fans and such.

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## terry57

Yer, 

Ya gota cut Waspy some slack though.

He's bang out of his mind on that Bogan Hydroponic mull.

Powerful shit i tell ya.   :cmn:

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## Wasp

> What I don't get is why you are always doing home improvements on that house you've built up, thats not lived in by you for a woman you are not even seeing. 
> 
> Is there a child involved here?
> 
> Sorry if that's intrusive, I just don't get  why you'd worry about cooling the sides of a house that you don't live in for a family of natives who are well accustomed to the heat


OK.....
1. I'm just nice .
Missy doesn't spend a huge chunk of her year there either - but when she IS there the place is badly designed and too hot even for her . 
So she uses the standard Thai/Auzzie/Pommy approach . Moaning how she can not sleep .
Thai solution ? Buy more fans . 
And as soon as she heads off in the back of a pickup in the direction of Suvarnabhumi Airport the brother , cousins , neighbours grab the fans and either disperse them or sell them . So it would be more sensible in the long run if I kindly out of kindly pure kindness bang up some Battens and boards and at least reduce the heat building up in 2 walls . 

2. Shading is appealing . Just a bit difficult to achieve when you look at the structure and position .
Grandma is 6 metres away and she is now 93 . SURELY the bewildered old sod will pop off to the Wat soon ? Then her old , old wooden house will be taken down and after all the snakes , rats and spiders have slunk away we will have space for shading trees and bushes galore .
 Right now though I wouldn't trust the weight of concrete tubs , soil and bushes on that cousin-built walkway .

3. I am NOT always making improvements . Mostly I am repairing shitty cousin lack-of-workmanship .
 You see a long cement piece running along the edge of the balcony and next time you look ... it's drooping down .
 Turns out it was a ' design feature ' that has been NAILED into place purely to cover up the crappy work behind it .

4. Despite the claim -- I don't believe the natives ARE well accustomed to the heat . They have no choice . But they ARE well accustomed to shit building work and they shrug - knowing anyone asked to fix it will be as bad . 
A fastidious Thai worker is a bit of a gem !


Wasp

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## HuangLao

> What I don't get is why you are always doing home improvements on that house you've built up, thats not lived in by you for a woman you are not even seeing. 
> 
> Is there a child involved here?
> 
> Sorry if that's intrusive, I just don't get  why you'd worry about cooling the sides of a house that you don't live in for a family of natives who are well accustomed to the heat



Indeed. A more common, and seemingly contradictory, activity/lifestyle than you might suspect, Dills...

One could simply ask - why...??

 ::chitown::

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## terry57

I put A/C in my handbags rental house and she thought I was a bit mad.

Recons Thai don't need A/C.  ???

Fook me, it's in Bangkok and the coonta of a joint is an oven come March April and May.  :Smile:

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## Pragmatic

> I am NOT always making improvements . Mostly I am repairing shitty cousin lack-of-workmanship .


 First rule when building a house in Thailand. Never employ family. 



> And as soon as she heads off in the back of a pickup in the direction of Suvarnabhumi Airport the brother , cousins , neighbours grab the fans and either disperse them or sell them .


 Second rule. Build a wall around your house and don't let immediate family in without ringing the bell. And third lock the house and gates when you're away. Works for me.

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## ootai

Wasp
What happened i thought you said this thread was finished.
Anyway I'M BACK but I did leave my ball and ball behind so I can't play so i have to be serious, sorry!

So in case you are still thinking about it in my opinion the best option would be a couple of 4m long roller blinds hung from the eaves and long enough to be tied off on the rail (wall X) and the floor (wall Y) of the balcony.  The blinds could be rolled up at night so you could see out the window to check on Grandma or once the sun moves north of the roofline (probably around March).
They can be secured to the eaves so they don't get stolen or sold. There would be sufficient "air gap" between them and the wall. I do not think they would be expensive and you would probably be able to get the seller to do the installation so you don't have to climb up to the eaves.

I am sure Missy could ask around and find a supplier easy enough. I have seen people selling them drive past our place so they may or may not be available at a shop.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

I'm outta here!!!

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## Klondyke

> I don't believe the natives ARE well accustomed to the heat


Wherever  switch the a/c or a fan off, Thai people switch it on...

But perhaps it is not because of "not accustomed", more because of "it's available, so why not"... 

Seeing the bank people, airport staff, etc, in their jackets, a/c always on full speed in any season (and coughing, sneezing). After 15 minutes waiting there I am catching cold, running outside to respire ...

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## Wasp

> First rule when building a house in Thailand. Never employ family. 
>  Second rule. Build a wall around your house and don't let immediate family in without ringing the bell. And third lock the house and gates when you're away. Works for me.


You are indeed pragmatic , Pragmatic.

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## HuangLao

> First rule when building a house in Thailand. Never employ family.


Goes without saying.
Acquired from experience and exposure. 

Yet, many will not connect with this basic understanding.

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## Wasp

> And if there was a way to cool a wall they'd be the best at knowing how to do it.


Your response looks very sensible ....... logical even ....... but I don't believe it's so .
The Thai solution to a hot home seems to be to sit outside . 
And shout " Benn Aye ? " at anybody passing by .

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## Wasp

> Wasp
> What happened i thought you said this thread was finished.
> Anyway I'M BACK but I did leave my ball and ball behind so I can't play so i have to be serious, sorry!
> 
> So in case you are still thinking about it in my opinion the best option would be a couple of 4m long roller blinds hung from the eaves and long enough to be tied off on the rail (wall X) and the floor (wall Y) of the balcony.  The blinds could be rolled up at night so you could see out the window to check on Grandma or once the sun moves north of the roofline (probably around March).
> They can be secured to the eaves so they don't get stolen or sold. There would be sufficient "air gap" between them and the wall. I do not think they would be expensive and you would probably be able to get the seller to do the installation so you don't have to climb up to the eaves.
> 
> I am sure Missy could ask around and find a supplier easy enough. I have seen people selling them drive past our place so they may or may not be available at a shop.
> 
> ...


Is this that bloody ootai with his wimpy bat and ball polluting my over-extended Thread again ???

That screen --- I do like .  I prefer Venetian slats but the screen which you portray would be acceptable .

When next you see that little chappy and his truck chock full of screens please give him directions to Nonkrasan .


Wasp

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## Mendip

Is that 'bai nai?'

When I lived in a village, every morning I took the dogs for a walk this woman would shout 'bai nai?'

FFS... she stopped after I started replying 'Lotus shopping', 'Bangkok', 'the moon'... 

I can't help meself sometimes.

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## HuangLao

> Is that 'bai nai?'
> 
> When I lived in a village, every morning I took the dogs for a walk this woman would shout 'bai nai?'
> 
> FFS... she stopped after I started replying 'Lotus shopping', 'Bangkok', 'the moon'... 
> 
> I can't help meself sometimes.



It's a subliminal figurative inquiry of greeting...


Traditional social thing.

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## Wasp

> Is that 'bai nai?'
> 
> When I lived in a village, every morning I took the dogs for a walk this woman would shout 'bai nai?'
> 
> FFS... she stopped after I started replying 'Lotus shopping', 'Bangkok', 'the moon'... 
> 
> I can't help meself sometimes.


We had a friend come to take us to some big lake . In his pick-up . 
Everyone around was calling " Bai Nai ? " and when we told them they called " Bayy Doo Aye " and climbed in the back .
I think it means " I want to come with you . "
Anyway we got there and there were 2 old ladies in the back and nobody knew who they were .
They had seen people going out for the day so they decided they wanted to come too and just climbed in  !!!!  :Lmao:

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## Mendip

Duplicate.. sorry.

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## Mendip

Yeah... I see that Jeff. It just got a bit much every single morning, and I like to vary my response to keep it interesting!

To be honest the politeness of my reply would depend on how well I was getting on with the wife that morning.

That's my weakness of course.

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## Wasp

Funny how a question which is really just .... " Shall I put up boards with Air Behind or Foam Insulation behind ? " becomes 85 Posts and 3 attempts to say ' Thread Finished ' .

I did say in one Post how the miseries do in the end piss me off .
But really it's always just one big Pissy Streak of Crap .
HuangLao .

And here's why ....... 
I get a question about why I work to make improvements for someone when I am not in Thailand myself .
' Why spend the Bahts ? '
And my answer is that I'm happy to help rectify some of the crappy work done by a thieving 'cousin builder '. For Missy's comfort.

And for that I get 2 responses . One from Dillinger and one from Huang Lao .




I don't know what's mentally wrong with Huang Lao but he always produces this stuff .

Anyway ...... greetings to Dill ...... and Latindancer and Mendip .


Wasp

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## Klondyke

> Funny how a question which is really just .... " Shall I put up boards with Air Behind or Foam Insulation behind ? " becomes 85 Posts and 3 attempts to say ' Thread Finished ' .


That will teach you to ask on TD for a kind advice...

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## Wasp

> That will teach you to ask on TD for a kind advice...


      Thread Finished , Klondyke !!



Wasp

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## NamPikToot

Wasp, your return was welcome, don't be a stranger and don't listen to naysayers...anyway you are going to have one mega build thread when missy gets all the land. You'll put ThaiDhup's Wat to shame.  :smiley laughing:

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## Latindancer

> I don't know what's mentally wrong with Huang Lao but he always produces this stuff .


Don't worry about Huanglao / Jeff.....he is the forum retard : either drug-fucked, schizo or both. After I'd been here years with no problem with him, he started sending me repo like he just sent you and at first I was halfway between being mystified and being offended. Then I noticed other people posting rep given by him, which included the very same words and phrases. Apparently I am also a "wannabe", except he calls me that in the oddest contexts...

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## terry57

Jeff is a retarded Septic pygmy fuker with serious mental issues.

Everyone knows that.  :smiley laughing:

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## Wasp

Well my thanks to* NamPikToot* and to *Latindancer* .
I assumed that HuangLao / Jeff does this quite a lot as there is no reason for him to be doing it at all .

I genuinely do wonder why people do such things though . You could as easily say decent things ....or say nothing at all .
In HuangLao's case ..... just disappear and make the site better .

NamPik --- there's no action taking place for me to be writing about .
I have been thinking of going back to my first ever Thread " Not A House Building Thread " and trying to restore it . Or rewrite it . Because it was an interesting enough story and I can put photos in there again now. It was just a renovation . It became a nonsense because of the '_guidance'_ :Yikes:  received mostly from Roobarb and Bettyboo .... plus a few others . So mayhap I'll get some energy and try to find the photos and tell a basic version again for the people who have joined more recently .

Thanks again .....


Wasp

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## Wasp

> Jeff is a retarded Septic pygmy fuker with serious mental issues.
> 
> Everyone knows that.


Succinct as always , *terence* !

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## NamPikToot

> I have been thinking of going back to my first ever Thread " Not A House Building Thread " and trying to restore it . Or rewrite it . Because it was an interesting enough story and I can put photos in there again now. It was just a renovation . It became a nonsense because of the '_guidance'_ received mostly from Roobarb and Bettyboo .... plus a few others . So mayhap I'll get some energy and try to find the photos and tell a basic version again for the people who have joined more recently .


Wasp i Reckon that is a great idea, i remember it and i am sure everyone else would appreciate it, got to think of all the people looking it who don't say much but need a steer in construction  :Smile:

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## Wasp

....................

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## Wasp

> Wasp i Reckon that is a great idea, i remember it and i am sure everyone else would appreciate it, got to think of all the people looking it who don't say much but need a steer in construction


Or as in my case ----- a guide in what NOT to do .
DON'T employ a cousin who looks up a supporting beam and says " *Yehh . That looks OK .* "
Buy him a Spirit Level !!!!!

Of course it would be far easier if I could just go back to the story and enter again the Photos that Photobucket destroyed . Which means having access to EDIT and insert photos . And Teakdoor doesn't allow that to be done .

I'll try to get the energy together .


Wasp

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## ootai

> I'll try to get the energy together .
> 
> 
> Wasp



Wasp if you do decide to do it again then you must do it with the same amount of enthusiasm and humour that you did the first time.
Unfortunately I am not sure you can reach that state of nirvana again.

Good luck

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## Wasp

........................

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## Wasp

> Wasp if you do decide to do it again then you must do it with the same amount of enthusiasm and humour that you did the first time.
> Unfortunately I am not sure you can reach that state of nirvana again.
> 
> Good luck


OK .

I'll not bother .


Wasp

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## Wasp

> Wasp
> You always make the same mistake in thinking you decide when the thread is finished, you don't.
> 
> So in my opinion all you or Missy need to do is wait a little while longer and the sun will be directly overhead or heading north so that wall x is no longer going to get the direct sunshine all day. This is of course based on my assumption that wall x faces south.
> 
> If you really want to be a cheap Charlie then tell Missy to just hang 80% shade cloth from the edge of the eaves down to the floor of the balcony.
> You would be very surprised how much difference there is in the temperature under shade cloth.
> My shade house only has 60% on it but it is many degrees cooler than outside in the direct sunshine.
> 
> ...


I was only having a small muse today and I came to this Post .
Don't know if I thanked you ...... looks like I didn't . So 10 months late --- thanks oots .

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## ootai

> I was only having a small muse today and I came to this Post .
> Don't know if I thanked you ...... looks like I didn't . So 10 months late --- thanks oots .



Wasp
No need for the thanks I did nothing.

What i would like to know is what did you or should I say Missy do to solve the problem?

Its good to know you are still alive and kicking.

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## Hugh Cow

Try this for some helpful advice.
Keeping your house cool naturally | CHOICE

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## Wasp

Well I actually didn't not do nothing about it .
I departed and haven't felt inclined to return .
There are moments when I consider returning but those are short-lived moments .
Gloomy Winter is upon us with the long long nights and they make me ( a little bit ) miss the balcony and the chilled Leo but whereas I can always have things to do here I would fiddle around with the house in Thailand for a while but I don't have your vast sweeping acreage of Pastoral land upon which to be lavishing my time .
So I am here ...... and I did not try any of the ideas there .

Except for some awning which went over the guiltiest window.

Wasp





> Wasp
> No need for the thanks I did nothing.
> 
> What i would like to know is what did you or should I say Missy do to solve the problem?
> 
> Its good to know you are still alive and kicking.

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## Wasp

Thank you Cow .

The article is basic but it does make you concentrate on things that should really be obvious ( Shade ... Fans .... AirCon  ) . 

Appreciations .

Wasp




> Try this for some helpful advice.
> Keeping your house cool naturally | CHOICE

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## Hugh Cow

> Thank you Cow .
> 
> The article is basic but it does make you concentrate on things that should really be obvious ( Shade ... Fans .... AirCon  ) . 
> 
> Appreciations .
> 
> 
> 
> Wasp


The basic things are generally the cheapest and most environmentally friendly. Planting (or transplanting) some trees are the best solution.

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