#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Living In Thailand Forum >  >  Girlfriend's mother has just lost major face

## Bruno

So, after coming back from the dead, my tgf's brother has recovered from a serious case of blood poisoning which cost the family dearly as he never had medical insurance. Not the first time emergency funds have been accumulated to help him out - although blood poisoning is hardly his fault - but he once knocked of a motorcyclist in his car, whom, threatened to sue his ass unless he could come up with 250,000 baht pronto!

The tgf's mother gave took a loan out with the bank as collateral and my tgf worked in bkk to pay back this debt, taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank whilst her brother - well I dont know what his was doing to help pay back his debt! Nevertheless, the debt was repaid (about which point I met her in Bkk for the first time) and never knew this story until recently.

Now, he is well and maybe karma is unkind to him, and decided to become a monk. He is married and works for his wife's mechanic shop for a paltry wage - they are Thai Chinese - and wavered the sinsod in order to procure his cheap services to the family business. My tgf's father died of liver abuse and left the mum on her own now for some time and the Thai-chinese family announced they wanted to throw a big F***k off party in his honour and that she should contribute half - around 25k - towards the cost of this, which is next week.

They know that her daughter is with me, yes a farang, and according to my tgf, they are really using this as an excuse just to see how rich or poor we really are as my tgf's mother rang her up stating that we have to pay 25k. 

Trouble is, I don't have it! I have gone back to University and what little money I do earn through my part-time job I divide amongst my needs and that of my other half's. Needless to say, it wasn't good enough for the mother in law and announced my tgf is no longer welcome back home as a result of a major loss of face.

I tried asking my tgf why her brother had not planned ahead and consider this possible eventuality, but that is very much wishful thinking on my part. So now I am stuck with a pissed off mother in-law (of sorts) and a tearful girlfriend who now questions her mother's cursed words of "why are you with a farang if he no money"

Of course when I explain that I am studying in order to get a good paying job, it falls on deaf ears and the damage is now done with regards to this loss of face.

----------


## Jesus Jones

Welcome to Thailand.

----------


## Kurgen

Luv it.

Write it down and send it off to one of those Thai soap TV companies, sounds like a winner to me.

Make sure you get caught shagging the sister in law too.

----------


## ItsRobsLife

Pack your bags now mate.

----------


## Bobcock

Fuck ém, you shouldn't even explain why, just tell them no.

If you love your GF and want to take it further to seperate her from her family is a good move.

----------


## dirtydog

> If you love your GF and want to take it further to seperate her from her family is a good move.


I don't think he has the finances for that.

----------


## Norton

> my tgf is no longer welcome back home as a result of a major loss of face.


Good news.

----------


## withnallstoke

> taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank


Rent her out part time again.

----------


## Stinky

> So now I am stuck with a pissed off mother in-law (of sorts) and a tearful girlfriend who now questions her mother's cursed words of "why are you with a farang if he no money"


Tell the old crow to go take a large fuck to herself,  she'll be living in your wallet forever more if you fall for this guilt trip she's laying on the daughter. 
You need to set the ground rules, don't let the old hag bully you. 
Good luck.

----------


## Loy Toy

Carrry on with your own life and distance yourself from this family Bruno.

If your girlfriend wants to be a part of your life she will soon prove it to you.

Do not let the things you have absolutely no control over get to you let alone trying to understand it.

----------


## bretby

Bruno, someone long ago said to me "you can only do your best and if that aint good enough then don`t worry about it".

Don`t be shocked or upset by the pressure that your girlfriend`s family are putting on her as it`s just par for the course. It`s a feeler to see if you will become a walking ATM for them, as they have probably heard that this is the way to go.

Be firm, stand your ground and time will tell if your girlfriend really wants to be with you knowing that you have little funds to spare at the moment.

If the family feel that you are soft then they will never be off your girlfriend`s back with requests for more dosh.

At least by the sound of it you won`t be seeing the family anytime soon.

----------


## reinvented

plenty more tgf's
tell em to take a flying fuck

----------


## dtalok

"trouble is i don't have it" theres your solution and you should thank them for showing the true colors early, put your dick back in your pants, and move on,,,,quickly

----------


## Bruno

Some great advice guys, appreciated!

Of course a few sarcastic ones but you expect that from time to time on a public forum!

I have just spent the last 30minutes taking to her about this problem and it seems the problem thickens. Aside from requesting this money and using the "never darken my doors again approach" she has now stepped it up a notch and said that she will "get a loan from the local mafia if she cant help".. JESUS, they really are hard as nails those rustic Issan mother in law types huh??

This has now put a newer perspective on things for my tgf as not only is face an issue, but the very real threat of a loan shark demanding his cash too. Just for the record, since we have been together just over a year, the mother in-law has never requested money before; no monthly fees; no regular bungs; nothing of this sorts has come up before. So maybe some of you say I am due a payment of some kind as this is the way things are done from time to time and being white just carries that stigma of wealth. 

She knows I am studying and money is tight right now so why put this pressure on her to use what little money we have, or even, as she suggested, use that 50k credit she has sitting there, to help. She obviously sees this as money that is accessible and not for emergencys as I would like to keep it.

So, she is in tears, and rightly so. Being told not to come back home and putting her in a really harsh predicament is just awful for anyone to be put in, let alone your own mother. I gave her the advice that we are not in a position to help right now and she really shouldn't take a loan out with no clear way of paying it back and left this with her to mull over; however, tomorrow is another day and my tgf is her own woman so I have made my feelings clear about what 'not' to do and now she must choose which path to take.

Could be a relationship breaker this one so I will keep you informed of the developments..

Didn't one of you say "Welcome to Thailand"  ?

----------


## ItsRobsLife

How long are you studying for and how long do you think money will be tight for you? Who pays the rent? Does she live with you? What are her options if you were to split? I assume that money wasn't such an issue when you first got together. Perhaps it's not just the mother that's trying to force the issue.

----------


## Loy Toy

My mother-in-law is no longer part of my familes life life and we are better off for it.

Unfortunately she cost us a bundle of money as some members here know about.

If she knows you are studying with limited funds and still demands the money from your lady then best your lady grows up and accepts her mother is no good and she is better off without her.

FFS she has already sold her soul to the devil on her behalf once before and it should end now.

----------


## Thetyim

If you give in and pay for a party for the brother, which is non essential, and he will probably be back at work soon because he is needed then guess what will happen when money is needed for a more deserving cause.

Don't worry about mum borrowing from a loan shark, that's her decision and not your responsibility.

----------


## Bruno

> How long are you studying for and how long do you think money will be tight for you? Who pays the rent? Does she live with you? What are her options if you were to split? I assume that money wasn't such an issue when you first got together. Perhaps it's not just the mother that's trying to force the issue.


I am doing a Master degree back in the UK and have a while to go until completion, another year at least so could safely assume until this is over, money will be a constant issue. No, before I decided to go back to my studies money was fine, no problems as such, comfortable I would say.

I see where you are going with that last statement but really, if you met her she really isn't the superficial type and that comment about her being a mia-noi may have painted a slight undue picture of her. What I was trying to say was that she was kind of expected to help out her mother and pay back the debt to the bank who is just a constant black hole for her.

----------


## buriramboy

Let her borrow the money from the mafia then all being well she won't be able to pay it back and get bumped off, financially it costs you nothing to get the end result you desire.

----------


## ItsRobsLife

So you're in the UK for at least another year. 
Is she in Thailand?
Are you paying her rent?
When you say you've been together for a year, how much time have you actually spent together?

----------


## Muadib

The plot thickens... You might check the chat sites to see if your tgf is making the rounds searching for sponsors with a bit more wherewithal...

----------


## sabang

Does your sister only have one brother? If she has more siblings, they should be up for some money too.
Did the Mil know about & approve the of 'mia noi' thing? If so, you know exactly where her priorities lie.

If you can't pay, it's as simple as that. Mil had no right to enter such an arrangement without knowing the source of the monies. It's her who has lost face- or will if she admits it to the In-laws. She probably hasn't.

There may be a few reasonable ways to get around this. Or maybe not- if she's as much of a biatch as she sounds (in which case you're well rid of her). One would be to give less money, in line with what you can afford. Another is to be honest with the In-laws, and the Mil stating a max. amount she _can_ contribute. 50K buys one helluva party btw- they certainly do not need to spend near that much. The amount they have 'budgeted' for a party (without consulting you) does raise some red flags actually.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> Rent her out part time again.


Makes a lot of sense to me if you have tolerated it before


Stop bummin off people and get the dough.

You found the money to get here, and freeloaded off us tax payers with your free education.

Take a leaf outta the moms book and start to keep some face yourself.

But obviously you dont care a fuk for this girl anyhow, or you wouldnt have accepted her sucking off some Thai guy to subsidise yourself 




> I tried asking my tgf why her brother had not planned ahead and consider this possible eventuality


FFs

----------


## Bruno

> Let her borrow the money from the mafia then all being well she won't be able to pay it back and get bumped off, financially it costs you nothing to get the end result you desire.


_And put it down to Karma right? I like your suggestion very much..._

Good suggestions here from everybody and I do appreciate them all. I have a feeling that maybe some of you have been in a similar situation, albeit, through your own personal circumstances and its nice to know I am not alone.

It is really out of my hands now and I've made my feelings perfectly clear on the matter. It is really my tgf whom I feel sorry for being put in this divide between logic and her ignorant mother, but without getting too frustrated at her selfish concern of saving face over logic I fear I am on the losing side in a country where culture and face play a big part in this society!

I will gladly notify you all of the developments of this story when I know more myself and see if the advice and logic I have tried to instil in my tgf comes to anything in the morning.

Thanks for all the comments once again!

----------


## Loy Toy

^ 50,000.00 Baht for an upcountry village piss-up seems to me to be way over the top.

I don't want you to start to doubt your GF but really I am starting to smell a rat.

Have you actually ever met these family members in person?

You say you are learning some serious and personal things about your GF all of a sudden and I am starting to put two and two toghether.

----------


## Bruno

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by withnallstoke
> Rent her out part time again.
> Makes a lot of sense to me if you have tolerated it before
> 
> 
> Stop bummin off people and get the dough.
> 
> You found the money to get here, and freeloaded off us tax payers with your free education.
> ...


Just had to reply to this last comment I see.

Rent her out before? I only learned of that relationship with her boss recently so it's not as though I knew what was going on when I dated her. Besides, you make her out to be a bar-girl or something when this really isn't the case at all. She was a mistress yes, but she didn't have to tell me this either, did she?

With regards to "bumming off other people" there is no master degree programme I am aware of where you can get it paid for in full by the government, maybe bursaries or loans yes, so if you know where I have to be a citizen to qualify for a 'free higher education' please, let me know...

And as for your last comment about subsidising off of her whilst she was sucking off some Thai guy - well I have just run out of patience to warrant an answer too as you are clearly illiterate.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> And as for your last comment about subsidising off of her whilst she was sucking off some Thai guy





> you make her out to be a bar-girl or something when this really isn't the case at all


Do you understand the term Mia Noi ?

----------


## monkeynuts

On the off chance that you're being sucked into a scam........ 

I suggest you read this book: 'Only 13-The True Story of Lon' Once read it's highly likely that you'll think twice about bailing her family out; now...and again...and again

----------


## Bruno

> Do you understand the term Mia Noi ?


I would say a Mia Noi was a mistress of sorts that is a married man's other woman. They have a sense of responsibility to take care 'financial care' to a mia noi in exchange for sex and a mia noi is free to engage in other open relationships. 

I would not say these are bar-girls, simply girls who refuse to sleep with numerous men and chose a sugar daddy to be a financial sponsor as she told me he put her through University and took care of the fees...

----------


## Stinky

> I have just spent the last 30minutes taking to her about this problem and it seems the problem thickens. Aside from requesting this money and using the "never darken my doors again approach" she has now stepped it up a notch and said that she will "get a loan from the local mafia if she cant help".. JESUS, they really are hard as nails those rustic Issan mother in law types huh??


You just cant help but hate these Issan fuckers-in-law can you, you dig in and refuse to play her game so she ups the anti with this bullshit storey piling even more pressure onto her own daughter which in turn puts it directly onto your shoulders, this is a ploy many of them use, I've experienced it first hand, charming people these Issan Mil ain't they.  
Unless your girl is prepared to sever ties with her family, (which is'nt likely as culturally it's the daughters responsibility to feed the family money, your money) or unless you are deeply emotionally invested in this girl I would strongly consider getting out of this relationship. It sounds like a lifetime of aggrevation for you.

----------


## Carrabow

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno

 so if you know where I have to be a citizen to qualify for a 'free higher education' please, let me know...

Get a can of black shoe polish, go to the vanity mirror and doll up.Then you pop up on the doorstep of the NAACP...Walla free ejikashon...Make sure your ebonics venacular is up to par as well  :mid: 

Obama did it

----------


## OhOh

> I would say a Mia Noi was a mistress of sorts that is a married man's other woman. *They have a sense of responsibility to take care 'financial care' to a mia noi in exchange for sex* and a mia noi is free to engage in other open relationships.


Get him to pay the money.

Walk away, she will either come to you or more probably find another ATM.

----------


## hazz

50k buys can 500l of beer, 50l of whisky or over a 1000 portions of food at any decent in the sicks restaurant. Clearly someone is scamming you with a variation of the 'sick buffalo scam' thats as thai and 419 scams are nigerian.

what you don't know is who is doing it, the inlaw's, the mother or the girlfriend.

If she is living with you in the UK, then its unlikely to be her, otherwise all bets are off. 

if you marry a thai lady who is either a scammer or nice lass who puts her scammer family first; your life will be hell until they suck every penny from you and in some cases kill you. If you hold firm now, not that you have a choice, you will get a lot of emotional blackmail etc and finally once they realise you are not the ATM they think, you will never hear from them again and you have had a very very lucky escape.

If you are very lucky she is a nice lass that is prepared to put her relationship with you first. As Sdigit said this is a very big step for a daughter, there are lots of cultural obligations strong enough cause some of the nicest people you will ever meet to do the most terrible self destructive things to support utter pieces of sh1t back home. The family is also the support network that thai's use when the shit hits the fan. So she will have to have a lot of confidence in you to do this.

Anyway I wish you the best of luck and hope everything works out well for you.

----------


## Carrabow

Bruno,

I am by no means able to give you any advice. Your plans to finish up your degree sounds like the best thing for you at this time in your life. Tell your GF you need some time alone and do some heavy duty thinking (avoid booze during this period). Davis Knowlton once gave me a good piece of advice one time. He said: "Carrabow, you gotta man up and not take any of this shit!" Eventually being the level headed type of person you seem to be; it will all come clear to you in the future.

Best of luck, and let your instincts guide you...

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> 50k buys can 500l of beer, 50l of whisky or over a 1000 portions of food at any decent in the sicks restaurant. Clearly someone is scamming you with a variation of the 'sick buffalo scam' thats as thai and 419 scams are nigerian.
> 
> what you don't know is who is doing it, the inlaw's, the mother or the girlfriend.
> 
> If she is living with you in the UK, then its unlikely to be her, otherwise all bets are off. 
> 
> if you marry a thai lady who is either a scammer or nice lass who puts her scammer family first; your life will be hell until they suck every penny from you and in some cases kill you. If you hold firm now, not that you have a choice, you will get a lot of emotional blackmail etc and finally once they realise you are not the ATM they think, you will never hear from them again and you have had a very very lucky escape.
> 
> If you are very lucky she is a nice lass that is prepared to put her relationship with you first. As Sdigit said this is a very big step for a daughter, there are lots of cultural obligations strong enough cause some of the nicest people you will ever meet to do the most terrible self destructive things to support utter pieces of sh1t back home. The family is also the support network that thai's use when the shit hits the fan. So she will have to have a lot of confidence in you to do this.
> ...


Good post.

----------


## Bruno

If you are very lucky she is a nice lass that is prepared to put her relationship with you first. As Sdigit said this is a very big step for a daughter, there are lots of cultural obligations strong enough cause some of the nicest people you will ever meet to do the most terrible self destructive things to support utter pieces of sh1t back home. The family is also the support network that thai's use when the shit hits the fan. So she will have to have a lot of confidence in you to do this.[/QUOTE]

 :Arrow Up: 

Thank you Hazz, this is excellent advice and exactly the sort of response I hoped I would get. 






> I am by no means able to give you any advice. Your plans to finish up your degree sounds like the best thing for you at this time in your life. Tell your GF you need some time alone and do some heavy duty thinking (avoid booze during this period). Davis Knowlton once gave me a good piece of advice one time. He said: "Carrabow, you gotta man up and not take any of this shit!" Eventually being the level headed type of person you seem to be; it will all come clear to you in the future.


 :Arrow Up: 

Also solid, sound advice like many posts here this evening. 

It's funny - well actually it's not in the least - how relationships in the West have not prepared me (and I've had a few emotional roller-coasters) for these interracial unions here we all have here in LOS. I don't think so much that it's down to bad judgement of partner when these situations occur, as we are all capable of seeing through those tinted glasses separating a keeper from whore/gold digger type (at least that's what I hope). 

It is more down to the peer pressure and parentage of these women, clearly, every girl needs some kind of security, it's a genetic trait after all. But these ignorant, "Issan fuckers" as Sidgit nicely puts it that are the problem...

I know from my own point of view that she is a great girl and one worth bothering with; as I said before, I feel sorry for her, not me, who is stuck in the middle of this melting pot of logic and draconian, archaic bullshit...

The ball is in my other halves net so to speak and her move with her mother to give her the 50k or at least some of it will dictate our relationship and the esteem she has for me. 

Trouble is chaps, if this one don't work out, am I not faced with another year lost and a repeat of this same scenario of money laundering from the white man yet again?

----------


## Spin

Send 5000 baht with a note explaining that your brother in the uk is having a foking massive party and you had to give him 20,000 baht.
Explain that family comes first for Brits as well.

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> Trouble is chaps, if this one don't work out, am I not faced with another year lost and a repeat of this same scenario of money laundering from the white man yet again?


If it works out or not, you still have to secure your own future. 

There are some guys here that have turned up with whatever is in their pocket and manged to make a life in Thailand, but that is a minority. Thailand is an extremely difficult environment for a foreigner. 
Unless you have made money outside of LOS or you have a profession that can get you a work permit and well paid job in LOS, your future here is always going to be uncertain. Perhaps you're considering moving her to the UK. Your girlfriend may be 'the one', but you cannot tie your future to her if you don't have a sustainable future in the first place. 

Concentrate on your own future first and don't succumb to this emotional blackmail. And don't limit your outlook while you are in the UK because you feel you loyalty lies in Thailand. 
If by the time you are finished getting you Masters your gf is still there for you, you can consider yourself lucky, but in the meantime life is long and full of opportunities, as long as you take them you're not losing out.

----------


## Loy Toy

I went back and read your OP and I must say in my opinion you are being scammed.

1. You have not met any member of her family but have heard all the stories and pretty horrific one's at that.

2. This girl you have known for about a year and only see her on short holiday breaks between your studies.

May I ask how old you are?

----------


## Bruno

> I went back and read your OP and I must say in my opinion you are being scammed.
> 
> 1. You have not met any member of her family but have heard all the stories and pretty horrific one's at that.
> 
> 2. This girl you have known for about a year and only see her on short holiday breaks between your studies.
> 
> May I ask how old you are?


I am sorry if I gave a misinterpretation earlier but I have met all of her family - all of two times. Like I said earlier she has never asked for money before and maybe because of a recent loss of face from the brother's wife's family has caused her to suddenly cause a fuss with us. 

It is true that I see her during term breaks but from this I have spent a few months at a time with her waiting until the next part of the course starts as this is a part-time degree, thus taking longer to complete. 

I am 32 years old and we have a house, or rather, I have a house registered with a company in LOS that has no outstanding mortgage so no rent to be paid. Of course to make a full opinion of this situation one needs to know the background of all concerned but I really don't want to bore anyone with all these facts, so I provide the minimum amount of information for everybody to make their own suppositions to this story. 

I might be getting scammed, but really it is only from the MIL as both myself and the TGF have plans outside of Thailand once my education is finished.

----------


## Loy Toy

> I am 32 years old and we have a house, or rather, I have a house registered with a company in LOS


Did you purchase this property before or after you met this particular lady?




> I might be getting scammed, but really it is only from the MIL as both myself and the TGF have plans outside of Thailand once my education is finished.


Only time will tell and to get her away from Thailand might be the best option for both of you and only if she turns out to be sincere.

Sorry mate I cannot help to think you are receiving the Issarn two step.

And I would think long and hard about dating a Thai woman who has been a Mia Noi. Whilst you have played this down as being a non issue I class these type of girls worse then bar girls.

There are other ways to earn a living as proven by 30 million other proper Thai woman who do so.

Best of luck to you.

----------


## Bruno

> If it works out or not, you still have to secure your own future. 
> 
> There are some guys here that have turned up with whatever is in their pocket and manged to make a life in Thailand, but that is a minority. Thailand is an extremely difficult environment for a foreigner. 
> Unless you have made money outside of LOS or you have a profession that can get you a work permit and well paid job in LOS, your future here is always going to be uncertain. Perhaps you're considering moving her to the UK. Your girlfriend may be 'the one', but you cannot tie your future to her if you don't have a sustainable future in the first place. 
> 
> Concentrate on your own future first and don't succumb to this emotional blackmail. And don't limit your outlook while you are in the UK because you feel you loyalty lies in Thailand. 
> If by the time you are finished getting you Masters your gf is still there for you, you can consider yourself lucky, but in the meantime life is long and full of opportunities, as long as you take them you're not losing out.


Thank you, again it's really appreciated for all you to impart your own perspectives on this subject, which, by the sounds of it, comes from personal experience for many of you. 

I am sure this forum has helped many in the past like one poster stated earlier through a variety of similar problems. Nobody likes to put their private shit up there for others to mock at and judge, but I tell you what, it does help sometimes.

Any opinions on Japanese MIL's or are they all money hungry lychees in ASIA?

----------


## Bruno

> Did you purchase this property before or after you met this particular lady?


It was before the relationship to which I kept it from her until I knew her more. Kinda like the secret millionaire - only on a much smaller scale. She was in BKK at the time and yes I kinda agree with you about the whole mia noi thing, she lost face with many friends over that episode and maybe it was part of the reason why she left BKK to move in with me to get away from all that - but most people have a dark past of sorts right? At least she was honest about it which counts for something.

I don't mean to paint a one-sided picture of her and at the same time don't wish you to think I naive beyond comprehension as I strongly believe you have to give people the benefit of he doubt otherwise you wallow away in a confined pit of mistrust and paranoia. 

The property is safe, well, as well as it can be in LOS, and the suggestion to get her away from Thailand for a while is a very, very good one that was made earlier. I will seriously consider this but as everybody knows, money is tight and what little money I have right now will not be spent on that wretched MIL.

----------


## Loy Toy

> money is tight and what little money I have right now will not be spent on that wretched MIL.


Good on you.

----------


## navynine

Sounds more like her husband NOT brother.........

----------


## Jools

I told my Thai wife about this and she said something to the effect of "just like Thai people....cheat, cheat cheat". LOL  :smiley laughing:

----------


## Butterfly

> 2. This girl you have known for about a year and only see her on short holiday breaks between your studies.


I wonder what she is doing when he is not around  :mid:

----------


## genghis61

> Send 5000 baht with a note explaining that your brother in the uk is having a foking massive party and you had to give him 20,000 baht.
> Explain that family comes first for Brits as well.


Always have a back-up plan

I've done well with this, as in 'wider family responsibilities back home' - never been asked for loot here but have got this story well embedded 'in case'; gf recently got a large payout from her share of the farm and put it on 14mth fixed deposit, she thought this a clever way to avoid being asked for any loans 'sorry, can't, in the bank'.

----------


## dtalok

"what little money i have will not be spent on that wretched mother in law [sic]" now you are making sense, you sound like a nice guy, dont get used

----------


## dtalok

I met an english guy with an absolutely gorgeous wife, he owned a nice restaurant and a big house, the girls friends told me all about how when he is in the UK, she has a thai boyfriend, i believe it because i asked her in thai if it was true [english guy did'nt understand thai] and she got very upset and wanted to leave immediately
555 don't get me drunk because i am a complete jerk, but still i felt sorry for the guy because he believd she was devoted to him, i know this isn't relevant, but thats part of the reason i am so sceptical

----------


## nidhogg

Sadly, I tend to beleive this as "straight up".  yes the Brother plans to go into the monkhood, and yes, they want to throw him a big fuck off party, and yes, they budgeted 50K to be divided between the family.

And yes, they expect the girlfriend of the farang to stump up half the money.  A few points that cross my mind randomly.  

The party wil not only be booze and food, but also in attendence will be other monks - and they get the normal donation - everyone who lives here knows the sort of things - buckets of foodstufffs, robes etc etc.

The family is probably "sincere" in thinking this will be good for the brother - who will most likely spend 2 weeks there before deciding its all too much like hard work and slinking back (seen that a few times).  The fact that the family _knows_ this -won't stop them from pushing the boat out....

The mothers/MILs (??) -if you don't give me, I will take from the loan shark is ooohhhhh so typical of upping the stakes.

While I kinda agree with the posters who go along the "fuck em" line - this does put a LOT of pressure on the girl friend - who has a whole life time of brain washing that "family comes first".  Sadly that can be very deep rooted.  Forcing her into a corner will put a lot of pressure on her and the relationship.

If I understand the current situation -she works, and stays rent free in OPs house?  If so, she can provide some money.  I would (and I expect howls of outrage) meet them half way.  tell the g/f she must chip in 5K and I suggest the OP chips in 10K.  And make it clear that the lot.

I suppose the problem is, that as I see it - Thai families are like this - they WILL beggar the whole family to provide a party for the waste of space son.  Sensible?  No.  But they way it is - in many, many cases yes.

I personally have spent 10 year trying to find the fine line between making it clear that I am not the familys ATM, but that I am also not "stealing away the daughter".  We try to help meet the family commitments, but NOT as a blank cheque and on a case by case basis.  over time the missus understands this, and will screen the more opportunistic crap out, and we can discuss the difference between what is asked for - and what is needed.

----------


## Marmite the Dog

In most of Asia daughters are considered as commodities and not as loved family members (sons have that sole distinction), and until you realise that, you'll never understand why they do what they do.

----------


## DrAndy

> the Thai-chinese family announced they wanted to throw a big F***k off party in his honour and that she should contribute half - around 25k - towards the cost of this, which is next week.


they want the party, they pay

mothing to do with anyone else

----------


## withnallstoke

Bruno.
Hope it's not a psychology masters you are doing, but if it is, you are having some of the best tuition Isaan can provide.
Surely thats worth 25 grand?

----------


## Simon43

Inform your GF that you have suffered a MAJOR loss of face by the MIL thinking that you do not have the funds for this (whether you do or not is immaterial).

Advise them that the MIL needs to make financial compensation (25k),  to you for this very serious loss of face that has occured, which is much more than the loss of face that the MIL suffered when she ... er ..... loss face when making you loose face.

The thing with this loss of face issue is to go on the offensive immediately when you're accused of making someone loose face and accuse them of causing a much greater loss of face to you by accusing you of making them of loosing face (I think)

Simon

----------


## DrAndy

> i believe it because i asked her in thai if it was true [english guy did'nt understand thai] and she got very upset and wanted to leave immediately





> don't get me drunk because i am a complete jerk


yes, that speaks for itself

----------


## jimmymck

> I personally have spent 10 year trying to find the fine line between making it clear that I am not the familys ATM, but that I am also not "stealing away the daughter". We try to help meet the family commitments, but NOT as a blank cheque and on a case by case basis. over time the missus understands this, and will screen the more opportunistic crap out, and we can discuss the difference between what is asked for - and what is needed.


I agree with that nighog, i have spent the last 3 years doing the same, at last the gf is starting to get the drift.. after a lot explaining how it is going to be and alot of sour looking faces from the rest of them.
As you say it is so drummed into these kids brainwashing them from a young age what is expected of them.

We will always be richer than them, fact ,because we get off our arses and work and don't have a bunch of fuckwits as family robbing us. Therefore will be seen as the ATM but you just have to draw the line and decide when you want to help them out. Its tough for the good girls that are out there, that want a different, better life they do get stick in the middle of it all. 

The shit i see in this village never cease's to amaze's me, as many of the user's here have seen the same shit, i find these people a huge amount of them esp in Issan the biggest hypocrites i have ever come across anywhere..

All out this morning making merit with the monks after a night of gambling, getting wasted, after a day of stealing and sitting on their arses all day, all wanting the good fortune;ie cash, to come to them.wankers!!

I love it when i read that people say "Issan is the Real Thailand", well if it is (and i don't doubt that it is real ) and more tourists saw it, half the amount of tourists would never want to return.

Good luck anyway, i am going off track here , i hope your not getting scammed, i found a few trips to the UK (of course the Uk as it downside's) with the gf helped alot, opened her eyes to how we grew up and live , not in castles with maids everywhere etc..

----------


## Rural Surin

> Fuck ém, you shouldn't even explain why, just tell them no.
> 
> If you love your GF and want to take it further to seperate her from her family is a good move.


Uh huh. Easier said than done...

----------


## Butterfly

> Inform your GF that you have suffered a MAJOR loss of face by the MIL thinking that you do not have the funds for this (whether you do or not is immaterial).
> 
> Advise them that the MIL needs to make financial compensation (25k),  to you for this very serious loss of face that has occured, which is much more than the loss of face that the MIL suffered when she ... er ..... loss face when making you loose face.
> 
> The thing with this loss of face issue is to go on the offensive immediately when you're accused of making someone loose face and accuse them of causing a much greater loss of face to you by accusing you of making them of loosing face (I think)
> 
> Simon


nice strategy, sounds like the voice of experience  :Smile:

----------


## somtamslap

The cheek of some of these people is beyond comprehension..get on the blower to mummy in law and tell her in plain English..Fuck you, you fucking BUFFALO Cnut..

That should put an end to any more of these outlandish requests..

----------


## beppi

Face saving measures are the order of the day here!
Your GF will lose face in front of her family if she doesn't contribute to the occasion at all. But, as everything in Thailand, the contribution is negotiable and the effort counts as much as the actual amount.
I hope it is not too late for the following suggestion:
Your GF should tell the family (possibly the brother, if that is easier than talking to the mother) that money is tight and she cannot (with apologies) contribute as much as requested, but she can offer amount X (I suggest half of the requested, if you can stomach it - and it should also be part her and part your money!). The amount offered must be enough so they don't have to cancel the party altogether, but have to scale back from their current lofty plans.
Then a few days later, she should announce to the family that she will keep her promise of amount X, but unfortunately can only give half of it now and will pay the rest in installments over the next Y months.
This way, you show your best effort and enable the party while clearly showing the tight financial situation. Let others deal with the rest (e.g. they can take a loan if they have to).
Hope this helps.
Remember: In Asia, you can only lose by stubbornly refusing out of "principle".
And: For good or bad, you "marry" a family, not just a person. If you cannot accept that, leave!

----------


## Stumpy

Here is my newbie input, I gave my TGF (38 yrs old) the readers digest of this post and she said that it is life in Thailand. As a Foreigner, whether you have money or not, YOU HAVE MONEY in their eyes. And if you want their daughter you are going to pay for it. She said a great portion(Especially up North) exploit this. She said this is why you can see a beautiful Thai women with a disgusting man. Its the money, its not that they really love them or will. She was curious why you would support the sex relationship with another man. 

Her summation was you are foreigner and that separating her from the family will not work. She said unlike most westerners, Thai's have deep seeded family roots and obligations and that westerners should not come over here and try to get Thai's to break them.  I tend to agree. From my point of view, it is a common theme and from what I have read on numerous sites this appears to be the case. I also have a real case going right now with my US friend. He was told 500K bht Sinsot. He said NO, it has been all out war.  Anyway we want our cake and eat it too and a lot get mesmerized with the beauty. I have witnessed over the last few years that city raised girls are little more westernized and are leaving some of the deep roots behind. Beware, a lot come to BKK to make money to send money back home. I will say this, the younger the girl and the further north you go, the greater this family angst will exists. 

In my case(sadly) my GF parents both passed away in separate events. She is survived by a wonderful sister and some cool aunts and uncles( I have not met them yet as my GF simply works all the time). She is a nurse at a major hospital.

As a guy to a guy I will offer this bit of input, Never ever "Force" a relationship. If you are suffering this anguish now you are probably in for a long haul. I say you cut your losses, tell her this is not the right thing to do to come between her, family and Thai cultural values and move on....

My comments from the cheap seats. Establish your future first, then date.

----------


## Cujo

What on earth could you be studying in Thailand?

----------


## SEA Traveler

don't let this MIL and family situation send you off the deep end.  I would say that if you are not willing to put up with this type of event, get out of the situation with GF as soon as possible.... or, have her commit to you and be done with her free loading family.  the requests for dosh will be never ending.  one crisis event after the other.  and in the end, you will be far worse off mentally and financially.  run, Run, RUN.

----------


## nidhogg

Just to add - I think there are two misconceptions here, that this is a "farang" thing, and this is an "issan" thing.  Its not.

I have had the same secretary for ten years.  She is a pure bangkok lass (despises issanites!), poor background (parents are day laborours), put herself through most of her education - working and studying.  Now has a Masters degree (paid for by herself).  Guess what - she is hit up for exactly the same things.  Father is sixty, pay for a party, brother (a total waster) is going into the monkhood, pay money, brother getting married (he knocked up a girl) pay money.  Brother in jail, pay money.  Sister (an other waster) needs a motor bike to go study - pay money.  and so on.  She is the only real wage earner in the family - and she pays, and pays and pays - despite the fact she is married (guess what, to another waster).  I really do feel sorry for her. She will continue paying for her family and siblings untl the day she dies - but hey - she also pays monthly life insurance so they will all be taken care of when that happens.  

Makes me quite mad.

----------


## SEA Traveler

[quote=nidhogg;1700399]Just to add - I think there are two misconceptions here, that this is a "farang" thing, and this is an "issan" thing. Its not.

I have had the same secretary for ten years. She is a pure bangkok lass (despises issanites!), poor background (parents are day laborours), put herself through most of her education - working and studying. Now has a Masters degree (paid for by herself). Guess what - she is hit up for exactly the same things. Father is sixty, pay for a party, brother (a total waster) is going into the monkhood, pay money, brother getting married (he knocked up a girl) pay money. Brother in jail, pay money. Sister (an other waster) needs a motor bike to go study - pay money. and so on. She is the only real wage earner in the family - and she pays, and pays and pays - despite the fact she is married (guess what, to another waster). I really do feel sorry for her. She will continue paying for her family and siblings untl the day she dies - but hey - she also pays monthly life insurance so they will all be taken care of when that happens. 

Makes me quite mad.[/quote


Makes one wonder. it's all Bravo Sierra the way some Thai's expect other family members to support them for their whole entire lazy life!

----------


## Jesus Jones

> I met an english guy with an absolutely gorgeous wife, he owned a nice restaurant and a big house, the girls friends told me all about how when he is in the UK, she has a thai boyfriend, i believe it because i asked her in thai if it was true [english guy did'nt understand thai] and she got very upset and wanted to leave immediately
> 555 don't get me drunk because i am a complete jerk, but still i felt sorry for the guy because he believd she was devoted to him, i know this isn't relevant, but thats part of the reason i am so sceptical


Leave the country?  Her name wasn't Pacharee, Pepsi or one of her other names she goes by, Jade?

----------


## hopskimoet

My wives family wanted to me to pay the land debt off. All of £1600. I politely told her to tell them to go fuck themselves. This debt was arranged before I met my wife and has absolutely nothing to do with me. I said to the missus, what would happen if the shoe was on the other foot....?

The silence was golden.

----------


## Jesus Jones

Personally, i wouldn't contribute a penny, then let's see how strong your relationship really is!  Might be best go find out now rather than later and being out of pocket to boot.

----------


## withnallstoke

> What on earth could you be studying in Thailand?


Scamming, cheating, bullshitting, stupidity, greed, the art of safe driving, how to stay independent, fine cuisine, temple-ology, jet ski good practice, family dependence, architecture, concrete making, littering, own doorstep shitting, corruption, one-upmanship, debt, banditry, etc. 
 ::chitown::

----------


## hopskimoet

Learning how to use a service station bog without getting fecal matter on yer fingers.

----------


## Stumpy

> Just to add - I think there are two misconceptions here, that this is a "farang" thing, and this is an "issan" thing.  Its not.
> 
> I have had the same secretary for ten years.  She is a pure bangkok lass (despises issanites!), poor background (parents are day laborours), put herself through most of her education - working and studying.  Now has a Masters degree (paid for by herself).  Guess what - she is hit up for exactly the same things.  Father is sixty, pay for a party, brother (a total waster) is going into the monkhood, pay money, brother getting married (he knocked up a girl) pay money.  Brother in jail, pay money.  Sister (an other waster) needs a motor bike to go study - pay money.  and so on.  She is the only real wage earner in the family - and she pays, and pays and pays - despite the fact she is married (guess what, to another waster).  I really do feel sorry for her. She will continue paying for her family and siblings untl the day she dies - but hey - she also pays monthly life insurance so they will all be taken care of when that happens.  
> 
> Makes me quite mad.


Let me add to my previous post, I agree 100% it is not exclusively a "foreigner" thing or "Issan" thing. It is a Thai culture. Foreigners do however get exploited much more due to the perception of greater financial wealth. True to fact example. The US friend I mentioned above was asked for 500K bht, her sister married 1 year ago to a Thai and he paid 200k bht. Clearly evident, in this case.

Also my GF gives money to her sister who is married and has a 15 year old daughter. She makes far more then they do combined. She has never asked me for any money in fact she pays for stuff for us all the time. I was very clear up front with her when we started dating. that I am living off savings and have a reasonably strict budget. However marriage is not on my radar and with her parents deceased a sinsot is probably not something I will contend with.

----------


## genghis61

> ... they are really using this as an excuse just to see how rich or poor we really are as my tgf's mother rang her up stating that we have to pay 25k. 
> 
> ... wasn't good enough for the mother in law and announced my tgf is no longer welcome back home as a result of a major loss of face.


back to the OP, and "Girlfriend's mother has just lost major face"

where did she lose it exactly? In whose eyes, and who cares?

A lot about nothing.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Dug
> What on earth could you be studying in Thailand?
> Scamming, cheating, bullshitting, stupidity, greed, the art of safe driving, how to stay independent, fine cuisine, temple-ology, jet ski good practice, family dependence, architecture, concrete making, littering, own doorstep shitting, corruption, one-upmanship, debt, banditry, etc.


i take it there's no Go Gos where you are then ?

----------


## withnallstoke

> i take it there's no Go Gos where you are then ?


Correct.
And i forgot to mention fornication, masturbation, intimidation, united nation, constipation, cash evaporation, tinned carnation and english bastardisation.

----------


## BobR

Sorry if this sounds just as unkind as some of the comments above, but if you value your sanity and quality of life, you'll dump her now.  You can never separate a Thai girl from her family, no matter how sick or dysfunctional that family is, and paying the 25k Baht this time  will only buy you a few more weeks or months until her next crisis.

----------


## withnallstoke

> You can never separate a Thai girl from her family,


A crowbar should do it.

----------


## genghis61

> I said to the missus, *what would happen if the shoe was on the other foot....?*
> 
> The silence was golden.


because she was looking at your feet?  
or looking for your other shoe?
wondering why you'd want to swap shoes?

and then JJ in post after: "_being out of pocket to boot_"

footwear fetish?

Maybe tell them to: *Stand on their own two feet and learn to live on a shoestring budget*?

----------


## kingwilly

> and with her parents deceased a sinsot is probably not something I will contend with.


Wrong. 

Expect an Aunt or another relative to step in and ask.

Seen it before.

----------


## Stumpy

> Originally Posted by JPPR2
> 
> and with her parents deceased a sinsot is probably not something I will contend with.
> 
> 
> Wrong. 
> 
> Expect an Aunt or another relative to step in and ask.
> 
> Seen it before.


Doubt it. I will keep you posted. 
Have to keep in mind the age of my GF. By the time anything serious would happen she would be 40. She gives no money to any other family member except Sister. She is the oldest sister and the "Psuedo" mother of the family now. I will give to a sinsot bucket over a long term payment plan  :Smile: 

Interestingly I did not come to Thailand for a women or booze, I came to set up a home base and travel around for a year or so and enjoy. Funny how you find the person you were not looking for. . Honestly though I would periodically and gladly assist with her sister. No extended family deals for me. Not in budget and GF very clear on that. Anyway I will not disrespect family, just does not make sense. Her aunt and uncle are well off up near Lampang. She actually has a very small family. I think in general I have a reasonably unique situation here

----------


## taffyapple

:cmn: bruno i think you are getting sucked into a very dangerous situation,you need to be very careful,as you havent got the money and you care about your tgf you have mentioned that the mil.will get the money from a loan shark,who is goeing to be the gaurantor maybe your gf.in that case the loan will be yours.once they default on the payments 50k becomes 100k and these people dont fnuk about they will find you and your gf.i dont want to tell you what would happen if you dont pay.my wife and me found out 15years ago with a family member who had gauranteed a loan for his inlaw,who done a runner if we had not been in thailand at the time he would not be with us today.it was only by luck we found out and paid off the gang.28years exp.i like others on td.who have given you good advice,take it.

----------


## WilliamBlake

> my tgf worked in bkk to pay back this debt, taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank


And now her mother has disowned her, and they want you to foot the bill for a party?

You're on a winner there, man.

----------


## Takeovers

See the positive side of it all. It is a win win situation.

If she sticks with you through this you probably have a good one, stick to her.
If she doesn't good riddance, just in time.

----------


## redbaron

Some years ago I was lucky enough to be involved in one of these  parties. The TG formerly known as Miss Red had a brother (yes, he was  definately her brother, I saw the baby/growing up photos and even until  the day we parted, they looked like twins) who was going for a stint in  the monkhood. The party was HUGE. MASSIVE. Miss Red's grandfather had a  bit of land - say 20 acres - so that's where the party was. Hundreds of  people turned up. Literally hundreds. Most of the town (Prachinburi) it  seemed. At least 20 monks. Chock-a-block.

 Party was awesome. Music from mid afternoon (after the parade in which I  took part) until late. I didn't see the end, flaked it. Massive amounts  of food. Miss Red's aunts, neighbours, friends all took ages to  prepare. Thai BBQ, beer, whiskey (mostly Thai but a fair bit of good  stuff as well). Kids everywhere having a ball. Preparation was massive,  as was the party.... BUT

 I wasn't asked for one single satang. Not one! Yes, I offered, and I  did donate some money to the temple, as did everyone else but never was I  put in a position where I was asked for money (other than when all the  girls were busy making food and they needed a couple of ingredients and I  ran down to the shops for them). 

 A bit of background. Miss Red's father is dead. 2 Grandparents still  kicking and retired. Mum on her own, brother was working but taking time  off to do the monk thing.... Only other close relatives 3 aunts... If  that wasn't the perfect opportunity to ask the handsum farang for a  sizeable donation I don't know what was. And we'd been an "item" for  some years.... just my 2 bob's worth...

 OP.. I'd run.Or lay down the law. Something like my girl (at the time) told her family... "This guy's going to give me a better future than any Thai guy. Don't fuck things up by making ridiculous demands." They respected her for that.

----------


## nidhogg

> OP.. I'd run.Or lay down the law. Something like my girl (at the time) told her family... "This guy's going to give me a better future than any Thai guy. Don't fuck things up by making ridiculous demands." They respected her for that.


Nice story.  Nice girl.  Good luck.

----------


## Aussie Tigger

Takeovers comment was spot on.Don't apologize,tell your girlfriend that it is you or them and move on.

----------


## sunsetter

stick to your guns mate, dont get sucked in,might be a good time to think about where your going at this point with the tgf,good luck and keep us all posted



this should be in famous threads soon

----------


## blue

I'm thinking of setting a Thai dating  / marriage service for western men ,

with the unique selling point that all the girls were brought up in orphanages ,

if anyone wants to nick the idea , no problem , just send me a case of beer

----------


## chitown

> my tgf worked in bkk to pay back this debt, taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank


Chi shudders.......

----------


## Loy Toy

> Originally Posted by Bruno
> 
> 
>  my tgf worked in bkk to pay back this debt, taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank
> 
> 
> Chi shudders.......


And then the OP claims later on that she was doing this so as to pay her Uni fees. 

As far as I can gather Thai wives can sometimes accept that their husbands have gone with a prostitute or bar girl for a one night stand but there was only one payment, end of story. No names............no long term commitment.

Mia Nois, little or second wives.......whatever you want to call them are hated due to the fact they are trying to steal a husband and his money which in turn hurts the family.

I would never have a serious relationship with such a woman no matter what as she has already proved her ethics or lack there of.

Again old Bruno is getting the Issarn two step or this is one hell of a boring troll.

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> ...or this is one hell of a boring troll.


Patience... there may yet be blood and guts.  :Very Happy:

----------


## Bruno

> Patience... there may yet be blood and guts.


Update:

I just need to set the record straight here with regards to the whole mia-noi thing. As loy toy states, and rightly so, One should never enter into a relationship with a known home wrecker as it simply doesn't bold well for the future. As for an ex-bargirl, well that is a different story and yes I personally do see a difference between the two.

When we met she was not involved with her boss - who at that time was her ex-boss - because she claimed that both guilt and the fact that she paid of this debt to the bank and put herself through University was simply 'enough for her'. It was always going to be this kind of relationship between them as he had kids and I guess after 2 or 3 years of this clandestine relationship taking place, she had enough. He moved on to another new bit of skirt in the office fresh from University and as naive as they come, my tgf simply quit and moved on herself from this affair. 

As I said before, nobody is perfect. Besides, can all of you here put your hand on your heart and say you have done no wrongs in your life - a little trip to Pattaya maybe?

Anyway, It is my choice to be with her regardless of her past as a former mia-noi and the latest events to have unfolded with the MIL now are as follows:

Speaking with her today she informed me that she had spoken to her mum about the party (which is this Friday by the way) and that she still 'wants' or 'expects' - not sure which - 10,000 baht to contribute to food and alcohol for the event. Like I said last night, the decision laid with my tgf and if she was going to give that money then just be honest and say you were going to do it rather than lie about it as this would annoy me more.

She then told me after the conversation between them that as much as she wants to help her 'right now we cant' because of our current financial situation and that maybe she can contribute about 1,000 baht at most. She sounded, well, better than yesterday on the phone and to be honest I am proud of her for forgoing pride in favour of logical reason. If we had the money then of course I would not mind contributing towards his party, but it would be for the right reasons - and not to appease the MIL in this ridiculous 'face saving culture'. 

So, my words and the advice from here seem to have paid off - or rather not as the case may be - and the MIL, according to the tgf will simply get a small donation to help with the party and will hopefully know next time that threatening her the way she did is not acceptable. 

Of course I would have loved to give her none of that money just as principal now, but I will settle for a thousand baht; until the next crisis arises!

My thanks to you all once again...

----------


## Thetyim

Well asking for a contribution is very different from demanding half.

Thousand baht won't go far so give what you can afford

----------


## Bruno

> Well asking for a contribution is very different from demanding half.


Yes this was the case to begin with but I guess as the time drew nearer to the event and money was looking less likely to appear - despite the threats of loan sharks - it has called her bluff and she will now settle for whatever she can get her paws on - which, is only a grand. 

I am proud of my tgf to be honest as she could of bowed down to this pressure, but she didn't!

----------


## withnallstoke

> He moved on to another new bit of skirt in the office fresh from University and as naive as they come


Bloody marvellous.
This sort of writing makes my bollocks explode.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

Your GF has lied to you before mate,
what makes you think she isn't lying to you now, and getting that money by hook or by crook ? 
just to keep you and her mom sweet

Maybe she's not as naive as you think.

----------


## Bruno

> Your GF has lied to you before mate,
> what makes you think she isn't lying to you now, and getting that money by hook or by crook ? 
> just to keep you and her mom sweet


Valid point Sabaii, very valid. Maybe the actual scenario will play like this:

MIL takes 10k from local loan shark mafia type on the promise tgf will pay it back.

TGF keeps this 'secret' from me and tries to establish a payment plan, which, goes horribly wrong, as I predicted it would, because we dont have the means to pay it back. As a result, interest spirals out of control, more pressure ensues from the MIL to pay this back, TGF under lots of pressure now and makes up a story to help her mum - problem solved!

Or is it?

----------


## sabaii sabaii

I'm trying to piece all this together.

You're back in the UK

So you've been with the Gf for ! year right?

Did you come over here for 1 year and stay here with her, or her family ?

How long have you been apart from your GF ?

Have you sent her any money ?

----------


## withnallstoke

This must be a great earning opportunity.
Secretly lend the mother in law to be the where withall to fund the monkenspiell at a great and advantageous interest rate, and demand sex by way of payment.
Simply slip alongside her at the gathering, and introduce your member to her at a rate of, say, a grand per centimeter.
Any surplus from either side should be paid, in notes, to the orangemen, and sworn by some old bloke from the village, who would be on your side for a small sum (known as the Jiddish cut).

----------


## sabaii sabaii

Bruno, there's a few members here from Isaan, give them the address and we can get a good photo thread on here of the party.

----------


## sabang

> but I will settle for a thousand baht


25 quid. Is the West really that poor?  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 
I keep reading stuff about Somalian slappers with heaps of rug rats (of uncertain patriarchy) being put up in million pound plus properties.
Compliments of mother england and it's compliant masses.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

25 quid. Is the West really that poor?
Yep,
49. somethin to the baht now, so that 25 quid is only about 21 GBP
Take off Western Unions 15% and dodgy exchange rate and well ..........

Lao Kao anyone

----------


## blue

thats true 
but the £ exchange rates a bitch

----------


## sabang

> so that 25 quid is only about 21 GBP
> Take off Western Unions 15% and dodgy exchange rate and well


If you pay 15% to transfer money, you deserve penury.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## harrybarracuda

> Originally Posted by sabaii sabaii
> 
> so that 25 quid is only about 21 GBP
> Take off Western Unions 15% and dodgy exchange rate and well
> 
> 
> If you pay 15% to transfer money, you deserve penury.


You would be quite amazed at the number of farang happy to swallow this to send money to the girl who ruv rem rong time.
 :ssssh:

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> I'm trying to piece all this together.


Try reading the thread. Idiot.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

Oi dognobber, paste the rest of my post,  Prick  !!!

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> I have gone back to University





> Pack your bags now mate.





> Is she in Thailand?


 :smiley laughing: 

Phew I thought I was the only illiterate one on here for a bit then.

----------


## Muadib

> I am proud of my tgf to be honest as she could of bowed down to this pressure, but she didn't!


Hold on, what about mama dis-owning the daughter? I guess she just took it back and all was forgiven? WTF!!! 

Moral blackmail is a form of slavery...

----------


## billy the kid

can't read it all but
talk about thai DRAMA.
they are good actors aren't they and they
can keep it running.
i would ask Bruno to observe all and nothing else.

----------


## genghis61

just to add to the mix

call from a former neighbour last night, bit upset as last weekend his gf of last 6 months had returned to Korat to look after her mother with lung cancer. Then yesterday her boyfriend from Switzerland arrived to collect the clothes etc she had left behind.

How do ya feel?

----------


## koman

> just to add to the mix
> 
> call from a former neighbour last night, bit upset as last weekend his gf of last 6 months had returned to Korat to look after her mother with lung cancer. Then yesterday her boyfriend from Switzerland arrived to collect the clothes etc she had left behind.
> 
> How do ya feel?


Failing grade in strategic studies...all round..... :smiley laughing: 

Still, maybe the GF did not lie.  Mum may well be sick....may even be in Korat.
The Swiss guy is incidental........ :Smile:

----------


## DrAndy

> Besides, can all of you here put your hand on your heart and say you have done no wrongs in your life - a little trip to Pattaya maybe?


me, me, I have never been to Pattaya

----------


## genghis61

re #111

my question is

*has he just lost major face?*

for neighbours, friends, people who know him, of course there will be no shortage of 'told you so' behind his back. 

Or is this 'face' BS limited to Thai folk only?

----------


## jimmymck

> Or is this 'face' BS limited to Thai folk only?


Due to the fact most of them could not give a fuck about any foreigners i would say they think only a Thai could lose or gain "face"

I blame alot of these money issue's many people seem to have to to deal with on the stupid fuckwits that just gave what ever the woman wanted which started many years ago, over the years all the "chinese whisper" stories have spread all over the country of what they got, bribed ,how ever you look at it, from the "stupid white fella" its now looked at as the norm that we are ATM's

Some of these boyfriends are/were twats, i have met numourous girls with cars,condo's,large monthly payment etc funded by some muppet flashing his dough about thinking that will impress em ..whilst they carry on working one way or another.

The nearest bloke that lives near me about 15km away,i've never met him, works at sea half the year has this fat ,ugly bitch gf, has brought her a lovely motor, land for the new house,condo in Hue Hin etc etc, common knowledge in the village she has at least one thai geek, and then to top it off as gone and got HIV from one of the geeks...and then c*nt has said she won't tell him she has it,.. maybe she does not want to lose "face"..

never ends the shit that goes on..

----------


## lob

> Some great advice guys, appreciated!
> 
> Of course a few sarcastic ones but you expect that from time to time on a public forum!
> 
> 
> Didn't one of you say "Welcome to Thailand"  ?



what u perseeve as sarcastic is in fact people trying to get u to see the obvious.  my advise.  dont get yourself worked up/involved with people that are not your concern.  u love your girlfriend not her family.   u cant help someone that cant help themselves.  full stop.

----------


## lob

Remember: In Asia, you can only lose by stubbornly refusing out of "principle".
And: For good or bad, you "marry" a family, not just a person. If you cannot accept that, leave![/quote]


ah what balls u have.  u need a dose of mumps mate.  grow some.  in thailand as elsewhere , ur selfsufficient or u go under. ur ur own mane or u aint. take care of ur own. fuck the rest of em.

----------


## lob

> Originally Posted by chitown
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Bruno
> ...


do u happen to know anyone without luggage

----------


## lob

> Your GF has lied to you before mate,
> what makes you think she isn't lying to you now, and getting that money by hook or by crook ? 
> just to keep you and her mom sweet
> 
> Maybe she's not as naive as you think.



my opinion too.

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> call from a former neighbour last night, bit upset as last weekend his gf of last 6 months had returned to Korat to look after her mother with lung cancer. Then yesterday her boyfriend from Switzerland arrived to collect the clothes etc she had left behind.


She doesn't normally reside on Koh Chang does she?

----------


## genghis61

> She doesn't normally reside on Koh Chang does she?


family near Nakhon Ratchisima; he met her after we left Phuket and has been there at least a year, before who knows. That's the second cashier that he's had as a live-in. 
First one gets house when he croaks.

----------


## Lancelot

> Carrry on with your own life and distance yourself from this family Bruno.
> 
> If your girlfriend wants to be a part of your life she will soon prove it to you.
> 
> Do not let the things you have absolutely no control over get to you let alone trying to understand it.


If we get to vote, I'll cast mine with LT. Good advice...

----------


## DrAndy

> do u happen to know anyone without luggage


only on AirAsia

----------


## DrAndy

well Bruno, amusing though this thread is, I am always mystified by anyone coming on here and asking for advice on some personal matter

as you have seen, you get replies from "kill the bitch" to "give her all your money, and more", and everything in between

the variety of posters and their experience, education and sense is also wide

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> well Bruno, amusing though this thread is, I am always mystified by anyone coming on here and asking for advice on some personal matter
> 
> as you have seen, you get replies from "kill the bitch" to "give her all your money, and more", and everything in between
> 
> the variety of posters and their experience, education and sense is also wide


But then you wouldn't know good advice because you never give any. 
Where does it say "kill the bitch" and "give her all your money, and more" ?
Only in your post apparently.
No doubt your disappointed the forum didn't rip him to bits so you could snap at his heels with your vapid one liners.

----------


## Bruno

> well Bruno, amusing though this thread is, I am always mystified by anyone coming on here and asking for advice on some personal matter
> 
> as you have seen, you get replies from "kill the bitch" to "give her all your money, and more", and everything in between
> 
> the variety of posters and their experience, education and sense is also wide
> __________________


I am glad you find the unfortunate circumstances of others to your 'amusement' DrAndy but I fear you are missing a very important point about what a forum is. Now, I am an academic type of fellow and according to the Oxford English Dictionary they declare a forum to mean "_a place where people can exchange opinions and ideas on a particular issue_".

Of course you can derive what you will from your own definition of what a forum means to you, as this is by no means exclusive to one and all, merely a definition of sorts. 

However, to be fair. Had I of said in the title of the OP "should I pay" then the comments would be more open to one's personal opinion as to what 'they' would do. But as I stated earlier money is tight for me right now and regardless of the MIL's request my answer will always be 'I am broke, therefore go away'. I cannot give what I don't have it is as simple as that. What the MIL was asking however, was 'if you don't help me I will take out a loan' and the comments I received here help me figure out - as a relatively new person to Thai relationships - that this is not so out of the ordinary.

Anyway, you are a Doctor yes? So I need not explain to you one's own actions as we are all individuals which makes this type of forum unique.

----------


## Loy Toy

> do u happen to know anyone without luggage


In fact most people carry luggage, and with respect to your question I presume you mean past mistakes. In fact I have made many mistakes but I wouldn't steal someone's wife, mother or girlfriend.

Mia Noi's know full well what they are getting into and take on the relationship knowing that they are playing second fiddle but do so anyway and to get some of the money on offer or an easy life.

Prostitutes or bar girls do what they do to get money but there is mostly no names or pack-drills associated with what they do.

The OP's girlfriend had many options and to pay her way in life and chose the path of the low of the low.

My opinion only.

----------


## CaptainNemo

> Originally Posted by ItsRobsLife
> 
> Patience... there may yet be blood and guts.
> 
> 
> Update:
> 
> I just need to set the record straight here with regards to the whole mia-noi thing. As loy toy states, and rightly so, One should never enter into a relationship with a known home wrecker as it simply doesn't bold well for the future. As for an ex-bargirl, well that is a different story and yes I personally do see a difference between the two.
> 
> ...


Never been to Pattaya... She's bad news...

My MIL is lovely, but then she's tribal Kuy, not I(n)san(e); plus I've got no brothers-in-law; and make sure I never remember the names of any SILs' attachments.

I would suggest that those are possibly sensible rules of thumb to selecting your serious Thai totty investment... 

can she speak some english... [tick]
do you like her mother... [tick] 
has she got no brother... [tick]
_...now you are on safer ground_ 

I might also add... 
is she *not* from the Isan plateau... [tick]
does she *not* have any tattoos... [tick]
does she *not* wear that horrible glow in the dark "gold" jewellery... [tick]
has she got some kind of education that might make her comparable to the sort woman you might talk to in your own country... [tick]
does she *not* watch TV or listen to Thai love songs... [tick]
does she actually have any hobbies and interests that give her something to talk about... [tick]

There seem to be a lot of very attractive, retarded lunatic ladies over there, seems odd that anyone would flee from the claws of a very westernised woman into the arms of a very easternised woman - seems like out of the frying pan; into the fire.

If you are already suffering from a state of limerance about her, then you could have just bypassed the old crow and chatted up the brother directly to get him to see things your way, and exclude the women from the decision making... making it easy for the mother to back down, when the son is arguing for your case... she'd have to a fucking 9 or a 10 to even consider that; forming friendships with oriental men is a decidedly overrated experience; with added trust dramas in SEAsia.

Your career is more important than dramas... "take a break", finish your course... simplify your life. You go back, and either she's got someone else (means she wasn't that fussy anyway); or they welcome you as a returning cash cow, and treat you with more respect.  :Smile:

----------


## Stumpy

Man...I see a Jerry Springer show in here some where...  :Wink: 

Sorry Bruno not dismissing your issue, it is a serious one but you should walk. If you are forcing a relationship or in a endless conditional deal. it is not meant to be. Your gut should tell you the answer

----------


## jimmymck

> Never been to Pattaya... She's bad news... My MIL is lovely, but then she's tribal Kuy, not I(n)san(e); plus I've got no brothers-in-law; and make sure I never remember the names of any SILs' attachments. I would suggest that those are possibly sensible rules of thumb to selecting your serious Thai totty investment... can she speak some english... [tick] do you like her mother... [tick] has she got no brother... [tick] ...now you are on safer ground I might also add... is she not from the Isan plateau... [tick] does she not have any tattoos... [tick] does she not wear that horrible glow in the dark "gold" jewellery... [tick] has she got some kind of education that might make her comparable to the sort woman you might talk to in your own country... [tick] does she not watch TV or listen to Thai love songs... [tick] does she actually have any hobbies and interests that give her something to talk about... [tick] There seem to be a lot of very attractive, retarded lunatic ladies over there, seems odd that anyone would flee from the claws of a very westernised woman into the arms of a very easternised woman - seems like out of the frying pan; into the fire. If you are already suffering from a state of limerance about her, then you could have just bypassed the old crow and chatted up the brother directly to get him to see things your way, and exclude the women from the decision making... making it easy for the mother to back down, when the son is arguing for your case... she'd have to a fucking 9 or a 10 to even consider that; forming friendships with oriental men is a decidedly overrated experience; with added trust dramas in SEAsia. Your career is more important than dramas... "take a break", finish your course... simplify your life. You go back, and either she's got someone else (means she wasn't that fussy anyway); or they welcome you as a returning cash cow, and treat you with more respect. __________________


very good... :smiley laughing:

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by CaptainNemo
> 
> Never been to Pattaya... She's bad news... My MIL is lovely, but then she's tribal Kuy, not I(n)san(e); plus I've got no brothers-in-law; and make sure I never remember the names of any SILs' attachments. I would suggest that those are possibly sensible rules of thumb to selecting your serious Thai totty investment... can she speak some english... [tick] do you like her mother... [tick] has she got no brother... [tick] ...now you are on safer ground I might also add... is she not from the Isan plateau... [tick] does she not have any tattoos... [tick] does she not wear that horrible glow in the dark "gold" jewellery... [tick] has she got some kind of education that might make her comparable to the sort woman you might talk to in your own country... [tick] does she not watch TV or listen to Thai love songs... [tick] does she actually have any hobbies and interests that give her something to talk about... [tick] There seem to be a lot of very attractive, retarded lunatic ladies over there, seems odd that anyone would flee from the claws of a very westernised woman into the arms of a very easternised woman - seems like out of the frying pan; into the fire. If you are already suffering from a state of limerance about her, then you could have just bypassed the old crow and chatted up the brother directly to get him to see things your way, and exclude the women from the decision making... making it easy for the mother to back down, when the son is arguing for your case... she'd have to a fucking 9 or a 10 to even consider that; forming friendships with oriental men is a decidedly overrated experience; with added trust dramas in SEAsia. Your career is more important than dramas... "take a break", finish your course... simplify your life. You go back, and either she's got someone else (means she wasn't that fussy anyway); or they welcome you as a returning cash cow, and treat you with more respect. __________________
> 
> 
> very good...


Despite being complete bollocks.

----------


## crippen

What are the rules for sin sot anyway???   In the good old days,the lady had to be a virgin.   Now it has been relaxed to "no children".   When did this change to any old lady with any number of kids??? :ourrules:

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> Now it has been relaxed to "no children"


Don't bet on it.

----------


## CaptainNemo

> Originally Posted by jimmymck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by CaptainNemo
> ...


you can't bullshit a bullshitter.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

X

I think you've hit a raw nerve with a couple of Isaan dwellers here Nemo ?








> can she speak some english... [X] do you like her mother... [X] has she got no brother... [X]





> is she not from the Isan plateau... [X] does she not have any tattoos... [X] does she not wear that horrible glow in the dark "gold" jewellery... [X] has she got some kind of education that might make her comparable to the sort woman you might talk to in your own country... [X] does she not watch TV or listen to Thai love songs... [bollocks] does she actually have any hobbies and interests that give her something to talk about... cnut

----------


## sabaii sabaii

Bruno, Is your GF in Thailand or UK with you ?

----------


## sabaii sabaii

At first I thought this was all a joke, and I picked up straight away on the Mia Noi thing. 
I was a bit tipsy that night and apologise for the spotty faced student jibe, 

But now I have read your previous posts and can see you seem like a nice guy and genuinely love this girl.

Like the Dr says, You are unique in being so upfront about your personal life, and you do deserve a lot of credit for that.

So I'm gonna send you a green dot :Smile: 

And as someone else said about luggage, Yea I've got a few cases and yes zipped em open in PPattaya, Bangkok and Roi Et

Ok as for advice- I would seriously find the money, 
Your GF will respect you a lot for it and so will the MILF
If you love her then do it


The family unit in Thailand is by far and away stronger than back home, where the kids tell there parents to fcku off and shove them in an old folks home

----------


## Thetyim

^
So you're feeling sorry for Mum now

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> ^ So you're feeling sorry for Mum now


She's been through the mill, losing her husband to cirrhosis, (I can sympathise with that after the other night vodka fuelled night), then the shit with her son and blood poisoning and digging him out of a 250,000 hole,and now, in her eyes not mine, her daughter with kee neow

----------


## DrAndy

> Stop bummin off people and get the dough.





> I would strongly consider getting out of this relationship





> Get him to pay the money.





> Send 5000 baht with a note





> I must say in my opinion you are being scammed.


 
the thing is, as this is a personal matter, each opinionated bit of advice will have been based on the posters own personal experience, which may not be yours at all

as I said, an amusing thread (maybe not for you) with some entertainment value - no disrespect intended

what more could you ask from any forum?

----------


## OhOh

> as I said, an amusing thread (maybe not for you) with some entertainment valu


That sums up the forum nicely.

----------


## taffyapple

:cmn: as you said bruno you have no experience on thai relationships,in thailand love and money go together as you have no money forget it,i have seen it all before you come here with limited funds and bullshit the girls,your living in a dreamworld not many survive without fnuk all so your best work and save for the next 15years and when you are ready come back there will be plenty of tgf,but dont forget what youve been told good luck,if you dont heed the advice given to you you will need more than luck.

----------


## DrAndy

> if you dont heed the advice given to you you will need more than luck


especially as most of the advice is contradictory

----------


## taffyapple

:cmn: 


> Originally Posted by taffyapple
> 
> if you dont heed the advice given to you you will need more than luck
> 
> 
> especially as most of the advice is contradictory


agree dr.the contradictory advice given is by those who know f.all about thai relationships.

----------


## sabaii sabaii

^ My brain hurts

----------


## Carrabow

> ^ My brain hurts


 
Could be the alcohol detoxifying the brain?

My blood type is Crown Royal  :Smile:

----------


## Phuketrichard

> but he once knocked of a motorcyclist in his car, whom, threatened to sue his ass unless he could come up with 250,000 baht pronto!


I did the same thing and it only cost me 50,000 baht 

this is taken straight from the never ending story called fleece the Farang, One question. Do u have proof ( other than what ur GF says) that any of the monies said to have been spent really were?

----------


## bifftastic

> Originally Posted by ItsRobsLife
> 
> Patience... there may yet be blood and guts.
> 
> 
> Update:
> 
> I just need to set the record straight here with regards to the whole mia-noi thing. As loy toy states, and rightly so, One should never enter into a relationship with a known home wrecker as it simply doesn't bold well for the future. As for an ex-bargirl, well that is a different story and yes I personally do see a difference between the two.
> 
> ...


Good news I reckon,
I had a fairly similar thing, my g/f's brother who lives in the family home in Korat (g/f lives in Chiang Rai) decided he was going to go off and work in Qatar, usual thoughts on this, go to a foreign country, earn shed loads of money (all foreigners are rich=foreign countries have money trees). He took out a 100,000 baht loan with mum's house as security.

Anyway, turns out (surprise surprise) the work wasn't all it was cracked up to be, he needed to do overtime to really earn the bucks and it wasn't forthcoming. G/f starts to get phone calls from Qatar, brother (who's just turned 20, g/f is 35 btw) crying on the phone, drunk. 'work not good, not have money now, don't know what to do blah blah blah'.

My advice was, tell him to stop drinking, and start working. G/f says she already tore him off a strip for borrowing money on mum's house and told him the exact same thing.
Anyway, a few more similar calls, and one from Mum herself asking if g/f can 'talk to him'. By now we are both expecting the 'need money' requests.
Lo and behold, the company send him home for drinking too much and not working!
Then the calls start in earnest 'you have husband farang you can help yes?'
g/f responds with 'mai dai!' we're buying our own home, she explains, my b/f work same everybody Thai, not rich man, he get money every month, but not enough for help everybody.
Eventually the calls stop but only after my g/f, who is extremely strong willed and independent thinking for a Thai person, was ready to change her number and got very angry with her numerous family members (not so much Mum but other siblings, of which there are many) We occasionally send a couple of thousand to Mum if we have it spare but it takes a lot of resolve on the part of a daughter to resist the pressure from family to support them.
You'll never change the perception that all farang are super-rich but you can, with time and a strong-willed Thai partner, modify or lower their expectations.
I'm quite happy with my new title of 'farang jon' and couldn't care less if I've 'lost face'. As someone else suggested, the whole 'face' thing can be turned around.
You've lost face by them trying it on with you.

Having said that, a precedent was set by your g/f when she was mia noi, so that's probably why they asked in the first place. In their mind there's no difference between being mia noi to some Thai business man and having 'boyfriend farang'
same same.
All I did was stick to my guns of 'kor thot, mai mee' and, with g/f's support, it seems to have been enough, so far! 
Good luck with it all, hope it works out for the best, whatever you decide to do in the future,

----------


## steven100

Wow !! this seems a really good story but i haven't seen the book yet. When is the movie coming out ? this has gotta be a best seller. 

Anyway, I believe the best has happened to you already and you should be thankful .... that is that MIL hates you ...and is pissed off with daughter ! youv'e won already don't you see ... this will set a preceedent for any possible future beggins.

I suggest you contribute something toward the piss up ... but not the 25K ..say you throw in 15K , get 5K from the GF and you give 10K .. shit your only giving $330 dollars , it's not that much considering you haven't had the misfortune of giving anything for a year or so. 

I think if you give the 15K together ... go to the piss up and get sloshed ..then go find dear old gracious mother in law behind the dunny wall , give her a smack around the ear hole and politely tell here your name is not Kasikorn tim and your not from Jackass creek .. so she can go jump the sick buffalo for a few hours .. and don't call you again.

That should fix things and hopefully you won't hear from any family members for a while.  :ourrules:

----------


## Panda

It aint ever going to end. 
Just say NO!
Sadly, it will be your girlfriend who has to choose between you and her family in the end. Its blackmail by proxy.

----------


## Nomaifalang

> tomorrow is another day and my tgf is her own woman so I have made my feelings clear about what 'not' to do and now she must choose which path to take.


The problem is that they NEVER think about tomorrow. Rual Thai people can have 50,000 Bt today and will spend and give it away before the sun goes down without thinking about tomorrow because as you said "Tomorrow is another day"

----------


## Loy Toy

> Rual Thai people can have 50,000 Bt today and will spend and give it away before the sun goes down without thinking about tomorrow because as you said "Tomorrow is another day"


100% correct mate.

And your first post (#148) was very good.

Welcome to the forum and I hope you can stick around.  :Smile:

----------


## Probosci Akimbo

> Originally Posted by Bruno
> 
> So now I am stuck with a pissed off mother in-law (of sorts) and a tearful girlfriend who now questions her mother's cursed words of "why are you with a farang if he no money"
> 
> 
> Tell the old crow to go take a large fuck to herself,  she'll be living in your wallet forever more if you fall for this guilt trip she's laying on the daughter. 
> You need to set the ground rules, don't let the old hag bully you. 
> Good luck.


Sums it up well.
You are either the extended family's meal ticket or substandard?

Tough moms! Let mother in law stew in the own juices for making it apear 
you would plump for the party without asking in advance. Her mistake.
It's clear mother thinks of your TGF as her meal ticket, maybe having written off #1 son, and doesn't care how she makes that money; Mia noi, a year in a soapy, milk a farang boyfriend, whatever, just do it girl or I throw you out the family.  Not my idea of a decent mother in law by any stretch of the spandex crotch protector.

So either the TGF is willing to stick it out with you and your schooling for a better future, and be treated better than she is by the family, or she is happy to be mommies little wage slave, no matter what the 'job' entails. 

Personally I see mommy dearest has lost more face manipulating her daughter, than any embarrassment at not being able to manipulate you,  could ever lose her.

----------


## bkkstan

This will never stop.Whether or not your girl is part of it or not!

The facts are ,if true,she can not let her mother or family suffer,Thais are intrinsically tied to their family and can not break the bonds.

She has either proved that with the ''mia noi story''or she used the story to set you up in the perfect scam!

You can not and should not,under any circumstances,come with the money!

You have only one path,you must convince your girl that you will never pay because there is no respect or gratitude involved,so you know it will go on and on!Therefore ,she will have to make the choice between the family and you.Your chances of her doing this are very slim,even if she is on the level!

If she is on the level,your job will be to convince her that she will be used like this forever!

If she can't or won't make the break,you must!YOU HAVE NO CHOICE,unless you are willing to pay over and over again! :Sorry1:

----------


## gaikokujin

Why are you asking about Japanese MILs??
 Spent 27 yrs in Asia and I think you should find another  area of earth.
You don't belong in Thailand, they gonna eat you up +spit you out.
And another Farang suicide.

----------


## Bruno

*UPDATE:*

Now that the party has passed - it was last Friday - I have heard no more from the demanding MIL, albeit through my tgf, and her requests for money. 

It is quite funny but somewhere in these posts I distinctly remember one guy saying that "he would only become a monk for a few days", I laughed at this to myself and perhaps I should of asked her how long he planned on entering the monkhood whilst the demands ensued to which she replied, "15 days naa".

I could not believe it. All that fuss for him going away for just 2 weeks to a temple not 20km away from his home is truly unbelievable. 

I am not so familiar with Thai culture as some of you out there might be but is this custom of becoming a 2 week trip normal? To me it doesn't ring true that paying out all that money for a pathetic 2 week trip to the temple is worth it - if he was going away for maybe 6 months or even a year I could understand the need for a send-off (if that is what this party is) but for 2 weeks and with him being a mere 10min ride away?!?  

Anyway, the party has now passed, he is now a monk - at least for the next 12 days - and my tgf seems less concerned about the constant calls from the said MIL and her inappropriate manipulative tone - for now!

----------


## Bruno

> Why are you asking about Japanese MILs??


Because I harbour a secret lustful desire for the more 'mature' woman, especially if they are Japanese, what's wrong with that? 




> Spent 27 yrs in Asia and I think you should find another area of earth.


But I really like Thailand, besides, I was only joking about the Japanese MILS. 




> You don't belong in Thailand


Ohh! But I love the food, and the climate, as do I love the beaches; why would you say such a thing?




> they gonna eat you up +spit you out.


Who? The Thais'? I never knew cannibalism was still practised in that part of the world? What are your predictions then gaikokujin for my future in Thailand what with all your years of experience in Asia and all? 




> another Farang suicide.


Charming bloke this one is wouldn't you say?

----------


## ItsRobsLife

It's no so much the two weeks in the Wat that they are celebrating, but more that he will be rid of all his past and future sins and will reach the next level in the afterlife.

The driving force behind your girlfriends need to help the family with money etc, is also based on the Thai Buddhist mumbo jumbo. If the daughter serves the family, or her husband, conscientiously her whole life, she will be fortunate in the afterlife and be reborn as a man. 

Sad isn't it that such chauvinism is so instilled into their culture that it can distort the perspective of young women, who are generally the most vulnerable in society, cripple ambition and ruin relationships.

----------


## Bruno

> The driving force behind your girlfriends need to help the family with money etc, is also based on the Thai Buddhist mumbo jumbo.


Not doubting your word at all, but if this is so, I would really, really, like to get a hold of the Sanskrit passage to that affect and after it being translated find out how much of that has been distorted along the years.

I thought being Buddhist was to free oneself from all material possessions and worldly goods, including money!

----------


## ItsRobsLife

Theravada Buddhism is not very progressive. Beyond the saffron robes and gold paint it's very autocratic.

----------


## Bruno

Found this article on Buddhist philosophy, must dash, got a date with the driving range again!! 

_"The Anguttara Nikaya contains some valuable advice which the Buddha gave to young girls prior to their marriage. Realizing that there could be difficulties with the new in-laws, the girls were enjoined to give every respect to their mothers-in-law and fathers-in-law, serving them lovingly as their own parents. They were expected to honor and respect their husband's relatives and friends, thus creating a congenial and happy atmosphere in their new homes.

They were also advised to study and understand their husbands' natures, ascertain their activities, characters and temperaments, and to be useful and cooperative at all times in their new homes. They should be polite, kind and watchful of their husbands' earnings and see to it that all household expenditures were properly administered. The advice given by the Buddha more than twenty five centuries ago is still valid even today."_

_"There is no specific Buddhist ritual or procedure to conduct a marriage. Buddhism recognizes the traditions and cultures practiced by people in different countries. Hence, Buddhist religious ceremonies differ from one country to another.

In general practice, a religious service for blessing and to give advice to the couple is customarily performed either in the temple or at home to give a greater significance to the marriage. Nowadays, in many countries, besides the blessing service, religious organizations also have been given the authority to solemnize and register marriages together with the issuance of legal marriage certificates.

By and large, the most important point is that the couple should be utterly sincere in their intention to cooperate with and understand each other not only during times of happiness but also whenever they face difficulties"._

I might be going slightly off the topic here but nevertheless, it does make a good read...

----------


## hazz

> I am not so familiar with Thai culture as some of you out there might be but is this custom of becoming a 2 week trip normal? To me it doesn't ring true that paying out all that money for a pathetic 2 week trip to the temple is worth it - if he was going away for maybe 6 months or even a year I could understand the need for a send-off (if that is what this party is) but for 2 weeks and with him being a mere 10min ride away?!?


Whist I have known my better half two relatives have become monks, they did 3 months each. They are both based in and near bangkok and went to bangkok temples; no expensive parties, no whiprounds; just huge numbers of people turing up for the becoming a monk ceremony.

In both cases they became monk's in thanks for the, in one case miraculous, recovery of a close relative to some dangerous medical condition.

Its not uncommon for women to become nuns for a few days/weeks each year. But it appears its something men are supposed to do once and then stay or leave for ever.

Note, this is based on what I have seen, rather than any academic knowledge.

----------


## Krumble

> Originally Posted by Bruno
> 
> the Thai-chinese family announced they wanted to throw a big F***k off party in his honour and that she should contribute half - around 25k - towards the cost of this, which is next week.
> 
> 
> they want the party, they pay
> 
> nothing to do with anyone else


This makes good sense.  Thais opt out of "obligations" of this type every day of the week claiming rightly or wrongly they don't have the money. I have even seen people refuse to contribute for their parents' funeral but this one is purely elective, as parties for this occasion are not obligatory. It is up to the Thai-Chinese family to pay, if they want the party.  If they really took the brother in without a sin sod in order to benefit from his cheap unskilled labour, then they clearly know he is from a penniless Isaan family and don't expect anything.  They must have given up hope for their daughter anyway, if they decided they could not find a decent Chinese man with a bit of money behind him to marry her.  The whole story sounds rather weird and not very believable.   Most Chinese families would rather their daughter remain a spinster than end up married to an Isaan pauper.   If they were forced into this situation, they would not throw a big party for a son-in-law who failed to provide a dowry and anyway they would feel embarrassed about him and not want to parade him in front of their Chinese friends and relatives. 

Since you don't have spare cash, your decision is made easier, whether you believe this unlikely story or not.  You just do what Thais do and refuse to contribute on the grounds that you don't have the money and suggest that the Chinese family should pay, if they think the party is really necessary, or scale down the size of it to a level they can afford without dunning anyone else for money.  In fact it is quite likely that, if the party is taking place at all, they are intending to pay for it and haven't even asked for any cash from the awful MIL.   

It will be a tough test for the tgf but the chances are not good that she will be able to get away from her mother's spell, given the level of indoctrination that daughters are subjected to.  If the brain washing has been successful, her family will always be a priority over you.  You will just have to tough it out and see what's left after the dust has settled.  The mia noi thing doesn't sound too good.   Some mia noi see themselves as real wives and really love their man and have very sad lives waiting for the phone to ring.  Those who do it just for money are whores and will take the easy way out again in future, if they get the chance.  If the whole thing ends up pear shapes, you might just have dodged a bullet.

----------


## nidhogg

> It is quite funny but somewhere in these posts I distinctly remember one guy saying that "he would only become a monk for a few days",


I think I actually said 2 weeks, so not so far off.

Of course the real kicker on this is that the "merit" on this one, of the eldest son doing the temple stint actually accrues to- the mother!

Cool or what.

----------


## sabang

> is this custom of becoming a 2 week trip normal?


Yes, entirely normal. Most 'monkhoods' seem to be for a duration of 1- 3 weeks.
And it is quite normal to throw a big party for it. Much ado about nothing to us, but quite big in the Buddhist 'merit-making' scheme of things.

----------


## steven100

did you give granny a smack around the chops at the party like I told you to do ?  :ourrules:

----------


## GoodMyFarang

Ok, you have two options:

1. Make your girlfriends family to stop that BS and seperate her as much from her family (looks like a rip off to me)

2. Tell her to fuck off if she ask you one more for any money, she got a Job and she earn money, thats it...........

Whole story stinks a bit, but welcome to the club TIT

----------


## Bob63

> Originally Posted by Bruno
> 
> 
> It is quite funny but somewhere in these posts I distinctly remember one guy saying that "he would only become a monk for a few days",
> 
> 
> I think I actually said 2 weeks, so not so far off.
> 
> Of course the real kicker on this is that the "merit" on this one, of the eldest son doing the temple stint actually accrues to- the mother!
> ...


Just to say, Nidhogg, I think you are spot on in your posts. It is about finding the balance between respect for culture (like the 2 week stint actually has a deeper meaning) and not being ripped off by MILs who mistakenly believes all farang are ATMs.

----------


## Zone

> as you said bruno you have no experience on thai relationships,in thailand love and money go together as you have no money forget it,i have seen it all before you come here with limited funds and bullshit the girls,your living in a dreamworld not many survive without fnuk all so your best work and save for the next 15years and when you are ready come back there will be plenty of tgf,but dont forget what youve been told good luck,if you dont heed the advice given to you you will need more than luck.


 
WELL SAID,,, No money no honey..... :Smile:

----------


## Bruno

> WELL SAID,,, No money no honey.....


Indeed, but does this not speak volumes of the type of relationship you yourself are in if you are an advocate of taffyapple's previous comment?

Whilst it is fairly obvious that the consensus here is that money plays an important part in ones relationship here in Thailand in order for it to be a, can I say - success? It is a harsh price to pay for the want of a superficial relationship wouldn't you say?

I believe all women, foreign alike, are programmed at birth to secure stability in their life, and in choosing a male for a potential companion their brain goes into overload by analysing the worth of a particular man by a number of signals. It is subconsciously done, just the way men subconsciously look at a pretty girl - you could say these are primeval instincts, only more intuited with today's culture but the need is still always present in some form or another.  

Quite simply, If I thought that my tgf was in this relationship solely for the money (which there isn't any) and conformed to this ridiculous adage many of you simply accept that "no money, no honey" is the norm, then I not only pity 'your' circumstances here and the relationships you seem to have with your Thai partner but also have zero respect for you as men who have conformed to this blissfully ignorant way of life.  

For me,  I would rather be single and lead the life of a bachelor than wake up everyday knowing that my Thai partner would do a runner if the money ever run out and then say "no money, bye honey".  

There are some genuine women out there in Thailand, it is just a case of choosing carefully and taking your time with new relationships, and I do strongly believe this, even though I am a newbie. The MIL situation, well, for me, this is also new because back in the U.K. this kind of request rarely pops up as we view a request for money as a loss of face as oppose to the Thais' who see this as maybe some kind of right now that their daughter is dating a foreigner and he is obliged to help. 

"No money, no honey" you say? Then I say obtuse!

----------


## DrB0b

> the consensus here is that money plays an important part in ones relationship here in Thailand in order for it to be a, can I say - success?


That only tells you about the type of people replying to you.

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> Originally Posted by Bruno
> 
> the consensus here is that money plays an important part in ones relationship here in Thailand in order for it to be a, can I say - success?
> 
> 
> That only tells you about the type of people replying to you.


Do you think in the majority of farang/thai relationships that money is not an important factor?

----------


## DrB0b

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Bruno
> ...


I've no idea about the majority, how could I know about that? I don't believe anybody else knows either, of course that doesn't stop people making sweeping assumptions about something they couldn't possibly know about. It is, though, a common coping mechanism for people to convince themselves that the terrible thing that has happened to them also happens to the majority of other people - it's a way for people to absolve themselves of their mistakes.

Certainly in most of the Thai/farang relationships I know about money is of no more, and no less, importance than in a Thai/Thai or Farang/Farang relationship. I know a large number of Thai/Farang couples, in almost every case both of them contribute to the family income.

Yes, obviously there are a number of Thai/Farang relationships in which one of the partners is basically a paid companion, equally obviously there are a large number in which that is not the case. Neither you nor I, nor anybody else, is in a position to make any general statements on this. There might be a consensus among some posters on here that their partners are leeches, they have my pity for that, but there is no wider consensus. Some people are in genuinely loving, mutually supportive, relationships, some are not - that's really all anybody can say with any degree of certainty.

----------


## Carrabow

Oustanding! Dr. B

I have been very fortunate with my Mia, the family can be fun and frustrating in the same breath  :Smile:

----------


## albarb

> Here is my newbie input, I gave my TGF (38 yrs old) the readers digest of this post and she said that it is life in Thailand. As a Foreigner, whether you have money or not, YOU HAVE MONEY in their eyes. And if you want their daughter you are going to pay for it. She said a great portion(Especially up North) exploit this. She said this is why you can see a beautiful Thai women with a disgusting man. Its the money, its not that they really love them or will. She was curious why you would support the sex relationship with another man. 
> 
> Her summation was you are foreigner and that separating her from the family will not work. She said unlike most westerners, Thai's have deep seeded family roots and obligations and that westerners should not come over here and try to get Thai's to break them. I tend to agree. From my point of view, it is a common theme and from what I have read on numerous sites this appears to be the case. I also have a real case going right now with my US friend. He was told 500K bht Sinsot. He said NO, it has been all out war. Anyway we want our cake and eat it too and a lot get mesmerized with the beauty. I have witnessed over the last few years that city raised girls are little more westernized and are leaving some of the deep roots behind. Beware, a lot come to BKK to make money to send money back home. I will say this, the younger the girl and the further north you go, the greater this family angst will exists. 
> 
> In my case(sadly) my GF parents both passed away in separate events. She is survived by a wonderful sister and some cool aunts and uncles( I have not met them yet as my GF simply works all the time). She is a nurse at a major hospital.
> 
> As a guy to a guy I will offer this bit of input, Never ever "Force" a relationship. If you are suffering this anguish now you are probably in for a long haul. I say you cut your losses, tell her this is not the right thing to do to come between her, family and Thai cultural values and move on....
> 
> My comments from the cheap seats. Establish your future first, then date.


Very good reply and interesting suggestions from your Thai GF. Maybe this will help Bruno to understand the issues between Family & Daughters better.

----------


## Tubtaywun

> The property is safe, well, as well as it can be in LOS, and the suggestion to get her away from Thailand for a while is a very, very good one that was made earlier. I will seriously consider this but as everybody knows, money is tight


Best thing I did was bring my wife to my own country...she never settled here but did learn how it works and more important how hard I work to get the money. Word obviously got back coz everything changed after that time.

----------


## albarb

[quote=redbaron;was. And we'd been an "item" for some years.... just my 2 bob's worth...

OP.. I'd run.Or lay down the law. Something like my girl (at the time) told her family... "This guy's going to give me a better future than any Thai guy. Don't fuck things up by making ridiculous demands." They respected her for that.[/quote]

So, miracles do happen in LOS?

----------


## DrAndy

> Originally Posted by ItsRobsLife
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> ...


 
spot on 

It is a very common phenonemon for non-thinking people to make judgements based on their own limited experience

and maybe it is because they are not thinking very deeply, they are the ones who get the money problems with their partners

----------


## DrAndy

> The driving force behind your girlfriends need to help the family with money etc, is also based on the Thai Buddhist mumbo jumbo. If the daughter serves the family, or her husband, conscientiously her whole life, she will be fortunate in the afterlife and be reborn as a man.


That makes you wonder why girls in other Asian countries with other religions also feel exactly the same need

----------


## GoodMyFarang

whats most of time a real problem is that farangs not make clear what the acpect, I married long time to my wife, what I did and I can just advice everyon eof you to do it too.

After we married, I call her mother and father, bought them a nice dinner, and asked one of my Thai Lawer friends to join us, after dinner was over I told them very clear and direct in Thai 

--> I married your doughter, and exept the brige gift (30k THB) dont expect anything at any time from me, not ask for it or try to put my wife under pressure.

Additional to this I made a health Insurance for Mom and Father of my wife and pay it every year until dead, it cost not realy much money but it lift my status in family very high because I take care for it....

And in now 15 year it cost me every year 60k THB and so far not 1 Satang more.....................

Just make clear you will not give anything, if wife still with you you are on right way

Dont say, yes dirak I take care you, she understand I take care you and family, its normal here

GMF

----------


## Bob63

> Dont say, yes dirak I take care you, she understand I take care you and family, its normal here


Good advice

----------


## hazz

> Additional to this I made a health Insurance for Mom and Father of my wife and pay it every year until dead, it cost not realy much money but it lift my status in family very high because I take care for it....


Essentially you have admitted to reality that if something serious happens to her parents you are going to have to help out; its not like you say; I told them I wouldn't give them any more money, I don't care if they have cancer is it. And paying for this upfront with insurance is  very sensibility mitigating the risk.

Qudos

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> Originally Posted by ItsRobsLife
> 
> The driving force behind your girlfriends need to help the family with money etc, is also based on the Thai Buddhist mumbo jumbo. If the daughter serves the family, or her husband, conscientiously her whole life, she will be fortunate in the afterlife and be reborn as a man.
> 
> 
> That makes you wonder why girls in other Asian countries with other religions also feel exactly the same need


Let me re-phrase that for you.




> That makes _me_ wonder why girls in other Asian countries with other religions also feel exactly the same need

----------


## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by GoodMyFarang
> 
> Dont say, yes dirak I take care you, she understand I take care you and family, its normal here
> 
> 
> Good advice


Perhaps. What is _normal_ here is an instinctive familial extension. Something not enjoyed in Farangville, less understood.

----------


## DrB0b

> Perhaps. What is normal here is an instinctive familial extension. Something not enjoyed in Farangville


Then you have a very limited experience of relationships in the Western world. Certainly in most European and other "Western'  countries the extended family is of the utmost importance. The idea that westerners don't appreciate family relationships should be treated with the same contempt as the idea that all Jews are greedy, that blacks are stupid,  or that all Muslims are suicide bombers. It's just ignorant bigotry. You might have a chip on your shoulder about westerners but you need to remember that it's us Westerners who made sure that monster like Genghis Khan, Adolf Hitler, Tojo, and Stalin didn't rule the world. We died in our millions to stop them. Yes, we might be a little confused about the right thing to do but at least we worry about the right thing to do. If it wasn't for us ignorant westerners most of the rest of the world would be slaves, living at the whim of despots. The very fact that you are free to question western society is a product of western society. Care to criticise the Government of China, or the rulers of Malaysia, Singapore, or Thailand? Let's see how far that gets you! Yes, many ordinary Westerners might be ignorant savages but cumulatively our culture has civilized the world, individually we might be thugs but as a civilization we are head and shoulders above the dictatorial murdering savages that claim to offer any alternative.

----------


## taxexile

ive only read the initial post on this thread so i dont know how the story has panned out.

but if you want to really know the daughter, then study the mother.

----------


## Takeovers

> Yes, we might be a little confused about the right thing to do but at least we worry about the right thing to do.


Worth quoting.

----------


## Muadib

> Originally Posted by Rural Surin
> 
> Perhaps. What is normal here is an instinctive familial extension. Something not enjoyed in Farangville
> 
> 
> Then you have a very limited experience of relationships in the Western world. Certainly in most European and other "Western'  countries the extended family is of the utmost importance.


Sadly, this is not the case in the US anymore... 

Disclaimer: My anecdotal experience only...

----------


## DrB0b

> this is not the case in the US





> My anecdotal experience only


Do i really need to point out the logical flaw there :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## Loy Toy

> Then you have a very limited experience of relationships in the Western world. Certainly in most European and other "Western' countries the extended family is of the utmost importance. The idea that westerners don't appreciate family relationships should be treated with the same contempt as the idea that all Jews are greedy, that blacks are stupid, or that all Muslims are suicide bombers. It's just ignorant bigotry. You might have a chip on your shoulder about westerners but you need to remember that it's us Westerners who made sure that monster like Genghis Khan, Adolf Hitler, Tojo, and Stalin didn't rule the world. We died in our millions to stop them. Yes, we might be a little confused about the right thing to do but at least we worry about the right thing to do. If it wasn't for us ignorant westerners most of the rest of the world would be slaves, living at the whim of despots. The very fact that you are free to question western society is a product of western society. Care to criticise the Government of China, or the rulers of Malaysia, Singapore, or Thailand? Let's see how far that gets you! Yes, many ordinary Westerners might be ignorant savages but cumulatively our culture has civilized the world, individually we might be thugs but as a civilization we are head and shoulders above the dictatorial murdering savages that claim to offer any alternative.


Worth a read that one BOb.............

Great post.

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> our culture has civilized the world


I thought you were a Paddy?  :Confused:

----------


## larvidchr

^^ yes he has got a way with words our DrBob  :Smile:  :Smile:  makes you feel very good about being a "Westerner"

Western society's are very different though, yes it is true we care, but what we care about most is not always the same, in northern Europe generally family ties is maybe not as all important anymore, and family members do certainly not unconditionally get our support at all times, in southern Europe family has a much stronger place maybe due to the fact that religion plays a stronger role in southern European society's and certain traditions and economic factors, like sharing a multi generation family home and old age pension size.

The condition that no elderly parents in northern Europe is dependent on their grown up children's economic support is a contributing factor to the truth that family ties plays a somewhat lesser role in the fabric of society today. Children have for years not been conditioned to the task of supporting their parents in old age, and likewise parents do not have to put up with their grown up children if they turn out to be shitheads  :Wink:  and very good friends have become more important than say ants, uncles and cousins with whom you have nothing but a bit of blood in common.

But making up for it, is that we all seems to care more and more about our community and society as a whole, and tend to be willing to contribute greatly to shared community services and state benefits for the common good of all our countrymen.

There is undoubtedly even quite localized area differences, for-instance in Ireland where religion still plays a major role and recent long serious conflicts probably have caused family's to stay/pull close together, as compared to say southern England or Scandinavia, where family now is of lesser importance than before in earlier times, and religion is pushed way back in importance and significance. 

I used to live in southern Europe for a while and found the stronger family relations quite heartwarming compared to Scandinavia, likewise i find Thais devotion to their parents (those that really do) and their sense of obligation and respect something that we could do with a bit more of back home, without going overboard that is  :Wink:

----------


## nidhogg

> You might have a chip on your shoulder about westerners .


Nah - he is just a tool.

As noted elsewhere however, good post.

----------


## forreachingme

they want the party, they pay

nothing to do with anyone else


 :deadhorsebig: 

By Dr Bob post 53, good one!

----------


## Rural Surin

> Yes, we might be a little confused about the right thing to do but at least we worry about the right thing to do. If it wasn't for us ignorant westerners most of the rest of the world would be slaves, living at the whim of despots. The very fact that you are free to question western society is a product of western society.


You're very amusing sometimes Bob, in all your seriousness. :tosser1:  What a load.

----------


## hazz

^could you expand of why you feel this way?

----------


## DrAndy

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by ItsRobsLife
> ...


 
OK maybe it is "I" who wonder why you post such nonsense about the Thai religion when exactly the same set of circumstances occur with other religions in neighbouring countries

I can understand why someone with little knowledge may jump to incorrect conclusions, but not why they cannot address the real facts and learn a little rather than being nitpicking and pedantic

 :mid:

----------


## DrAndy

> Yes, many ordinary Westerners might be ignorant savages but cumulatively our culture has civilized the world


on the backs of the Greeks, Romans and Arabs

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> Yes, many ordinary Westerners might be ignorant savages but cumulatively our culture has civilized the world
> 
> 
> on the backs of the Greeks, Romans and Arabs


On the backs of Sumerians, African tribesmen, Neanderthals...

----------


## grasshopper

[quote=Bruno;1704764]


> The driving force behind your girlfriends need to help the family with money etc, is also based on the Thai Buddhist mumbo jumbo.
> 
> I thought being Buddhist was to free oneself from all material possessions and worldly goods, including money!


Naaah! Its "to free the falang from all material possessions and worldly goods, including especially money!

 :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> ...


On the backs of rickshaw wallahs from Calcutta, at least my pet retard can feel he has a place in history.

----------


## DrB0b

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> Yes, many ordinary Westerners might be ignorant savages but cumulatively our culture has civilized the world
> 
> 
> on the backs of the Greeks, Romans and Arabs


Greeks and Romans ARE our culture. The Arabs preserved their writings during the brief hiatus when we became christian barbarians, and then we, gratefully, asked for them back.

Andy, go read a history book.

----------


## DrB0b

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> ...


Well, if you want to get that stupid about we could say it's all on the backs (if they had backs) of blue-green algae.

----------


## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> ...


You could catch up on some of that history reading yourself, Bobby. ::chitown::

----------


## DrAndy

> The Arabs preserved their writings during the brief hiatus when we became christian barbarians,


that brief 500 years of stupendous scientific and cultural advances

I must have a different book to you

----------


## blue

Most of the advances were by Jewish folk ,either  forced to convert , or living amongst the Arabs 
you trying to say those finger wagging idiots we see on the news every night , used to be a smart race ?

----------


## Marmite the Dog

> I must have a different book to you


Probably. The Arab involvement in the progression of the sciences is very overrated and seems to be more about trying to garner a smidgeon of kudos to Islam than actually reporting fact.

The Caliphate used captured/enslaved 'gifted' Christians to do most of their thinking for them and it was when they started using local folks (placed there under the Eastern system of bribery & graft) to do this work that things started going down the shitter.

----------


## DrB0b

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> The Arabs preserved their writings during the brief hiatus when we became christian barbarians,
> 
> 
> that brief 500 years of stupendous scientific and cultural advances
> 
> I must have a different book to you


We're talking about totally different things. You're talking about Arab civilization, I'm merely talking about the fact that the Classics were preserved by the Arabs during the *European* dark ages. The "brief hiatus" I'm talking about is the *European* dark ages. That's all I'm talking about in that sentence, nothing more. I've absolutely no idea how you got the idea I was saying anything at all about Arab civilization.

However, now that you've totally misinterpreted what I said I guess this thread is going to turn into an Arab versus West thread, as if we didn't already have enough of those. What a pity  :Sad:

----------


## DrAndy

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> ...


 
as you can see, I was referring to the fact of the Muslim world civilising the us, rather than our culture civilising them, or the world

The main influence was probably in Berber Spain, although Egypt and Bagdad were also influential

I suppose it was you that changed the point?

----------


## Carrabow

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrAndy
> ...


 
I actually agree with you on this. Current events in the ME put shivers down my spine. If they ever figure out how to ban together instead of fight each other, we are in a world of hurt.

----------


## nidhogg

> I actually agree with you on this. Current events in the ME put shivers down my spine. If they ever figure out how to ban together instead of fight each other, we are in a world of hurt.


Fortunately the only thing most radical muslims hate worse than a western infidel - is another muslim fanatic from a different sect....

----------


## DrB0b

> I actually agree with you on this. Current events in the ME put shivers down my spine. If they ever figure  out how to ban together instead of fight each other, we are in a world  of hurt.


What did you actually agree with? This thread is turning into a game of Chinese whispers. Is there a vbulletin plugin that translates every post into whatever readers _want_ to see? If there is would some mod please activate it for my profile? It would dramatically reduce my stress levels :Smile:

----------


## Carrabow

> Originally Posted by Carrabow
> 
> I actually agree with you on this. Current events in the ME put shivers down my spine. If they ever figure out how to ban together instead of fight each other, we are in a world of hurt.
> 
> 
> What did you actually agree with? This thread is turning into a game of Chinese whispers. Is there a vbulletin plugin that translates every post into whatever readers _want_ to see?


*" was referring to the fact of the Muslim world civilising the us, rather than our culture civilising them, or the world"
*

Now, is this safe to agree with? :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## DrB0b

> " was referring to the fact of the Muslim world  civilising the us, rather than our culture civilising them, or the  world"


Right, and that inevitably leads to




> If they ever figure out how to ban together instead of fight each other, we are in a world of hurt.


if you're the kind of person who thinks an aluminium sombrero is not only a stylish but a useful fashion accessory :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 


Leaving your startling non-sequitur in the dustbin where it belongs, no, it's not that safe to agree with at all. It's not that simple. Cultures cross-fertilize each other. Anybody with any understanding of history can trace both Western and Arabic cultures all the way back to the fertile crescent. The hard part, or at least the part the cracker-barrel historians can't quite figure out, is tracing the evolution of civilisation from it's beginnings. It can't be expressed in a couple of cartoon pictures and a diagram so it's too complicated for them to grasp. It's safe to say that at the moment the nearest thing to a global culture is Western Culture as it's pervasive, that's not to say that it IS a global culture, just that through a combination of historical, military,  and cultural events it has a wider global impact than any other currently existing culture or civilisation. That western culture, while taking influences from many other cultures, has been distinctively Western for over 2,000 years and there is not a single place or person on this planet right now that has not been affected by it.

Hmm, you know what, I've just realised that I'm actually trying to make subtle historical, cultural, and anthropological points on teakdoor. My mistake. If you need me for anything else I'll be down the pub.

----------


## Carrabow

> ^No. It's not that safe to agree with at all. It's not that simple. Cultures cross-fertilize each other. Anybody with any understanding of history can trace both Western and Arabic cultures all the way back to the fertile crescent. The hard part, or at least the part the cracker-barrel historians can't quite figure out, is tracing the evolution of civilisation from it's beginnings. It can't be expressed in a couple of cartoon pictures and a diagram so it's too complicated for them to grasp. It's safe to say that at the moment the nearest thing to a global culture is Western Culture as it's pervasive, that's not to say that it IS a global culture, just that through a combination of historical, military, and cultural events it has a wider global impact than any other currently existing culture or civilisation. That western culture, while taking influences from many other cultures, has been distinctively Western for over 2,000 years and there is not a single place or person on this planet right now that has not been affected by it.
> 
> Hmm, you know what, I've just realised that I'm actually trying to make subtle historical, cultural, and anthropological points on teakdoor. My mistake. If you need me for anything else I'll be down the pub.


 
People need to look up a term called  *"Naskh"* is an theory in Islamic law and understands what its true meaning is. I could go on for days about this.

----------


## DrB0b

> I could go on for days about this.


That, at least, is as obvious as it is irrelevant to the thread.

----------


## Rural Surin

> Leaving your startling non-sequitur in the dustbin where it belongs, no, it's not that safe to agree with at all. It's not that simple. Cultures cross-fertilize each other. Anybody with any understanding of history can trace both Western and Arabic cultures all the way back to the fertile crescent. The hard part, or at least the part the cracker-barrel historians can't quite figure out, is tracing the evolution of civilisation from it's beginnings. It can't be expressed in a couple of cartoon pictures and a diagram so it's too complicated for them to grasp. It's safe to say that at the moment the nearest thing to a global culture is Western Culture as it's pervasive, that's not to say that it IS a global culture, just that through a combination of historical, military,  and cultural events it has a wider global impact than any other currently existing culture or civilisation. That western culture, while taking influences from many other cultures, has been distinctively Western for over 2,000 years and there is not a single place or person on this planet right now that has not been affected by it.


The diffusionist paradigm. Went to the Max Weber school of social theory, did you? Why shouldn't this surprise anyone?

----------


## astasinim

^
Sounds like some bollocks Obsidian would say. He was a twat too.

----------


## Rural Surin

> ^
> Sounds like some bollocks Obsidian would say. He was a twat too.


Certainly would be considered bollocks when not universally recognized. Consider the masses...as most are taken in, even conditioned instinctively, to regard social science disciplines by cultural-centric measures and models.

----------


## zeusbheld

> Hmm, you know what, I've just realised that I'm actually trying to make subtle historical, cultural, and anthropological points on teakdoor. My mistake. If you need me for anything else I'll be down the pub.


classic copout. 

yeh, ace, the audience is beneath you. THAT'S the problem.

guess you'll have to go publish in peer-reviewed journals (which i'm sure you've done plenty of already, judging by the penetrating insights you've posted).

----------


## DrB0b

^who the fuck are you, knobhead?

----------


## Carrabow

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> 
> Hmm, you know what, I've just realised that I'm actually trying to make subtle historical, cultural, and anthropological points on teakdoor. My mistake. If you need me for anything else I'll be down the pub.
> 
> 
> classic copout. 
> 
> yeh, ace, the audience is beneath you. THAT'S the problem.
> ...


You sure have a unique and tantalizing vernacular. Your syntax and phrasing tells me (if my crystal ball is working) you are from the east coast?

----------


## ItsRobsLife

> Hmm, you know what, I've just realised that I'm actually trying to make subtle historical, cultural, and anthropological points on teakdoor. My mistake. If you need me for anything else I'll be down the pub.


Cheers Bob  :smilie_clap:  Have a good one.

----------


## DrAndy

> Cultures cross-fertilize each other


only if they exist at the same time; I think we were referring to historical influences

----------


## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> Cultures cross-fertilize each other
> 
> 
> only if they exist at the same time; I think we were referring to historical influences


Yes. Historical fertilizer.

----------


## jamiejambos

Give her fuck-all mate,this is just a game that thais play when their daughter"s meet falang boy-friend,,,,,,,baht mak mak,be as tough as them and refuse every time they ask for money.they will soon get the message and leave you alone..and if your girl ditches you because of it....GOOD RIDDANCE.I am giving you sound advice after 12 years in thailand.just keep saying nik noi tang and mean it !!!!!!!!

----------


## DrB0b

> only if they exist at the same time


What? Like ancient Hebrew Culture and Christian Western Culture or ancient Greek Culture and Renaissance European culture?

----------


## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by DrAndy
> 
> only if they exist at the same time
> 
> 
> What? Like ancient Hebrew Culture and Christian Western Culture or ancient Greek Culture and Renaissance European culture?


...or ancient Chinese? :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## DrB0b

> Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrAndy
> ...


What, you mean those guys who invented paper and movable type but yet never quite managed to get to grips with the concept of books? No, I don't mean them. It would do you some good to become familiar with the idea of "Inclusive Cultures" and "Exclusive Cultures". 

If you want to take part in discussions like this you need to both learn something about what you're talking about and the ability to express yourself. You're very verbose in other threads yet on threads like this you seem to be only capable of making very short and very silly statements. The limit on TD posts is about 1,000 lines, if you have a point to to make there is nothing to stop you making it clearly and at length.

----------


## albarb

What happened...??? 

While the topic is a very interesting issue - the Laste few pages totally lost the subject matter...
Can somebody PLEASE bring this Thread back onto line??

----------


## OhOh

The requirements to add to the tread suddenly became difficults when DrBob demanded an understanding of "Inclusive Cultures" and "Exclusive Cultures" and a post of circa 10,000 words :Smile: 




> become familiar with the idea of "Inclusive Cultures" and "Exclusive Cultures"





> 1,000 lines, if you have a point to to make there is nothing to stop you making it clearly and at length

----------


## koman

> The requirements to add to the tread suddenly became difficults when DrBob demanded an understanding of "Inclusive Cultures" and "Exclusive Cultures" and a post of circa 10,000 words
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by DrB0b
> 
> ...


Only read back a couple of pages, but I think I understand what DrBob is getting at.

In thread after thread you get someone making a point; taking a stand and attempting to explain themselves.   Inevitably this is then blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never  really take a stand or make a point, but instead make every effort to undermine those that do.  It's unproductive and fucking annoying.  Usually the whole thread just gets bogged down and those with anything useful to contribute just move on.

We were dealing with a guy with a Thai wife/GF and a MIL trying to extract endless amounts of cash out of him.  Somehow,  Roman, Greek, Chinese and Arab cultures came into the plot......man this Thailand shit gets complicated at times.. :Smile:

----------


## sunsetter

> ^who the fuck are you, knobhead?


 
waahheeyy!!!  :Smile:

----------


## sunsetter

> blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never really take a stand or make a point, but instead make every effort to undermine those that do. It's unproductive and fucking annoying. Usually the whole thread just gets bogged down and those with anything useful to contribute just move on.


just like my post above? or in general like, just saying  :Smile:

----------


## sunsetter

everything that needs to be said about this matter has been said, then repeated over and over,he is going to get his pants pulled down or he is not, simple as that  :Die Thread:

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> Only read back a couple of pages, but I think I understand what DrBob is getting at.





> In thread after thread you get someone making a point; taking a stand and attempting to explain themselves. Inevitably this is then blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never really take a stand or make a point,





> We were dealing with a guy with a Thai wife/GF and a MIL trying to extract endless amounts of cash out of him. Somehow, Roman, Greek, Chinese and Arab cultures came into the plot......man this Thailand shit gets complicated at times.


That is due to people like yourself who add there own bits, without even reading the whole thread, making it even more confusing.

----------


## koman

> Originally Posted by koman
> 
> blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never really take a stand or make a point, but instead make every effort to undermine those that do. It's unproductive and fucking annoying. Usually the whole thread just gets bogged down and those with anything useful to contribute just move on.
> 
> 
> just like my post above? or in general like, just saying


Actually no, a one word post does not qualify as vapid...... :smiley laughing:

----------


## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by koman
> 
> Only read back a couple of pages, but I think I understand what DrBob is getting at.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


....*sigh* and then pretending they're connected with the original topic of the OP. Nonetheless, this can be a very common item - an initial theme that eventually becomes sidetracked. It is what it is.

----------


## koman

> Originally Posted by sabaii sabaii
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by koman
> ...


Actually ...I responded to the OP way back when this thread was still responding to the subject at hand.  I offered a small bit of advise for what it was worth...even got a bit of green,   I then came back today for a quick visit, and posted an opinion on the way things evolve on threads when the one line wonders eventually fuck it up with inane comments.   I believe my point is proven.  Now off you go and sniff some more glue... . . :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

----------


## sabaii sabaii

> 1,000 lines, if you have a point to to make there is nothing to stop you making it clearly and at length


[/quote]

Only read back a couple of pages, but I think I understand what DrBob is getting at.

In thread after thread you get someone making a point; taking a stand and attempting to explain themselves.   Inevitably this is then blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never  really take a stand or make a point, but instead make every effort to undermine those that do.  It's unproductive and fucking annoying.  Usually the whole thread just gets bogged down and those with anything useful to contribute just move on.

We were dealing with a guy with a Thai wife/GF and a MIL trying to extract endless amounts of cash out of him.  Somehow,  Roman, Greek, Chinese and Arab cultures came into the plot......man this Thailand shit gets complicated at times.. :Smile: [/quote]

Koman, He was asked ONCE for some money for a party.

You are saying you agree with 10,000 word posts, but you can't even be arsed to read through the "vapid one line posts" on this thread before adding your speculations

----------


## koman

> You are saying you agree with 10,000 word posts, but you can't even be arsed to read through the "vapid one line posts" on this thread before adding your speculations


I never said anything about agreeing to 10K word posts!!....and my comment about vapid one liners was meant as a general statement about how people with nothing to contribute insist on undermining the thread with vapid comments.  I specifically stated "thread after thread" which should be a clue that I was not just referring to this particular thread.    I simply expressed an opinion. I was not trying to start a pissing contest.   Carry on now....be as vapid as you like... :Smile:

----------


## DrAndy

> Only read back a couple of pages, but I think I understand what DrBob is getting at. In thread after thread you get someone making a point; taking a stand and attempting to explain themselves. Inevitably this is then blitzed with vapid one line posts from people who never really take a stand or make a point, but instead make every effort to undermine those that do. It's unproductive and fucking annoying. Usually the whole thread just gets bogged down and those with anything useful to contribute just move on. We were dealing with a guy with a Thai wife/GF and a MIL trying to extract endless amounts of cash out of him. Somehow, Roman, Greek, Chinese and Arab cultures came into the plot......man this Thailand shit gets complicated at times..


so you think posting vapid paragraphs is a better way to go?

make some contribution yourself instead of whingeing, if there is anything new to post on the topic

you sound more and more like Nobswife, but he flounced so you can't be

----------


## bellagrego

Seriously, Bruno. You are a novice in a tank full of seasoned sharks. Only time and experience will toughen you up to deal with this total thai bullshit. been there, done that and survived. You set the rules, you make the game, you support the gal. Take no garbage and believe no threats, simply don't give a fuck about her family or her tears. You, her direct needs and forget the rest. give one warning and then take a hike. There are one million waiting and wanting to take her place, without the drama. 
it's hard when you are pussy whipped and under the influence of TGF syndrome, but you can do it if you try. Give one inch and live in misery for all time in Thailand.

----------


## horet

:mid:


> So, after coming back from the dead, my tgf's brother has recovered from a serious case of blood poisoning which cost the family dearly as he never had medical insurance. Not the first time emergency funds have been accumulated to help him out - although blood poisoning is hardly his fault - but he once knocked of a motorcyclist in his car, whom, threatened to sue his ass unless he could come up with 250,000 baht pronto!
> 
> The tgf's mother gave took a loan out with the bank as collateral and my tgf worked in bkk to pay back this debt, taking up a mia-noi role with her thai boss in order to help pay back the bank whilst her brother - well I dont know what his was doing to help pay back his debt! Nevertheless, the debt was repaid (about which point I met her in Bkk for the first time) and never knew this story until recently.
> 
> Now, he is well and maybe karma is unkind to him, and decided to become a monk. He is married and works for his wife's mechanic shop for a paltry wage - they are Thai Chinese - and wavered the sinsod in order to procure his cheap services to the family business. My tgf's father died of liver abuse and left the mum on her own now for some time and the Thai-chinese family announced they wanted to throw a big F***k off party in his honour and that she should contribute half - around 25k - towards the cost of this, which is next week.
> 
> They know that her daughter is with me, yes a farang, and according to my tgf, they are really using this as an excuse just to see how rich or poor we really are as my tgf's mother rang her up stating that we have to pay 25k. 
> 
> Trouble is, I don't have it! I have gone back to University and what little money I do earn through my part-time job I divide amongst my needs and that of my other half's. Needless to say, it wasn't good enough for the mother in law and announced my tgf is no longer welcome back home as a result of a major loss of face.
> ...

----------


## Wayne Kerr

Man … my missus' family was just happy their gal had husband "laaw mak mak". Any money talk and I promptly fk off to one of my special places for a few weeks, gotta keep’em guessing about ya true intentions I reckon.

Good luck with the studies bro and the fun that lie ahead … 



 :sexy:

----------

