#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Teaching In Thailand >  >  why I have come to despise these loser, fake "educators"

## DJ Pat

I honestly think that Smeg has some kind of point.

I'm a TEFL-er myself and well proud of it. But, my origins of getting my TESOL certificate were quite accidental and unothordox. 

I got grade "A"s at my school in both GCSE English language and literature and also did very well on the communication side of it, I was very good at speaking and explaining stuff to the class, and revelled in my ego trip at being up there in front of a crowd talking and presenting my topic.

No, I didn't want to be some teacher I wanted to be a chef, and also scored a grade A in the Home Economics food course at the same school.

Anyway, in 1997 I had what some alcoholics refer to (and to quote Samuel L. Jackson in Pulp Fiction) as "a moment of clarity", and amidst my drunkeness and alcoholism of 1997 decided to return to the church our family had frequented when I was a kid.

At the church at the time they were well into 'community projects', and one of which was "teaching" basic english to the first wave of Kosovan refugees that had descended upon London and to enable their status to appear more geuine, many of these refugees enrolled at English classes in the evenings to appear more favourable to the Home Office who would be assesing wether they would be allowed what is known as "indefinite leave to remain", ie can stay in the UK forever as an immigrant and claim benefits.

Anyway the church, being the do-gooders that they are, drafted volunteers to go and teach basic english greetings to classfuls of these badly dressed refugees and I volunteered enthusiastically, hoping that I could get them writing stories about mysterious black cars and football heroes (my fave subjects as a kid). 

How naiive I was at 23.

The deal was that  you did the voluntary work, and in return they would send you each weekend to the Friends' (quakers) Meeting House in Euston Road to study a TESOL course, which was designed to help brush up on grammar and the finer points and qualities of being an english tutor. To me, the course was easy, the only part I found hard was the phonetic alphabet which to this day, I fucking hate explaining.

(I say 'tutor' because when I was a kid, part time teachers at school were reffered to by other teachers as 'tutors') 

Anyway, after almost four months I and several others came out with TESOL certificates to show we'd completed and passed the course, and this certificate, along with my City and Guilds in electrical installation and Radio studio course ended up in the box that also contained my swimming medals, football medals, GCSE certifiates and judo belts until 2002, when I was moving stuff out after my divorce.

I was totally unaware of the significance of a TEFL / TESOL certificate and what it meant until I travelled alone for the first time and realised that the course I had taken was worth over 500 quid and was recognised worldwide. 

I had seen some old ****s at the Central School of English in London I worked at after I did the course and wondered why this particular course appealed to such older types of men who appeared to be lonely, 40-something conversation-less anoraks.

My first choice was to go and do some teaching in Portugal as a mate of mine had a huge house there and I wanted some sun and sea after a gloomy marriage.

Anyway, after assessing my options, I ended up in Thailand for the first time alone without the chaperone of family of my ex-wife. 

The point being, that I constantly came across very badly dressed guys who were obviously teachers and many of the ones who I have had conversations with expressed their desire to "exist" as lomg as possible under the guise of being a "teacher" so they could enjoy their honeymoon life of staying in Thailand where many females are pretty and for a small cost, can relieve oneself whilst straddling over some useless whore from a bar for ten minutes.

Firstly I thought to myself, is sex that important that you would eke out an existence and live hand to mouth just to fulfill this desire? Then I told myself I was being naiive and that these guys must have savings or property to fall back on to be so cavalier in their attitude towards their "career". 

But no, I was being even more naiive. 

Then after some experience in Thailand teaching, which I will add that I was very lucky to get some really 'cushy numbers' that included being employed full time at a chemical factory in Samut Prakan, and working at a gold factory in Charoen Nakorn. 

I then realised that these guys wouldn't know a noun or a verb if it came up and kicked them in the teeth, and there I was working my bollox off while these clowns pissed it up night after night whilst doing their meaningless duties at ECC or some godforsaken Govt school where they were lauded as 'heroes' purely for having blonde or brown hair and being a native speaker. No certificates, no pre-prep, not an ounce of knowledge and not any ambition to actually educate.

I will say it again, I was well naiive, but I, like Smeg, have come to despise these losers who can exist as 'educators' while they themselves probably spent half of their education stahding outside the headteachers office for being disruptive wankers in class. 

Glad I've got that off my chest.

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## hillbilly

Probably for the first time I agree with DJ Pat. The reason? I have a MA-TESL along with a elementary certification.

I HATE fakes... :Smile:

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## thaibook

^ Definitely understand and completely agree with what you have said here.  Firstly, about the cost, I remember seeing a local university in Scotland charging more than 700 quid for students looking to receive a TESOL certificate.  Paying a little bit less in Thailand but with a similar degree, I decided to take a TESOL course.

Building on what you said, I met two people that struck my interest during my course.  One person took the course with me and the other had completed it within the previous month.  The person who took the course with me was not a native speaker of English.  That is not the problem I had, but when it came to learning and as the month progressed, I realised that this person's level of English was a great deal lower than I had expected.  I was suprised that someone who didn't have a strong grasp on English was able to complete and pass a TESOL course! I guess it is hard to charge people a bundle of money and fail them.  The other man, who completed the course and merely passed is now an English teacher.  I see him every night drinking and barely waking up the next morning to teach at school - without a doubt heavily hungover.

It is sad to see that people's intentions to come to Thailand and teach English are far from the teaching reasons but to have the ability to live in Thailand long term and pay for their alcohol.  I, too, must admit that I was naiive in thinking that there were a greater amount of people in Thailand teaching English for the right reasons.  Upon taking this TESOL course, I not only learned how to teach students but realised this problem.

Am I wrong in saying that in at least Bangkok based schools, it is getting harder to teach without certificates.  I know that elsewhere in Thailand there really is not too much need...

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## hillbilly

BTW, it took me 2 years to get a MA-TESL with an elementary certification.

I really dislike 1 month teachers. :kma: 

Truth is, they probably couldn't get a job where I work anyway. :Smile:

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

I saw myself as providing 'English conversation classes' - I didn't see myself as a lifelong 'educator'.

.......but you shouldn't get so worked up about it. You're making yourself upset unnecessarily.

And, yes you can get on a high horse about the nitelife - but, do you indulge? Only if you don't can you cast the first stone.

Your photos of the 'English teachers' in Topshop shoes were funny - but there seems to be some self-hate exercise afoot here.

Would you rather be in another profession?

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## hillbilly

But why do the 1-2 month trained ESL teachers seem to settle in Thailand? The answer is easy. Women, booze and or drugs... :Smile: 

Seen this happen way to many times.

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## obsidian

and you are married to a jamacan, hillbilly? while you are undoubtedly a better teacher, the moral conclusions ring hollow to me. in the end its just people fighting for a better spot in the food chain. fookin waste of time if you ask me.

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

^ So whats your bottom line here.

They should be sent home?
Teachers should pass an ongoing ethical probity test (lie detector) to maintain employment?

DJ Pat is preaching bland utopianism based on a set of correlated personal recollections.

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## Boon Mee

> But why do the 1-2 month trained ESL teachers seem to settle in Thailand? The answer is easy. Women, booze and or drugs...
> 
> Seen this happen way to many times.


Can't be talking about _quality_ TEFLer's like John Michael Karr are ya? :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## NickA

What is qualified? I have a degree in the subject which I teach, but I don't have an education degree or a PGCE (or other equivalent). Most teachers back in the UK do NOT have a degree in their subject, but do have a PGCE or education degree.

I am at the moment wondering if I can face a year or two back in the UK to get some qualifications....

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## thaibook

> I really dislike 1 month teachers.


No doubt you are much more "qualified" that the rest of the TESOL one month teachers.  But, in my opinion, there is a lot more to teaching than getting a degree/certificate.  The actual teaching and experience is just as important as learning how to do it.  More so, it is the teacher's personality which plays a large role.  Something that many "teachers" in Thailand fail in - experience, the want to teach and correct personality.

Also, despite what I said before, there are still those who are in Thailand for more than drugs, sex and/or alcohol - maybe not as many as I hope but there are those few!

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## hillbilly

NickA, you hit the nail on the head.

If you want to make the money here in Thailand, you must have a piece of paper stating such. No, it is not right. A degree don't mean shit, common sense wise, nor a good teacher.

But, if you want to make the money, it does. Not that different from the UK or USA.

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## thaibook

^ But weigh the prices...It is easy to go back to the UK/USA get a degree and pay a small fortune and then move to Thailand for what? You will be paying off the degree for ages.

With that said, I would not consider a teaching career in the USA/UK.  The reason being is that teachers are not looked highly upon there but, in my belief, they are looked much more highly upon in Thailand...

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## NickA

^not a degree, but a PGCE, which is only a year long and in the UK is paid for by the government (they even give you a bit of pocket money)... then maybe a years experience in an English school.

Another point - in general fully qualified teachers are unable to handle teaching in a Thai school - I've seen two 50+ year old lifelong American teachers who have thrown the towel in after only 1 term. Even if Thai schools paid the same money as international schools, most of the better teachers would still go to international schools because of the better organisation and greater will to educate.

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## hillbilly

The key is to make at least B100,000 per month. :Smile:

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## NickA

^or to work as little as possible (a la CMN)  :Smile:

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## thaibook

From talking to some other TESOL teachers, I have heard that you can get a teaching job (obviously a better one) with a TESOL degree and make 80-90K. Most make a lot less but these posts are available from time to time.

My mistake.

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## hillbilly

^ I have to apologize to thaibook. Maybe I hit the wrong button. I did not mean to nor did I want edit anything. Please resubmit and accept my apologies.

Regardless, I have never in my year or two in BKK ever seen such ESL positions. Take, that back. If one had a teaching credential and a top international school, was needy, well then maybe.

But if you can, good luck!

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## thaibook

^ No problem at all.  Not looking for a teaching job - just thought it be interesting to take the TESOL course.  Still have to deal with my own Uni studies first (not a teaching major though).  You and the others have made some good points though...

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## NickA

^I know ESL (or EFL) teachers who earn that kind of money by working two jobs or a lot of overtime, but not any that earn it by working normal hours.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Probably for the first time I agree with DJ Pat. The reason? I have a MA-TESL along with a elementary certification.


Wow! You must be the best teacher in the world. 

And you're right. ALL other 'teachers' are only here for cheap whores.

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## mad_dog

> I honestly think that Smeg has some kind of point.
> 
> I'm a TEFL-er myself and well proud of it. But, my origins of getting my TESOL certificate were quite accidental and unothordox. 
> 
> I got grade "A"s at my school in both GCSE English language and literature and also did very well on the communication side of it, I was very good at speaking and explaining stuff to the class, and revelled in my ego trip at being up there in front of a crowd talking and presenting my topic.
> 
> No, I didn't want to be some teacher I wanted to be a chef, and also scored a grade A in the Home Economics food course at the same school.
> 
> Anyway, in 1997 I had what some alcoholics refer to (and to quote Samuel L. Jackson in Pulp Fiction) as "a moment of clarity", and amidst my drunkeness and alcoholism of 1997 decided to return to the church our family had frequented when I was a kid.
> ...


 Fair enough. However it is a odd that someone like you that left school at 16 or so educates post graduate executives . Does the subject of your education ever come up? Do you tell the truth or lie like Bangkok Phil?

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## obsidian

^ what do you think?

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## mad_dog

> ^ what do you think?


 Well he's been honest about his level of education on the web... Shill has lied through his yellow teeth for years.

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## tuferguson

> From talking to some other TESOL teachers, I have heard that you can get a teaching job (obviously a better one) with a TESOL degree and make 80-90K. Most make a lot less but these posts are available from time to time.



the only folk who I know who make 80k+ a month are PGCE people.    Even then some of the "international" schools will only pay 50/60k.  Either that or you work like a nigger on private lessons after the first job which sort of destroys the whole lifestyle point of escaping the rat race in the west.

Just because 1 person wins big money on lottery tickets doesnt mean shit to the other 15 million.

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## thaibook

^ Hence the reason I said time to time the job opportunities come about.  I did not say that it happens all the time and the majority of teachers do only make 30k or so.

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## ChiangMai noon

> Wow! You must be the best teacher in the world.
> 
> And you're right. ALL other 'teachers' are only here for cheap whores


yes, snotting it over qualifications is cool but telling us you earn 100,000 a month at the very least shows genuine class.
 :Smile: 

sorry, i think i accidentally hit red.
 :Sad:

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## kayo

Ok Teacher, 

here's a question for you educated rodents: 

Why does this thread come up white  background with light blue toolbars, while evry other thread I've been on comes up dark blue background with light blue background?

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

> Ok Teacher, 
> 
> here's a question for you educated rodents: 
> 
> Why does this thread come up white  background with light blue toolbars, while evry other thread I've been on comes up dark blue background with light blue background?


Because this is the Teachers Forum, a strange and spooky place, and if you're not a teacher of English as a second language it will be to them as if you quite literally do not exist.

Thare be monsters in the woods

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## dirtydog

^^the page never loaded fully for you.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Why does this thread come up white background with light blue toolbars, while evry other thread I've been on comes up dark blue background with light blue background?


The Teacher's forum has the other skin set as the default one. Probably to make the Ajarners feel more at home.

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## dirtydog

^Huh, its dark blue for me, same as all the others.

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

Less morbid speculation.....

....more unrequited self-justification needed now......

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## DJ Pat

> Fair enough. However it is a odd that someone like you that left school at 16 or so educates post graduate executives . Does the subject of your education ever come up? Do you tell the truth or lie like Bangkok Phil?


 
To be honset with you, I do state on my teaching CV that I do have a degree, but I sure don't posess a fake one. 

I have never been asked to produce any paperwork of any kind as the half-Thai scenario tends to work in my favour and then throw them off.

Never had a problem.

And as for educating executives, I swot up, I read up, I know my politics and read the world news. I'm a history anorak too. I'm great at public speaking in front of people, and that stemmed from presenting stuff at corporate events, ie being a compere at big events too, of which I have a real, genuinely excellent record.

The subject of my education does pop up and I'm a good, confident talker. I've mixed in decent circles business wise in my other fields of work too. I just make sure I don't tell any white lies and leave myself exposed. 

I just make sure I don't get 'out of my depth' and I can hold my own.

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## mrsquirrel

> I am at the moment wondering if I can face a year or two back in the UK to get some qualifications....


Same same, but I don't know if I can do it. I might pay for it out of my own pocket and do it in OZ or NZ instead.

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## NickA

^I've heard of a few people doing it in Thailand, but I've never been able to find out where and how.

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## klongmaster

> the only folk who I know who make 80k+ a month are PGCE people. Even then some of the "international" schools will only pay 50/60k. Either that or you *work like a nigger* on private lessons after the first job which sort of destroys the whole lifestyle point of escaping the rat race in the west.


can you explain how a nigger works?




> ^Huh, its dark blue for me, same as all the others.


and for me...Marmers are you sure about your answer?



> The subject of my education does pop up and I'm a good, confident talker.


a bullshitter is what you really mean...okay well stated...

Pat: this is one of your better threads but I worry that it might come back and bite you in the arse some day...too much info on a public forum...



.

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## kingwilly

> Probably for the first time I agree with DJ Pat. The reason? I have a MA-TESL along with a elementary certification.
> 
> I HATE fakes...


are merkins allowd to drop the 'an' in front of words starting wiv vowels now?  :Razz:

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## Whiteshiva

Just out of curiosity - does anyone here teach anything else than English - such as math, history, economics, physics, etc?

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## ChiangMai noon

^
I think Nick is a Maths teacher.
quirrel too and amazingly KW, well they wouldn't allow him to teach English would they.

I'm a language consultant by the way.
 :rofl:

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## kingwilly

^ I think Squirrel teaches science, as do I.

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## bustak

I'm going to teach Gym & Thai.

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## NickA

> I think Nick is a Maths teacher.


In fact a general science teacher for the 11-14 and a physics teacher to anyone older. I s'pose I could teach maths, but I haven't so far.

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## DJ Pat

> a bullshitter is what you really mean...okay well stated...
> 
> Pat: this is one of your better threads but I worry that it might come back and bite you in the arse some day...too much info on a public forum...


 
Yes but I don't make up obvious bullshit. Bullshit will be believed when you can back it up with decent appearance, convincing banter, and knowing just what you are talking about. 

The many bleary eyed losers I see on the BTS in the mornings with a mouthful of clorets and baggy red eyes cannot and are not capable of this. They posess that sorry, down-ass, guilty, scuffy look about them. 
Add a Scouse or Brummie accent to that sad combo and they may as well be in a British prison uniform.

If you see me around town on my way to class, I look and dress not like a teacher. I have no satchel, no light blue shirts nor do I posess an ill-fitting trouser belt.

My shirts are ironed immaculately and my socks match my shoes colour. My shoes are dapper I could be a CEO at KFC or something (but I am not).

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## NickA

^So how do you know that some of the other well dressed people aren't teachers?

You assume that ill-dressed people are teachers and from that assumption create the inference that therefore all teachers are badly dressed, yet you admit that you are a teacher, but say that you don't dress like a teacher... which to me seems paradoxical and idiotic at the same time. :Smile:

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## sabang

I'm educated to Masters level, with two degree's and a diploma. I have no teaching qualifications- don't even know if I would need them.

But teaching English as a second language is surely not rocket science. No doubt my stuff would assist me if I was teaching business English, economics or something. But teaching a bunch of schoolkids basic conversational and written English surely does not require Chaucer like qualities.

I would have thought the ability to communicate to a group, teach by example (i.e. no Glaswegians) and no small degree of patience would be more important attributes than how many letters after your name.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## DJ Pat

> ^So how do you know that some of the other well dressed people aren't teachers?
> 
> You assume that ill-dressed people are teachers and from that assumption create the inference that therefore all teachers are badly dressed, yet you admit that you are a teacher, but say that you don't dress like a teacher... which to me seems paradoxical and idiotic at the same time.


 
Just some double standards that I have, we all suffer from them.

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## Whiteshiva

> The many bleary eyed losers I see on the BTS in the mornings with a mouthful of clorets and baggy red eyes cannot and are not capable of this. They posess that sorry, down-ass, guilty, scuffy look about them. 
> Add a Scouse or Brummie accent to that sad combo and they may as well be in a British prison uniform.
> 
> If you see me around town on my way to class, I look and dress not like a teacher. I have no satchel, no light blue shirts nor do I posess an ill-fitting trouser belt.
> 
> My shirts are ironed immaculately and my socks match my shoes colour. My shoes are dapper I could be a CEO at KFC or something (but I am not).


I am occasionally dead tired and red-eyed when going to work, thanks to having two small kids who occasionally wake up in the middle of the night.  I sometimes wear a blue shirt, and my trouser belt could probably be better fitted than it is.  I carry a small backpack and my shoes are not always spotless.  But then again, I studied engineering and finance rather than fashion, so I guess I am excused. :Smile: 

I could perhaps be mistaken for a whore-mongering English teacher, but I frankly my dear, don't really give a shit.  I am happily married family man with a good job at a major international company in Bangkok and on a rather generous expat package.

So be a bit careful of jumping to conclusions, Pat.  Looks can be very deceiving.  The "losers" could in fact be a lot more successful than yourself.

Oh yeah - while I have your attention:  The word "possess" is spelled with double "ss"s...... :Wink:

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## obsidian

> Yes but I don't make up obvious bullshit. Bullshit will be believed when you can back it up with decent appearance, convincing banter, and knowing just what you are talking about.


is this an example of what you mean? (cough)

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## DJ Pat

> I am occasionally dead tired and red-eyed when going to work, thanks to having two small kids who occasionally wake up in the middle of the night. 
> 
> I sometimes wear a blue shirt, and my trouser belt could probably be better fitted than it is. I carry a small backpack and my shoes are not always spotless. But then again, I studied engineering and finance rather than fashion, so I guess I am excused.
> 
> I could perhaps be mistaken for a whore-mongering English teacher, but I frankly my dear, don't really give a shit. I am happily married family man with a good job at a major international company in Bangkok and on a rather generous expat package.
> 
> So be a bit careful of jumping to conclusions, Pat. Looks can be very deceiving. The "losers" could in fact be a lot more successful than yourself.
> 
> Oh yeah - while I have your attention: The word "possess" is spelled with double "ss"s......


No, there is a difference.

Look and read between the lines before you attack me for stereotyping stereotypes.

There is an obvious difference. That look of "I wish I was elsewhere" and "What the hell am I doing here at this hour" are synonymous with TEFL-ing. 

If you've done it, then you'd know. 

A mans appearance can be scrutinised in many ways. Ask a successful man like yourself.

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## obsidian

> No, there is a difference. Look and read between the lines before you attack me for stereotyping stereotypes. There is an obvious difference. That look of "I wish I was elsewhere" and "What the hell am I doing here at this hour" are synonymous with TEFL-ing. If you've done it, then you'd know. A mans appearance can be scrutinised in many ways. Ask a successful man like yourself.


or is this an example of non-bullshit banter? my god.

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## Whiteshiva

> There is an obvious difference. That look of "I wish I was elsewhere" and "What the hell am I doing here at this hour" are synonymous with TEFL-ing.


I beg to differ - I keep asking myself both these questions from time to time. Believe me, I'd much rather be chilling out at some beach resort with the kids or spending a quite day at home than getting up at the break of dawn for another boring day at the office.




> [A mans appearance can be scrutinised in many ways. Ask a successful man like yourself.


 :Wink: 
I will only consider myself a successful man when I have enough money to stop working. 

But one thing I learned a long time ago is to be careful with judging people based on their appearances. You may be correct on many, perhaps even most occasions when you do so, but there will be times when you will have completely underestimated or misjudged the person before you. And that may cost you - your job, your reputation, you money or, since we are here in Thailand, perhaps even your life.

It is important to try to make a nice first impression when you meet people for the first time, but it is equally important to avoid making up your mind about people you have just seen or met before you know at least a tiny bit about them.

Who knows - perhaps these "losers" seeing you in the BTS have an equally low opinion about you - as in "who is this poofter with the arrogant attitude and the designer clothes"?  :Smile: 

So chill out, Pat - if they are truly "losers", shouldn't you then feel sorry for them for being so clueless, ignorant or poor, rather that taking the mickey out of them?

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

Whiteshiva: I agree.

Those who propound these notions are suffering from an inverted form of intellectual snobbery - derived from great misgivings about being in teaching when they feel they could be doing something else.

An 'if only' complex.

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## mad_dog

I've got a degree in International Relations (Bsc) and seeing as my job is basically the same as a kindergarten teacher in the UK ( I teach 6 year olds) I have higher qualifications than my counterparts in the UK. I'm planning to do a PGCE in September 08 or 09 my heart really isn't in it but seeing as I have 25 years of work ahead of me it seems like common sense. 

I like teaching and couldn't give a shit about what others think of my chosen occupation. Most of the negativity about teaching seems to be online from other teachers... They should Try getting a job at a private school that employs a high percentage of young, female teachers and no weirdo, fat, alcos with Pattaya live in hoes and I'm sure they would have better experiences.... However they probably can't becuase they are the fat paedo looking disheveled twats that half decent schools wouldn't touch with a barge pole.

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

^ You're clearly over-qualified. Isn't there some other profession that you'd like to pursue - you have 25 years of productivity ahead god-willing.

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## kingwilly

> Originally Posted by DJ Pat
> 
> 
> There is an obvious difference. That look of "I wish I was elsewhere" and "What the hell am I doing here at this hour" are synonymous with TEFL-ing. 
> 
> 
> I beg to differ - I keep asking myself both these questions from time to time. Believe me, I'd much rather be chilling out at some beach resort with the kids or spending a quite day at home than getting up at the break of dawn for another boring day at the office.
> 
> 
> ...


bladdy well said mate!

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## The Ghost Of The Moog

There's a massive sense of personal entitlement and elitism emanating from teachers who consider themselves to be the 'real deal' - when they compare themselves to those they perceive as dilettantes.

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## kingwilly

is there? 

i think DD stole Hillbilly's login - cos i aint even seen or heard him talk like this b4!

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## NickA

> I've got a degree in International Relations (Bsc) and seeing as my job is basically the same as a kindergarten teacher in the UK I have higher qualifications than my counterparts in the UK. I'm planning to do a PGCE in September 08 or 09 my heart really isn't in it but seeing as I have 25 years of work ahead of me it seems like common sense.


Me too, it'll be in '08 or '09, or maybe '10, or '11.... sometime anyway.

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## thaibook

> are merkins allowd to drop the 'an' in front of words starting wiv vowels now?


Sorry to say but that is a common misconception - this is not a legitamate rule.  You add a 'an' according to sound.  Too lazy to find an example online...

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## thaibook

> But teaching English as a second language is surely not rocket science. No doubt my stuff would assist me if I was teaching business English, economics or something. But teaching a bunch of schoolkids basic conversational and written English surely does not require Chaucer like qualities.


I, too, thought the same thing prior to taking a TESOL course.  Despite what I thought, I took the course with an open mind and picked up a lot of things that I had never even considered.  Some things, I must admit, was obvious in nature, but some other things on how to teach and why is quite essential for teachers to know and understand.  Just my opinion after taking a TESOL course.

Also, teaching business English is nearly the same as teaching any other English.  Most business English classes end up doing a lot less business related teaching than you would expect.  Just think of it like this - you go to work at the crack of dawn, work all day in a business somewhere and then go to a one to two hour class after work to learn the English version of what you have been doing all day? Doesn't work for most...

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## mad_dog

> ^ You're clearly over-qualified. Isn't there some other profession that you'd like to pursue - you have 25 years of productivity ahead god-willing.


 Sorry... I am 26 so I could have 39 years of work ahead of me ... But I also have two  inheritances coming my way so probably wont drag on past 55 or so. 


NickA... I'm serious I'm going to apply this October when I am in the Uk. It is just the thought of teaching fat chav kids for two years which frightens me.

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## NickA

^I'm serious too, but also seriously lazy... the long term benefits will be great, but the short term messing up of my rather pleasant and relaxed life here is too great a price to pay!

I'm waiting to get sacked or deported to force me to do it.

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## kayo

i used to teach maths in kanchanburi, a few years back.

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## mad_dog

> ^I'm serious too, but also seriously lazy... the long term benefits will be great, but the short term messing up of my rather pleasant and relaxed life here is too great a price to pay!
> 
> I'm waiting to get sacked or deported to force me to do it.


 Yeah I know exactly how you feel. You just need to bare in mind that if you get over the age of 35 the government just aint going to train you to be a teacher (in the UK at least)

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## Roc

Loads of fake teachers here in Ayutthaya.....whoops!! :Smile:

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## NickA

> Yeah I know exactly how you feel. You just need to bare in mind that if you get over the age of 35 the government just aint going to train you to be a teacher (in the UK at least)


Not sure if that's true, but I'm only 30 so I've got a few years left anyway.

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## mad_dog

> Originally Posted by mad_dog
> 
> Yeah I know exactly how you feel. You just need to bare in mind that if you get over the age of 35 the government just aint going to train you to be a teacher (in the UK at least)
> 
> 
> Not sure if that's true, but I'm only 30 so I've got a few years left anyway.


 I'm was guessing but really but after 40 I am fairly certain the government wouldn't stump up the cash to train you.

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## corvettelover

Dj is this you second attempt to stay off the piss. Hows that going by the wayn ?   sorry didnt mean to hi jack

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## DJ Pat

> Dj is this you second attempt to stay off the piss. Hows that going by the wayn ? sorry didnt mean to hi jack


First attempt thanks, almost 6 weeks dry.

Also just got an job once each thurs evening taking the fitness class for a football team, increasing stamina exercises and strength work, ie running and stretching then floor exercises (sit ups, push ups etc) and a warm down.

And I also provide a diet recommendations leaflet for them.

Money for old rope, and I don't have a sports science degree.

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## MagicLeaves

> My shoes are dapper I could be a CEO at KFC or something (but I am not).


glad to see you aspire to such heights

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## DJ Pat

> Originally Posted by DJ Pat
> 
> My shoes are dapper I could be a CEO at KFC or something (but I am not).
> 
> 
> glad to see you aspire to such heights


 
Gotta have standards haven't we? 

Kilmarnock Football Club are currently 6th in the Scottish Premier League.

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## Fast Eddie

> I'm was guessing but really but after 40 I am fairly certain the government wouldn't stump up the cash to train you.


 
They will do, they're desperate. I'm not sure what the cut off point is, but i've met a guy who was nearer to 50 and doing a PGCE in the U.K.

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## robin

Is it really so easy to get a TEFL cert. there?

I teach languages in Germany and I'd get work nowhere if I hadn't completed advanced diploma studies.

Admittedly, it's quite a different field, I teach translation and interpreting to adult advanced students  - but a TEFL certificate for a month's course?

What can you learn about teaching in a month?

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## Marmite the Dog

> What can you learn about teaching in a month?


A fair amount actually. It's certainly better than going in blind.

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## BigRed

> What can you learn about teaching in a month?


Enough to bullshit your way into a job and have some idea what a lesson plan is. After that it's all learning on the job.

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## kingwilly

> Originally Posted by kingwillyhggtb
> 
> are merkins allowd to drop the 'an' in front of words starting wiv vowels now?
> 
> 
> Sorry to say but that is a common misconception - this is not a legitamate rule.  You add a 'an' according to sound.  Too lazy to find an example online...


huh? wot u saying ? that not all words starting with a vowel have to have an in front of them?? :Confused:

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## Sir Burr

> [ I sometimes wear a blue shirt, and my trouser belt could probably be better fitted than it is. I carry a small backpack and my shoes are not always spotless. But then again, I studied engineering and finance rather than fashion, so I guess I am excused.


I'm lucky enough to be able to wear shorts, T-shirt and thongs at work.

Now I've got that off my chest, I'll bugger off........

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## Frankenstein

> Originally Posted by thaibook
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by kingwillyhggtb
> ...


Example: 'a user', not 'an user'. Why? 

Because the first actual sound of 'user' is not a vowel, even though the letter 'u' is a vowel.

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## kingwilly

^ oh ok. absolutely right. i stand corrected.

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## IsaanAlex

Good post Pat, for the most part.

The "real people" element of the stories on some message boards make them far more interesting than curling up to a good book for me.

I'd like to hear how some others got into TEFLING.

I also don't despise bottmfeeding teachers; there is obviously a niche for them, and they are easily getting as "used" by the Thais as "using".

The Thais aren't much into charity last I  checked...

IA

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## DJ Pat

> there is obviously a niche for them, and they are easily getting as "used" by the Thais as "using".


 
They could at least learn to dress properly in a decent shirt and trousers and shoes couldn't they?

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## Marmite the Dog

> They could at least learn to dress properly in a decent shirt and trousers and shoes couldn't they?


Agreed. Decent clothes makes one a much better teacher. In fact, I would say it's more important than having a degree or being able to communicate with your students and instil confidence in them so they are more comfortable using English.

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## IsaanAlex

*DJ Pat wrote:*



> They could at least learn to dress properly in a decent shirt and trousers and shoes couldn't they?


Hmm...

ECC in Khon Kaen had me blocked for a 3 hour class one Sunday. I showed up...but no students did. They "informed" me that I would get paid for *1* hour (even though I knew the students prepaid and wouldn't get a make-up class).

That one hour made me about 230 baht. For that I...

(a) stayed in on a Saturday night.
(b) Woke early on a Sunday.
(c) Took my gas and my time to commute (roundtrip)...
(d) had my wife prepare my "proper" teaching gear, etc,etc.

And they fuck me off with 230 baht???

The next time I showed up I was in flip-flops, shorts, and a loud Hawaiian-style shirt.

That's the type of teacher they paid for, that's the...*type of teacher they got.*

IA

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## Texpat

^
One beer at Suzy Wong's = 145 B
Two chicken sandwich dinners at KFC = 190 B
8.5 liters of diesel or 98 kilometers in my truck = 230 B
Six days of UBC Gold = 224 B

Ummmmmm, no thanks.

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## Marmite the Dog

> One beer at Suzy Wong's = 145 B


You're shitting me! 145 Baht for a small beer on Cowboy?!

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## kingwilly

says the teacher!  :rofl:

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