#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Doing Things Legally >  >  Criminal Defense Lawyer - Petchabun

## johnbkk

Anyone know of a decent criminal defense lawyer in Petchabun?  English language ability not necessary.

I don't want to go into the whole story right now, but...

Friend was driving a truck and had a collision with a motorbike.  Truck was old so no first class insurance.  Friend was not drunk.  Situation is unfortunately quite serious.

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## david44

The embassy has the up to date  list
One caveat after many dealings with lawyers they are not always honest.
If necessary I'd go by personal recommendation from a trusted friend.

Sorry I am not near that area I think we;ve had posts from there.

Irish Embassy  Tel : 02 016 1360
UK 02 305 8333.

USA U.S. Embassy Bangkok
95 Wireless Road
Bangkok 10330, Thailand
Tel: +66-2-205-4000

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## Chittychangchang

NCA Claim Law Office are Lawyers in Phetchabun, Thailand. Contact NCA Claim Law Office directly on 084-488 2722 or meet them at 29, Moo 13, Samakkeechai Road, Tambon Thaphon, Amphoe Muang Phetchabun, Phetchabun, 67250, Phetchabun, for your all Lawyers enquiries.

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## johnbkk

Thanks guys.  Chitty - I missed that office in my google search.  I take it you haven't used them though?

I've jotted down the number but like David mentioned, it's great to get a personal recommendation.  I've used a few lawyers in TH and it's rather hit and miss, to say the least.

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## Chittychangchang

> I take it you haven't used them though?


No, thankfully :Smile:

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## Neverna

Has your friend been charged with a crime? 

I expect the outcome of this will revolve around negotiations for a compensation payment to the motorcyclist or his family.

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## thaimeme

Shopping for a decent and upstanding attorney, for one's needs, shouldn't be limited to a particular province.....

I do have to wonder if some have the ability to think logically at all.

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## johnbkk

> Has your friend been charged with a crime? 
> 
> I expect the outcome of this will revolve around negotiations for a compensation payment to the motorcyclist or his family.


I might as well discuss.

Apparently an elderly woman on a motorbike hit the back of his truck at an intersection.  Sounds to be me like he's as innocent as he insists he is.  

The old woman's family apparently populates that intersection.  It very much is their home turf.

Pooyai baan claims the camera that was pointed at the intersection is broken.  

One witness has stepped forward to support my friend's story.  Cops say he needs three.  Others at the scene supported his story but said they wouldn't go on record with that as they have to work and live around there.

Doesn't appear that the other side has any witnesses.

No charges yet.  Cops are still trying to get him to accept blame and then start the negotiation process with the family.

The family showed up today.  The 40ish daughter went directly into how she needs a big payout.

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## crackerjack101

> an elderly woman on a motorbike hit the back of his truck at an intersection


Is she dead or just injured?

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## Neverna

If she hit the back of his truck, it's almost certainly her fault. Are there dents in the pick up truck from the accident? If so, perhaps your friend should seek compensation from the woman's family to pay for the repairs.

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## Ratchaburi

Best thing is you have no money give them the truck.
That it

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## johnbkk

> Shopping for a decent and upstanding attorney, for one's needs, shouldn't be limited to a particular province.....
> 
> I do have to wonder if some have the ability to think logically at all.


Jeff, you are an ass and an idiot.  Please disinvite yourself from my thread.

I've sent a lawyer up from BKK.  However, if you knew anything about life, you'd realize that local connections are paramount in a case like this.  You'd also realize that paying an attorney to travel hundreds of km to another province for multiple appearances will run the bill up massively for likely mediocre results.  Connections, Jeff.  Stop drinking, go outside, learn about Thailand.

*At least work on the first part.  From your aphasic speech patterns it does seem likely you have pickled your brain.

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## johnbkk

> If she hit the back of his truck, it's almost certainly her fault. Are there dents in the pick up truck from the accident? If so, perhaps your friend should seek compensation from the woman's family to pay for the repairs.


Basically a scuff mark on the back of the truck. 

My understanding is that she clipped the bumper and must have gripped the throttle after that as she went careening on for a few meters before she came off the bike.

I'll admit I can't fully picture the physics of what happened.  But the fact everyone seems to agree on is that she did hit the back of the truck.

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## johnbkk

> Best thing is you have no money give them the truck.
> That it


Good advice, if it comes to that.  It's possible he will want to 'retire' from driving anyway.  He's getting up in years.

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## jamescollister

Mountain and mole hill comes to mind, first woman has to take him to court, civil matter.
Second, if the truck had an up to date registration/road tax that covesr some medical costs.
If her M/C was registered, it's got, I think 50,000 medical coverage, so they are just trying it on.

If the guy lives local, bit of face money, if not, f off, no police charge, no case.

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## johnbkk

> Mountain and mole hill comes to mind, first woman has to take him to court, civil matter.
> Second, if the truck had an up to date registration/road tax that covesr some medical costs.
> If her M/C was registered, it's got, I think 50,000 medical coverage, so they are just trying it on.
> 
> If the guy lives local, bit of face money, if not, f off, no police charge, no case.


I hear what you're saying.  You're right about the gov insurance and in  the case of a minor accident, one party can agree to be guilty enabling  the other party to get the maximum payout (if necessary) and that  usually covers it.  A bit added on top, perhaps, to say 'sorry'.

But this was not a minor accident.

First  of all, causing injury by vehicle is a criminal offense.  If the police  decide you were at fault, and you do not agree, you go to court on the  criminal charge.  The civil case is brought separately.

You can  head off both by agreeing to be at fault and offering compensation (from  you or ins.).  If the other side is satisfied then generally that can  be end of it.  Often you plead to a relatively minor traffic violation  and there's no issues going forward.  

My friend needs someone to  advocate for him and show the flag so they don't try to railroad him,  which is what it looks like right now with pooyais trooping to the  police station for chitchats, etc.

Sending the lawyer up there  seems to have curtailed some of the obnoxious behavior of yesterday.   But my experience with BKK lawyers in the provinces is that they wear a  nice lawyer suit, play the role well, but at the end of the day you'd  rather have someone who's plugged in locally and a bit of a fixer. 

Ideally,  that's someone who says 'I know those guys' when you mention which  police station the case is at.  I had a lawyer in CM years back who was  like that, some kind of super ajarn at one of the local unis, and using  him was miles better than bringing three suits up from Bangkok.

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## Mr Earl

If someone hits the rear of your vehicle, it is thier fault. 

Sounds like a case where the geezer who ran into the truck is trying to capitalize on the "farang in the way" so his fault scenario. 
But the police unless owned by the geezer aren't going to fuck with it

Legaly if no charges are brought against your friend, for reckless driving or whatever. The unfortunate injured party can go suck khlong water.


Tell you friend to take a holiday and keep his head down, it is Issan and it will pass.

Unlike Issan, the south if something like that happens it can and does get ugly....Southern Thai are sometimes very fucked up. I've learned that the hard way.

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## taxexile

> If someone hits the rear of your vehicle, it is thier fault.


in a country with a functioning legal system maybe, but in countries where corruption, nepotism and vested interests rule i think justice depends on who your brother in law knows and little else.

the uninsured drug dealing driver of the stolen truck was obviously in a drunken state when he heartlessly and with malice aforethought reversed his truck at full speed over the hapless old lady as she was innocently waiting at the junction.

next case please.

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## Topper

> in a country with a functioning legal system maybe, but in countries where corruption, nepotism and vested interests rule i think justice depends on who your brother in law knows and little else.


I couldn't agree more.

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## thaimeme

> If someone hits the rear of your vehicle, it is thier fault.
> 			
> 		
> 
> in a country with a functioning legal system maybe, but in countries where corruption, nepotism and vested interests rule i think justice depends on who your brother in law knows and little else.
> 
> the uninsured drug dealing driver of the stolen truck was obviously in a drunken state when he heartlessly and with malice aforethought reversed his truck at full speed over the hapless old lady as she was innocently waiting at the junction.
> 
> next case please.


 
Well stated.....even though there might be variables in every situation.

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## Topper

> Well stated.....even though there might be variables in every situation.


There's variables in ANY situation.  Jeff, please don't post stupid shit.  I know you're smarter than that.

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## kingwilly

> Jeff, please don't post stupid shit. I know you're smarter than that.


lol. treating Jeff like he is a growned up adult. 

 ::doglol:: 

good luck with that.

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## jamescollister

> in a country with a functioning legal system maybe, but in countries where corruption, nepotism and vested interests rule i think justice depends on who your brother in law knows and little else.


Not true, no to bit cop, village boss, local governor tells a judge what to do.
The appeals system means oversight by higher courts, you will never hear of cops, village heads etc going for the money when an insurance company is involved.

Local deals are all about not getting involved with the legal system.

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## Mr Earl

> Originally Posted by taxexile
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 			
> 				If someone hits the rear of your vehicle, it is thier fault.
> ...


Indeed Thailand is a bit of a melange of legal bureaucracy. For the most part it is the western "innocent till proven guilty" premise.
But as most of us long timers here have seen they can easily revert to ass backwards French system of "guilty till proved innocent".
Both of which are largely  convoluted with the presence of money.

But I reckon arguably a better system than say Cambodia or India, where the guilty are often beaten to death on the spot.

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## Mundi

I ended up in the same situation late last year in Nakhonsawan. 19 year old uni kid ended up with his hip smashed and right leg broken in two places. No lawyers but both parties had advocates who did the negotiations. They wanted 200,000 baht, we offered 20,000 and stuck to our guns. In the end the advocates agreed to the 20K, and convinced the boys family to accept the deal. I went to pay the next day and the boy's father tried to renege and wanted the 200,000. His advocate was furious with him for embarrassing her, took him aside, made him sign the agreement and kindly thanked us for the 20,000.

The police were very helpful throughout and really only wanted both parties to reach an agreement without going to court, though they did emphasise to my wife how serious the situation could have been.

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## crackerjack101

> I ended up in the same situation late last year in Nakhonsawan. 19 year old uni kid ended up with his hip smashed and right leg broken in two places. No lawyers but both parties had advocates who did the negotiations. They wanted 200,000 baht, we offered 20,000 and stuck to our guns. In the end the advocates agreed to the 20K, and convinced the boys family to accept the deal. I went to pay the next day and the boy's father tried to renege and wanted the 200,000. His advocate was furious with him for embarrassing her, took him aside, made him sign the agreement and kindly thanked us for the 20,000.
> 
> The police were very helpful throughout and really only wanted both parties to reach an agreement without going to court, though they did emphasise to my wife how serious the situation could have been.


But were you at fault, in your opinion?

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## kingwilly

Don't have to be at fault.

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## crackerjack101

> Don't have to be at fault.


No, I know I just wanted his opinion.

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## pickel

Why didn't the OP's "friend" call the insurance company when the accident happened. They would have sent somebody with his interests in mind, and also capable of "monkey speak"?

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## Mr Earl

Actually from the description of the accident, the pickup driver should be seeking recompence from the motorbike rider.

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## Norton

> Why didn't the OP's "friend" call the insurance company when the accident happened.


Bingo! We have a winner. May be to late but call them now anyway.

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## johnbkk

> Why didn't the OP's "friend" call the insurance company when the accident happened. They would have sent somebody with his interests in mind, and also capable of "monkey speak"?


The truck is ancient.  All he had on it was the government insurance.  

Whether that was his only option, I don't know.  You won't get 1st class insurance on an old beater like that but I would have thought some supplementary liability coverage would be available.

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## Mundi

Yes I do believe that I would be considered at fault.

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## johnbkk

> Yes I do believe that I would be considered at fault.


Thanks for sharing your experience.  Do you know what your insurance paid in addition to that?

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## Mundi

Sorry for the delay in replying.
They paid the hospital bills only. 
The family took him straight to a private hospital with expectations that there would be a farang coverage.
We did have first class insurance which helped. My wife and the advocates warned them not to  exploit the situation. Strange thing was the step-father was a bank manager who should have known better.
In your friends situation,  I would suggest a few pointers;
 Notify the embassy. They won't much help for me but it provided a degree of comfort.
 If this happened in his home town, then let as many people know as possible; it is amazing how quickly the rumour network works in a town.
 Treat the police with respect. They have a job to do. Next time you are in the local police station, look at the customers they deal with on a daily basis.
Above all else, trust his partner.

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