#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Doing Things Legally >  >  So you want to own property in Thailand?

## William

An article I have written for my fellow members to chew over and flame me for:




> *So you want to own property in Thailand?*
> 
> _* Note: the following is intend only to provide the reader with an overview of the issues that need to be considered when buying property (read "land") in Thailand; it is not intended to be a comprehensive guide, nor is it intended to constitute legal advice. In the event that you are contemplating buying property in Thailand, it is strongly recommended you seek the advice of a reputable lawyer in Thailand._
> 
> At some point or another, nearly every foreigner who makes the decision to live in Thailand long-term will consider whether or not to buy property here. However, unlike [likely] the case in their home country, a quick search of Google will show that purchasing property in Thailand is nothing if not fraught with risk. The following is intended as a brief Guide providing an overview of the issues at-hand for just such a group of foreigners.
> 
> *Section 86 of the Land Code*
> In effect, Section 86 of the Land Code 1954 ("*Land Code*") places a general prohibition on foreigners owning land in Thailand by providing, inter alia, that:
> 
> ...

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## kenkannif

As always William....you're bloody brilliant (and thanks for the help yesterday mate!).

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## Fabian

William, as a farang heir to a thai wife, how likely is it to get a permission under section 93 of the land code from the minister of the interior?

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## ChiangMai noon

why fabian are you dragging up these old threads?

are you thinking of knocking your wife off?

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## Fabian

No, CMN, she did not have any land because it's in my stepson's name. There just was a question on a german forum about this issue.

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## William

Fabian:

In all honesty, I think it would be remote.  However, you would still have he right to seel the land if permission were not given - something you could not necessarily do if you were not the named beneficiary

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## Smeg

It needs updating due to the new analysis made of the shareholder status of companies set up for land ownership purposes.

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## Fabian

Thanks, William, but what do you mean by "seel"?

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## William

sorry Fabian, should read "sell"

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## William

> It needs updating due to the new analysis made of the shareholder status of companies set up for land ownership purposes.


provided you can show that the shareholder is a "genuine" shareholder and not a "nominee" shareholder, then the fundamentals hold true.

However, I would be the first to agree, this is probably not the best time to be using a ThaiCo to purchase land in Thailand

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## Spin

William, I became aware of this website the other day.

I think it's the best out there, and no I dont have anything to do with it!

Independent legal Internet Website - Property law, foreign land ownership. Koh Samui, Thailand

It's pretty relevant to everywhere in Thailand and not just Samui, the owners dont seem to be selling anything and they really have worked hard to bring all that info into one place, I dont think they cntrl+c 'ed any of it!

What do you reckon?

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## William

I'll look at it, but whoever owns it best take down the Garuda symbol, as it's illegal to use this unless you have been award it. It's a little like getting the Queen's Award for export.

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## Spin

I just noticed the link to the list of Bangkok law firms on the homepage. I did not see that before. So they are painting the situation in dim light to drum up business for legal firms that pay for a link on the website?

They state this:

"To verify any legal information supplied in this website one should consult a reputable law firm in Bangkok without interest in the property market"

and the link take you to a list of Real Estate related BKK lawyers?

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## Fabian

Ah, now I understand. So you mean, if the farang is the beneficiary (or however that is spelt), he does not lose the money anyway?

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## William

^well Fabian, he may lose some money as a result of having to do a "fire sale" (minimum 180 days maximum 1 year), but it'll be a lot less than he would otherwise have lost

EDIT - he might also be able to arrange a sale to a friendly 3rd. party

Also, with luck, he may even get to keep the place

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## cheeryble

I have made some conclusions about "buying" land here. Hope they may help.

1. Do not use a company unless you actually have a "real" reason to have one.

2. Generally, use a lease. 

3. Do not try to tie your nominee up in legal knots that you think will keep you safe. It may only antagonise them and they are not safe.

4. Rather, take pains to find the right nominee and make a pretty simple lease deal with them for 30 years. Add the extra 30 years even of it may not hold up. If you really want you could add a loan agreement. DO NOT make anything onerous or scary for them, it's not nice. Be willing to err on the loss side in the event of a loan agreement.

5. Do not choose a nominee who asks for payment. Rather, buy them a meaningful present in appreciation.

6. Tell them up front that you require very little from them apart from an hour if you sell or subdivide, but one thing you require is that they renew the 30 year agreement completely every, say 5 or 10 years. It may require a bit of tax to be paid. 
In the event of a turncoat nominee you will know 25 years before any possible eviction. The Thai mentality will not risk a definite modest payment now for possible benefit if they win the court case about validity of the extra 30 years in 25 years time.

6. If you pick the right people with social connections to you, and remember the renewals, you'll probably have no problem at all.

7. This one may be a brainfart or a sign of truly great deviousness. It has occurred to me that it may be possible to include rights to sell the earth from the land in the lease price. In many areas such as outside CM the dirt is worth about the same for fill as the land itself. So if you get a problem, get your money back by the truckload and give them back an unusable 60 ft deep hole in 30 years. 

having said this I've just been ripped off for a deposit by a farang here so I'm not that smart!
good luck Cheeryble

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## dirtydog

> EDIT - he might also be able to arrange a sale to a friendly 3rd. party


I love this lawyer speak  :Smile:  ie your mate who has Thai citezenship could pretend to buy it from you and then transfer it back, but lawyers aint allowed to say that in plain language, me , a cop mate and a lawyer were going to set up a company, the idea was that if it was a farang that was arrested I would speak to and prep him first and explain to him what he could tell the lawyer and what he couldn't, the policeman was there to advise, and then he would have his story to tell the lawyer, I would probably be rich by now or in jail if I had done it  :Smile:

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## cozun

I simply like to observe the situation that one may own a house but not the land it stands on.

In Ayutthaya there is temple and Royal (belonging to the royal family) land, mainly found on what is called 'the island'. Some are known to live, practically to squat, on those 'properties' without legal permission. If the land is required and the people living on it have no proof or authorization of rightfully being there they have to move, understandably, but it can also happen to people living officially on those land surfaces. This means that many have sort of lease contracts in those areas to be able to stay. Still, the contracts can be annulled and you might be asked to leave if the land is needed, read can be seized.

Further, because the 'island' is now a historical site protected under Unesco rules, if house or land owners can trace back or prove that their family owned, inhabited (may be lived) or leased the land they live on for a certain time (may be 100 years, I don't know anymore) or several generations (again I don't know how many), they are then the rightful title-holders or proprietors but (and this one is great) they are not allowed to sell it (because it is under historical protection rules) yet still the terrain can be forwarded to heirs (and renting or leasing might still be allowed).

At least, that's what I heard lately and did not crosscheck it so can't confirm what is pretended, but it is interesting to contemplate the very possibility of the situation.
So, remember, be careful if you rent, lease or buy land on or around the island of Ayutthaya.

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## Razzaq

Great...

nice useful information ... 

thanks for posting...  :Smile:

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## William

^just keep in mind that the article was written some 2.5 years ago and things may well have changed.  As I no longer reside in Thailand, it is difficult for me to keep up-to-date with these sorts of things.

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## Sebastien

Very nice william. However, Usufructs are not a HOT topic and I would disagree to say "let's wait and see what will happen". This is civil law. It has been in the civil Code of Thailand since it's adoption. It has been tested in Supreme Court by many decisions. Not only that, but we have a copy of the land department manual and it's clear how it applies, what are the criteria, and how it works. Problems is corruption in Thailand, lack of stability in applying the law in different corners of Thailand. Commonwealth lawyers don't understand or didn't study Usufructs, how we can subdivise property in civil law. It's purely legal, no doubt about it, and there is nothing wrong with that. A sale is a sale. A gift is a gift. A lease is a lease. A usufruct is a usufruct. Some clauses of ANY agreements, including a preniptual or a marriage can be void. I would say that OVER warning people about usufruct against leases is only a misunderstanding of how usufructs work. Now, I am not saying that they are better for everyone. Each situation request to look at it, with all the factors and options available. You state many options and that's quite nice. You didn't mention SUPERFICIES and it's an important part of property.

We uploaded the complete section of the civil code about property:
http://isaanlawyers.com/images/Comme...20Property.pdf

And the land code:
http://isaanlawyers.com/images/Land%20Code.pdf

No method is perfect as you perfectly noted, there are section prohibiting foreign ownership of land in Thailand and sections that allows it. If some lawyers and real estate agents are selling the idea to separate the land and the house, as you mentionned that it is possible, this could be a big problem when it comes to inheritance, divorce, etc. I know what "undue enrichment" is, I know "sin somros" and the confirmation letter that foreigner must sign when married and the spouse buys land:
http://isaanlawyers.com/images/lette...nfirmation.jpg

Samui for sale has good information. I respect the foreign lawyer, that I know, who worked on this site with Thai partner. However, I believe the following information about usufruct is MUCH more accurate and up to date:
http://isaanlawyers.com/Usufruct%20a...20Thailand.pdf

The right of habitation is very limited to the land. It's normally on the house. That's why a usufruct will be a better protection as it fully covers the land.

I would have love to have a beer with you William but heard that you left for another paradise...  :Smile: 

Sebastian.

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## Bluecat

> Very nice william. However, Usufructs are not a HOT topic and I would disagree to say "let's wait and see what will happen". This is civil law.


Indeed and civil law does not allow foreigners to own land in Thailand.
And it is not going to change soon.
So, in conclusion, you can own property but not the land it is sitting on... :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## Loy Toy

FYI (and depending on those who land on their feet and in power here in the coming weeks) the laws in Thailand may change and by adopting the same land lease laws as Singapore in the very near future.
That means a foreigner can lease a property fo a period of 99 years and an increase from the existing 30/30 year lease terms offered.

IMO leasing land here is the only real legal way to do it and as you own the house outright, with the house title books being registered in your name why risk buying land through a bogus company.

Everything is registered at the land office and if you have proper contracts drawn up your as sweet as a nut.

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## Bluecat

> That means a foreigner can lease a property fo a period of 99 years .


Considering that in the 99 years in question, he is sure not Thai government won't change the law or the constitution.
He's indeed safe, they only change it every year... :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## Loy Toy

> Originally Posted by Loy Toy
> 
> 
> That means a foreigner can lease a property fo a period of 99 years .
> 
> 
> Considering that in the 99 years in question, he is sure not Thai government won't change the law or the constitution.
> He's indeed safe, they only change it every year...


Quite correct Bluey. There are risks involved of course but I cannot see the government over turning a decision that they need to make because the country is bleeding at the moment. (particularly the real estate business) 

All of the land and properties I have purchased here is in my wifes name and I don't hope I regret my decision but what the heck. Gotta spend your money somewhere and for me here is as good a place as anywhere else.

Shrewd and calculating Risk Takers usually prosper. The rest can suit themselves.

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## EmperorTud

> FYI (and depending on those who land on their feet and in power here in the coming weeks) the laws in Thailand may change and by adopting the same land lease laws as Singapore in the very near future.





> There are risks involved of course but I cannot see the government over turning a decision that they need to make because the country is bleeding at the moment.


The status quo will remain regarding land ownership as long as the revered institution is at the helm and continues to be the biggest land owner and property developer in the country.

This isn't a change polititians have the ability to effect.

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## Loy Toy

> Originally Posted by Loy Toy
> 
> FYI (and depending on those who land on their feet and in power here in the coming weeks) the laws in Thailand may change and by adopting the same land lease laws as Singapore in the very near future.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Agree wholeheartedly ET.

Although common sense may prevail and they should introduce the 99 year lease deal. A move in the right direction and to help the ailing real estae industry here.

Anyway the 30/30 existing lease terms should be acceptable for any farang that wants to take the risk here and build a property.

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## Khun Custard

Thanks William.. Good advice

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## pompeybloke

> Originally Posted by Bluecat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Loy Toy
> ...


Naivety at its most astounding. Shrewd and calculating-not!

I hope for your sake that you don't regret buying land/properties totally in your wife's name.

Why any extraterestrial alien would consider buying in this country under such xenophobic un-balanced conditions is beyond me, unless you have children and can put their name on the chanote.

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## good2bhappy

Unless you have children - a wise caveat.
To look after the future of kids is a fathers duty. I have 2 and have no regrets buying land and a Bangkok house for their future.

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## Loy Toy

> Originally Posted by Loy Toy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Bluecat
> ...


With all due respect Pompey it always make me smile when I tell some farang I have put all of the land in my wifes name and I receive such a response as yours.

Your country, (and I presume you are English) has special rights for the husband and in the event of a divorce Hmmmmmmmmm? 

Does he automatically get 50% of the house and all joint assets even if he has a young family and in the event of a divorse?

Plenty of poor English divorsed husbands floating around Thailand and after a very one sided and unfair divorse settlement and after being fleeced over by his English wife.

Would you care to explain to us how you consider that we as men would have  different rights in Thailand (from those rights in England) and if I didn't do as I have done (put the properties exclusively in my wifes name).

Fortunately I trust my wife and we share the joys of a young family and each others company.

Maybe you would have a different opinion if you could have such a relationship. 

Extraterestrial alien  :rofl:  you make me laugh.

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## Whiteshiva

Great retort, LoyToy - have to spread some repo before I can green you again!

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## pompeybloke

Granted Loytoy, English law is a disgrace and heavily in favour of women. However, not totally. Although a man is discriminated against he still has "some" rights whereas you have "no" rights at all. A land of gawps woman in my cynical experience can play a dutiful and loving wife for as long as it takes, with the end game in mind.

Heaven forbid that your relationship should go sour at some stage in the future as you will find yourself up shit creek with no paddle on the way to far canal.

The true love you have is dandy, and I'm pleased for you, I have a wife downstairs but prudence lives up top.

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## jandajoy

Isn't it sad that there are so many bitter people out there?   :Sad:

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## pompeybloke

^The rose tinted glasses support team are coming into play.  Not bitter at all. 

Feet on the ground please

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## jandajoy

> ^The rose tinted glasses support team are coming into play. Not bitter at all. Feet on the ground please


Streuth, I've never been accussed of that before. Why did you assume I was referring specifically to you?  :Smile:

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## AntRobertson

> A land of gawps woman in my cynical experience can play a dutiful and loving wife for as long as it takes, with the end game in mind...
> 
> The true love you have is dandy, and I'm pleased for you, I have a wife downstairs but prudence lives up top.


What a depressing way to live a life.  :Sad: 

And it begs the obvious question; why even bother [with a Thai wife] then?

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## William

Seb,  

Yes, I have moved on.  And this article was written almost 3 years ago and has more response in one, today, than it did then!!

TiT  :Smile:

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## Fabian

It has been greatly appreciated though, William, even back then.

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## BLee

> "let's wait and see what will happen". This is civil law.
> 
> Sebastian.


About a lease continuing after the usufruct is terminated: 

  In this case, if the usufruct ends the rights to the fruits / rental ends with it. The lease may not be terminated, but the real owner should receive the rental for the remaining term of the lease. If the rental is for a token amount the owner can after the termination of the usufruct claim a reasonable rent or claim damages. And, if the lease is registered for a token amount, say, to the children of the usufructuary, the owner can claim that the parties were not in good faith and ask cancellation of the lease.

Another point: If you advice a usufruct in the names of more than 1 person, I would argue that the lifetime term would be limited to 30 years. Similar to when a usufruct is for the life of a juristic person the term of the usufruct is reduced to 30 years.

  If you simplify usufruct, make it understandable for everyone: usufruct is a personal real right and is not transferable nor inheritable, usufruct has a limited term and will always and by law be terminated with the death of the usufructuary.

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## spikebs4

many thanks william for info ..... ive just set up company here with the veiw to buying house in the furture .... me ,md... 49 pc... thia g/f 48 pc ... thai accontant 3 pc .. g/f will sign agreement not to have any claim on home or bizz ... will this be a legal binding agreement under thai law .. just trying to cover myself if n e thing goes tits up in the furture ...... the only monies ive paid out is to set up company .. t.c .. spike  :UK:

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## EmperorTud

^ you can't legally own land in Thailand as a foreigner through a shell company.

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## William

> many thanks william for info ..... ive just set up company here with the veiw to buying house in the furture .... me ,md... 49 pc... thia g/f 48 pc ... thai accontant 3 pc .. g/f will sign agreement not to have any claim on home or bizz ... will this be a legal binding agreement under thai law .. just trying to cover myself if n e thing goes tits up in the furture ...... the only monies ive paid out is to set up company .. t.c .. spike


I would strongly suggest you reduce your shareholding to below 40%.  Split you class of shares to A and B.  Make A shares voting power 2:1 on B.  You hold A and everyone else holds B.

Make sure your company is an operating company.

Make sure your company capitalisation is NOT the same as the purchase of the property, i.e. 3 million baht capital in the company and an asset [property of 3 million].

^NONE of these will guarantee you success, but they should minimise your risk

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## EmperorTud

I would strongly suggest you rent.

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## Megahorn

> Naivety at its most astounding. Shrewd and calculating-not!
> 
> I hope for your sake that you don't regret buying land/properties totally in your wife's name.
> 
> Why any extraterestrial alien would consider buying in this country under such xenophobic un-balanced conditions is beyond me, unless you have children and can put their name on the chanote.


I completely agree. But for different reasons.

Nobody knows the future. Anybody can fall out of love at any time. My older sister met her partner at 15, they were in the most loving relationship for 18 years, then in they're early 30s just naturally grew apart. It was a long hard seperation as it was all completely peaceful. 

People can be in love big time for decades, then grow apart, fall out of love, fall in love with someone else. Having all your assets in someone elses name, when there is NO need to is just a bit retarded.

One of the senior members here seperated from his wife of 10 years not so long ago, just grew apart if I remember correctly. Well done for him for being smart enough to have his assets in his name sos didn't even risk losing anything.

Nobody knows the future.

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## spikebs4

thanks for info .. g/f has land near khorat so was going down the path of leaseing from her / 30 yr lease /  if im still alive in 20 yrs il be happy .. llf

hi william tks for your time cap in company is 1 mil going to speak to law soon tks again for your advice  :UK:  :UK:  :UK:

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## johngal

rent do not buy this place is going down the pan when it does just walk away

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