#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Farming & Gardening In Thailand >  >  Hydroponics

## Tomster

Hello All,

Met a regular member of the forum on Sunday, told me to join up and pop a post in the newbie section so here it is...

Living between Bangkok and the UK, roughly half and half. Own a hydroponics company in the UK that's (not surprisingly) doing very well in the economic meltdown, we buy quite a bit from China so base myself in Bangkok wherever possible. If you've been to industrial China, you'll obviously know why I prefer Bangkok...

Just started learning Thai after coming and going to Thailand for the last 8 years or so, went for the full script option that Im now regretting. 

Anyways, look forward to getting involved, nice to see a decent option to the angry, dull affair that TV seems to be nowadays.

Cheers,

Tom.

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## kingwilly

> nice to see a decent option to the angry, dull affair that TV seems to be nowadays.


well, I suppose we aint dull!  :Wink:  

welcome

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## good2bhappy

welcome

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## Nawty

Hey Tom...where can I buy this sytem in Los and how much ??



Or can I just make it out of pvc piping, anything special required for it ?

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## Tomster

Hey Nawty,

The only place I know of in Thailand where you can buy NFT plactic like that is Accent Hydroponics in Bangkok, however i'm not even sure if they are still in operation and when I spoke to them a few years ago they were pretty clueless to be honest with you. They should have rockwool as well, but i'm gessing it'll be very expensive unless there's a Thai version....

If it was me i'd go for a DIY setup, there should be plenty of places to get white plastic guttering from. It won't be food grade but it should be UV stabilsed over here, pumps are no probs obviously, and if there's anything you get really stuck on just let me know and I can bring it over with me or add it to a food parcel etc.. If you want any further info or help with the project PM me, i'll do what I can to help.

Mate, where did you take that picture, it looks identical to something I saw in Samui on Chaweng Road a while ago...

Cheers,

Tom.

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## Marmite the Dog

Sukhumvit Soi 38, just past Melodies Skool on the left is a hydroponics place.

And welcome Tom.

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## Tomster

> Sukhumvit Soi 38, just past Melodies Skool on the left is a hydroponics place.
> 
> And welcome Tom.


Marmite,

When you say hydroponics place do you mean that they grow hydroponic produce, or sell hydroponic growing equipment?

Tom.

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## dirtydog

Use stainless if your in Thailand to get your hydroponics gear made up.

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## Nawty

The photo was in Khao Yai, saw 3 or 4 places doing it, growing their own for restaurant or home use.

Wonder if i could hide one in the basement here and grow some 'indoor' plants.

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## Marmite the Dog

> When you say hydroponics place do you mean that they grow hydroponic produce, or sell hydroponic growing equipment?


It's a small hydroponic farm, but I don't know if they sell the systems as well.

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## Nawty

It does not look that difficult to setup or grow stuff.

What is it that you pump through the system ?

I read about pumping the water from fish ponds through it, fish feed off of the nutrients, plants feed off of the fish crap.

Do you need any electronic monitoring gadgetry for just a small home based vegi patch ?

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## Tomster

> The photo was in Khao Yai, saw 3 or 4 places doing it, growing their own for restaurant or home use.
> 
> Wonder if i could hide one in the basement here and grow some 'indoor' plants.


Nawty,

If it's the type of "plants" that I think your talking about, you'll need a different type of hydro system, or soil...

I've seen quite few people using NFT systems like that one in the last few years, maybe it's finally catching on. Like I said, if you plan on setting one up let me know and i'll do what I can to help.

Marmite,

I'll swing past soi 38 tomorrow and see if they have any info, although when i've asked people about where they buy their equipment from over here in the past they tend to start giving me funny looks and moving slowly away like I dropped one... For some reason they don't seem to want to share the info.

Tom.

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## Tomster

> It does not look that difficult to setup or grow stuff.
> 
> What is it that you pump through the system ?
> 
> I read about pumping the water from fish ponds through it, fish feed off of the nutrients, plants feed off of the fish crap.
> 
> Do you need any electronic monitoring gadgetry for just a small home based vegi patch ?


Sorry mate,

You posted this whilst I was writing that last post...

You pump water with nutrients added past the plant roots, like you say it's pretty easy when you have the basics straight in your mind. 

There are a few gadgets that would come in handy, but they're not essential, I don't know where to get the nutrients though, that will take a bit of looking around.

The fish thing is call Aquaponics and takes quite a bit more knowledge, I like fish on plate (fried or steamed), but not sure about keeping them alive in a tank, sounds like allot of trouble to me...

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## Nawty

Where we will be moving shortly has a nice big pond in the backyard. Was thinking to grow fish in it and use that water.

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## Marmite the Dog

My missus will try to get some info from the place on Soi 38 tomorrow as she wants to set something like this up for her family up-country.

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## Tomster

> Where we will be moving shortly has a nice big pond in the backyard. Was thinking to grow fish in it and use that water.


Ah, gotchya. To be honest it's not something I've ever done so I can't be much help with there, and I have a feeling you may need some slightly more advanced (see expensive) nutrient management equipment to keep an eye on things, a lettuce is probably allot a harder to kill than a koi carp... Or maybe not, I really have no idea.

Anyway, good luck and let me know if I can help.

Tom.

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## Tomster

> My missus will try to get some info from the place on Soi 38 tomorrow as she wants to set something like this up for her family up-country.


Hey Marmite,

If you want I could send you a list of things she needs to ask about - basically the stuff that will be hard to get as opposed the stuff that you can get in the harware shops?

Tom.

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## dirtydog

Nawty for your hydro stuff you need *poo*, post your address so we can send you some  :Smile:

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## Boon Mee

> Hello All,
> 
> Met a regular member of the forum on Sunday, told me to join up and pop a post in the newbie section so here it is...
> 
> Living between Bangkok and the UK, roughly half and half. Own a hydroponics company in the UK that's (not surprisingly) doing very well in the economic meltdown, we buy quite a bit from China so base myself in Bangkok wherever possible. If you've been to industrial China, you'll obviously know why I prefer Bangkok...
> 
> Just started learning Thai after coming and going to Thailand for the last 8 years or so, went for the full script option that Im now regretting. 
> 
> Anyways, look forward to getting involved, nice to see a decent option to the angry, dull affair that TV seems to be nowadays.
> ...


Welcome aboard Tom.  I'm too, getting back into my Thai lessons after having put them down for a couple years.  

Best of luck...

BM

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## Marmite the Dog

> Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog
> 
> 
> My missus will try to get some info from the place on Soi 38 tomorrow as she wants to set something like this up for her family up-country.
> 
> 
> Hey Marmite,
> 
> If you want I could send you a list of things she needs to ask about - basically the stuff that will be hard to get as opposed the stuff that you can get in the harware shops?
> ...


Sure, but keep it as simple as possible. Will you post the list here or do you want me to PM you my shemale address?

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## Tomster

> Originally Posted by Tomster
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog
> ...


Thinking about it there are only two things that you need to ask for:-

1. Hydroponic nutrients in powder form (liquid form is expensive)
2. Rockwool (brand names Grodan, Vacroc etc)

Just about everything else can be bought in the hardware store, and there are even ways around these two items if it turns into a ball ache getting them, but they will make life allot easier. Like I said, the channel can be made from guttering and all the irrigation bit's and pieces are available everywhere as are the pumps. 

Let me know how she gets on.

Tom.

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## Marmite the Dog

Can you describe the rockwool in more detail for me, as I have to pass that on to the Midget in simple Tinglish?

Also, I was thinking that the guttering would be nice if made from bamboo.  :Smile:

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## melvbot

Looks interesting, Im assuming the Rockwool is different to what I know Rockwool as i.e insulation.
Oh yeah, welcome  :Smile:

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## Marmite the Dog

This site looks quite useful.

The main reason I am interested in this is because I want to grow my own steak tomatoes as well as giving the midget something to do with her family.  :Smile:

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## melvbot

Theres a bit of interest in this from another thread so I'll shamelessly jump on the bandwagon and see what comes of it.

 Ive been interested in growing my own veg ever since my grandad took me in his greenhouse, he used to have a small plot in the garden where he grew all his own veg, potatoes, carrots, onions, radish and other stuff I cant quite remember. The only problem Ive had is not having the small bit of land to grow anything on. The MIL has land but she uses it already for growing stuff and I dont want to tread on her patch, so after seeing the other thread hydroponics seems to be an alternative, no land needed just space.

 So Ive done a quick Google and come up with a few websites within Thailand that deal with Hydro, now the fugger is I cant read Thai, I can see the prices etc but not whats actually with the kits so if anyones interested and has the time maybe they could give a brief outline of what comes with this kit.

Thaimee... D.I.Y.

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## kingwilly

> Nawty for your hydro stuff you need poo, post your address so we can send you some


i'm sure via PM would work just as well....

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## Marmite the Dog

I'm going to merge the juicy bits from the other thread with this one, so sorry for your OP moving downstream, Melv.

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## thehighlander959

Hi Tom

Welcome

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## baldrick

Hi Tom

this sounds like a nice project  - a couple of nice little hydro tables with lettuce and tomatoes would be great - I have a fair sized balcony upstairs I don't use.

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## melvbot

> I'm going to merge the juicy bits from the other thread with this one, so sorry for your OP moving downstream, Melv.


No worries, it was intended to start something and it did so job done.

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## melvbot

Found a few sites for hobby/commercial, some in Thai some are in English

ªØ´»ÅÙ¡ ÍØ»¡Ã³ì»ÅÙ¡¾×¢äÃé´Ô¹

ªÁÃÁ¡ÒÃ»ÅÙ¡¾×ªâ´ÂäÁèãªé´Ô¹

Accent Hydroponics 1997 (Thailand) Co.,Ltd

ackhydrofarm

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## biggrtiggr

Hello everyone!

Forgive me if I cock this up.... never tried this system before.........

Just a comment about using insulation type slabs..... don't do it

Insulation has a treatment which repels water.... not what you want in a root medium

Done a fair bit of hyrdoponic growing in the UK.... not expert by any means, but had success with various systems ( in private :mid: )

Pleased to discuss any aspects with you...... whatever crop you want to grow!!!

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## Propagator

Interesting subject - Wiki throws up some info on this with a lot of links.    It seems that rock wool is used but must be stabalised first

Hydroponics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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## oldgit

This will give you some idea about rock wool as there is a shot of one on its side with roots showing through. tells you how to also

Hydroponics - Rockwool as growing substrate

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## Loombucket

Thanks everyone for the information, I will be heading down the same path, at some point.

Welcome Tom and biggrtiggr.

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## biggrtiggr

Grodan cubes are good.... used them before, but a bit expensive. Expanded clay balls are cheaper and despite claims to the contrary, can be used again a few times if cleaned properly.   For growing many crops, aerated water systems ( aka 'bubblers') are bloody marvellous when you have mastered the basics of hydroponics.   BTW..... living back in UK now, but wife is Thai, hence my visits to TeakDoor. Hope my credentials are good enough!

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## melvbot

Ive seen a few alternatives to Rockwool such as sand and rice husks, surely there must be an equally useful material lying around somewhere for cheaper just to try a small setup. The reason I'd look for an alternative is disposing of Rockwool, pretty difficult to get rid of properly, a nice throwaway substance would be better.

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## melvbot

Something we should be able to get hold of fairly easily

*Coconut fiber.* Coconut fiber, also called coir, is rapidly becoming one of the most popular growing mediums in the world and may soon be the most popular. It is the first totally organic medium that offers top performance in hydroponic systems. 
 Coconut fiber is a waste product of the coconut industry and is actually the pulverized husks of coconuts. Coconut fiber is available in different grades, the lowest of which has an extremely high salt content that necessitates leaching before use.
 The main advantages of coconut fiber are its oxygen and water-holding abilities. It can maintain a larger oxygen capacity than rockwool yet also has superior water-holding ability. Some research has also shown that coir might have insect-repelling abilities. High-quality coir (the grade commonly used for hydroponics consists of the coarser fibers) also has the advantage of not containing any, or extremely low, levels of nutrients, so it wont alter the composition of the nutrient solution.


Alternative Hydroponic Substrates

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## Nawty

> Nawty for your hydro stuff you need *poo*, post your address so we can send you some



Do you know how many comedians there are out of work ??

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## Nawty

> Hello everyone!
> 
> Forgive me if I cock this up.... never tried this system before.........
> 
> Just a comment about using insulation type slabs..... don't do it
> 
> Insulation has a treatment which repels water.... not what you want in a root medium
> 
> Done a fair bit of hyrdoponic growing in the UK.... not expert by any means, but had success with various systems ( in private)
> ...



My kinda crop I think....wink wink nudge nudge.

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## El Gibbon

Found this site some time ago, they seem to have everything needed. Also includes a map to their location.

Bangsai Agricultural Center : Bangkok, Thailand

E.G.

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## Tomster

> Found this site some time ago, they seem to have everything needed. Also includes a map to their location.
> 
> Bangsai Agricultural Center : Bangkok, Thailand
> 
> E.G.


That link is by far the best i've seen for hydroponic products in Thailand (which isn't saying much...), that would care of the nutrient side of things. Would be worth asking if they have rockwool, if not perlite or vermiculite would also be OK depending on which type of system you went for.

There's a link to Autopot's website in an earlier thread, they kind of work OK with soil but they can have problems if you use them with a hydroponic growing medium - and they're shite in hot weather conditions for long term crops like tomatoes.

Coco/coir can work exceptionally well but needs to be used as a "run to waste" style of system, this basically drips onto the top of the pot and has about 20% run off per feed. Great system, but wastes nutrients and water. The other thing would be finding the correct coir, it needs to be treated for use in horticulture and if it isn't it will tend to kill the plants.

If it was me i'd go to the company in the link above, looks like they're geared up to promote hydroponics, lots of Thai's seem to be very closed about sharing the knowledge for some reason. If you need anything clarifying let me know - I may drop in and say hello to those guys myself, looks interesting....

Cheers,

Tom.

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## melvbot

Tom just for a rough guess how much in nutrients/cost would it be for  something like 10 or 20 tomato plants?

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## Tomster

> Tom just for a rough guess how much in nutrients/cost would it be for something like 10 or 20 tomato plants?


Melvbot,

Hard to say as they're not listing any prices on the site...

It depends on allot of factors. If you buy the indivdual nutrients as powders that will work out loads cheaper - without meaning to be evasive all I can say is that it would work out at a fraction of the cost of buying the veg from the supermarket, and they'd be better quality.

If someone can get some prices for the nutrients then I could work out roughly how much the cost would be over the length of the crop you'd be growing.

Cheers,

Tom.

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## melvbot

Nutrient Solution   Concentration. 1:200                       
                      1 set ( A 500 ml 2 bottle + B 500 ml 2 bottle)  
                      Price  350 Baht

Would it be easier to work out from this? ie rough amount of plants this would feed for one crop

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## Marmite the Dog

After seeing that website with all the stuff, we didn't bother going to the place on Soi 38, as we don't think they'd be very helpful, as Tom said.

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## Tomster

> Hard to say as they're not listing any prices on the site...


Think i'm losing it, prices all over that site...!

OK, so there's two options there, liquid and powder form. Powders are always loads cheaper although they're only showing prices for the individual elements, not a complete mix. You'd have to mix them yourself, which is easy enough and this would be by far the cheapest option although you'd have to spend about 4000 baht buying all the powders up front. That would last you for the best part of a season at a guess and would produce a seriously huge amount of fruit or veg.

For the 5 litre liquid, say you had 10 fully developed tomato plants that were constantly fruiting, you'd need a tank of at least 200 litres, anything smaller and it would become unstable very quickly. At their dilution rate of 5ml per litre a 5 litre set would probably last around 2-3 weeks, but you'd be producing kilos and kilos of tomatoes in this period. You'd also be able to grow green peppers, cucumbers and any other vine crops with that mix of nutrients.

Not sure if Bangsai sell NFT channel like the stuff in the first page of this thread, looks like they have their own sort of DFT system. I'll go and have a poke around later in the week and see what the crack is. If not then Accent Hydroponics Thailand would be a good bet, or DIY it with guttering.

Hope that helps,

Tom.

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## jizzybloke

Hello to Tom and the other one with a strange name!

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## Tomster

> Hello to Tom and the other one with a strange name!


Allo Jizzy...

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## El Gibbon

I haven't checked lately but the system in the link I provided can be designed for just about any size. I was originally interested in a patio size table... they do have their own system for rooting as I recall.

E. G.

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## Tomster

> I haven't checked lately but the system in the link I provided can be designed for just about any size. I was originally interested in a patio size table... they do have their own system for rooting as I recall.
> 
> E. G.


As far as I can see they're basically a container with a polystyrene lid with holes cut into it, a form of Deep Flow Technique hydroponics. Should work fine but only suitable for small plants such as herbs and lettuce, there's no way you could do tomatoes, peepers or cucumbers in a system like that. 

I'll pop over tomorrow for a chat and see what they say about it, i'll post when I get back.

Cheers,

Tom.

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## El Gibbon

^ not sue I understand why not tomatoes or cukes. If you can grow tomatoes upside down I would think a hanger arrangement could be developed. BWDIK   :Smile: 

Will await your view after the visit. Thanks for undertaking it as I'm still somewhat interested.

E.G.

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## Mr R Sole

Has anyone got any interesting seeds..they want to share? for a similar special growing project. As my local-ish variety don't produce much of a yield  :Sad: . Nawty?
I too did some interesting growing projects in the UK and wouldn't mind also growing some rosemary and other heabs from the UK..a little concerned about the heat and humidity over here.. don't want everything to die, also don't wanna do my bit for global warming by using the air-con (god they got that name right eh?air-con) suggestions?

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## attaboy

^ Use a large enough exhaust fan to suck the heat and humidity out of the room. I don't know the turnover rate you'd need.

Regularly check the pH. The pH of the water will effect the efficiency of nutrient uptake by the plant.

Don't get cheap.  Do an overall water change of the water and nutrients in the system on a regular basis, topping off to adjust for evaporation is fine but just topping off alone w/o a overall water change will lead to salt build up which is bad for the plants.

These are only suggested leads to follow.  I am no expert.

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## Tomster

> ^ not sue I understand why not tomatoes or cukes. If you can grow tomatoes upside down I would think a hanger arrangement could be developed. BWDIK 
> 
> Will await your view after the visit. Thanks for undertaking it as I'm still somewhat interested.
> 
> E.G.


Hey E.G,

Tomatoes and other vine crops get VERY big in hydroponics, you can be looking at 20 kilos plus per plant when you get it right. The systems that Bangsai sell are not designed for this type of crop, they would only work for short term crops that don't drink too much and don't require support. A fully grown tomato plant can suck up 10 litres plus on a hot day, I doubt the containers they sell have a volume of much more than that...

For tom's and other vine crops you really need either NFT that's over 200m wide, or some kind of growing medium like Coir or clay pebbles (hydroton is available in Thailand). I think Accent Hydroponics would be a good bet for this kind of stuff, i'll drop them an email today.

I was going to pop over to Bangsai today, but I think my hangover's going to get in the way - i'll try to get over there on Monday morning.

Cheers,

Tom.

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## nedwalk

> . I am no expert.


from what i just read your a lieing bastard, those were very important and relative tips, but i could be wrong cause i ain,t no expert either :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## Tomster

Just found this company as well, looks like they have systems for larger plants...

ackhydrofarm

Tom.

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## Smithson

> I read about pumping the water from fish ponds through it, fish feed off of the nutrients, plants feed off of the fish crap.


This is called aquaponics and is getting popular in Australia due to water restrictions.

I'm currently doing both hydro and aquaponics systems at my place in Bkk. Hydro done in greenhouses has advantages in cooler climates, but Thailand is tropical and plants grow easily all year round.

My tomatoes are fruiting now, I've got Romas and beefsteak, the latter are doing much better, the Romas don't like the hot weather and have a fair bit of blossom end rot. 

The aquaponics is interesting but a bit tricky, you have to be more careful what you use because of the fish, as you'll end up eating them. After months of killing fish things are starting to grow now. These system suit leafy vegetables rather than fruiting ones. The basil, chinese spinach and coriander are doing well. I've got catfish and Pla Nin, but there struggling a bit as I'm only using a large garbage bin!

There is a large hydro company in Pak Chong, not sure of the name though. I'm using recycled plastic containers, which are pretty cheap. The most expensive thing is the nutrients and testing gear.

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## Smithson

> Just found this company as well, looks like they have systems for larger plants...
> 
> ackhydrofarm
> 
> Tom.


Ack is around the corner from me, this is where I get my nutes from, apparently there is a cheaper place.

Just a question about the coco coir, I can get this stuff really cheap, some place even give it away.

This is what I'm using for my tomatoes, but the blossom end rot is a bastard. I wonder if salt build up has anything to do with it? Seems like the ones getting the most sun are worse, it's only happening to the Romas, apparently they are more susceptible.

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## biggrtiggr

This is a useful site, UK based shop but shows many details about different systems;.......http://www.growell.co.uk/......... They are heavily biased towards one particular crop, but many of the basic facts are relevant to any plants.

Just a comment on fertilisers; it may be cheaper to buy in powder form and mix yourself, but take care...... many different compounds are needed in hydroponics.... you must provide ALL the required compounds and trace elements, in the right balance.

Ready mixed liquid fertiliser is easier to mix in the correct (and very weak) solutions commonly used, provided they are available in LOS.

I will try to put together a list of links to useful information..... had them all to hand once, but wiped all references off my hard drive, fearful of a visit from local constabulary
 :ourrules: 

Good luck to all you who want to give it a try..... but now some of us must go out in the cold and wet to earn an honest living!!!!

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## Tomster

> Originally Posted by Tomster
> 
> 
> Just found this company as well, looks like they have systems for larger plants...
> 
> ackhydrofarm
> 
> Tom.
> 
> ...


Hi Smithson,

Seems like there's quite a few people doing hydro over here...

What's ACK like - do they have a shop or is it warehouse style? Have they rockwool/perlite etc as well as the systems they show on their site?

Blossom end rot is down to several factors (mainly calcium transport), but coir can make it worse by drying out quickly, which is also known to affect BER. 

How are you irrigating the coir? The plants in the sun will look worse as they're under the most pressure to grow, BER hits the more rapidly growing plants first. Also, a rapidly growing plant in coir will drink allot more water than a slow growing plant, this can cause imbalances in the coir which could further lock out calcium....

Also, horticultural coir goes through a buffering process before being sold which includes adding calcium nitrate in most cases, the stuff you're buying (or getting for free) won't have been through this process...

The cheapest way to buy nutes is normally as individual elements in powder form and mix your own formula, have a look at the prices on the bangsai site and see how they compare. Let em now if you need a coir specific recipe, I can grab one off a manufacturer. I'm not familiar with the pricing of equipment here yet so can't be much more help - yet. I'm going to set some systems up on a friends balcony next week so should be a bit more useful after i've seen what's on the market.

Can you get cheap PH and EC pens off Ebay from China, I would have thought they would ship here?

Cheers,

Tom.

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## biggrtiggr

Another interesting site, again UK based........Hydroponics - Kits, Systems, Videos, Books and Grow Lights particular this page......Hydroponic Systems - Grow Systems.

Used this system for a single tomatoe plant last summer before setting up a multi pot system. Can give phenomenal results, and can be set up very simply with DIY skills. BUT it does need regular attention and care, cant bugger off and leave it for a week :Smile:

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## Tomster

> Another interesting site, again UK based........Hydroponics - Kits, Systems, Videos, Books and Grow Lights particular this page......Hydroponic Systems - Grow Systems.
> 
> Used this system for a single tomatoe plant last summer before setting up a multi pot system. Can give phenomenal results, and can be set up very simply with DIY skills. BUT it does need regular attention and care, cant bugger off and leave it for a week


Hi Biggrtiggr,

The systems Esoteric sell are high end systems priced for people NOT growing tomatoes - as you know they're excellent systems but most people reading this thread will be after budget or DIY systems...

Work bloody well though....

Cheers,

Tom.

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## biggrtiggr

Certainly high end...... not proposing anyone will order from these sites, just study the information and methods.  That's what i did, then produced my own systems at a fraction of the price.  None of the different methods are fool proof, and I have no experience of growing anything in LOS, but hydro systems are great ways of growing many crops. Just hope people dont see the idea as being EASIER than growing in soil..... it isn't. Hydro is even less forgiving than soil growing, but great fun and productive if you get it right

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## Tomster

> Certainly high end...... not proposing anyone will order from these sites, just study the information and methods. That's what i did, then produced my own systems at a fraction of the price. None of the different methods are fool proof, and I have no experience of growing anything in LOS, but hydro systems are great ways of growing many crops. Just hope people dont see the idea as being EASIER than growing in soil..... it isn't. Hydro is even less forgiving than soil growing, but great fun and productive if you get it right


Agreed!

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## Smithson

[quote=Tomster;928765][quote=Smithson;928456]


> Hi Smithson,
> 
> Seems like there's quite a few people doing hydro over here...
> 
> What's ACK like - do they have a shop or is it warehouse style? Have they rockwool/perlite etc as well as the systems they show on their site?


It's not great for shopping, the just have a glass cabinet with some nutes, pumps, EC pens etc. They do sell systems, my guess is they'd be pricey. 




> How are you irrigating the coir? The plants in the sun will look worse as they're under the most pressure to grow, BER hits the more rapidly growing plants first. Also, a rapidly growing plant in coir will drink allot more water than a slow growing plant, this can cause imbalances in the coir which could further lock out calcium....
> 
> Also, horticultural coir goes through a buffering process before being sold which includes adding calcium nitrate in most cases, the stuff you're buying (or getting for free) won't have been through this process...


I'm using flood and drain, the pump runs for 15 mins and then turns off with the water running back through the pump. When i first noticed the BER I put up shade cloth, rinsed the system and changed the nutes. Seems to have helped. The plants receiving the most sun aren't growing quicker than the others, I think it's just too much heat. It's only the Romas, so I'm wondering if this type just can't be grown in Bkk? Checking the supermarkets, I don't see any plum tomatoes for sale, even from the expensive hydro brands.

I am using coco coir cubes and coir inner husks. This stuff retains water very well, so I wouldn't have thought that was a problem. It's also really light. Can you recommend any other growing mediums?




> The cheapest way to buy nutes is normally as individual elements in powder form and mix your own formula, have a look at the prices on the bangsai site and see how they compare. 
>  Let em now if you need a coir specific recipe, I can grab one off a manufacturer. I'm not familiar with the pricing of equipment here yet so can't be much more help - yet. I'm going to set some systems up on a friends balcony next week so should be a bit more useful after i've seen what's on the market.
> 
> Can you get cheap PH and EC pens off Ebay from China, I would have thought they would ship here?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Tom.


Ack sells the tomatoes nutes for B900 for 1,000 litres, this is almost double the price of their other nutrients! There is a place called Wesco in Lad Prao that does wholesale nutes, min order is B2,500, but I think you have to mix everything yourself. 

To give you an idea of prices, I used a cement mixing tub (B700), fish tank pump (B350), 200 lt tank (B600), timer (B200) and PVC pipe. I also added some square plastic boxes that I get second hand for B75 ea. 

You can also get blue barrels for B80 (25 lts), B350 (120 lts), B450 (200 lts). Square plastic containers are cheap enough, but don't last too long in the sun.

 My EC pen was B3,800, I suppose you could get the pens from China, I was told the ebay ones weren't much good.

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## attaboy

> Originally Posted by attaboy
> 
> . I am no expert.
> 
> 
> from what i just read your a lieing bastard, those were very important and relative tips, but i could be wrong cause i ain,t no expert either


Only at Liar's Dice.  :Smile:  They are important tips but I don't know the specifics, ie., what rate of air turnover is necessary in a room or in what pH range the water should be or what measuring meters one should use if they are using high concentrations of fertilizer. If growing indoors the expense of electricicty becomes an issue. Some people try to maximize their yield in relationship to expense. Maximizing the fertilizer concentration means a person is walking the line from being just ok to over the limit when water is lost to evaporation and the solution becomes more concentrated. How detrimental or how important this is to growing I don't know. 

It's a good idea to complety wash down and disenfect the set up after each harvest cycle. This way salt does not build up and alage or disease doesn't take hold. Algae will rob nutrients from the water and choke the roots of plants depending on the type of setup.

It's important to keep pH pens clean and to keep them from drying out otherwise false readings can become and issue.

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## nedwalk

ph levels about 6.4 and on a tds meter, usually about 1200 per parts, not too much or you will fry your fruit the old less is more is the best advice, the water is not lost in run to waste system however in a flood /drain system the water level must be monitered as with ph and nutient mix in the flowering stages especially just after [if you are useing lights] you swich your cycle down from nominal16hr to 12 hr, re expence of elec, that is where solar grid systems also come into effect to offset power expense, after yeilding absolutely sanitise all equipment to prevent disease and pests you are working in a controlled enviroment and should be treated as such..


so i been told anyway, apperently its lots of fun too :Smile:

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## baldrick

> I'm going to set some systems up on a friends balcony next week so should be a bit more useful after i've seen what's on the market.


if you can take some photos of the setup it would be great

smithson - can we see some photos of your setup.

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## Tomster

[quote=Smithson;932003][quote=Tomster;928765]


> Originally Posted by Tomster
> 
> 
> Hi Smithson,
> 
> Seems like there's quite a few people doing hydro over here...
> 
> What's ACK like - do they have a shop or is it warehouse style? Have they rockwool/perlite etc as well as the systems they show on their site?
> 
> ...


Hi Smithson,

Apologies for the delay in getting back, my laptop got a virus and was out of action for a few days.

Still haven't made it over to ACK, everytime I try to get there something pops up... The price of their tomato feed seems quite high for over here - if it costs more than their other feeds then obviously it's a money spinner for them. It'll probably take a few weeks to sort out, but i'll take a look at getting a powdered tomato blend for coir made up, hopefully that will cost quite a bit less than what you're paying now. 

With regards to your system and the growing medium coir isn't ideal for flood and drain, it hangs onto the nutrients a bit to much for this style of growing. If it was me i'd get hold of some hydroleca :-

Growing Media[at]>[at]Hydroleca & Seramis[at]>[at]Hydroleca 8-16MM

and mix about 1/3 coir into that - that way the tomato feed you have will be more suitable and the pots should be more free flowing, which will probably help with the BER. For Flood and drain feeding little and often with a open growing medium is optimum. How many times a day are you flooding the pots for 15 mins, remeber that BER can also be caused by over watering as well as under watering:-

CSU Cooperative Extension Tri River Area

On a slightly different note, I've got around 15 samples coming over to my place next week of these:-

Hydroponics[at]>[at]Autopots & Easy2grow[at]>[at]Easy2Grow Two, Four & Six Plant Kits

They're the modules only so need a tank, piping and growing medium (which i'll probably get shipped from the UK) - about 5 have homes but if anybody wants to have a go with the other ones let me know. As they're samples they're free but will you'll obviously need to pay for the other bits. Smithson, can you tell me where to get the blue barrels from? The only requiremnt I have is that if anybody takes them they post some pictures up here showing the results... You'll need to pick them up from Bangkok, PM me if interested.

The pens on ebay can be a bit hit and miss, but generally speaking i've found the red PH pens to be quite good. Can I ask what make your EC pen is?

Cheers,

Tom.

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## peterpan

Tom. Useful to have a Hydro expert on the forum, I used to grow a bit in OZ but there were specialist Hydro shops there. good for advice and equipment, not much around here as you will have noticed on the other hand its not economically viable to grow your own. 
I brought some nice red tasty tomatoes yesterday, 10 kg bag for 30 Bt, when its in season here they almost give it away.

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## Tomster

> Tom. Useful to have a Hydro expert on the forum, I used to grow a bit in OZ but there were specialist Hydro shops there. good for advice and equipment, not much around here as you will have noticed on the other hand its not economically viable to grow your own. 
> I brought some nice red tasty tomatoes yesterday, 10 kg bag for 30 Bt, when its in season here they almost give it away.


Hey Peterpan,

To be honest i'm no expert, but I spent several years talking to customers day in day out about why they were having problems with their growing setups whilst building my business in the UK, this gives you a pretty good insight into what works and what doesn't across the board.

I guess in my mind the reasons for growing hydroponically over here would be:-

- For enjoyment
- To grow crops (or varieties of certain crops) that you can't get here
- To guarentee that some w*nker hasn't sprayed pesticides all over them which you then eat
- To have consistent supply throughout the year when perhaps shop bought crops go down in quality or up in price

For me the most important issue is the pesticide one, I simply don't trust the farmers here not to drench the crops in all sorts of chemicals, even if they swear blind that they don't...

The biggest barrier to hydroponic growing over here seems to be the cost of fertiliser, which I will look into over the coming weeks. If it can be purchased in bulk, I'm thinking that if enough people were interested it could be shared around at a much cheaper price than everybody is paying now...

Cheers,

Tom.

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## Smithson

Tom,

Thanks for the info, I'm flooding about every two hours thru the day. I'm familiar with expanded clay balls, but they're bloody expensive! 

The blue barrels can be got in several places, such as Thanyaburi along hwy 305 and out past the airport along On Nut road.

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## Tomster

Smithson,

Have PM'd you.

Tom.

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## Lily

> The only problem Ive had is not having the small bit of land to grow anything on.


You dont need a lot of land. I have a reason area of yard but it is in almost complete shade all day (big trees). I do have a very sunny courtyard and I grow lettuce, tomatoes, shallots (green onions), cucumbers all year round in pots. Only cherry tomatoes in winter.

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## Tomster

> Originally Posted by melvbot
> 
>  The only problem Ive had is not having the small bit of land to grow anything on.
> 
> 
> You dont need a lot of land. I have a reason area of yard but it is in almost complete shade all day (big trees). I do have a very sunny courtyard and I grow lettuce, tomatoes, shallots (green onions), cucumbers all year round in pots. Only cherry tomatoes in winter.


Lily,

In hydroponics?

Cheers,

Tom.

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## Lily

> Lily, In hydroponics?


No, in soil. If you are just growing for your own table, do you need hydroponics? How many tomatoes can you eat if they are all at the same stage?

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## Tomster

> Originally Posted by Tomster
> 
> Lily, In hydroponics?
> 
> 
> No, in soil. If you are just growing for your own table, do you need hydroponics? How many tomatoes can you eat if they are all at the same stage?


They wouldn't all be at the same stage, different parts of the plant ripen at different times in hydro, in soil less so as things grow very slowly...

If you have enough for your own table and don't want to get there quicker, then obviously hydro is not an option for you. Personally I get bored waiting for plants to grow in soil, but everybody's different, and it's not a competition.

Cheers,

Tom.

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## Lily

^I am sorry Tom, I didnt mean to lessen your efforts. I really did think that hydroponics was meant for a more commercial scale than just a backyard veggie garden. I stand corrected.

I love seeing the growth of plants, but women have always had more patience than men, after all, it takes us a whole nine months to grow the best crop of all. :Smile:

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## Tomster

> ^I am sorry Tom, I didnt mean to lessen your efforts.


Hi Lily,

No offence taken!!! 

Cheers,

Tom.

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## Smithson

> smithson - can we see some photos of your setup.


Here's some pics, these were taken about 3 months ago when the system was just starting.

The water is pumped from the tank in the bottom corner. It fills the growbeds and the overflow goes back into the tank. Then after 15 mins the pump stops and the nutes flow back thru the pump. 



The plants are fruiting now and we're having some nice pasta sauces. I've made a few mistakes, but overall it's not too bad considering a lot of ppl have trouble with tomatoes in Thailand. 

It'll be interesting to see how long the plants go for, the weather will start getting very hot next month. I started these in early Oct, which was a bit late. This year I'll start earlier so I get the fruit in Dec.

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## Mozzbie47

Has anyone tried Hydroponics, is it to hot, hard to keep cool etc.

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## superman

Loads about it on Google.Thitawan Orchard : The largest hydroponics farm in Nakornratchasima &ndash; Thailand

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## AUSSIE EXPAT

Going to set up an aquaponic system when I get back to Thailand. Check this out as well.

Set up costs will be your main overhead but you have to sell your produce for premium prices.

If you can establish a niche market great - if you can't don't waste your time.

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## dirtydog

^ your reading something I am not, is he starting a farm or just produce for himself?

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## Ceburat1

For aquaponics information and education go to: www.backyardaquaponics.com/forum/.  There is hydroponics and aquaponics in Thailand.

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## AUSSIE EXPAT

^^ Fair point but I would try to make some money out of it and eat for free.

Weather here is fine for greenhouses provided there is adequate ventilation.

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## rawlins

Seems to be some good books available on Amazon on the subject...

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## Mozzbie47

> ^ your reading something I am not, is he starting a farm or just produce for himself?


Sorry, l should have offered more information, my wife likes the idea of Hydroponics, to start with as a hobby for our own use. But with the intension of maybe building it up to on sell if the need was there.

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## Zooheekock

I know someone (Rajabaht teacher, Thai not foreign) who lost a ton of money on commercial hydroponics, mainly I think because there just wasn't much of a market for pricey veg. But that was quite a few years ago and maybe things have changed - the supermarkets certainly have plenty of mentally expensive lettuces in so perhaps. I'm thinking about setting up an aquaponics system later this year but just for home use, not commercial. If you're interested in that, there's a Facebook group called Thai Aquaponics which is run by a foreign guy who seems pretty helpful.

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## barmine

I tried hydroponics in Bangkok, with only limited success on tomatoes. I moved to Udon Thani and am doing better, but still do not have many answers. Bangkok is probably to hot. I use 2 inch pvc and have fish in trash bins, with the pvc laying on top the 30 gallon trash bins. Pole beans grow well in this system.

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