#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Living In Thailand Forum >  >  > Health, Fitness and Hospitals in Thailand >  >  The Medicate Yourself Thread

## chitown

I don't like going to doctors much, so I tend to try and medicate myself. I have a friend that is a doctor that I can email with symptoms, and he does give me free advice.

If you want to add to the below Rx list, feel free to do so!

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## chitown

*Acid Reflux -*

Chitown's pill of choice? Miracid. 

Comes in a green box and sells for 60 to 120 baht for 14 capsules depending on where you buy it. It is close to 1000 baht in the US. 

Dosage 2 or 3 per day.


*Acid Reflux Symptoms*


          Lots of people are intimately familiar with acid reflux symptoms. More than 60 million Americans experience acid reflux at least once a month. Acid reflux disease, also known as gastroesophageal reflux disease (GERD), can produce a variety of symptoms.
*What are the common acid reflux symptoms?*

     Heartburn, regurgitation, and dyspepsia are a few of the most common acid reflux symptoms.
*Heartburn.* Also called acid indigestion, heartburn is a burning pain or discomfort that can move up from your stomach to the middle of your abdomen and chest. The pain can also move into your throat. Despite its name, heartburn doesn't affect your heart.
*Regurgitation.* Another common symptom of acid reflux is regurgitation -- or the sensation of acid backing up into your throat or mouth. Regurgitation can produce a sour or bitter taste, and you may experience a "wet burp" or even vomit some contents of your stomach.
*Dyspepsia.* Many people with acid reflux disease also have a syndrome called dyspepsia. Dyspepsia is a general term for stomach discomfort. Symptoms of dyspepsia include:BurpingNausea after eatingStomach fullness or bloatingUpper abdominal pain and discomfortSymptoms of acid reflux may be a sign that stomach acid has inflamed your esophagus. When that happens, stomach acid can damage the lining of your esophagus and cause bleeding.
     Although acid reflux is extremely common and rarely serious, don't ignore your acid reflux symptoms. Making a few lifestyle changes and using over-the-counter antacids usually are all you need to control acid reflux symptoms.
*When do acid reflux symptoms occur?*

     Acid reflux symptoms most often occur:After eating a heavy mealWhen bending over or lifting an objectWhen lying down, especially on your backPeople who have frequent acid reflux symptoms most often experience them at night. Nighttime GERD also produces the most pain. However, the level of pain does not always indicate the degree of damage to your esophagus.
     More than half of all pregnant women experience heartburn during pregnancy. Increased hormones and pressure from a growing fetus can combine to produce this acid reflux symptom. In most cases, heartburn goes away after delivery.
*What makes acid reflux symptoms worse?*

     Certain foods can make the symptoms of acid reflux worse. To lessen your symptoms, try avoiding:Citrus fruitsChocolateCaffeinated drinks or alcoholSpicy, fatty, or fried foodsGarlic and onionsPeppermintTomatoes

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## chitown

Insomnia or jet lag?

Pop 2 - 25 mg Atarax pills and you will be out like a light for 8 hours minus any hangover symptoms .  :Smile: 

*Atarax* - no script needed in Thailand. Found at Boots and Watson's.

*PRESCRIBED FOR:* Hydroxyzine is used for the relief of pruritus (itching)  caused by various allergic conditions. Hydroxyzine is also used for treating   anxiety and tension, and inducing sedation prior to or after anesthesia. 
*DOSING:* Hydroxyzine has its maximal effect about 30 to 60 minutes after it is  taken. Its effects last for 4 to 6 hours. The recommended dose for treating  pruritus is 25 mg given 3 or 4 times daily. When used for sedation, the  recommended dose is 50 to 100 mg. Anxiety and tension are managed with 50 to 100  mg 4 times daily. Hydroxyzine can be taken with or without food. 
*DRUG CLASS AND MECHANISM:* Hydroxyzine is an antihistamine with  anticholinergic (drying) and sedative properties that is used to treat allergic  reactions. The body releases histamine during several types of allergic  reactions and--to a lesser extent--during some viral infections, such as the   common cold. When histamine binds to its receptors on cells, it causes the cells  to release chemical messengers that lead to sneezing,  itching, and increased  mucus production. Antihistamines, like histamine, binds to the histamine  receptors, but when they bind to the receptors they do not stimulate the cells  to release chemical messengers. In addition, they prevent histamine from binding  and stimulating the cells. Hydroxyzine itself has no activity. After ingestion,  it is converted to its active form. The active form of hydroxyzine is a drug  called cetirizine (Zyrtec). Although, both hydroxyzine and cetirizine act as  antihistamines, hydroxyzine causes more sedation than cetirizine. The FDA  approved hydroxyzine in 1956. 

*PRESCRIBED FOR:* Hydroxyzine is used for the relief of pruritus (itching)  caused by various allergic conditions. Hydroxyzine is also used for treating   anxiety and tension, and inducing sedation prior to or after anesthesia. 
*DOSING:* Hydroxyzine has its maximal effect about 30 to 60 minutes after it is  taken. Its effects last for 4 to 6 hours. The recommended dose for treating  pruritus is 25 mg given 3 or 4 times daily. When used for sedation, the  recommended dose is 50 to 100 mg. Anxiety and tension are managed with 50 to 100  mg 4 times daily. Hydroxyzine can be taken with or without food.

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## chitown

Have you ever gotten the trots after drinking bad water or water with maybe some dirt ice in it? Or maybe gotten the Bangkok Belly from some dirty Thai street food?

You might have an amoeba or a bacterial infection of the stomach.

A few times, I have spent a few days at some Thai hospitals. I wasted time and money taking their concoction of crappy meds and left the hospital still sick. 

After I left, I took Flagyl and was back on my feet in no time!

Important information about Flagyl 

Take this medication for the entire length of time prescribed by your doctor. Your symptoms may get better before the infection is completely treated. Flagyl will not treat a viral infection such as the common cold or flu. Do not drink alcohol while you are taking this medication and for at least 3 days after you stop taking it. You may have unpleasant side effects such as fast heartbeats, warmth or redness under your skin, tingly feeling, nausea, and vomiting. 

*How should I take Flagyl?*

 Take this medication exactly as it was prescribed for you. Do not take the medication in larger amounts, or take it for longer than recommended by your doctor. Follow the directions on your prescription label.
 Take the extended-release form of metronidazole (Flagyl ER) on an empty stomach, at least 1 hour before or 2 hours after eating a meal. Do not crush, chew, or break the extended-release tablet. Swallow the pill whole. It is specially made to release medicine slowly in the body. Breaking the pill would cause too much of the drug to be released at one time. Take this medication for the entire length of time prescribed by your doctor. Your symptoms may get better before the infection is completely treated. Flagyl will not treat a viral infection such as the common cold or flu. To be sure this medication is not causing harmful effects, your blood will need to be tested on a regular basis. Your liver function may also need to be tested. Do not miss any scheduled visits to your doctor.
 This medication can cause you to have unusual results with certain medical tests. Tell any doctor who treats you that you are using Flagyl.
 Store this medication at room temperature away from moisture and heat. 
*Before taking Flagyl*

 Do not use this medication if you are allergic to metronidazole, or if you are in the first trimester of pregnancy. Tell your doctor if you are pregnant or plan to become pregnant during treatment. Before taking Flagyl, tell your doctor if you are allergic to any drugs, or if you have:
liver disease; a stomach or intestinal disease such as Crohn's disease; a blood cell disorder such as anemia (lack of red blood cells) or leukopenia (lack of white blood cells); epilepsy or other seizure disorder; or nerve disorders.If you have any of these conditions, you may need a dose adjustment or special tests to safely take this medication.
Flagyl can pass into breast milk and may harm a nursing baby. Do not use this medication without telling your doctor if you are breast-feeding a baby.

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## the dogcatcher

Citrus fruitsChocolateCaffeinated drinks or alcoholSpicy, fatty, or fried foodsGarlic and onionsPeppermintTomatoesThat is my complete diet.

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## chitown

Does Thailand's heat cause you to break out with a bit of acne or other bumps, razor burn and boils? (rashes was not the right term to use)

Go to any pharmacy and get some Differin gel 0.1%. 

Dab a little on the problem area and within 24 to 48 hours the blemish is gone. 

500 baht per tube in Thailand, nearly 3000 baht for the same tube in the US.

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## good2bhappy

be careful with flagyl

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## good2bhappy

anaphylactic reactions are not uncommon

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## superman

Any recommendation for itchy crotch and in between the cheeks. I wake in the night scratching.

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## Bangyai

> Any recommendation for itchy crotch and in between the cheeks. I wake in the night scratching.


Either get a new gf or persuade her to do her own scratching.

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## Bangyai

> Does Thailand's heat cause you to break out with a bit of acne or other bumps and rashes?
> 
> Go to any pharmacy and get some Differin gel 0.1%. 
> 
> Dab a little on the problem area and within 24 to 48 hours the blemish is gone. 
> 
> 500 baht per tube in Thailand, nearly 3000 baht for the same tube in the US.


 
Ouch...500 baht not cheap. I am currently at war with a rash in one armpit, rash in my crutch, and a rash on my left hand so I would like to try this if there is a locally made version.

I am currently using a cocktail of 3 anti fungal creams : Canesten, Nizoral and Tonaf ( green ) plus prickly heat powder. All this medication is forcing these rashes into retreat but its up hill work. All brought on by one sweaty days work clearing out a blocked drain at the back of the house.

If you get the trots after some dodgy food I recommend NOXZY, very cheap and available over the counter. For some reason it has a real photo of a man on the moon on the front of the box of 4 tablets. It is basically just immodium so tried and tested. Hell, if it stopped Armstrong crapping for a week it can't be bad.

For acid reflux I take antacil tablets. 10 baht for a sheet of 10. Cheap and pretty effective for mild cases.

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## Spitfire

^If you have a rash on you hand then you should be able to look it up and go in the right direction because very few things cause a rash on the palms of your hand or the sole of your foot.

It is also worth having a look at the 'symptom checker' facility on sites such as 'Wrong Diagnosis" etc, can help you get a general idea of what might be wrong, not a substitute for a decent doc but can enlighten you generally and point you in the right direction.

^^ Itchy crotch can be anything from 'Jock itch' to scabies/crabs and an itchy arse can be ought from irritations to something scary like pinworms. Sure, try the over-the-counter stuff but if it persists then you have to see a doc.

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## chitown

> Originally Posted by chitown
> 
> 
> Does Thailand's heat cause you to break out with a bit of acne or other bumps and rashes?
> 
> Go to any pharmacy and get some Differin gel 0.1%. 
> 
> Dab a little on the problem area and within 24 to 48 hours the blemish is gone. 
> 
> ...


This stuff is more for razor bumps, acne, boils and things such as that.

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## daveboy

Is there anything to help make my hair grow back and help me shed a few pounds ?

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## chitown

> help me shed a few pounds ?


Try Serc 3 times a day. It is for inner ear problems, but they curb your appetite.

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## Spitfire

^^ Not sure about hair but with weight loss then the natural answer is to stay away from eating any carbohydrates after 5pm, eat something other than bread, pasta, rice etc. The other option is a carbohydrate blocker pill that stops you from absorbing calories from these foods but there are conflicting reports about how effective they are, some say great and some say not.

For me personally, I find the best option is the first one, don't eat carbohydrates after 5pm, that tends to work.

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## Bangyai

> ^If you have a rash on you hand then you should be able to look it up and go in the right direction because very few things cause a rash on the palms of your hand or the sole of your foot.
> 
> It is also worth having a look at the 'symptom checker' facility on sites such as 'Wrong Diagnosis" etc, can help you get a general idea of what might be wrong, not a substitute for a decent doc but can enlighten you generally and point you in the right direction.
> 
> ^^ Itchy crotch can be anything from 'Jock itch' to scabies/crabs and an itchy arse can be ought from irritations to something scary like pinworms. Sure, try the over-the-counter stuff but if it persists then you have to see a doc.


Thanks for the advice. The hand rash is not on the palm but on the back of the hand at the thumb base.

The crutch thing is not scabies or crabs as I've smothered meself in anti scabies cream for 48 hours just incase. 

Whatever these things are , I'm winning and every day sees a little improvement but at this rate it could take 3 weeks. My fault for putting off treatment at the onset.

As for seeing the docter. Of course, good advice and I have been tempted a couple of times but the thought of coughing up 1000 baht to probably be given what I'm already taking would end up with me having to be treated for depression as well.

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## daveboy

Thankyou doctors.

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## slackula

> I have a friend that is a doctor that I can email with symptoms, and he does give me free advice.


Does anybody else find it odd that a doctor is giving out advice based on a description of symptoms over the intertubes without actually seeing the patient?

Is any consideration being given to drug interactions or other pre-existing conditions when handing out these 'take x for condition y' suggestions?

My late father was a consultant ophthalmologist and pretty much the only advice he would ever give without seeing the patient in person was 'go and see your doctor' or 'never try to put anything smaller than your elbow into your ear'. 

I know he would not have suggested taking anything much stronger than a paracetamol without more information and a physical examination of the patient.

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## daveboy

^
Well said   :Doh:

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## Panda

> Originally Posted by Spitfire
> 
> 
> ^If you have a rash on you hand then you should be able to look it up and go in the right direction because very few things cause a rash on the palms of your hand or the sole of your foot.
> 
> It is also worth having a look at the 'symptom checker' facility on sites such as 'Wrong Diagnosis" etc, can help you get a general idea of what might be wrong, not a substitute for a decent doc but can enlighten you generally and point you in the right direction.
> 
> ^^ Itchy crotch can be anything from 'Jock itch' to scabies/crabs and an itchy arse can be ought from irritations to something scary like pinworms. Sure, try the over-the-counter stuff but if it persists then you have to see a doc.
> 
> ...


Could be Thrush, aka Candida.

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## chitown

> Does anybody else find it odd that a doctor is giving out advice based on a description of symptoms over the intertubes without actually seeing the patient





> ^
> Well said


I guess I could go to a Thai doctor for professional advice.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## superman

> but with weight loss then the natural answer is to stay away from eating any carbohydrates after 5pm,


That is a myth. It's the amount of food one intakes that causes weigt gain. Not the time it's eaten at.

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## superman

Another medical myth is 'don't drink alcohol when on antibiotics as it reduces their ability to work'. The myth was started when antibiotics were first used to treat STD's. Alcohol can be consumed when taking this medication.

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## slackula

> Alcohol can be consumed when taking this medication.


The NHS would disagree with such a blanket statement:



> It is necessary to completely avoid drinking alcohol when taking the antibiotics described below.
> *Metronidazole*
> 
> Metronidazole is sometimes used to clear dental, or vaginal, infections, or to clear infected leg ulcers, or pressure sores.
> *Tinidazole*
> 
> Tinidazole is sometimes used to treat many of the same infections as metronidazole, as well as to help clear bacteria called Helicobacter pylori (H pylori) from the gut.
> Drinking alcohol when you are taking either metronidazole, or tinidazole, can cause a serious reaction. The symptoms of this reaction include:
> breathlessness,headaches,chest pain,skin flushing,increased, or irregular, heartbeat,low blood pressure (hypotension), andnausea and vomiting.*Other antibiotics that may interact with alcohol*
> ...


Source:

Can I drink alcohol while taking antibiotics?







> I guess I could go to a Thai doctor for professional advice.


It's your choice of course but over the years I have lived here I have had excellent care everywhere from small clinics and govt. hospitals up to the most expensive private hospitals. I think that Thai docs do have a tendency to over prescribe though, but I expect that is due to pressure from hospital admins to increase revenue, not from some fundamental defect in their medical training.

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## chitown

> I think that Thai docs do have a tendency to over prescribe though


True, it seems they always give me the same four or five pills.  :Sad: 





> but I expect that is due to pressure from hospital admins to increase revenue, not from some fundamental defect in their medical training.


This does not help your argument.  :Smile: 

Although in the US, they give you a bunch of test you really don't need and charge you $25 for two Tylenols.  :Sad: 




> It's your choice of course but over the years I have lived here I have had excellent care everywhere from small clinics and govt. hospitals up to the most expensive private hospitals.

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## superman

> The NHS would disagree with such a blanket statement:


 Read "Can you drink alcohol while on antibiotics" on 'WikiAnswers'. The article is written by a Dr Alan Galbraith. I think the definition of antibiotics needs to be varified.

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## slackula

Superman, I am not trying to pick a fight but there are a couple of things here that highlight the dangers of taking medical advice from forums imho.

The first is that virtually anybody can post under the moniker of Dr this or that at wikianswers, it is an inherent weakness that has been exploited several times at wiki sites. 

The second is that you said:



> Another medical myth is 'don't drink alcohol when on antibiotics as it reduces their ability to work'. The myth was started when antibiotics were first used to treat STD's. Alcohol can be consumed when taking this medication.


You said you got this from wikianswers but that is not what wikianswers says, in fact the wiki and the good Dr Galbraith agree with the link I posted:




> "There is no reason whatsoever that alcohol cannot be drunk while on amoxycillin or for *most* antibiotics. I do not know where this urban myth came from but it is very widespread even amongst some of the medical profession. *There is only one group of commonly used drugs which are antibiotics in the wider sense of this term that may cause unpleasant adverse effects when taken with alcohol. These are the imidazoles, of which metronidazole (Flagyl) is the commonest in use.*"


 (bolding added by me)

WikiAnswers - Can you drink alcohol while on antibiotics

You made a blanket statement that drinking and taking antibiotics was not a problem, but that is not entirely correct. 

Now you may argue that the definition of antibiotics is somehow in need of correction but the average muppet like me cannot be expected to know that so saying that _"Alcohol can be consumed when taking this medication"_ is potentially dangerous if you don't provide a link to your source or at least include the proviso that Dr Galbraith saw fit to add.

I concede that reduced effectiveness is not on the list of potential adverse effects of combining alcohol and imidazoles (whatever they are) but that still doesn't justify you implying that mixing booze and antibiotics is completely risk free.

Anyway, as I said I am not trying to pick a fight mate, but I always feel that medical threads along with legal threads either need to be backed up with reliable citations and links or at least IANAL/D (I am not a lawyer/doctor) type disclaimers when advice is being offered.

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## superman

Chill 'Slac'. Obviously you're a better read person than I am. I therefore accept what you say to be true. I may have been wrong in my statement that antibiotics aren't affected by the consumption of alcohol. I can only go by what I've read. Never the less, I will still consume alcohol when on antibiotics, my choice.

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## slackula

> Obviously you're a better read person than I am.


Absolutely not, my only intention was to highlight the flaws of internet forum medical advice, nothing personal was intended.




> I will still consume alcohol when on antibiotics, my choice.


Indeed it is your choice, and I have done the same before but only after a bit of time spent googling to see if there were any unpleasant effects in my future.

I apologise if I am coming across as a patronising git, that really wasn't my intention.  :Sad:

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## ENT

*A diet high in dairy products assists in weight loss by increasing calcium intake, so removing ingested fats.*

Skim milk, hard cheeses, cottage cheese and plain acidophilus yoghurt consumed as often as you wish will make you feel fuller too.
Exercise workouts are *not* necessary for weight loss on this regime, but *sleeping/resting helps* instead.
Dairy foods will also neutralise acid stomach/heartburn. Eating an *apple* is another *good antacid* remedy.

Cutting *down on carbs*. in *favour of proteins* also reduces body fat production.
Pastas, potatoes, rice and bread and sugars in excess will all metabolise into body fat if they are not burned off by activity.
Beer has heaps of carbs!
The brain needs 150 gm of glucose per day to function normally, increasing that amount *before* strenuous exercise or study is recommended.

Keeping *meal sizes small* causes the stomach to shrink, so that you feel full after food easier, thus eating less.
Eat as much porridge oats or muesli as you like with skim milk, instead of snacking and in place of potatoes, cakes, pastries and pastas.

Eat as much as you like of the *small, the young, growing and reproductive parts of*  all edible plants and animals for the best *RNA protein*, which are the essential building blocks for repair and growth of all animals.

Beans/legumes/grain/seed sprouts,*(raw*) the tips of vegetables,(asparagus, artichoke, brussells sprouts, brocolli),  all seeds, pollen, flowers and fruits, eggs, fish roes (caviar), sardines and other small fish such as whitebait, herring, mackerel and salmon all contain high levels of RNA protein.

Eating *raw foods*, especially vegetables, ensures a *high live enzyme intake* level, it assists in digesting the food, reducing the use of your own body enzymes which are used for other body functions, repair and growth, instead.

*A typical daily diet for me, more or less*
*Breakfast*
Vits B,C,E + iron and glass of milk.
Coffee ( fresh ground, <2 cups) and a cigar.   :Smile: 
Fruit juice,(orange or tomato, usually).
*Later.Snack #1*
Whitebait patties (125gm = one egg, salt and pepper, fried in olive oil)
Glass of milk.
*Snack #2*
Acidophilus yoghurt (350 cc) with honey, sometimes.
*#3*
Avocado on wholemeal toast (2 slices)
Cottage cheese and caviar on top, squeeze of lemon, a dash of salt and pepper.
Glass of milk.+Vit C.
*#4*
Cold meats, (corned beef, tongue)
Cheeses, with olives, tomato, onions, garlic, bean sprouts.
Slice of wholemeal or rye bread.
Glass of milk. Vit C.
*#5*
Broccoli soup, prepared in a blender, then heated.(various recipes) + added yoghurt.
*#6*
Bananas and other fruits
*#7*
Muesli with milk
Vits B,C,E Iron.
*#8*
Steamed mussels or salmon, or suchi with nori and wasabi
Steamed rice.
A glass or two of red wine, good spliff sometimes.

A couple of pints of home made stout and a few cups of real tea, more fruit juice and milk keep my taste buds happy.
Other days, I'll substitute a fish meal with a damn good home made Indian curry.
A big steak and kidney pie will give me six big serves, for a cold lunch to take out.
A few suchi rolls in nori will keep well in a fridge, also good to take out for an away from home meal with my flask of Darjeeling tea.
I'll also make a big batch of scones or pikelets or bake a rich fruit cake, indulge myself, once in a while.

I rarely buy canned, prepared, processed or fast foods for normal consumption, except for cheeses. Sometimes, only.

*Itchy balls, crutch, arse, armpits, under tits, waistline and other rashes.*
Usually the result of damp and heat, encouraging weird biota to take over.

Shower, use soap, dry thoroughly.
Powder with *cornflour,* it dries your skin better than any other powder, will absorb moisture and is sterile. Can be washed off easily.
For sub-cutaneous eruptions, use wintergreen oil or paste, that bloody strong green "tiger-balm" stuff that Muai Thai guys use.
Anything wosre, use an antibiotic powder.

Headaches and other bodily pains can be alleviated by using willow bark or tips in a tea, nature's aspirin.
Congestion, can be alleviated by drinking sage tea.

Sleepless? Have a spliff, some O, or some chamomile tea.
Hangovers, headaches? A spliff works.
Loss of appetite? Suck on a spliff.
Alcohol problems? Have a spliff.
Stomach upsets, the running trots etc? Manuka (T-tree) bark or tips in hot water, or chew on them.
Hair loss? You're doomed., have a spliff.

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## rickschoppers

> Another medical myth is 'don't drink alcohol when on antibiotics as it reduces their ability to work'. The myth was started when antibiotics were first used to treat STD's. Alcohol can be consumed when taking this medication.


Not good advice. It is not that antibiotics or other medication will not work if you consume alcohol, it is that alcohol changes the absorption rate of medication. This can cause uneven blood levels and in some cases cause problems. Definately don't take alcohol with any central nervous system depressants unless you want to wind up like Marilyn Monroe or some other dead celebrities.

DO NOT drink alcohol while taking Flagyl (Metronidazole) since it has an antabuse affect, which is not pleasant. I am surprised that this has not been already mentioned. If it has, my apologies.

One has to be careful when giving medical advice dealing with potentially lethal medication. I have tried to only recommend those medications that have a good safety profile. If you have a serious problem, seek professional attention.

Just my two cents worth.

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## Rural Surin

> Originally Posted by Spitfire
> 
> but with weight loss then the natural answer is to stay away from eating any carbohydrates after 5pm,
> 
> 
> That is a myth. It's the amount of food one intakes that causes weigt gain. Not the time it's eaten at.


Type and quality of food may be the largest contributor to the proverbial weight gain.

Instinctive cultural gluttony may be a close second.

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## ENT

I refuse to imbibe big pharma poisons.

The usual story with them is take a pill for this, then a counter balancer for that side effect, followed by the newer version because the first lot is starting to use it's efficacity.
That's just the regulatory chemicals.

Move on to antibiotics and once they're in your system, prescribed for any damn thing these days, your own immune reaction goes on the blink and doesn't recover at all for about six weeks after the antibiotic course.

You're then open to any other infection around!
So you've got to start again on another round of medications that simply throw your whole body system out of kilter.

The only winners in that game of pills is Big Pharma and the quacks peddling the drugs.

Keep a healthy balanced diet and life style and you'll never get sick, or if you do, you'll recover quickly without chemicals and antibiotics.

Some folk I know have a veritable bloody pharmacy in their homes, and even encourage others to get on that drug dependency kick pushed by their greedy doctors.

My mother, who was doing well in her 80s, suffered from diabetes, but continued with her good diet with minerals and vitamins and physical activity until her "carers" decided to move her into a "home" and switch her over to antibiotics for bouts of urinary tract and lung infections, caused by careless toilet habits and neglect.

She deteriorated on the new regime of medications and was dead within a year.

Herbal medicines are the bases from which most if not all modern medication is derived, so why not use the source compounds instead of the calcium loaded carcinogenic chemical sweetened crap pushed by Big Pharma drug dealers?

I *do* use an antibiotic topically but bloody rarely and internally only in emergencies, but it has to be a life or death situation.

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## Dan

> Keep a healthy balanced diet and life style and you'll never get sick,  or if you do, you'll recover quickly without chemicals and antibiotics.


Ridiculously bad advice.

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## ENT

:smiley laughing:

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## Rural Surin

Sponsored by the ubiquitous and omnipresent [allopathetic] Medical and Pharmaceutical Industrial Complex Mafia.

Edward Bernays is feeling his oats.

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## chitown

> Keep a healthy balanced diet and life style and you'll never get sick,  or if you do, you'll recover quickly without chemicals and antibiotics.
> 			
> 		
> 
> Ridiculously bad advice.


Why is that?  :Sad:

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## Dan

Because having better health through diet and exercise is not the same as having perpetually perfect health through diet and exercise, though resumably ENT recognizes this fact since after coming out with the secret to eternal youth, he says "I *do* use an antibiotic."

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## chitown

> Because having better health through diet and exercise is not the same as having perpetually perfect health through diet and exercise, though resumably ENT recognizes this fact since after coming out with the secret to eternal youth, he says "I *do* use an antibiotic."


He says you will never get sick OR if you do you will recover quickly. 

It has been my experience. Also if you you worry, think about being ill or talk about Beijing ill or illnesses all the time, you will attract illness. The mind is very powerful.

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## Dan

> He says you will never get sick OR if you do you will recover quickly.


Yes. I can read my own posts and I can also read his: he says you don't need to take antibiotics but he does. Maybe it's me but that looks a little contradictory.

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## ENT

Mind is an extremely powerful tool, especially in self healing.

This is why I don't indulge in beliefs, as such, for doing so will make the power of belief weaker as it's wasted on mundane things and becomes ordinary and unremarkable in effect.

If one needs to summon up the psychological will needed to overcome a great trauma, it's essential that one uses that energy wisely by conserving its use for greater challenges in life.

This is getting towards esoteric systems of self control, I know, but non less valid than other psychological tools, IMO.

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## chitown

I forgot about this thread. Funny, the only pill I still take at the moment is for acid reflux. But I could probably go off it. When I am in the US the food gives me acid reflux. In Thailand I do not suffer from it.

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## FlyFree

Aspirin's good. For everything.

Now if I could source some medical marijuana.

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## Rural Surin

> Aspirin's good. For everything.
> 
> Now if I could source some medical marijuana.


I find medical peyote quite helpful.

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## FlyFree

> Originally Posted by FlyFree
> 
> 
> Aspirin's good. For everything.
> 
> Now if I could source some medical marijuana.
> 
> 
> I find medical peyote quite helpful.


Sounds very helpful, medically speaking. Maybe even better than aspirin.




> We listened to Jimi Hendrix wich was realy great end we started to draw  living things on the wall with wasco's. A cat came in and started  licking my hand and it gave me orgasms and the cat looked like a rainbow  and I could see the life in it.


I think Socal needs some medication.

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## ENT

> He says you will never get sick OR if you do you will recover quickly.
> 			
> 		
> 
> Yes. I can read my own posts and I can also read his: he says you don't need to take antibiotics but he does. Maybe it's me but that looks a little contradictory.


You obviously have not read either my post nor your own clearly.

I said that I will* use* an antibiotic topically but *rarely* and internally only in a life or death case.

One natural antibiotic is penicillin, a green mould that you find everywhere, on bread and on the shadow side of trees and caught on spiderwebs
You can use it raw on badly infected cuts and internally.
Ausie Abos have been using it for generations, so did ancient Egyptians, the Chinese and Brythonic Celts.

*How to use.*
Apply green mouldy bread, soy beans or rice, or green mould scraped off a tree or a spider's web from the bush directly to the infected wound 

You can also eat the green mouldy stuff.   :Smile: 

If you can grow enough of it, a warm dark place helps, treating what you'ce collected by mixing it with water and salt will cause the penicillin mould cell walls to break down and then the resulting juice can be drunk or added to a a vaseline or glycrine base to apply to the skin for topical infections.

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## Dan

See if you can spot any problems with this. It's what you said, but re-formed a little:

(i) You don't need to take antibiotics to stay healthy or return to heath.
(ii) I sometimes take antibiotics.

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## chitown

> One natural antibiotic is penicillin, a green mould that you find everywhere, on bread and on the shadow side of trees and caught on spiderwebs
> You can use it raw on badly infected cuts and internally.
> Ausie Abos have been using it for generations, so did ancient Egyptians, the Chinese and Brythonic Celts.
> 
> *How to use.*
> Apply green mouldy bread, soy beans or rice, or green mould scraped off a tree or a spider's web from the bush directly to the infected wound 
> 
> You can also eat the green mouldy stuff.


So what do I do. I am allergic to penicillin  ::chitown::

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## blue

My shoulder has been very painful for over 3 months 
I've self diagnosed it as a frozen shoulder
I don't have a doctor ,and have not seen one for 7 years
instead  I'm following Dr Hippocrates comment
"To do nothing is also a good remedy."

combined with the Tommy Cooper line
''I said to the doctor, it hurts when I do this. He said don't do it then. ''

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## Rural Surin

Any pharmaceutical advice towards sociopathic desires?

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## ENT

^^^ Chitown.  
                                                                                                                                                                            There are other antibiotics such as amoxyllin which may be more suitable for you.
The old sulfa-methysin drugs were the standby, even when I was a kid.

But do you seriously need antibiotics?
As I pointed out, they are only essential in a life or death situation when all else fails.

The old remedy until then was simply amputation of an infected wound or the cutting out of deep seated infections such as in osteomyelitis, where va blood infection has seated itself in a weak part of the bone.
This happened to my eldest daughter, and she had to have the bone scraped to remove the infection.

Keeping fit, keeping all circulatory systems functioning and a sound and healthy diet with as few stimulants and narcotics as possible will ensure that the body functions properly.

As you pointed out, think sick and you'll be sick.
Conversely, put your mind on what you're doing and your own bio-energy, your Ki will direct your healing functions.
The Chinese concentrated on the liver as the source of well being and the seat of the soul.

I use that trick to concentrate on self healing.
Try it, just say to your liver, "Heal me.", and that organic bio-lab will start to kick into action.

Tobacco, ganja, other drugs and alcohol will seriously deplete your body of Vits B and C, so take added vitamins, especially Vit C in more frequent small doses than normal, up to 400 times the so called daily minimum requirement.

I will take as much ascorbic acid powder as will cover my little finger nail every twenty minutes to get the optimum amount of ascorbate into me. Vitamin C is essential for the proper healing of all wounds and clearing of infections.
Iro, zinc a d selenium are other elements that help the body catalyse bio-chemical processes in you.
Vit A, also a great catalyst, found in dairy products, eggs and so on.

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## ENT

> See if you can spot any problems with this. It's what you said, but re-formed a little:
> 
> (i) You don't need to take antibiotics to stay healthy or return to heath.
> (ii) I sometimes take antibiotics.


Ok, reformed a little;
Point (i) True, you don't _have_ to take antibiotics to stay healthy or return to health.
Point (ii) I _do_ take antibiotics either topically or orally but *only in a life or death situation*.

To qualify,*sometimes* means maybe six times ever in my life.   
Once with a burst appendix, once with a badly infected tooth and jaw arising from injury, once after a serious MVA all (oral doses).                                                                                                                                           Twice for skin infections, (topically, a powder) and once for a really bad case of conjuntivitis,(drops). 

The last three times were all in Thailand within the last three years.

OK?

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## ENT

> My shoulder has been very painful for over 3 months 
> I've self diagnosed it as a frozen shoulder
> I don't have a doctor ,and have not seen one for 7 years
> instead  I'm following Dr Hippocrates comment
> "To do nothing is also a good remedy."
> 
> combined with the Tommy Cooper line
> ''I said to the doctor, it hurts when I do this. He said don't do it then. ''


Get a bicycle inner tube and fasten one end of it to a wall at about elbow level, hold the other end by the affected hand.
Turn to face away from the wall, then pull the inner tube from as far back as you can reach to as far forward as possible.
Do that twenty times, repeat the exercise frequently.

Find a shelf or fridge who's top is below the height of your shoulder.
Place your palm on that surface and turn your body 180 degrees away from itto , so that your arm is stretched out behind you.
Bend your knees to gradually lower your body, then rise.
It'll hurt like hell; but persist,Do this ten times. Repeat frequently.
Your frozen shoulder will get better over about a couple of weeks.
Don't use steroids.

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## rickschoppers

^^^

I believe Chitown stated he was allergic to penicillin. If it is a "true" allergy, he would not be able to take Amoxicillin or any other penicillin derivative without risking the same allergic raction.

Personally, I do believe in taking antibiotics. Not how they are given in most of the world, but for proven infections. The only way to know what antibiotic to give is to have a culture and sensitivity done which shows which anitbiotic the bug is suseptable to. If more doctors ordered these instead of just "guessing" , there would be fewer visits to the doctor and less resistance due to antibiotic overuse.

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## Dan

> Ok, reformed a little;
> Point (i) True, you don't _have_ to take antibiotics to stay healthy or return to health.
> Point (ii) I _do_ take antibiotics either topically or orally but *only in a life or death situation*.


If i is true, then ii is unnecessary (perhaps you take antibiotics for fun) and if ii is true (and true because the alternative is death), then i is false.

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## Rural Surin

> The only way to know what antibiotic to give is to have a culture and sensitivity done which shows which anitbiotic the bug is suseptable to. If more doctors ordered these instead of just "guessing" , there would be fewer visits to the doctor and less resistance due to antibiotic overuse.


Nice. This is old school. And the proper manner in which to prescribe the correct antibiotic to said ailment.....which is never practiced.

With all the sorted antibiotics for every conceivable bacteria and than taken in to account the individual reaction to any of them.

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## rickschoppers

^
Yes, old school and correct practice. What this does is allow a physician (or pharmacist) choose a narrower spectrum antibiotic which also reduces resistance. It is the "big gun" antibiotics that kill everything and thus cause some antibiotics to be ineffective since the bacteria gets smart and developes the resistance. Typically these narrow spectrum antibiotics are pennies compared to the newer antibiotics that the drug companies make millions/billions on.

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## ENT

Good info. mate.
Over use willy nilly of antibiotics does more harm than good, and is often unnecessary.

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## Rural Surin

> Good info. mate.
> Over use willy nilly of antibiotics does more harm than good, and is often unnecessary.


And to think that there are numerous occasions in which a doctor will prescribe any old antibiotic for a common hard cold......you've heard the stories.

Whether he/she is a lazy kunt with ill-advised practices or they just need to coddle their patient - who of course insist on an antibiotic for a virus.

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## mecht004

I know! Always stock up on meds, especially prescription when traveling, especially to Malaysia. Easy to get meds there from pharmacies, original-no fakes and much cheaper and discounted in bulk with no questions asked. Sometimes frens give me shopping list for them Lol. 

Recently also found a good site for oral HIV test kits. Safe as no blood required just a saliva swab from gums, testing for HIV antibodies. If interested can check out site called rapid-kits.com

Usually have a few handy. Thinking of doing regular testing for potential new employees. Can do privately especially some cultures shy and no doctors cos they have to report in some countries. Troublesome.  :yerman:

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## RickThai

I have no problem buying antibiotics and painkillers, but I would hesitate to buy any prescription drug (without expert medical advice), that I have never used before, or if I am currently taking some other heavy-duty drugs.

Even medical doctors screw-up and prescribe meds that may not be compatible with other meds you are taking.

Sure you might save a lot of money (especially in areas where doctor visits run $200.00- $300.00 a pop), but if you wind up killing yourself, or letting a serious condition get even worse, the price you pay may be your life!.

If you insist on following "internet advice" or the advice of non-medical people, then I would encourage you to at least check out the "contra-indications" on the drug manufactures website.

There are some really dangerous medicines out there.  If you don't believe me check out "amiodarone", that was a med I once had prescribed for me.  It can kill you in two or three different ways (besides making you blind and deaf!).

Cheers to All,

RickThai

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## rickschoppers

^
100% correct. Always research any medication you are thinking about taking or giving to a loved one. Paracetamol(Acetaminophen) is a perfect example. This medication is contained in most cold preparations and is used for pain and fever. The lethal daily dose is around 4000mg or 4 grams which is not a lot of tablets if you are taking something for a cold, aches and pains and fever. I have seen physicians in the hospital prescribe well over this dose and we have had to call them to back things down.

Most physicians know very little about drug campatablility and I once had a heart surgeon tell me Adenosine was a "safe" drug. Needless to say we got into a heated debate in a large medical meeting and I ultimately walked out since he called me stupid. After about a year, he finally admitted he was wrong. Just take a look at Adenosine as a drug and see if anyone here thinks that it is "safe."

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## ENT

> Ok, reformed a little;
> Point (i) True, you don't _have_ to take antibiotics to stay healthy or return to health.
> Point (ii) I _do_ take antibiotics either topically or orally but *only in a life or death situation*.
> 			
> 		
> 
> If i is true, then ii is unnecessary (perhaps you take antibiotics for fun) and if ii is true (and true because the alternative is death), then i is false.


You're just playing little word games.
Antibiotics are well over used and prescribed.

They are not necessary in most cases of infection, and necessary only in extreme cases.

Stop splitting hairs.

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## DrAndy

> A diet high in dairy products assists in weight loss by increasing calcium intake, so removing ingested fats.


do you have a link for that - it doesn't seem logical

and what about the amount of Chloresterol consumed in dairy products?

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## DrAndy

> The lethal daily dose is around 4000mg or 4 grams


no, not lethal but possibly harmful to liver and/or kidneys

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## DrAndy

> Antibiotics are well over used and prescribed. They are not necessary in most cases of infection, and necessary only in extreme cases


they are over-prescribed but are useful in many cases

if you have an infection, in your throat for example, do you take antibiotics to help clear it up or do you just wait and hope that it gets better soon

when it has become worse, do you take antibiotics or keep hoping it will go away?

when you are then so sick with a high temperature and miserable/bedridden, the antibiotics will then be necessary, but why wait?

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## BaitongBoy

^




> Stop splitting hairs.


Somebody can't read 'too good'...

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## ENT

> Originally Posted by ENT
> 
> A diet high in dairy products assists in weight loss by increasing calcium intake, so removing ingested fats.
> 
> 
> do you have a link for that - it doesn't seem logical
> 
> and what about the amount of Chloresterol consumed in dairy products?


I've been trying to find that link for weeks.
The doco. was aired by BBC a few months ago now, maybe June last year.

I was surprised too.
The guts of it was that an increase in low fat dairy food and more rest and sleep caused a greater weight reduction than dieting and/or a low carb. and high exercise regime.

I stick to pretty much that diet now, have done for years, along with low carbs/high protein, Vits and minerals and moderate exercise. I also nap frequently.

Excess alcohol, and my weight goes up fast, especially with Guinness!

If I find the link again I'll post it, but there are some other links to similar vids, some pro. some con. the theory.

As for cholesterol, eating oily fish and less animal fats is a good idea, but eating a good serving of onions, shallots, leeks and especially garlic daily reduces cholesterol levels in the blood rapidly.

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## ENT

> Originally Posted by ENT
> 
> Antibiotics are well over used and prescribed. They are not necessary in most cases of infection, and necessary only in extreme cases
> 
> 
> they are over-prescribed but are useful in many cases
> 
> if you have an infection, in your throat for example, do you take antibiotics to help clear it up or do you just wait and hope that it gets better soon
> 
> ...


Sore throats and other mouth and lung infections I deal with by using wintergreen or Thai green tiger balm, used by MuaiThai folk. Just inhale the fumes. Eucalyptus oil works too. It kills all the germs on the surface of your mucous membranes.

A high dairy product diet, esp. milk, will increase mucus production, the body's natural flushing system, as it acts as a barrier against all particulates in the air we breath, or if you smoke.

I use sage to encourage expectoration of excess mucus and use Vit C frequently, small doses several times a day, to boost the immune system.

Gargling with salt water is very effective in oral hygiene, or in treating open cuts and some skin infections. Dry thoroughly after.
Expose the body to sunlight, too, it kills a lot of infection.

It works for me and all those who use these methods combined, that I know of.

Any infections that I get never last long.

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## DrAndy

> As for cholesterol, eating oily fish and less animal fats is a good idea, but eating a good serving of onions, shallots, leeks and especially garlic daily reduces cholesterol levels in the blood rapidly.


as you say, make sure the dairy product is low fat

Does garlic really reduce chloresterol significantly?  do you need to eat a kilo a day, or garlic concentrated pills?

I eat a fair amount of garlic but my chloresterol levels stay the same as before

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## ENT

Eat about 5 large cloves of garlic a day to reduce LDL cholesterol rapidly.Shallotts, leeks onions, all good, reduce bad cholesterol.
(LDL = Low Density Lipids) lock on to High DL (good cholesterol) and are broken down in the liver to be digested instead of depositing along artery walls.

Porridge oats, (the best breakfast  :Smile: ), all nuts and seeds contain fibre, HDLs and Vit E, good for cholesterol reduction.
All small fish and oily fish have high levels of RNA protein (good for repair) and Omega 3 oils which are again HDLs which knock out the LDLs( bad cholesterol lipids)

If you ate all the foods in this post you'll improve your good cholesterol levels massively and remember to walk, the best exercise.

----------


## rickschoppers

> Originally Posted by rickschoppers
> 
> The lethal daily dose is around 4000mg or 4 grams
> 
> 
> no, not lethal but possibly harmful to liver and/or kidneys


OK, it is the maximum daily dose, but there are many cases of liver toxicity and death at lesser dosages. The 4000mg was the red flag to any pharmacist that knows a person is taking multiple medications containing acetaminophen. This is one of the small facts that most doctor's miss. Also, there are usually multiple doctors prescribing for medication in the States and physicians rarely check the patient's entire list of drugs before prescribing more.

Lethal is a relative term in the sense that deadly doses are different for everyone and I should have been a little more specific. It is just that I have treated so many acetaminophen overdoses that I wanted to drive home the point that too much can lead to liver failure and ultimately death.

----------


## rickschoppers

> Originally Posted by ENT
> 
> Antibiotics are well over used and prescribed. They are not necessary in most cases of infection, and necessary only in extreme cases
> 
> 
> they are over-prescribed but are useful in many cases
> 
> if you have an infection, in your throat for example, do you take antibiotics to help clear it up or do you just wait and hope that it gets better soon
> 
> ...


Because this is how overuse occurs. Most physicians claim they know a viral infection when they see one, but that is bs. Without a throat culture, how can one be sure, so must physicians play the odds and prescribe antibiotics for both viral and bacterial infection. Live I have said before, do a throat culture and then you will know if the infection is viral or bacterial and also be able to prescribe a narrower spectrum antibiotic which reduces resistance.

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## rickschoppers

ENT, taking an alternative medicine approach is to be commended, but you would still need to sparingly use antibiotics in some cases. I would rather see infections cured by other means than antibiotics but this is not always possible.

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## ENT

You are quite right Ricky,                                                                                                                                                                             As I mentioned in an earlier post, I have taken an antibiotic in extreme situations only.

Once (orally) when recovering in hospital from a MVA, (hospital bugs can be deadly).
Once (orally) when I had to fly to UK from NZ with a badly infected root canal job.
Once (orally) for a badly infected jaw after getting some broken teeth.
Once (eye drops) for a _ta deng_ (conjunctivitis) infection, a really nasty one I caught in Lao a couple of years back.
Twice (topical) for skin infections in Asia.

Any other time, I've occasionally used spider web or bread mould (green, penicillin) to good effect on infected cuts from time to time.
That's about it.  :Smile:

----------


## rickschoppers

^
How do you determine a dose when eating bread mold or other natural sources?

----------


## ENT

Eating bread mould can cure a bad case of acid indigestion, a stomach infection.
Eat a small amount of green penicillin mouldy bread, about enough green mould to cover your thumb nail.
That should do the trick, but if it's still there after a few hours (the symptoms should have eased by then), eat the same amount again.
Repeated small doses is best.

Normally I find apple the best for acid indigestion symptoms, or eat a piece of cheese, or if all else fails a flat teaspoon of baking soda in  a small glass of milk works wonders.

I don't do that for lower bowel problems, such as flatulence, where undigested proteins in the large intestine can ferment.
This is an uncomfortable problem especially for older folk, you fart a lot and guts are bubbling away.
The best I've found for that is acidophilus yoghurt, a pint at a time as the acidophilus is destroyed in digestion unless you literally flood the stomach and alimentary tract with yoghurt, so only partly digesting that volume. 
The acidophilus bacterium digest the yeasts in the large intestine that cause the fermentation.

Using penicillin mould for cuts is straight forward.
Separate most of mould from the mouldy slice and make a paste with water from the mouldy bits and pack onto the cut like a poultice.
A few hours (one or two) will tell you if you need to repeat the process. The same goes for spider web.

If dosing with home made penicillin extract, again, no more than half a teaspoon at a time of the juice.
Because of the salt used to extract it, it tastes a bit funny so you can mix it with milk and a touch of honey.

If severe pains persist or there's an accompanying fever get to a doctor fast.
Self diagnosis can be tricky at times.

----------


## ENT

Experimental hit and miss was the method I used, the same way I learned to identify/differentiate between narcotic and poisonous plants and edible ones.

The trick is to place a small amount in the mouth first and keep it there for fifteen minutes.
If there is no ill effect, then swallow the sample.
If there is no ill effect after fifteen minutes in the gut, then the food is edible.
If pain or queesyness occurs, regurgitate the stuff and drink milk after.

If you just get a high, then you've found some trippy stuff, enjoy!

The same goes for penicillin mould.
A small amount in the mouth to test, then swallow, if ok, wait a while and repeat.
If symptoms of infection start to reduce within a few hours, you've found the right dosage.

There are books on bush medicine, and I daresay if I look some remedies up on the web now I'd find some recipes.

----------

