#  >  > Living And Legal Affairs In Thailand >  >  > Thailand and Asia News >  >  > Business, Finance & Economics in Thailand >  >  Teakdoors stock portfolio

## Spin

Ok, lets see if we can make some imaginary money to donate to Teakdoor.
Ive been watching and waiting for a few companies to pull back from recent highs and today the price levels have reached lower than I was expecting.

Lets look at the companies I've chosen...

Potash This is a fertilizer company based in Canada.

Mosiac Another fertilizer company.

MonsantoThis company supplies seeds (including genetically modified stuff)


First SolarThis company makes solar panels and are a market leader.

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## Spin

So heres how the Teakdoor donation portfolio looks right now, since I placed the trades the market has moved in our favour and were up 4600$ :Smile:  DD needs much more than that to maintain his swanky lifestyle so lets not take any profits just yet, we need to make big so that DD can barfine whole sois and ship them home in a convoy of bahtbusses :Smile: 

Because we are using imaginary money, I spent big, way more than i can afford to do in real life :Sad:  That little lot cost over 105,000 U$

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## Spin

Ok so the market closed early today, 1pm eastern USA time. We made 4722$ in just a few short hours. The markets closed tomorrow as its July 4th and most yankies will be watching re-runs of the movie "Independance day" and whooping and throwing popcorn at their tellys  :Smile: 
Anything could happen on Monday though. We might lose the whole lot or we could make some more cash and put a smile on DD face.

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## Spin

Talk about talking to yourself :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 

Here is a link to some charts so you can see where things are at for each company.....
First Solar
Potash
Monsanto
Mosiac

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## Jet Gorgon

Interesting picks, Spin. But you are almost wholly weighted in the agro sector, with a solar company thrown in...hehe
Monsanto is a big co, but I do not like its operating mentality -- farmers must buy its GM seeds every year, rather than saving seeds to replant. The company also gets farmers to snitch on each other if one of them sneaks last year's seedlings for sowing. I think the co is doing well in developing countries.
I would add a few financials in the mix, oil service companies (the guys who lease and fix rigs) and utilities for stability. Haven't picked any yet.

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## Thormaturge

Potash Corporation has been a favourite of mine for the past year, and I mentioned it on here a while back. Above is their performance chart for the past 12 months.

The recent fallback is probably due to speculative profit taking.

I wouldn't want to be holding any stock in financial institutions, and in particular insurance companies.  Not only will there be a deluge of legitimate claims but the number of people torching warehouses, sinking ships and setting light to the hearthrug for an few extra bucks is going to soar as the world lurches deeper into recession.  Additional loss adjusting costs and increased claims will cripple the insurance industry.

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## NickA

I will give you a piece of advice that I have gained from many many years of working in the money markets. I'm now a retired multi-millionaire.

buy low, sell high

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## mrsquirrel

^ You can do something similar on MSN Spin and set up a group where we compete.

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## Spin

> But you are almost wholly weighted in the agro sector, with a solar company thrown


Just on this thread jet, it real life I have a slightly wider choice, but lets face it, with so many sectors in trouble there isnt much to choose from. These four are the one that should move up again quickly and solve all DD's sandwich buying problems.



> The recent fallback is probably due to speculative profit taking.


Yes, I'm pretty sure its a buying opportunity. Buy when others are dumping shares of good companies for no good reason is how I approach things.



> You can do something similar on MSN Spin and set up a group where we compete.


great idea, how many are up for it? perhaps we can get some tips from each other....



> buy low, sell high


Much easier said than done Nick unfortunatley :Sad:

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## Rattanaburi

Interesting thread, Spin. I will be interested in seeing if you've made good choices. Too bad you don't have any lower-priced stocks to suggest!

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## Spin

> I would add a few financials in the mix


I'm keeping an eye on them and have a couple of targets in mind. Purchasing US housing companies is something I want to do also (Toll Brothers in one i will buy i think). Problem is, just when you look at these companies and think "damn they're cheap now" a few days later they fall another 10-15% or whatever! It like catching a falling knife isnt it?
I think just nibbling away at a position 10 or 20 shares per month in companies like Citi might be a good policy. At those levels if things go Bear Stearns the losses should be minimal. Long term, its a double your money situation I feel.
Jet, which financials would you recommend?

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## Agent_Smith

Would now be a good time to sell my Enron stock or should I wait for a turnaround?  :bunny3:

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## Spin

Been sniffing around for more relative bargains and FCX Freeport McMoran copper and gold mining company looks pretty beaten up this week. No real reason other than the fact this stock gets dumped heavily when the market gets choppy. Have made money on this one before as it tends to rebound pretty quickly after sell offs. I added 200 at fridays closing price of 108.64$

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## bkkandrew

Can we use the fund to short stocks? I think more money could be made...

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## Spin

Yeah sure, but the bloomberg thing doesnt show shorts :Sad:  But we can do the maths ourselves.
Actually I was planning to shift most of the longs i bought into shorts when the technicals indicate any overbought situation but thats a few weeks away yet.
What companies do you have in mind?

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## bkkandrew

Barrett Developments. BDEV:IX
HBOS:IX

Both fallen sharply, but have a long way to go.

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## GooMaiRoo

Fertilizer companies like TNH, MOS, POT and SQM were a good call a year ago but have become a bubble of their own and really dropped off the past month or so. I'm not so sure how to take advantage of the financial chaos that seems to be unfolding. A US exchange traded fund 'ultra-short' of the financials called SKF has been good to me. It also helps me to revel in the misery of those as*sholes. Some of the small long-term US water and electric infrastructure companies such as CLHB, AZZ and BMI seem immune to the US downturn. The Vietnamese stock market has been the worst performer in the world this year and this can't continue seeing how smart and hard-working the Vietnamese are compared to others in the region (and how much foreign investment is going there), but there's little transparency and the only vehicle I know to invest there is a battered US pink-sheet Vietnamese fund called VTOPF.PK. Another US exchange traded fund for agricultural firms, DBA, might be a good choice.

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## GooMaiRoo

> Barrett Developments. BDEV:IX
> HBOS:IX   Both fallen sharply, but have a long way to go.


I like the way you think. As a small investor who does my own research and doesn't have the wherewithal to actually short individual stocks, I can easily buy short ETFs such as SKF (mentioned in my previous post). Without going too far off-topic, does anyone have ideas on contra-funds, short ETFs and other ways to profit from a downturn of a specific sector without actually shorting individual stocks? It might also be a way to spread the shorting risk with our imaginary TD portfolio.

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## Spin

> Fertilizer companies like TNH, MOS, POT and SQM were a good call a year ago but have become a bubble of their own


I agree to a certain extent but i think theres a little bit more milage to be had on the upside yet.

Skf has been good to me also, maybe the financials are oversold right now and a rally might pan out in the near future. Be looking to take a position if it pulls back to 120 ish.

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## Butterfly

I am buying nuclear stocks, should be fun

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## Stubi

What a rubbish here. I did a lot of trading and was very successful - I simply had luck. My advice - if anybody wants to give you help in such a case, think about it and him. The future is tomorrow - but what will happen the next minutes??? We all might have problems to understand today... And if you do not like or understand the purpose of  casinos then stay away from other gambling. There is not much difference in the end - perhaps they sell it to you in a different way. Never forget - it is their BUSINESS and your HOPE. A bad start for YOU.

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## Spin

Stubi, take a look at this chart, Here
Can you see anything in this chart that would contradict a reversal in the stock anytime in the next few days? Please include any specific opinion as all positive and constructive comments are welcome.

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## Jet Gorgon

^ Um, yes, quite.

If it's utilities with nuke-generating power, it's a maybe, but you never know -- if Obama gets in, not much chance for more nuke stations. Westinghouse & GE are plant makers and there's a new 8-member utilties group -- NuStart -- that's looking into feasibility. Some say plants could be on line by 2014.




> Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon
> 
> I would add a few financials in the mix
> 
> 
> I'm keeping an eye on them and have a couple of targets in mind. Purchasing US housing companies is something I want to do also (Toll Brothers in one i will buy i think). Problem is, just when you look at these companies and think "damn they're cheap now" a few days later they fall another 10-15% or whatever! It like catching a falling knife isnt it?
> I think just nibbling away at a position 10 or 20 shares per month in companies like Citi might be a good policy. At those levels if things go Bear Stearns the losses should be minimal. Long term, its a double your money situation I feel.
> Jet, which financials would you recommend?


You are so right, Spin. Citi's carnage in its inv banking ranks and a reorg might help; I just don't like the CEO Panjit. JPM has to deal with its Bear Stearns reorg, but hey, its got US$748bil in cash on its books, altho debt is about $472 bil. Wait for 2Q results.
Insurance cos -- gag. A few are doing OK with greater strides in int'l markets. Can't divulge info at the mo. 



> Would now be a good time to sell my Enron stock or should I wait for a turnaround?


Trade it for Bear Stearns.  :Smile: 

The US utilities are ok for value as most pay dam fine divs; with stock prices rising and the div yield, the returns are pretty healthy. The new-age power cos (solar, wind, hydro stuff) are so dependent on govt subsidies, coz their costs are so bladdy high. I'd also really research the mgmt and check the books. One green co making enviro-friendly cleaning products is listed on the Vancouver SE (steer clear by an ocean); a few friends invested at $0.40 or something; the stock zoomed up and then crashed -- mgmt probs. 
Potash would have been good when Thormaturge bought in (show off :Smile: ), but all of those cos need to come down a bit more for a good entry point.
Airlines -- def no. But an Ireland-based aircraft leasing co (sorry had to edit out the full name) may be worth a look see. They lease aircraft to major carriers who obviously cannot afford to buy now. Mgmt seems astute. Only prob: lots of debt.
Food cos -- input costs are zooming up, but many are passing those on with pricing and everyone seems to be taking it, altho private label brands (retailer brands, etc) are carving out a wide niche.

Sorry I can't name more names (the stocks I like are on our restricted list). I don't wanna die...

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## Rattanaburi

I like the stockcharts site. I remember I was looking at LVS back about new year. It's cheap but there was a report out the other day that Las Vegas is suffering. I guess gambling even real gambling isn't so popular nowadays. EXM is bouncing around all over the place and its down again. GSX is probably the only stock I hold which hasn't gone down. 

I would like to find some stocks like Iraqi telecom or cement companies. The war was shit but sooner or later that place is going to fix up really quickly. I guess you have to invest in Iraq to buy those stocks. 

They used to say anyone who ever made any money made it in real estate. Or something like they aren't making anymore land' Lately it seems that many of the world's wealthiest made it through telecoms. There aren't many countries left where you can do that except in those that have seen war or dictatorships.

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## Stubi

> Stubi, take a look at this chart, Here
> Can you see anything in this chart that would contradict a reversal in the stock anytime in the next few days? Please include any specific opinion as all positive and constructive comments are welcome.


I did this gambling many years. Mostly with options. And with the worst - currencies - trade 24 hours almost seven days a week. I made some money with it. But I know that I had luck and not more. Could not give advise to anyone - if I knew for sure I would make the deal myself too. But it hurts me even more to give wrong advice than losing my own money.The technical view on this chart would suggest a reversal. But trading does not often follow this logic - at least in my experience. And honestly - how much do you really know about this company? Even if you have insider knowledge it is not always sure how the market will react to news. At least it helps to get on average better results. But without such a knowledge?

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## Jet Gorgon

^ Yep, the doom and gloom scenario-speak is driving me batty! No wonder nobody is spending. And small biz couldn't get credit if they had a suicide bomb packed to their bellies. I hate this "govt will save you" rhetoric. Crikes, ease up on credit and let's get the biz moving again. A friend is using her credit card to buy product and finance her trade show this week. Stinky.

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## Butterfly

damn, I would have never dreamed to see the DOW at 6,500 again, but I think we are getting there. Things are looking up  :Smile: 

10 years worth of growth gone in less than 6 months, make sense !!! as usual, complete overreaction. Overreaction when it went up, and now when it's down.

Thanks god, Obama is there and he is going to save the day  :Smile:

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## Spin

> I would have never dreamed to see the DOW at 6,500 again


I have a small wager wih some pals that it will touch 5650. Its a pretty easy bet too because the Dow will go where GE goes, and that sucker is gonna print 3$ soon :Smile: 

Here's a monthly award vid from my fave blogger, The Fly, over at ibankcoin.com

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## baldrick

> it demonstates perfectly the way the stock exchange behaves technically





> and put in a new low at 735





> Look at the action just before 13.00, the market came down and touched 741, moved up to 750 and then came back down to test to see if everybody was happy above 741


so all these traders are sitting watching their charts and deciding on what is good business by saying " that is a floor , bottom , barrier  etc ".

I understand from reading " A Mathematician plays the Stock Market" that the majority of investors use emotion to decide on which companies are worth investing in and just because you use due diligence and do the calculations on a companies assets and liabilities and dividends it does not mean the stock will hold its value.

which means the stock market does not obey logic , therefore it is all fcuked up. Maybe this is a teething stage which will remove the gambling and massive gains that have been the norm for many years.

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## Spin

> so all these traders are sitting watching their charts and deciding on what is good business by saying " that is a floor , bottom , barrier  etc ".


Yeah basically, the pros use the market levels as one way to help decide buy and sell points. Falling below 741 was a trigger to sell longs and get short. Hitting 701 yesterday and not falling below that was good place to cover that short position and go long. If the market falls below 701 then sell those longs for a small loss and go short and see what happens at the next support levels below which are around 643 area. Less active traders will of course just come in a buy and hold long term, most of these buyers have been scared out of the market at the moment though becuase nobody has any clear idea of how low this thing can go. These days its mostly institutions and day traders that make up most of the markets volume.




> the stock market does not obey logic , therefore it is all fcuked up


Agreed, this is certainly true right now in these extraordinary conditions but less so in more balanced periods. Generally good companies will get noticed and buyers will come in, Buffet made his money finding those companies before everybody else did.

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## Butterfly

it's actually quite logical in the long run, it's only in the short term that it behaves erratically, as we are seeing today

no logic behind the sell off, pure emotion and silly investor sentiments

and of course the short sellers, having a field day, but we might run out of shares to sell soon  :Smile:

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## Spin

^ I dont think you can run out when naked short selling can you? :mid: 

US Markets just closed, not a good day, S&P500 closed at 696 down 5 points or -0.73%

Closing below 701 paves the way for further falls. Im watching for 680, 658 and 641 levels, the market is "oversold" which means a rally is due basically because stocks have been kicked down the stairs and are sitting at values way below actual value.



The Dow Jokes closed at 6711 -51.90 points -0.77%

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## Spin

Slightly better day today, fell of towards the end though. Tomorrow is anybodies guess.

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## Spin

Down, I havent seen two days of gains for ages. Today Citigroup saw 99 cents, once the largest bank in the world by market value and today reduced to a pathetic remnant of its former self by reckless capitalism.

The Dow Jokes lost 271 points close at 6604 down 3.94%
The S&P500 lost 29.63 points to close at 683.19 down 4.21% a level last seen on 19th September 1996. 

Tomorrow sees the release of the main unemployment numbers, its expected that over 700,000 Americans lost their jobs in February. Some of the falls in todays market can be attributed to folks selling ahead of this news tomorrow. If there is one piece of data from the goverment that really moves the markets, its this one tomorrow. Maybe we'll get a decent number and we'll see some upward action, if not, it will be business as usual and we'll be heading lower towards 650.

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## Rattanaburi

I think I'll play this game now. I'll start with the same amount of money as you and see if I can do better than you.  :Smile:

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## Spin

^ Do you realise that if we continued going down at the current rate, both the dow jones and the S&P500 will hit zero before the end of August?

Maybe you should wait and start your buying in a few months! :Smile:

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## Spin

BUY 1000 URE real estate etf at 1.85$
BUY 1000 UYG financials etf at 1.44$

Bit of bottom fishing.

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## Spin

I dare not even look at the state of the TD portfolio. Its crushed along with every other dimwit who owns stocks right now.

Lets have a look at the market, the only real points of interest today were that the dow jokes dipped below 6500 and the S&P500, after a bright start to the day then decided to implode only to be reversed by the devil himself at the 666 level. I shit you not, look at the last hour on the lower half of the chart, tested 666 twice and then went higher. 

Headlines for tomorrow's copy of The Sun "Satan steps in to save S&P500"

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## passengers

And you are _now_ surprised?

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## Spin

> And you are now surprised?


Surprised?..... no, whatever gives you that impression? :Smile:

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## passengers

Prepare for the helecopter drop of $1TR in STRs by the IMF in the next few weeks (target date 31/3). This will push up worldwide inflation by 10-14% on top of the QE taking place in US/UK...

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## Spin

A rally at yesterdays open ran out of steam and the market moved lower throughtout the day as the comments from Warren Buffet saying the US economy "had fallen off a cliff" weighed on peoples minds. Guys like him should know better and should just STFU. He's obviously short the market here otherwise he wouldnt say things like that.

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## Perota

> A rally at yesterdays open ran out of steam and the market moved lower throughtout the day as the comments from Warren Buffet saying the US economy "had fallen off a cliff" weighed on peoples minds. Guys like him should know better and should just STFU. He's obviously short the market here *otherwise he wouldnt say things like that.*


Why ? So far he's always sound like an honest guy, smart but honest ... actually VERY smart but still an honest bloke

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## Spin

> Why ?


Because the market is close to falling down into a blackhole that could see the S&P500, err, below 500.

At those levels, pension funds are bankrupt, people are not retiring. All manner of nonsense will be triggered if the market falls much further. Buffett has the power to move markets when he speaks, he is entitled to his opinion, but there are times to STFU and there are times to speak.

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## Spin

Big rally today, 6.0% gains in Dow Jones and S&P500. Market was oversold and needed to bounce. It had too many down days to fast and needed to come off its lows. Maybe this will continue for a few days, if we can move higher tomorrow and close above the 723-725 area that could see a move upwards towards 775. 



The portfolio remains 25% down but recovered about 30,000 U$D today.

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## baldrick

> THE International Monetary Fund warned that the world economy will likely contract this year in a "Great Recession"





> 6.0% gains in Dow Jones and S&P500.


there a a fcuk of a lot of greedy stupid people on this planet

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## Spin

> a lot of greedy stupid people on this planet


Not greedy, most of the buying comes from short sellers who are forced to cover their positions. This means they have to buy back the shares that they sold already at a (hopefully for them) higher price. This buying feeds on itself throughout the day as more and more shorters get shaken out. 
This could go on for a couple of weeks and the markets could rise 20-25%....or it could be just one day and the market will continue on its slide. If I knew which one it was going to be I would most likely be lying on the deck of a yatch somewhere and not typing this now :Smile:

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## Butterfly

They are going to re-instate the up tick rule for short selling, about fucking time




> The portfolio remains 25% down


more like 50% when you use the correct calculation,

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## Spin

> more like 50% when you use the correct calculation,


Last time i checked the total invested was 450,000 USD. with about 125,000 USD showing as unrealised losses. Thats about 25% always has been and always will be.

God knows where you get 50% from but lets face it, who gives a shit.

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## Spin

Markets consolidated today after the sharp move up. Thats good to see and we booked gains for two days in a row. Thats only happened once or twice, *this year.* My monies on a continued climb upwards tomorrow, todays action confirms this rally may have some legs which is backed up by the options markets with plenty of "calls" which are bets on higher prices in the future.

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## Spin

The move upwards continued today, this rally has nothing to do with good news or a turn in the economy or anything like that. Its just the market adjusting itself from so many down days. Its just bouncing back, when the bounce is finished it will head lower and reach new lows. You can bet your house on that.



Key today was that we moved up over 741 which was a key level on the way down. 
Tomorrows action will be focussed on whether or not we can move above 752. If it goes over 752 then were off to the races, 765, 775 and then 800 are the targets then. In real life I'll be looking to put some short trades on at these three levels if we get there, seasonally summer time is crap for the markets and expect the true bottom of this entire credit crunch recession fiasco to occur july through August.

The TD portfolio is still down 22% percent today.

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## Rattanaburi

Where is all this 'money' going anyways? Was it all virtual money? Or did the great sell off put all that money into people's pockets. If it was virtual money than no one is a millionaire until they have cash in hand. There are only virtual millionaires. Spin its all an illusion!

Actually, I hear the same stuff you are saying about a bearmarket rally that will fade. But I can't help but think this is the time to get into the market. I wonder if this movement is going to stump the (I hate to say this nowadays) 'experts' and 'analysts'?  Afterall, these people turned out to be wrong wrong wrong about the economy we are in now. So the current logic would say that the experts who now are calling this a bearmarket rally could very easily be totally off the mark. JMHO

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## Spin

Charts from Friday, sideways movement saw the close near where the open was.






> But I can't help but think this is the time to get into the market


The mainstream media would love all retail investors to believe that now is a good time to buy. Unfortunatley the mainstream media comes from satan himself. Take a look at the macro economic situation and tell me if you see any improvement that would warrant a continued move upwards? 
A good time to put a little into the market was last week with the S&P at the 666 level. Today its 756, that boat is missed. Buying now would be a very bad move indeed. The worst is yet to come, I'm 100% convinced of that.

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## Spin

Well the wheels fell of this rally today, I did say a couple of days ago that the 756-775-800 level would be difficult to crack and today saw things reverse significantly at 775. At that point the dow was up 160 points to 7375 which is a big gain from its lows at 6500 just last week.

The S&P500 had risen 16% from 666 to 775 in just 5 days, that typical of bear market rallies which are notable for their strenght and rate of climb.



The big question is whether this pullback is the end of this "bear market rally" or is it just a healthy pullback before we move higher? 

My gues is that the market rolls over here and goes lower, the real estate sector took a real beating today and financials joined in later also. Going on recent history, those two sectors dont change directions too often. The long term trend for both of them is long term is down and theres no development out there that I'm aware of which has changed for me to think a corner has been turned.

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## Spin

Ok, update on the action for the last two days. The rally continues skyward, driven by 100% hope and some flimsy "positive" news.

Tuesday saw gains across the board of about 3%



Today was heading is the same direction until the market get supercharged by news from the Federal reserve that they now had printing machines that could churn out a billion dollars an hour :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 



So last weeks lows at 666 for the S&P500 seem like a distant memory, thats a shame because the worlds economic problems are deffo not a distant memory. That means that the there is plenty more pain to come in the markets, its just a question of, _when._

Tomorrow is going to be interesting, the S&P500 is now at a point where it can break out of its long term downtrend. If it moves above 803 and closes above that level then anybody remaining in the market who is short is going to have their ass handed to them on a shiny silver platter.

Meanwhile, the TD portfolio still licks balls at around 20% down :Smile:

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## Spin

Well the 800-803 level didnt hold and the market drifted lower aided by chatter that the governments plan to print ridiculous amounts of money will not actually solve any of the problems.


Basically, this rally has been driven by hope and not much else, but it is over. Fridays action confirms this as the market has made a "lower low" (meaning todays trading moved below 782) than the previous day.
The day isnt over yet but its clear where things are headed.
The next few days should see that "741" level tested again. That should be interesting.

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## Spin

Its been quite a day. 

One of the first things you need to learn as an investor is to ignore news.

News is bullshit, todays action is the greatest example of bullshit news you will ever witness.
The dow ended the day up over 450 points from 7278 to 7745 or a gain of 6.42%
The S&P500 moved up an incredible 51.4 points or 6.94% to 820.

All of this is based on absolute 100% bullshit news that consists of 2 parts:

Bullshit element number 1: Sales of existing homes rose 5% in February. 
This number is bollocks, the year on year number was horrific. The 5% gain comes from Januarys number which was ghastly due to most of America being covered in snow and nobody buying houses. 45% of that 5% was banks selling off houses for next to nothing.

Bullshit element number 2: Timmay Geithner announces a hideous plan to team up with private investors to buy toxic bank assets from toxic banks. The entire basis of this plan is pivoting on them finding people to toss up scarce cash for absolute shit assets. Bill Gross from Pimpco and other raging homos might get involved with this. This plan may take months to happen. Dont expect anything overnight.
It might work, then again, it probably wont.
All day CNBC and Bloomberg TV rolled out an endless supply of fully paid up assholes to decalre the start of the "next bull market" Millions of retails investors, have jumped into stocks today. This is a gross error for they will be raped of that investment in due course by the fuckery that is, NYSE.

Meanwhile, the Teakdoor portfolio made 30,000$ today and is now about 17% in the red, much to my eternal shame and chagrin.

Expect this bulllshit rally to continue up towards 865 on the S&P. But just dont forget one thing. There is much more fcukery to come from the US governmint. Expect bad things from this market in the future!

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## Spin

Oh, One thing I forget to add is that Oil now appears to be a stock that trades with the Dow Jones. Today is hit 55$ per barrel even though demand is currently diving from the tp board into an empty swimming pool.

Expect to see diesel at 24 baht per litre any day now. Thats up something like 20% in the last 5 days.

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## peterpan

> Meanwhile, the Teakdoor portfolio made 30,000$ today and is now about 17% in the red, much to my eternal shame and chagrin.


Thats the reason after 5 years of online trading I decided to give it away and go safe. 
Now our family cash is with a guy at home who invests the money in commercial properties and A grade secured mortgages.
 He doesn't make spectacular gains but has NEVER lost a brass razzo of capital either. While this year earnings are SHITE at around 4.5%, over the last decade hes managed an average return of 12.5%.

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## Spin

> While this year earnings are SHITE at around 4.5%


4.5% right now is great. I was getting that on my savings in Uk bank accounts about 6 months ago. Today I get about, erm, sweet FA  :Smile: 

I went from getting my rent and lecky and water paid for me to having to shell out myself in less than 4 months :Sad:

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## peterpan

The only time I actually made money consistently was when I followed the procedures of a guy name of D Guppy who had a series of buy indicators and a rigid 2% stop loss policy.
 It worked but you spent a lot of money on brokerage fees complying with the stop loss rules.

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## Spin

> It worked but you spent a lot of money on brokerage fees complying with the stop loss rules.


Yes, stop losses are essential these days. Losses incurred from hitting stops should be viewed as wins, I think. It shows you that your trade didnt work and that you got out before your shirt went. The broker I use charges 1 U$D per 200 shares bought or sold so theres no reason to hesitate when buying or selling.

Getting stopped out is no problem, in this market another opportunity pops up a couple of hours later :Smile:

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## Spin

> Expect this bulllshit rally to continue up towards 865 on the S&P.


Thats what I said on the 24th March over a month ago and exactly that has happened. The market has hit 875 and there currently exists a huge battle between "bulls" and "bears" to drive the market higher, or lower from here. There are a lot of folks out there who believe things are improving, personally I'm not in this camp just yet but might get enthusiastic again in the thrid quarter. Now is too early, especially as the traditional summer slump in stock prices begins in soon, "Sell in May and go away" is the term used. This is the time when many of the big hitters on Wall Street retreat to their Hamptons retreats to sniff coke for a few months. It might present a good buying opportunity to top up the port before the world economy eventually starts to improve for real, (I think) in the fourth quarter of this year.

The portfolio hasnt moved much as the recent rally has been mostly about insolvent financial companies shares gaining about 300%. We're nicely placed to make plenty of coin later this year though, about 10% as of now, the print below shows losses of 70,000 but we banked 20K U$D already as shown in post number 253 here (Teakdoors stock portfolio)



Heres a chart of the S&P500 showing its blistering run up from the "666" lows, its open to huge debate whether these 850-875 levels will hold over the summer though.

----------


## Spin

UPDATE on FSLR First solar....

First Solar (NASDAQ:FSLR) reported Q1 EPS of *$1.99, far ahead of the $1.51* analysts were expecting. Revenues for the quarter *more than doubled* year-over-year to $418.2 million, beating consensus estimates of $399.9 million. The company noted that it reached two key production milestones this year; building a total of 1 gigawatt of photovoltaic modules, and its manufacturing costs have dropped below $1 per watt. First Solar also said that the global recession and tightened bank lending will squeeze profit margins for full year 2009 despite federal stimulus grants and loan guarantees for renewable energy.

This traded in the 150$ range before this news broke, in after hours trading yesterday, it jumped to 175$. lets see how it moves today as TD has 600 shares in this company.

----------


## Spin

^ FSLR now trading at 181.00$ whicj means TD portfolio banked 22,000 U$D.

----------


## Spin

Decent week in the end, various bits of US economic data painted the picture that the economy is improving. I'm not getting carried away because it could be just the grubbermint messing with the numbers but one thing for sure I noticed this week was that the rally from the 666 S&P500 lows, which has been driven by financials, was led by commodoties for the last 2 or 3 days. Its an interesting development, for sure.

As for the the portfolio, all told, about even now taking into account the 20 grand previously banked. Well maybe ten grand underwater, nothing really.

----------


## passengers

Once you change Mark to Market in favour of Mark to Fantasy, the numbers can say anything you like. This does not alter the fact that the debt is still real and either has to be defaulted on or (hyper)inflated away.

----------


## Spin

^ The worlds problems are over! The markets are up so everything is fixed right?


The TD portfolio has risen about 75 thousand dollars in the last few sessions, with a move of over 31 thousand bucks today.



The S&P500 ripped 3.2% higher today to 905 on news that the Chinese economy is improving and some slightly better housing data in the US.

This rally has legs, I'm thinking it could go on to see 1040 / 1100 level on the S&P500.....or 10,000 on the Dow Jones.

The next test is the 940 area which might get hit in the next 48 hours.

Lets see how things pan out........

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## Spin

Another up day for the markets Dow moved up 115 points to 8526 and S&P500 up 17 points to 920. 

A little bit more red ink was scrubbed from the TD portfolio, ten grand to the good today so now up 30 grand overall.

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## Spin

Take a peep at this chart for one of our stocks, Freeport McMoran, FCX.

Freeport produces copper, copper is seen as a barometer for world economic condition.
The chart gives you an idea of where the world has been and where it is now with regard to demand for copper, demand for copper dictates copper price, the daily copper price will affect the daily price of Freeports stock. There are other factors involved but the concept is valid.
I've included the buy in points for the TD shares we hold, 1100 in total.
As you can see, some I bought at the top, which were terrible buys, when viewed with hindsight. At that time though, not many people could have predicted that the price would fall from 125$ to 17.50$
Fortunatley for me, I bought 400 shares at 18.60$ which are now 300% to the good.
The average price we hold at is 60.14$. 
Recently there are signs that the worlds economy is waking from the coma that Lehman Brothers failure in September last year brought on. It probably wont be a rapid recovery, it might take 2 years to get buzzing again, but things are improving.

----------


## passengers

^So much to learn.

Some key words:

Deflation trap;
Monetary decoupling;
Tangibles inflation.

You are fond of charts. Google the Weimar charts 1928-1935. Same entry-point paradign, similar policy response, inevitable outcome.

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## Butterfly

^ is that what you learn from your dodgy "downtown" Seminar ?  :Razz: 

come on bkka, be a man, and re-register, you are a bit of a coward to hide behind that new moniker !!!

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## Spin

Not much red ink now, plenty of green not sure how long that will last though because popular consencus is that the market will reverse and move much lower.

I'll be keeping a close eye on the 875-880 level on the S&P500, that could be a key area of support for the market.

So far we're up about 45,000 U$D (including the 19$K banked previously)



Out of all the companies that I bought, only one, "Dryships" (DRYS) has not weathered the world economic downturn well. It has all kind of debt problems and Im not sure what the furture holds for the share price.

The rest of the companies are absolute corkers and will bank us egregious amounts of imaginary coin sooner _or later_ :Smile: 

Most of these companies had the living shite kicked out of their share prices, most are up 100% or more off their lows.
This whole crisis had ruined many folks financially but for the smart ones that bought wisely at the bottom, there will be fortunes made thats for sure.

Best pick so far, ACH, they make Aluminium in China, its up 100% + since I bought it, problem is, I only bought 200 shares, I should have taken 1000.

----------


## SiLeakHunt

http://www.nakedtrader.co.uk/

this fella seems quite good well worth a look

----------


## Spin

Ten grand to the good today.

----------


## Spin

Paragon Shipping PRGN, one of our picks, reported Q1 earnings today..... a 21 percent jump in first-quarter profit that beat expectations, sending its shares up 26 percent so far this morning :Smile:

----------


## Spin

So Paragon finished the day up 25%, which is nice.

Sadly, as a result of the US grubbermints activites printing money, the dollar is falling.
Earlier today it crashed through a significant support level and will now probably fall lower. 
We dont care about that though!  :Smile: ..... becuase its good news for us, the dollar falls and oil goes up. When oil goes up people start worrying about energy costs and stocks like solar go up. See todays 7000$ gain in our holding of First Solar (FSLR)  :Smile: 

The wider market was dogged by banks moving lower and that dragged everything else with it, mid morning the portfolio was up 23,000$ but finished up 8 grand for the day so not too bad.

----------


## Spin

Not much change this week, some lost, some gained, and we finished the week about 2 grand better off. The dollar is showing weakness, which is sending up oil and other commods. This is good for this portfolio. 



Total gains are about 65K.

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## Spin

Markets just closed witht he S&P500 at 940, theres a good chance it will hit 1050 soon., another big up day, 13,000$ came our way.

Total gains are now about 80,00U$D



This has been a great rally but there has to be some kind of significant pullback. Im considering selling the whole lot if I see 100K profit in the next few days and looking to buy back cheaper at a later date.

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## Butterfly

^ hey man, you are lagging the market

everyone is up 25% or more  :Smile: 

you should be up 130,000 not 80,000

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## Spin

BUY 500 UNG at 14.88

This is an electronically traded fund that tracks the price of natural gas, which is very cheap right now but will rise towards the end of the year when US factory utilisation improves and winter sets in.

I'll take another 500 next week on any dips in the price.

----------


## Butterfly

speaking of ETF, I am looking for different ETF in commodities so I can short them. I am very new to ETF, just have been reading how they work technically and internally and it raised my interests.

I would need the followings in commodities Futures:

- a mainstream Oil ETF
- a mainstream Gold ETF
- a mainstream Copper ETF

any experience with those ?

Thanks,

----------


## Spin

> any experience with those ?


Yes, I sometimes tinker around with them intra day if things are volatile.

Basically there are three types. Ones that give unleveraged returns, one that give double returns and ones that give triple returns. The triple return ones are good for daytrading only as they suffer badly from decay. Its vital than anyone wanting to use these products is aware of what decay is, rather than me try and explain it, use this link for a better explanation than I could do





> a mainstream Oil ETF


For and unleveraged long trade USO is best. For a 2x return DXO is best.
You can short these ETF's in the same was as any other stock.
A 2x leverage short oil to check out is DTO

For a long term hold, when you want to short something, it is better to "short the long fund" for example. If I wanted to short oil now at 2x leverage I would short sell DXO as opposed to buying DTO. This is to avoid decay and to actually benefit from it.





> - a mainstream Gold ETF


Shorting GLD would be my choice or buying DZZ




> - a mainstream Copper ETF


I'm not sure if there are any, and if there are, they will be too thinly traded....no volume. Not good.

Better to go with the etf's for the "basic materials" sector. Long would be UYM and the short one is SMN

More info on the ones I mentioned here and here

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## TSR2

I have pulled out of DXO , just taking my profits ! 

I reckon Oil is going to drop to $50 ish

Apart from Speculation there arn,t any reasons for $70+ per barrel

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## Spin

^ The weak dollar is the main reason for 70$ oil, that, and the fact that the world IS recovering from total collapse in world trade last september.
Oil overshot to the upside to 147$ and it overshot the downside to 36$.

The common perception seems to be that oil should "be" priced at like 50-60$ is in my opinion "fantasy".

Part of the reason this portfolio is commodity based is due to the fact the long term outlook for the dollar is bleak.




> I have pulled out of DXO , just taking my profits !


Why? Are you aware that DXO returns are also linked to the monthly t-bill index and that any rises in interest rates will cause DXO to spike. It could go to 25-30 bucks in the next 12 months from its 4.50$ level now.
USA has to start raising rates soon!

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## TSR2

^
True  ,I expect oil to drop short term , then I will buy back into DXO !

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## HermantheGerman

> STO might go down to $17 but I'am sure it will be up in the $40 soon.
> I call STO my family stock because its for the long run. You know the part with "buy a stock and take a sleeping tablet for 10 years".
> Nothing to make a quick buck but now is defintely the time to buy this stock because it is way undervalued.



o.k. 10 years are not over yet, but waking up after 1 year ain't too bad

Nov.20 2008   $13,37 
Okt. 24 2009   $24,69

----------


## HermantheGerman



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## Butterfly

fucking DOW is back to 10,000

and SET was close to 800, but it had fallen to below 700 in the last few days

Oil is back at 75 USD

This market is surreal,

----------


## Rattanaburi

Someone on the BBC was already calling it a bubble.

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## Spin

Time for an update.

First things first. The crude oil electronically traded fund I was holding "DXO" ceased trading about a month ago. Not sure why it was pulled, but pulled it was.

Performance for that was a 96% profit to the tune of 8500$, I'll leave it sitting in the portfolio page for now, but it ceased trading at 4.35$ I'll reallocate the money into a chinese company, ticker,  RINO when it pulls back a little from its recent run up. Hoping to get in at around 18$






Don't forget there was 19,582 U$D made earlier (Teakdoors stock portfolio) to be added to the profit shown above

The fertilizer stocks are pissing me off a little, MOS and POT, but maybe there are better days for those stocks on the horizon soon.

In short, grains have started to rip, and have broken out from their long term down trend. Oil is going bananas off the back of the dollar flushing itself down the toilet. Next stop for oil 87$, probably before Christmas. All this will help the fert's bust higher (aided by a BHP Billiton takeover rumour) as you can see by the 7% move in POT today.

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## Spin

Buy 100 Rino 21.35$

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## Muadib

The RSI and MACD indicate that RINO is on a downward trend... Under selling pressure today and down 6.5% as of now...

Also, you're still showing DXO on the Bberg portfolio... DXO was delisted and liquidated in the US markets...

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## Spin

I'll be buying RINO into weakness up to 1000 shares total between here and about 18$.....17.59 is where it might settle on this pull back but you cant be sure so why not start nibbling now.

 I know also about DXO, did you read post 341? 

Full update coming later today.

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## Muadib

Sorry, missed the DXO bit on post 341... I'm still a bit light-headed from the AAPL after hours spike last night...  :Smile:

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## Spin

> I'm still a bit light-headed from the AAPL after hours spike last night.


I hope you weren't caught short  :Smile:  That might really have set your hair alight  :Smile: 

Ok, I updated the realized profits list and moved the delisted DXO onto it. This is money in the bank available for DD to spend on clacker down Soi 6.



I'll add an update of the state of play for the unsold element of the portfolio later. looks like the market is heading lower today so there might be a lot of red ink on it.

----------


## Spin

Buy 100 Rino 21.20$

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## Muadib

> Originally Posted by Muadib
> 
> I'm still a bit light-headed from the AAPL after hours spike last night.
> 
> 
> I hope you weren't caught short  That might really have set your hair alight


I'm long on AAPL having added positions to my portfolio back in July... New targets for APPL are $300, so I'm a happy camper...  :Smile:

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## Spin

Buy 200 Rino 20.36$

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## Spin

Buy 100 Rino 19.45$

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## Muadib

^ Nice pick...

RINO - $30.61 at 11:41AM EST... 

Thanks...

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## Spin

> Nice pick...thanks


Ur Welcome :Smile: 

It was a pretty easy one to spot though, looking at the chart, the areas I circled, where the prices fall for a few days and the (selling) volume decreases also (bars at bottom of image) until selling is exhausted.....it keeps happening.....and then rips higher. RINO is a traders dream right now and there's gossip it might go to 60$ inside of 12 months or so.

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## Spin

Lets bring the rest of it up to date.....




About 20% gains, 100K U$D add onto that the 28K U$D gained from wheeling and dealing earlier.....

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## Slipstream

Spin, are these real stocks or fantasy ones you are whiling away your time with?

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## Spin

The stocks mentioned in this thread are real US listed stocks that I have bought with imaginary money for the purposes of making imaginary profits.

Some of the stocks mentioned I trade in real life with real money, where losses sometimes are sadly very real. :Smile:

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## Chunkton

The market has had a good counter rally since Mar 2009 to the first wave of the crash but that will finish soon.

2010 - Currently I am going long US Dollar, dumping stocks back home in Oz & waiting for the stock market crash to buy back in lower and expect Gold to drop dramatically, may buy in then. Not sure here in Thailand or back home as have both options...yeah. Long term bonds, my commiserations, short term a better idea as more liquid. 

Maybe check which banks are solid in which country if have substantial funds there (don't be lazy), big isn't necessarily good. Not sure about Thailand banks but watching and holding some cash. May shift to Singapore yet, depends what I end up with after a couple of moves. If high cash then yeah out she goes.

If I'm wrong I have lost some profit, if I am right I have saved my arse and future. Just some food for thought as a heads up. Agree or disagree, up to you.

Cheers....

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## meepho

> The stocks mentioned in this thread are real US listed stocks that I have bought with imaginary money for the purposes of making imaginary profits.
> 
> Some of the stocks mentioned I trade in real life with real money, where losses sometimes are sadly very real.


Hi Spin,
Have a look at batm advanced comms, ticker  BVC.L, trading at approx 5 times earnings [ cheap ] 60million sterling in the bank, market cap approx 200m, good orders going forward, I have shares in them already and the chart is possibly showing another bullish trend, up 3.5% today, i will see what happens tommorow and buy on monday, give me your thoughts.

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## Spin

BUY 500 RINO at 20.03

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## Spin

Been waiting for well over a year for some good news out of the fertilizer sector, it finally came today.....

Potash  Corporation of Saskatchewan Inc. (PotashCorp) today stated that  first-quarter earnings are estimated to be in the range of $1.30-$1.50, well above the initial guidance of $0.70-$1.00 per share(1) provided on January 28, 2010. *The upward revision reflects a  sharp rebound in potash demand* that is expected to drive a record  quarter for North American sales volumes and strong offshore shipments,  as well as higher-than-expected margins in nitrogen and phosphate. 

Shares are up 8$ (7%) during higer than normal volume pre-market trading at 125$

----------


## Friedclams

CX or Cemex might have potential. I should have bought this back before it doubled. They say now its paying of debt. Cement still is the first choice for building in many places. In this case, Latin America. Just seem like it's got a future. 

Citibank (C) is starting to move after a year of silence. With offices all over the world and such a seemily well know brand why wouldn't it come back?

----------


## Mr Earl

> Been waiting for well over a year for some good news out of the fertilizer sector, it finally came today.....
> 
> Potash  Corporation of Saskatchewan Inc. (PotashCorp) today stated that  first-quarter earnings are estimated to be in the range of $1.30-$1.50, well above the initial guidance of $0.70-$1.00 per share(1) provided on January 28, 2010. *The upward revision reflects a  sharp rebound in potash demand* that is expected to drive a record  quarter for North American sales volumes and strong offshore shipments,  as well as higher-than-expected margins in nitrogen and phosphate. 
> 
> Shares are up 8$ (7%) during higer than normal volume pre-market trading at 125$


That's why my fertilizer cost are through the roof!
"higher-than-expected margins"
Greedy cocksuckers! :mid:

----------


## songkla

NBG - National Bank of Greece. (seriously, no joke)

----------


## Spin

> That's why my fertilizer cost are through the roof!


You could hedge yourself with an agriculture ETF such as (ticker)  "MOO" 

If you hold that, when your fertilizer goes up, your MOO holding goes up.




> CX or Cemex might have potential


Mexican cement company, erm, my collection have picks here already has a bundle of risk already. Don't need any more!




> Citibank (C) is starting to move after a year of  silence.





> why wouldn't it come  back?


They have about a trillion dollars worth of toxic pooh on their books already, albeit hidden by "mark to fantasy, FASB rules"

Having said that, if you were young guy and were looking for something invest in long term, like 30 years plus...retirement timeframe then why the hell not? It will probably increase 5 or 6 fold given enough time.

Actually, The EFT held for this thread, ticker: "UYG" has a 3.78% exposure to "C" Citigroup that is already showing a gain of 125% since I bought it at 2.87$




> NBG - National Bank of Greece. (seriously, no joke)


Well, S&P did just take Greece of creditwatch but I think I'll pass on this one as there are so many more better opportunities out there right now!

----------


## Muadib

I've been long Citi waiting for the move... Target is $5.25 if it makes it through resistance at $4.29...

----------


## Spin

BUY 1000 GS Goldman Sachs 145.64

----------


## Spin

GS should trade back towards 155$ in short order, if it doesn't, I will look stupid.

----------


## Muadib

Yep, I bought some RIG this morning at $70... Already bounced nicely...

----------


## Butterfly

^^ nice screen ? where from ?

----------


## baldrick

> GS should trade back towards 155$ in short order


you had better hope the yermans don't come forward in short order - they have some bones to pick with GS

----------


## Muadib

^^ 

FreeStockCharts.com - Web's Best Streaming Realtime Stock Charts - Free

I use it and like it quite a bit... Only problem is that it's written with Microsoft Silverlight and has a memory leak from hell...

----------


## baldrick

looks like you might get a bit of bounce in your GS shares




> *BERKSHIRE Hathaway CEO Warren Buffett declared his support for  Goldman Sachs Group CEO Lloyd Blankfein, and said he has no plans to  sell his company's stake in the bank. 				*

----------


## Spin

> ooks like you might get a bit of bounce in your GS shares


Then again maybe not.....

*Wolf Popper LLP Files Class Action Against Goldman  Sachs*

"In 2008, the SEC began investigating Goldman for its role in a synthetic  mortgage-based securities transaction, called "Abacus."  In Abacus,  Goldman partnered with a hedge fund that wanted to "short"  mortgage-related securities.  Goldman structured a transaction where the  hedge fund participated in selecting the mortgage products that  Abacus's performance was based on, knowing the hedge fund would be  "short" Abacus and was motivated to include the mortgage products it  believed would perform most poorly.  Goldman then sold Abacus without  disclosing the hedge fund's role to investors"

It seems lawsuits are coming out of the woodwork......I think I'll jump out of this trade today if I see a few grand profit at the open in a few minutes......

----------


## Muadib

GS up 1.96% or $2.02 this morning, 15 minutes after the open...

----------


## Spin

> BUY 1000 GS Goldman Sachs 145.64


SOLD 1000 GS Goldman Sachs at 150.07  

That gives us a profit of about 4400 U$D

Here's what I'm going to do, that 4400 profit is going to cancel out my losses in the natural gas fund, UNG...... I SOLD out of UNG today with the losses showing 3960$ I book no loss for UNG, and book no gain for the Goldman Sachs trade, so the band plays on..... :Smile: 



I foolishly bought UNG when it was being heavily "pumped" or "talked up" by the mainstream media. They were doing this because the big boys needed someone to take the other side of their short sales.

Why?

Because the big boys knew that gas from "shale" was a total game changer and could well depress the price of gas for a long time.

This is a good example of how wall street operates, it doesn't exist to make you wealthy, it exists with the aim of stealing all your money any which way it can, and then distributing it amongst a select few.  As long as you don't lose sight of this fact, there is a chance you can survive in the trade.  :Smile: 

A chart showing the Goldman Sachs sell point, it looked to be running out of steam at 150$ so I jumped ship.

----------


## Spin

Not much happening today, the Dow plunged 1000 points on fears of Europe imploding and then recovered 500 points. Nothing to see here, move along  ::chitown::

----------


## S Landreth

Spooky


*Last* *Change* *High* *Low*

.DJIA Dow Jones Industrial Average 10520.32 -347.80/-3.20% 10879.76 9869.62 

.TRAN Dow Jones Transportation Average (change only) -144.97 / -3.18% 


.UTIL Dow Jones Utilities Average -10.28 / -2.69% 


COMP NASDAQ Composite Index -82.6502 / -3.44% 


.SPX S&P 500 Index -37.75 / -3.24% 


.DIWC Dow Jones Wilshire 5000 Compindex Full Cap -401.45 / -3.30% 

NK225-OK Nikkei 225 -Tokyo Stock Exchange Index -361.71 / -3.27%

----------


## Muadib

Fook me what a day... 

Tomorrow doesn't look any better... 

Futures for 5/7/2010 

DJIA  -379
NASDAQ  -70
S&P  -42

----------


## Spin

> Fook me what a day...


Yep, it just goes to show you that there is no liquidity provided by humans in the markets anymore. Yesterdays event was computer driven, high frequency trading algos that went bezerk.

Joe Salluzi has been predicting this kind of thing for ages....

Key statement is at 2mins 50 seconds

----------


## Spin



----------


## Spin

SOLD 1300 POTASH at 140.30 $

Booking 44,000 $ profit in this one as BHP talkeover rumours saw the stock jump 25% today.

I'll get back in later much lower.

----------


## Lorenzo

^ nice one

----------


## Tokyo Rose

This thread is useless without a running tally.
Of course most simians will only look at daily trades.

They require a steady flow of bananas. Feed us both.

----------


## Spin

> This thread is useless without a running tally.


Did you even bother to read the fucking thread?

----------


## Butterfly

he does have a point though,

some of your performance reporting are highly misleading,

I pointed that out to you before, but since you were a mod, you were very quick to remove those posts when it exposed certain discrepancies in the performance reporting.

Anyway, use the Yahoo portfolio thing, they have a transac thing for portfolio simulation, so it might be more accurate than the misleading "virtual" portfolio you have here

it would be an interesting exercise at the end, even for you

----------


## Lorenzo

> Anyway, use the Yahoo portfolio thing, they have a transac thing


use the thing connected to the other thing for best results   :Smile:

----------


## Thormaturge

> Potash Corporation has been a favourite of mine for the past year, and I mentioned it on here a while back. Above is their performance chart for the past 12 months.
> 
> The recent fallback is probably due to speculative profit taking.
> 
> I wouldn't want to be holding any stock in financial institutions, and in particular insurance companies.  Not only will there be a deluge of legitimate claims but the number of people torching warehouses, sinking ships and setting light to the hearthrug for an few extra bucks is going to soar as the world lurches deeper into recession.  Additional loss adjusting costs and increased claims will cripple the insurance industry.



Anyone who read this and sold AIG then bought Potash is welcome to send me a commission cheque.

----------


## Hampsha

Times change. What happened to this thread?

----------


## BaitongBoy

^ Everyone started masturbating over gold...

 :Smile:

----------


## Hampsha

Seems like it. Some may be in the corner in tears, too.

----------

