#  >  > Non Asia Travel Forums >  >  > Australia & New Zealand Travel Forum >  >  Johnny and Joe Go Green

## Johnny Longprong

Both Joe Kerr and I are committed environmentalists, not actual greenies yet but approaching lime green. We have been exploring alternative energy systems for the farm, and have concluded that wind generators would play a large role in our future power generation. However, we have been hearing lots of negative comments about how these systems are noisy and downright ugly. We thought we would see for ourselves how the big boys do it, and combine a spot of camping in the process.

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## Johnny Longprong

Destination - Carcoar Lake in the Blayney Shire of NSW, Australia of course, where they have 15 wind turbines. We picked a few days with an approaching frontal system so that we could see the things in full flight.
Carcoar is about 3-4 hours west of Sydney, and once you are there you have quite a few alternative ways back. We decided to head south on the way home, and then back to the coast via Mittagong.

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## Johnny Longprong

There is this nice viewing area with lots of technical info. How considerate.

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## Johnny Longprong

I thought they said 15 turbines?

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## Johnny Longprong

It looks like there has been some rain here. The dam is at about 12% full. Poor bastrads out here have been in drought for years, so 12% is a lot. Nice and green too.

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## Johnny Longprong

Joe Kerr relaxes after dinner with a camp dog.

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## Johnny Longprong

Next morning the expected front came through. Blew it’s tits off actually. Joe was sorry he didn’t sleep in the big house with me last night. I just heard on the radio it is snowing near us.

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## Johnny Longprong

We walked over the dam wall and up to the turbines. We could hear them from where we were camped, a sort of voooomp, voooomp sound, not too offensive really, and we were downwind of them. They seem to turning at about 50 cycles per minute, almost like a classical beat.

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## Johnny Longprong

This is looking back down at the campsite. This campsite is what is known as a “free” camp. That is you don’t have to pay. The local council maintains it along with toilets and showers. It is very nice indeed, and was home that night to a few “grey nomads” in their caravans and motorhomes along with  two very nice Skando girls in a beat up old Landcruiser, who are all obviously seen as potential consumers of district goods and services. For you potential travellers, there are lots of these sites now to cater for budget travellers. There is a good book they call the traveller’s bible. Free and Budget Top Camp Sites, Best Camping Grounds and Caravan Tourist Holiday Parks Australia

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## Johnny Longprong

This looks like the Ponderosa of the now rich bastrad who leased the land to the power company. Nice spread Hoss.

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## Johnny Longprong

These are Short Billed Corellas, a parrot, a little bit smaller than a Cockatoo but twice as raucous.

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## Johnny Longprong

Getting up close and personal now. No real noise, although it was still blowing a gale and I had two beanies on. They blend relatively well into the landscape and sort of look like big dead trees.

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## Johnny Longprong

“What are you looking at dopey?” From L to R - Chuck, Rib, Sirloin, Short loin, Round, Brisket and Flank. No noise complaints from these fellas.

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## cimboc

Nice work Johnny, I've been to 4 different winds farms during my travels around WA. 2 of them you could actually walk right up to a couple the turbines - bloody impressive thats for sure! and yet the woosh is pretty awesome  :Smile: 

That camping ground looks great - its amazing what a bit of green can do to a place!

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## Johnny Longprong

Some more turbines over the next hill. They really aren’t that offensive to the view, particularly placed in the country area high on a hill. I can fully understand objections to them in a built up area, but out in places like this they make more sense than offence.

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## Johnny Longprong

Part of the dam catchment area.

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## Johnny Longprong

This was probably the old corner store in the nearby township of Carcoar. It is now an antique shop for trendy city visitors. Nice Wisteria.

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## Johnny Longprong

CBD Carcoar. We didn’t see any stressed people in this town. In fact we didn’t see anybody.

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## Johnny Longprong

Royal Hotel Carcoar. We went in to see mine host, Ross who was busy renovating the bar area, and the pub was closed. He seems a nice bloke who bungs on  home cooked meals with some very cheap traditional pub accommodation. Has nice log fires in the bar areas.

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## Johnny Longprong

The obsolete Carcoar Railway Station is now a tea shop. How embarrassing for it.

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## Johnny Longprong

The township of Carcoar. It was obviously once a prosperous place. Lots of gold still in them hills according to the locals.

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## Johnny Longprong

Ewe paddock. Lots of spring action going on.

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## Johnny Longprong

Nice creek near town

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## Johnny Longprong

Along the way we happened upon this rainbow. We were tempted to get the shovel into that dirt bank.

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## Johnny Longprong

We pushed on into the dark, down into the Wombeyan Caves. This is a very well setup campsite administered by the National Parks of NSW and well worth a visit.  The road in is very steep and windy, so best done in the daylight. Lots of wildlife wandering about and it is very noisy at night with various copulating and fighting creatures carrying on.

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## Johnny Longprong

This is what it looks like in the daylight.  Each campsite has a fireplace and a water tap. There are some big fire pits where you can have a huge fire if you want. Midweek you can often have the place to yourself.

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## Johnny Longprong



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## Johnny Longprong

Check the tail sticking out of the pouch.  She looks well sick of motherhood, and he only just fits into the pouch by the looks of it.

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## Loy Toy

Absolutely lovely pictures Johnny and seeing them makes me all home sick.

Looking forward to enjoying more and thanks for sharing.  :Smile:

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## Johnny Longprong

Some nice birds too. This is the Satin Bower Bird (Ptilonorynchus violaceus). The male is an iridescent blue colour. He is much more elusive than the female and it is hard to get a good shot of. I like their purple eyes.

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## Johnny Longprong



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## Johnny Longprong

The road out of the caves to the east is pretty exciting, lots of washaways and unfenced cliffs.  There are some nice views along the way and an interesting tunnel through the sandstone.

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## Johnny Longprong



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## Johnny Longprong

A nice relaxing 3 day trip.

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## peterpan

Nice photos JL, nailed a few of these suckers ^ on the front of the Holden in my time.

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## Nawty

Great clear pics, nice to see a country town again like that.

The girls in the paddock made me feel a little lonely.

As for the wind generators, I have been told that wind is the least effective/inefficient way to generate power....any clues on this ?

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## Marmite the Dog

> As for the wind generators, I have been told that wind is the least effective/inefficient way to generate power....any clues on this ?


I saw on t'telly that small multi-vane fans in an array were far more efficient than the three bladed variety.

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## Johnny Longprong

> The girls in the paddock made me feel a little lonely. As for the wind generators, I have been told that wind is the least effective/inefficient way to generate power....any clues on this ?


Not too lonely I hope!!

They say that wind generators are generally more efficient than solar, converting about 20% of the wind energy into electricity. The efficiency measurement factors are all very variable situation to situation, and the cost/benefit analysis would be pretty involved too I guess. This location is very windy being on the central tablelands and those propellors would be turning a lot of the time. 

There a quite a few cost efficient home units available now and combining them with solar, you can make a reasonable amount of power. Storing the stuff is the problem unless you want to go to some 12V system as well.

NSW is considering a net tariff arrangement, in which housholders and businesses would be paid above the market rate for electricity that they put back into the grid. This could be something like A$.6 a kilowatt hour which is nearly 4 times the cost of coal fired electricity, so the incentives might be there to have a combination system. They are only talking solar at this stage but my bet is that this will be expanded to include wind generated power as well.

Something to think about for the future. I suppose anything that cuts the amount of coal burnt, and reduces our dependence on fossil fuels can only be good.

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## TizMe

Nice photos Johnny.

Its good to see that its green out there for a change.

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## Nawty

yes but it has to be affordable and worthwhile to make the masses change.

For example cleanup Australia is great, but then you come to Asia and see the amount of rubbish daily, the amount of wasted packaging in sweets and snacks for kids and it all gets dumped......whats the point.

Green energy needs the multiplying effect to make it work and to do that it needs to be efficient and affordable and equivelent, or cheaper, or if a little more expensive than traditional energy sources, then it needs to be able to be seen to pay back the investment in a short time frame, say 5 years, not 20.

Here is an example, I posted here ......this guy spent 1,400,000 baht on his solar system and is so proud that he does not have to pay for electricity anymore and can even run aircon......but if I take that 1.4mil and divide it by my average electricity bill here over the last 3 or 4 years in this house, then it will take 40 years to save that money, in fact it will be more cos in that 40 years you can bet your arse there will be repairs and costs etc to add to it.

https://teakdoor.com/thailand-land-pr...ergy-cost.html

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## Johnny Longprong

> Green energy needs the multiplying effect to make it work and to do that it needs to be efficient and affordable and equivelent, or cheaper, or if a little more expensive than traditional energy sources, then it needs to be able to be seen to pay back the investment in a short time frame, say 5 years, not 20.


Yes, spot on. It will be very hard to convince cash strapped people to part with their readies unless there is a clear benefit to them. They recently paid an incentive for people to change over to gas on their cars. The cost/benefit at the time was quite good but then the price of gas just about doubled, and the payback time did too. Unfortunately the vehicles might wear out first.

A few I know here that have solar simply because it is the only power they can have, reckon it is not so bad so long as you look after your batteries and keep the panels clean and in one piece. Of course everything wears out and you have to change over at a new higher cost when things do. 

For sure that wire from the pole is way ahead on convenience and cost at the moment, but things may change.

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## terry57

Nice piccys Johnny, lots of work throwing that lot up well done.

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## nedwalk

at the moment here in ozzie the govt have an incentive scheme, to get people to go green, we have just set up a a solar business rideing on the govt incentives, we are marketing a 1kw system, which includes 6 solar panels [sharp] an invertor for the princley sum of only 2500 ozzie, this system collects about 5kw a day and saves approx 100 a quater of the power bill, the whole thing is means tested and at the moment its the bloody pensioners who are really running with the idea, they love it , grid connect, you pay 16 to 17 cents from the power company and if you are real aware you can export back to the grid at 44cents i,m putting on a 9 panel system and a bigger inverter so i can add later and maybe toy with a stand alone system down the track, there is so much more in alternative energy that we really should be getting onto,  ie bio desiel as for wind generators i,m still not 100% sold yet seems to be a bit of dicking around and a lot of moveing parts that can/do fuck up

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## Nawty

So can you solar power a house fully in the tropics yet for a reasonable price ?

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## nedwalk

> reasonable price


in ozzie yes, with the govt hand out 50% rebate if you are further than a klm from the grid, though i have been wondering how stand alone systems would go in los [expense] 
and its all relative to just how much power do you require as to how much you spend, same as anything i suppose

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## Nawty

Well use the example I supplied in the link above...1.4mil to power his house.

All the usual modern appliances including aircon...do not try to skimp on anything as people want their modern appliances, so solar needs to be able to power them all.

My electirc bill here as a 3 bedroom home, 2 adults, 2 kids and one nanny. An office, 1 puter and 2 aircons on all night.......is around 3000 per month. So do the math as to how long it will take to pay back that 1.4 mil.

My question... is there a system anywhere in the worlld that can solar supply a house like this fully, relatively cheaply and pay back the investment in a matter of years, not decades. If there is, I will certainly build it into future houses.

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## nedwalk

your right nawty, would take a very long time before it is viable economically, if how ever and i am refering to here in ozzie, you manage to pass  the means test and the expense of connecting to the grid is as expensive as stand alone then it is certainly viable to go solar, as many are doing, i was quite suprised to learn just how many people are in this area, both grid connect and stand alone systems with the occasional wind generators in the hills, as i am building presently i though a little future proofing would,nt hurt especially if the govt is going to give me the best part of 9 grand to do it :Smile:

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## Marmite the Dog

> So can you solar power a house fully in the tropics yet for a reasonable price ?


I think that the Thai government taxes the hell out of solar panels here and limits the supply in an effort to prove just how environmentally ignorant the Thai leaders really are.

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## Nawty

^lol...awesome strategy.

Yes Ned, I would also if I lived in Oz and would get half of it paid for by the guv. Good work.

Looks like we will be sticking to good old fashioned electric power here for awhile yet.

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## Marmite the Dog

> Looks like we will be sticking to good old fashioned electric power here for awhile yet.


No need.

Home biogas system (original - Appropedia: The sustainability wiki)

HBS (Home Biogas System) & MS PBD

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## Nawty

Nice if you live on a pig farm or such....but not in Bkk.

'When fed with at least 20 L/D (liters/day) 
of manure, it can produce 2.0 m3 of biogas that can be used to cook twice a day'......woohooo.....crisis averted.

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## Marmite the Dog

^ Easily done with other manure I would think. And yes, for the country dwellers.

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