Ukraine war mega thread

[helge]

Oh Helge . . .

Invading and killing tens of thousands is never justifiable, irrespective of what two politicians said/might have said

Yes

Oh, PH

I asked you a question or an opinion of Minsk and the Hollande/Merkel statements, well knowing that you wouldn't like it and that it doesn't fit your narrative.

There is no "might have said" involved. The equation with only one guilty party doesn't hold up.

You gave me the usual Rope a Dope. I do not appreciate it coming from you.

[bsnub]

The equation with only one guilty party doesn't hold up.

Yes it does. A massive invasion into a peaceful democracy is completely unjustifiable on every level. The only people attempting to apply that laughable argument are vatnik morons like yourself, as it is kremlin supplied talking points.

Minsk

Here is another one backspin. I mean Heldge.



You clowns all sound the same.

[helge]

A massive invasion

It's a "Special Millitary Operation"

Putin ordered me to tell you to "get with it".

it is kremlin supplied talking points.

Where do I find these "Kremlin talking points"?

News stream is a bit "one sided" round here.

Link ?

[panama hat]

I asked you a question or an opinion of Minsk and the Hollande/Merkel statements, well knowing that you wouldn't like it and that it doesn't fit your narrative.

The narrative is irrelevant, helge. Theorising on who said what when is irrelevant when looking at tens of thousands of innocents murdered.

[bsnub]

Where do I find these "Kremlin talking points"?

Who knows, the point is that you have found them, and you are regurgitating them ad nauseam.

[helge]

The narrative is irrelevant, helge. Theorising on who said what when is irrelevant when looking at tens of thousands of innocents murdered.

I'm afraid you can count the dead in hundreds of thousands now.

How is it irrelevant who has guilt and who has motives in this ?

If you can't bear thinking about motives of the West-Ukraine, then start with Putin's motives.


"War mongering idiot" doesn't cover all of it

[bsnub]

The ruzzians blew it in the middle of the night. Had to use explosive to do this, too big for a missile. This is going to be bad...

The Nova Kakhovka hydro-electric dam on the Dnipro River in southern Ukraine has been blown

https://twitter.com/saintjavelin/sta...09781008203776

[bsnub]

If you can't bear thinking about motives of the West-Ukraine, then start with Putin's motives.

Blah Blah Blah. You are parroting, you idiot.

"War mongering idiot" doesn't cover all of it

Oh, but it does.

[Takeovers]

The Nova Kakhovka hydro-electric dam on the Dnipro River in southern Ukraine has been blown

It can only mean, the Russians expect to lose badly. Almost all of the damage is on the Russian occupied Kherson. Also no water for agriculture in that area and in Crimea.

Worst case, cooling at the Zaporishia NPP fails. The plant has been shut off for a long time but still needs some cooling.

[HermantheGerman]

This lady has the balls

I think 4-6 people clapped

[HermantheGerman]

This lady has the balls

at 1:07 Absolutely!

[HermantheGerman]

Blah blah

I reckon Putin can watch Youtube if he wants to

I reckon RuZZians can protest for Putler....only.

[HermantheGerman]

Here is one for you PH

You are usually so fond of the indians

Give it a chance

India! a country who's people are starving and can't build a railroad system, but wants to fly into space. Sorry but I don't read or listen to Indian mumble jumble. In this case I have more respect of those communist Chinese pecker heads. Chinese have only one castes system instead of four.

[bsnub]

It can only mean, the Russians expect to lose badly. Almost all of the damage is on the Russian occupied Kherson.

I would agree with you. Basically, the ruzzians just wiped out their entire first defensive on the east side of the Dnipro.

Worst case, cooling at the Zaporishia NPP fails. The plant has been shut off for a long time but still needs some cooling.

I was listening to a nuclear expert speak on Twitter spaces a few hours ago, and he said that because the reactors have been shut down for so long that they do not need a large amount of water to cool them and that the plant workers will be able to keep the reactors stable.

The real tragedy will be the civilians who do not get out of the way of all that water soon enough.

[Takeovers]

I was listening to a nuclear expert speak on Twitter spaces a few hours ago, and he said that because the reactors have been shut down for so long that they do not need a large amount of water to cool them and that the plant workers will be able to keep the reactors stable.

Assuming the Russian occupiers allow a sensible response, yes.

[bsnub]

Assuming the Russian occupiers allow a sensible response, yes.

They would be committing suicide otherwise.

[Bonecollector]

"To make matters more difficult, an ICBM can only be intercepted at certain points on its journey: when it launches, when it is out in space, and when it re-enters the atmosphere. Each of these phases “has its limitations”, said LiveScience.

During the launch phase, a country wishing to knock a nuclear bomb off course would have just a few minutes to respond. And countries that have historically been seen as a nuclear threat, such as Russia and China, “have large land masses”. This allows them to “keep their missiles far inland, meaning sea-based interceptors couldn’t get to a missile during its launch phase”.

And any intercepting missile would have to hit exactly the right spot on a nuclear bomb, or it could simply knock the missile off course and towards another, perhaps friendly, country. This is commonly known as the ‘shortfall’ problem. “You really have to be explicit and target the payload at the tip of the missile,” Grego told the site."

This is what it is all about. The US/ Nato's ability to knock out nukes at all 3 stages to give it the best chance of possibly not even getting hit by a single nuke. It would also then give them free reign to hold Russia to whatever position they wanted them in. This is what this war is really all about. I don't like it, many innocent people are dying on both sides. Putin is a [at][at][at][at] but I don't trust Zelensky. This is all in the end probably necessary but I don't revel in any of it, its very sad but this is how we are, just stupid monkeys doing monkey things.

[bsnub]

There are more pressing issues inside Ukraine at the moment rather than discussing the old nuclear chestnut.

[david44]

Enerhodar will need still need the integrity of the ZNPP cooling ponds opposite Nikopol

If you zoom into the red dot the pools are west of the Plant on the river banks.

Any such sudden actions around a NPP is totally irresponsible

[Hugh Cow]

"To make matters more difficult, an ICBM can only be intercepted at certain points on its journey: when it launches, when it is out in space, and when it re-enters the atmosphere. Each of these phases “has its limitations”, said LiveScience.

During the launch phase, a country wishing to knock a nuclear bomb off course would have just a few minutes to respond. And countries that have historically been seen as a nuclear threat, such as Russia and China, “have large land masses”. This allows them to “keep their missiles far inland, meaning sea-based interceptors couldn’t get to a missile during its launch phase”.

And any intercepting missile would have to hit exactly the right spot on a nuclear bomb, or it could simply knock the missile off course and towards another, perhaps friendly, country. This is commonly known as the ‘shortfall’ problem. “You really have to be explicit and target the payload at the tip of the missile,” Grego told the site."

This is what it is all about. The US/ Nato's ability to knock out nukes at all 3 stages to give it the best chance of possibly not even getting hit by a single nuke. It would also then give them free reign to hold Russia to whatever position they wanted them in. This is what this war is really all about. I don't like it, many innocent people are dying on both sides. Putin is a [at][at][at][at] but I don't trust Zelensky. This is all in the end probably necessary but I don't revel in any of it, its very sad but this is how we are, just stupid monkeys doing monkey things.

Sadly true it would be nice if we could sort things out other than just by murdering each other.

[david44]

Sorry I omitted map link

The red dot is location of Europe's largest NPP at Enerhodar named after nearby city hence ZNPP, cooling ponds t west by river

Level of water in Kakhovka water reservoir is rapidly dropping near Nikopol of Dnipropetrovsk region Zaporizhia - Ukraine Interactive map - Ukraine Latest news on live map - liveuamap.com

No need to understand nuclear physics just imagine a runaway pressure cooker, however this wont blow Irish Stew or Goulasch but deadly radionucleides.

The trapped operators are not generating but it still needs cooling and the war is again a hazard.

The experts are watching closely in Wien

Today the Nova Kakhovka dam was severely damaged leading to a significant reduction in the level of the reservoir used to supply cooling water to the ZNPP.
The water is required for the essential cooling water system which provides cooling (among other) to the following:

• residual heat removal from the reactors (spent or partially spent fuel there);
• residual heat removal from the spent fuel ponds; and
• cooling of the emergency diesel generators (when they are running).

Absence of cooling water in the essential cooling water systems for an extended period of time would cause fuel melt and inoperability of the emergency diesel generators.
However, our current assessment is that there is no immediate risk to the safety of the plant.
The IAEA staff on the site have been informed that the damage to the Nova Kakhovka dam is currently leading to about 5 cm/hour reduction in the height of the reservoir. The team continues to monitor this rate and all other matters on the site.
The main line of cooling water is fed from the reservoir and pumped up through channels near the thermal power plant to the site. It is estimated that the water through this route should last for a few days.
Water in the reservoir was at around 16.4 m at 8 am. If drops below 12.7 m then it can no longer be pumped.
ISAMZ reported that ZNPP is making all efforts to pump as much water into its cooling channels and related systems as possible. In addition, non-essential consumers of water are being stopped at ZNPP to reduce the consumption of water.
ZNPP management is discussing further measures to be implemented.
There are a number of alternative sources of water.


A main one is the large cooling pond next to the site that by design is kept above the height of the reservoir. As the reactors have been shut down for many months it is estimated that this pond will be sufficient to provide water for cooling for some months. The Agency will confirm this very shortly.


It is therefore vital that this cooling pond remains intact. Nothing must be done to potentially undermine its integrity.
I call on all sides to ensure nothing is done to undermine that.
My trip to ZNPP next week was planned and now it is essential. I will go.
I will keep the Board informed as developments unfold.

=
IMHO

As I suggested above, no special skill just simple thermodynamics, ultimately fission reactors are big Kettles

A big blow could do big damage and perhaps push Europe to work harder on the Tokamak unproven commercially fusion designs which are safer.

None are viable or generating at present or unlikely to do in my remaining decades for any members under 25 you may see them I believe at a trial level by 2050 and if successful universally by 2070=2100 by which time my only greens will be daisies above
====================

[david44]

Originally Posted by panama hat
Invading and killing tens of thousands is never justifiable, irrespective of what two politicians said/might have said

It did seem to be the only way to treat the Germans before they stopped murdering Jews, even after Hitler's death Geza Havas was killed on the death March from Mauthausen in 1945, same the Japanese even after Hiroshima they wouldn't surrender.

Mauthausen was notorious and when I visited coach loads of Greeks and Catalans whose relatives had perished there, when asking fior directions in the village in perfect dialekt withoy a hint of a Yiddisch accent people in 1970s pretended they didn't know where it was like not knowing the Eiffel Tower of Red Sq

Austria may soon have a right wing national government while Graz has gone communist, meanwhile in Urfahr (where Hitler was a student" and Leonding I know people who openly display not just their nazi trophies but sympathies, hardly a Jew left at VOEST Alpine, its like a car crash in slow motion

Mauthausen concentration camp - Wikipedia

Meanwhile in Leipzig anti fascists imprisoned , Budapest Jobbik marching with nazi banners

[helge]

^Lost me there

India! a country who's people are starving and can't build a railroad system, but wants to fly into space.

Some truth to that

Are you OK ?

Sorry but I don't read or listen to Indian mumble jumble

Wasn't posted for you

Was for PH as posted

[harrybarracuda]

Is this the "counteroffensive"?

[bsnub]

Is this the "counteroffensive"?

It's on. The next several days should be decisive. Heavy contact is underway in Zaporizhia. Russian telegram in full on panic mode.

Slava Ukraini.