Thread: US marine in Subic Bay Ladyboy slaying identified

Originally Posted by chassamui

Originally Posted by bowie

“I don’t take anymore arguments.”

Cheeky fucker. Surely it's not up to him when the Marine appears? If the defence believe it to be inflamatory then a no show, if permitted by law, is the best thing for all except the snake oil salesman.

This should be on prime time live. Much more interesting than Pistorius.

Very true. The prosecutor has no say. That said, my guess is that the defense will have Pemberton appear tomorrow.

Not much up yet today.

Don't yet know if Pemberton attended the preliminary hearing today, or if the Kraut is out of the hospital and made his scheduled meeting at Immigration Legal Offices.

The Commanding General Of the Philippine Army, having dealt with the Kraut, is now moving to have the Laude family and their lawyer banned from all Philippine military facilities. While Filipinos are allowed access to these relatively open bases, foreigners are not. It appears the lawyer was turned away at two gates due to the presence of the Kraut, then hid the Kraut and went through a third gate, lying to the gate guards about their destination. Bad, bad lawyer......Per social media, Filipinos are getting sick of his circus act.

More as it comes on line, for those who are following.

Oh, and the Filipino guard assaulted by the Kraut was given a commendation this morning by the Army Commander.

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Filipinos are getting sick of his circus act.

Must be a particularly bad circus act. Filipinos love and tolerate a decent circus act.

Originally Posted by Norton

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Filipinos are getting sick of his circus act.

Must be a particularly bad circus act. Filipinos love and tolerate a decent circus act.

They do indeed. He has a soap opera following as the character you really hate.

He is a well-known activist lawyer, especially known for his hatred of America and for his desire to see VFA scrapped.

Where he lost the mob was in his total disregard for his clients, the family and the Kraut, in his moves to keep himself and his agenda in the headlines.

His comments to the Filipino guards at the Camp Aguinaldo detention facility were extremely rude, and incensed Filipino viewers. As did the entire staged incident there where he used both the dead guy's sister and the Kraut as pawns, knowing they would end up in deep shit.

Filipinos, as you said, do love a circus, and this one has plenty of clowns.

That German guy must be a nutter. What could he honestly believe he will achieve by entering the military base?

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Defense lawyer filed a motion requesting clarification of the murder charge, a declaration that there was no probable cause, and a request to have the murder charge reduced to homicide.

That's interesting. It seems (to me at the moment) that there's something missing. Has the defendant been questioned by police in the Philippines? If he has, didn't the police ask what happened or what caused the death, and ask or ascertain the motive for any alleged actions? Surely that's in Detective 101.

^I'm not a lawyer, but I believe that what it all means is that the burden of proof is on the prosecution, and that the defense is asking that they present justification for a murder charge, vice a charge of homicide.

As far as I know, Pemberton has not spoken to police in the Philippines other than his defense team. There is no way to know who he spoke to, what he said, or whether DNA testing and fingerprinting were done, while he was in US custody on the ship.

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Defense lawyer filed a motion requesting clarification of the murder charge, a declaration that there was no probable cause, and a request to have the murder charge reduced to homicide.

Not that hot on the law side of things. Does the murder charge mean the prosecution believe they can prove pre -meditation? Presumably the defence wants a lesser charge with a lower penalty tarrif?

Originally Posted by chassamui

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Defense lawyer filed a motion requesting clarification of the murder charge, a declaration that there was no probable cause, and a request to have the murder charge reduced to homicide.

Not that hot on the law side of things. Does the murder charge mean the prosecution believe they can prove pre -meditation? Presumably the defence wants a lesser charge with a lower penalty tarrif?

I think the murder charge is the standard opening charge in a killing. Then the defense argues (as they are doing) to have it reduced.

I don't see how the prosecution could make a case for premeditation as Pemberton knew the victim for only minutes before they went off to the hotel and, per the victim's friend, had no clue he was dealing with a transgender up until after they were in the hotel room.

The lawyer now has sent a formal request to the Philippine Army to allow him and the family to view Pemberton, as they don't believe he is actually in the Camp Aguinaldo facility. This, of course, resulted in the Army responding that Pemberton is in US custody, per the terms of VFA, and that the request should be sent to the DFA and US Embassy.

This allows the lawyer to once again make the case not about murder, but about the VFA, which, of course, was his intent in filing the request.

The Army, meanwhile, is now considering filing charges against the lawyer and the Laude family for fraudulent entry into Camp Aguinaldo, against the sister for climbing the fence into the restricted area, and against the lawyer for facilitating, encouraging, and organizing it all.

The Palace has issued a statement giving its full support to the Bureau of Immigration in its actions against the Kraut.

And the beat goes on...........

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

The lawyer now has sent a formal request to the Philippine Army to allow him and the family to view Pemberton

They trying to turn him into a museum specimen now? This just gets better and better.
Send the lawyer a picture of pemberton holding the morning paper, at a local landmark, surrounded by guards.
Allowing that specious, self serving lawyer anywhere near him would infringe the marine's human rights.

Did a bit of research. It appears that with Pemberton's no-show at the preliminary hearing, it rests with the prosecution to determine the charge, and if they think they can make a murder charge stick, vice the lesser charge of homicide.

Murder carries life in prison; homicide twenty years.

The prosecution has scheduled a viewing of the hotel room scene for 5 November (although I can't imagine what new evidence they think they will uncover) and after that will decide what charge to file.

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

I don't see how the prosecution could make a case for premeditation as Pemberton knew the victim for only minutes before they went off to the hotel and, per the victim's friend, had no clue he was dealing with a transgender up until after they were in the hotel room.

Premeditation - in the case of murder- is intent to kill or cause serious harm.

'She's got a cock. I am going to kill her.'

Premeditation is not necessarily dependent on longer term plotting and planning.

^True. It's a very gray area. Time will tell.

On one hand, I think if the charge was reduced to homicide, there's a good chance Pemberton might plead out, and they could be done with it, with a verdict of twenty years.

On the other hand, if they go for murder, they could keep the case going through a lengthy trial, which is what the family lawyer wants, as it would keep the VFA on trial and in the public eye.

The severity of the charge will depend on what he says.

If he does say

'I saw a cock. I flipped and decided to give it a damn good thrashing.'

Then murder is the charge that a decent prosecutor would aim for. It's a hate crime.

'A fight started when I refused to pay for her vaginalessness'...he stands a better chance.

Davis, the USMC could (probably will) conduct an inquiry/ investigation (military tribunal) which could pass an additional sentence.
Do you believe that scenario will become evident after a civilian court's verdict in PI ?

^I don't really know. I am not a lawyer. I think repeat think that he could be tried again under UCMJ after completing his foreign sentence. I doubt, if he had served a 20 year sentence administered by a Filipino court, that UCMJ would pile on again. But I really don't know.

Originally Posted by PeeCoffee

Davis, the USMC could (probably will) conduct an inquiry/ investigation (military tribunal) which could pass an additional sentence. Do you believe that scenario will become evident after a civilian court's verdict in PI ?

I seriously doubt they would want to discipline him further especially if he faces a murder charge and a life sentence. Bringing military charges against him would seem pointless and vindictive. Suspect the US wants this to go away quickly for the reasons stated.

I communicated with a filipina today in the course of business and she stated that the feeling is of sorrow for a person losing their life.

There seemed to be no sense of retribution in her converstaion against the Marine...possibly understanding a young persons mindset.

Possibly there are many good Catholics in PI that take Jesus 'turn the other check' to heart and forgive another's transgression.

Caveat: This was just one person I talked to who maybe wanted to sound kinder and gentler knowing I was an American.

Originally Posted by The Ghost Of The Moog

The severity of the charge will depend on what he says.

If he does say

'I saw a cock. I flipped and decided to give it a damn good thrashing.'

Then murder is the charge that a decent prosecutor would aim for. It's a hate crime.

'A fight started when I refused to pay for her vaginalessness'...he stands a better chance.

It's not the USA and no federal US law has been broken, so how a hate crime.
It's the Philippians, different legal system, doubt they have hate crimes, no premeditation, no murder charge.

There is no hate crime legislation in the Philippines.

^Think harder.......