Ukraine war mega thread

[David48atTD]

... please stay on script!

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Democrats clarify Biden's Putin remark as Republicans knock his 'mistake'

President Joe Biden said his Russian counterpart, Vladimir Putin, “cannot remain in power” during a fiery speech from Poland.



“For God’s sake, this man cannot remain in power,” Biden said at the end of a speech from Warsaw, Poland’s capital, on Saturday — a line that a source familiar with the situation said wasn’t included in prepared remarks.

“The President was speaking from his heart but it is not U.S. policy to see regime change," Rep. Ro Khanna, D-Calif., said in an interview on "Fox News Sunday."

Democrats clarify Biden'''s Putin remark as Republicans knock his '''mistake'''

Joe, please de-escalate the tensions, not escalate them.

[sabang]

The restoration of the former Soviet Union!

In all of it's Glory! My view on that is, even if "he would if he could'- he can't, so he shan't". I guess I see Putin as considerably more pragmatic than that. If he is in fact a crazed megalomaniac, he will lose. Not that He matters- his beloved Russia does.

Bullet points-

• The lesson of Afghanistan- what Russian could fail to learn from that
• The Georgian expedition- in and out like Flynn
• His own governments assurance 'no Occupation' (sure, can they be believed)
• Military withdrawing from Kiev area, military focus on the ethnically Russian east
• His tenure as Russian President has been basically pragmatic. Ok, some will say this war has upended that.

I will try to get the article you linked to later Norton, but it 'is not available in my area'. There are dodgy ways though.

[Buckaroo Banzai]

So you're another one swallowing this "having NATO neighbours is dangerous" bullshit.

I will say The same thing tp you as I said to others when they create a strawman argument and then handily defeat it.
You provide a quote not contained anywhere in my reply. Please show me where I said " having NATO neighbours is dangerous".

No, having neighbours with a history of invading other countries is dangerous.

Which exactly why the Russians wo not want the Americans in Ukraine. Thank you for making my point.

[Buckaroo Banzai]

A reply so good I post it twice. !! But being the great guy that I am, if I could say so myself, I thought better and removed it .

[sabang]

We can debate the 'Nato is pure and sweet' line all we want, but isn't that a bit irrelevant now? When Putin said Ukraine was his red line- he obviously was not bluffing.

[Buckaroo Banzai]

“For God’s sake, this man cannot remain in power,” Biden said at the end of a speech from Warsaw, Poland’s capital, on Saturday — a line that a source familiar with the situation said wasn’t included in prepared remarks.

I guess the cat is out of the bag now. Nothing we did not all of us know.
Well most of us from some of the acrimony in this Thread.
Getting Putin out of power is not a bad thing IMO, using another country to do it, and it's subsequent destruction is.
The tragedy of all this is that if anything ,it has made Putin's hold on power stronger.
People don't change horses in mid- stream.

[harrybarracuda]

In all of it's Glory! My view on that is, even if "he would if he could'- he can't, so he shan't". I guess I see Putin as considerably more pragmatic than that. If he is in fact a crazed megalomaniac, he will lose. Not that He matters- his beloved Russia does.

Bullet points-

• The lesson of Afghanistan- what Russian could fail to learn from that
• The Georgian expedition- in and out like Flynn
• His own governments assurance 'no Occupation' (sure, can they be believed)
• Military withdrawing from Kiev area, military focus on the ethnically Russian east
• His tenure as Russian President has been basically pragmatic. Ok, some will say this war has upended that.

I will try to get the article you linked to later Norton, but it 'is not available in my area'. There are dodgy ways though.

Christ now we've got two Hoohoos spouting the same fucking shit.

[harrybarracuda]

Please show me where I said " having NATO neighbours is dangerous".

That would be where you said "Russia would not had invaded if Ukraine had not invited western interests in Russia front door" so if you're trying to play the dumb fuck, you're succeeding.

[harrybarracuda]

Joe, please de-escalate the tensions, not escalate them.

Bollocks. Do everything to tell his military leaders that it's OK to top him.

[harrybarracuda]

We can debate the 'Nato is pure and sweet' line all we want, but isn't that a bit irrelevant now? When Putin said Ukraine was his red line- he obviously was not bluffing.

Putin invaded a sovereign nation.

That stays relevant until he's in jail or dead.

[Buckaroo Banzai]

That would be where you said "Russia would not had invaded if Ukraine had not invited western interests in Russia front door" so if you're trying to play the dumb fuck, you're succeeding.

Someone is playing the " dumb fuck" and it certainly is not me. If you wanted to react to the above, why did you then put quote marks around "" having NATO neighbors is dangerous". or don't you know what quotation marks mean?

[Troy]

In other words 'I'm not sure but'
Well in a nutshell in your own words, in a nutshell.
Not the fucking history of the region, what did Ukraine do to 'provoke' the recent illegal invasion of their sovereign country?
You've got nothing.

Building a dam to cut off the water supply to Crimea and ruining its agriculture was not the smartest of moves. Friction was already high and that provoked the need for a land link between Russia and Crimea. This cost Ukraine the Eastern regions, which were destabilised. However, that was taking too long, Putin was getting more and more frustrated, until he decided enough was enough.

If you need a solid reason then you have it although life is far more complicated.

[panama hat]

And Russia would not had invaded if Ukraine had not invited western interests in Russia front door.

Greece deserved to ass-fucked by the Italians and Germans because . . . well, they weren't part of the axis . . . had they joined it wouldn't happened . . . and Greece might have some discipline today.
So, if Turkey decides to invade Greece the it's Greece's own fault.

Easy, history BB-way.

Seriously, that is a sad statement.

Do you really believe that Russia would be honest when telling you their military strategy?

How freakishly deluded he is . . .

But like i said, not that i know anything in this area.

You know more than he does. What has brought out the mindless maggots with this invasion . . .

[Norton]

I will try to get the article you linked to later Norton, but it 'is not available in my area'. There are dodgy ways though

Good luck. Post is gone. Must have been unworthy of TD high standards.

[harrybarracuda]

Someone is playing the " dumb fuck" and it certainly is not me. If you wanted to react to the above, why did you then put quote marks around "" having NATO neighbors is dangerous". or don't you know what quotation marks mean?

Oh FFS is trying to change the fucking subject de rigeur now?

I'll keep it simple. You're talking shit.

[David48atTD]

Interesting clip about a BBC reporter out with a Ukrainian Patrol.

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Ukraine war: The drone pilots monitoring Russian troops

Ukraine war: The drone pilots monitoring Russian troops - BBC News

[David48atTD]

Ukraine war: Destruction of cities shown from above

Ukraine war: Destruction of cities shown from above - BBC News

[OhOh]

what did Ukraine do to 'provoke'

Here are a few.

1. Demanding NATO inclusion,
2. 8 years of Ukraine military SPLATTERING fellow Ukrainian men, women and children,
3. Denying some Ukraine citizens of water,
4. Constant threats from NATO countries leaders,
5. NATO refusing to discuss diplomatic solutions/requests from Russia to solve historic agreements being ignored by NATO, OSCE,
6. Permanent members of UNSC ignoring UNSC resolutions,
7. Recent increases of Ukraine/separatist military at the LOC
8. Threats to use nuclear weapons
9. .......

For details, I refer you to multiple previous posts in this and other TD threads.

Any intelligent comments to refute these "provocations"?

[panama hat]

Any intelligent comments to refute these "provocations"?

If you made any then responses would be forthcoming


You really are a sick little fucking apologist, sad to see you've got sabang as company

[Norton]

Good luck. Post is gone. Must have been unworthy of TD high standards.

I stand corrected. It's in the News thread. Got cornfused.

[sabang]

Well it is confusing. Now they are moving Editorials from SC to News?

[kingwilly]

If you made any then responses would be forthcoming


You really are a sick little fucking apologist, sad to see you've got sabang as company

And Backspit and Bucky.

Klongdick would also be in like a pig in shit if he was still posting here.

[Buckaroo Banzai]

Greece deserved to ass-fucked by the Italians and Germans because . . . well, they weren't part of the axis . . . had they joined it wouldn't happened . . . and Greece might have some discipline today.
So, if Turkey decides to invade Greece the it's Greece's own fault.

Easy, history BB-way.

When I ask where did I say any of that, or how did you infare that from what I said I am either met with silence or
nonsense.
Why some of you can not understand a simple proposition such as "Provocation" is beyond me . Just because the response to the provocation might be unwarranted, it does not eliminate the occurrence of the provocation.
I gave you a historical perspective, I provided you with quotes and links from respected US diplomats that said in the past exactly what I am saying now. In case I am inarticulate I provided video from strategic analysis thot supports the proposition that I am putting forth,
even Biden in a fit of dementia fueled gaffe, blurted out what the goals of this whole endeavor are .
I some times feel like joining all of you in the epithet calling but the truth of the matter is that I am the bigger idiot here, for thinking that I can engage in a logical fact bases discussion.

[sabang]

This is most interesting. So now we have-

Some oil exports from ME to China to be priced in Yuan
Gas exports Russia to EU, Ruble
Oil exports Russia to India, Ruble (or maybe Rupee?)

Incidentally, India is not an 'unfriendly nation' - it doesn't have to pay in rubles.
You know the US has protected the primacy of it's Petrodollar like a hawk, right? Now it is actively being eroded. This is really quite significant.

Gaddafi died trying to get rid of the Petrodollar. – The Awareness Project

[bsnub]

Why some of you can not understand a simple proposition such as "Provocation" is beyond me .

Why wasn't it a provocation when Latvia and Estonia joined NATO back in 2004? They share borders with Russia just the same as Ukraine and regularly host US troops. How can you honestly apply a different metric to Ukraine, for some reason? The argument just does not hold water.

Both countries are hosting thousands of NATO forces as we speak, which is more than Ukraine could ever claim yet no "provocation" in those nations. Surely you see the hypocrisy in the argument?