Ukraine war mega thread

[Takeovers]

The same is even more true of Crimea, which voted overwhelmingly to rejoin Russia.

Bullshit in the extreme. Russia first invaded Crimea, then drove out the ethnic Ukrainians. Then they made this bogus vote. Sure at that time most of them would vote Russia, knowing that they would no longer be liked in Ukraine. A fair vote would have been before the invasion under international control. I bet most of even the ethnic Russians then would have voted Ukraine, knowing what dump Russia had become.

[Takeovers]

The fact that Putin is a gangster politician shouldn't blind people to the facts about Crimea. But don't take my word for it, try Reuters instead:
"Tense Crimea votes overwhelmingly to leave Ukraine for Russia"
Tense Crimea votes overwhelmingly to leave Ukraine for Russia | Reuters

PS The history of Russia-Crimea dates to well before the US became a nation.

This does not contradict my reasoning. Do you think ethnic Russians automatically vote for a gangster politician, because he is ethnic Russian too? I don't.

At the time this bogus vote was held, after Putin invaded and drove out the ethnic Ukrainians, they had little choice left.

[sabang]

^ Absolute twaddle. Not worth responding to further.

[beam8]

I'd personally like to see a referendum held soon in the east with a sixty percent threshold required for separation.

Didn't they have one in Crimea? and even after that they said that Russia stole it? And then Russia got Trump elected? FFS The big BoogyMan Russia.

[Backspin]

This does not contradict my reasoning. Do you think ethnic Russians automatically vote for a gangster politician, because he is ethnic Russian too? I don't.

At the time this bogus vote was held, after Putin invaded and drove out the ethnic Ukrainians, they had little choice left.

There's no such thing as ethnic Ukrainians They are all Slavs.

[beam8]

gypsies and settlers?

[sabang]

What was the American pretext to bomb Yugoslavia? Was it authorised by the Security Council, or what? Where is Yugoslavia and where is the United States? The Americans destroyed the country. Indeed, Yugoslavia had an internal conflict, they had their own problems, but who gave the Americans the right to conduct airstrikes against a European capital? No one did. They just chose to do so, and their NATO satellites were running behind them yelping along. So much for international law.

Under what pretext did Washington go into Iraq? It was Iraq developing weapons of mass destruction. They went in, destroyed the country, created a hotbed of international terrorism, and then it turned out that they made a mistake: “The intelligence failed us.” Wow! They destroyed a country. The intelligence failed – that is all they had to say to justify their actions. It turned out there were no weapons of mass destruction there. On the contrary, everything had been destroyed as agreed.

How did they go into Syria? With Security Council authorisation? No. They do as they please. However, what they are doing, or trying or planning to do in Ukraine, is not happening thousands of kilometres away from our national border. It is on the doorstep of our house. They must understand that we simply have nowhere further to retreat to.

There are experts here, sitting with us, I stay in constant contact with them. The United States does not possess hypersonic weapons yet, but we know when they will have it. It cannot be hidden. Everything goes on record, successful or unsuccessful tests alike. We have a sense of when it might happen. They will supply hypersonic weapons to Ukraine and then use them as cover – that does not mean that they will start using them tomorrow, because we already have Tsircon and they do not – to arm extremists from a neighbouring state and incite them against certain regions of the Russian Federation, such as Crimea, when they think circumstances are favourable.

Do they really think we do not see these threats? Do they think that we will just stand idly watching threats to Russia emerge? This is the problem: we simply have no room to retreat. That is the question.

Armed conflicts and bloodshed are absolutely not our choice. We do not want to see events go that way. We want to use political and diplomatic means to resolve problems but we want to at least have clearly formulated legal guarantees. This is what our proposals are all about. We set them down on paper and sent them to Brussels and Washington, and we hope to receive a clear and comprehensive response to these proposals.

[beam8]

Sabang ^ makes the best point to abolish NATO, or at least get non European countries out of it.

[sabang]

I cannot think of one single positive thing Nato has done in the last 30 years. Can anyone? Just a bunch of warmongering gerontocrats, trying to justify their own existence and bloated budget by constantly trying to stir up conflict.

[beam8]

I second that^.

After the last great War ended in 1945, did they just start a conflict to test their weapons?
Korea?
Vietnam?
Kuwait?
Iraq?
on and on and on?

[Takeovers]

There's no such thing as ethnic Ukrainians They are all Slavs.

Who made the argument that the ethnic Russians would prefer to join the madman Putin over West/EU orientation with Ukraine?

[bsnub]

At the time this bogus vote was held, after Putin invaded and drove out the ethnic Ukrainians, they had little choice left.

This is spot on and there is video evidence to back it up, and I have posted it many times in these types of threads. The videos are ignored by posters like sabang who wants to push a false narrative because he is a Putin apologist who is not interested in the truth.



This is just one of a video series by Simon Ostrovsky. It shows just what was happening there at the time, It shows a reality that sabang denies and refuses to acknowledge because he is basically a blinkered lemming.

[sabang]

Hi snubs- we're not real, we're from the internet.

[bsnub]

Hi snubs- we're not real, we're from the internet.

The truth stings eh?

[HermantheGerman]

I cannot think of one single positive thing Nato has done in the last 30 years. Can anyone? Just a bunch of warmongering gerontocrats, trying to justify their own existence and bloated budget by constantly trying to stir up conflict.

Absolute twaddle. Not worth responding to further.

[HermantheGerman]

There's no such thing as ethnic Ukrainians They are all Slavs.

...and corrupt

[HermantheGerman]

...are you related to him ^

I second that^.

After the last great War ended in 1945, did they just start a conflict to test their weapons?
Korea?
Vietnam?
Kuwait?
Iraq?
on and on and on?

[Hugh Cow]

It seems some have forgotten the lessons of the past. Maybe ask the hungarians and the Czechs how well they went in leaving the Soviet union which was a defacto Russian empire. Or the Tartars who were expelled from Crimea who were replaced by many russian immigrants.Or the Katyn massacre by the Russians of around 21,000 Poles when Poland was divided between Germany and Russia in 1940.
Nato was a neccessary response to Russian (soviet) aggression. It's mandate was one of defense not attack. (An attack on one would be considered an attack on all) It was to prevent Russia taking europe country by country.
I do see the historical hypocrisy of the USA which seized Territory from Mexico mainly by force. Then there were the european empires etc.
Hopefully, history has shown us what not to do and what we should not tolerate In this day and age.
We should no longer tolerate annexation of countries territory especially in areas that in some cases were a product of forced migration.
As far as the citizens voting for Russias annexation of Crimea. Some may find this article interesting.

Crimea: Six years after illegal annexation

[HermantheGerman]

Some may find this article interesting.
Crimea: Six years after illegal annexation

For most of that time, the Baltics regaining independence seemed implausible…until it happened.

Why? Because NO ONE trusts/likes Russians (politically).

[panama hat]

So who in the EU is going to help out Ukraine. The US and U K have said they wil not send troops so surely this is a moment for the EU to stand up and do something more than just sit in Brussels making up rules.

Good to see that nothing changes, you're still a fucking idiot who spouts anti-EU butthurt shit at every chance.

You're out of the EU - accept it and fuck off, focus on yourselves.


And OhOh . . .

[NamPikToot]

I see your holiday in the nut house hasn't dealt with your obsession. You never stop

[panama hat]

You never stop

You're as much a fucking idiot as ever. I did stop . . . for a few weeks. YOU continued.

Not really difficult to follow logic, is it . . . oh, it's you . . .

Good God, what a fucking idiot . . . thick as pigshit and zero sense of humour . . .

[Backspin]

Germans don't want this war. But the Anglo axis does.

Two British C-17 transport aircraft carrying weapons to Ukraine had to fly around German airspace after Germany refused to supply weapons to Ukraine.

Link - https://twitter.com/UKDefJournal/sta...094436875?s=20

[russellsimpson]

I see Canada has sent a small contigent of military personel into Ukraine which pretty well indicates that there will be no Russian 'invasion'. There is no way the Canadian government would put troops in harms way, no way at all. Many are making comparison to this crisis and what happened in 1914. The dynamics are certainly similar. I still consider it highly unlikely that any Russian troops will be crossing any borders. One has to find it unimaginable that this show is going to escalate further. I consider it highly unlikely that Ukraine would ever receive an invitation from NATO, just ain't ever going to happen. Unfortunate that it's become a bone of contention.

[Bonecollector]

I see Canada has sent a small contigent of military personel into Ukraine which pretty well indicates that there will be no Russian 'invasion'. There is no way the Canadian government would put troops in harms way, no way at all. Many are making comparison to this crisis and what happened in 1914. The dynamics are certainly similar. I still consider it highly unlikely that any Russian troops will be crossing any borders. One has to find it unimaginable that this show is going to escalate further. I consider it highly unlikely that Ukraine would ever receive an invitation from NATO, just ain't ever going to happen. Unfortunate that it's become a bone of contention.

I agree and I would further add that Putin just does this shit to maintain control in his own country. He can get away with most things in Russia as long as he keeps the rich rich and a national perception that Russia is still a massive player on the world stage and one not to mess with. It's all KGB type mind games to keep him in power. The army needs to do regular exercises anyway, so sending them to the Ukraine border instead of Siberia, is no additional cost financially and gives his political points with the nationalists of which are still the majority in Russia.