Thread: Comments on a world without God.

Fry makes his point extremely well IMO.

Fry is a contemporary genius. Burdened with the an intelect the size of two planets, no wonder he has the odd breakdown.
Carrying all that knowledge and understanding, he is fortunate to have us mere mortals to indulge his passion for living life to the full.

https://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=lnSByCb8lqY&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=lfmqiBfoPwA&feature=related

"Ignorance breeds monsters to fill up the vacancies of the soul that are unoccupied by the verities of knowledge."
-Horace Mann

A man's ethical behaviour should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death.
(Albert Einstein, "Religion and Science", New York Times Magazine, 9 November 1930)

Quite.

butterfly talking utter nonsense as usual when it comes to secularism.

man has sufficient intelligence to see the corruption and fallacy that exists in all religions.

No need to beat yourself with a stick to prove you are wrong butterfly. Every word you write continues to beat you senseless.

Originally Posted by chassamui

man has sufficient intelligence to see the corruption and fallacy that exists in all religions.

he does now, but that's thanks to religion in some ways. Think of a caveman mentality, do you think without religion he will have become "civilized" ? Religion made man evolution. You need to read Rousseau

Originally Posted by chassamui

No need to beat yourself with a stick to prove you are wrong butterfly. Every word you write continues to beat you senseless.

Glad to see you are a believer in your own religious crap. Who is your god ?

Originally Posted by Butterfly

you have to realize that men are religious animals, so the issue is not really god per se, but man interpretation of the world though his narrow vision, because his brain is simply incapable of dealing with certain reality, but just enough to understand the depth of that reality

therefore, maybe it be Christian gods, Muslims, Science, and even "Free Entreprise", these are all a model framework that we put in place to "protect" ourselves.

We need religion to survive, even if it kills a few in the process

When it comes to religion and politics, I always get the distinct feeling you were dropped on your head as a baby, or maybe you are on acid or summat.

This good Butterfly;

Originally Posted by Butterfly

you have to realize that men are religious animals, so the issue is not really god per se, but man interpretation of the world though his narrow vision

Man is not crippled with narrow vision or requiring of an external supernatural being to provide insight in to the beauty of nature and the universe. The literary, artistic and scientific geniuses of history are testament to this.

'God' is just a poetic metaphor for that insight into the sublime which is actually a feat of the human spirit itself.

Organised religion is not spiritually relevant anymore it was a stepping stone in the evolution of organised society and its desire to weave moral consciousness into its fabric.

wasn't his father a vicar?

Originally Posted by good2bhappy

wasn't his father a vicar?

Fry ?

His father was a physicist.

and inventor
my mistake

Originally Posted by Looper

The literary, artistic and scientific geniuses of history are testament to this.

but these are exceptions, hence confirming the rule

Originally Posted by Looper

Man is not crippled with narrow vision or requiring of an external supernatural being

you obviously haven't been outside

the world is full of believers, the majority of the mass is scared and live in lala land. The world is a world full of people with a narrow vision, and this is a fact. I believe that 90% of the world population believe in some type of god or religion. That's what we are, religious animals, nothing else. And stop taking this personally

Originally Posted by Looper

Organised religion is not spiritually relevant anymore it was a stepping stone in the evolution of organised society and its desire to weave moral consciousness into its fabric.

agree but only for an educated minority. It remains relevant for a majority, mostly uneducated, that would be more happy to return to the stone age. We remain vicious and salvage animals deep down.

Off on a bit of a tangent but well worth watching. I've posted the first bit, it's about nine minutes long. There are 5 altogether. The final result of the debate is pretty amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=pXACuQXQ7Co&feature=related

Originally Posted by Butterfly

We need religion to survive

I don't.

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Looper

Organised religion is not spiritually relevant anymore it was a stepping stone in the evolution of organised society and its desire to weave moral consciousness into its fabric.

agree but only for an educated minority. It remains relevant for a majority, mostly uneducated, that would be more happy to return to the stone age. We remain vicious and salvage animals deep down.

You are suggesting that humans are essentially savages and that God is the boogeyman who keeps us in line.

I don't think humans are essentially savages. I think most humans conform to mutually cooperative moral codes hard-wired into our social evolution. There are exceptions of course but we don't need a mythical sky-phantom to discourage misbehaviour. That is what the criminal justice system is there for. Better to have something tangible to discourage rogue behaviour than something intellectually deniable.

^ disagree, remove the social infrastructure or any "social barriers", and see how we return to the animal stage in a matter of days

we remains apes, that is we are basically monkeys. If you go to a zoo and watch Orangutans, look at them in the eyes, and see how surprising "human" they are in their eyes and facial expression.

the "social contract" is the only thing that keep us "civilized". Remove it, and we will go apeshit like monkeys out of their cage. The first "social contract" ever is the 10 commandment.

The "imaginative" being is a necessity to establish a credible authority,

Originally Posted by Butterfly

The first "social contract" ever is the 10 commandment.

So you're saying that prior to the 10 commandments all was chaos?

Originally Posted by jandajoy

So you're saying that prior to the 10 commandments all was chaos?

it was probably also after, but I am just illustrating that our society is based on a religious "social contract"

other religions have them too, "covenants" are contracts

Why does a social contract have to religious?

^ intrinsically it doesn't need to be, but in the early days it was needed to establish credibility or authority