Ukraine war mega thread

[Hugh Cow]

^ “refrigerated rail cars near the Hungarian border are not even officially listed as KIA”

If you read that item again it says there is ONE rail car and it COULD hold as many as 500 bodies.

I'll just take your word on that MK. Not a good look though, innit?

No, but your insinuation is typical of pro russian propaganda and there once again Sabang your credibility lies in tatters. You have been brought to task so often I am amazed how you gleefully go on with not a sign of embarrassment.

[sabang]

Pretty obvious hughie innit? Ukraine is not winning this war. The Economic sanctions haven't worked. The much spruiked 'Thunder run' of the mythical Ukrainian Winter offensive was just a pile of pony shit. Russia is gaining ground, and causing heavy attrition to Nato arnaments and Ukrainian lives. You are being fed a pack of lies. D'uhhh, guess I wasn't so wrong after all.

[bsnub]

You have been brought to task so often I am amazed how you gleefully go on with not a sign of embarrassment.

It has been utterly laughable for some time now. He is like a beaten dog that keeps coming back with the same horseshit time and time again.

You are being fed a pack of lies. D

This from a clown who constantly refers and posts Russian propaganda and lies. The irony is overwhelming.

[sabang]

The facts on the ground are not.

[Backspin]

This is hilarious

[Backspin]

Oh man KIA's!

The Western media can pick any number it wants. It's bullshit.

And it doesn't even matter what the casualties are. This isn't a sport war or an away game. Do you think the US was worried about the casualties in the war against Mexico to annex Texas ? Hell no. This is real territory.

But hey. Let's just give Ukraine to the US to install missile batteries pointed at us for the next 100 years because we might have some casualties. And some US naval bases just miles from the Black sea fleet for the next 100 years too. Yeah

[Hugh Cow]

Pretty obvious hughie innit? Ukraine is not winning this war. The Economic sanctions haven't worked. The much spruiked 'Thunder run' of the mythical Ukrainian Winter offensive was just a pile of pony shit. Russia is gaining ground, and causing heavy attrition to Nato arnaments and Ukrainian lives. You are being fed a pack of lies. D'uhhh, guess I wasn't so wrong after all.

What you fail to understand was that Russia when it first tried to overwhelm the Ukrainian army with a superior force and what would have been a cakewalk for the USA and or NATO, they failed miserably. Their attempt at taking Kiev and killing off the Ukrainian government was a complete disaster. They have consistently overestimated their own ability and underestimated the Ukrainians. Sanctions are and always will be a long game and Putin has been planning this since Crimea so he has had 8 years and is still fighting twelve months later. Using the Wagner group only shows his army is not up to the task. They are moving at a glacial pace.
I dont know where or when this will end militarily. I concede it is possible the Russians may keep Crimea and even part of the Donbas. They will remain a pariah politically and financially isolated from the west. They will be squeezed until their military is a shadow of its former self and no longer able to invade. Their citizens will be set back financially and Russia may take a generation to recover. The Ukrainians will never again trust Russia and the only way I can see them giving up territory is in return for membership of both NATO and the EU.
There is not one country in the world over the last century that has made financial and social gains for its citizens without trade with the west. Japan and China would both still be economic backwaters. Russia has that to look forward to in their future. Eventually they will learn there is all pain and little gain. In other words Russia will be the loser in the end.

[bsnub]

The facts on the ground are not.

Facts like these...

Kyiv
Kherson
Kharkiv
Chernihiv

Oh wait...

[HuangLao]

As long as it's highly profitable for particular circles......it's all good.

[Little Chuchok]

As History has repeated with the dirty Ruskies, they will supply more and more canon fodder to this war. I read that by May, they will have close to 500,000 troops. All badly trained, badly equipped, badly led and with a terrible morale. That's 500,000 though...jesus! This is what Russia has done for centuries.They win half of their wars this way.

By May, the Ukrainians will have an additional 60,000 troops that have been trained with the much superior weapons from the Nato countries. They also have more equipment that they have stolen from the Russians than they started the war with.

So after the mud season in May, you might be able to tell which way the war goes, but this might be early days.

So if the Ukrainians can break the supply chain of the Ruskies, you will end up with 500,000 dead troops. If the Ruskies break through with their sheer numbers, then you are probably looking at over a million Ukrainians (Civilians) dead. Then the Russians have to occupy... That would be a shit show!

Hopefully the Ukrainians win, but either way it's a disgusting, horrible war.

[panama hat]

You have been brought to task so often I am amazed how you gleefully go on with not a sign of embarrassment.

Ukraine is not winning this war.

That wasn't and isn't the point made . . . this is:

I look forward to your further humiliation.

It's become a bit sad by now . . . his elation at Russians bombing cities, torturing people sabang is wetting himself at the thought.

[sabang]

A'hhh yes, as expected- moving the goal posts. Oh dear, looks like sab was right- Ukraine is losing this war, the economic sanctions haven't worked, and Ukrainian casualties significantly exceed those of Russian. So lets move the goalposts- b'waaah, sab glorifies in war and torture! Grow up.

[happynz]

In 2030 Putin has behaved himself and as a result the devil gives him a 24 hour furlough from hell. Putin chooses to go to Moskva for a beer. He asks the bartender how things are going in Russia. "Very good!" replies the bartender. This pleases Putin greatly. He asks the bartender for the bill. The bartender answers, "That will be 3 Euro."



Best outcome.

[sabang]

Meanwhile in the real world, they are earning and spending rubles in Donbass & Crimea.

[bsnub]

Oh dear, looks like sab was right- Ukraine is losing this war

You have not been right since before this war started, and you surely are not right now. Most of your posts are completely detached from reality and are commonly riddled with lies and propaganda.

What major victories has Russia had in the last eight months? Ukraine has liberated the entirety of Kharkiv oblast, handing Russia its largest battlefield defeat since WW2. It also defeated Russia in Kherson. Those are too massive strategic victories, while on the other hand Russia has only lost ground. It has failed for months to take the small city of Bakhmut. A place with absolutely no strategic value.

Yet you claim Russia is winning. Ok clownboy.

[sabang]

So lets pin recruit snubski down. Are you saying:-

1/ Ukraine is winning this war? Y/N
2/ The economic sanctions have worked/ are working? Y/N
3/ Russian casualties exceed those of Ukrainian? Y/N

Three simple Y/N answers recruit snubski- now man up.

[sabang]

Ukrainians Military Fleeing Bakhmut/Artemovsk Describe

February 6, 2023INTEL-DROP

The situation in Artemovsk for the Armed Forces of Ukraine is becoming more complicated with every passing hour. The militants of the Kyiv regime can no longer hold the line, but the leadership of Ukraine continues to declare the impossibility of retreating from the city. Such a position of the command forces the Ukrainian soldiers to arbitrarily leave their positions in Artemovsk.

One of the soldiers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine posted a video on the Web, which shows how a small group of Ukrainian servicemen leave Artemivsk.

We got out of this hell. Bakhmut is on fire. We went out in small groups. Our bosses beat us up. I speak as it is. The boys were lost today.
In half an hour – four “three hundredths”, two “two hundredths”. Let’s get out of here. It’s just hell
– commented the author of the video.


Recall that the fights in the so-called Bakhmut meat grinder have been going on since August last year. Russian volunteers from PMC “Wagner” continuously storm the city. In recent days, they managed to occupy several settlements on the outskirts of Artemovsk. A little more, and the city will be in operational encirclement.

In Artyomovsk itself, the battles are fought directly in the city blocks, which the Ukrainian army has turned into fortified areas. Despite this, the Russian units storming the city manage to move forward.

Western curators of the Kyiv regime have repeatedly called on the President of Ukraine to withdraw troops from Artemivsk. However, Vladimir Zelensky continues to declare the need to defend the city. The military command of Ukraine continues to attempt to transfer reinforcements to the city.
Бегущие из Артемовска боевики ВСУ описали происходящее в городе

[Hugh Cow]

Define "winning" Russia has less territory now than before so that could be classified as losing.
The sanctions are working when you consider Putin has been attempting to sanction proof Russia since 2014 whilst sanctions are not even a year old. Like all things financial there is always a lead lag effect and it will take to the end of 2023 to see how well or not they are working. They are certainly working as with the huge increase in energy prices Russia's economy should be powering along and it isn't. Russian military casualties and Ukrainian are hard to estimate but the fact Russia is nowhere near succeeding in its original objectives and the call up that was never going to happen plus the need to use wagner and russian prisoners would suggest Russian casualties far out pace Ukrainin casualties.

[Norton]

Russian military casualties and Ukrainian are hard to estimate

Can't be done and even it it could, irrelevant to winning a war. Many losers killed way more than the winners of past wars.

[bsnub]

So lets pin recruit snubski down. Are you saying:-

1/ Ukraine is winning this war? Y/N
2/ The economic sanctions have worked/ are working? Y/N
3/ Russian casualties exceed those of Ukrainian? Y/N

Three simple Y/N answers recruit snubski- now man up.

1. Ukraine has liberated more territory in the last 8 months, while Russia has taken next to none.
2. Russia's defense industry is practically shut down, as it can not acquire sensitive parts like optics and microchips to produce its war machines.
3. Russia is taking far higher casualties than Ukraine. Ukraine's army is far better trained and equipped than the Russians are. It is fighting from a mostly defensive posture, which results in less casualties than an attacking army. Furthermore, Russia employs 'meat grinder' human wave attacks with its Wagner prison conscripts. Russia's casualty rate, particularly in Bakhmut, is far higher than Ukraine.

nytimes.com

[bsnub]

Ukrainians Military Fleeing Bakhmut/Artemovsk Describe

More shit Russian propaganda posted by the dimwitted useful idiot.

[sabang]

Kyiv demanded $500 million from Tel Aviv and condemnation of Moscow


The Ukrainian authorities put forward a number of demands to Israel, including a loan of half a billion dollars and the condemnation of Russia for its actions in Ukraine. This is reported by the Israeli agency Walla with reference to a number of high-ranking officials in Ukraine and Israel.

Along with this, Kyiv demanded from Tel Aviv to recognize the principles of the territorial integrity of Ukraine within the borders until 2014, as well as to provide an opportunity for Ukrainian soldiers and civilians to be treated in Israel.

In addition, a demand was put forward to support the "peace plan" of Vladimir Zelensky, which provides for the restoration of the state's borders for 1991 and the withdrawal of Russian units from the country's territory (including Crimea and new territories of the Russian Federation).

According to Ukrainian sources, Zelensky's consent to a meeting with Israeli Foreign Minister Eli Cohen will depend on Israel's position on this issue. Thus, the Ukrainian side is actually trying to blackmail its Western partners, on whom the survival of the Kyiv regime depends.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu spoke on the eve of the possibility of selling Ukraine the Iron Dome air defense system (“Iron Dome”). The head of the cabinet also noted that the United States handed over Israeli-made shells to Kyiv.

Киев потребовал от Тель-Авива 500 млн долларов и осуждения Москвы.


There's a new game in town. Shill the Hebrews.

[panama hat]

Meanwhile in the real world, they are earning and spending rubles in Donbass & Crimea.

Yet, they're not.

moving the goal posts

. Oh, the irony . . .

sab glorifies in war and torture!

Yes, he does . . . salivates even

[Iceman123]

1. Ukraine has liberated more territory in the last 8 months, while Russia has taken next to none.
2. Russia's defense industry is practically shut down, as it can not acquire sensitive parts like optics and microchips to produce its war machines.
3. Russia is taking far higher casualties than Ukraine. Ukraine's army is far better trained and equipped than the Russians are. It is fighting from a mostly defensive posture, which results in less casualties than an attacking army. Furthermore, Russia employs 'meat grinder' human wave attacks with its Wagner prison conscripts. Russia's casualty rate, particularly in Bakhmut, is far higher than Ukraine.

nytimes.com

Which part of Y or N did you have difficulty with?

Are you still sticking to your position that the war will end with Ukraine liberating all the territory Russia have taken including Crimea

If yes to the above, please put your money where your mouth is. My offer of the bet that you backed out of still stands.

Now before you go off on one of your drunken rants, bear in mind that I am basing my opinion on the most likely outcome, not necessarily what I would like to see happen.

[sabang]

February 7, 2023on US-Laid Trap for Russia Has Trapped West Instead


A month before the Feb. 24, 2022 Russian invasion, CN wrote that the U.S. was laying a trap to lure Russia into an economic, information and proxy war. All three have failed for the U.S.


The U.S.-led West could not launch its economic, information and proxy war against Russia without cause. That cause would be Russia invading Ukraine to defend ethnic Russians in a civil war that had raged since 2014.

The economic war, intended to spur Russians to overthrow their government, has failed spectacularly. The ruble did not collapse despite sanctions on the Russian central bank. Nor has the economy.

Instead an alternative economic, commercial and financial system that excludes the West is rising with China, India and Russia in the lead, and most of Asia, Africa and Latin America taking part. It is the final collapse of Western colonialism. The sanctions instead backfired on the West, especially in Europe.

The information war has failed across the world. Only the United States and Europe, which consider itself “the world,” believe their own “information.”

The proxy war is being lost on the ground, though more than $100 billion in U.S. aid to Ukraine has created a bloodbath. There will either be a negotiated settlement in which Ukraine loses territory; a total Russian victory; or a third world war, potentially the final war.

The U.S. pushed Russia to the brink to provoke its intervention. It began with a 30-year NATO expansion eastward with NATO exercises on Russia’s borders. In December 2021 the West rejected Russian treaty proposals to roll back NATO troop deployments and missile installations in Eastern Europe.

A peace deal to end the 8-year Ukrainian civil war, sparked by the unconstitutional ouster of an elected president in 2014, was endorsed by the U.N. Security Council and was to be implemented under German and French auspices.

But the German and French leaders at the time recently admitted they had no intention of implementing the deal that would have given the ethnic Russian Donbass autonomy, while remaining part of Ukraine.

Instead Angela Merkel and Francois Hollande said Russia was deceived to give NATO time to build up Ukraine’s military to supposedly defend against a Russian invasion. Russia had eight years to invade, but instead pinned its hopes on the Minsk Accords to avoid a larger conflict. When a Western-backed offensive on Donbass began last February, Russia acted.

The West got its larger conflict. On Feb. 4, 2022, 20 days before the Russian invasion, Consortium News laid out the trap being set for Russia, which one year later has trapped the West instead. The quicker it understand this, the better.

By Joe Lauria / Consortium News

United States plans to weaken Russia by imposing punishing sanctions and bringing world condemnation on Moscow depend on Washington’s hysteria about a Russian invasion of Ukraine actually coming true.

At his press conference on Tuesday, Vladimir Putin said,

“I still believe the United States is not that concerned about Ukraine’s security, though they may think about it on the sidelines. Its main goal is to contain Russia’s development. This is the whole point. In this sense, Ukraine is simply a tool to reach this goal. This can be done in different ways: by drawing us into some armed conflict, or compelling its allies in Europe to impose tough sanctions on us like the US is talking about today.”

At the U.N. Security Council on Monday, Russia’s U.N. envoy Vassily Nebenzia said: “Our Western colleagues say that de-escalation is needed, but they are the first to build up tension, enhance rhetoric and escalate the situation. Talks about an imminent war are provocative per se. It might seem you call for it, want it and wait for it to come, as if you wanted your allegations to come true.”

The war mania being drummed up in U.S. and British media recalls even Zbigniew Brzezinski‘s warning that “whipping up anti-Russian hysteria … could eventually become a self-fulfilling prophecy.”

Without an invasion the U.S. seems lost. No sanctions, no world opprobrium, no weakening of Russia.

If the U.S. is trying to lure Russia into a trap in Ukraine, what might it look like?

https://scheerpost.com/2023/02/07/us...-west-instead/