The U.K and the E.U - In or out?

Folks, the dices have already been rolled.

There will be "NO BREXIT" !

Mark my words for it.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

the £ will devalue sharply and reach parity with the $, inflation will be imported, the economy will shrink accordingly and the process of re-aligning our tariffs with new markets will be a long drawn out affair blighting the next ten years,

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Join the € EURO € and stop whining. You can't have your cake and eat it

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

Scotland will secede and N.Ireland will become even more of a desperate backwater rotting in isolation,

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There is no colonialism in the EU.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

wine will become expensive again

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Now that's what I call an arguement. :rolleyes:
What about beer for the dumb folks

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

and we'll pay more for our cars and probably everything else we fucking import given the £ will be worth diddlysquat.

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Join the @ € or start singing "The Queen" song. On your mark...get set...go...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8_K9O52DrM

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Originally Posted by Bower

Having visited family on the council estate I come from, they are voting out, out, out, almost to a man. All fuelled by anger. Doctors appointment takes 7-10 days, hospital appointment 6-10 weeks knee operation 18-36 months. 35+ kids in a classroom and many cannot speak English so holds the whole class back. Daily and hourly rates on building sites dropping through over supply of labour.
It's also pointless trying to explain many of these problems are caused by our own government, they have been ridiculed and insulted by 'remainders' too much. It's become a them and us so reason goes out the window.

I am voting out because the EU is broken, undemocratic and corruptly exploits anywhere it can, part of the reason for mass economic migrants.

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To attribute these alleged woes to membership of the EU is just so imbecilic but somewhat typical of the average Brexiter who is of course usually a fucking moron.

Surprising article from The Guardian :) https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ur-party-loser

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Originally Posted by taxexile

i'm not so sure britains future will be as dire as you suggest should brexit occur.

the eu cannot afford to lose the uk, that is a fact, and brexit would quickly fire up the nascent exit movements in other countries, which is the last thing they want.

a scared merkel and her cronies would very soon be, and i'm sure it has already been discussed, offering the uk some form of placatory and very beneficial "associate membership" rather than cast us adrift mercilessly.

the germans, belgians, dutch, austrians and even the execrable french have said in the past that the demands britain have made over the past few years are perfectly valid demands and that the eu cannot just go on undemocratically usurping power from nation states.

i suspect a brexit might be just what the eu needs in order to curb its excesses of power and bring about the necessary changes that benefit all of europe, and the uk could well end up with the sort of membership terms it has always wanted and is justified in demanding.


time will tell of course, and at the moment i am sitting on the fence but with both feet on the brexit side, whereas a week ago my feet were on the remain side.

i think we should call their bluff, for they need us more than we need them.

any recession, currency collapse or outbreak of bubonic plague would be but a temporary blip and whatever happens it could not be worse than a labour government led by corbyn or macdonald.

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You misunderstand but being an obdurate Yorkshire tyke this is quite normal.
One either has free movement and the right to services in each member state or one does not and if that occurs then the thing is broken.

The British people are largely incapable of comprehending their insignificance to the rest of the world. Britain exports to the EU 60% of its manufacturing contribution to annual GDP. The Germans and French have already stated that upon full Brexit, as demanded by the fuckwits of Britain, they will fuck the UK.Tariffs will be imposed on British goods but given the British dependence on imports the financial controls will not be reciprocated however the devaluation of the £, concomitant to a full Brexit, will mean those imports will all be that much more expensive.

The juxtaposed controls in Coquelles etc will be abandoned and all the economic migrants demanding to enter the UK will flood in - the French will simply state it is not their problem anymore and quite right too - the French have already stated this.

Just about every economic pundit of any worth, and all the money markets from the US to fucking Japan, have illustrated the £ will fall by 30 % - the merest fucking hint that a Brexit might occur lost us 12% alone - and shall remain at that level for the foreseeable.


It is universally understood that Scotland will gain its independence in the event of a Brexit.

The UK will cease to be and its currency will be permanently devalued. Your "blip" is no more than wishful thinking.

Only a fucking moron would vote to quit the largest trading bloc in the world with all its protections and values.

As I said, Brexit is for fuckwits.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

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Originally Posted by Bower

Having visited family on the council estate I come from, they are voting out, out, out, almost to a man. All fuelled by anger. Doctors appointment takes 7-10 days, hospital appointment 6-10 weeks knee operation 18-36 months. 35+ kids in a classroom and many cannot speak English so holds the whole class back. Daily and hourly rates on building sites dropping through over supply of labour.
It's also pointless trying to explain many of these problems are caused by our own government, they have been ridiculed and insulted by 'remainders' too much. It's become a them and us so reason goes out the window.

I am voting out because the EU is broken, undemocratic and corruptly exploits anywhere it can, part of the reason for mass economic migrants.

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To attribute these alleged woes to membership of the EU is just so imbecilic but somewhat typical of the average Brexiter who is of course usually a fucking moron.

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That is what i said but without adding another insult.............

Bower,I tend to scan read and when I see daft statements such as " the EU is broken " I assume the worst and conclude that what is written is merely silly propaganda.

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Originally Posted by piwanoi

Surprising article from The Guardian :) https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ur-party-loser

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A very good article, agree with it or not. It spells out what is wrong and partly downright evil with the EU. One can still see it as the lesser evil.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

You misunderstand but being an obdurate Yorkshire tyke this is quite normal.
One either has free movement and the right to services in each member state or one does not and if that occurs then the thing is broken.

The British people are largely incapable of comprehending their insignificance to the rest of the world. Britain exports to the EU 60% of its manufacturing contribution to annual GDP. The Germans and French have already stated that upon full Brexit, as demanded by the fuckwits of Britain, they will fuck the UK.Tariffs will be imposed on British goods but given the British dependence on imports the financial controls will not be reciprocated however the devaluation of the £, concomitant to a full Brexit, will mean those imports will all be that much more expensive.

The juxtaposed controls in Coquelles etc will be abandoned and all the economic migrants demanding to enter the UK will flood in - the French will simply state it is not their problem anymore and quite right too - the French have already stated this.

Just about every economic pundit of any worth, and all the money markets from the US to fucking Japan, have illustrated the £ will fall by 30 % - the merest fucking hint that a Brexit might occur lost us 12% alone - and shall remain at that level for the foreseeable.


It is universally understood that Scotland will gain its independence in the event of a Brexit.

The UK will cease to be and its currency will be permanently devalued. Your "blip" is no more than wishful thinking.

Only a fucking moron would vote to quit the largest trading bloc in the world with all its protections and values.

As I said, Brexit is for fuckwits.

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Assuming all that to be correct it will be interesting to see how the Brexiters then manage to turn it all around into blaming Johnny Foreigner.

I remember this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j-Gb8Pk2Pk

Peter Shore EEC speech, he was not so wrong.

Poor old Shore, never quite grasped the awful truth that it took membership of the EU to finally comprehend what a useless, screwed up economy we were under a sclerotic management cadre hamstrung by subversive unions exploiting an unproductive and lumpen proletariat.

Watching the likes of the Brexiters now is akin to a resurrection of the old dinosaurs.

I almost wish brexit wins, just to see what happens. Would that be counted as mean?

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Originally Posted by Takeovers

I almost wish brexit wins, just to see what happens. Would that be counted as mean?

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Not at all, a change is as good as a rest:)

Bookmakers have Remain as clear winners now because of that Jo Cox murder..

The endless propaganda from both sides is reaching it's crescendo, i predict 54% Remain and 46% Leave, without the murder it would have been the other way round.

Australians sending in postal votes for the upcoming UK referendum on European Union membership could have considerable influence on the result, writes Julian Lorkin.
Fresh from Australia's success at Eurovision - when contestant Dami Im came in second - many Australian residents are about to cast a much more important vote on Europe and its future.
Anyone with a British passport who lives Down Under is eligible to participate in the UK's referendum on exiting the EU if they have registered to vote in the past 15 years.
With 1.2 million British nationals in Australia, and 250,000 in New Zealand, both the stay and leave camps are in full campaign mode half a world away from the UK. Southern hemisphere votes have the potential to swing the knife-edge referendum.
Posters supporting both sides have sprouted in areas popular with UK residents. In some locations, such as Perth, up to 15% of the population was born in England.
The referendum vote is optional. As a result there has been a strong campaign just urging voters to post their ballot slips back from Australia.
"Expat conversations swirl around it," says the Guardian's cartoonist David Squires. He is a household name in Britain, even though he migrated to Australia several years ago. "I'm just overloaded trying to work out the issues and the timing is woeful - the vote comes right after Eurovision, just before the Australian general election - and with all the noise of the US election too."
He feels that it's odd to have a postal vote when he has essentially left the UK behind. "I really shouldn't have a vote. I'm an ex-pat who has migrated - almost the opposite as to what the vote is about. It's great for comedy though."
Some expats have been incorrectly told they need to pay to return their postal vote, which uses the free International Business Reply Service (IBRS).
Post offices have asked for up to A$68 (£32) to courier votes. The UK's Electoral Commission told the BBC in a statement it was working closely with postal operators to correct misunderstandings.
A pounding for the pound?
Expats are also closely watching the sterling and the Australian dollar, among the world's most-traded and most-volatile currency pairs. The value of the pound has recently veered between A$1.50 and A$3. At its last meeting the Reserve Bank of Australia deferred changing interest rates ahead of the Brexit vote, calling it a "near-term risk" with considerable implications for the Australian dollar.
"Sterling could take a pounding with a Brexit," confirms Australian business commentator Ross Greenwood. He has spoken to many business leaders in the UK about the impact of a Brexit.

"Mind you, the pound dropping would make the UK's exports more competitive, giving a boon to UK tourism. Aussies would queue at Kingsford Smith [Sydney's airport] keen to get a cheap trip back," he says.
"Hundreds of Australian companies are champing at the bit to get access to Britain. They want a UK Free Trade Agreement on much better terms than Europe.
"Many farmers have been enviously eyeing up their traditional British market for Australian milk, beef and wool. It would build an economic relationship that used to be the cornerstone of the Australian and British partnership."
'Considerable influence'
However, he thinks Australian banks would be very cautious. "Australia's NAB had an ill-fated adventure into UK regional banking, losing millions on Clydesdale and Yorkshire Bank. Once bitten, they'd fight shy of jumping in feet-first again."
Although the UK might eye-up Australia, he says, "Down Under is linked now to Korea, Japan and the US. But make no mistake; a newly independent UK would be welcomed with open arms by trade delegations from Canberra."
However, Annmarie Elijah, from the ANU Centre for European Studies, urges caution. "The UK and Australia cannot dig the UK-Australia Trade Agreement [UKATA] out of the bottom drawer, dust it off and carry on."
Creating a new trade agreement would take time. "There is no reason to think that Australia would be top of the UK's prospective trade partners."
Far more British expats live Down Under than elsewhere in the world. Only Spain, with 760,000, and the United States at 600,000 come close. As such they will wield considerable influence over whether the UK stays in the EU.
And Ross Greenwood, whose parents are from the UK, says one other thing might change with a Brexit - the EU passport queues. "It might also heal the small hurt that Aussies of British parentage feel, when they have to queue in the non-UK, non-EU passport line at Heathrow."

https://teakdoor.com/images/imported/2016/06/1366.jpg
1.2 million British nationals live in Australia and many are eligible to vote in the UK referendum on EU membership


Could Australia swing the UK?s EU vote? - BBC News

Err, just why would we buy Australian milk, wool, and meat?

This article is just so fucking illiterate, economically, it could only have emanated from the BBC.

The fucking ocker dollar is so far down the fucking toilet, it doesn't matter if sterling devalues. The cost of a holiday in Blighty would still make them walk with a fucking limp, never mind the fact that inflation will see prices increase further.

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

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Originally Posted by Bower

Having visited family on the council estate I come from, they are voting out, out, out, almost to a man. All fuelled by anger. Doctors appointment takes 7-10 days, hospital appointment 6-10 weeks knee operation 18-36 months. 35+ kids in a classroom and many cannot speak English so holds the whole class back. Daily and hourly rates on building sites dropping through over supply of labour.
It's also pointless trying to explain many of these problems are caused by our own government, they have been ridiculed and insulted by 'remainders' too much. It's become a them and us so reason goes out the window.

I am voting out because the EU is broken, undemocratic and corruptly exploits anywhere it can, part of the reason for mass economic migrants.

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To attribute these alleged woes to membership of the EU is just so imbecilic but somewhat typical of the average Brexiter who is of course usually a fucking moron.

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So basically Any one who does not agree with your point of view is a fucking Imbecilic Moron eh ?:)

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Originally Posted by Chittychangchang

has shown the politicians up for what they truly are, liars and self serving.

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never been clearer.

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Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

, the dices have already been rolled.

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Dice herman,, Die 1 .

^^Clearly.

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Originally Posted by piwanoi

Any one who does not agree with your point of view is a fucking Imbecilic Moron eh

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Agree Piwanio too much of this online.

It's meant to hurt,,, stand-up for for your rights, :tantrum: :)

DrGob,, piwanio can't spell X.

Brutal. :)

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

^^Clearly.

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Nice to see that you believe in true democracy, like freedom of choice and free speech :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Seekingasylum

^Clearly.

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no clearer. would have to change sentence for clearly.

If it's any consolation..

Bookmakers are unconcerned with politics. They simply try to make a round book. That's to say, the odds are calculated so that they don't lose either way.

All the current odds tell us is that the most money has been placed on Bremain. That's all it tells us. It doesn't necessarily follow that most betting people are supporting Bremain... millions of the average voter's small punts would be matched by a handful of thumping bets from The City.

In the polling booth, all votes are of equal weight.

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Originally Posted by Takeovers

I almost wish brexit wins, just to see what happens. Would that be counted as mean?

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No, when Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales then decide they want nothing more to do with us, England will be a hotch-potch of poverty stricken shire counties where the filthy rich reside in stately mansions and right-wing morons such as the BNP and Liberty GB will roam the streets. Perhaps it might then dawn on the f**wits who voted out just how stupid they are although this won't happen overnight of course.

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Originally Posted by Ronin

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Originally Posted by Takeovers

I almost wish brexit wins, just to see what happens. Would that be counted as mean?

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No, when Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales then decide they want nothing more to do with us, England will be a hotch-potch of poverty stricken shire counties where the filthy rich reside in stately mansions and right-wing morons such as the BNP and Liberty GB will roam the streets. Perhaps it might then dawn on the f**wits who voted out just how stupid they are although this won't happen overnight of course.

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Scotland already voted on having nothing to do with us and lost .

seeking asylum

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obdurate Yorkshire tyke.
fucking toilet
fucking illiterate
a fucking moron
fucking moron.

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you are clearly unwell.

is it hemorrhoids?

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Originally Posted by piwanoi

Scotland already voted on having nothing to do with us and lost .

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Use your common sense (oop sorry I forgot you haven't got any). Scotland has said they will want another referendum if Britain votes out - do try reading, understanding and comprehending the news. :rolleyes:

For me, it's pretty simple: as governance moves further away and becomes more opaque, people feel disenfranchised (because they are), corruption massively increases (the centralized monies ever increasing with procedures so distant and complex that a Federal Europe is a corrupt politician's wet dream) and governance itself becomes worse (the distance between the individual citizen and governance decision mechanism is huge) or indeed secondary (politiking at the federal level will increasingly dominate and push real needs and governance off the agenda).

This central identity and being part of Europe is fine at a personal and national level when it means respecting others and working together. It is also fine at a trading level when it benefits both parties by removing red tape and overly bureaurcratic mechanisms (of course, we have seen the opposite happening...). But, it is not fine when it means rewriting European boundaries of nation states and political ownership by the electorate in said nation states. For example, whatever the rights and wrongs of Greece, we have seen that the nation state was unable to forward their political agenda and the citizens voice was crushed by banking and political institutions outside of that nation state - this is wrong. It empowers bankers and institutions, and as we saw in that case private sector debt was socialized while private sector profits remained corporatized - totally corrupt, the banks get richer, the politicians that enable the corruption get richer and the individuals have their pension money taken away and lose jobs and get poorer.

Local governance, citizen engagement, highly visible checks and balances are always preferable to distant governance, a disinfranchized citizenship and complex/opaque regulations/laws, that is unless you're a corrupt politician, a faceless institution or a corporate lobbyist.

We will not be allowed Brexit, and we will be totally fuked from here on in. &, yes, it is the fukin Fourth Reich...

https://teakdoor.com/images/imported/2016/06/1380.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJdhwOobeQM

^Nice rant Betty but you overlook the fact that most problems occur from within our own country.

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Originally Posted by Ronin

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Originally Posted by piwanoi

Scotland already voted on having nothing to do with us and lost .

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Use your common sense (oop sorry I forgot you haven't got any). Scotland has said they will want another referendum if Britain votes out - do try reading, understanding and comprehending the news. :rolleyes:

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Why not be truthful (for a change) and just say it slipped your mind that they had already had a referendum instead of making insipid excuses:rofl:

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Originally Posted by Ronin

^Nice rant Betty but you overlook the fact that most problems occur from within our own country.

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That is a separate issue, Sir and in no way mitigates my points.

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

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Originally Posted by Ronin

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Originally Posted by piwanoi

Scotland already voted on having nothing to do with us and lost .

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Use your common sense (oop sorry I forgot you haven't got any). Scotland has said they will want another referendum if Britain votes out - do try reading, understanding and comprehending the news. :rolleyes:

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May have escaped your attention Ronin, but as of the last Scottish Parliament elections, the SNP no longer have an overall majority in their Parliament. Ironically, the Conservatives are now the second most rèpresented party. By inference, a call for a further Scottish referendum wouldn't even leave Edinburgh.

From what I'm reading about Wales, the majority are in favour of leave, at least in the highly populated south.

Northern ireland is still a predominately Unionist country, and whilst the Brexit scenario presents the most tangible impact of border restrictions, the reality is that the prospect of their population majority wishing to break from the UK is pretty much inconceivable.

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Originally Posted by Neo

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

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And perhaps learn a little more about "fullfact.org" here:


Enza Ferreri: UK Fact-Checker "Full Fact" Is not Impartial

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Originally Posted by PAG

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Originally Posted by Neo

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

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And perhaps learn a little more about "fullfact.org" here:


Enza Ferreri: UK Fact-Checker "Full Fact" Is not Impartial

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Enza Ferreri is a right-wing racist from Liberty GB

Can't remember to whom this quote is attributed, but "lies, damn lies, and statistics" has sprung to mind from both sides over the last few weeks/months.

Bottom line for me at least is whether the UK population wishes to retain their present situation re economics and immigration etc through Remain (with seemingly little to no chance of change in the future, or whether the majority will say 'bring it on, we'll do it our way'. Simplistic I know, but for many who see no hope of change or improvement to their and their families future, maybe the risk is worth taking.

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Originally Posted by lom

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Originally Posted by PAG

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Originally Posted by Neo

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

---

And perhaps learn a little more about "fullfact.org" here:


Enza Ferreri: UK Fact-Checker "Full Fact" Is not Impartial

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Enza Ferreri is a right-wing racist from Liberty GB

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Wouldn't expect anything less. Highlights my point about manipulation of reality to serve the agendas of both sides.

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Originally Posted by lom

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Originally Posted by PAG

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Originally Posted by Neo

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

---

And perhaps learn a little more about "fullfact.org" here:


Enza Ferreri: UK Fact-Checker "Full Fact" Is not Impartial

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Enza Ferreri is a right-wing racist from Liberty GB

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So PAG.. you don't actually check the site to test the veracity of the facts yourself, but instead find a right wing blogger that denounces it... totally in keeping with the self imposed ignorance preferred by the leave campaign.

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Originally Posted by PAG

Can't remember to whom this quote is attributed, but "lies, damn lies, and statistics" has sprung to mind from both sides over the last few weeks/months.

Bottom line for me at least is whether the UK population wishes to retain their present situation re economics and immigration etc through Remain (with seemingly little to no chance of change in the future, or whether the majority will say 'bring it on, we'll do it our way'. Simplistic I know, but for many who see no hope of change or improvement to their and their families future, maybe the risk is worth taking.

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Seems you don't want to know the truth... I don't see anyone on the Remain campaign using Nazi style propaganda to stir up sentiment.. in fact most of those that know full well that leaving the EU will be a disaster are also very much of the mind that they think politics in the UK are total bollocks anyway and the country is fucked by austerity, war and cuts to public services, not by immigration or contributions to the EU.

But why should I give a fuck..? I already voted with my feet. But it bothers me that the agenda in the UK is being driven by closet racists preying on the fears of the gullible.

Britain is fucked because the electorate has been sold down the river so many times before on promises of a brighter, more secure future and this time is no different. Britain out of the EU will be a financial and therefore social disaster.

Especially when the Scottish get enough leverage to fuck England off and get back into the EU.

https://teakdoor.com/images/smilies1/You_Rock_Emoticon.gif

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Originally Posted by Neo

If you want to know the facts on the issues surrounding Brexit then look at Full Fact.
Or if you want to be a sheep driven by racist, nationalist hatred and outright lies.. don't.

Up to you :chitown: https://fullfact.org/

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I went to fact check and it seems pretty decent, but I couldn't find the but where it says the leave campaign is driven by racist nationalistic lies, can you link to that? Or are you just sensationalising their findings?