Thread: Rubber trees 101

Seems Mr Happiness is gonna shore up prices? Us southerners will not hold our breath.

How does that look in terms of the case against st yang luck?

It obviously exposes the hypocritical sham that is the political and legal system here Troy, but that is hardly News.

But good to see Jim has got a boost, along with our other rubber farmers. Assuming of course, the pledge is not Thai, and corruption and middlemen do not cream off the proceeds.

^^ Apologies but I think I have a hazz or David manufactured mobile. It seems to write whatever it wants...ex PM it seems ok with the little MF.

The post was rhetorical...I can't be bothered with emoticons every time.

Have i got this right? Current approx price for a kg of sheet is 34 baht. The "subsidised temporary help" from this shambles of a govt is 45 baht. 150 kgs max per person/farmer. And you have to register. Difference twixt 45 and 34 is 11. 150x11=1650 baht. WTF is the point?

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Have i got this right? Current approx price for a kg of sheet is 34 baht. The "subsidised temporary help" from this shambles of a govt is 45 baht. 150 kgs max per person/farmer. And you have to register. Difference twixt 45 and 34 is 11. 150x11=1650 baht. WTF is the point?

Just another political face saving stunt, pretending the government cares.
Under the last government, they were allegedly subsidizing rubber, I never saw a Baht of it, nor anyone out my way.

How can they even set up buying stations, when this 1,500 per rai payment, we were getting in December, hasn't been paid.

If they can't organize payments to bank accounts, set up in the last handout, on lands already documented, how can they organize this.

A 150 kilos max, hows that going to work, I have 10 plus tappers {tappers families help out at times] do they all get 150 kilos.
Is it only for planters with good land title, if so few out here will see a Baht.

On a brighter note, last week wholesale auctions prices [rubberthai.com] rose 6 Baht a kilo for RSS, if it continues rising this week, markets may now be factoring the decreased output and possible large under supply due to El nino, fingers crossed.

Good heavy rains here last night, trees will be loving it.

Oil price crashes . . . rubber prices will suffer

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Have i got this right? Current approx price for a kg of sheet is 34 baht. The "subsidised temporary help" from this shambles of a govt is 45 baht. 150 kgs max per person/farmer. And you have to register. Difference twixt 45 and 34 is 11. 150x11=1650 baht. WTF is the point?

Yeah Guzzi Its an ill wind that blows no one any good , but maybe there is some light at the end of the tunnel and I do hope its true , Sabang says that this administration is now offering to pay all Thai rubber farmers 50% over the world price for their produce, although I must confess I cannot find any article to back up his claims , see his post 870

https://teakdoor.com/thailand-politic...pledge-35.html (Why people bitch about the rice pledge)

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Yeah Guzzi Its an ill wind that blows no one any good , but maybe there is some light at the end of the tunnel and I do hope its true , Sabang says that this administration is now offering to pay all Thai rubber farmers 50% over the world price for their produce, although I must confess I cannot find any article to back up his claims , see his post 870

Government can't really subsidize rubber, most of it goes for export, free trade agreements etc. would see tariffs imposed.
China got caught out with it''s tire exports, back door subsidies, US slapped 30% plus import tax on them.

As said, they can up prices tomorrow, kill the 5 Baht a kilo export tax, sure this suppose rubber stabilization tax, as it was called, earns a lot more then is going back into the industry.

Do the numbers, for a small operator, a 1,000 kilos a month say, that's 5,000 Baht loss.

Rubber up 5% on the Tokyo stock market...

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Rubber up 5% on the Tokyo stock market...

Lets hope the trend continues , although I am retired, I have 4 good friends who are in the Rubber trade , 2 of them have got every baht they have tied up in the farm /land etc , in fact talking to one last night he said if it does not get better he's off back to Germany in July as he has an offer of a very well paid job in his SIL company .

Cup prices in Udon province yesterday;
on the gate 14.8 baht per kg
auction 16.8 baht per kg.
So we decided to give the recently opened crepe factory just up the road a go;
19.5 baht per kg.
Met boss-man, we did a little experiment on the first load into the machine. 35 kgs of cup went in, 31.8 kgs of rolled sheet crepe came out the other end, a 9.1% loss in weight.
Prices - auction, 35kgs x 16.8 = 588 baht
crepe factory, 31.8 kgs x 19.5 = 620 baht.
So we bunged the whole lot through.
I'll try and put some pics up tomorrow.

Local rumour/gossip is that at the next auction, there will be no bidders, because the army are coming up as a one off and buying the lot... ?...!....

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Cup prices in Udon province yesterday;
on the gate 14.8 baht per kg
auction 16.8 baht per kg.
So we decided to give the recently opened crepe factory just up the road a go;
19.5 baht per kg.
Met boss-man, we did a little experiment on the first load into the machine. 35 kgs of cup went in, 31.8 kgs of rolled sheet crepe came out the other end, a 9.1% loss in weight.
Prices - auction, 35kgs x 16.8 = 588 baht
crepe factory, 31.8 kgs x 19.5 = 620 baht.
So we bunged the whole lot through.
I'll try and put some pics up tomorrow.

I've looked at this, can't make money producing RSS, but could making crepe, but can't find the buyers.

BAAC is happy to loan money for the machines, could buy as much wet cup as needed, no competition here, but no market to sell it.

Mike, any idea where these guys sell the crepe sheet.

Yes James, they sell to the two nearest factories that buy all the local cup, and most sheet.

Originally Posted by jamescollister

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Yeah Guzzi Its an ill wind that blows no one any good , but maybe there is some light at the end of the tunnel and I do hope its true , Sabang says that this administration is now offering to pay all Thai rubber farmers 50% over the world price for their produce, although I must confess I cannot find any article to back up his claims , see his post 870

Government can't really subsidize rubber, most of it goes for export, free trade agreements etc. would see tariffs imposed.
China got caught out with it''s tire exports, back door subsidies, US slapped 30% plus import tax on them.

As said, they can up prices tomorrow, kill the 5 Baht a kilo export tax, sure this suppose rubber stabilization tax, as it was called, earns a lot more then is going back into the industry.

Do the numbers, for a small operator, a 1,000 kilos a month say, that's 5,000 Baht loss.

2004 U.S. Crop Subsidies[22] Commodity Millions of US$ Share Feed grains, mostly corn 2,841 35.4% Upland cotton and ELS cotton 1,420 17.7% Wheat 1,173 14.6% Rice 1,130 14.1% Soybeans and products 610 7.6% Dairy 295 3.7% Peanuts 259 3.2% Sugar 61 0.8% Minor oilseeds 29 0.4% Tobacco 18 0.2% Wool and mohair 12 0.1% Vegetable oil products 11 0.1% Honey 3 0.0% Other crops 160 2.0% Total 8,022 100%
Going on for years:

http://farm.ewg.org/

Times have changed, free trade agreements and treaties everywhere, anti dumping laws etc.
If rubber was subsidized here, Thailand could produce cheap tires for export, under cutting China, US, EU and India.
Other rubber producing nations, ASEAN etc, would take sanctions, as they could not compete, sure Vietnam would love to subsidize it's rubber industry, pay out in Dong [which is worth nothing] sell in Dollars.

Never really looked at how it all works.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_subsidy


At the WTO's Tenth Ministerial Conference was held in Nairobi, Kenya from 15 to 19 December 2015, the WTO member states agreed to eliminate export subsidies for agricultural products; least-developed nations have until the end of 2018 to eliminate agricultural export subsidies (until 1 January 2017 in relation to cotton exports), while developed nations agreed to eliminate most such subsidies immediately. [2][3][4]

Where Thailand stands in all this, no idea, but it has agreements outside of the WTO and I would guess, under this, the rice pledging scheme, for exports, would be no longer allowed after 2017, or earlier under other agreement.

So what assistance rubber producers would be allowed, is an international thing, interesting, boring Sunday, may have a bit of a read up on it.

Had a few hours reading up on subsidies for rubber, you'd need a few years of international law studies to really understand all the ins and outs.

Anyway, from what I gleam, the Thai government can pay over the market price for rubber, if that rubber is for domestic use only, it can't be processed for other uses for export.

They can give income supplements, to poor farmers, similar to the west, were workers can get welfare to top up low incomes.

So I don' see any real government intervention, other then bike paths, road making, school play ground mats.

As to income supports for rubber farmers, not going to happen, pay one group, then every low paid farmer/worker will want an income top up.

Sure there are other options, tax breaks for tire companies to set up here, but think the BOI already covers that sort of stuff.

Looks like my rubber seasons coming to an end, biggest plantation, 2 more taps, then downing tools.
Normally we would keep going to the end of the month, but it's been windy here, drying the rubber out, so not much latex flow, plus low prices.

Lost one family of tappers last week, but got a new lot for next season already, going to be a long dry period in more ways then one, have had to knock the beer intake on the head, to save money.

Now it's sit back and wait for the new leaves to turn dark green and hope for better prices next season.

Time to turn Thai, again, eat and sleep, at least it's cool, sleeping is easy.

Interesting how it pans out today. Sold at auction yesterday, 2 buyers. One was a winning bidder @ 17.5 baht per kg, the other, was the military buying 150 kgs per farmer (we got 6 sacks in - approx 300kgs - 2 seperate pieces of paperwork) @ ... wait for it... 41 baht per kg (for cup!!) less DRC content.
More to follow tomorrow....

Okay fellow rubber farmers:
Do you ever wonder that perhaps we have got it all a bit wrong? Following established ‘THAI’ tradition?
Early days on our farm we used to follow the rules of 2 on and 1 off cutting...now we cut as long as it is not raining with the odd day off to attend dead people parties and weddings...Leaf down still cut.
Early days I used to brush cut among young trees and inadvertently chopped down several young trees at ground level...Came back tall thick and strong.
We cut back many plants e.g. roses and they come back stronger and healthier.
Canadians tap maples in mid winter...No leafs.
Dunno just my musings….


Last sale at gate two days ago 15bt/kilo cup

Originally Posted by thaiguzzi

Interesting how it pans out today. Sold at auction yesterday, 2 buyers. One was a winning bidder @ 17.5 baht per kg, the other, was the military buying 150 kgs per farmer (we got 6 sacks in - approx 300kgs - 2 seperate pieces of paperwork) @ ... wait for it... 41 baht per kg (for cup!!) less DRC content.
More to follow tomorrow....

Piss up.
Brewery.
Organise.
Cannot.
Shambles.
etc etc...
Complete waste of time yesterday with the military clerks and officials sitting behind their desks with computers, laptops and ... a poor internet connection... ya don't say... in the middle of the boondocks. As with most people who'd had enough by early afternoon, removed our 6 sacks and put them in with the normal winning bidders. And got the 17.30 baht per kg price.
two crepe factories locally were offering 18 and 20 baht per kg, which is where we are going in a fortnight.
One more 2 week tapping session...
And no, when the trees tell us to stop tapping, we stop. Patently obvious from one week to the next with output.