Thread: Mystery Phi Phi Deaths; Survivor Speaks, Finally

Originally Posted by dirtydog

I got to admit, I am taking a liking to the theory that Muslim terrorists are testing their new chemical weapons on tourists, wonder if Spielberg has some spare time for a new movie.....

don't take the piss.

how would YOU like it if you were to become the next victim of a suicide poisoner?!

..........sitting down eating a meal in a decent restaurant and some camel-jockey walks in and tries to kill everybody by swallowing a cyanide tablet!

Phi Phi, for walkers and wheelbarrows, keeps its secret about mystery deaths
Photo by phuketwan.com/file

Phi Phi Deaths Riddle: That Last Hour at Laleena

By Alan Morison
Saturday, January 23, 2010
THE MOTHER of tourist Julie Bergheim spoke to her daughter as she lay dying from a mysterious malady on Phi Phi, say reports in the Norwegian media.

Unexplained deaths echo especially loudly in a nation that values the lives of its citizens, and today Norway cannot forget the tragic holiday deaths of Bergheim, 22, and another traveller, American Jill St Onge, 27.

A burst of coverage has followed the closure of the Norwegian investigation into the mystery, and now comes a public rebuke from Bergheim's travelling companion, Karina Refseth, 21,

Refseth remained silent until the Norwegian investigators admitted that, halfway around the world from Thailand, their best forensic scientists were unable to unravel the mystery through a second autopsy and tests.

''I am very disappointed with both Norwegian and Thai police,'' Ms Refseth, who almost died herself from the same malady, told VG Nett, the largest circulation newspaper in the country.

She added that she feared Thai police were more concerned about the reputation of Thailand's tourist industry than to apportion responsibility for the tragedy.

''I am sure that we were exposed to a kind of gas,'' she is quoted as saying, ''and I think Julie died of this gas. I certainly do not feel that the police down there have taken this seriously.''

For the first time, the final awful moments the two women spent together, both close to death, have been revealed in detail.

Unknown to them, another tourist pair, Julie St Onge and her finance Ryan Kells, had been enduring similar agony in the room next door at Laleen Guesthouse.

The two couples probably never spoke or even nodded, yet they went through the same hell, and the two survivors have had to bear the same lack of explanation.

Ms Refseth says they Norwegian friends were out that night in May until 2am on Phi Phi, a highly social backpacker destination about an hour by ferry from Phuket. There are no cars, only walking tracks.

''It was the third night and when we got home that evening, I noted a strange smell in the room, but we thought nothing more of it,''she said.

Explaining that the two were on their way home after studying hotel management for 18 months in Australia, where they became friends, Ms Refseth said: ''Julie was an adventurous and bubbly person.

''We had a couple of weeks in Thailand before we moved in at Laleena Guesthouse on May 1 last year,'' she told the newspaper.

''We stayed first in a place without air conditioning, but by chance we found this guesthouse.

''It was so hot that we decided to move in there, the price was quite low, although it had air conditioning,'' said Ms Refseth.

''The third night when we got home that evening I felt a kind of strange smell in the room, but we thought nothing more of it, "she says.

During the hours that followed, the two became so sick that they were unable to move from their beds.

''We just kept throwing up,'' Ms Refesth said. They knew nothing about the tragedy that had already struck the couple in the next room.

Ryan Kells, 31, who also fell sick but had spent less time in the room, was able to have his seriously ill companion pushed to the local island hospital on a wheelbarrow of the kind used to cart baggage and goods around the island.

Nobody thought to alert the other guests in the 10 rooms of the guesthouse to the drama, or the apparent potential danger.

The Laleena maid, who preferred not to be named, has described to Phuketwan how she found Refseth and Bergeim in their room at 9pm, naked and clearly dying.

''We had not paid for the rooms, so they came looking for us,'' Ms Refseth said. ''I can remember that we told them we needed a doctor.''

She remembers very little of the last hours in the room, but she does know that her friend spoke with her mother at home in Drammen.

''Then she grew so bad that she could not bear to talk,'' Ms Refseth said.

Having been found close to death, the two Norwegian girls were feried in wheelbarrows to the small Phi Phi hospital.

''I cannot recollect the Phi Phi hospital, I was out of it,'' Ms Refseth said. ''During the night they took us by boat to a larger hospital in Phuket.

''I saw that the light was extinguished in Julie's room. They told me that she was sleeping, and I believed them.

''At first I refused to move, I was so sick that I was not prepared to sit for an hour in the boat, but eventually I gave up, " Ms Refseth said.

''I had asked for Julie several times, but they said she was sleeping. I was angry because nobody told me anything.

''First, the next day, after I had come to Phuket, I learned that Julie had died. It was Mom who called and said that, " Ms Refseth said.

Eight months on, she finds difficulty in talking about Phi Phi.

''No one knew what had happened. First, it was speculated that someone had put something in our drinks. It was suggested that it had to do with food poisoning.

''But we had nothing to do with the American pair. It was just nonsense,'' Ms Refseth said.

The latest of several articles in the Norwegian media this week is accompanied by a photograph of a woman, in deep snow and with more snowflakes falling, kneeling down beside a grave with a black marble headstone.

The grave belongs to Julie Michelle Bergheim, and the woman in her mother, Ina Thoresen, 52. She places candles or flowers there every day.

''On that Sunday I had a strange feeling that something was wrong, so I called Julie on Phi Phi,'' Ms Thoresen told the Norwegian media.

'''She said that both she and Karina were so bad that they could not bear to leave. I asked her to contact a doctor, but she said only that she was not able to talk more.

''Then she had to hang up,'' Ms Thoresen said.

Laleena Riddle: The Room Maid's Account

Phi Phi Mystery Deaths: The Room Maid's Account
Phi Phi Photo Album Thai guesthouse maids have a way of knowing what goes on and the maid at the Laleena on Phi Phi was close to two mysterious deaths. This is her account.
Phi Phi Mystery Deaths: The Room Maid's Account

The American couple ate some burgers and both got sick, with vomiting, and the woman turned blue on her way to the hospital just before she died. The Norwegian women ate some ‘rice, pasta and spaghetti’ and both also got sick, with vomiting, and one died. It is irritating that we don’t even know the name of the restaurant or restaurants where they got their food. Was it only one restaurant, or did the victims eat in two separate restaurants? You would think the survivors-- Ryan Kells and Karina Refseth, 21 (we finally learn her name! it’s about time!)—could take a moment to recollect exactly where they got their food so we can at least know if it was from only one restaurant. If only one restaurant, then that would certainly point in the direction of poisoning. If from two different restaurants, then you would have to keep open to the idea of exposure to poison from the guesthouse itself.

Freon or another refrigerant—or insecticides--could have caused vomiting, turning blue--turning blue called ‘cyanosis’ not to be confused with cyanide poisoning—and death. So could carbon monoxide if there were a motor, generator, cooking stove etc burning outside their adjoining rooms. It would be very helpful if Ryan or Karina could tell us 1) what restaurant did they eat at and 2) did they hear or see a motor, cement mixer or propane stove outside their rooms.

The police can neither deny or confirm whether the three ate at the same restaurant, but confirms that both the American couple and the Norwegians lived in the same hotel. “The only thing I currently know is that the two Norwegian girls ate at the restaurant on the island, and that the American woman also did”, said the police investigator. https://teakdoor.com/thailand-and-asi...h-phi-phi.html (Deaths on Koh Phi Phi)

WTF does this mean? First the cops neither confirms or denies they ate at the same restaurant. Then he says they did.

But you have to suspect deliberate poisoning just because myself and other posters feel they were deliberately poisoned in Thailand and there are plenty of other stories of tourists falling ill with vomiting but no diarrhea, (which lack of diarrhea probably rules out bacterial food poisoning); also, the Thais use poison for homicides and suicides and cyanide, among others, is readily available in Thailand. And I realize the Norwegians ate ‘rice, pasta and sphaghetti’ and since many noodles and probably breads (hamburger buns) in Thailand are not from wheat but from cassava, those foods could have had cassava-cyanide in them. But I say ‘forget that’, since many others must have eaten those same noodles and burgers and they didn’t get sick.

“PHI PHI / OSLO (Manager): The local police on the Phi Phi Islands to the Manager says that cyanide was found in the deceased Julie Michelle Bergheim (22) during the initial investigation of the girl in Phuket.

“To our great surprise, it was found cyanide in her stomach. Surprise was so great that she was sent to a new autopsy in Bangkok”, said Police Chief Nopadon Klom Thong on Phi Phi Islands to the Manager.” https://teakdoor.com/thailand-and-asi...h-phi-phi.html (Deaths on Koh Phi Phi)

Note: "According to a Seattle newspaper Thai authorities will not allow Jill St. Orge’s family bring her body home for an independent autopsy, and instead are planning to cremate her body." (see above url)

Still, the fact is that the only people to get sick and die this way that day were staying in adjoining rooms so that throws a monkey wrench into quicky blaming it on ingested poison. We need Ryan and Karina—survivors from each room--to come forward and explain in greater detail exactly where they ate and did they see or hear motors, cooking stoves, etc near their windows.

"From the symptoms and rapid death I think accidental pesticide poisoning, from bottles of water refilled by the guest house from a contaminated source, likely a refillable 5 gallon container." MustavaMond at url above.

This is a good theory, too, especially considering how I have witnessed many Thais using old pesticide bottles for human and animal applications. But I still wonder why others staying at the guest house weren't sickened.


And many if not most fumigants (for insect, rodent, etc control) seem to cause cyanosis (turning blue) as well as pulmonary edema both of which symptoms both victims had. Cyanide poisoning also causes cyanosis and pulmonary edema and cyanide also--but I suppose not always--causes seizures. Did the victims have seizures? (See url below: "Physician's Guide to Pesticide Poisoning")
http://www.getipm.com/thebestcontrol...ection-III.htm

Originally Posted by guyinthailand

Freon or another refrigerant—or insecticides--could have caused vomiting, turning blue--turning blue called ‘cyanosis’ not to be confused with cyanide poisoning—and death. So could carbon monoxide if there were a motor, generator, cooking stove etc burning outside their adjoining rooms. It would be very helpful if Ryan or Karina could tell us 1) what restaurant did they eat at and 2) did they hear or see a motor, cement mixer or propane stove outside their rooms.

. “The only thing I currently know is that the two Norwegian girls ate at the restaurant on the island, and that the American woman also did”, said the police investigator. https://teakdoor.com/thailand-and-asi...h-phi-phi.html

.

GIT,
I wish you fix your text size, or font - it is difficult to read.

That reference to the cyanosis, and other snippets you are posting was, I suspect lifted discussed at length on Thai Visa, (I participated in it as user CFIT, until I was banned for calling out Phuket Gazette as a property market rag.)

You might add this info, just in the name of attributing.....


Let me add something totally OT and I know I will bring in the dogs.. But I find the statement attributed to Thai police fascinating, or perhaps it actually was translated this way , interesting usage of the terms girl and woman.

The Norwegian " girls"- The American, " Woman". St Onge

What differentiates the females that mandates use of these terms.
Nationallity, sexiness, age?
St Onge isn't as attractive, all three are in their 20's , did she appear older ?