Thread: Thaksin: Let's put unity before justice

^^I would like to be wrong about the victims and their families signing their rights away, and the reports I read from what I remember referred to these people giving up their court cases etc. Fundamentally thats why I am asking you to point em towards the articles that gave you the impression that they had not, If you want me to take you word for it, fair enough.

At the heart of the issue is the question you asked earlier 'where in thailand do you do for the truth', well at the end of the day you have to use the tools that are available, and in thailand its the same as anywhere else.

You can sit back and wait for the government to give you as much truth as it wants

You could use the official information act

You can use the courts, probably the best place to ask questions, as at the very least you are putting those who want to lie in a compromising position which for people high up in the patronage networks is not much of an issue, unless someone in another network decided it will. But use the often courts you must demonstrate a loss for which you require financial compensation in order to start the case. you cannot do this if you have accepted a full and final compensation payment.

You can argue with justification that these organisation are compromised, the OFA is administered by the Office of the Primeminister and well the courts.... But even if they are and you loose your cases, you have forced these people to come out into the open, lie and deceive; which is hard to do without damaging their political and social reputation.

Originally Posted by Butterfly

let's be honest here, it's a bribe for their silence, not compensation

the fact that they accept this is all you need to know about the recipients and their cause for Democracy,

everyone in the red camp is being bought out like a SHIN CORP mega deal,

As they have dangled the shiny ball of the ICC in front of the grass-root reds as some kind of viable alternative to achieving justice, its becoming more and more obvious that the UDD is an active participant in the duping process.

If they are sincere or serious in any way of pursuing this avenue, the they should be pressuring the PT governement now, perhaps as a condition for suppoting amnesty, or later to ratify Thailand's signing up to the ICC. If they dont then they are full of shit.

Originally Posted by hazz

Fundamentally thats why I am asking you to point em towards the articles that gave you the impression that they had not,

First batch of political violence victims compensated

Originally Posted by hazz

as at the very least you are putting those who want to lie in a compromising position which for people high up in the patronage networks is not much of an issue

Originally Posted by hazz

you have forced these people to come out into the open, lie and deceive; which is hard to do without damaging their political and social reputation.

You're going to have to decide which it is, because having it both ways might be possible in a thoroughly Thai cultural frame, but it really doesn't carry much weight elsewhere.

I think that the best liars and most successful cheaters will always float to the top of the various bowls in the Thai system, whether they are bureaucrat-floaters, military-floaters, aristocratic-floaters or political-floaters. Thailand's upper reaches are flush with floaters, and gravity runs upwards.

Originally Posted by Calgary

Riots?.....What riots? You mean the reaction of anti-coup political demonstrators to being attacked by heavily armed, Government pro-coupists?

Riots, like the burning down of Central World and many other properties in the Rajprasong and adjacent areas. Hell they were setting fires all over Bangkok.

I now must put you on ignore. I just can no longer stand the style in which you write. No anger just a wish to distance myself from this fanatical red shirt stuff being spouted by a western person, who it seems is close to be brain washed.

Over and out.

Originally Posted by aging one

Riots, like the burning down of Central World and many other properties in the Rajprasong and adjacent areas. Hell they were setting fires all over Bangkok.

The perps. of property damage and who they were, is open to debate.

What is not open to debate are murders and the perps.

To segue into a conversation about property damage, thereby avoiding the discussion of a murderous attack, is a little bit like changing the conversation about the armed onslaught by coupists, to discussing the feeble defence efforts of the demonstrators.

Those diversionary tactics are obvious to all non-PADites.

Originally Posted by aging one

Originally Posted by Calgary

Riots?.....What riots? You mean the reaction of anti-coup political demonstrators to being attacked by heavily armed, Government pro-coupists?

Riots, like the burning down of Central World and many other properties in the Rajprasong and adjacent areas. Hell they were setting fires all over Bangkok.

I now must put you on ignore. I just can no longer stand the style in which you write. No anger just a wish to distance myself from this fanatical red shirt stuff being spouted by a western person, who it seems is close to be brain washed.

Over and out.

He's no red shirt. He us a plant or troll of some kind. He says exactly the kind if stuff we would expect a 'the nation' stereotype of a red shirt would say. The genius is that he makes himself out to be an foreign red shirt 'educated' by them, thus damning them

Originally Posted by Calgary

holding a different view of reality.

Originally Posted by Thaihome

Originally Posted by Calgary

...Once a political comfort zone has been adopted, it is uncomfortable having its' basic tenets challenged.

It is therefore no wonder that such views are interdicted, suppressed and excluded.

...

Most likely the best description of Calgary so far. Ironic that it came from himself.

TH

Cute TH.

You know very well where UDD/Red Shirt perspectives are interdicted, suppressed and excluded, plus 'Inconvenient Posts eliminated".

I welcome your views for debate. You and your friends fearfully do not.

Devious misrepresentations don't become you TH, but it is consistent for your kind.

Originally Posted by Calgary

I welcome your views for debate. You and your friends fearfully do not.

Spouting rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery over and over again interspersed with ad hominem attacks accusing anyone that disagrees with you or puts forth a different perspective is not engaging in debating.

What you engage in is polemics. Your only interest is in establishing the supremacy of a your single point of view. You are not least bit interested in any facts that do not support that view.
TH

Originally Posted by Thaihome

Originally Posted by Calgary

I welcome your views for debate. You and your friends fearfully do not.

Spouting rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery over and over again interspersed with ad hominem attacks accusing anyone that disagrees with you or puts forth a different perspective is not engaging in debating.

What you engage in is polemics. Your only interest is in establishing the supremacy of a your single point of view. You are not least bit interested in any facts that do not support that view.
TH

Yeah, I can't argue with that as LB would say.

To PADites, pro-UDD/Red Shirt perspectives are "rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery"

Only an Amart frame of reference and mindset are worthy of consideration for you, as espoused in your compliant media and forcefully projected elsewhere to the exclusion of anything else.

But TH, you and your people do not have the 'market cornered' on political awareness.

No amount of trying to shout down from the inconsequential political sidelines, those whom you consider lesser political beings who electorally put you there, will change that.

Originally Posted by Butterfly

^

what a little coward turd you make, always an excuse to explain in the worst logic a fucked up situation by this government or the reds,

typical mentality of an ignorant TEFLer,

Well at least Calgary is a little more respectful than this remark.

Flutterby to the depths of Hell Butterfly as the Rev Spooner might have said.

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

I might not have spoken clearly that day. The signal was very bad and was cut off

oh boy, typical Thai Chinese MO when caught red handed (no pun)

Thaksin says sorry for 'anger' remarks | Bangkok Post: news

Thaksin, who has lived in self-imposed exile for four years, is worried the red shirts may misunderstand the message he gave to them during their gathering to mark the second anniversary of the military crackdown at Ratchaprasong intersection on May 19, 2010.

>Thaksin not worried Red Shirts may misunderstand.....simply pointing out the Amart attempts to forge a wedge between them.

>Military crackdown?...........Carefully avoiding any reference to a political context. Using two methods, namely:

#1...Not mentioning the reality of the demonstration being against their coup,

#2......not wanting to give the protesters a political connection and framework

>Military?............Not really. Doesn't tell the whole story. It was merely the armed extension of coupists, aided by the PAD friends.

"My brothers, today it's time for us to return to resume political roles and help drive the country forward," he said.

They can do that, while the UDD/Red Shirts pursue the R'song murderers.

The RS are OK with that.

Everyone fullfil their own political niche against the coupists.

"Thaksin then fled the country to live in self-exile abroad to avoid the prison term."

Giving some more "self-serving historical context to the events of this article".

With zero reference to the "mother-of-all' causes being their coup, puts these comments into the catagory of 'historical revisionism"

Originally Posted by Calgary

"Thaksin then fled the country to live in self-exile abroad to avoid the prison term."

Giving some more "self-serving historical context to the events of this article".

With zero reference to the "mother-of-all' causes being their coup, puts these comments into the catagory of 'historical revisionism"

The historical revision is all yours.

The coup happened while he was in New York.

He only fled in 2008. 2 years after the coup. You may recall he came back to Thailand for a while.

Try reading. It helps.

Thaksin Shinawatra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Originally Posted by Calgary

"Thaksin then fled the country to live in self-exile abroad to avoid the prison term."

Giving some more "self-serving historical context to the events of this article".

With zero reference to the "mother-of-all' causes being their coup, puts these comments into the catagory of 'historical revisionism"

The historical revision is all yours.

The coup happened while he was in New York.

He only fled in 2008. 2 years after the coup. You may recall he came back to Thailand for a while.

Try reading. It helps.

Thaksin Shinawatra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Amart media's scrupulous avoidance of giving a coup-context to political actions since 2006, is historical revisionism...period.

This is the same deviousness they exercise, when trying to always change the conversation away from their murderous rampage at R'song, to focus on the taxpayers feeble attempts at fightback.

The same deviousness when they try to portray Abhi's mafia offer during their TV conversations............. Particularly laughable when they try to characterize it as "negotiation".

Originally Posted by Calgary

pro-UDD/Red Shirt perspectives are "rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery"

no - your views are

"rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery"

any intelligent pro-democracy person would find you downright embarrassing

Originally Posted by baldrick

Originally Posted by Calgary

pro-UDD/Red Shirt perspectives are "rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery"

no - your views are

"rhetoric, hyperbole, and demagoguery"

any intelligent pro-democracy person would find you downright embarrassing

Spoken like a true PADite believer.

One wouldn't expect anything else.

The messenger focus puts their paucity of alternative thinking on full display.

Originally Posted by Calgary

Spoken like a true PADite believer.

except I am not - which indicates to me that your perception of anything is not likely to be correct

Originally Posted by baldrick

except I am not

BS, you are

and just another PADite mushroom