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Thread: Womens' Issues

  1. #151
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    ^

    Had he posted the real report he would shown that the Supreme Court of mullahs initially rejected harsh punishment until the judge involved personally intervened because of her 'sharp tongue.' She was a rebellious girl who was foul mouthed, filthy, and promiscuous. She was personally hanged by the judge in her case and it is not typical punishment handed out for such a crime.

    I wonder how many times in the past children were executed in the United States.

    Edit: It looks like even the U.S. allowed execution of those under the age of consent until very recently with a recent Supreme Court decision barring the practice and overturning state laws (mostly, ironically, in the most Christian of states which allowed executions of children). So, hardly one to throw stones if we live in a glass house.

    Dalton Prejean [black, Louisiana], sentenced to death in 1978 and executed in 1990. He was 17 years old at the time of the murder of a police officer in 1977. Prejean was tried before an all-white jury and represented by a court-appointed lawyer. At his trial, evidence was presented of intellectual impairment. His IQ was measured at 71. He was abandoned by his mother at the age of two weeks and was raised by a relative who was reportedly violent. From the age of 13 he spent time in institutions and was diagnosed as suffering from various mental illnesses including schizophrenia. At age 14 he was committed to an institution for killing a taxi driver. Medical opinion recommended long-term hospitalization under strict supervision. He was nevertheless released after three years, reportedly because of lack of funds to keep him institutionalised. Despite appeals for clemency in 1989 and 1990 he was electrocuted on 18 May 1990, 12 years after being sentenced to death.

    Johnny Garrett [white, Texas], executed in 1992. He was convicted of the murder in 1981of a 76-year-old white nun. He had a long history of mental illness and was severely sexually and physically abused as a child. This history was not revealed at the trial. Between 1986 and 1992, three medical experts reported that he was chronically psychotic and brain-damaged as a result of head injuries sustained as a child. Appeals for clemency from Pope John Paul II and from the Franciscan Sisters religious community to which the murdered nun belonged were to no avail and Johnny Garrett was executed by lethal injection on 11 February 1992.

    Curtis Harris [black, Texas], executed in 1993. He was 17 years old at the time of the crime - the murder of a white man in 1978. He was one of nine children brought up in extreme poverty. He was regularly beaten as a child by an alcoholic father. At the trial, three black jurors were excluded; his jury was all white. He was sentenced to death in 1979. His conviction was overturned, he was retried and sentenced to death again in 1983. In 1986 he was examined by Dr Dorothy Otnow Lewis, Professor of Psychiatry at the New York University School of Medicine, who found that he had a low IQ (77) and had organic brain damage resulting from beatings suffered as a child. None of the information about his upbringing or mental capacity was raised by his lawyer at the original trial. His appeals against the sentence failed and he was executed on 1 July 1993.

    Frederick Lashley [black, Missouri], executed in 1993. He was the first child offender to be executed in Missouri for 60 years when he was subjected to lethal injection on 28 July 1993. He was convicted and sentenced to death by an all-white jury in 1982 for the murder of his cousin in 1981. He was under the influence of drugs at the time of the killing. He had been abandoned at a young age by his mother and had been brought up by relatives. He began drinking alcohol heavily at the age of 10 and at the time of the crime was homeless. At his trial he was represented by a lawyer who had never previously acted in a capital case.

    Christopher Burger [white, Georgia], executed in 1993. He was the first child offender to be executed in Georgia under its current death penalty law. He was 17 at the time of the murder, committed in 1977, for which he was convicted. He was sentenced to death in 1978. The sentence was vacated but a new sentencing hearing was held and in 1979 he was again sentenced to death. Fourteen years later he was executed by electrocution.

    At his trial he was represented by a lawyer who had not previously acted in a capital case. Although US juries are required to consider mitigating factors in deciding whether to impose a death sentence, Christopher Burger's lawyer did not present mitigating evidence at the sentencing hearings in either 1978 or 1979. The jury was therefore not told that Christopher Burger had a low IQ, that he was mentally ill and brain damaged from physical abuse received as a child, or that he suffered from a highly disturbed, unstable upbringing and had attempted suicide at the age of 15.

    In 1989, Dr Dorothy Otnow Lewis of the New York University School of Medicine examined Christopher Burger and found organic brain impairment and mental illness. He was scheduled to be executed on 18 December 1990 but received a last-minute stay of execution pending an appeal based on the issue of his mental competence at the time of the crime. The appeal failed and he was executed on 7 December 1993.

    Ruben Cantu [Latino, Texas], sentenced to death in 1984 and executed in 1993. He was 17 at the time of the offence. He was represented by an inexperienced lawyer, had a troubled family upbringing and was of limited intellectual capacity.

    Joseph John Cannon [white, Texas], executed in 1998 for the murder of Anne Walsh in 1977. He was sentenced to death in 1980. The conviction was overturned in 1981. He was retried and sentenced to death again in 1982. At the age of four, Joseph Cannon was hit by a truck and left hyperactive, with a head injury and a speech impediment. Unable to function in the classroom, he was expelled from school at the age of six or seven and received no other formal education. He turned to glue sniffing and other solvent abuse, and at age 10 he was diagnosed as suffering from organic brain damage. Suffering from severe depression, he attempted suicide at the age of 15. He was diagnosed as schizophrenic and borderline mentally retarded. From the age of seven up to the time of the murder for which he was sentenced to death, Joseph Cannon suffered repeated and severe sexual abuse from male relatives. So brutal and abusive was his upbringing that Joseph Cannon thrived better on death row, where he learned to read and write, than he ever had in his home environment. By the time he was killed, Joseph Cannon had spent more than half his life on death row.

    Robert Anthony Carter [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1982 for the murder of Sylvia Reyes in 1981 and executed in 1998. One of six children in one of the poorest families of an impoverished Houston neighbourhood, Robert Carter was abused throughout his childhood. His mother and stepfather would whip and beat the children with wooden switches, belts and electric cords. At the age of five he was hit on the head with a brick. At the age of 10 he was hit so hard on the head with a baseball bat that the bat broke. He received no medical attention for these injuries. In an incident shortly before the murder of Sylvia Reyes, Robert Carter was shot in the head by his brother, the bullet lodging near his temple. He afterwards suffered seizures and fainting spells.

    At his trial, the prosecution took one day to present its entire case. At the sentencing, during which the prosecutor told the jury that life imprisonment would be like a "slap on the wrist", the jury was not invited to consider as mitigating evidence Robert Carter’s age at the time of the crime; the fact that he was borderline mentally retarded, brain damaged and had suffered brutal physical abuse as a child; or that this was his first offence. The jurors took 10 minutes to decide that he should die.

    Dwayne Allen Wright [black, Virginia], sentenced to death in 1991 for the murder of Saba Tekle in 1989 and executed in 1998. Dwayne Wright grew up in a poor family in a deprived neighbourhood of the US capital, Washington DC, rife with criminal drugs activity, where he witnessed habitual gun violence and murder. From the age of four, Dwayne Wright lost his father to incarceration in prison. His mother, who suffered from mental illness, was often unemployed for long periods. When he was 10, his 23-year-old half-brother, to whom he was very close, was murdered. After this Dwayne Wright developed serious emotional problems. He did poorly at school. Between the ages of 12 and 17, he spent periods in hospital and juvenile detention facilities. During this time he was treated for "major depression with psychotic episodes"; his mental capacity was evaluated as borderline retarded, his verbal ability as retarded; and doctors found signs of organic brain damage.

    The American Bar Association was among the organizations which appealed for clemency for Dwayne Wright, stating that his proposed execution "demeans our system of justice" and that "a borderline mentally retarded child simply cannot be held to the same degree of culpability and accountability for the actions to which we would hold an adult."

    Sean Sellers [white, Oklahoma], sentenced to death in 1981 for shooting his mother and stepfather and a shopkeeper and executed in 1999. He was the first person since 1959 to be executed in the USA for a crime committed at 16 years of age. Born to a 16-year-old mother and raised by various relatives, he was exposed to violence and physical abuse from an early age and became involved with drugs and Satanism. In post-conviction examinations, he was found to be chronically psychotic and to have symptoms of paranoid schizophrenia and other major mood disorders. He was diagnosed with multiple personality disorder in 1992. On death row he became very religious and engaged in writing and artwork with a view to helping others learn from his experience. One of his trial jurors appealed for clemency, recalling that the jury never believed that he would be executed but that they feared his early release if they sentenced him to life imprisonment. The trial judge had refused to allow expert testimony that a sentence of life imprisonment would have meant at least 15 years in prison before he would become eligible for parole.

    Chris Thomas [white, Virginia], sentenced to death in 1991 and executed in 2000. After his adoptive parents died when he was 12, Chris Thomas became involved in petty offending and drug abuse. Psychological reports described him as an isolated, angry, depressed, alienated teenager. His intense relationship with 14-year-old Jessica Wiseman culminated in their plan to kill her parents. Without an adult present, while still under the effects of alcohol and drugs, and having slept for only two hours in the previous 40, Thomas confessed to both murders. He later said he had not fired the second fatal shot at the mother, whose killing resulted in Chris Thomas’ death sentence (he received a life sentence for the murder of the father). The jury never heard evidence that Jessica Wiseman may have fired this shot. She was released in 1997 at the age of 21.

    Steve Roach [white, Virginia], executed in 2000. He had been sentenced to death in 1995 for the 1993 shooting of Mary Ann Hughes, his only recorded act of violence. Born into a family with frequently absent parents, Roach dropped out of school at 14 because they wanted him to do chores. An expert testified at trial that Roach had poor impulse control and was particularly immature as a result of the lack of structure in his home life. Arguing that Roach was a future danger, the prosecution cited his parole violation in possessing a shotgun as a sign of his future dangerousness, despite the fact that no adult, including the police, had seen fit to remove it from him.

    Glen McGinnis [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1992 and executed in 2000. Glen McGinnis was born to a mother who was addicted to crack cocaine and who worked out of their one-bedroom flat as a prostitute. He suffered repeated physical abuse at her hands and those of his stepfather, who raped him when he was nine or 10. He ran away from home at the age of 11 and lived on the streets of Houston where he engaged in shoplifting and car theft. He was sentenced to death by an all-white jury for the shooting of Leta Ann Wilkerson, white, during a robbery in 1990. Various juvenile correctional officials testified that he was non-aggressive even in the face of taunts about his homosexuality from other inmates and that he had the capacity to flourish in the structured environment of prison.

    Gary Graham [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1981 and executed in 2000 amid massive national and international media attention. He was born to a mentally ill mother and an alcoholic father and was exposed to violence from an early age in the poor neighbourhood of Houston where he grew up. He became involved in drug and alcohol abuse and by the age of 15 had a juvenile record for thefts. In 1981, aged 17, he was under arrest for a string of armed robberies and aggravated assaults when he was charged with the murder of Bobby Lambert, white, the crime for which a jury of 11 whites and one black sentenced him to die. He was represented by lawyers too busy to defend a client they apparently assumed was guilty because of the other crimes to which he admitted. Their failure meant that Gary Graham was convicted on the testimony of a single eyewitness whose credibility they never scrutinized. Gary Graham’s lawyers failed to question suggestive police techniques used in obtaining her identification of Graham. They neglected to interview other, better-placed witnesses, none of whom identified him as the gunman and several of whom said he was not the gunman. No physical evidence linked Gary Graham to the shooting. The jury never heard forensic evidence that a gun found on him at the time of his arrest could not have fired the fatal bullet.

    No hearing was ever been held into whether Graham’s 19-year claim of innocence was supported by such evidence. Two of the trial jurors signed affidavits that they would not have voted for death if they had been presented with such evidence.

    Gerald Mitchell [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1986 and executed in 2001. Gerald Mitchell was on death row for 15 years after being convicted by an all-white jury for the murder of a white man, committed when he was 17 years old. Evidence presented at trial indicated that Mitchell had been assessed as having an IQ of 75 and had a long history of substance abuse.

    Napoleon Beazley [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1985 and executed in 2002. He was sentenced to death in 1995 for the murder of a white man in Tyler, Texas, committed when he was 17 years old. He had no prior arrest record and the state produced no evidence of any other assaultive acts by him. He was tried by an all-white jury. One of the jurors was later shown to harbour severe prejudice against African Americans. There was evidence that another was a long-term employee of one of the victim's business partners, which was not revealed during jury selection. Two co-defendants later said that their testimony at the trial, central to the prosecution's bid for a death sentence, had been false and was made under pressure from a prosecutor needing to cast the defendant in as bad a light as possible in front of the jury. The prosecutor repeatedly referred to Beazley as a predatory "animal" in front of the jury. Many witnesses testified at his trial about good aspects of his character and his potential for rehabilitation. He was a model prisoner.

    T.J. Jones [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1994 and executed in 2002 for the murder of a white man during a carjacking. Jones was assessed as having an IQ of 78, and to be particularly immature for his age at the time of the crime. According to an expert at the trial, his "grossly poor judgment" was compounded by alcohol and drug abuse which began at the age of 13.

    Toronto Patterson [black, Texas], sentenced to death in 1995 and executed in 2002. Toronto Patterson was sentenced to death for the killing of three-year-old Ollie Brown, whose body was found in her home in Dallas in June 1995 along with that of her sister and their mother. All three, who were cousins of Toronto Patterson, had been shot. After his arrest, the 17-year-old Toronto Patterson gave police a statement without a lawyer present, in which he admitted to being present at the scene of the crime but not to having committed the murders themselves. After being held incommunicado for over four hours, and subjected to aggressive interrogation, Toronto Patterson confessed to the shootings. He claimed at his 1995 trial that the confession had been coerced, and in his final statement before being executed in 2002, maintained his innocence of the murders.
    Last edited by man with no head; 29-08-2006 at 01:43 PM.

  2. #152
    Thailand Expat HermantheGerman's Avatar
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    ^^
    One must remember that it is only the Islamic countries, which amputate human limbs for trivial offenses, and hang people for the most innocent criticism of the Prophet.

  3. #153
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    In other news, people get punished worldwide for breaking the law. Story at 11.

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman View Post
    ^^
    One must remember that it is only the Islamic countries, which amputate human limbs for trivial offenses, and hang people for the most innocent criticism of the Prophet.
    Law of the state we call it. You get electric chair for first degree murder in some states. You'll be stonned to death or hanged in some countries. What difference does it make?

  5. #155
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    Big diff when you get stoned to death for just having sex, never mind all the other BS you mussies do to people for stealing or anything else. Go ahead and chop off his hand and a foot, then they'll be really able to find legal work.

  6. #156
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    I though it was time to bring this old letter out.....

    Dear Dr. Laura,
    Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s law. I have learned a great deal from you, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him the Bible clearly states it to be an abomination (Lev. 18:22) ..... End of debate !
    I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some specific laws and how to best follow them as a true believer.
    When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbours. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. How should I deal with this?
    I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as it suggests in the Bible (Exod. 21:7). In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
    I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.
    The Bible also states that I may buy slaves from the nations that are around us (Lev. 25:44). A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans but not Canadians. Can you clarify?
    I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. The Bible clearly states he should be put to death (Exod. 35:2). Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
    My friend practices the Wiccan religion. Since the Bible states that he must be put to death (Exodus 22:18), am I morally obligated to kill him as well?
    A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this?
    The Bible states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight (Lev. 21:21-23). I have to admit that I wear prescription glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
    I need to do some business on the island of Crete soon but the Bible states that people from the island of Crete are liars and lazy (Titus 1:12). Should I be careful when doing business there?
    I read Amnesty International protesting the selling of under-aged girls into slavery and prostitution. Should I write my congressmen and Request that we encourage these young girls to obey their masters as it states in the Bible (Eph. 6:5)?
    Should I have the foreskin of my penis cut off? The Bible commands that all men must do this (Exod. 12:48). I would have my doctor do it but I think I can save some money by doing it myself.
    Any ideas on how best to do it?
    At the church I attend, some women lead a Bible study. What is the best way to tell them to shut up. We must not have women speaking in church when the Bible forbids them to (1 Timothy 2:12).
    Many of the women in our church wear jewellery. Since women are forbidden to wear jewellery (1 Peter 3:3) what is the best way to tell them God is going to torture them in hell for eternity for doing so?
    I want to obey the Bible and greet all the women at our church with a kiss (2 Thess. 1:26). Why do I get strange looks from them when I do - especially from their husbands? What about French kissing?
    Recently, I have asked several women in my church to marry me since it is permissible for a man to have many wives (1 Kings 11:3). Why do I continually get rejected? People at church are beginning to talk.
    I suppose I will not get married since the Bible states that men should not marry (1 Cor. 7:1). What do you suggest?
    There are many unbelievers where I work and because we are forbidden to associate with them (1 Cor. 4:11). I am wondering how best to tell them to keep away from me.
    Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev 19:27. How should they die?
    I know from Lev 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
    My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev 24:10-16) Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
    I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident that you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is eternal and unchanging.
    Any error in tact, fact or spelling is purely due to transmissional errors...

  7. #157
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    whiteshiva, Reads like something raycarey the terrorist supporter would write. Unlike muslims, Christians have progressed in their thinking and do not take all things so litterally or should I say, they have advanced in their thinking to be cappable of living in the 21st century. To me, all religious followers are sheep, it's just that the muslims all seem to be blind and can't do anything without a mullah or whatever religious teacher to tell them right from wrong and just to keep them in line is to pass out the harshest penalties if you or any others do not follow islam.
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  8. #158
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    And it wasn't that long ago that Christians had the same mentality. Then came the industrial age, right? Wasn't that long ago, but, you act like it's been thousands of years.

    People around the world adapt and change at different rates. Just because I'm an expert in the computer field should I also expect every person alive to be one as well? Only an insane person would think that, but, we're supposed to expect everyone to be fully compatible with the 21st century (i.e. our ideas)?

    I would argue that industrialization and the ability to increase one's worth without having to feel like one has to go to church and confess one's sins every day likely did more to eradicate the backwards Christian mentality than simple evolution.

    Don't forget, many of the most ridiculous and backward laws still on the books or that were on the books in the States came from Christian beliefs. It's barely been a few years since we outlawed executions of teenagers here.

    Is it any coincidence that the leading industrial countries are also ones where religion is generally on the decline (with one exception) because the worship of God and spread of the Gospel has been replaced with worship of money and material objects?
    Last edited by man with no head; 30-08-2006 at 02:57 PM.

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliminator View Post
    Christians have progressed in their thinking and do not take all things so litterally or should I say, they have advanced in their thinking to be cappable of living in the 21st century.
    Funnily enough - the same goes for basically every Muslim I have ever met in my life as well, who I think are representable for the great majority of Muslims.

    Sure there are fanatics out there, but look at it this way - which religion has caused the most deaths in history - pick any year in the last 500-1000 years - my guess is the christians will come out on top.

    You make the occasional good point here, and I don't neccessarily disagree with them. However, if you tried to get the issues a bit in perspective and look at the big piture, I am sure these kind of debates would be a lot more interesting for all concerned.

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliminator
    Big diff when you get stoned to death for just having sex,
    Tell me something you know you are gonna get a ticket for driving fast,you know you are gonna get hanged or electrocuted for murder but still if you kill someone that means you are trying to be Mr.Smart ass.

    Now the people in Holland might find it disturbing that people are shot in the back of the head for selling or buying whead in China.suppose one dutch goes to China and smokes whead in the middle of the street despite the fact that he knows it is illegal.Now if he is shot who's fault is it??

    They know it is not allowed to have SEX in Muslim countries.Iran and Saudi stone you to death and some countries arrest you on charges of adultery and let you go after doin some time.Why do they do these things???

    Why is the west worried about Muslims being stoned in their own countries for commiting a crime????Isn't the west trying to impose their beliefs on Muslim countries??

    It's Okay to shag others and see your loved ones getting shagged without marriage but in Muslim countries it aint allowed.

  11. #161
    Thailand Expat HermantheGerman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteshiva View Post
    Dear Dr. Laura,
    Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s law. I have learned a great deal from you, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him the Bible clearly states it to be an abomination (Lev. 18:22) ..... End of debate !
    I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some specific laws and how to best follow them as a true believer.
    When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbours. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. How should I deal with this?
    I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as it suggests in the Bible (Exod. 21:7). In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
    I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.
    The Bible also states that I may buy slaves from the nations that are around us (Lev. 25:44). A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans but not Canadians. Can you clarify?
    I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. The Bible clearly states he should be put to death (Exod. 35:2). Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
    My friend practices the Wiccan religion. Since the Bible states that he must be put to death (Exodus 22:18), am I morally obligated to kill him as well?
    A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this?
    The Bible states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight (Lev. 21:21-23). I have to admit that I wear prescription glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
    I need to do some business on the island of Crete soon but the Bible states that people from the island of Crete are liars and lazy (Titus 1:12). Should I be careful when doing business there?
    I read Amnesty International protesting the selling of under-aged girls into slavery and prostitution. Should I write my congressmen and Request that we encourage these young girls to obey their masters as it states in the Bible (Eph. 6:5)?
    Should I have the foreskin of my penis cut off? The Bible commands that all men must do this (Exod. 12:48). I would have my doctor do it but I think I can save some money by doing it myself.
    Any ideas on how best to do it?
    At the church I attend, some women lead a Bible study. What is the best way to tell them to shut up. We must not have women speaking in church when the Bible forbids them to (1 Timothy 2:12).
    Many of the women in our church wear jewellery. Since women are forbidden to wear jewellery (1 Peter 3:3) what is the best way to tell them God is going to torture them in hell for eternity for doing so?
    I want to obey the Bible and greet all the women at our church with a kiss (2 Thess. 1:26). Why do I get strange looks from them when I do - especially from their husbands? What about French kissing?
    Recently, I have asked several women in my church to marry me since it is permissible for a man to have many wives (1 Kings 11:3). Why do I continually get rejected? People at church are beginning to talk.
    I suppose I will not get married since the Bible states that men should not marry (1 Cor. 7:1). What do you suggest?
    There are many unbelievers where I work and because we are forbidden to associate with them (1 Cor. 4:11). I am wondering how best to tell them to keep away from me.
    Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev 19:27. How should they die?
    I know from Lev 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
    My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev 24:10-16) Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
    I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident that you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is eternal and unchanging.

    Great Post! Realy! I died laughing! I even told some friends of mine about it.
    Imagine you post the same thing in a muslim country about the Koran!
    You are not going to die of laughter! You are going to DIE!!!!
    Do you maybe understand the difference now?
    Please tell me.....so I can rate your intelligents (brain).

  12. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman View Post
    Great Post! Realy! I died laughing! I even told some friends of mine about it.
    Imagine you post the same thing in a muslim country about the Koran!
    You are not going to die of laughter! You are going to DIE!!!!
    Do you maybe understand the difference now?
    Please tell me.....so I can rate your intelligents (brain).
    Tell you what - you read the Quran, comment intelligently on what is written there, PM it to me, and I will post it here. Is that good enough for you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerm
    Imagine you post the same thing in a muslim country about the Koran!
    You are not going to die of laughter! You are going to DIE!!!!
    There is a fine line between discussion and ridicule.If you have objections about the Quran you can ask any educated Muslim and believe me you wont be killed but if you go out and start saying that Quran is 2000 years old it should be in the museum then it just shows your nature.

    There are many non-Muslims like Hindu and Christian scholars who debate and discuss the Quran with Muslim scholars,they ask all types of questions and they are honestly and humbly answered.We dont see them dying.

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    but they damn sure aren't doing this in a muslim country.

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    They're well doing it in focking Muslim countries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliminator View Post
    but they damn sure aren't doing this in a muslim country.
    I have frequently discussed religious issues, including Islam and the Quran when I worked in Malaysia, Indonesia and Oman. Had many a good argument/discussion, but never any negative reactions.

    If you take a respectful approach, and actually know something about the issue, you would probably find most Muslims interested in talking about their religion. In that respect, they are no different from people of other faiths.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteshiva View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman View Post
    Great Post! Realy! I died laughing! I even told some friends of mine about it.
    Imagine you post the same thing in a muslim country about the Koran!
    You are not going to die of laughter! You are going to DIE!!!!
    Do you maybe understand the difference now?
    Please tell me.....so I can rate your intelligents (brain).
    Tell you what - you read the Quran, comment intelligently on what is written there, PM it to me, and I will post it here. Is that good enough for you?
    Maybe you can try the book the Satanic Verses
    Salman Rushdie - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    or this little song "It's In The Koran", by "Patrick Henry"
    Last edited by HermantheGerman; 05-09-2006 at 09:46 PM.

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    Seems like a suitable place to post this ...


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    There are no Women Rights in Islam!
    Here is another great example of how muslim men depress their women.

    Women's Rights Lawyer Quits, Says She Feels Threatened | Germany | Deutsche Welle | 04.09.2006

    This great woman has decided today 11.9.06 to continue her fight against forced marriage, headscarves, so-called honor killings, domestic violence and the subjugation of women in many Turkish and Kurdish families.

    I hope she can help many more women and does'nt get killed herself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman
    There are no Women Rights in Islam!
    There's a perception in the minds of many, like yourself Herman, that Islam teaches that women are second class citizens. People like yourself often point to the many backward customs prevalent in the Muslim world as proof that religion is to blame for this sorry and pathetic situation.

    The Prophet of Islam himself established the equal suffrage rights of women by including them in the oath taking practice, which was the equivalent of voting in Arab society. Islam has never taught that women should be denied a political voice. Islam doesn't teach that women are inferior in religion or in political rights.

    Now if you see Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia you'll find out that most people have no rights, men or women.

    Remember that the Islamic civilization was virtually wiped out during the era of colonialism and thus what is left is a confused and focked up jumble of customs, religious ideas, imported governmental structures.

    Islam doesn't encourage the oppression of women. Islamic laws, if you really know anything about them, contains thousands of laws for the protection of women's rights.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macha View Post
    They're well doing it in focking Muslim countries.
    Macha:

    What sort of questions do scholars and students ask in Muslim countries, and would it be ridicule to ask if it is true, for example, that right-living Muslims should expect in Heaven, a three hundred course banquet, followed by the granting of eternal youth and vitality, and then the presentation of a palace, eighty thousand infidel servants, and seventy-two houris whose beauty and pulchritude will endure forever, and whose virginity is renewable at pleasure?

    Is it a legitimate question, or should I be stoned for asking where I may view the tomb of Mohammed, which is miraculously suspended between Earth and Heaven? Is it really true that the Prophet saw the kneeling of Al Adha as a sign from God, thus allowing him, a camel, to enter the portals of heaven?

    Also, it is said that when Habib the Wise challenged Mohammed to validate his mission by cleaving the moon in two, the Prophet raised his hands toward heaven and commended the moon to attend his bidding. Accordingly, it descended to the top of the kaaba, made seven circuits, and coming to the prophet, rose into his right sleeve
    and emerged from the left. It then entered the collar of his robe, descended to the skirt and clove itself into two plaits, one of which appeared in the east of the skies and the other in the west. The two parts ultimately reunited.

    I could go on but no need to...sorry, but I have a problem with the above, as I do with miracles of Christianity, Judaism and all other religions that choose to believe in the absurd.

  22. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman
    There are no Women Rights in Islam!
    There's a perception in the minds of many, like yourself Herman, that Islam teaches that women are second class citizens. People like yourself often point to the many backward customs prevalent in the Muslim world as proof that religion is to blame for this sorry and pathetic situation.

    The Prophet of Islam himself established the equal suffrage rights of women by including them in the oath taking practice, which was the equivalent of voting in Arab society. Islam has never taught that women should be denied a political voice. Islam doesn't teach that women are inferior in religion or in political rights.

    Now if you see Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia you'll find out that most people have no rights, men or women.

    Remember that the Islamic civilization was virtually wiped out during the era of colonialism and thus what is left is a confused and focked up jumble of customs, religious ideas, imported governmental structures.

    Islam doesn't encourage the oppression of women. Islamic laws, if you really know anything about them, contains thousands of laws for the protection of women's rights.
    For example, a raped woman has to produce 4 male witnesses, otherwise, under the same legislation, she will be charged with adultery, and we all know the penalty for that, right? > nudge nudge <

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    Quote Originally Posted by keda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Macha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HermantheGerman
    There are no Women Rights in Islam!
    There's a perception in the minds of many, like yourself Herman, that Islam teaches that women are second class citizens. People like yourself often point to the many backward customs prevalent in the Muslim world as proof that religion is to blame for this sorry and pathetic situation.

    The Prophet of Islam himself established the equal suffrage rights of women by including them in the oath taking practice, which was the equivalent of voting in Arab society. Islam has never taught that women should be denied a political voice. Islam doesn't teach that women are inferior in religion or in political rights.

    Now if you see Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia you'll find out that most people have no rights, men or women.

    Remember that the Islamic civilization was virtually wiped out during the era of colonialism and thus what is left is a confused and focked up jumble of customs, religious ideas, imported governmental structures.

    Islam doesn't encourage the oppression of women. Islamic laws, if you really know anything about them, contains thousands of laws for the protection of women's rights.
    For example, a raped woman has to produce 4 male witnesses, otherwise, under the same legislation, she will be charged with adultery, and we all know the penalty for that, right? > nudge nudge <
    Absurd law it is. I'm with you on this one Keda.

    But let me remind you again that there are hundreds or perhaps thousands of sharia laws that protects women rights. I can produce them if the need may arise.

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    Macha:

    The absurdity is not that these laws exist, but that they are protected by those who wish to spread the word, so to speak.

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    Those people who are protecting them are the ones brought by General Zia Ul Haq. Gen. Zia was an American puppet. I think it would be very unfair if you start blaming the whole nation just cos of a puppet.

    As a Pakistani and a Muslim I want to see these absurd laws changed.

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