Thread: New iPhone - It's Wonderful!

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

"I assume there is no fix then. If this is legit, I have lost all respect for Apple and just want to go back to Verizon and get a nice Android phone. [...] I have bought just about every Apple product made in the last 20 years and this is the first time I am ashamed to be a Mac fan. This is just sickening."

This is what happens one time or another to all Macfan, they eventually realize they have been fucked, like I did before, and then they lose the Apple religious attitude and start to think by themselves or in objective terms. When that comes, they realize that macs are indeed inferior and all about marketing for marketing victim drones.

Originally Posted by Clogiron

I reiterate, this simple test was carried out using 3GS handsets which don't suffer same problem and not 4, but the update is for 3G / 3GS / 4 models

...and if the 3G/3GS were not similarly affected by the reception issue, how did you expect any changes on them?

The only thing apple can do on the firmware side of things is increase the power output of the transmission. However they still have to stay within legal limits but they can still do this with the the 2-4 bar signals by outputting on a power level as if they were 1 bar signals. Obviously this would chew through the battery and the effects would be negligible anyway if the antenna design is faulty.

Originally Posted by mc2

The only thing apple can do on the firmware side of things is increase the power output of the transmission. However they still have to stay within legal limits but they can still do this with the the 2-4 bar signals by outputting on a power level as if they were 1 bar signals. Obviously this would chew through the battery and the effects would be negligible anyway if the antenna design is faulty.

I wish you wouldn't keep bringing facts into this argument...

Originally Posted by DaffyDuck

Originally Posted by Clogiron View Post I reiterate, this simple test was carried out using 3GS handsets which don't suffer same problem and not 4, but the update is for 3G / 3GS / 4 models ...and if the 3G/3GS were not similarly affected by the reception issue, how did you expect any changes on them?

Are you a complete moron or is it just an act you have perfected for this forum?


a. Did you read what I wrote
b. Did you understand it

I suspect the answer is b since it is pretty obvious that you are lacking in knowledge to discuss this topic at even a basic technical level and can only repeat parrot fashion Apple press releases. No wonder Steve Jobs is laughing all the way to the bank with such a large market of uninformed consumers to target.

Originally Posted by mc2

The only thing apple can do on the firmware side of things is increase the power output of the transmission. However they still have to stay within legal limits but they can still do this with the the 2-4 bar signals by outputting on a power level as if they were 1 bar signals. Obviously this would chew through the battery and the effects would be negligible anyway if the antenna design is faulty.

No.
The bars indicates the received signal from the base station and increasing the phones transmit power will in no way make the receive signal stronger.
It will only increase the noise level for phones receiver and may also make the phone visible for a more distant cell base station.
If a current nearby cell base station is getting overloaded then you may be kicked over to the more distant one which will give you a lower received signal due to the distance.

Originally Posted by Clogiron

Originally Posted by DaffyDuck

Originally Posted by Clogiron View Post I reiterate, this simple test was carried out using 3GS handsets which don't suffer same problem and not 4, but the update is for 3G / 3GS / 4 models ...and if the 3G/3GS were not similarly affected by the reception issue, how did you expect any changes on them?

Are you a complete moron or is it just an act you have perfected for this forum?


a. Did you read what I wrote
b. Did you understand it

I suspect the answer is b since it is pretty obvious that you are lacking in knowledge to discuss this topic at even a basic technical level and can only repeat parrot fashion Apple press releases. No wonder Steve Jobs is laughing all the way to the bank with such a large market of uninformed consumers to target.

Daffy does seem to have problems reading all the way through things, I've pointed it out to him many times.

I don't know if it is actually a design flaw, or if it can be fixed with a software update.....

Originally Posted by lom

Originally Posted by mc2

The only thing apple can do on the firmware side of things is increase the power output of the transmission. However they still have to stay within legal limits but they can still do this with the the 2-4 bar signals by outputting on a power level as if they were 1 bar signals. Obviously this would chew through the battery and the effects would be negligible anyway if the antenna design is faulty.

No.
The bars indicates the received signal from the base station and increasing the phones transmit power will in no way make the receive signal stronger.
It will only increase the noise level for phones receiver and may also make the phone visible for a more distant cell base station.
If a current nearby cell base station is getting overloaded then you may be kicked over to the more distant one which will give you a lower received signal due to the distance.

It will make the received signal stronger because the base station receives a weak signal from the mobile unit and thinks that the mobile units reception is not good so increases its own transmission power accordingly. Also, the mobile unit sends out information on the control channel to the base station to tell the base station things like SNR and power level received, which the BS will take into account with its own transmission, in the case of a weak or noisy signal, power goes up.

Handoff is a different story...

Originally Posted by mc2

It will make the received signal stronger because the base station receives a weak signal from the mobile unit and thinks that the mobile units reception is not good so increases its own transmission power accordingly.

So pray tell me then what an increase in the phones output power will be seen as by the base station..

Originally Posted by lom

Originally Posted by mc2

It will make the received signal stronger because the base station receives a weak signal from the mobile unit and thinks that the mobile units reception is not good so increases its own transmission power accordingly.

So pray tell me then what an increase in the phones output power will be seen as by the base station..

that, plus the information on the reverse control channel, will be seen by the base station as weak reception for the mobile unit, and the BS will increase its transmission power for that particular channel.

A reviewer's take:

I upgraded my iPhone 4 to iOS 4.0.1 and, big surprise (not), it still can't make phone calls if I'm holding the thing in my left hand using the kung fu grip of doom (i.e. the normal way I hold a phone). And, unsurprisingly, my 3GS still can make phone calls with the same grip in the same location.

I ran the Strength App, which we've discussed in previous posts about the iPhone 4 antenna issue. It is now showing a more nuanced level of how bad my home reception really is, but the bottom line remains the same. If I put on the Bumper, the thing can just barely make calls. Without, it can't.

The iPhone 4 just isn't a very good phone in low signal areas, which unfortunately is where my home seems to be. The difference is that my old phone never had a problem with those same signal conditions and my new iPhone 4 is crippled.

I know that Apple intended its update to change expectations -- fewer bars indicating less reliability -- but my expectations are that I should be able to make and receive calls in an area where I have already been doing so for the last three years, with Apple-branded equipment.

Bet that won't last long if someone posts it on the Apple forums.

Originally Posted by mc2

Originally Posted by lom

Originally Posted by mc2

It will make the received signal stronger because the base station receives a weak signal from the mobile unit and thinks that the mobile units reception is not good so increases its own transmission power accordingly.

So pray tell me then what an increase in the phones output power will be seen as by the base station..

that, plus the information on the reverse control channel, will be seen by the base station as weak reception for the mobile unit, and the BS will increase its transmission power for that particular channel.

No, the base station will see the its strong reception as the phone being nearby and therefore only needing low transmit power from the cell.

You can never improve receive sensitivity on a receiver by increasing the power output of the transmitter on the same unit.
You can not increase connection distance or quality by only increasing power output without increasing receiver sensitivity.
Antenna improvement is the only way to increase receiver sensitivity and radiated power output at the same time, improving only one of them is worthless.

Originally Posted by lom

No, the base station will see the its strong reception as the phone being nearby and therefore only needing low transmit power from the cell.

my mistake, you are correct. i had them mixed up.
its the mobile unit that adjusts its power based on the level of power received from the BS + metrics on the control channel.

For a minute there I thought you were going to tell me the fix for the iPhone 4 is to amplify the signal from every base station. God, if Steve Jobs read that.....

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

For a minute there I thought you were going to tell me the fix for the iPhone 4 is to amplify the signal from every base station. God, if Steve Jobs read that.....

Well, they could falsify the report of the phones receive quality, the report going to the base station which as a first step would lead to the base station increasing its transmit output power.

Originally Posted by lom

If a current nearby cell base station is getting overloaded then you may be kicked over to the more distant one which will give you a lower received signal due to the distance.

Actually they wont be kicked off, they just block new connections and the newly registering mobile unit must connect to the next base station in the area with the next strongest signal.

Originally Posted by mc2

Originally Posted by lom

If a current nearby cell base station is getting overloaded then you may be kicked over to the more distant one which will give you a lower received signal due to the distance.

Actually they wont be kicked off, they just block new connections and the newly registering mobile unit must connect to the next base station in the area with the next strongest signal.

That is only half of the truth, if the newly registering mobile can only connect to one cell which is already full then this cell will send a list of possible hand overs to nearby cells and one of them will take over one or more of the full cells present connections.
This is dynamic allocation, load balancing of subscribers in order to get most connections out of a cluster of cells and it usually takes place without the subscriber noticing anything or very little of it.
You can sometimes though when you are stationary suddenly notice a drop in connection quality and that is because you have been handed over to a worse/more distant cell.

We are derailing this thread now so I will stop here with giving you two links, there are surely more of them to find if you want a better understanding of the system.

Handover - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

What is GSM

Ooooh the tension mounts.....



I think the bloke on the right is going "Hello? Hello? Are you there?"

^ I like the smell of mactard ownage in the morning,

CNBC have the best coverage, but Stevie doesn't want any cameras in the catching his fake tears live.....

“‘Antennagate’ — it doesn’t seem like a good idea if you touch your phone in a certain way and the bars go down. But one of the first things we learned: it’s certainly not unique to the iPhone.”

Bullllllllllshit!



Desperately trying to point the finger at all the other phone manufacturers, the idiot.

Here's the best live link:

http://live.gdgt.com/2010/07/16/live...age/#sort=desc