Thread: Why isn't the Thai government resigning ?

Originally Posted by Panda

You are confusing facts with your own personal opinions there Loy Toy.

Au contraire, you are making blank statements that have nothing to do with reality, LT is right on the money, maybe you were living overseas during that period and have no clue,

This is exactly how it happened,

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Panda

You are confusing facts with your own personal opinions there Loy Toy.

Au contraire, you are making blank statements that have nothing to do with reality, LT is right on the money, maybe you were living overseas during that period and have no clue,

This is exactly how it happened,

That's one thing I have always wondered about poster on these sites. How many have have lived here (on a continuous basis) since Thaksin came to power and have been able to follow things in detail on a daily basis, as opposed to other who might have come latterly or periodically. I am sure it could have some bearing on ones take on things.
Could make another poll?

^ not supporting this "illegal" government doesn't mean it is a direct support of the PAD ?

I would rather see Thaksin at the top than those guys, but the facts remain, he went too far and he got caught. He could have done it right but he chose to fuck it up. If he really had the interests of the Thai people at heart, he wouldn't have fucked up like he did, and do everything he could to change things, like he promised, and that includes stopping himself from his own temptations.

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

1. Fact>The ruling party achieved their position by way of vote buying and corruption.

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Fact 1 is incorrect.

DrBOb quite possibly you and I have 2 different souces of information.

Based upon discussions with Thai people from just about every walk of life in Thailand they unanamously agree that the last election was won with the use of bribes and vote rigging.

Yes I very rarely read newspapers or cut and paste internet news articles as I prefer to listen to the people on the streets and then make my own judgement.

At the same time I may be wrong (I have been in the past) but I believe what I posted is the truth.

What is going down at the moment is driving Thai society down and it is quite heartbreaking to see it happen.

Only wish that somebody clean would come along and take this country over for the good of the Thai people and us farang that want to contribute here.

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Fact 1 is incorrect.

Election 2001 and 2005, he did buy the vote. Last one in 2007 was more tricky, they did made promises of future payments, not sure if it was delivered.

^^up to you, it's a point I'm very tired of debating. I've produced masses of evidence on here that the last two elections weren't rigged or bought, nobody has provided any real evidence otherwise. Unfortunately gossip and innuendo and "what everyone knows" have always been more powerful than the truth. e.g you see any supporting evidence for butterfly's claim up there? Me neither. Me? I'm sick of the whole thing, farangs are just as stupid as Thais are just as stupid as most of the human race

Originally Posted by Butterfly

^ not supporting this "illegal" government doesn't mean it is a direct support of the PAD ? I would rather see Thaksin at the top than those guys, but the facts remain, he went too far and he got caught. He could have done it right but he chose to fuck it up. If he really had the interests of the Thai people at heart, he wouldn't have fucked up like he did, and do everything he could to change things, like he promised, and that includes stopping himself from his own temptations.

Exactly on the mark there butterfly.

I too would welcome Thaksin back (and for what it is worth) as long as he doesn't step across the line as he did before.

shouldn't this be in issues or mkp, both of which I have on ignore?

Originally Posted by DrB0b

I've produced masses of evidence on here that the last two elections weren't rigged or bought,

where ? link ? you are starting to sound like Boon Mee and Jet making all kind of unfounded claims, I will be curious to see those undeniable evidence

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Let me ask a question here. Why is it that with the reams of information published in Thailand and worldwide on recent Thai history and on Panthamit, with Panthamit being quite open about the fact that they want to return the country to a dictatorship and that they despise and want to disenfranchise the vast majority of the population, with Panthamit ranting and raving words of pure lunacy on TV 24 hours a day, with all the records, analyses, articles, and the words of Panthamit themselves, and the fact that their policies and tactics are being condemned world-wide do some farang people here support them?

Other than PaulSmithson, i haven't seen anybody on here in full support of PAD. Perhaps you are confusing being anti Thaksin with being a supporter of them?

Originally Posted by pickel

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Let me ask a question here. Why is it that with the reams of information published in Thailand and worldwide on recent Thai history and on Panthamit, with Panthamit being quite open about the fact that they want to return the country to a dictatorship and that they despise and want to disenfranchise the vast majority of the population, with Panthamit ranting and raving words of pure lunacy on TV 24 hours a day, with all the records, analyses, articles, and the words of Panthamit themselves, and the fact that their policies and tactics are being condemned world-wide do some farang people here support them?

Other than PaulSmithson, i haven't seen anybody on here in full support of PAD. Perhaps you are confusing being anti Thaksin with being a supporter of them?

No, let me put it more clearly, why do some people believe that Panthamit are what they say they are when there is so much evidence that what they actually are is a force for authoritarianism and disenfranchisement?

[quote=pickel;856678]

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Other than PaulSmithson, i haven't seen anybody on here in full support of PAD. Perhaps you are confusing being anti Thaksin with being a supporter of them?

It is interesting how the Thaksin obsessionists are now trying to distance themselves from PAD. Its not only happening here on TD, but in the Thai English media as well. Trying to back out of earlier positions and retain some face.

Originally Posted by Panda

I am not going to debate each one of them point for point with you.

of course, you won't

Originally Posted by Panda

A plain and simple misrepresentation of the truth.

Sweet Jesus !!!

Originally Posted by Panda

Just because you may actually believe what you claim doesn't make it a fact.

Strangely enough my opinions are based upon what some very influential and trusted Thai people have advised me with no particular gain for themselves (and by telling me).

Evidence is gained normally by the testimonials of witnesses and there are a lot of witnesses here that would confirm my posts as true.

Originally Posted by Loy Toy

Originally Posted by Panda

Just because you may actually believe what you claim doesn't make it a fact.

Strangely enough my opinions are based upon what some very influential and trusted Thai people have advised me with no particular gain for themselves (and by telling me).

Evidence is gained normally by the testimonials of witnesses and there are a lot of witnesses here that would confirm my posts as true.

"Testimonials of witnesses" !!?
Did they swear on the bible in a court of law or are you confusing it with hearsay and political gossip again.
Everyone has got a right to put their opinion up here. Just don't try to present your personal opinions as proven facts, --- especially with such a flimsy excuse its based on the "testimonials of witnesses" that don't exist.

^^Don't you know that the PAD are a front for "very influential and trusted Thai people"? Of course that kind of person would support them. Nor is evidence normally gained by testimonial of witnesses, the kind of evidence you're talking about is normally gained by cross-examining witnesses, very different from asking for a testimonial.

What do you think of PAD's plan to appoint 70% of parliamentarians and only allow certain groups to vote for the other 30%? What do you think about the fact that they persistently state that the majority of people in this country are too dumb and too greedy to vote? Do you support those stances?

Originally Posted by Panda

It is interesting how the Thaksin obsessionists are now trying to distance themselves from PAD. Its not only happening here on TD, but in the Thai English media as well. Trying to back out of earlier positions and retain some face.

Since that quote was from me, are you inferring that I obsess about Thaksin? Or that I've been close to the PAD?

How long have you been in Thailand Panda ? and do you remember clearly those times when it happened ? I have an idea you didn't really follow any of it when it happened, and you are getting your info from some unreliable source

Originally Posted by BKKBoet

How many have have lived here (on a continuous basis) since Thaksin came to power and have been able to follow things in detail on a daily basis,

Quite interesting you should bring this point up Boet.

Whilst considering the points of DrBOb and Panda I was thinking about one of the ploys all of us long term ex-pats use and around election times.

What we did, and during the week leading up to an election is, and when we had to travel on the Tollway is present a 1,000 Baht note and claim we had no change. More often then not the collection officer would tell me they had no small notes and would wave me on.

This very ploy was advised by one of my "very influential and trusted Thai people" as most other Thai's know the score and before an election and do the same.

All the small notes are collected and for the purpose of..........................!

Wow, what an argument.

Thaksin uses popularism as a sly tool to facilitate massive personal corruption, and the yellows want a few percent of the population to call all the shots to ensure that they stay wealthy. And there are no other alternatives

Until less selfish people find a way to rise in politics here, nothing will change, and that will take decades to happen.

Just remember that the democracy that has existed in many developed countries since the 19th century and before is still in its infancy here, and in its weak state is being manipulated. Unlike in the west, there are powerful people here who have lived in and enjoyed a dictatorship, and until they die off, not much will change. The same almost certainly happened elsewhere, all that time ago.

Originally Posted by Norton

Guess we will just have to accept the common wisdom of the Thais from all walks of life you have spoken with. I'm sure most of them are residents of the "corruptible" regions of Thailand and personally got the big payoff?

Unfortunately corruption here, and at every level of society is a way of life Norts.

Find me one person here that hasn't had to wrestle with it just to get the simplest thing done or has ever driven a car here.

I will never forget when Thaksin was interviewed about rampant corruption in the police force and his response was (well what do you expect as they get such a small salary). On National TV and from memory the police chief was really miffed.