Thread: 180baht to make an ATM withdraw

What you omit is the decryption effort required to clone the chip. Whilst it's simple enough if you can load a Windows program and follow instructions, it is a deterrent to those criminals that can and do simply swipe and duplicate the mag strip with the press of a button.

So I'll say it again: Smartcards are harder to clone.

Of course it also depends on how your bank has chosen to implement the technology.

However, I do agree that it is nowhere near as secure as it needs to be.

This made me laugh when I heard about it. They release technology before they do their homework.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=-St_ltH90Oc

Originally Posted by bangkokbonecollector

There is a lot of fraud and money laundering going on in Thailand now that the Russkies have turned up. I mean there was before but Russkies are just mad and once they smell a trick, they will utilize it to the full extent, even if it is blatantly obvious, they just don't give a shit.

There has been a lot of fraud and money laundering going on in Thailand before the Russians got here. The Thais are seasoned criminals!

Originally Posted by chitown

Originally Posted by bangkokbonecollector

There is a lot of fraud and money laundering going on in Thailand now that the Russkies have turned up. I mean there was before but Russkies are just mad and once they smell a trick, they will utilize it to the full extent, even if it is blatantly obvious, they just don't give a shit.

There has been a lot of fraud and money laundering going on in Thailand before the Russians got here. The Thais are seasoned criminals!

The russkies are better at it though. They took it to a whole new level getting people to install malware that allows them to collect card details and banking passwords.

That's why the money laundering thing is such an issue. They persuade idiots to do the laundering for them.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

What you omit is the decryption effort required to clone the chip. Whilst it's simple enough if you can load a Windows program and follow instructions, it is a deterrent to those criminals that can and do simply swipe and duplicate the mag strip with the press of a button.

So I'll say it again: Smartcards are harder to clone.

Of course it also depends on how your bank has chosen to implement the technology.

However, I do agree that it is nowhere near as secure as it needs to be.

This made me laugh when I heard about it. They release technology before they do their homework.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=-St_ltH90Oc

'Arry, all card data is encrypted, but copy/paste transfers it from one medium to another. Chipped cards are - as you say - encrypted more securely, but copy/paste still transfers all of the data from one medium to another.

So I'll say it again: Smartcards are no harder to clone than magstrip cards.

I am no computer buff, but for example: A bitmap image is smaller and far less complex than a 700mb movie file, but it takes no more effort to copy/paste it from one folder to another.

More secure, futuristic encryption or whatever other tags the banks use to generate confidence become irrelevant, when the effort required to clone either type of card remains the same.


The 'deterrent' you mention, which indicates that cardco propaganda does work, is that they made a big deal about building a fortress in preparation for the ongoing siege, but didn't bother to mention it would be made of cardboard. This may have deterred a few people in the distance, but the real enemy had its hoses ready before it was even completed.

Originally Posted by leemo

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

What you omit is the decryption effort required to clone the chip. Whilst it's simple enough if you can load a Windows program and follow instructions, it is a deterrent to those criminals that can and do simply swipe and duplicate the mag strip with the press of a button.

So I'll say it again: Smartcards are harder to clone.

Of course it also depends on how your bank has chosen to implement the technology.

However, I do agree that it is nowhere near as secure as it needs to be.

This made me laugh when I heard about it. They release technology before they do their homework.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=-St_ltH90Oc

'Arry, all card data is encrypted, but copy/paste transfers it from one medium to another. Chipped cards are - as you say - encrypted more securely, but copy/paste still transfers all of the data from one medium to another.

So I'll say it again: Smartcards are no harder to clone than magstrip cards.

I am no computer buff, but for example: A bitmap image is smaller and far less complex than a 700mb movie file, but it takes no more effort to copy/paste it from one folder to another.

More secure, futuristic encryption or whatever other tags the banks use to generate confidence become irrelevant, when the effort required to clone either type of card remains the same.


The 'deterrent' you mention, which indicates that cardco propaganda does work, is that they made a big deal about building a fortress in preparation for the ongoing siege, but didn't bother to mention it would be made of cardboard. This may have deterred a few people in the distance, but the real enemy had its hoses ready before it was even completed.

No the chips have a key, but it's piss easy to extract. But you can't just copy the card (or at least you shouldn't be able to!).

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Whilst it's simple enough if you can load a Windows program and follow instructions

dunno if it is a simple as people would like to think - the "security bit" has been used for quite a while

Originally Posted by Fluke

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Originally Posted by Fluke

ATMs do cost money to make and to run , and to get filled up , so you must expect a small charge to use them .

O.K. Ill join in : Bloody ATM machines typical Thais, always scamming , its a rip off, big banks charging me for my own money moan moan moan

Hows that ?

Almost there... forgot to add Thais are ignorant, violent, thieving bastards and this country would be better off without them.

most banks offer a bunch of different services,
insurance, safe deposit boxes, foreign currency accounts, currency exchange, transfers,
real estate sale/purchase etc etc

the by far most expensive service offered by banks is the handling of cash

no wonder they charge for it

Originally Posted by melvin

most banks offer a bunch of different services,
insurance, safe deposit boxes, foreign currency accounts, currency exchange, transfers,
real estate sale/purchase etc etc

the by far most expensive service offered by banks is the handling of cash

no wonder they charge for it

But as is typical they hammer non-Thais for it.

Onanists.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Originally Posted by melvin

most banks offer a bunch of different services,
insurance, safe deposit boxes, foreign currency accounts, currency exchange, transfers,
real estate sale/purchase etc etc

the by far most expensive service offered by banks is the handling of cash

no wonder they charge for it

But as is typical they hammer non-Thais for it.

Onanists.

The Thai banks make their money from the Thais who use their banks and the cost of the ATMS that the banks endure is taken from the profits the banks make, Foreigners dont keep their money in Thai bank accounts so they have to pay another way and that is through ATM charges

Originally Posted by Fluke

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Originally Posted by melvin

most banks offer a bunch of different services,
insurance, safe deposit boxes, foreign currency accounts, currency exchange, transfers,
real estate sale/purchase etc etc

the by far most expensive service offered by banks is the handling of cash

no wonder they charge for it

But as is typical they hammer non-Thais for it.

Onanists.

The Thai banks make their money from the Thais who use their banks and the cost of the ATMS that the banks endure is taken from the profits the banks make, Foreigners dont keep their money in Thai bank accounts so they have to pay another way and that is through ATM charges

They already make money from Forex.

This is just greed. Not that Thai banks have a global monopoly on greed.

^^
Oh I dunno, our company retains a healthy cash balance so the bank is making a nice profit lending our money out to the locals.

^So you wouldnt have to pay the 180 Baht ATM fee then ?

Thursday, 13 Feb 2014
Smart cards, already used for credit transactions in about 130 countries, are coming to America. But it will be years before we all have these fraud-resistant credit cards in our wallets.
Though U.S. banks have been issuing the cards for a few years, the recent rash of data breaches at Target and other retailers has injected a sense of urgency into their efforts.
The big question is what type of smart cards the banks will issue. Will they require a PIN code for authentication or simply a signature?

Smart cards are far more secure than traditional credit cards, which store account information—unencrypted—on a magnetic stripe. These next-generation cards encrypt and store that data on an embedded microchip that generates a new code for each transaction. So even if your credit card number is stolen, it's nearly impossible for a criminal to create a counterfeit card.
Point-of-sale credit card fraud has dropped dramatically where the smart cards have been deployed—in Europe, Asia, Mexico and Canada.


Whether PIN or signature, smart cards are coming

Originally Posted by Fluke

^So you wouldnt have to pay the 180 Baht ATM fee then ?

If I use my UK ATM card in a Thai ATM then, yes, I would have to pay the ThB 180. Small beer compared with the money to be made lending out the company's cash balance considering the pitiful interest we receive.

Originally Posted by Thormaturge

Originally Posted by Fluke

^So you wouldnt have to pay the 180 Baht ATM fee then ?

If I use my UK ATM card in a Thai ATM then, yes, I would have to pay the ThB 180. Small beer compared with the money to be made lending out the company's cash balance considering the pitiful interest we receive.

So you have a Company in Thailand with a large cash deposit and you use your UK ATM card to make withdrawals ?
Can you not get a Thai ATM card to make the withdrawals and thus not have to pay the 180Baht ?

^
The ATM withdrawals with the UK card are from my personal UK account.

Withdrawals from my Thai accounts using a Thai ATM card are free, of course.

Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

Will they require a PIN code for authentication or simply a signature?

I have had a chip and pin card from an australian bank for about 4 years - they have notified me that they will require the pin to be used starting this august .

And what about the new charge for travellers cheques...153 baht per cheque.
Came into force on 1st March.
Greedy coonts!

^ Have you heard the phrase "Cutting off your nose to spite your face"?

Originally Posted by bangkokbonecollector

I got my card swallowed today by SCB ATM.

I had this with SCB a while back and it transpired they were changing the style of card and mine was due for replacement.

They did ask for ThB 100 for the new card but after I let them know what I thought of that the charge was dropped.

Originally Posted by Fluke

ATMs do cost money to make and to run , and to get filled up , so you must expect a small charge to use them .

Fair enough but AU $ 6.00 every withdrawal is over the fuckin top ! 60 bucks from every 10 withdrawals x10 = 600 bucks every 100 withdrawals multiplied by however many ATM's is a lot of money in my opinion and probably more than enough to cover the running costs as other posters have said Theiving KUNTS !

Originally Posted by steve down under

Originally Posted by Fluke

ATMs do cost money to make and to run , and to get filled up , so you must expect a small charge to use them .

Fair enough but AU $ 6.00 every withdrawal is over the fuckin top ! 60 bucks from every 10 withdrawals x10 = 600 bucks every 100 withdrawals multiplied by however many ATM's is a lot of money in my opinion and probably more than enough to cover the running costs as other posters have said Theiving KUNTS !

Just withdraw the maximum each time, to lessen the cost .
Or if you dont want to pay for using ATMs, then dont use them

Or just exchange your money into Baht back home or buy dollars and change them in Thailand.