"On Line" definition

**Perota** · 24-04-2010, 12:20 PM

We have asked a "design" company in HK (I'll give you the name once we have solved this matter) to redesign our web site.
It has been a very difficult collaboration and actually half of the job has been done by our own people. Now it's time for the final payment. The contract states that the balance payment will be made once the website is online.

What does it mean "online" ? So far our website is still on the design company server and and they try to BS us by making a redirect from our address to their server. My understanding is the website should be on our server before we have to pay. I know people here have a lot of experience in web site design. What do you think ? What are your advises ?

**Butterfly** · 24-04-2010, 12:26 PM

^ you oWNED, it's technically online, should have said on the contract "on production site"

was is a small amount ? or a big one ? if small, just pay, they have you by the balls. If it's plain HTML, you could simply download all the pages with a Web downloader, if it's dynamically created with codes, you will need to pay

hope that helped,

**melvbot** · 24-04-2010, 12:40 PM

If it's working and ready for use i.e someone can type the addy in and access it freely then I'd say it's online

**Perota** · 24-04-2010, 12:43 PM

Not a big amount. For the money we owe them, worse come to worse, we can ask a Chinese programmer to rewrite the code since we made a copy of all the pages.

It's their arrogance that piss me off. They were way behind schedule, one of our staff had to chase them all the time. They accused her of "harassment", that we didn't understand anything of the "creative process". And at the end, our staff had to do half of the job to see the end of this project.

Now we just want the matter over. If legally we have to pay before the program is on our server, so I guess we will pay. If not, I'm not so sure ... I just wish to be some kind of Tony Soprano ...

**baldrick** · 24-04-2010, 12:46 PM

if it is just HTML, jpegs, CSS and javascript , just grab the files and put them on your web hosting server.

if it is SQL PHP , then tell them they get final payment when the site is running on your hosted server and the database is up and running.

**Perota** · 24-04-2010, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by melvbot

If it's working and ready for use i.e someone can type the addy in and access it freely then I'd say it's online

The program is on their server. Can any problem arise when the program is installed on our server ?
Then even we owed them money, it took them ages to do the job. When they will get the payment, how can we be sure the program will be installed correctly and on time ?

**Norton** · 24-04-2010, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by Perota

So far our website is still on the design company server and and they try to BS us by making a redirect from our address to their server.

It's on line but hosted on the design companies server.

If you want to host it on your company computer or another then it must moved from design company computer to the one on which you want it hosted.

**Perota** · 24-04-2010, 12:49 PM

Originally Posted by baldrick

if it is just HTML, jpegs, CSS and javascript , just grab the files and put them on your web hosting server.

if it is SQL PHP , then tell them they get final payment when the site is running on your hosted server and the database is up and running.

No database, just "flash" animation. Is it that easy to grab the files ?

It's not that we don't want to pay them, it's just this blackmail that we hate.

**Butterfly** · 24-04-2010, 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by Perota

The program is on their server. Can any problem arise when the program is installed on our server ?

they could ask for extra money for deployment,

**Muadib** · 24-04-2010, 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

^ you oWNED, it's technically online, should have said on the contract "on production site"

Not hardly... Not until the production URL / DNS entries resolve to the new website, located on whatever servers the client owns or are contracted to use... The development servers at the design company ain't production... Not unless the client authorizes updates to DNS entries to have the production URL resolve to the IP address of the development server...

Sounds like they are trying to pull a fast one... If you change your DNS entry to resolve to their servers, then it's production... They also have you over a barrel and will likely charge you a hosting fee and technically can pull the code at any time...

Tell them they receive payment once the new code is running on YOUR servers and the production URL resolves to the new code... Even after that, have someone test all contracted functionality prior to signing off on delivery... Then pay them the final payment... If anything is broken and you don't discover it until after payment is made, you're fooked... You'll have to pay them again to fix their fuck ups...

**Butterfly** · 24-04-2010, 01:20 PM

they are probably unprofessional, so very unlikely that they will do anything before payment. Most companies would have put everything on production, and then ask for final payment, unless the client is dodgy or felt dodgy.

**baldrick** · 25-04-2010, 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by Perota

The program

when you say "program" in intimates that is is not just html with some flash animations.

if one of your staff cannot just copy it to your webhost and determine that it is good or tell you it caannot be done because of ?? , then I think you have some deeper problems to come.

as I said before - just tell the company you are dealing with that final payment will not be made until it is installed and confirmed running on your webhost server - no ifs or buts.

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