Thread: ‘Open source is safer, and Linux is more secure than any other OS’

Originally Posted by quimbian corholla

Somebody needs to tweak spaminacanbot's algorithms, it seems it's now trolling its own threads.

What? You need a clarification here?

It is simple as pie, I posted a good topic about opensource use and what do I get? Two kibitzers now asking me about semiconductors and different types of doping of the material. Do they think I am dopey or something?

No! I am not.

They can now answer the original thread, or, they can feel free to ask away with their doping questions, and other questions that apply to the physics and nano-science of materials, or semiconductors, and also energy conversion questions as they pertain to converting radiation from the sun into electric power used to run computers.

Yes, I know plenty, and you are free to ask away!

have you attempted to post in a vacuum tube ? can anyone hear you scream ?

Originally Posted by baldrick

have you attempted to post in a vacuum tube ? can anyone hear you scream ?

There is no pure vacuum, so
Moot point here.

Or, mute point if you were posting in a semi vacuum.

i used linux for years and was an insufferable convert until i was forced to used windows 7 and realised that it was better than either any of the linux systems i'd used and previous flavors of windows

has linux got its act together or is it still an incredible pain in the bollucks?

Originally Posted by ChiangMai noon

i used linux for years and was an insufferable convert until i was forced to used windows 7 and realised that it was better than either any of the linux systems i'd used and previous flavors of windows

has linux got its act together or is it still an incredible pain in the bollucks?

Use what works for you. GNU/Linux is not a pain in my 'bollucks' but if you don't like it then don't use it. Nobody is forcing you.

Originally Posted by ChiangMai noon

i used linux for years and was an insufferable convert until i was forced to used windows 7 and realised that it was better than either any of the linux systems i'd used and previous flavors of windows

has linux got its act together or is it still an incredible pain in the bollucks?

You Speak the Truth!
Khun Pud Tuk!?

I have been using OpenSuse since 8.1.
Then I was forced to change when I needed this laptop in a hurry which was loaded with Windows 8.0.

At the time I booted up, I thought "what happened to Windows?"
Windows has really gottten much better.
And now, I do like to use Windows 8.1.

The only problem with Windows 8 is that it does not have a good search function for the entire hard drive, or 10 hard drives all at once if you have them partitioned that way.

And then, of course you can't find anything if you are looking for certain applications in the new app search section.

Other than that, when i am just doing simple things, it is really nice to use.

I HAVE NEVER USED APPLE'S COMPUTERS, SO I WONDER HOW MUCh I would like them?

I have heard so many good things about the Apple OS.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

You should thank your lucky stars you are not in there changing vacuum tubes, 5 a minute, just as they used to do when computing was a man's game.

Originally Posted by Troy

Argie Bargie.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Porki? Argie? What did you call me?

I would have expected anyone that had studied valve theory well enough to be let loose fixing equipment containing them would have understood the Argie Bargie comment....(think Rg g/bar)
BTW How do you add a negating macron to a letter in a browser?

As for the OP, I think you got a little lost about the time I suggested no direct link to the outside world. The "direct link" was either missed or seems to have caused you a little confusion.

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

You should thank your lucky stars you are not in there changing vacuum tubes, 5 a minute, just as they used to do when computing was a man's game.

Originally Posted by Troy

Argie Bargie.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Porki? Argie? What did you call me?

I would have expected anyone that had studied valve theory well enough to be let loose fixing equipment containing them would have understood the Argie Bargie comment....(think Rg g/bar)
BTW How do you add a negating macron to a letter in a browser?

As for the OP, I think you got a little lost about the time I suggested no direct link to the outside world. The "direct link" was either missed or seems to have caused you a little confusion.

As I said below, when I see 'bar' I always think pressure first.

I don't think I was confused re the no direct link to outside world, but computers are not usually useful without one.

^ I think you've missed the point again.....A simple hardware router will remove the direct access but for added security you can use a switcher/router with a firewall and set it up such that it acts as an isolator between your machine(s) and the public internet.

Suggesting that computers are not useful unless they are linked to the public internet is, to use your phrase, hogwash. There are thousands of useful computers confined to themselves or joined using internal LANs with no access to the outside world.

BTW, what masquerading tools are you using?

Originally Posted by Troy

^ I think you've missed the point again.....A simple hardware router will remove the direct access but for added security you can use a switcher/router with a firewall and set it up such that it acts as an isolator between your machine(s) and the public internet.

Suggesting that computers are not useful unless they are linked to the public internet is, to use your phrase, hogwash. There are thousands of useful computers confined to themselves or joined using internal LANs with no access to the outside world.

BTW, what masquerading tools are you using?

Well, yes, you could say hogwash.
But I do not.....And here is why.

You might say that the computer in my car, which runs linux to control the brakes, is not connected to the outside world. It is just there, helping me drive more safely, and is not getting any input from outside, other than measuring the pressure I apply, or the speed of the wheels, or something that requires no data transmitted from outside the system.

Still, it is not safe.
It is hard to know what nefarious code lurks inside.
Is this what you mean?

Anyway, I don't think that we are talking here about routers or other firewalls not part of the computer in question.

What we are wondering about here is a given system:

1. A linux computer connected to the internet. (without regard to what is beyond the ethernet connection or the wireless connection)

Is such a computer more secure because it runs opensource software?

2. Or, if you are considering a whole system, such as a network that runs opensource software, then is the network more secure, and does it run better because it is running opensource software?

3. Or, you can consider the other examples which are listed or suggested by the person who made the original statement which I quoted in the start of this thread.

4. And, please feel free to add on the newly budding field of opensource hardware, which might be used with opensource software to really make a much more hardened system.

Because who knows what is being added to the hardware by major manufacturers (IBM, Asus, etc) to circumvent security measures which are instituted in the software?

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Anyway, I don't think that we are talking here about routers or other firewalls not part of the computer in question.

You were talking about Iran and Stuxnet earlier, which was a worm and therefore network related rather than simply part of the computer...Routers and switches are very much part of the private network and play an important part in keeping a system secure from external attack.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

1. A linux computer connected to the internet. (without regard to what is beyond the ethernet connection or the wireless connection) Is such a computer more secure because it runs opensource software?

This is a double-edged sword since the code is open-source it is open to abuse but on the other hand it is also open for security trials and fixes as well. Instead of a small group battling against the world of abusers there is a whole world of fixers battling against them.....

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Well, yes, you could say hogwash. But I do not.....And here is why. You might say that the computer in my car, which runs linux to control the brakes, is not connected to the outside world. It is just there, helping me drive more safely, and is not getting any input from outside, other than measuring the pressure I apply, or the speed of the wheels, or something that requires no data transmitted from outside the system. Still, it is not safe. It is hard to know what nefarious code lurks inside. Is this what you mean?

Now we are jumping to embedded software and "security" against software failure, which is a completely different topic. The most recent one hitting the news is probably the Toyota troubles with their electronic throttle:

Toyota's killer firmware: Bad design and its consequences | EDN

There is a pdf version for those interested ...just google the title

Thankfully, Toyota don't make aeroplanes.....

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Anyway, I don't think that we are talking here about routers or other firewalls not part of the computer in question.

You were talking about Iran and Stuxnet earlier, which was a worm and therefore network related rather than simply part of the computer...Routers and switches are very much part of the private network and play an important part in keeping a system secure from external attack.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

1. A linux computer connected to the internet. (without regard to what is beyond the ethernet connection or the wireless connection) Is such a computer more secure because it runs opensource software?

This is a double-edged sword since the code is open-source it is open to abuse but on the other hand it is also open for security trials and fixes as well. Instead of a small group battling against the world of abusers there is a whole world of fixers battling against them.....

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Well, yes, you could say hogwash. But I do not.....And here is why. You might say that the computer in my car, which runs linux to control the brakes, is not connected to the outside world. It is just there, helping me drive more safely, and is not getting any input from outside, other than measuring the pressure I apply, or the speed of the wheels, or something that requires no data transmitted from outside the system. Still, it is not safe. It is hard to know what nefarious code lurks inside. Is this what you mean?

Now we are jumping to embedded software and "security" against software failure, which is a completely different topic. The most recent one hitting the news is probably the Toyota troubles with their electronic throttle:

Toyota's killer firmware: Bad design and its consequences | EDN

There is a pdf version for those interested ...just google the title

Thankfully, Toyota don't make aeroplanes.....

I was thinking about that, also. Toyota's problem was so difficult to judge, for press and the citizenry, and even people working within Toyota. This is why worms and viruses can be so dangerous, because they are difficult for people to see and understand. But was that problem caused by a virus or a mat which pressed down on the accelerator pedal? I say a mat. It has happened to me, many times, and I do not try to return an automobile because of it.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Toyota's problem was so difficult to judge, for press and the citizenry, and even people working within Toyota. This is why worms and viruses can be so dangerous, because they are difficult for people to see and understand. But was that problem caused by a virus or a mat which pressed down on the accelerator pedal?

It helps if you read the article.....

So what happens when an automaker decides to wing it and play by their own rules? To disregard the rigorous standards, best practices, and checks and balances required of such software (and hardware) design? People are killed, reputations ruined, and billions of dollars are paid out. That's what happens. Here's the story of some software that arguably never should have been.

Some pretty elementary mistakes were made in all departments. Looks like the 'KISS' rule was ignored as well...

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

Toyota's problem was so difficult to judge, for press and the citizenry, and even people working within Toyota. This is why worms and viruses can be so dangerous, because they are difficult for people to see and understand. But was that problem caused by a virus or a mat which pressed down on the accelerator pedal?

It helps if you read the article.....

So what happens when an automaker decides to wing it and play by their own rules? To disregard the rigorous standards, best practices, and checks and balances required of such software (and hardware) design? People are killed, reputations ruined, and billions of dollars are paid out. That's what happens. Here's the story of some software that arguably never should have been.

Some pretty elementary mistakes were made in all departments. Looks like the 'KISS' rule was ignored as well...

Thank you.
It is a good article, and the reason I posted it is so we would read it.

I liked this article re software bugs:
Epic failures: 11 infamous software bugs

Originally Posted by Troy

I liked this article re software bugs:
Epic failures: 11 infamous software bugs

A bug indeed.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

I have been using OpenSuse since 8.1. Then I was forced to change when I needed this laptop in a hurry which was loaded with Windows 8.0.

Why did that force you to change? Surely you could have installed OpenSuse and restored your system on the new machine with one of your backups? If you're going to spam then do it right...

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

I have been using OpenSuse since 8.1. Then I was forced to change when I needed this laptop in a hurry which was loaded with Windows 8.0.

Why did that force you to change? Surely you could have installed OpenSuse and restored your system on the new machine with one of your backups? If you're going to spam then do it right...

I had an emergency need for a laptop, and had to buy one in a hurry. There was no time to install another OS, and then see if it would work on this laptop with no tweaking, and I had no other backup in case the installation failed.

So, there you have it, I was forced to use whatever OS came with this laptop.\\

Simple.
And it really is nice to use, this 8.0, I must admit.
Ideology is not important.

(You can see my laptop if you like, because I did post a screenshot here, a few hours ago, although on which thread I do forget now.)

I am not sure what is the point of this thread,

Originally Posted by Butterfly

I am not sure what is the point of this thread,

You're not the only one.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Originally Posted by Butterfly

I am not sure what is the point of this thread,

You're not the only one.

The point is obvious, and you only need to read the start of the thread.

Originally Posted by SpamInCan

The point is obvious

it's the sharp bit at the end