Thread: Proof the lunatics are running the UK today

Pointless. Car and truck drivers will park or drive on the bicycle paths, and not give a crap about the right of way crossing them. There is no other way than to ban cars in cities completely.

Originally Posted by Rainfall

Pointless. Car and truck drivers will park or drive on the bicycle paths, and not give a crap about the right of way crossing them. There is no other way than to ban cars in cities completely.

Driving or parking in either bus or cycle lanes is against the law and is punished by a set fine , nearly all the roads in London have CCTV and all people know this too.

I have to deal with cyclist riding down a 1 way street the wrong way at speed.
When they decide to play chicken they get a face on cos i won't move over.

Sure.

Originally Posted by piwanoi

So the London transport authority haven't a clue what they are talking about then, and if the lights had changed to green and the truck driver had started to turn left just as a cyclist was trying to pass on the inside to go straight ahead and got side wiped it would not have been the fault of the cyclist!!! , are you aware that overtaking on the left is an offence and is only legal when the vehicle in front is indicating to turn right , I drove an HGV for many years and lost count of the trucks I saw fitted with boards at the rear of their vehicles , on the right was written "passing side" and on the left "suicide"

Stationary vs Moving traffic ....Obviously different and people gauge the risks accordingly. I realise the near side can be a blind spot but the "dual mirror" has been around almost as long as I have so no real excuse for a stationary lorry to turn into a cyclist, so why is this the most frequent accident?

More to do with patience and checking by the lorry than the cyclist being out of order. Moving traffic and the rules change completely. No doubt this is why lorry drivers are being told to cycle around because "experts" like you still think you can do what you like as long as you have a blinking orange light....

Lorry drivers are professionals and, as such, need to act accordingly. If it was up to me they would only be allowed to enter cities between 1am and 5am. Delivery by night only would solve a lot of the congestion problems....

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by piwanoi

So the London transport authority haven't a clue what they are talking about then, and if the lights had changed to green and the truck driver had started to turn left just as a cyclist was trying to pass on the inside to go straight ahead and got side wiped it would not have been the fault of the cyclist!!! , are you aware that overtaking on the left is an offence and is only legal when the vehicle in front is indicating to turn right , I drove an HGV for many years and lost count of the trucks I saw fitted with boards at the rear of their vehicles , on the right was written "passing side" and on the left "suicide"

Stationary vs Moving traffic ....Obviously different and people gauge the risks accordingly. I realise the near side can be a blind spot but the "dual mirror" has been around almost as long as I have so no real excuse for a stationary lorry to turn into a cyclist, so why is this the most frequent accident?

More to do with patience and checking by the lorry than the cyclist being out of order. Moving traffic and the rules change completely. No doubt this is why lorry drivers are being told to cycle around because "experts" like you still think you can do what you like as long as you have a blinking orange light....

Lorry drivers are professionals and, as such, need to act accordingly. If it was up to me they would only be allowed to enter cities between 1am and 5am. Delivery by night only would solve a lot of the congestion problems....

i think you need to jump in a lorry to see the dickheads ,both car and cyclists who do the most stupid things in traffic, really comes down to ,do not put your self in a dangerous position, so , stay back from a truck at the lights.
does not matter how many mirrors he has,cyclists are hard to see.

Originally Posted by reddog

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by piwanoi

So the London transport authority haven't a clue what they are talking about then, and if the lights had changed to green and the truck driver had started to turn left just as a cyclist was trying to pass on the inside to go straight ahead and got side wiped it would not have been the fault of the cyclist!!! , are you aware that overtaking on the left is an offence and is only legal when the vehicle in front is indicating to turn right , I drove an HGV for many years and lost count of the trucks I saw fitted with boards at the rear of their vehicles , on the right was written "passing side" and on the left "suicide"

Stationary vs Moving traffic ....Obviously different and people gauge the risks accordingly. I realise the near side can be a blind spot but the "dual mirror" has been around almost as long as I have so no real excuse for a stationary lorry to turn into a cyclist, so why is this the most frequent accident?

More to do with patience and checking by the lorry than the cyclist being out of order. Moving traffic and the rules change completely. No doubt this is why lorry drivers are being told to cycle around because "experts" like you still think you can do what you like as long as you have a blinking orange light....

Lorry drivers are professionals and, as such, need to act accordingly. If it was up to me they would only be allowed to enter cities between 1am and 5am. Delivery by night only would solve a lot of the congestion problems....

i think you need to jump in a lorry to see the dickheads ,both car and cyclists who do the most stupid things in traffic, really comes down to ,do not put your self in a dangerous position, so , stay back from a truck at the lights.
does not matter how many mirrors he has,cyclists are hard to see.

Obviously you have driven an HGV , If you look at the road markings in the video in post #86 it plainly says turn left only ,and yet these boneheads risk life and limb to steal a few seconds instead of like you say hanging back or at least going past the truck on its right , there no if buts whys or were for,s in a case like this the cyclists are plainly at fault and thats why the video was posted to youtube in the first place , end of story .

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by reddog

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by piwanoi

So the London transport authority haven't a clue what they are talking about then, and if the lights had changed to green and the truck driver had started to turn left just as a cyclist was trying to pass on the inside to go straight ahead and got side wiped it would not have been the fault of the cyclist!!! , are you aware that overtaking on the left is an offence and is only legal when the vehicle in front is indicating to turn right , I drove an HGV for many years and lost count of the trucks I saw fitted with boards at the rear of their vehicles , on the right was written "passing side" and on the left "suicide"

Stationary vs Moving traffic ....Obviously different and people gauge the risks accordingly. I realise the near side can be a blind spot but the "dual mirror" has been around almost as long as I have so no real excuse for a stationary lorry to turn into a cyclist, so why is this the most frequent accident?

More to do with patience and checking by the lorry than the cyclist being out of order. Moving traffic and the rules change completely. No doubt this is why lorry drivers are being told to cycle around because "experts" like you still think you can do what you like as long as you have a blinking orange light....

Lorry drivers are professionals and, as such, need to act accordingly. If it was up to me they would only be allowed to enter cities between 1am and 5am. Delivery by night only would solve a lot of the congestion problems....

i think you need to jump in a lorry to see the dickheads ,both car and cyclists who do the most stupid things in traffic, really comes down to ,do not put your self in a dangerous position, so , stay back from a truck at the lights.
does not matter how many mirrors he has,cyclists are hard to see.

Obviously you have driven an HGV , If you look at the road markings in the video in post #86 it plainly says turn left only ,and yet these boneheads risk life and limb to steal a few seconds instead of like you say hanging back or at least going past the truck on its right , there no if buts whys or were for,s in a case like this the cyclists are plainly at fault and thats why the video was posted to youtube in the first place , end of story .

There was a case in England that I knew about in which a driver was convicted of DWDC&A after turning left out of traffic and knocking a cyclist over. All road users must take care and drivers should watch their mirrors for anyone on their nearside. Being a bone head with a truck is no defence.

I'm not sure the is appropriate at the end of your post.....

What if the rules were changed and traffic had to give way to pedestrians and cyclists when turning "nearside" at junctions? At traffic lights the pedestrian crossing/cyclist crossing went green on the nearside and traffic had to wait until they had crossed before turning. How would you feel about that? Do you think it would make it safer for all?

The problem with your video #51 was that it was a left only filter lane and the cyclists should have been queued up on the outside of the lorry rather than the inside. It is a special case that tries to make the general case wrong. That is, with no filter left-only lane and the same thing happening...or with a cycle lane on the road with the same conditions. Having different rules under different conditions like this complicates matters and common sense dictates that a single simple rule would be far easier. Such is the case in Germany and some other European countries and that is all I meant in my "what if the rules were changed scenario" There really is no need to get worked up about it and storm off in a hussy fit.

Some rules that are pertinent to the problem:
https://www.gov.uk/using-the-road-15...ons-170-to-183

Rule 177 being the one to notice for left lane filters and that "Give other traffic, especially cyclists, time and room to move into the correct lane" is all important...why should a cycle track have to be marked on the road?

Note that if the cyclist dismounts then he/she becomes a pedestrian and you have to give way before turning left if they have started to cross....Rule 170

But we all know the rules...a little run around London as a cyclist does give you some thinking time as someone who is very vulnerable on the road though. Having experienced it, you get a better perspective of the frustrations and problems the cyclist has and you become more aware of them when driving a Lorry. I think, on that basis alone, the scheme is good.

The rules are far more explicit in Germany with cyclist and pedestrian crossings. They force the rule that is clearly implied in England. You have no choice but to give way to a cyclist approaching, as well as crossing, the junction as you make a nearside turn.....And cyclists will happily crash into your vehicle to make the point that you are in the wrong.

They will do the same if you make the mistake of parking in a cycle lane...crash into you, call the police and make you pay BIG time. Probably the best possible way to enforce the rules.

England used to be fortunate in that rules applied common sense and no-one needed to make a fuss....do we need to go the way of the Continent and force the rules?

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Of course that could well happen , but in this case should you care to look was quite different , the road markings said turn left only, and the cyclist,s was going straight ahead ,so they would be held responsible if any accident happened , road markings are there for a purpose, be it give way markings, stop markings, or any other marking and to ignore them you do so at your own peril .

Any cyclist getting between the lanes could end up in a sandwich between two arrogant and angry truck drivers. If drivers have any eyes or common sense, they know that cyclists usually keep well to the left. You need to live with reality instead of risking mangling people because you think you're in the right.

Originally Posted by Morden

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Of course that could well happen , but in this case should you care to look was quite different , the road markings said turn left only, and the cyclist,s was going straight ahead ,so they would be held responsible if any accident happened , road markings are there for a purpose, be it give way markings, stop markings, or any other marking and to ignore them you do so at your own peril .

Any cyclist getting between the lanes could end up in a sandwich between two arrogant and angry truck drivers. If drivers have any eyes or common sense, they know that cyclists usually keep well to the left. You need to live with reality instead of risking mangling people because you think you're in the right.

I repeat the road markings are there for a purpose ,if you come to a road junction and there is a stop or give way marking on the road and you ignore it and get side wiped by a vehicle approaching from your right whatever the circumstance you will be found at fault ' its not rocket science ! , and if a cyclist goes between two trucks that are close together instead of hanging back like the LTA says then he really is insane , it would appear you have somewhat of a downer on HGV drivers ,arrogant and angry indeed!

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by Morden

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Of course that could well happen , but in this case should you care to look was quite different , the road markings said turn left only, and the cyclist,s was going straight ahead ,so they would be held responsible if any accident happened , road markings are there for a purpose, be it give way markings, stop markings, or any other marking and to ignore them you do so at your own peril .

Any cyclist getting between the lanes could end up in a sandwich between two arrogant and angry truck drivers. If drivers have any eyes or common sense, they know that cyclists usually keep well to the left. You need to live with reality instead of risking mangling people because you think you're in the right.

I repeat the road markings are there for a purpose ,if you come to a road junction and there is a stop or give way marking on the road and you ignore it and get side wiped by a vehicle approaching from your right whatever the circumstance you will be found at fault ' its not rocket science ! , and if a cyclist goes between two trucks that are close together instead of hanging back like the LTA says then he really is insane , it would appear you have somewhat of a downer on HGV drivers ,arrogant and angry indeed!

OK, you carry on running them down because you're in the right.

Originally Posted by Morden

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Originally Posted by Morden

Originally Posted by piwanoi

Of course that could well happen , but in this case should you care to look was quite different , the road markings said turn left only, and the cyclist,s was going straight ahead ,so they would be held responsible if any accident happened , road markings are there for a purpose, be it give way markings, stop markings, or any other marking and to ignore them you do so at your own peril .

Any cyclist getting between the lanes could end up in a sandwich between two arrogant and angry truck drivers. If drivers have any eyes or common sense, they know that cyclists usually keep well to the left. You need to live with reality instead of risking mangling people because you think you're in the right.

I repeat the road markings are there for a purpose ,if you come to a road junction and there is a stop or give way marking on the road and you ignore it and get side wiped by a vehicle approaching from your right whatever the circumstance you will be found at fault ' its not rocket science ! , and if a cyclist goes between two trucks that are close together instead of hanging back like the LTA says then he really is insane , it would appear you have somewhat of a downer on HGV drivers ,arrogant and angry indeed!

OK, you carry on running them down because you're in the right.

Many times cyclist get killed or injured cos they are in the wrong just the same as those crackpots in the video doing just what the LTA advised them in the interests of their own safety not to do , and of course some are killed or injured through no fault of their own ,but in this case those in the video was plainly in the wrong ,and that is all I contend .

sitecraft.net.au

I don't say kill stupid people, but we could do away with warning them of what should be obvious to anyone with a legal license, and let nature take its course.

I believe it was in a Euro country where they tried an experiment at a new coxplex road junction with no warning signs, no lights, no cops, no nothing. Outcome in the 6-month trial, zero accidents.

Originally Posted by leemo

I don't say kill stupid people, but we could do away with warning them of what should be obvious to anyone with a legal license, and let nature take its course.

I believe it was in a Euro country where they tried an experiment at a new coxplex road junction with no warning signs, no lights, no cops, no nothing. Outcome in the 6-month trial, zero accidents.

Yeah Thailand copied the system I believe, cos no one takes any notice of anything ,only it did,nt turn out quite right in Thailands case did it!

Originally Posted by reddog

i think you need to jump in a lorry to see the dickheads ,both car and cyclists who do the most stupid things in traffic, really comes down to ,do not put your self in a dangerous position, so , stay back from a truck at the lights.
does not matter how many mirrors he has,cyclists are hard to see.

I don't need to jump in a lorry to see them thank-you.

This comment, and others like it, that try to turn advisories into rules does nothing but reduce the rights of other road users rather than enforcing them. Horses pedestrians and cyclists have rights to cross roads and vehicles should be looking out for them and giving way to them. This excuse of "they're hard to see" is nothing more than an excuse and a pathetic one at that. It won't get you very far in Court, that's for sure.

The introduction of more and more "Toucan Crossings" in order to enforce the rights of the cyclist and pedestrian is required as per the Continent. There can be no excuses then and every vehicle driver will be forced to stop and give way before turning into a nearside junction.

Quite simply the modern driver has lost the plot and forgotten the essential rights of others.

Originally Posted by Troy

Originally Posted by reddog

i think you need to jump in a lorry to see the dickheads ,both car and cyclists who do the most stupid things in traffic, really comes down to ,do not put your self in a dangerous position, so , stay back from a truck at the lights.
does not matter how many mirrors he has,cyclists are hard to see.

I don't need to jump in a lorry to see them thank-you.

This comment, and others like it, that try to turn advisories into rules does nothing but reduce the rights of other road users rather than enforcing them. Horses pedestrians and cyclists have rights to cross roads and vehicles should be looking out for them and giving way to them. This excuse of "they're hard to see" is nothing more than an excuse and a pathetic one at that. It won't get you very far in Court, that's for sure.

The introduction of more and more "Toucan Crossings" in order to enforce the rights of the cyclist and pedestrian is required as per the Continent. There can be no excuses then and every vehicle driver will be forced to stop and give way before turning into a nearside junction.

Quite simply the modern driver has lost the plot and forgotten the essential rights of others.

Absolutely right. The basic rule is to look out for the most vulnerable.

Whatever you say or any one else says for that matter the road marking were quite plain for all to see, it was a turn left only lane, any one going straight ahead should not be in it, so therefore THEY are in the wrong and responsible should an accident happen.