Thread: Jatuporn: "I dare you to stage a coup"

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Tom Sawyer

Remember when they used to (constantly) warn the Samit Government and his successor (PPP etc) and the police against using "violence" against the protestors (yellow PADs) when they occupied Govt House and the Airport?

Notice how now that word has been replaced by suggestions that the Abhisit govt has said it will not use "force"..

how long have the reds staging protests and how many already ? don't think the PAD did so many, I guess they were more effective. The reds want to test the government patience and they have been stirring shit with no clear agenda for almost 2 years, so that their beloved leader, officially or not officially, can return.

Once Thaksin is condemned by the courts, and face possible jail terms then maybe the process can start to be normal. The best solution would be for Thaksin to have an "accident" and let's see how long the red movement will last on its "noble" ideas and existing leaders.

"The best solution would be for Thaksin to have an "accident" fantasised Butterfly.
I suggest abduction by aliens (no, not us Farang) or voluntary self combustion, anything which doesn't leave a corpse. Nothing to rally around in the future.

^ I don't think they would rally over it, this is just non-sense and myths spread by the Thaksin supporters present in the reds to justify their existence. That accident is going to happen now, when is the only question.

You know, I almost agree with Butterfly. When people say things like "everything would be alright if only Thaksin died" it's very hard to argue with his point that many people are very, very stupid

^ it might be stupid, but it doesn't make it less true. There will be no stir shitter left, because frankly, if it wasn't for him to finance it all, you know they would just give up and roll over, exactly like the Democrats did when T was in charge.

This country doesn't have a credible opposition, and never will. They just lack the motivations and the ideas for it.

Originally Posted by Butterfly

This country doesn't have a credible opposition, and never will. They just lack the motivations and the ideas for it.

Perhaps real credible opposition or counter convention positions are not allowed to establish themselves....always tends to be minority underground movements that are vocal, yet weak. As you well know, the principle systematic foundation is largely a conservative model - regardless of the dozens of political identities that have passed and remain, attaching philosophical facades that might harbour alternatives, but at their core remain loyal to an establishment position. The creative and motivated ideals are still around - have been for years. It's just been ingrained that such social and political visions are aligned with unorthodoxy. The political and social systems exist to protect. Nothing more, nothing less.

Originally Posted by DrB0b

There are also a number of people who could easily step in if Thaksin were to suddenly keel over.

castle in the sky DrB ? come on, you can do better than that,

Originally Posted by DrB0b

He's definitely the figurehead but he's too far away to be the real leader. There are others.

right, heard that one before, and yet they fail to come forward when faced with road blocks. It's all a big secret, right ? or maybe they are simply too coward to come forward if things get hot

Originally Posted by DrB0b

I guess you didn't see the Khon Kaen rally? That might have cleared up a few of your misconceptions

let me guess, a big stage, some music, a lot of food stall, lao kaho flowing and a good party was had for all

be serious, DrB, you are starting to sound desperate again.

Originally Posted by Rural Surin

attaching philosophical facades that might harbour alternatives, but at their core remain loyal to an establishment position. The creative and motivated ideals are still around - have been for years. It's just been ingrained that such social and political visions are aligned with unorthodoxy. The political and social systems exist to protect. Nothing more, nothing less.

I agree with you here, exactly my point. Not credible. That's not an opposition.

^You think Thais are sneaky and westerners are smart? No wonder you're confused about what's going on this country.

No, I was referring to individual levels of skill in perception (westerners).....and also that the Thai's behaviour we observe is hardly unique to Thai's. Perhaps re-reading would be a useful activity.........

Their history aside (which I'm fully aware informs the present), people are pretty much the same all over the world, in their motivations, behaviour and expression.

You seem to be convinced (from your previous posts) that what transpires here is somehow special. How can a mere westerner ever comprehend?

A quick reminder of your thoughts appears in order.....

Originally Posted by DrB0b

I fully agree, intepreting these events in Western terms is more or less a waste of time. The rules are different, the background is different, the history is different. It is, of course, possible to be interested and involved but it does require some effort and understanding, bringing our western baggage to that study and effort doesn't help much, often quite the opposite.

it's nothing but a pipe dream to believe all Thailand's troubles will end with T's demise .

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

No, I was referring to individual levels of skill in perception (westerners).....and also that the Thai's behaviour we observe is hardly unique to Thai's. Perhaps re-reading would be a useful activity.........

Their history aside (which I'm fully aware informs the present), people are pretty much the same all over the world, in their motivations, behaviour and expression.

You seem to be convinced (from your previous posts) that what transpires here is somehow special. How can a mere westerner ever comprehend?

A quick reminder of your thoughts appears in order.....

Originally Posted by DrB0b

I fully agree, intepreting these events in Western terms is more or less a waste of time. The rules are different, the background is different, the history is different. It is, of course, possible to be interested and involved but it does require some effort and understanding, bringing our western baggage to that study and effort doesn't help much, often quite the opposite.

If you don't understand the meaning of words then you shouldn't use them. "subdolousness and prevarication" (particularly subdolous, which means sneaky) are pejorative words, "adroitness" and "cognizance" are positive words. By describing Thais as people of "subdolousness and prevarication" and westerners as adroit and cognizant you are making a comparison (a false comparison, by the way) between Westerners and Thais to the detriment of the Thais.

What I said is nothing like you said, it contains no insults against anybody, veiled or otherwise, nor does it mean what you seem to think it means. To simplify it for you, what I said was "if you want to try to understand Thai society you should first try to understand the Thai idea of society."

wonder if the army will be on parade on 26th feb for the money decision

Originally Posted by DrB0b

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

No, I was referring to individual levels of skill in perception (westerners).....and also that the Thai's behaviour we observe is hardly unique to Thai's. Perhaps re-reading would be a useful activity.........

Their history aside (which I'm fully aware informs the present), people are pretty much the same all over the world, in their motivations, behaviour and expression.

You seem to be convinced (from your previous posts) that what transpires here is somehow special. How can a mere westerner ever comprehend?

A quick reminder of your thoughts appears in order.....

Originally Posted by DrB0b

I fully agree, intepreting these events in Western terms is more or less a waste of time. The rules are different, the background is different, the history is different. It is, of course, possible to be interested and involved but it does require some effort and understanding, bringing our western baggage to that study and effort doesn't help much, often quite the opposite.

If you don't understand the meaning of words then you shouldn't use them. "subdolousness and prevarication" (particularly subdolous, which means sneaky) are pejorative words, "adroitness" and "cognizance" are positive words. By describing Thais as people of "subdolousness and prevarication" and westerners as adroit and cognizant you are making a comparison (a false comparison, by the way) between Westerners and Thais to the detriment of the Thais.

What I said is nothing like you said, it contains no insults against anybody, veiled or otherwise, nor does it mean what you seem to think it means. To simplify it for you, what I said was "if you want to try to understand Thai society you should first try to understand the Thai idea of society."

Amusingly it is you that has failed to understand what I meant.

It may shock you to discover that I'm particularly adept at understanding what I mean. I chose my words very carefully.

You over-interpreted, as you are often seen to do with those you have issue with. Your eagerness to criticise or have a dig at someone you've taken a dislike to clouds your judgement.

Where you've failed considerably is in your comprehension of this sentence....

"the degree of adroitness and cognizance of the westerner would be more important variables to consider I'd wager."

I've highlighted the important bits for you, to aid you in understanding...

I was actually inferring that not all westerners fit into your rather generalised opinion. Notice the use of degree and westerner. Westerner being a singular NOT a plural noun.

Here's a dictionary definition for you...

westerner definition
west·erner (wes′tər nər)
noun
a person born or living in the west

Maybe that was a little too subtle for your blunt wit.

Also there was no comparative usage in my statement whatsoever. That was your misinterpretation.

And finally, my use of pejoratives. Perhaps if I used simpler words it would aid you.

Lets try....

"The endemic subdolousness and prevarication is hardly difficult to discern. It can be found the world over."

Becomes......

"The all-pervading subterfuge and dishonesty are hardly difficult to appreciate. It can be found the world over."

Hardly insulting. An accurate statement on the human condition if anything.

Maybe you'll understand now. In simpler words, it suggests that the very thing you've described ("if you want to try to understand Thai society you should first try to understand the Thai idea of society.") are rather easily understood as such behaviour/attitudes etc exist everywhere in the world.

Your postulation is highly flawed. Thai society is easily understood. Perhaps you should try studying a bit of psychology.....then perhaps you'll see that what I've suggested is in fact true.

Oh good lord. You just wont accept it when you're wrong will you.

Very childish.

DrB oWNED !!!

seriously, I think we all agree that Thailand is dysfunctional, we just have a different explanation for it

As I didn't specify it was a Thailand only problem....and in fact made the point of it being a global phenomena, you are shown to be wrong on all counts.

You'll notice I used endemic in a descriptive manner, followed by the nouns "subdolousness and prevarication". It appears you're unable to understand its usage. Here's another dictionary reference for you....

Endemic

–adjective Also, en⋅dem⋅i⋅cal.
1. natural to or characteristic of a specific people or place; native; indigenous: endemic folkways; countries where high unemployment is endemic.

Definition: firmly fixed or held
Synonyms:
ingrained, inveterate, deep-rooted
Antonyms:
superficial, temporary


Please feel free to apologise for your insulting remarks, at a convenient moment. I'm here every day.

Btw you are utterly and totally......

How many times is it now?

Studying a bit of psychology. Naturally, the standard pursuit would be of a Eurocentric model. Passed on and interpreted as all cultural infrastructures should follow and abide by. I do wonder about the truer connective tissue and awareness of many here.....it's highly and collectively vacant.

^ Euro humanists ideology are based on universal understanding of what man stands for or should be. Asians never went that far, they are cognitively impaired, you can see it in the shopping malls or in the roads, they have no fucking clue where they are. Not even with Confucius and all those other funny guys in a Sarong.

*sigh* ....expected.