Israel expanding settlements.

**Cujo** · 17-02-2009, 01:58 PM

Is this meant to goad the palestinians.
It appears the Joos aren't interested in peace except on their own terms.

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip) Plans to expand a West Bank settlement by up to 2,500 homes drew Palestinian condemnation Monday and presented an early test for President Barack Obama, whose Mideast envoy is well known for opposing such construction. Israel opened the way for possible expansion of the Efrat settlement by taking control of a nearby West Bank hill of 423 acres. The rocky plot was recently designated state land and is part of a master plan that envisions the settlement growing from 9,000 to 30,000 residents, Efrat Mayor Oded Revivi said.
Israeli officials said any new construction would require several years more of planning and stages of approval.

The outgoing government of Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has said it reserves the right to keep building in large West Bank settlement blocsthat it wants to annex as part of a final peace deal with the Palestinians. Efrat is in one of those blocs.

The composition of Israel's next government is not clear yet, because last week's elections were inconclusive. However, right-wing parties are given a better chance to form a ruling coalition, with hard-line leader Benjamin Netanyahu as prime minister.
Netanyahu supports settlement expansion and has derided peace talks with the Palestinians as a waste of time, saying he would focus instead on trying to improve the Palestinian economy. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has called Netanyahu's approach unacceptable, and his aides said recently that peace talks can resume only if settlement construction is halted.

Israel seizes land for settlement expansion | Newsweek News | Newsweek.com

**Butterfly** · 17-02-2009, 02:00 PM

where is DaffyTheKunt when we need him ?

DaffyDuck · 17-02-2009, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by Dug

Netanyahu supports settlement expansion and has derided peace talks with the Palestinians as a waste of time, saying he would focus instead on trying to improve the Palestinian economy. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has called Netanyahu's approach unacceptable, and his aides said recently that peace talks can resume only if settlement construction is halted.

He's right, of course (Netanyahu), but not entirely so --- improving the Palestinian economy would seem far more important than quibbling over minutiae like plots of land (that the Paleys wouldn't be developing anyways), albeit he would probably get more cooperation from the *LEGITIMATE* Palestinian government, if he delayed, or just underplayed the land expansions.

Oh well...

**Bugs** · 17-02-2009, 04:51 PM

Sure there are Israelis that don’t want peace and they are expanding settlements. Just as there are Palestinians that don’t want peace – you know the one’s launching rockets and mortars at Israeli areas.

One of the big differences between the two IMHO is that if there are enough settlements and they occupy enough land, when the final boarders are drawn up for the two state solution Israel will end up with more – or at least get more concessions in return for tearing down the settlements. Whereas the rockets and mortars do little to nothing to improve the current or future position of the Palestinian people.

Note that generally speaking the folks building the settlements are typically not in favor of a two state solution – so increasing the boarders is not really their goal. They feel this land is theirs - given to them buy Yahweh or some such nonsense.

By putting the issue in the news Netanyahu may be just pushing the limits are far as possible to see just what Obama will let him get away with, or alternatively to make sure he has as much as possible to bargain with during talks with Obama.

**sabang** · 17-02-2009, 06:43 PM

This is a never ending story- Israel has in fact never ceased settlement expansion. The main difference is the rhetoric- bellicose governments like Sharon, Begin & Netanyahu make a song and dance about it, to please their Right wing constituents and political partners. More 'dovish' governments keep it more quiet, in fact the few times there is a real attempt to halt Settlement expansion it is stymied within the Israeli government and bureaucracy- the Department that oversees settlements & housing is quite openly sympathetic to the 'cause' of illegal settlement expansion, and wraps everything up with red tape and truculence. The IDF is reluctant to expel their 'own people' from illegal settlements. The Right wing loonie parties make a big protest in Parliament, and will bring down the governing coalition if they can. Sympathetic voices in the presss- especially the Jerusalem Post (Haaretz is much better) are on hand to blow it all up with righteous indignation. And so on- it really is a mess.

Looking at this from the Pali side does not require a great deal of imagination. On the one hand, you've got the UN, US & Israeli government giving vague assurances about a two state solution, based on the 1967 borders. Otoh, every single year the Jewish population of illegally occupied Palestine increases- existing settlements expand, new ones are set up. So what is even a reasonable Pali meant to make of this- obviously that Israel is whispering sweet nothings, Lies, to the Pali's & International community, whilst it proceeds regardless with the creeping colonialisation of Palestine. Which in turn makes the reasonable Pali's look like Fools to the people they represent, and the Hardliners who emphasize armed Resistance and insurgency look like the true advocates of the Palestinian cause to many. Which is exactly what I reckon the Israeli Right wants- because they then justify that to further expand Settlements because the resisting Pali's 'Don't want Peace'.

What bullshit- only the most naive can not see the smokescreen that is really happening here. It would be so damn simple for Daddy America to make it's annual aid to Israel, of which even the official figure is massive (And understated) contingent on there being a freeze or preferably reduction in the Jewish population of illegally occupied Palestine. This would be a big start in giving the average Palestinian faith in the Peace process, and those representatives of theirs (the majority) that favour diplomacy over armed Resistance and insurgency. But don't hold your breath.

I really hope the Obama administration has some Cojones, really the Islamic world has little reason to trust us otherwise.

**TSR2** · 17-02-2009, 06:50 PM

Israelis are very clever, play games, encourage uprising, seize more land, re-instate Israel,

**sabang** · 17-02-2009, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by Bugs

Just as there are Palestinians that don’t want peace – you know the one’s launching rockets and mortars at Israeli areas.

Not necessarily. Idiots is a better word, imo. Israel demonstrates little if any sincerity that it wishes for Peace, and a Palestinian state based on the 1967 borders as long as it continues with illegal Settlement expansion- which it does, every year. This in turn 'justifies' Palestinian armed Resistance- it feeds the militants over the Diplomats. Even Hamas has said it is willing to stop it's armed struggle for the establishment of a Palestinian state based on this model. Yet for every time I actually read this in the Western media, there must be twenty or more times I read that nonsense that Hamas only seeks the destruction of Israel.

**sabang** · 17-02-2009, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by TSR2

Israelis are very clever, play games, encourage uprising, seize more land, re-instate Israel,

Exactly. Except it is not really that clever. In fact, it is not clever at all.

**Butterfly** · 19-02-2009, 10:55 AM

good words, Sabang. Yes, it's a suicidal game for Israel, and this is not the first time they went through that stage. I think they will look at no less than their self destruction to be satisfied with themselves.

The Palestinians are the real noble cause here, the enemies are Israel.

**TSR2** · 19-02-2009, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by sabang

Originally Posted by TSR2

Israelis are very clever, play games, encourage uprising, seize more land, re-instate Israel,

Exactly. Except it is not really that clever. In fact, it is not clever at all.

A misinterpretation of my use of the word "clever" .I am not justifying Israels actions, I deplore them, I just do not see who can and how they can be stopped, they are far better equiped than the Arab states and far better militarily,

**Whiteshiva** · 19-02-2009, 02:23 PM

Perhaps the Palestinians should make a formal appeal to build their own settlements in Israel in retaliation.......?

**Butterfly** · 19-02-2009, 04:25 PM

^ they do already, while Israel is sending Bulldozers, they are sending rockets, perfectly legitimate IMO

**HermantheGerman** · 19-02-2009, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by sabang

I really hope the Obama administration has some Cojones, really the Islamic world has little reason to trust us otherwise.

As much as I like Obama, but I think he is already "Brandmarked". Like all U.S. Presidents before him.

**TSR2** · 19-02-2009, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

^ they do already, while Israel is sending Bulldozers, they are sending rockets, perfectly legitimate IMO

Oh you mean the bulldozers with 120 mm guns ? rockets cause little damage shells and bombs do, Israelis should not steal land, ah but they are Gods chosen people, he must have been pissed at the time,

**Bugs** · 19-02-2009, 10:27 PM

Well it is nearly a done deal - Netanyahu will likely be the new Israeli PM:

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide

Feb. 19 (Bloomberg) -- Two Israeli parties recommended to President Shimon Peres that he name Likud leader Benjamin Netanyahu to form the next government, bringing the party closer to commanding a majority in the 120-member Knesset.

“Netanyahu will be prime minister, but it will be a Netanyahu-Livni government,” said Avigdor Lieberman, head of Yisrael Beitenu, the third-largest party in parliament with 15 seats. He called on the former prime minister to bring Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni’s Kadima Party into his government.

Industry and Trade Minister Eli Yishai of the ultra-Orthodox Shas party that commands 11 seats said he told Peres that “Netanyahu will form the next government, bring in the partners and formulate the guidelines.”

Peres is meeting with the 12 elected political parties to hear their recommendations for prime minister before he decides who should lead the next government. He plans to meet all the parties by the end of today.

The Feb. 10 elections gave Kadima a one-seat lead over Likud, leaving neither with a parliamentary majority and both in need of coalition partners. With the backing of Likud, Shas, Lieberman and the Jewish Home party, Netanyahu has 56 seats.

Livni and Netanyahu met with Peres in Jerusalem last night, after the president was informed by the Central Elections Committee that the results of the vote were published in the official government registry.

Opposes Rotation
Lieberman said he opposed the idea of a rotation agreement in which Netanyahu and Livni would join forces and each serve for two years as prime minister. “Tzipi will have to get used to the idea that it will not be a rotation government,” he said.

“I will not serve as a fig leaf for a government of paralysis,” Livni said in response. She pledged not to stray from the party’s policy of “advancing a peace process and fighting terrorism,” wherever she ended up, indicating she may prefer to take her party into opposition.

Parties that share Netanyahu’s skepticism toward the current peace negotiations with the Palestinians, which include Yisrael Beitenu, won 65 seats in the election.

Labor Party leader Ehud Barak, who supports Livni’s efforts to reach an agreement with the Palestinians, said last night in remarks broadcast on Army Radio that his faction wouldn’t recommend anyone to Peres as the next prime minister. Barak said that Labor, which holds 13 seats, prefers to be in opposition given the election results.

Under Israel’s system of proportional representation, the number of seats each party receives is determined by the percentage of the national vote it wins.

The president can give the prospective prime minister 42 days after the elections to enlist enough parties to form a parliamentary majority. If the designated premier fails to reach a majority the president can pass the task to another candidate.

And another linky:
Benjamin Netanyahu endorsed as Israel PM - Telegraph

Not only did Lieberman give his support and his parties 15 seats, but Eli Yishai of the Shas party tossed in his 11 seats for good measure.

**pickel** · 20-02-2009, 02:02 AM

Originally Posted by Bugs

Well it is nearly a done deal - Netanyahu will likely be the new Israeli PM:

What is it that Israel really wants? Because this sure as hell isn't going to stop the rockets. Netanyahu and his cronies can only hold power as long as the rockets are flying. Things that make you go hmmm.......

**Butterfly** · 20-02-2009, 09:46 AM

Excellent, Netya will become the next PM. That should accelerate Israel descent into hell, couldn't happened to a better bunch of kunts.

**Bugs** · 20-02-2009, 10:53 AM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Excellent, Netya will become the next PM. That should accelerate Israel descent into hell, couldn't happened to a better bunch of kunts.

If it does accelerate their descent into hell, one can bet they will take as many Palestinians with them as possible (if not all of them), along with as many of their neighbors as well.

The world economy won't help matters either. As times get tough people look for places to lay blame or at least to vent, and it seems the Palestinians are an easy place for them to vent (regardless of the lack of connection between the Palestinian people and the problems at hand). Maybe next time around they'll finally go whole hog and simply flaten Gaza once and for all? Then again maybe they'll decide to take out their frustrations on Iran?

**Butterfly** · 20-02-2009, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by Bugs

If it does accelerate their descent into hell, one can bet they will take as many Palestinians with them as possible

they are already in some sense, but now it will destroy completely the little credibility they have left. They will be responsible for another genocide with the world watching and doing fuck all as usual. It's still better than killing Palestinians one by one and claiming some kind of moral high ground because they are the "promised land".

**Butterfly** · 20-02-2009, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by Bugs

Then again maybe they'll decide to take out their frustrations on Iran?

they wouldn't dare do that one, retaliation in their little shithole would be bigger than any small air strike. It's like watching a clumsy bully playing with fireworks,

**Bugs** · 20-02-2009, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Bugs

If it does accelerate their descent into hell, one can bet they will take as many Palestinians with them as possible

they are already in some sense, but now it will destroy completely the little credibility they have left. They will be responsible for another genocide with the world watching and doing fuck all as usual. It's still better than killing Palestinians one by one and claiming some kind of moral high ground because they are the "promised land".

The world has sat back and watched for decades now, and will likely continue to do so. But as long as Israel was killing them off one, by one, they could at least reproduce faster than the killing took place. If Israel goes down, one can bet the killing will happen faster than the reproduction takes place.

**Bugs** · 20-02-2009, 11:21 AM

Originally Posted by Butterfly

Originally Posted by Bugs

Then again maybe they'll decide to take out their frustrations on Iran?

they wouldn't dare do that one, retaliation in their little shithole would be bigger than any small air strike. It's like watching a clumsy bully playing with fireworks,

Problem is that clumsy bull might figure out how to launch just enough fireworks to start a big enough fire to engulf the world.

**keda** · 20-02-2009, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Bugs

Well it is nearly a done deal - Netanyahu will likely be the new Israeli PM:...

Haven't been following but can't see Netanyahu doing much to break any deadlock. Still, better him than a Livni that even talks of the remote possibility of Israel giving half of the country in exchange for peace and security.

**sabang** · 20-02-2009, 03:26 PM

^ I'm not in the mood to maul, but I would remind you of the actuality, being returning half of somebody elses country.

**TSR2** · 21-02-2009, 07:03 AM

Originally Posted by keda

Originally Posted by Bugs

Well it is nearly a done deal - Netanyahu will likely be the new Israeli PM:...

Haven't been following but can't see Netanyahu doing much to break any deadlock. Still, better him than a Livni that even talks of the remote possibility of Israel giving half of the country in exchange for peace and security.

Why not? they stole it in the first place, if you treat it as spoils of war great, but it does not solve the situation, the Zionist dreams put the region and the world in danger,
Why are you so pro Israeli , you a Yid or shagging one

Thread: Israel expanding settlements.

Thread Tools

Display

Israel expanding settlements.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

Posting Permissions