Thread: All American friends are possible targets

Originally Posted by blackpanther

Originally Posted by ceburat

There is no US Aggression - Just a response.

sorry..i don't like simple answers....but

Maybe you don't like the truth of what I said.

Originally Posted by ceburat

Soldiers doing their duty are guilty of nothing.

I think you will find that soldiers doing "their duty" by dutifully following orders can well be found guilty in a court of law on lots of grounds.

But maybe not US soldiers, who's government will never release them into other duristictions to face trial.

Originally Posted by ceburat

No they do not know or they would not fire.

This contradicts directly what you said earlier.
So is it ok to shoot women and children to get to the armed enemy, or is it not?

Originally Posted by ceburat

The fact that I think the killing is wrong now that I am a christians in no way makes me blame the innocent US Soldiers.

So it is wrong, though you do not blame the soldiers? I can agree with this.
But, if it is wrong, why do you advocate doing it so strongly? Are you a Christian now, or not?

Originally Posted by ADare

When you have war Civilians will be killed. When the USA / UK / major power kills them, they justify it as collaterol damage. In this instance they justify it by saying they could not help it / they were human shields.

On the other hand when the "terrorist" kills civilians they act morally outraged saying there is no justification for it. Lot's of posters come on here and say the are cave men / devils / whatever.

These acts of terror can be morally justified!

All killings and death in this way (war) are to me abhorent.

In my mind the US / UK / major powers should be looking and striving to solve these conflicts in other ways than war. Unfortunately I cannot see any of them doing this.

Instead of people saying good on our soldiers for killing the bastards, we should be encouraging our governments to find a different solution.

Do you have the solution? Easy to talk. What do you do in meantime, lay down and play dead or worse be dead????

I have no easy solution, I am sure there is not one.

What is happening at this moment is not working, the problem is getting bigger and bigger and bigger. The major powers are extending the scope of their operations and this can only exagertate the problem.

There is a solution out there that does not involve the continued killing of more and more people. It may mean the the major power has to give something up, maybe money, food, resources and start to share with the rest of the world.

This they seem unlikely to do. They act like little children at times "this is my toy (money / power) and i am keeping it". As adults we try to teach our children to share things, so that our kids will not fight. Maybe we need to teach our governments to share things too.

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ceburat

Because it is wrong is you know innocents are your target. If the enemy is your target, no problem.

What if Americans are the enemy? Don't they "support the troops", just as the other civilians support their fighting men?

Yes and when they do so, if they are killed it is their own fault.


Maybe what you meant was armed enemy,

Yes


but then, you still have to make the conscious decision to shoot at unarmed "innocents" as well. I am surprised how unfamiliar you are with the intricacies of this issue, are there no questions and controversies amongst Christians on this?

Christians I know do not fight. No killing. No war. You seem to have a hard time understanding that I was millitary a long time before I was a christian. What I did then as a soilder or would do now as a soilder is much different then what I would do as a christian. Now that I am a christian I would not go to war.

Originally Posted by ceburat

You seem to have a hard time understanding that I was millitary a long time before I was a christian.

What I have a hard time with, is making out the Christian behind the (indoctrinated) soldier who seems to do most of the posting here.

Originally Posted by machangezi

..... and seeing the Merikan fuckwits killing innocents around the world proves what?

that 2 wrongs do not make a right.

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ceburat

No they do not know or they would not fire.

This contradicts directly what you said earlier.

There is no contradiction. You seem to think that the US always knows that innocents are there and fires anyway. Wrong. They fire at the enemy only and do not know innocents are there.

So is it ok to shoot women and children to get to the armed enemy, or is it not?

Not if you know innocents are there.

Originally Posted by ceburat

The fact that I think the killing is wrong now that I am a christians in no way makes me blame the innocent US Soldiers.

So it is wrong, though you do not blame the soldiers? I can agree with this.
But, if it is wrong, why do you advocate doing it so strongly? Are you a Christian now, or not?

You are the one who says I advocate doing it so strongly. I am only taking the side of the soilder since I was one before and I don't believe or put up with any of this anti-American, anti-US Military BS.

Originally Posted by ceburat

There is only one God. His name is the Lord Jesus. And no he did not start the war.

And you're a brainwashed monkey, I spit on the bible, the coran, the torah, Jesus and any other liars who have generated the biggest mass killings in the world history.

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ceburat

You seem to have a hard time understanding that I was millitary a long time before I was a christian.

What I have a hard time with, is making out the Christian behind the (indoctrinated) soldier who seems to do most of the posting here.

The only thing you have a hard time with is being something besides anti-American and anti-religion. You don't like my post because I tell it like it is and don't hold back. Clear your head of these anti attitudes and you could see the world much clearer.

Originally Posted by Wallalai

Originally Posted by ceburat

There is only one God. His name is the Lord Jesus. And no he did not start the war.

And you're a brainwashed monkey, I spit on the bible, the coran, the torah, Jesus and any other liars who have generated the biggest mass killings in the world history.

You are completely ignorant. You will bow down before the Lord Jesus someday and have a completely different attitude, but you will bow down. Hopefully of your own accord.

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ceburat

The only thing you have a hard time with is being something besides anti-American and anti-religion.

You may have noticed I defended American civilians in this thread, I think it is wrong to kill them.

I agree.

And I challenged you on your switching between your attitude as a former soldier and your present one as a Christian, the comments are pretty contradictory.


Nothing contradictory. I thought one way as a soilder and now I think different as a christian. My defending the soilder, American way, etc is because I do not like the anti-american attitude. Amreica is always wrong is BS. America is right. If you don't want America in your back yard fighting then leave them alone.

Seems I hit a sour spot there, good if it makes you reflect on your attitude.

No sour spot. No reflection.


No, you don't "tell it like it is", you are expressing your opinions, which don't match. You need to clear your head of your military as well as religious indoctrination and make your mind up for yourself.

Just because I am a christian does not mean that I have to join the liers of the world and condem USA, UK for every thing they do. I made up my mind about many things long ago. Indoctrinated. Ha stroller, you can read the same Bible I read and come to the same conclusions. How is that being indoctrinated.


And I sincerely wish you all the best with this task for your spiritual growth.

Thank you

Originally Posted by ceburat

No sour spot. No reflection.

That's a pity.

Originally Posted by ceburat

Just because I am a christian does not mean that I have to join the liers of the world and condem USA, UK for every thing they do.

Noone suggested such.

Originally Posted by ceburat

Ha stroller, you can read the same Bible I read and come to the same conclusions. How is that being indoctrinated.

I don't think so. Believing this is part of your religious indoctrination.
Being so cock-sure about the US military actions being right and the 'fault' lying entirely with the 'enemy', is part of your military indoctrination.

Sad.

i think machas friends would be a bit disappointed if every muslim was put to death in a country after some misguided muslim fundamentalist chap decides to do a suicide bombing and kills some innocent people out shopping.

and anyway macha i dont really understand why you should use the term paki. is it normal in pakistan to describe one of your own as a paki?

Originally Posted by slimboyfat

i think machas friends would be a bit disappointed if every muslim was put to death in a country after some misguided muslim fundamentalist chap decides to do a suicide bombing and kills some innocent people out shopping.

This is, more or less, what a number of Westerners, including some on this forum are advocating.

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ADare

Can this action be morally justified, yes I think it can.

Which part would you take?

Justify killing random US civilians, let's put personalities to them - Buad Hai, Milkman, Hillbilly, Surasak, FriscoFrankie.

Deserving of yet another green. That's the second time on this topic. I see a hat trick in the making.

Originally Posted by ceburat

Originally Posted by blackpanther

Originally Posted by blackgang

Hezbollah fighters only fire rockets from populated areas that is home to many civillians and only have their bases and compounds and seek out fire fights in populated areas

so they should play the queensbury rules?

expose youselves lads to our superior firepower so we can wipe yer dirty filty upsurgent (ain't that a new word for freedom fighter btw??) ass off the earth!!!!!!


ya got them all in one bomb!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They should not play by the queensbury rules. What they should do is quit hiding behind women and children to do their dirty work, hoping that no one would fire back. When the enemy does fire back they cry - you shot innocent women and children, not, you shot back at the enemy. All blood shed from this type of fighting is directly on the hands on the fighters hiding behind the women and children.

Utter bullshit! Haven't you heard Hassan Nasrullah's speech when Israel invaded? He openly challenged Israeli forces. He asked the Israelies not to target civilian population (but Israel put it the other way round that civilians are killed cos Hezbollah fighters are hiding behind women and children). He called for a man to man fight on ground which Israel never responded to. Now you don't want me to upload the news?

Originally Posted by stroller

Originally Posted by ceburat

Which "religion" needs to be convinced? You already know the answer to that one.

Yes, I know your answer to that.
Maybe it's not the religion itself, but some of its misguided followers, who need to be talked out of medieval sentiments like "an eye for an eye"?

Medieval sentiments? Mind suggesting any solution to the US aggression then? Are you suggesting we should offer an eye to uncle sam and when it's chopped off we offer another then our arses?

..... and if it's not about eye for an eye then why do we see the whole American army inside Afghanistan? Aren't they their to take revenge?

By the way, IMO the Americans need a lesson (although I am not a supporter of war) for invading a country on false grounds. I am talking about Weapons of Mass Disgrace (WMDs)!