Thread: What Will It Take To Get Rid Of ISIS?

Yeah I watched it, she'll change her tune when she gets into office and the weapon manufacturers put $$'s in her eyes... just another bent slag in the making.

You're still wrong about Putin though Harry, obviously

Originally Posted by Neo

Yeah I watched it, she'll change her tune when she gets into office and the weapon manufacturers put $$'s in her eyes... just another bent slag in the making.

You're still wrong about Putin though Harry, obviously

I'm spot on but you Putin apologists will never admit it.

Originally Posted by OhOh

A Turkish plane, allegedly, shot down a Russin plane, allegedly, in Turkey.

https://www.rt.com/usa/323324-hollan...sis-terrorism/


"Ankara alleges that Turkish F-16 fighters on combat air patrol shot down one of the Russian planes after it violated Turkish airspace for "17 seconds," says the letter."

Due of course to the law than a sovereign state's borders and air space are inviolate.

As harry and others have stated:

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Because they were flying in Turkey?

“Turkey, like every country, has the right to defend its territory and its airspace,” US President Barack Obama, admitting that he had no specifics yet on the incident involving the Russian jet."

Either the POTUSE is lying or NATO SOP are that any incursion in NATO countries airspace, by unidentified airplanes, will be dealt with by shooting them down. One wonders whether the radio communications and radar evidence will be published by both parties, Russia and NATO. One may also wonder if any communications were held between NATO command, Turkish command or Russian Command centres, as we are led to believe that the "hot lines" do exist.

One also wonders whether Syria will now follow similar ROE. I would hope for a 10:1 display of Syrian "defense of it's territory and airspace" will follow. Their are ample targets for the President to select from. Unfortunately the LORD seems very reluctant to take this step, even if asked by the Syrian President.

No wonder the French brought an aircraft carrier to the scene and the Ameristan carrier is steaming through the Med to arrive on station.

Hopefully a Chinese sub won't pop up in the middle of the Ameristan carrier group.

Stop your moaning OhOh.

Putin was warned before to stop flying over Turkey. He's even had a drone shot down.

If he can't command his own troops properly, he should step down.

If he thinks he's bigger than NATO, bring it on.

apparently the violation of airspace lasted 17 seconds,

not sure why warning the pilot for 10 min after that 17 seconds violation resulted in him being shot down

fucking idiot Turks,

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

I'm spot on but you Putin apologists will never admit it.

Two wrongs don't make you right Harry.

Must be some connection between getting rid of isis and russian plane getting shot down by turks. No idea what it is but we have 4 threads talking about it. Carry on. Reckon I'll just have to read them all.

We need a megathread.! just needs a snappy title

Originally Posted by Dragonfly

apparently the violation of airspace lasted 17 seconds,

not sure why warning the pilot for 10 min after that 17 seconds violation resulted in him being shot down

fucking idiot Turks,

That would be the second violation then, the radar track clearly showed them circling round.

They were given ample warning.

Must have had a death wish.

Or they believed all this bollocks their dear leader told them about how everyone is frightened of him.

Originally Posted by Neo

We need a megathread.! just needs a snappy title

How's about ...

Crises in the Levant megathread

The "warnings" were apparently/allegedly given while the planes were in Syrian airspace.

In a letter to the U.N. Security Council, Turkey said it had shot down the jet while in Turkish air space. Along with a second plane, the aircraft had flown more than a mile into Turkey for 17 seconds, despite being warned 10 times in five minutes while approaching to change direction, the letter said.

Turkey downs Russian warplane near Syria border, Putin warns of 'serious consequences' | Reuters

“Air strike decision on hold until we decide what to call the bad people” – PM.



David Cameron is expected to table an urgent commons vote this week to decide the next name to give to the terror group, formally known as ISIL.

The terrorist organization has undergone a series of radical name changes over the last 3 years as their PR machine struggles to find a universally acceptable brand.

Having been known as the ‘So called Islamic State’ for several months now, the so called Prime Minister is understood to think that’s not a very tidy name for a bunch of bloodthirsty psychopaths.

He is favouring the name ‘Daesh’ since it was used by French President Francois Hollande in the wake of the Paris terror attacks.

“Daesh is considered a derogatory term by the group themselves.” said Mr Cameron outside Downing Street today, “And I firmly believe it is in the interests of British security to call them by a name they don’t like.”

However, Labour Leader Jeremy Corbyn has argued for a more conciliatory moniker. In a statement he said “While I agree that these are very naughty people, calling them nasty names will only make them sad, and that is something my conscience can’t agree with.”

As US, French and Russian forces continue to hammer the region back into the stone age, talk of the UK joining in with air strikes will be put on the back burner until the new name has been agreed.

A Conservative Party think tank commissioned a special phone vote on ITV’s ‘This Morning’ programme, which determined the public’s favourite suggestion to be “Caliphate of Ultra Nationalist Terrorists in Syria”.

This is expected to be put to the commons vote, just as soon as a suitable abbreviation can be decided upon.

Link

Russian Crackdown on Muslims Fuels Exodus to IS

Security forces in Russia's southernmost republic of Dagestan keep devout Muslims under surveillance, routinely raid their homes and haul them to police stations to give DNA samples and fingerprints.

So it was no surprise to many in the village of Komsomolskoye that Rashid Magomedov fled to Syria to join the Islamic State group, leaving behind a pregnant wife and two children.

The 30-year-old had been detained several times, spent two months in jail on charges that later were dismissed and complained that police repeatedly planted weapons at his home as a pretext to arrest him.

"The fact that he left for Syria -- the police are to blame. They wouldn't leave the boy alone," said Magomedov's father, Zaynudin.

more here Russian Crackdown on Muslims Fuels Exodus to IS

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

That would be the second violation then

Wow, look whose counting airspace violations. Any other countries on your list that violate a sovereign countries airspace, Turkey for one is a multi serial action man at this heinous crime against humanity.

Maybe a spread sheet is required here sir, set it for home work sir, please, please........ the crack of a board cleaner hitting Plot Toys head was the only thing that was heard for a moment or two in Por 2 that morning.

Harry was taken in cuffs to the local police station and never heard of again in Chunburi district. Emails keep appearing, allegedly from him, but a short search reveals a Langley IP address.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

That would be the second violation then

Wow, look whose counting airspace violations. Any other countries on your list that violate a sovereign countries airspace, Turkey for one is a multi serial action man at this heinous crime against humanity.

Maybe a spread sheet is required here sir, set it for home work sir, please, please........ the crack of a board cleaner hitting Plot Toys head was the only thing that was heard for a moment or two in Por 2 that morning.

Harry was taken in cuffs to the local police station and never heard of again in Chunburi district. Emails keep appearing, allegedly from him, but a short search reveals a Langley IP address.

Don't overthink it Ohoh, they went round in a big fucking circle is all.

The Syrian government, with assistance from the legitimately requested P$+ 1 coalition, is continuing to attack the terrorists close to the Turkish border.


Some of the terrorist openly acknowledge their Turkish roots and the assistance that the Turkish government have and continue, to give them.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/syr...&NewsCatID=352



"Emrah Çelik, a 27-year-old district organization member of the Justice and Development Party (AKP) in northwestern Tekirdağ province who joined the Turkmen forces voluntarily, said the 2nd Coastal Division has been fighting against regime forces for the last seven months.

“We are defending Turkmen Mountain and our region against powerful countries, al-Assad, who has the backing of Russia and Iran, the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant [ISIL] and the Democratic Union Party [PYD], despite all impossibilities under harsh conditions. Turkey has always been accompanying us. We are staying up all night in tents and at positions. Despite all the tough conditions, Turkmen Mountain will not fall and, God willing, Turkmens will be victorious. We are also handing out aid to the locals. Our priority is the peace and comfort of our people,” said Çelik."

The drug pusher is the crusader coalition and the pimp is NATO

A free Turkish press may help.

Cumhuriyet daily?s Dündar, Gül arrested over report on Syria arms transfer




"The editor-in-chief of the Cumhuriyet daily, Can Dündar, and the paper's Ankara representative Erdem Gül have been arrested on charges of being members of a terror organization, espionage and revealing confidential documents -- charges that could see them spend life in prison.

"We have been arrested!" Dündar tweeted after the 7th Penal Court of Peace ruled to arrest the two men pending trial, complying with prosecutor İrfan Fidan's request. Dündar and Gül were taken to the Silivri Prison after the court's decision. "Don't worry, these are medals of honor for us," Dündar was also quoted as saying by Cumhuriyet's website.

CHP İstanbul deputy Mahmut Tanal said the arrests mark a “coup” staged against the press. “It is the massacre of the law to launch an investigation and now rule for the arrest of the two journalists with special orders,” Tanal said, referring to the government’s role in the prosecution of the journalists.

Opposition People’s Democratic Party (HDP) also condemned the arrests in a joint statement by its co-leaders, who said the ruling once again revealed that judicial mechanisms are under the influence of President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan and the Justice and Development Party (AK Party) government.

The Platform for Independent Journalism (P24) immediately condemned the court decision as a severe blow to freedom of press in Turkey. “Is there still anyone who would say Turkey media freedom?” it asked on its Twitter account.
The International Press Institute (IPI) said “journalism was arrested,” after the court’s decision. IPI's Turkish National ComMİTtee said in a press statement on Thursday that it is the job of journalists to obtain and publish documents that would serve the public interest. “As journalists, we stand in solidarity with Dündar and Gül, who just performed journalism,” the statement said.

The articles, published on the daily's front page, reported that the trucks in question were intercepted by gendarmes on two occasions in January 2014 after prosecutors received tip-offs that they were illegally carrying arms to Syria. There have been allegations that the arms were going to extremist groups fighting against the Syrian regime. Ankara, on the other hand, insisted that the trucks were carrying aid to Syrian Turkmens and branded their interception as an act of “treason” and “espionage.”

Dündar continued, “First the government responded saying: ‘No there is nothing of the sort. This is aid. Then it was revealed that these were guns. Then they said that these were going to the Turkmens. Then the present deputy prime minister, Tuğrul Türkeş said, ‘I swear to God they [the trucks] were not going to the Turkmens.' … Then later the Turkmens said they did not receive any arms.”

Alternatively, let the crusader coalition decide the borders of Syria. After all they have been so successful in destroying or "containing" terrorism in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Sudan ....... for th past 20+ years.


I know Ameristan has difficulty in distinguishing between a state and a sovereign country but to suggest that the terrorist organisation, responsible for butchering, maiming bombing ...... law abiding citizens of the world, will become Ameristan's 53 state and by de facto part of NATO is somewhat disturbing?

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/25/op...nni-state.html

John Bolton: To Defeat ISIS, Create a Sunni State


"Today’s reality is that Iraq and Syria as we have known them are gone. The Islamic State has carved out a new entity from the post-Ottoman Empire settlement, mobilizing Sunni opposition to the regime of President Bashar al-Assad and the Iran-dominated government of Iraq. Also emerging, after years of effort, is a de facto independent Kurdistan.

If, in this context, defeating the Islamic State means restoring to power Mr. Assad in Syria and Iran’s puppets in Iraq, that outcome is neither feasible nor desirable. Rather than striving to recreate the post-World War I map, Washington should recognize the new geopolitics. The best alternative to the Islamic State in northeastern Syria and western Iraq is a new, independent Sunni state."


"Years of effort" to bring such a place into being , by the crusader coalition.


Who the fuck is the third world empire Ameristan to decide the borders of a sovereign country why are the they body to determine what is feasible or desirable?


Islamic State's Achilles' heel: Its Sunni identity - LA Times


Islamic State's Achilles' heel: Its Sunni identity


"But Islamic State's hold on Raqqah, in Syria, and Mosul, Ramadi and other cities in Iraq has not been shaken. They are primarily populated by Sunni Arabs (admittedly with a large Kurdish minority in Mosul) who see Islamic State's rule as a better alternative than domination by vengeful Alawite or Shiite militias backed by Iran."


The terrorist's hold certainly hasn't been shaken by the crusader coalitions non-actions that's for sure. The P4+1 efforts may have a somewhat different outcome.




Partition Syria to crush the Islamic State: James Dobbins
Partition Syria to crush the Islamic State: James 2



"This ceasefire in place, representatives of all the Syrian factions should assemble under United Nations auspices to design the future Syrian state. Given the differences among these factions, this process could take years. In the interim, each faction should govern the territory it holds, while the external parties should undertake to ensure no internal party seeks to expand its territorial hold."



Who the fuck is the crusader coalition to decide which terrorists gets to be "rewarded" by being given a piece of Syria? If the crusader coalition members feel so deeply about giving terrorist a place to call there own give them some of their own country.


The crusader coalition has certainly not "contained" or "stopped the expansion" of the terrorists for the past 20+ years.

Why should anyone believe they can or wish to do it now?

conclusion: it's a big fucking mess and we have no solution in sight

in short we are fucked until the next decade !!!

Originally Posted by OhOh

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Don't overthink it Ohoh, they went round in a big fucking circle is all.

The plane went from northern Russia south in the Atlantic, east into the med to Syria ( being escorted by Russian fighters), dropped it's payload and then flew north through Iraq and Iran, back to Russia.

What plane are you talking about?

Because the one that got shot down took off from Humaymim.

This is what the Turks say happened:



And this is what the Russians say happened.

Originally Posted by OhOh

see post #1313 - miss kit or search the net!

The backfire bombers that let loose some cruise missiles last week. There is another thread for turkey problem

Ah I see.

I have no doubt they bombed the odd IS target, gotta keep up the cover story you know.

Originally Posted by Dragonfly

conclusion: it's a big fucking mess and we have no solution in sight

in short we are fucked until the next decade !!!

Bite your tongue, Butters...
We've have all the knowledgeable experts, from every perspective, right here amongst us.
We're so blessed.

Originally Posted by Neo

Sometimes I think he's trying to play devils advocate, but mostly he comes across as having senile dementia

Left out in the sun too long probably , if he was playing devil's advocate, he would have to make sense sometimes.