Thread: Hot Water,whats the Best Method

Has anyone investigated hot water heat-pumps in Thailand?

A magical device that delivers more heat-energy than the electrical energy used.

The type you'd be looking for is known as an air-to-water heat-pump, not to be confused with the heat-pumps/air-conditioners used internationally.

I can't understand why the discussion. Solar hot water heating here is the obvious solution; just make sure you can mix it with cold water at the tap as it gets too hot sometimes.

I'm wondering if maybe there is some sort of financing, help, etc that can be gotten from the Ministry of Energy.

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

Instant gas water heaters or OK for the kitchen sink or for filling a bath but not reliable for constant temp requirement of a shower.

Again, not so sure about that. The showers in our house are brilliant; high-pressure and constant temp. Honestly the best showers I've encountered in Thailand save for a few hotels.

Nothing worse than a piss-weak, dribbling, shower with no pressure!

No matter which system you use. They all depend on a Good constant pressure supply.
So first you need to know how the water pressure is now. This is easy to test by using a pressure gauge.

If you have low pressure or intermittenly low pressure or a big pressure drop when you use two or more outlets at the same time, then you should go for the tank in the loft system a few of which have been describe above. i.e. Header tank in the loft and water cylinder below, or combination Header tank and cylinder combined.
An electrically heated tank on it's own still needs good water pressure.

But if you have a good constant water pressure. Then I still recommend Intant electric water heaters for the bath room showers and if you use lots of hot water in your sinks then go for an instant gas heater. You only need one gas heater to supply all your sinks if they have already been piped up. The running cost is much cheaper with this system. as I said before PM me if you need more info or detailed drawings.

Oh! I fogot to metion the solar powered systems.
Solar panels are good for heating your hotwater cylinder providing your cylinder is well insulated.They don't need direct sunlight just daylight or UV light is still good for converting light into electrical energy, But they are still very expensive and you need a lot of them.

Direct water heating by solar power also work but this is a little more complicated particlaly the water flow rate throught the heat exchanger tubes needs to carefully regulated i.e. to much flow and not enough heat, to little flow and the water can boil causing other problems. The Chinese are experts at making these systems, and they work very well. But also very ugly looking in your roof. The chinese don't seem to mind it looking ugly because they sell 10 million per year.

There are two types of solar hot water systems. Pressurised and gravity feed. The gravity feed systems are cheap [from China] but maybe a pain in the butt. The pressurised systems are better - and more expensive. The panels last 25+ years but the tank, etc will give you about 8 years of life. There are accessories that fit thenm to make sure the water doesn't burn your bum. In Thailand these things are perfect. send me an email [haydn[at]sutletgroup.com ] and I will put you on to a bloke in China who can help.

I'm in China now, been here Nine years.

As said, solar is an expensive option for a private household.

The instant shower heaters work fine, maybe a storage tank under the roof to take advantage of the sun's energy as an additional plus and equal out the pressure.

Find a sympathetic builder, it can be a nightmare to get them to do stuff they don't know, hence I dropped the idea of a roof storage tank - I wish I had been more assertive.

Originally Posted by SEA Traveler

There are various temp settings on the water heater so based on usage you have some options. I maintain the temp setting very low as the need and frequency for very hot water is rare but I do like something to take the edge off the cold water, especially for shaving and early morning showers.

mostly agree except that it is more efficient to set the temp higher and install a time clock set to go on for only a couple of hours at peak usage times during the day (say 1-2 hours in the morning and 1-2 hours in evening depending on usage) that way it will hold ample temp all the rest of the day and night especially with the warm temps here..

Originally Posted by watterinja

Has anyone investigated hot water heat-pumps in Thailand?

A magical device that delivers more heat-energy than the electrical energy used.

The type you'd be looking for is known as an air-to-water heat-pump, not to be confused with the heat-pumps/air-conditioners used internationally.

yeah and if your really clever like me you can recover the cold air being let off into the atmosphere (as it works the reverse of an A/C discharging cold air instead of hot..) and use it to cool your house like an A/C for no extra money..just vent it up at roof height back into your house..

Originally Posted by DrAndy

some tanks will not take the pressure of a pump and will break after a few years, so need to be gravity fed, check on that

have a "bypass" installed with a valve so you can adjust it to make perfect temp every time and reduce pressure on the system...
the bypass will allow a given amount of cold water to bypass the entire system, easily done, problem solved..done with any type of boiler system as well..

Originally Posted by SEA Traveler

Originally Posted by DrivingForce

Originally Posted by SEA Traveler

There are various temp settings on the water heater so based on usage you have some options. I maintain the temp setting very low as the need and frequency for very hot water is rare but I do like something to take the edge off the cold water, especially for shaving and early morning showers.

mostly agree except that it is more efficient to set the temp higher and install a time clock set to go on for only a couple of hours at peak usage times during the day (say 1-2 hours in the morning and 1-2 hours in evening depending on usage) that way it will hold ample temp all the rest of the day and night especially with the warm temps here..

Wise and viable suggestion. Too easy to do as well.

unfortunately here it may be slightly more complicated as finding a decent time clock that can handle that amount of amperage is questionable so it may need to go through a contactor and be energized by the time clock.

but overall still quite simple and not too expensive relatively speaking over your potential savings..

For cost effective solar for the D.I.Y enthusias.Check out the coolthaihouse .com blog site.Really good site if you are doing any type or building or D.I Y.
Tried to post you the link but apparently I have to have 5 or more posts?

Thailand - Expat Builders' Guide and Forum

Yes, a good site.

Originally Posted by Issan Man

Just been sat thinking about what method to use for heating Water for Showers,and Running Hot Water in the Kitchen and Bathrooms.I know that I could use Electric Showers,but what about the Various Hot Taps that will be in the House?.Is there a way of heating water using a Solar Panel coupled to some kind of Storage System?Also does Anyone use or know about installing Solar Panels to provide Electricity in Thailand?

Check with Yoy Toy he uses solar water heaters in some of his houses.

I would like to contribute a little to this thread as welll....
When we build our house we installed a 80 ltr electric water heater (2.5 Kw max power consumption),it did cost around 10.000 as i remember....the place where we bought it in Surin,also had the piping and fittings needed for the setup.....
Until now both med and the wife are very pleased with having hot water where ever we need it....
I our old house we had these on demand water heater in the bathrooms....but as i remember in the cold season it couldt heat the water so that it was actually what i would call warm water....but now.....a nice steaming hot bath if that is what i want.......
I can see a problem installing an extra piping system in an already finished house...but if building a new house i sure woulde recommend having installed a hotwater system allover the house while constructing it
just my point of view....


Claus

Originally Posted by DrivingForce

Originally Posted by DrAndy

some tanks will not take the pressure of a pump and will break after a few years, so need to be gravity fed, check on that

have a "bypass" installed with a valve so you can adjust it to make perfect temp every time and reduce pressure on the system...
the bypass will allow a given amount of cold water to bypass the entire system, easily done, problem solved..done with any type of boiler system as well..

sorry, I do not understand that! bit thick me.

The problem with the tanks is that the pumps switch on and off depending on the useage. This causes variations in pressure which makes the tank move slightly in and out. This eventually leads to failure. How does a bypass help this?

as for perfect temperature, there is not one! for a shower or for washing up you need diferent temps, I suppose. And in cloudy weather the water temp itself is lower.

Originally Posted by DrAndy

The problem with the tanks is that the pumps switch on and off depending on the useage. This causes variations in pressure which makes the tank move slightly in and out. This eventually leads to failure. How does a bypass help this?

as for perfect temperature, there is not one! for a shower or for washing up you need diferent temps, I suppose. And in cloudy weather the water temp itself is lower.

well of course that advice is subjective and I really haven't seen your system first hand just basing my advice on your post..there should not be that much expansion directly on the tank, but if there is, than a bypass can help regulate that pressure by allowing some water to bypass them altogether. If a valve is installed in the bypass once it is adjusted to the amount of pressure you have coming in without damaging expansion it should no longer have such expansion and contraction extremes anymore and should extend the tanks life..

as for the temp of course it is also subjective, of course I was speaking in general terms but certainly it shouldn't be so hot as to burn bums....

Originally Posted by Issan Man

Just been sat thinking about what method to use for heating Water for Showers,and Running Hot Water in the Kitchen and Bathrooms.I know that I could use Electric Showers,but what about the Various Hot Taps that will be in the House?.Is there a way of heating water using a Solar Panel coupled to some kind of Storage System?Also does Anyone use or know about installing Solar Panels to provide Electricity in Thailand?

The instant electric heaer that we had got dropped when it was rmoved to tile the bathroom.
I went and bought a Bosch or AEG brand heaterand wired and plumbed it my self.
very easy. very cheap.
There are plenty of DIY solar heaters on the net.. Some as somple as a coil of black poly pipe. Maybe that is the answer

Yes, that is a can do. However, one still needs a decent ground or one will probably get a tingle or two in the future.