Thread: Cuba

Originally Posted by Driventowin

Originally Posted by Milkman

Originally Posted by Driventowin

Originally Posted by blackgang

spics

Spics is actually a more common slur used in describing Puerto Ricans my friend..As wetbacks refers to Mexicans, etc..

SPIC:

Spanish, puerto rican, Indian, Cuban.

Wetback:

An illegal Mexican alien who "swam across the Rio Grande" river, and his/her back is still wet.

Actually the wetback term could be much disputed as it was more commonly referred to by the way they wet their hair back, when I lived in San Diego..

Oh well hell what do I know I'm only from South Florida for more than 42 years and never referred to a Cuban as a Spic...But then again I never referred to a Puerto Rican as one either.. I only know of others who used it commonly..
In spite of other false claims to the contrary, I'm not up on racial slurs and racist nics..

I might add one more caveat. I'm quite certain I mentioned the words "more common" in that post..And not the word "exclusively"...

I guessed you are from back east. My experience with the word wetback has to do with their backs being sweat soaked from day labor. I've heard spic and beaner applied to Mexicans. There's other stoo.

Originally Posted by Milkman

As expected, Raul is implemented slow but steady changes in Cuba.

Good to see another commie country admit that they've fecked up the lives of millions by making changes in the direction of how things were before their ilk got into power.

Originally Posted by Milkman

A couple of days ago, I noted that I believed, that a country that doesn't allow mobile phones is "odd." I was put down for stating this by a poster, who went off topic and started talking about "weird Americans." Well, sorry. I still think it's odd for a country to ban mobile phones among citizens. Why is this the case?

Burma allows it's citizens to buy phones. provided they can pay the application fee.

For a nonBurmese the fee is approx $5000.

Obviously it is all about control of information.

Why are there two million Cubans living in the USA while nearly no Americans live in Cuba?

Why are there millions of Canadains living in America and only a handful in Cuba?

People vote for societies by where they choose to place their asses.

Eastern Europe duing Communist rule, North Korea and Cuba today uses its armed forces and police to keep people from leaving, while in the USA we use the armed forces and police (in various forms) to keep people out who want in.

Anyway, there will still be supporter of the Cuban government due to the sole reasoning that it is the "enemy" of the USA.

But saying that, The USA's economic sanctions have not worked and have given the opponents of freedom and democracy a propaganda tool. Time to reevaluate.

Originally Posted by Bugs

And they certainly did not bring about regime change, but that does not mean that they have not worked. At the very least they have had a negative impact on the Cuban economy.

And made the lives of the ordinary Cubans worse, no?

Bugs

I hope the purpose of the sanctions was to bring about regime change or at least policy changes and not to weaken the economy and harm average Cubans. Otherwise, some of the anti-american rhetoric would be legitimate.

I have a belief Americans are basically good-intentioned people and foreign polices are created with a view to doing the most "good" and are not intended to cause more harm than good. Of course, what is good is debateable and it is obvious that our government has not always created more good than harm despite the good intentions.

In my opinion, the sanctions made sense during the cold war when Cuba was a military ally of the Soviet Union, but now Cuba is not a military threat to the USA. Can change be brought quicker through trying to isolate or by trying to engage Cubans? I doubt there is a definate answer to this question.

Seems to me that engagement has a better record (assuming a military invasion of the country is a non-option) than isolation in bringing about positive change.

But I have not really studied the situation enough to say my mind is made up on the issue.

Originally Posted by Bugs

At the very least they have had a negative impact on the Cuban economy.

Quite an understatement really- The US, under normal circumstances, would both be Cuba's largest foreign investor and trading partner.

I've thought that the sanctions should have been ended for some time but, with Fidel dead and Raoul seemingly liberalising the country, there seems to me no point at all in continuing with them. As and when this happens, there will also be several opportunities for American business and entrepreneurs there.

Totally unrelated, but I love Cuban music and it is one of the few countries in the world that i am still curious to visit.

Originally Posted by sabang

with Fidel dead

Is he?

Originally Posted by Accidental Ajarn

assuming a military invasion of the country is a non-option

That should never be an option.

Well I am not of the mindset that seems to think that somehow one can attempt to punish the leaders of a nation without affecting the common folk of said nation – especially if the action taken is imposing sanctions. Of course the sanctions have had very negative impact on the common folks of Cuba.

Lot of talk right now about santions on Zimbawe and the Sudan - think those sanctions will have a positive impact on the average folk in those nations?

I am not saying it is not a worthwhile exercise to reexamine our current position. But I don’t think the US should lift the sanctions based solely on the impacts of those sanctions on the average Cuban, as it is pretty much a given that economic sanctions will negatively impact them.

Personally I think the US foreign policy as it relates to pretty much every nation south of our boarder has been a disgrace pretty much since there has been a US. Far too little has been done to secure strong relationships and build ties with those geographically closest to us. The Monroe Doctrine was the US telling the rest of the west to keep-out, but unfortunately the US has never done enough to fill in the void.

Originally Posted by pickel

Visiting the land of the not so free and having to hide the fact from the government of the land of the free. Ironic?.

Every country like it when anyone comes as a tourist and leaves money, no matter what kind.
You are not very smart are you??

Anytime a country has economic sanctions again another country they do not want their citizens going there and spending money.

You really are not very smart are you??

sorry, double post,, to much lightening I guess

Originally Posted by sabang

there will also be several opportunities for American business and entrepreneurs there.

Sabang, incase you did not know,,American business interests and America doing business in Cuba, mainly Havana was the reason for the Fidel uprising and the take over of Cuba in the first place.

But no great loss for the US as they had Las Vegas to take over.

But Cuba is a nice place to visit and the broads do have a fine rack, as nice as you would want to see north of Rio.

Originally Posted by blackgang

American business interests and America doing business in Cuba

Casinos, prostitution, money laundering and drug dealing.
I think a safe majority of people do not have that in mind this time.

Originally Posted by blackgang

But Cuba is a nice place to visit and the broads do have a fine rack, as nice as you would want to see north of Rio.

Never been to Cuba but the 'racks' in Venezuela are real fine!

well they have sufficient darkie blood in Cubanas that they horn out fair at an early age, but also go to seed fairly early so you have to be quick and before 50 or it is all over because the Coopers Droop sets in right heavy about 45, that is unless they have had a couple of pickninnys,, then it can be before that.

Originally Posted by blackgang

Originally Posted by pickel

Visiting the land of the not so free and having to hide the fact from the government of the land of the free. Ironic?.

Every country like it when anyone comes as a tourist and leaves money, no matter what kind.
You are not very smart are you??

Anytime a country has economic sanctions again another country they do not want their citizens going there and spending money.

You really are not very smart are you??

I've no doubt that there are countries my (Brit) government would prefer I didn't visit but they haven't yet made it illegal for me to do so.

Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog

Is he?

I meant to put- with Fidel 'dead'.
He ain't dead, though he's said to be heading that way, but he's that most rare breed of revolutionary dictators- one who has voluntarily chosen to step down, and take no further part in public life. Raouls more liberal policies are already being noticed.

I didn't realise this though, he remains First Secretary of the Communist Party in Cuba. Really an honorary title, it might explain why the US hasn't made more moves yet to normalise relations with Cuba.

Aug 25, 2008
The Associated Press

HAVANA - Fidel Castro on Monday defended the Cuban taekwondo athlete who kicked a referee in the face at the Beijing Olympics, saying Angel Matos was rightfully indignant over his disqualification from the bronze-medal match.



Taekwondo officials want Matos and his coach banned for life from the sport. But Castro expressed "our total solidarity" for both Matos and his coach Leudis Gonzalez.

Matos was winning 3-2 in the second round when he fell to the mat after being hit by his opponent, Kazakhstan's Arman Chilmanov, and was disqualified for taking more than his one minute of injury time.

Matos angrily questioned the call, pushed a judge and then pushed and kicked referee Chakir Chelbat of Sweden, who needed stiches to repair his lip. Matos then spat on the floor and was escorted out.

Taekwondo officials called Matos' behavior an insult to the Olympic vision. Matos' coach countered that the match was fixed and accused the Kazakhs of offering him money.

Castro said the alleged bribery attempt gave Matos good reason to expect the judges to treat him unfairly.

"They had tried to buy his own coach," Castro wrote in his essay published in state media. "He could not contain himself."

Cuba is accustomed to winning golds in boxing, but settled this year for four silver and four bronze medals. Overall, Cuba took home only two golds, down from nine in Athens four years ago.

"I saw when the judges blatantly stole fights from two Cuban boxers in the semifinals," Castro wrote. "Our fighters ... had hopes of winning, despite the judges, but it was useless. They were condemned beforehand."

The ailing, 82-year-old ex-president also noted that defections have taken their toll, blaming "the repugnant mercenary actions" of promoters who lure Cuban boxers off the island with lucrative contracts.

And Castro hinted that big changes could be in order for Cuban sports, pledging a serious review of "every discipline, every human and material resource that we dedicate to sport."

"Cuba has never bought an athlete or judge," Castro wrote, adding that Cubans need to begin preparing now for London in 2012. "There will be European chauvinism, judge corruption, buying of brawn and brains ... and a strong dose of racism," he predicted.

***

A real class act there.

The Cubans that came to the US, especially the early ones, generally were rich. That's why they ran away from communism. Apropos of Am business interests, there wasn't a huge presence. The Spanish had been there for 450 years by already and were locally known as Cubans. Fidel (Dr. of law) wanted power and he got it. If it wasn't for Che he probably would eventually crowned himself king. He also came from a rich family.

Here is the story of a dissenting Punk Rocker. Finally Cubans were allowed to get mobile phones and computers. But you better be careful.

Jailed Cuban punk rocker to stand trial Friday
Aug 27, 8:26 PM (ET)

By WILL WEISSERT
HAVANA (AP) - Cuba has ordered jailed punk rocker Gorki Aguila, an outspoken critic of Fidel Castro and the communist government, to stand trial on Friday for "social dangerousness," a charge that could carry up to four years in prison.

Authorities arrested the 39-year-old lead singer of Porno para Ricardo at his Havana home on Monday, shortly after the band had completed work on a new album. Cuban law defines "social dangerousness" as behavior contrary to "communist morality," and police use it to detain offenders before they have a chance to commit a crime.

Performing songs with angry lyrics that poke fun at or openly insult Fidel Castro and his brother Raul, who became Cuba's president in February, Porno para Ricardo is banned from official Cuban airwaves.

Link: My Way News - Jailed Cuban punk rocker to stand trial Friday

Obama has shifted US policy on visits to Cuba and sending money to Cuba. But it seems we are still not allowed to send some cash to either of the Castro boys?

U.S. to allow travel, money transfers to Cuba - Focus on Cuba- msnbc.com

President Barack Obama is allowing Americans to make unlimited trips and money transfers to family in Cuba and easing other restrictions Monday, ushering in a new era of openness toward the island nation ruled by communists for 50 years.

The formal announcement was made by presidential spokesman Robert Gibbs and, in Spanish, by Dan Restrepo, the president's top aide on Latin American policy.

"The president would like to see greater freedom for the Cuban people. There are actions that he can and has taken today to open up the flow of information to provide some important steps to help that," Gibbs said.

Gibbs said Obama is only one part of the equation, with the White House calling on Cuba to do more as well.

Lessen dependence on Castro regime
With the changes, Obama aims to lessen Cubans' dependence on the Castro regime, hoping that will lead them to demand progress on political freedoms, the official said. About 1.5 million Americans have relatives on the island nation that turned to communist rule in 1959 when Fidel Castro seized control.

Republican Sen. Mel Martinez of Florida called the travel announcement "good news for Cuban families separated by the lack of freedom in Cuba." Likewise, he said, the change in remittances "should provide help to families in need."

Some U.S. lawmakers protested the changes, saying they could funnel money or goods to the Castro regime. Others, backed by business and farm groups seeing new opportunities in Cuba, wanted Obama to go farther and lift restrictions on travel by all Americans to Cuba.

Officials said Obama is keeping the decades-old U.S. trade embargo — for now, at least — arguing that that policy pressures the regime to free all political prisoners as one step toward normalized relations with the U.S.

Restrepo said U.S. policy toward Cuba "is not frozen in time." He had no timetable for when future decisions might be made.

Sending money to senior government and Communist Party officials remains prohibited under Obama's new policy

I don't have a strong opinion on this one way or the other. But I do think they need to go all-in, one way or another. Either cut them off completely - no cell phones, no family visits, no remittances - period. Or work towards normilized relations. This might be the opening of the door of going all-in towards normalizing relations with Cuba in the long-long run?

Originally Posted by pickel

Visiting the land of the not so free and having to hide the fact from the government of the land of the free. Ironic?

Interesting way of looking at it . . . and quite appropriate

Originally Posted by Bugs

And they certainly did not bring about regime change, but that does not mean that they have not worked. At the very least they have had a negative impact on the Cuban economy.

And, as was said previously, had a disastrous effect on the standard ofliving of ordinary people - without the desired effect of regime change

Originally Posted by blackgang

American business interests and America doing business in Cuba, mainly Havana was the reason for the Fidel uprising and the take over of Cuba in the first place.

See next post:

Originally Posted by sabang

Casinos, prostitution, money laundering and drug dealing.

As well as numerous other one-sided exploits

Originally Posted by who

The Cubans that came to the US, especially the early ones, generally were rich. That's why they ran away from communism.

The US got a whole boatload of inmates from Cuba's prisons . . . no need to execute them, send them to the US instead . . .


I find it quite surprising that the US has this attitude, one would have thought that Cuba under Batista would be the perfect country to invade militarily as he was both a corrupt and dangerous man . . . who eventually fled the country with $700 million.

His friends, among others, were Albert, The Mad Hatter, Anastasia, Vito Genovese, Lucky Luciano . . .

Surprisingly the US denied him his request to live in exile in the US, which might give you an indication of how bad this guy really was . . .

I don't care about Cuba.

Castro was/is over-vilified and also over-rated. Raul will slowly make changes. And has purged many loyal to Fidel and the communists are getting older. Still, screw Cuba.