US Presidential Campaign 2008

**chinthee** · 21-02-2008, 11:26 AM

Now watching the daily show Jon Stewart on TVU.

John Brokaw is on and says this is the worst the Republican party has ever been for the past 8 years. He says Bush has been the most divisive Republican President in history.

**Hootad Binky** · 21-02-2008, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by Mr Earl

The NYT published under pressure from the New Republic!

The leak could've also originated from the the Evangelicals, who are going to have a field day with this.

Anyone remember Gary Hart?

**Jet Gorgon** · 21-02-2008, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by raycarey

Originally Posted by Mr Earl

because I hate Al Gore and John Kerry.

why because they actually had the courage to serve in vietnam? what is it you were doing at the time?

55555
"Mr. Gore enlisted in the Army on Aug. 7, 1969, reporting to Fort Dix, N.J. He was based at Fort Rucker, Ala., working as an information specialist. For a reason neither he nor the military can explain, Mr. Gore would remain at Fort Rucker for a lengthy period awaiting orders." "When they finally came, he would spend less than five months in Vietnam, arriving on Jan. 8, 1971, to write newspaper and magazine articles. He was discharged on May 24, 1971." (The Washington Times National Weekly Edition Nov. 28 - Dec. 4, 1994)

A five month stay in Vietnam is less than half the normal tour. Gore asked for and received an "early out" that May at a time when the 20th Engineers were standing down as part of a gradual U.S. troop reduction. (Washington Post. 12/31/99 pg. A1)

Ya, and we all know of Kerry's illustrious career in Nam.

Originally Posted by Mr Earl

I think GWB was dealt a tough hand.

Originally Posted by raycarey

he dealt it to himself.

he's the one who decided to invade iraq even though it had nothing to do with 9/11

he's the one who decided to stay on vacation in texas during hurrican katrina

he's the one who didn't veto a single outrageous republican spending bill

he's the one who used wedge issues to divide the country...and while it won him re-election '04, he hasn't accomplished anything.

he made his bed, and now...well, you know how it goes.

[/quote]

Ray, you just like to rag, don't you? I'm surprised you missed the "Bush was in an elementary class when 9-11 happened and he did nothing."

GW has kept the country together. I'd rather have been in the US under his command than in the UK or Europe struggling under mega taxes and warming my feet at a one-bar heater. The US has always given hope and support to people who want to start their own business. The liberals will dampen these dreams by taxing the crap out of these people and giving tax dollars to welfare cases.

I wonder, are you a welfare case, Ray?

**KID** · 21-02-2008, 11:44 AM

dem. party ain't lookin that good either---- maybe mrs. spears will jump in the race at the last moment

**chinthee** · 21-02-2008, 11:45 AM

[quote=Jet Gorgon;540715][quote=raycarey;540665]

Originally Posted by Mr Earl

I wonder, are you a welfare case, Ray?

This is a legitimate question.

**Jet Gorgon** · 21-02-2008, 12:08 PM

^ Hey, that was my Q, not MrEarl's!

**sabang** · 21-02-2008, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by njdesi

I am not sure if Bush represents an aberration from core Republican values, or if he represents what the party has evolved into, a mix of nativists, religious zealots, authoritarians, and corporatist.

Me too. It seems the Dem's are more about fiscal conservatism and balanced budgets lately.

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

GW has kept the country together.

Oh Jet. Like CT, I too used to be staunchly conservative. They changed, not me.

**AntRobertson** · 21-02-2008, 12:23 PM

[quote=chinthee;540721][quote=Jet Gorgon;540715]

Originally Posted by raycarey

Originally Posted by Mr Earl

I wonder, are you a welfare case, Ray?

This is a legitimate question.

No it's not. Not really.

**lom** · 21-02-2008, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

Originally Posted by chinthee

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

I wonder, are you a welfare case, Ray?

This is a legitimate question.

No it's not. Not really.

Ah, but if your on welfare then you should only keep your gob closed and be thankful

**Norton** · 21-02-2008, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

"When they finally came, he would spend less than five months in Vietnam, arriving on Jan. 8, 1971, to write newspaper and magazine articles. He was discharged on May 24, 1971." (The Washington Times National Weekly Edition Nov. 28 - Dec. 4, 1994) A five month stay in Vietnam is less than half the normal tour.

Yes a 5 month stay was less than half but his enlistment period was finished and so was discharged not rotated back to another military command.

**AntRobertson** · 21-02-2008, 12:35 PM

^^Your avatar change threw me there for a second.

But yes, you're right. Bunch of no-good, lazy ingrates. If they can't afford to live then they can't afford to have an opinion I say!

**raycarey** · 21-02-2008, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

GW has kept the country together.

is that what they tell you on newsmax.com?

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

we all know of Kerry's illustrious career in Nam.

i know i do. i also know that gore served....and i also know that earl didn't.

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Bush was in an elementary class when 9-11 happened and he did nothing.

too true.

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

I wonder, are you a welfare case, Ray?

why do you wonder that?

**raycarey** · 21-02-2008, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

No it's not. Not really.

not even remotely.....he's just embarrassed about being called out on the other thread.

**raycarey** · 21-02-2008, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by Norton

Yes a 5 month stay was less than half but his enlistment period was finished and so was discharged not rotated back to another military command.

hey, hey, hey! don't go ruining their fun with facts.

**Norton** · 21-02-2008, 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Ya, and we all know of Kerry's illustrious career in Nam.

Not sure we do. Please elaborate?

**lom** · 21-02-2008, 01:20 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

^^Your avatar change threw me there for a second.

Yea, the old one made people think I was not serious when posting.

**AntRobertson** · 21-02-2008, 01:22 PM

^ The change has made an immediate impression on me

**barbaro** · 21-02-2008, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

GW has kept the country together. I'd rather have been in the US under his command than in the UK or Europe struggling under mega taxes and warming my feet at a one-bar heater. The US has always given hope and support to people who want to start their own business. The liberals will dampen these dreams by taxing the crap out of these people and giving tax dollars to welfare cases.

1. I don't think GWB has held the country together - He's polarized and divided it further.

2. I cannot compare the US to UK and Europe with only one President. Different countries and cultures and histories geographic locations all together.

3. The Liberals are not in Congress, except for a few. The Welfare reform act in the 1990s, ended life-long welfare prgrams.

The GOP taxes the working and middle classes, and gives token tax cuts to the top.

**Hootad Binky** · 21-02-2008, 02:58 PM

^ Agreed.

**Hootad Binky** · 21-02-2008, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by Norton

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Ya, and we all know of Kerry's illustrious career in Nam.

Not sure we do. Please elaborate?

Military honors

During the night of December 2, 1968 and early morning of December 3, 1968, Kerry was in charge of a small boat operating near a peninsula north of Cam Ranh Bay together with a Swift boat (PCF-60). According to Kerry and the two crewmen who accompanied him that night, Patrick Runyon and William Zaladonis, they surprised a group of men unloading sampans at a river crossing, who began running and failed to obey an order to stop. As the men fled, Kerry and his crew opened fire on the sampans and destroyed them, then rapidly left. During this encounter, Kerry received a minor wound in the left arm above the elbow. It was for this injury that Kerry received his first Purple Heart.[21]

Kerry received his second Purple Heart for a wound received in action on the Bo De River on February 20, 1969. The plan had been for the Swift boats to be accompanied by support helicopters. On the way up the Bo De, however, the helicopters were attacked. They returned to their base to refuel and were unable to return to the mission for several hours.
As the Swift boats reached the Cua Lon River, Kerry's boat was hit by a RPG round, and a piece of shrapnel hit Kerry's left leg, wounding him. Thereafter, they had no more trouble, and reached the Gulf of Thailand safely. Kerry still has shrapnel in his left thigh because the doctors tending to him decided to remove the damaged tissue and close the wound with sutures rather than make a wide opening to remove the shrapnel.[22] Kerry received his second Purple Heart for this injury, but like several others wounded earlier that day, he did not lose any time off from duty.[23][24]

Eight days later, on February 28, 1969, came the events for which Kerry was awarded his Silver Star. On this occasion, Kerry was in tactical command of his Swift boat and two others. Their mission included bringing a demolition team and dozens of South Vietnamese soldiers to destroy enemy sampans, structures and bunkers. Running into an ambush, Kerry "directed the boats to turn to the beach and charge the Viet Cong positions" and he "expertly directed" his boat's fire and coordinated the deployment of the South Vietnamese troops, according to the original medal citation (signed by Admiral Zumwalt). Going a short distance farther, Kerry's boat was the target of an RPG round; as the boat beached at the site, a VC with a rocket launcher jumped and ran from a spider hole. While the boat's gunner opened fire, wounding the VC on the leg, and while the other boats approached and offered cover fire, Kerry jumped from the boat and chased the VC and killed him, capturing a loaded rocket launcher.[25][26][27]

Kerry's commanding officer, Lieutenant Commander George Elliott, joked to Douglas Brinkley in 2003 that he didn't know whether to court-martial Kerry for beaching the boat without orders or give him a medal for saving the crew. Elliott recommended Kerry for the Silver Star, and Zumwalt flew into An Thoi to personally award medals to Kerry and the rest of the sailors involved in the mission. The Navy's account of Kerry's actions is presented in the original medal citation signed by Zumwalt. The engagement was documented in an after-action report, a press release written on March 1, 1969, and a historical summary dated March 17, 1969.[28]

On March 13, 1969, five Swift boats were returning to base together on the Bay Hap river from their missions that day, after a firefight earlier in the day (during which time Kerry received a slight shrapnel wound in the buttocks from blowing up a rice bunker), and debarking some but not all of the passengers at a small village. They approached a fishing weir (a series of poles across the river for hanging nets), so that one group of boats went around left, hugging the shore, and a group with Kerry's 94 boat went around right along the shoreline. A mine was detonated directly beneath the lead boat, PCF-3, as it crossed the weir to the left, lifting PCF-3 completely into the air.[29]

James Rassmann, a Green Beret advisor who was aboard PCF-94, was knocked overboard when, according to witnesses and the documentation of the event, a mine or rocket exploded close to the boat. According to the documentation for the event, Kerry's arm was injured when he was thrown against a bulkhead during the explosion. PCF 94 returned to the scene and Kerry rescued Rassmann from the water. Kerry received the Bronze Star for his actions during this incident; he also received his third Purple Heart.[30]

After the crew of PCF-3 had been rescued, and the most seriously wounded sailors evacuated by two of the PCFs, PCF 94 and another boat remained behind and helped salvage the stricken boat together with a damage-control party that had been immediately dispatched to the scene.

John Kerry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

**Mr Earl** · 21-02-2008, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by raycarey

i know i do. i also know that gore served....and i also know that earl didn't.

Yep I avoided the draft by turning 18 in 1974! I did register per statute.
They stopped the drafting in February 1973.

According to Ray this makes me a draft dodger.

**raycarey** · 21-02-2008, 05:30 PM

why didn't you enlist earl?

and back to my question...is the reason you hate gore and kerry because they actually served, and you didn't?

**Boon Mee** · 21-02-2008, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by Norton

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Ya, and we all know of Kerry's illustrious career in Nam.

Not sure we do. Please elaborate?

Heh...

You won't get an answer from the 'usual suspects' on this one...

**AntRobertson** · 21-02-2008, 05:51 PM

^ Jet's one of the "usual suspects"?

**Boon Mee** · 21-02-2008, 05:53 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

^ Jet's one of the "usual suspects"?

Referring to your alter-ego...K. Ajarn aka raycarey...

Thread: US Presidential Campaign 2008

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