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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntRobertson View Post
    Probably another Musk promised development that won't eventuate anyways.
    Name one. He fulfills his announcements, though frequently not in the very optimistic time frame. Sometimes he changes course and does not deliver something but something better instead.

    Full self driving is not complete yet and won't be for a few years at a level that will get road permission.
    "don't attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by incompetence"

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers View Post
    Name one. He fulfills his announcements, though frequently not in the very optimistic time frame. Sometimes he changes course and does not deliver something but something better instead.

    Full self driving is not complete yet and won't be for a few years at a level that will get road permission.
    what announcements like "funding secured" ?

    https://seekingalpha.com/article/431...ything-matters

  3. #78
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers
    Name one. He fulfills his announcements, though frequently not in the very optimistic time frame. Sometimes he changes course and does not deliver something but something better instead.
    Well then I don't need to name any because you've just done it for me though for one I could ask where the Semi is that was supposed to begin production this year, later revised to next year (probably to be revised again at that).

    There seems to be a pattern forming of 'product launches', building hype, pumping the stock and gaining investment, taking reservation money (which is pretty shady of itself) and then... *Delays*

    There business model is iffy (though nothing against what they have actually released).

    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers
    Full self driving is not complete yet and won't be for a few years at a level that will get road permission.
    So there won't be 1,000,000 self-driving taxis on the road by next year then.

    That's two.

  4. #79
    I Amn't In Jail Plan B's Avatar
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    At some point the media coverage of angry, autistic, Scandi teens is gonna be enough to make governments & companies start to see the value in these vehicles, even if it is just to win votes/put a positive spin on their efforts to reduce carbon emissions.

    Long term, Elon's onto a winner here.
    Dear Anti-vaxers: Enjoy your free trial.

  5. #80
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plan B
    Long term, Elon's onto a winner here.
    Could be if electric comes out the winner ahead of other technologies like hydrogen (or anything else developed in the future).

    Might just be another Betamax Vs. VHS scenario.

  6. #81
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    Hydrogen and fuel cells are a bad joke. Maybe suitable for buses with well known distance/day. But even then batteries will be better.

  7. #82
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Seems quite promising to me, just lacking infrastructure currently really.

    James May is actually conducting his own real world experiment comparing hydrogen and electric currently so will be interesting to see his conclusions.

    Anyways who really knows. The next development could be endless renewable energy from flux-capacitors or something.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers View Post
    Hydrogen and fuel cells are a bad joke.
    There are hundreds of millions of dollars that are currently test that theory.

    I have an open mind about which will emerge as the best technology.

    Both Deisel and Petrol (and LPG/NCG) use an internal combustion engine.

    Both Hydrogen and Battery cars use electric motors.




    The one thing about this video's assumptions is that it doesn't take into account the cost of replacing the car's batteries, nor address their inefficiencies as they age.
    Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago ...


  9. #84
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    The thing is Tesla for all it hype hasn't been properly challenged in EV market. The japs and europeans autos and the US majors are treading a line between running down fossil fuel production units and gearing up for the enevitable full on electric - once that happens Tesla will face real competition.

  10. #85
    Member Bettyboo's Avatar
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    Many folks say, batteries are good for 10 years in a car - thereafter, they are good for another 10 years, at least, for stuff like storing solar power, etc. I don't know, never studied the science of it, but if that's so, it's moving in the right direction.

    Have we worked out a way to deal with nuclear power waste or are we still saying we'll sort that out later?
    How do I post these pictures???

  11. #86
    Thailand Expat AntRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bettyboo View Post
    Many folks say, batteries are good for 10 years in a car - thereafter, they are good for another 10 years, at least, for stuff like storing solar power, etc. I don't know, never studied the science of it, but if that's so, it's moving in the right direction.
    It's not really a directly comparison, but my current car is a hybrid and coming up about five years old. Those are obviously dual fuel and battery but I've noticed in this past year that the battery is increasingly inefficent -- takes longer to charge and holds the charge for less amount of time. If it keeps up then eventually it will just become and under-powered, over weight and inefficient petrol powered car.

    I think hybrids were kinda like the compromise for a lot of people but I don't think they're anything more than a stop-gap temporary thing. Not a viable solution or the future.

  12. #87
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    Tesla share value is now the second highest of all auto companies. Toyota still 1. by a wide margin. But they have surpassed VW, the second so far. I wonder how long they can stand that high.

    TSLA

    Today's High/Low $576.18/$567.43
    Market Cap 103,119,813,612

  13. #88
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    Tesla hits all-time-highs as TSLA shorts' losses beat US airline industry in 2020

    A company tracking the market found that Tesla short sellers, who have bet on Tesla shares slipping, lost ~$35 billion this year. More than the losses of the Airline industry in the US due to Covid 19. A bloodbath at unprecedented scale.

    Tesla shares stand yesterday at 641,76 USD. That's after they split 1 share into 5 shares so that a single share becomes more affordable to small investors. Pre split shares would now be $3,208,80.

    Daimler once saved Tesla with a $60 million investment. Today the share value of Daimler is just a small fraction of the value of Tesla. If they had not sold their Tesla shares long ago it would be a major asset for Daimler today.

  14. #89
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    It will continue this way for sometime to come. The truth is that Tesla stands alone and has no real competition at this point.

  15. #90
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    Tesla seems to be in front in both electric motor design and battery life. They were fairly behind in car body design and mass production. This is where they will start hurting when others catch up unless they improve their whole body construction design and production. I believe the model 3 is better.

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Cow View Post
    Tesla seems to be in front in both electric motor design and battery life.
    They are way out front there is no "seems" about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Cow View Post
    They are fairly behind in car body design and mass production.
    Behind in body design? That would seem to be subjective to me and with regard to mass production I would question that as well. Building ecars is not the same thing as building gas powered cars at all.

  17. #92
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    Tesla was behind in build quality probably, but they have caught up. They were ahead in body design for a while because they designed from the ground up for battery, while others adapted existing designs and production lines to electric as a poor compromise. Coming Model Y takes another step in that direction. When people still complain about Tesla it is mostly because other luxury brands use root wood and velvet for the interior. Tesla design is more minimalistic.

    The next big step will be a car more priced for the mass market. They aim for $25,000 for the european market. Funny enough, they sell more of the upper bracket in each class they offer. The versions with longer range, even if they cost substantially more. For 2030 Tesla aims at 20 million car sales, though, if they get to 10 million would already be a huge success. They need to build a facory or 2 every year, but they have the capital to do it with the present market cap.

  18. #93
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    I think the Tesla share price is insane.

  19. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers View Post
    When people still complain about Tesla it is mostly because other luxury brands use root wood and velvet for the interior. Tesla design is more minimalistic.
    This is spot on. The cars interiors are they way Elon wants them to be. He does not want Tesla to be another Rolls-Royce.

    Quote Originally Posted by Takeovers View Post
    They need to build a facory or 2 every year, but they have the capital to do it with the present market cap.
    Yes they are positioned to grow and will continue to do so while maintaining dominance in the ecar market for the foreseeable future as they poor a lot of money into r&d and since they are based in Silicon Valley they will maintain the tech edge.

    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    I think the Tesla share price is insane.
    It has been quite nice for me as I have been a shareholder since 2008.

    As I have stated before due to the fact that they basically have the market cornered with no legitimate competition their stock will continue to rise.

  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabang View Post
    I think the Tesla share price is insane.
    Elon Musk agrees. Just days ago he said it is overvalued. Doesn't change my gloating about the losses of the shortsellers. They flooded the media with fake news trying to talk Tesla down. No lies barred. Also does not change that Tesla is now very well established, no longer in danger of going down.

    Little story at the side. A friend of mine could not afford a Tesla. But his mother decided it is better to invest her lifes savings in buying one for him rather than wait until she is dead. What was left of her savings she invested in Tesla shares against dire warnings of her bank. Her savings are now higher than ever.

  21. #96
    Thailand Expat David48atTD's Avatar
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    Tesla’s worst enemy is Elon Musk. The serial entrepreneur has an affliction that many serial entrepreneurs have: Shiny Thing Syndrome.
    Mr. Musk loves to chase after new challenges and novel projects.

    Tesla is currently producing ...
    • 3 different cars,
    • wall chargers,
    • charging stations,
    • electric semi-trucks,
    • photovoltaic roofs, and
    • spearheading autonomous technology.


    Throw in the odd flamethrower, underground tunnels, and a new insurance product (not to mention Space X), and you see a leader not focused on doing the hard work of pushing his company through a crisis of scale, but a man obsessed with moon-shots and new projects.
    Scaling up production is the activity that is killing Tesla, but scaling up further is the only thing that can save it

    It should be noted that Musk has never operated any business at this scale before. Running a nimble online service such as Paypal is a very different thing than running a multinational car manufacturer — especially one that is exclusively pursuing new technologies.


    Quite frankly, Musk is not qualified to be CEO of Tesla any longer, and the mismatch of his skills to the company’s needs could not be worse timed for Tesla.

    Tesla is dying, and this is how it will end | Digital Trends

  22. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsnub View Post
    As I have stated before due to the fact that they basically have the market cornered with no legitimate competition their stock will continue to rise.
    For what it is worth:

    If you look at an E-car pioneer country like Norway, the competion is there.

    In Norway 61 % of all new cars are electric compared to Denmark where it is only 13,5 %.

    The competition is there.

    Tesla isn't number one as I read it. VW is

    As I said a pioneer country.


    Might be a market to follow, if you are interested in E-car shares

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    Data last updated: 2020-12-08 11:16:12

    Show 102550100 entries
    Search:
    Make and Model Today December 2020 Total % / total November 1-8 Nov Parallel Import (%)
    Nissan Leaf 11 132 5 874 64 875 18.66 % 674 122 19 026
    (29.33%)
    Volkswagen Golf 1 12 5 129 47 513 13.66 % 61 16 4 007
    (8.43%)
    Bmw I3 9 81 2 660 27 940 8.04 % 225 36 1 416
    (5.07%)
    Tesla Motors Model S 1 14 299 21 033 6.05 % 13 117
    (0.56%)
    Kia Soul 4 42 2 872 20 335 5.85 % 227 57 13 371
    (65.75%)
    Tesla Model 3 39 522 4 061 19 748 5.68 % 267 3 6
    (0.03%)
    Audi E-tron 13 134 9 181 14 794 4.25 % 579 123 604
    (4.08%)
    Renault Zoe 3 19 2 306 14 143 4.07 % 109 18 230
    (1.63%)
    Tesla Motors Model X 1 31 535 13 710 3.94 % 47 1 65
    (0.47%)
    Hyundai Ioniq 3 27 2 126 11 482 3.30 % 134 38 1 374
    (11.97%)
    Total 263 2 546 72 830 347 722 100 7 841 1 487 49 938 (14.36%)



  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by helge View Post
    Tesla isn't number one as I read it. VW is
    That may be the case in Norway but is not so for the rest of the world. Tesla is the world's largest producer of electric vehicles.

    Tesla becomes world’s largest EV automaker, surpasses China’s BYD


  25. #100
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    Tesla no 3 having a great day

    Registreringer av nye elbiler i Norge

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