Former Russian spy critically ill in Britain after exposure to unidentified substance

Renewed appeal for information from anyone who saw Salisbury victim's car


Renewed appeal for information from anyone who saw Salisbury... - Metropolitan Police"Police are renewing appeals for information from members of the public who may have seen the burgundy red BMW owned by the man found seriously ill in Salisbury.

Officers are today releasing a picture of Sergei Skripal's burgundy red BMW 320D saloon - registration plate HD09 WAO - about which they appealed for information earlier this week.


Sergei, 66, and his daughter Yulia Skripal, 33, were found seriously ill on a bench in Salisbury town centre on Sunday, 4 March. Scientists determined this to be the result of a military grade nerve agent. Both Sergei and Yulia remain in a critical condition in hospital.

A Wiltshire Police officer - Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey, who was among those first to respond to the incident - was also taken ill and remains in a serious but stable condition in hospital.


Met Assistant Commissioner Neil Basu said: "We are learning more about Sergei and Yulia's movements but we need to be clearer around their exact movements on the morning of the incident.


"We believe that at around 9.15am on Sunday, 4 March, Sergei's car may have been in the areas of London Road, Churchill Way North and Wilton Road. Then at around 1.30pm it was seen being driven down Devizes Road, towards the town centre.

"We need to establish Sergei and Yulia's movements during the morning, before they headed to the town centre. Did you see this car, or what you believe was this car, on the day of the incident? We are particularly keen to hear from you if you saw the car before 1.30pm. If you have information, please call the police on 101."


Anyone who has images or footage that may assist the investigation is asked to upload them at the secure websitehttp://www.ukpoliceimageappeal.co.uk

AC Basu continued: "In any investigation, the information we receive from the public can be crucial to helping the police build a picture of events and in this case the public response has been immense. Around 400 witnesses have already given statements, with hundreds more to be taken in the coming days.

"This is an extremely challenging and complex investigation and we currently have around 250 exceptionally experienced and dedicated specialist officers from the counter terrorism network working around the clock on this case.


"They are being supported by hundreds more officers from across the police family, as well as the military and other emergency services.

"To date, detectives have recovered 762 exhibits and are trawling through around 4,000 hours of CCTV. They are making good progress in what is a painstaking investigation that is likely to be ongoing for weeks, if not months."


Police have today released the following updated timeline of events (all times approximate):



14.40hrs on Saturday 3 March: Yulia arrives at Heathrow Airport on a flight from Russia.

09.15hrs on Sunday, 4 March: Sergei's car is seen in the area of London Road, Churchill Way North and Wilton Road.

13.30hrs: Sergei's car is seen being driven down Devizes Road, towards the town centre.
13:40hrs: Sergei and Yulia arrive in Sainsbury's upper level car park at the Maltings. At some time after this, they go to the Bishops Mill Pub in the town centre.

14.20hrs: They dine at Zizzi Restaurant.

15:35hrs: They leave Zizzi Restaurant.

16.15hrs: Emergency services receive a report from a member of the public and police arrive at the scene within minutes, where they find Sergei and Yulia extremely ill on a park bench near the restaurant.


As the investigation continues, the local community will continue to see a police presence at various sites across Salisbury, and also in Dorset where the military have been helping police remove a number of vehicles and items.


AC Basu explained: "Public Health England has advised that the risk to the public is low. I would like to reassure anyone who may be concerned by the continued presence of officers wearing specialist protective clothing that they are wearing this as a precaution and that it is not an indication of an increased risk."


Anyone with concerns regarding the ongoing police activity at these locations is encouraged to speak to any of the local officers or PCSOs at the locations, who will be happy to offer reassurance.


For the full advice from Public Health England, please see http://www.gov.uk/government/news/pu...s-in-salisbury




Three points:

1. "They are making good progress in what is a painstaking investigation that is likely to be ongoing for weeks, if not months." - The story will have disappeared from the daily news cycle, overtaken by more "topical" events. Sound familiar?

2. "A Wiltshire Police officer - Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey, who was among those first to respond to the incident - was also taken ill and remains in a serious but stable condition in hospital. - Not explanation of how or where the detective became involved and affected. Where was he was affected and what he was responding too at the time, hmmmmmmm? Some are alleging he was affected inside the attacked man's house.

3. "To date, detectives have recovered 762 exhibits and are trawling through around 4,000 hours of CCTV. - Unfortunately none from the main square in Salisbury? With open spaces and seats which suggests it would be a prime area to monitor normally, as many "incidents" may take place their every day. But I'm sure the police have records that would support the numbers of normal incidents and hence, by installing CCTV cameras, would or would not be justified. To keep the peace in the quiet, cathedral city of Salisbury etc. If they do have any CCTV cameras in the square, the attack on the two would "highly likely" be visible and any suspects possibly traceable. As, if administered at this point in location and time, this super CW which acts in seconds we are led to believe.

4. "police arrive at the scene within minutes" - All of them forget to turn on their cameras duh!

https://teakdoor.com/attachment.php?a...id=10466&stc=1

I leave the witness box to others, for the next witness to give any evidence to assist this high Court of TD, under the tutelage of The Honourable Judge Sir 'arry of "a nondescript ME entity" QC. I remain, at your service, should the need require a recall to the box.

Cheers and applause from the public benches. Flash explosion from the attendant news reporter's cameras and TV commentators shouting further questions.

Bedlam rules in a quiet High court in rural Wiltshire once again.
Sky news.

:)

And how do you know what evidence they do and don't have HoHo?

Are you still seething that you aren't important enough to have access to it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bsnub

He is not respected at all he is a crackpot and all you have to do is google his name to see it. As soon as I read this I knew he was a clown;

---

His CV:

"
Educational Background

• PhD, Columbia University
• MS, Columbia University
• MA, Columbia University
• BS, Cornell University

Publications

• Solution Structures of Lithium Amino Alkoxides Used in Highly Enantioselective 1,2-Additions. Bruneau, A. M.; Collum, D. B. J. Am. Chem. Soc. 2014, 53, 2885.
• Method of Continuous Variations: Applications of Job Plots to the Study of Molecular Associations in Organometallic Chemistry. Renny, J. S.; Tomasevich, L. L.; Tallmadge, E. H.; Collum, D. B. Angew. Chem., Int. Ed. 2013, 52, 11998.
• Enediolate-Dilithium Amide Mixed Aggregates in the Enantioselective Alkylation of Arylacetic Acids: Structural Studies and a Stereochemical Model. Ma, Y.; Stivala, C. E.; Wright, A. M.; Hayton, T.; Liang, J.; Keresztes, I.; Lobkovsky, E.; Collum, D. B.; Zakarian, Z. J. Am. Chem. Soc. 2013, 135, 16853.
• Azaaldol Condensation of a Lithium Enolate Solvated by N,N,N’,N’ Tetramethylethylenediamine: Dimer-Based 1,2-Addition to Imines. De Vries, T. S.; Bruneau, A. M.; Liou, L. R.; Subramanian, H.; Collum, D. B. J. Am. Chem. Soc. 2013, 135, 4214.
• Regioselective Lithium Diisopropylamide-Mediated Ortholithiation of 1-Chloro-3-(trifluoromethyl)benzene: Role of Autocatalysis, Lithium Chloride Catalysis, and Reversibility. Hoepker, A. C.; Gupta, L.; Ma, Y.; Faggin, M. F.; Collum, D. B. J. Am. Chem. Soc. 2011, 133, 7135.

Which maketh to hoist with his own petard are verily cardinal location herewith appear.

Hey

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxB1gB6K-2A

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhOh

His CV:

---

ZeroHedge is by far my preferred consolidator of news.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

And how do you know what evidence they do and don't have HoHo?

---

My paramountcy is under question? Who advances themselves above the angels?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Are you still seething that you aren't important enough to have access to it?

---

I moisten but a smidgen beneath unbounded firmament.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhOh

My paramountcy is under question? Who advances themselves above the angels?



I moisten but a smidgen beneath unbounded firmament.

---

Does Jeff teach a class in this shit or something?

:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bsnub

ZeroHedge is by far my preferred consolidator of news.

---

Whilst his academic qualifications are not in dispute, clearly he is another fucking tin foil whackjob.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bsnub

ZeroHedge is by far my preferred consolidator of news.

---

"What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Does Jeff teach a class in this shit or something?

---

Ask whomever they may be.

:)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

clearly he is another fucking tin foil whackjob.

---

Indeed he is and it is not hard to find simply by googling his name.

Digging further he has been accused of being a rape apologist and a homophobe by students.

LETTER TO THE EDITOR | On a professor?s misconduct | The Cornell Daily Sun

Quote:

---

He has tweeted support for Mike Cernovich, a rape apologist whose social media record includes statements like: “Have you guys ever tried ‘raping’ a girl without using force? Try it. It’s basically impossible. Date rape does not exist”

---

https://teakdoor.com/images/imported/...size=336%2c162

Quote:

---

He told a friend to “bring roofies” (a date rape drug) on a trip to Las Vegas.

---

https://teakdoor.com/images/imported/...size=336%2c174

This is the type of "highly respected" source that ohdo comes up with. :rofl:

BREAKING NEWS

In shock news, Russia’s President Putin has named the Agent who poisoned the Ex Spy in Salisbury.

When asked the killers name, he said Yukanol Fukov

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PAG

When asked the killers name, he said Yukanol Fukov

---

...mistransliteration...the original reads Yukan al-Fukov, a Chechen goat herd...

Paper from 1st of January 2017 where Iranian researchers synthesized Novichok agents.

Iranian chemists identify Russian chemical warfare agents - Ezine - spectroscopyNOW.com

Chemical weapons’ detection requires good analytical data


Chemical weapons, and their precursors, were banned by the Chemical Weapons Convention, which has been signed and ratified by nearly all the countries in the world. However, the illegal use of chemical weapons, whether by state agencies or terrorist organisations, remains a threat. Chemical weapons were used by Iraqi forces in the 1980s against Iranian forces and Kurdish civilians. Some chemical weapons, such as chlorine gas, are believed to have been used in recent years in the Syrian civil war.

Current databases include mass spectra of the more common chemical warfare agents; however, more work needs to be carried out on rarer agents. The so-called ‘Novichok’ agents are a range of highly toxic nerve agents developed in the Soviet Union in the 1970s and 1980s. The literature on their spectral properties is sparse.

The detection of chemical weapons may involve samples in which they are present at extremely low levels. Mass spectrometry is generally used for identification, typically GC/MS or LC/MS. Even with these techniques, identification may be difficult in situations where the molecular ion is weak or isomeric compounds could be present. It is important to recognise typical fragmentation pathways in order to reliably identify the compounds.

GC/MS and LC-MS/MS used for ‘Novichok’ agent detection

The Iranian researchers synthesised five ‘Novichok’ agents, along with four deuterated analogues. They were all O-alkyl N-[bis(dimethylamino)methylidene]-P-methylphosphonamidate compounds (i.e. molecules with the typical nerve agent phosphorus group coupled to N,N,N’N’-tetramethylguanidine). The O-alkyl group was varied, with the methoxy, ethoxy, isopropoxy, phenoxy, and 2,6-dimethylphenoxy derivatives being prepared. The syntheses were carried out on a micro-scale in order to minimize exposure.

Any proof that Russia did it yet.? :dunno:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Neo

Any proof that Russia did it yet.? :dunno:

---

Unfortunately we need proof they didn't.

And begbie posting fairytales isn't it.

Quote:

---

• Published: Jan 1, 2017

The authors succeeded in synthesising and obtaining detailed mass spectral data on a series of unusual nerve agents. The data have been added to the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons’ Central Analytical Database (OCAD).

---

Quote:

---

Published time: 13 Mar, 2018 19:02
The Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) carefully describes all known types of weapons-grade chemicals, including notorious sarin and VX, as well as their properties, mechanisms of action, and possible antidotes. But oddly enough, ‘Novichok’ – the substance supposedly deadlier than sarin or VX – is not on the OPSW <sic> nerve agents list.

---

And I look forward to our forum whackjobs disputing that because it's from RT.

:bananaman:

https://www.rt.com/news/421200-uk-no...t-allegations/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Unfortunately we need proof they didn't.

---

Ah the old ones are the best eh. Keep it up 'arry. I wont tell anyone you have a Cambridge First. Oops.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

And I look forward to our forum whackjobs disputing that because it's from RT.

---

"arry are OK, has the virus taken control of your brain?

Be very careful, delete the link, wipe your hard drive with a disinfected cloth and burn the cloth. Shower thoroughly, take a dump, burn any clothes worn whilst online to RT.

One more visit and you will be doomed forever. Doomed, doomed ........

On the other hand the TDART, (Teak Door Appreciation of Russia Today) group do sample great pizza. You do have to pledge secrecy and not name any of the RT clan. If you behave for your trial period we can show you how to access the RT hidden pages.

Answer this test question, "Is the UK statement, that Russia is the source, proven or not?"

Bsnub tried to join but was blackballed. That's why he constantly reds grandpa.

Post the answer on a blank web site and PM with the link.

:)

In simple terms:

A Russian nerve agent was used to try and kill a Russian spy who was an enemy of the Russian state.

Russia have been asked "Did you do it or did you lose your Novochik, and if so who to?".

Not a difficult question really.

Only the whackjobs think it's unreasonable.

good question harry... only problem, you don't like the answer :chitown:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

A USSR nerve agent was used to try and kill a USSR spy who was an enemy of the USSR state.

Russia have been asked "Did you do it or did you lose your Novochik, and if so who to?".

---

Fixed the first sentence for you. Maybe the leaders of the USSR should be in the spotlight.

The second to be true casts doubt on the certification of all countries, by the UN OPCW, which it has claimed have been clean for years.

For clarity here’s an extract from the Craig Murray interview on Radio 5

Stephen Nolan: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office have said to us tonight: “We have no idea what Mr Murray is referring to. The Prime Minister told MP’s on Monday that world leading experts at Porton Down had positively identified this chemical agent. It is clear that it is a military grade nerve agent of a type developed by Russia. None of that is in any doubt”. Well, you’ve already covered that Craig and you are zoning in on the fact that they are saying “developed by Russia”, they are unable to say whether it’s made – well they are not saying whether it was actually manufactured in Russia or the source of it or whether it was from Russia, right?”

Craig Murray Yes, exactly. No-one doubts that the Russians had the idea of making these things first, and worked on developing the idea. It has always been doubted up till now that they really succeeded. The Iranians succeeded under OPCW supervision some time ago and the chemical formulae were published to the whole world twenty years ago. So many states could have done it. The “of a type developed by Russia” thing means nothing, undoubtedly.

^

Do you have a link to the interview in full. Apologies if it has already been posted here.

Transcript of the programme at:

https://t.co/O1dnOuB2ex

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Begbie

The Iranians succeeded under OPCW supervision some time ago and the chemical formulae were published to the whole world twenty years ago. So many states could have done it. The “of a type developed by Russia” thing means nothing, undoubtedly.

---

For clarity (again): the OPCW have never received a sample of Novichok nor have they had a member state tell them they have it. Yet we are to believe some Iranians knocked it together and told the world 20 years ago?

Kneads careful handling, from Russia with glove.


https://teakdoor.com/attachment.php?a...id=10495&stc=1

BBC 5 Live 17 March 2018
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b09v5vgh

[00:10] The Main News: Russia tells 23 British diplomats they have to leave…
[00:37] The Prime Minister Theresa May says the government is considering its next move after Russia expelled 23 British diplomats. Moscow’s decision was in response to the UK saying the same number of Russian officials must leave following the nerve agent attack on a former spy in Salisbury.

Here’s the Shadow Foreign SecretaryEmily Thornberry:
I’m pleased that the government have now asked for the international community to verify this chemical attack so that there is clear evidence that it was Russia. At the moment it’s a prima facie case that it is, and the government is right to condemn them, and the government is right to take the action that the government has.

Police in Salisbury are renewing their appeal for any witnesses who may have seen Sergei Skripal’s burgundy BMW before he was found unconscious with his daughter Julia. The pair are still critically ill in hospital, and our reporter Tom Burridge is following investigations in the city:
They’re particularly interested in the car. We’ve seen a lot of work on the car by officers in specialist suits over the last few days, and we saw the car being towed late yesterday. What’s new is that they want to hear from anyone who might have seen the car earlier in the day – at around about 9:15, on three main roads.

[06:00] With Steven Nolan [SN]

[06:30] We’re starting tonight with a roll [??] over the Salisbury nerve agent attack, ‘cos former Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Julia remain critically ill in hospital. The debate over who was responsible, and the consequences of the attack, is raging. Russia is to expel 23 British diplomats. Their Foreign Ministry says UK staff will be expelled from Moscow within a week in response to Britain’s decision to expel 23 Russian diplomats. It also says it will close the British Consulate in Russia, which promotes cultural ties between the nations, and the British Consulate in St Petersburg.

The UK government says, ah, they were poisoned with a nerve agent “of a type developed by Russia” called Novichok. The Russian government denies any involvement in the attack.

Prime Minister Theresa May has been speaking about this today:
In light of their previous behavior, we anticipated a response of this kind, and we will consider our next steps in the coming days, alongside our allies and partners. But Russia’s response doesn’t change the facts of the matter. They attempted assassination of two people on British soil, for which there is no alternative conclusion other than that the Russian state was culpable. It is Russia that is in flagrant breach of international law and theChemical Weapons Convention.
I repeat today that we have no disagreement with the Russian people. Many Russians have made this country their home, and those who abide by our laws and make a contribution to our society will always be welcome. But we will never tolerate a threat to the life of British citizens, and others, on British soil from the Russian government.

While Russia is not at all disputing Britain’s claim that the Kremlin is most likely to blame for this, I speak toCraig Murray [CM], who’s a former British Ambassador to Uzbekistan

[08:40] Craig, good evening.

CM: Good evening.

SN: Good evening. So why are you not convinced Russia is behind this?

CM: We’ve clearly not seen enough evidence to come to a definite conclusion, and because Theresa May, as you just said, is obviously milking it for all it’s worth, trying to sound as Churchillian as possible, and to, you know, distract attention from the obvious state of the government in general.
When you see politicians jumping on a bandwagon, trying to become popular, getting well ahead of the evidence, then you have to be very skeptical.

SN: But why would the British government respond in this way if they weren’t certain?

CM: Because, as you just heard: it’s popular, they play it to advantage, and it fits in well with their current diplomatic stance against Russia anyway.

You have to listen very carefully to what they said. A phrase which you’ve repeated and they’ve used, that this is a weapon “of a type developed by Russia.”

They said that in parliament, they said it in the UN Security Council, and they said it in theJoint Statement by [Britain, France, US, and Merkel]. All those used the exact words: “of a type developed by Russia.”

And that’s true. You know I’ve got some vodka here, of a type developed by Russia, but it was made in Warrington. The OPCW (theOrganisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons) has always been of a view that there is no [definitive?] evidence that the Russians actually succeeded in synthesizing the Novichoks

Novichoks were successfully synthesized in 2016 by Iran, in a controlled programme with OPCW supervision, and reported by the OPCW, and if Iran can synthesize them, then so can many other countries, including the Uk, including the US, including Israel, and quite possible including a number of, you know, a states who might not be too careful of their security and what happens to them.

Also, we have to consider that there may be countries who had the motive in “setting up” Russia, and trying to damage Putin just as he gets re-elected, and perhaps trying to damage Russia’s international reputation in response to the role Russia has played in Syria.

So to say “this has to be Russia” is a nonsense. And what’s particularly pernicious is that they are trying to develop that by attempting to imply only Russia has this weapon – which is completely and utterly untrue. And the reason that they always have to use the same phrase: “of a type developed by Russia” is the scientists at Porton Downs refused to sign up to any stronger phrase, and there were very fierce Whitehall battles with the government trying to get them to say it was a Russian agent, and they wouldn’t, because it isn’t. They .. Well there’s no evidence of where it came from and who made it.

SN: The [NATO ??] General has told the BBC just yesterday that the Alliance had “no reason” to doubt the findings and assessments of the British government.

CM: Well of course. NATO is controlled by its member states, and France and Germany and Britain and America have made a political decision to go with this line. That’s not evidence. That’s politicians talking. And when they say: “of a type developed by Russia” that shows they haven’t said it’s made in Russia, they haven’t said it’s produced in Russia, they haven’t said it’s manufactured in Russia.

And no journalist at the BBC has said “Why do you keep saying ‘of a type produced by Russia’? Are you saying this is made in Russia?” No journalist at the BBC has asked the Minister, because the BBC is a puppet of state propaganda as well.

SN: Well, obviously I would reject that as one of the people who work for the BBC, and that’s just simply not true.

CM: Have you asked anyone from the government whether this is actually made, produced, or manufactured in …

SN: Well I haven’t had an interview with the Minister in the government, but if I did, I would. And you’re on the BBC tonight giving a counterview, so I don’t think there’s any point going down this red herring of that we are some type of state sponsored voice for the British government because that is palpably nonsense.

If it’s not Russia, who would it be Craig?

CM: Well as I said, there are a number of possible alternatives. One of them is it’s a non-state actor. It could be a Russian non-state actor. Obviously Mr Skripal sold the names of Russian agents to the [UA ??] for money. We don’t know the circumstances. Some of those agents could have been operating in conflict theatres, you know. People could have died because of this. So obviously he would have a great many enemies, not merely the Russian state itself.

But also, as I say, it could be another state, wishing to pin the blame on Russia, particularly with regard to Russia’s role in Syria. Could be … it’s a good time to undermine Russia, at a time when Putin appears to have played his hand very well and been, if you like, on the winning side of the Syrian conflict. And that brings in a great many states who have the motive to do Russia down.

SN: You mentioned Israel earlier on. We contacted the Israeli embassy. They said that any claims that Israel is involved in the attack in Salisbury are preposterous and ridiculous.

CM: Well no more preposterous and ridiculous than Russia. Israel has chemical weapons. Unlike Russia, Israel has never signed the Chemical Weapons Convention. Israel refuses to declare its chemical weapon stocks to the OPCW. It should be said Russia is a member, has signed the Convention. And 40,000 tons of Russian chemical weapons have been destroyed by the OPCW in a programme under OPCW supervision which finished last year. If it’s preposterous that Israel might do it, why is Israel one of a tiny handful of countries – including North Korea – which refuses to sign, or to ratify, the Chemical Weapons Convention. It’s not preposterous – it’s a possibility. I can by no means say “Israel did it” but it’s not impossible.

It’s not impossible quite a number of people did it. But jumping to the conclusion “it can only be Russia” is simply wrong when there’s simply been no evidence presented to make that clear.

SN: Stay there for us Craig.

Professor Ivor Gaber [IG] is a Professor of Political Journalism at the University of Sussex, and was involved withAlexander Litvinenko when he came to the UK.
Good evening to you Ivor.

IG: Good evening.

SN: Hi. Do you think Russia is responsible here?

IG: Oh, I have absolutely no idea. I have no knowledge of it specifically. I mean it looks ... on the balance of possibilities, I would even say probabilities, but that’s not what I know. All I can talk about was my experience with one ex-FSB agent and the insight he gave me into London has become, at the invitation virtually of both governments, the centre of a very shady mixture of oligarchs, of spies, of mafiosi. The mafia wasn’t entirely fictional and it’s not surprising that we see this spate of deaths, unexplained deaths of this class of people who we have welcomed in.

SN: [Technical issues re sound quality.]

SN: How does Russia operate – its politicians, its big business?

IG: I’m going to be one of those embarrassing interviewees who’s going to say that wasn’t my expertise, that wasn’t what I was writing about. I had a piece in theIndependent today. I was writing about my personal experience with Litvinenko and withBoris Berezovsky, and the insights that gave me into how this sort of swamp of Russian oligarchs, of spies, of gangsters, operate in London, and why I’m not surprise we’ve had all these unexplained and deaths and why …

SN: So how do they operate in London? Give me an insight into that then.

IG: Well … The insight that I can offer you is the way that Litvinenko explained it to me in terms of … how shall I put it, [c??] is the wrong word, that many of these oligarchs and people working … espionage agents, andChechen separatists, and other political activists, and gansters all know each other, they all have fairly affluent lifestyles, eating in the same restaurants, living in the same areas, know each other, and business is done and sometimes that business turns bloody. There is very close links one can see between people close to Putin and business oligarchs, some of whom settled here, and they fall out with Putin and sometimes meet an unfortunate end. It happened in the case of the one I dealt with – Mr Berezovsky.

SN:So Putin has the undisputed power, does he, if he wants to, to order the death of anybody? Is that what you’re saying?

IG: No, I’m not saying. I would not, I’m not sure, I could not see any advantage to Putin ordering the death of the MI6 agent in Salisbury. I can’t see any immediate reason why he’d do that, but I coud see that these people dabble in politics, they dabble in big business, and they get their fingers burned. And there might well be people close to Putin who felt he was an embarrassment and [??] get rid of him. But let me specify I do not know, and make no claim to know. I just had some passing acquaintanceship with that world, and I’m not surprised that we’ve had all these unexplained deaths.

SN: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office, Craig Murray, have said to us tonight “We’ve no idea what Mr Murray is referring to. The Prime Minister told MPs in Parliament on Monday that world leading experts at Porton Down had positively identified this chemical agent and it is clear that it is a military grade nerve agent of a type developed by Russia. None of that is in any doubt.”
You’ve already covered that Craig, and you’re zooming in on the fact that they’re saying “developed by Russia.” They are unable to say whether it’s … well they’re not saying whether it was actually manufactured in Russia, or the source of it was from Russia. Right?

CM: Right. No one doubts that Russia had the idea of making these things first, and worked on developing them. It has always been doubted until now that they really succeeded. The Iranians succeeded under OPCW supervision some time ago, and chemical formulae were published to the whole world 20 years ago. So, many states could have done it. The “of a type developed by Russia” thing means nothing. Undoubtedly.

I should say – and I agree with the good professor – and I think that Russia could have done this. Putin probably does have the power to do this, if he wanted to. And I think Russia definitely is a suspect. But that’s far from the same thing as saying “Russia did it.”

SN: Okay. Craig Murray and Professor Ivor Gaber, thank you very much indeed

Quote:

---

The Iranians succeeded under OPCW supervision some time ago, and chemical formulae were published to the whole world 20 years ago. So, many states could have done it. The “of a type developed by Russia” thing means nothing. Undoubtedly.

---

You keep posting this as if somehow it will magically become true.

But it isn't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

the OPCW have never received a sample of Novichok

---

Morning 'arry. You don't happen to have the chemical formulae of "Novichoke", do you old chap? The CAS RN + HS Code + Key, would be sufficient.

Novichoke is allegedly translated into english is "New Family". Allegedly numerous chemical bases/binary agents are used to create any one of the "New Family" chemical weapons. But of course you may know more than I.

It would make the search of the attached database somewhat easier. Being chemists they use chemical names and pretty schematics to describe the things, not 8 letter, punchy, Russian sounding words.

Here is a snapped image example for what's required:

Typical chemical name:

1-Isobutyl-3-methylbutyl isopropylphosphonofluoridate

and a typical screen shot of picture of one of the 1,500 odd chemicals spread over 54 pages:

https://teakdoor.com/attachment.php?a...id=10503&stc=1

Looking forward to you clarifying and you substantiating your assertion. Or are you just being obstructive?


:chitown:

https://www.opcw.org/fileadmin/OPCW/..._Oct_2014_.pdf

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

For clarity (again): the OPCW have never received a sample of Novichok nor have they had a member state tell them they have it.

---

Doesn't the USA have it? I understood they obtained it, along with Uzbekistan, when they cleaned up the manufacturing site in 1999? I could be wrong.

https://www.sott.net/article/380244-...-Plant-Cleanup

Has ameristan admitted it to the OPCW?

:)

Yesterday the UK government finally went down the internationally agreed official route, calling in the OPCW. Lets await the report, should be available in a month or so.

:england:

In addition the announcement includes a further allegation:

"The Foreign Secretary revealed this morning that we have information indicating that within the last decade, Russia has investigated ways of delivering nerve agents likely for assassination. And part of this programme has involved producing and stockpiling quantities of novichok. This is a violation of the Chemical Weapons Convention."

As per-normal in these things, one hopes they share the "evidence" with the OPCW ,to support this claim.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/i...o-arrive-in-uk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhOh

Has ameristan admitted it to the OPCW?

---

Best if you don't tell. You can then take advantage of it when you need it.

Trump reckons the russkies did it.


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rmer-spy-video

Video in the link

Donald Trump pointed the finger at Russia in the poisoning of a former Russian spy in Great Britain, saying he had spoken with the British prime minister, Theresa May. During a meeting with Ireland's prime minister in the Oval Office, Trump said it was something 'that should never, ever happen'. The US has joined Britain, France and Germany in a joint statement blaming Moscow for the poisoning of an ex-Russian spy who was living in England. The list of Russians now under sanction includes the 13 indicted last month by the US special counsel Robert Mueller as part of his Russia-related investigation into alleged election interference.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Doesn't the USA have it? I understood they obtained it, along with Uzbekistan, when they cleaned up the manufacturing site in 1999? I could be wrong.

https://www.sott.net/article/380244-...-Plant-Cleanup

---

All that link confirms is:

Quote:

---

The SAB states that it has insufficient information to comment on the existence or properties of "Novichoks". (OPCW, 2013)

---

Which allows the whackjobs that run the site to claim that they don't exist.

And also confirms that OhOh is still pissing to the wind.

:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Morning 'arry. You don't happen to have the chemical formulae of "Novichoke", do you old chap?

---

No, and neither do the OPCW. Can't you fucking read either?

:chitown:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

No, and neither do the OPCW. Can't you fucking read either?

---

A lot can occur since 2013 'arry. I'm sure the list of which chemicals are included and which countries are cleared of having CW is updated annually at least.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cujo

Trump reckons the russkies did it.

---

Not at all, he agreed to the statement that Russia is "highly likely" and to Russia to assist in clarifying the situation. Which Russia suggested under the OPCW control. Now that has been accepted by the UK, Russia will gleefully join the investigation, analysis and reporting efforts by the OPCW. Visiting the incident site, the site of the analysis, assisting with a sample analysis undertaken in Russia and adding aspects to the OPCW report that the UK may have "forgotten".


" The US has joined Britain, France and Germany in a joint statement blaming Moscow"

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rmer-spy-videoPartners support the UK

"Russia should, in particular, provide full and complete disclosure of the Novichok programme to the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPWC), says the statement.


The UK’s partners share its view that there is no plausible alternative explanation. Russia’s refusal to respond to the UK’s legitimate questions are seen as a further indication that it is responsible.


The United Kingdom explained to its partners in detail that it is highly likely that Russia was responsible for the attack."

From the official German government website:

https://www.bundesregierung.de/Conte...html?nn=393830

1. "provide full and complete disclosure of the Novichok programme to the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPWC)" How do you know they haven't already as illustrated in the 2017 OPCW announcement of the complete eradication of Russian CW in Russia, as previously posted here?

2. "no plausible alternative explanation" Is their opinion prior to an authoritative investigation.

3. "that it is highly likely" As many have pointed out, if the UK Government had any evidence it would have paraded it around the world. As they haven't that expression is the strongest agreed by all the parties lawyers.

You're pretty well just waffling aren't you.

Russia has it.

Everyone knows Russia has it.

The OPCW wants it.

Russia denies it has it.

Pretty well sums it up.

Only one person can change that and he's too busy basking in the "glory" of his fake election.

You can waffle away as much as you like but it doesn't really change anything.

Quote:

---

As many have pointed out, if the UK Government had any evidence it would have paraded it around the world.

---

You still haven't grasped this concept of "classified", have you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

You still haven't grasped this concept of "classified", have you?

---

No proof of Russia currently having it.

You mistakenly believe anything that is classified is unusable, if a politician wishes to profit from it being revealed it will be revealed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhOh

No proof of Russia currently having it.

You mistakenly believe anything that is classified is unusable, if a politician wishes to profit from it being revealed it will be revealed.

---

Clearly you have never heard of the Official Secrets Act.

^

I don't think many would weep if Boris lost his head.

A briefing note from concerned chemists. Snippets below, background in attachment.

Doubts about ?Novichoks? ? Working Group on Syria, Propaganda and Media

Working Group on Syria, Propaganda and Media

Summary of key issues that need to be addressed

"1) There are reasons to doubt that these compounds are military grade nerve agents or that a Russian “Novichok” programme ever existed. If they were potentially usable as chemical weapons, people on the OPCW Scientific Advisory Board who were in a position to know the properties of these compounds would have recommended that they be added to the list of Scheduled Chemicals. They have never been added.



2) Synthesis at bench scale of organic chemicals such as the purported “Novichoks” is within the capability of a modern chemistry laboratory. Porton Down itself must have been able to synthesize these compounds in order to develop tests for them. The detection of such a compound does not establish Russian origin.

As the structures of these compounds have been described, any organic chemist with a modern lab would be able to synthesize bench scale quantities of such a compound. Indeed, Porton Down must have been able to synthesize these compounds in order to develop tests for them. It is therefore misleading to assert that only Russia could have produced such compounds.



A letter from the UK OPCW Ambassadoor 2017 annual review of the work accomplished. Included is a statement regarding Russia's verified conclusion of the destruction of Russia's declared chemical weapons programme.

https://www.opcw.org/fileadmin/OPCW/..._Statement.pdf

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhOh

Or are you just being obstructive?

---

You're giving him too much credit.. if it wasn't for snub then harry would be the dumbest poster in this thread :yup:

A video from a Russian TV station . The Russian Foreign Ministry Spokesman Maria Zakharova is the guest.

You get to hear what Maria Zakharova had to say in response to the British campaign of lies and deception.


https://youtu.be/vTA6KA3fCzc