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  1. #401
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    but I do know that it's pulmonary oedema.

    .
    Edema is spelled edema in the States.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    experts in such a field would not engage in public speculation without first hand knowledge.
    The trouble with the 'experts' is many of them have consistently gotten this whole thing wrong. Go back and study the Chiang Mai 'experts' who propounded food poisoning, shellfish poisoning, seafood poisoning, and even said the 7 deaths in 4 different hotels around the same time-frame were 'coincidences'. Then you had the fatuous 'expert' governor of Chiang Mai saying he would eat a spoonful of chlorpyrifos (idiot would have died had he done that).

    And then there is the so-called toxic waste expert, 'Dr' Ron McDowall, botching his investigation and coming to erroneous conclusions (see many posts above) saying it could have been chlorpyrifos by inhalation and making other ridiculous remarks (implying he's seen inhalation suicides with it when what he should have said is he's seen ingestion suicides).

    And then of course there were/are the 'expert' Thai doctors saying it 'might' have been food poisoning, mushrooms, etc.

    And lets not forget the 'experts' in the media swallowing whole all the bullshit spun by the Thais and sending this BS around the world: puffer fish, food poisoning, blahblahblah.

    The world is run by 'experts' and look what a mess they've made of it. What we need are people who can think critically.


    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    , experts in such a field would not engage in public speculation without first hand knowledge. It is at least unethical.
    I don’t think you understand ethics very well.
    Last edited by guyinthailand; 16-07-2012 at 03:15 AM.

  2. #402
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    Here's some 'experts' you might want to think twice about trusting:

    The American Medical System Is The Leading Cause Of Death And Injury In The United States
    By Gary Null PhD, Carolyn Dean MD ND, Martin Feldman MD, Debora Rasio MD, Dorothy Smith PhD

    The leading cause of death and injury in the United States

  3. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyinthailand View Post
    What we need are people who can think critically
    That rules you out of the equation, then.

  4. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by socal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by thegent View Post
    The problem in this case is that coupled to the length of time it took to raise the alarm ( anything up to 36 hours depending upon which report ) the subsequent delay in transferring the bodies to the foreign jurisdiction meant that a full post mortem by their possibly more competent authorities could not be conducted.

    And that will always be the problem in these types of death. One can never be certain of the competence of the Thai but corroboration by other pathologists is undermined by the passage of time, a factor quite crucial in determining cause of death by poisonous substances.

    In the absence of such evidence the opportunity inevitably arises for wild conjecture and even hysterical notions of serial murder as propounded by cyber fantasists here weaned on a diet of Hollywood pap and this latest case has proved no exception.
    And BTW , nobody noticed sylvester stallones douche kid was dead for 3 days.
    He wasn't staying on a resort island in a tiny guesthouse you fucking moron.

  5. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    I'm no expert and I'm not even an enthusiastic amateur, but I do know that it's pulmonary oedema.

    I am not denying you are an expert but my experience is that in general, experts in such a field would not engage in public speculation without first hand knowledge. It is at least unethical.

    On the other hand, if you have first hand knowledge, I apologise and recommend the government pays you more money.
    I shouldn't bother deferring. GIT is just another frazzled American cut and paste merchant with too much time on his hands and not enough wit or intelligence to utilise it.

    His posts here have become more prolific of late because they kicked him out of Thaivisa for being the tedious demented bore that he is.

  6. #406
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    I had a gander at ThaiVisa. I thought this was a nasty place at times, but it's got nothing, in the You're-a-Prick stakes, on that forum. I reckon if you get turfed from TV you would need to be a very special 'case' indeed.

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegent View Post

    I shouldn't bother deferring. GIT is just another frazzled American cut and paste merchant with too much time on his hands and not enough wit or intelligence to utilise it.

    His posts here have become more prolific of late because they kicked him out of Thaivisa for being the tedious demented bore that he is.

    It figures thegent and Blue Water Dreaming would side with the autocrats on that other forum, who 'temporarily suspended'--like a kindergarten 'time out'--me for 2 days (not kicked me off), but of course I would not deign to reappear in Thaivisa, a place full of little dictators and posters incapable of sustained, critical thought. I merely defended myself from the rabid dogs who reside there. That place is controlled by little dictators masquerading as school marms—kind of like thegent--who visciously gang up on anyone that doesn’t tow the party line there, or whose arguments they can’t ‘best’. So now we know where thegent and Blue Water Dreaming sits with respect to freedom of speech: square on the side of fascism.

    Did you clap your hands in glee when you learned of it, thegent, chortling and harrumphing with pleasure?

    thegent shows his true colors once again: all your flowery words can’t hide the little autocrat that lurks inside you.

    And if only your wit and intelligence could match your predictable, pathetic putdowns, but, alas, your putdowns are all you've got going for you. Never able to mount a sustained argument, or post anything of relevance to this thread, you instead mount your boring fusilades from the peanut gallery.


    Here’s another freedom-hating gem from thegent.
    Quote Originally Posted by thegent View Post

    Sometimes I despise the British to their very core.

    Come happy Al Qaeda bombs and fall upon the swine ......
    Isn’t it about time you changed your name to ‘theAhole’.
    Last edited by guyinthailand; 16-07-2012 at 12:15 PM.

  8. #408
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    ^I said nothing nasty, hateful or deliberately disrespectful, nor is it generally in my nature to do so. I have 'sided' with no one and it does you no credit to leap to such a conclusion with no basis in fact.

    You need to accept in life that not everyone, every time will agree with you. If they occasionally disagree, you should accept it as nothing more than the continuation of a healthy discourse, rather than an attempt to prickle someone else's paranoia.

    As far as TV forum is concerned, I looked recently and discovered the threads which I read to be populated by people who appear to be socially inept. I expressed that in my above post. I saw nothing which you posted when I made my quick visit there and, as a result, offered no opinion on your reported TV demise.

  9. #409
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    I have 'sided' with no one and it does you no credit to leap to such a conclusion with no basis in fact…and offered no opinion on your reported TV demise.
    Really? So it’s just a coincidence that thegent made his petty remark about the Thaivisa fascists temporarily suspending me for two days and then you quickly pop out with
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    I reckon if you get turfed from TV you would need to be a very special 'case' indeed.
    You could have said, ‘Wow, Thaivisa is a fascist little place to have suspended someone like guyinthailand’ or at least called thegent on his idiocy.

    But, instead, you seem to have allied yourself with Teakdoor’s resident nabob of negativism, thegent.
    Last edited by guyinthailand; 16-07-2012 at 12:16 PM.

  10. #410
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    It is a sad fact of cyber life that those addicted to it and attribute a value to their persona actually believe everyone should give a fig.

    TV is a bore, its membership largely of no consequence and their moderation intrusive to the point of imbecility practised by prigs, neurotic women and degenerate inadequates of confused sexual orientation. Personally, I would have thought it a perfect medium for GIT.

  11. #411
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    I have no association whatsoever with theGent. The only 'coincidence' is that having no knowledge of any other forum, I went to look when it was named. It didn't impress me. The level of flaming appeared excessive and, in that case, it seems to me that someone would need to be particularly base to be banned.

    It was a simple comment with no specific direction and I reiterate my intention was not to stir anyone's paranoia. It seems I have failed in that regard. I would not second guess TV or anyone else with ‘Wow, Thaivisa is a fascist little place to have banned someone like guyinthailand’, because I have no knowledge of you or your posts with the exception of 4 in this thread.

    I am often amazed by the sheer malice shown even on this forum by people protected by geography and a computer screen who, I am sure, would be less ready to make the same statements if they were face to face with their protagonists.

  12. #412
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    it seems to me that someone would need to be particularly base to be banned.
    Your assumption is incorrect. Before making statements like that, you might want to look at the facts.

    It is ThaiVisa who is ''particularly base" and who should be criticized for temporarily suspending me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    I have no knowledge of you or your posts with the exception of 4 in this thread.
    Then why 'assume' it was I who was 'base'?
    Last edited by guyinthailand; 16-07-2012 at 12:17 PM.

  13. #413
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    For goodness sake!
    I qualified the selective comment you highlighted above. I said, "The level of flaming seemed excessive and, in that case, it seems to me....".
    I have no interest in revisiting TV, no interest in pandering to your apparent paranoia, no interest in maintaining this discourse and no interest in repeated explanations to address your selective interpretation.

  14. #414
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyinthailand View Post
    The trouble with the 'experts' is many of them have consistently gotten this whole thing wrong.
    Finally, an admission of truth.


  15. #415

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming
    no interest in pandering to your apparent paranoia
    Forgive him, he's American, they are all like that

  16. #416
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrybarracuda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by guyinthailand View Post
    The trouble with the 'experts' is many of them have consistently gotten this whole thing wrong.
    Finally, an admission of truth.

    Well done, grasshopper. You are ready to leave the monastery.




    One time, Zen Master Seung Sahn said:
    I don't teach Korean or Mahayana or Zen. I don't even teach Buddhism. I only teach don't know. Fifty years here and there teaching only don't know. So only don't know, okay?

    This don't know forms the core of all Buddhist teaching. Don't know is a rendering of prajna, the Sanskrit term that we usually translate as "wisdom." Literally, prajna means "before thinking" (pra=before; jna=thought).
    The Greek philosopher Socrates used to teach, "You must understand your true self."
    One time someone asked Socrates, "Teacher, do you understand your true self?"
    Socrates replied, "I don't know. But I also understand this don't know."
    Similarly, when the Indian monk Bodhidharma came to China, he was brought before Emperor Wu of the Liang Dynasty for an interview.
    As the interview proceeded, the emperor became increasingly irritated with Bodhidharma and finally challenged him.
    "Who are you?" he shouted at Bodhidharma. The monk simply said, "Don't know" and ended the interview.
    .
    .
    .

  17. #417
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    I was, of course, referring to "experts" (i.e. in quotes).


  18. #418
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue water dreaming View Post
    I had a gander at ThaiVisa. I thought this was a nasty place at times, but it's got nothing, in the You're-a-Prick stakes, on that forum. I reckon if you get turfed from TV you would need to be a very special 'case' indeed.
    I think you're mistaken, OT here , too but I have to say I bet many members here have been made to feel most unwelcome there. (And I wonder how many of the boasted 200 000 plus members have been banned, more than once .. to rejoin?)

    I have always felt these deaths are deliberate .. young attractive , foreign women although reading about the toxic crap used to grow shrimp in the region.., yes of course maybe food contamination buy no not poisoning, which implies bacteria.
    And my neighbors all pouring toxic crap every- where, it is the likliest cause.

    Then again, though Iwould look at what substance do young women take ?

    Pain killers for cramps for instance- Ibuprofren was in the room. Birth control pills, too.

    Fake pills? We know that is out of hand.. too.

    I am beginning to agree, country is a shit hole. Please boycott it until some accountability is restored.

    Remember the US Tylenol poisonings- 15 years or so ago? was a lady trying to cover up the murder of one person.

    GIT vomiting as main symptom, not diarhea. please stop repeating that, it is only in third sourced, foreign media.

    Here's my tally 15 known deaths in three years related no doubt , I only count 4 in CM possibly 6- older Brit couple Mr Mah symptoms were different, he had heart failure. Lets also for the record tally German in Phuket, and Iranian women in Phuket , had been to Phi Phi day before in week after Bergheim.

    Thi stime it seems T A may be serious aobout tests, in fairness I have to give them a littlle more time, I does take months.

    So for interested new readers I think we can all agree Thai TAT , etc authorities have no qualms about lying, it is perfectly acceptable to sacrifice a few whiteys for the sake of tourism.

    I

  19. #419
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    Quote Originally Posted by KAPPA View Post

    GIT vomiting as main symptom, not diarhea. please stop repeating that, it is only in third sourced, foreign media.


    Below is from an earlier post in this thread. Note feces is spelled faeces here.

    Quote Originally Posted by StrontiumDog View Post
    The Nation(thailand newspaper)
    June 19, 2012 1:00 am

    Dr Pornthep Siriwanarangsan, head of the Disease Control Department, said the initial investigation in the room found a large quantity of vomit
    and faeces. There was evidence of bleeding and their nails had turned black, probably caused by internal bleeding.

    Meanwhile, Pol Col Wissawa Sanehha of Phi Phi police, said the initial investigation found that the sisters had visited a bar on the island the night before having a meal at a restaurant on the beach.


    | Bangkok Post: newsDept suggests 'toxic substance' killed sisters
    The Disease Control Department suspects the two holidaying Canadian sisters found dead in mysterious circumstances in a hotel room on Koh Phi Phi succumbed to a "toxic substance".

    However, department experts have not yet identified the deadly substance, department chief Phonthep Siriwanarangsan said yesterday.


    He based his poisoning assumption on observations of the physical condition of the dead bodies.


    Dr Phonthep ruled out the possibility that the tourists died from either bacterial or viral
    infections.
    ...

    An initial examination of their bodies found bleeding under their nails, in the whites of their eyes and in their cheeks.

  20. #420
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sailing into trouble
    The deaths of these two women follow an American and two Norwegian tourists dying of suspected poisoning after staying at 'The Laleena guesthouse’ on Phi Phi Island in 2009.
    There is a nut case serial killer still on the loose. Imo.

  21. #421
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    Charles Sobhraj does spring to mind.

    Charles Sobhraj - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  22. #422
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    Besides his ability to escape jails and live as a celebrity and earn millions in Paris AFTER it was known he was a serial killer, the other thing that 'impressed' me was his having his female lawyer who had fallen in love with him and another cohort crush 820 valium-type tablets, water them down, and inject a little of this mixture with a syringe and needle into dozens or hundreds of grapes and other small deserts to incapacitate jail guards in India. He used this and probably other methods of poisoning on victims in Thailand and elsewhere, some of whose bodies he chopped up and burned, others he made to look like 'accidents'.

    but sometimes he just used plain ol strangling. Here is Teresa Knowlton, from Seattle, one of his many victims, found on the beach in Pattaya.



    and a full-length documentary
    Last edited by guyinthailand; 18-07-2012 at 11:13 PM.

  23. #423
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    Phi Phi Riddle of Dead Sisters Grows With 'Pesticide' Claim and More Deaths in Vietnam - Phuket Wan


    The Belanger sisters: now another alarming double death in Vietnam
    Photo by phuketwan.com

    Phi Phi Riddle of Dead Sisters Grows With 'Pesticide' Claim and More Deaths in Vietnam

    By Alan Morison and Rattanawan Vatcharasorat
    Friday, August 31, 2012

    PHUKET: The mysterious deaths of Canadian sisters Audrey and Noemi Belanger on the holiday island of Phi Phi were caused by insecticide, police said yesterday.

    No more details are available at this stage, a Thai officer said, although it has been 12 weeks since Audrey, 20, and Noemi, 26, were found dead in their room at a solid, respectable resort on June 10.

    Since then, as autopsies on the women were carried out first in Bangkok and then in Canada, secrecy has enveloped the double fatality.

    Beyond saying that insecticide has been found in the bodies of the women, police in Krabi, the mainland province closest to Phi Phi, have little to add.

    It could be three months before official results are revealed if ever, Krabi Town Deputy Superintendent Colonel Jongrak Pimtong told Phuketwan yesterday.

    All the signs in the room at the Palm Residence Phi Phi were that the sisters died a horrible death from some kind of toxic substance. Much speculation has followed about everything from an allergic reaction to a serial killer.

    The tragedy of the Canadian sisters mirrors the equally msterious deaths on Phi Phi of Jill St Onge, 27, and Norwegian Julie Bergheim, 22, in May, 2009.

    Comparisons have also been made with a series of unexplained deaths - coincidentally or not, mostly involving young women - at and near the now-demolished Downtown Inn in the Thai city of Chiang Mai last year.

    One big difference is that the father of the most prominent of the Chiang Mai victims, 23-year-old new Zealand tourist Sarah Carter, conducted a very public campaign to find out what killed his daughter.

    The Thai authorities were forced to instigate a full and proper probe, with regular updates on their findings.

    Although there was no formal conclusion, the likelihood is that pesticide killed Sarah Carter and the others in Chiang Mai.

    Pesicide in Chinag Mai, insecticide on Phi Phi . . . Whatever the killer, it was no ordinary bug spray.

    Could someone have doctored their drinks? Others with Ms St John and Ms ergheim also fell ill and survived, as did the companions of Ms Carter.

    Phi Phi is renowned as a rites-of-passage destination for 20-somethings, and it transforms from a haven for day-trippers in the sunshine to a less beguiling party island after dark.

    Alcohol is just one the many ingedients that Phi Phi's party people mix in their ''buckets.''

    Each bucket is a concoction of all kinds of juices and substances that are mixed into containers of various sizes and usually sucked through straws all night long.

    There is no evidence, however, that Ms Bergheim and Ms St Onge, who fell sick in adjacent rooms at the same Phi Phi guesthouse, shared a meal or a drink.

    Ms St Onge was cremated but Ms Bergheim's body was returned to Norway where a second autopsy that extended over a period of months failed to produce a reason for her death.

    It is believed that the post-autopsy tests for the Belangers have concluded in Bangkok but are continuing in Canada.

    Public Health Department officials in Thailand say they check for contaminants in the Phi Phi ''buckets'' once a month but have found none.

    That could mean an inordinately large dose of pesticide or insecticide was inhaled, swallowed or absorbed by the Belanger sisters some other way.

    Unlike Sarah carter's father, the parents of the Belangers, despite the shocking double loss, are maintaining a consistent silence, probably on the advice of Canadian authorities.

    When asked a series of questions this week, a government spokesperson in Canada responded: ''Our thoughts continue to be with the family and friends of the Canadian citizens who passed away in Thailand.

    ''Canadian consular officials in Bangkok and in Canada are providing consular assistance to the family.

    ''Our officials are in contact with authorities both in Thailand and Canada and will continue to liaise closely with them.

    ''However, out of respect for the family and to protect the privacy of the individuals concerned, further details on this case cannot be released.''

    Despite the calm in Canada, fresh alarm surfaced earlier this month with reports of the deaths of two young women in Vietnam, an American and a Canadian of Vietnamese extraction.

    There is a sense of deja vu about the reporting of the riddle in thespec.com, the online news site of a respectable Canadian publisher.

    ''[Cathy] Huynh, 26, . . . and Kari Bowerman, 27, of Lake Geneva, Wisconsin, died suddenly and mysteriously in Vietnam while on vacation together from their English teaching jobs in South Korea.

    ''Both were healthy young women before travelling to Vietnam, according to their families. News reports in Vietnam said they had been vomiting and sought help at a local hospital, where they died - Bowerman first on July 30 and then Huynh on August 2.''

    The report adds: ''In Texas, Bowerman's sister Jenny Jaques is not only in shock and grieving, as is the Huynh family in Hamilton, but she is also angry and frustrated at not being able to get information about what happened.''

    Little has been reported about the case since, and the same can be said of the Belanger sisters mystery.

    Despite the deaths and the continuing mysteries, disquiet does not appear to have affected tourism to Phi Phi.

    Crowded ferries still come and go each day to the scenic island from Phuket, about two hours' sailing away. Many of the passengers are young women.
    "Slavery is the daughter of darkness; an ignorant people is the blind instrument of its own destruction; ambition and intrigue take advantage of the credulity and inexperience of men who have no political, economic or civil knowledge. They mistake pure illusion for reality, license for freedom, treason for patriotism, vengeance for justice."-Simón Bolívar

  24. #424
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    Audrey And Noemi Belanger, Quebec Sisters Drank Insecticide DEET: Autopsy

    Audrey And Noemi Belanger, Quebec Sisters Drank Insecticide DEET: Autopsy

    CBC

    Posted: 08/31/2012 12:13 pm Updated: 08/31/2012 12:40 pm


    Audrey and Noemi Belanger, Quebec sisters, were found dead in their room, and it was speculated that poisoning, probably accidental, played a role.

    The death earlier this year in Thailand of two sisters from Quebec was caused by caused by drinking a cocktail that includes the insecticide DEET, an autopsy concluded.

    Results of the autopsy at a Bangkok hospital have not been publicly released, but they were shown to reporters for CBC's French-language news network.

    According to the report, 20-year-old Audrey and Noémi Bélanger, 25, had DEET in their bodies that they had ingested.

    Though the chemical is a potentially neurotoxic mosquito repellent, it is used as an ingredient in a euphoria-inducing cocktail that is popular among youth in Thailand. The drink containts cough syrup, Coke, DEET and a leaf extract.

    It is thought that an overdose of DEET was accidentally mixed into the young women's drinks.

    They had just arrived on the Thai island of Phi Phi and were last seen partying with two Brazilian friends in the early morning of June 13. Forty-eight hours later, when staff at their hotel hadn't seen them emerge from their room, a receptionist called police.

    The sisters were found dead in their room, and it was speculated that poisoning, probably accidental, played a role. Police said they found no signs of foul play.

    However, officers did find a lot of vomit in the room and there was blood on the young women's faces, leading investigators to say early on that the women may have suffered some kind of toxic reaction.

    In 2009, two young tourists, one from the United States and the other from Norway, who were staying at a nearby guest house also died under mysterious circumstances.

    Their deaths remain unsolved, but there was speculation the women had been poisoned.

    Another spate of mysterious tourist deaths occurred last year in the northern Thai city of Chiang Mai, involving several visitors from different countries staying at the same hotel in January and February.

    The cause of death was not established, though some evidence suggested the use of the chemical spray chlorpyrifos, used to kill bedbugs, may have been responsible.

    Audrey Bélanger, 20, and Noémi Bélanger, 25, were from Pohénégamook, in Quebec's Lower Saint Lawrence region.
    Last edited by StrontiumDog; 01-09-2012 at 01:05 AM.

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    you can think, that the usual dose is far lower than a deadly one... harmful, ok, but certainly not fatal...

    in a drink with so many ingredients, the mixer does get "accidentially" the deadly one wrong and only this one - and in such a high dose, that people die?

    and this with women only?
    yes, women might be "less resistant" (even if not proven, but just suggesting it was so), but that they die and men dont get seriously ill, is not normal...

    seems, someone is deliberately poisoning women on koh phi phi...

    so many cases, so many women - and really fatal cases (means a heavy overdose)...

    why do they conclude it was "accidentially"?

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