UK fixed penalty charge.

[superman]

I hired a car in the UK using my Thai driving license. I returned the car one month ago. Today I received, from the hire firm, invoices for 2 penalty charges administration fees for a total 60 Pounds. The letter is dated 9 November. They say "The amount shown above (60 Pounds) has been processed to your credit Card account." I in fact paid with a Debit Card and as yet this 'administration fee' has still not been taken from my account.
The letter from the hire company has not enclosed the fixed penalty notices, but just tells me the penalty number. The hire company has not paid the fines on my behalf.

Question 1. Can the hire company take the 'administration fee' from my Debit card?
Question 2. What happens if I don't pay the fines?
Question 3. How do I find out where I got the fixed penalties?

Sorry for posting this in the wrong forum section. Whoops.

[AntRobertson]

fixed penalty notices

I presume from this you mean speeding/parking tickets or some such?

The answer to your question #1 is a definite "yes", not so certain on the other two though. From my own experience with something similar (in NZ) the ticket (speeding, in my case) arrived direct from the police at a later date.

The 'administration fee' was charged by the rental Co. for the time and effort it took them to give the police my details. Thanks, cnuts!

[Listerman]

Without sight of 'the fixed penalty charges' and unless you knew you were flashed by a speed camera or similar. I would challenge the vehicle hire company to provide this information to you. As these offences always come with points on your licence if your a UK driving licence holder. Hence the police will try and make every effort to contact you in person, so they can send you notice of intent to prosecute the driver (which in their eyes will be the person who hired the vehicle).

Until the vehicle hire company can provide you with this information, I would explain the situation to the credit card company, and instruct them to reverse the paymnet, as they can do this quite easily if instructed to do so.

[superman]

Sorry but I think it to be 'penalty charges' (parking tickets). But according to the web (parking) offenses must be handed to you or attached to your vehicle. i received neither. It also says that the owner of the vehicle is responsible for fines as the driver cannot be verified.

[chassamui]

I have never known a hire company to accept a debit card in the last few years, unless you pay a cash sum up front as an excess against possible losses?
They usually insist on a credit card and then place a limit against your card until you return the car in good nick. They take a print off it in cases like this so they can claw back charges.
There will be a police notice issued to state when and where and the speed you were doing in the case of a speeding ticket. Usually a photo is attached from modern cameras. The car hire company may have it unless the police are waiting for the company to identify you as the driver. It can take up to six weeks for first class mail to get here from UK.

[DrAndy]

just tell them nothing, don't answer them, they are not the police

If charges appear on your debit card, you can have them taken off, that is the beauty of debit cards unlike the credit version. Anything on a debit card can be reversed by you complaining they had no right to take the charges as you gave no authority

just forget the whole thing, you have a Thai licence so the authorities just write them off

[richie22]

Interesting.I did not UK rental companies would accept a Thai driving license.That's the one I will be using next time.Too much hassle for them to track you down.

[superman]

You can use a Thai driving license in the UK for 12 months from date of entry. But for hire your Debit/Credit card billing address must be as per the Thai licence ie Thailand.

[superman]

just tell them nothing, don't answer them, they are not the police If charges appear on your debit card, you can have them taken off, that is the beauty of debit cards unlike the credit version. Anything on a debit card can be reversed by you complaining they had no right to take the charges as you gave no authority just forget the whole thing, you have a Thai licence so the authorities just write them off __________________

Phoned the bank. They say if I use the internet to give my Debit Card details then the hire company can take extra charges against it at a later date. Nothing they can do to prevent it. Which is something I can't get my head around.

[superman]

I have never known a hire company to accept a debit card in the last few years, unless you pay a cash sum up front as an excess against possible losses?

Some hire companies accept Debit Cards, no cash up front.

I don’t want to complicate the payment process even more but it’s worth noting that aside from the credit cards I have listed, we do accept Visa debit cards in most countries, as their processing rules are the same as Visa credit cards. This rule does apply in every country across the world (Spain is the most notable exception).

Information on accepted credit cards | We Try Harder - the Avis UK blog

[chassamui]

Thanks for that. I had assumed all companies only accepted CC.

[superman]

If charges appear on your debit card, you can have them taken off, that is the beauty of debit cards unlike the credit version. Anything on a debit card can be reversed by you complaining they had no right to take the charges as you gave no authority

Not picking on you DrAndy, but I was/am like you and thought/think Debit Cards were/are okay.

As much as you might resist it, debit cards should not be used to pay for online transactions; a credit card is always safer for e-commerce. You're not as protected against fraud when you use a debit card, and disputes with those cards can be difficult to resolve. Plus, if someone steals your debit card number, your entire bank account is vulnerable.

HowStuffWorks "Is it safe to shop online with a debit card?"

[Satonic]

Phoned the bank. They say if I use the internet to give my Debit Card details then the hire company can take extra charges against it at a later date. Nothing they can do to prevent it.

Wrong. Call the bank and tell them you have lost the card. They will re-issue you a new card with a different number making the details the hire company have null and void.

[chassamui]

I had to wait 13 weeks for a replacement card earlier this year. No laughing matter.

[Listerman]

If charges appear on your debit card, you can have them taken off, that is the beauty of debit cards unlike the credit version. Anything on a debit card can be reversed by you complaining they had no right to take the charges as you gave no authority

But the OP states he paid with a credit card.

[Satonic]

But the OP states he paid with a credit card.

Debit Card

I had to wait 13 weeks for a replacement card earlier this year.

Mine took 3 days to my parents house then 6 days from the UK to Thailand.

But yes I have had friends that have waited week upon week. If the OP isn't in desperate need for the card, reporting it lost/stolen is the only way I can think to insure the hire company can't take any money.

[OhOh]

But the OP states he paid with a credit card.

maybe for you?

[adzt1]

they cannot take from a debit card. its their fault for not requesting a CC .
don' worry abt it t

[Listerman]

[quote=Satonic;2277959]

But the OP states he paid with a credit card.

Debit Card

So he did, I missed that, apologies all round chaps, I must read these posts in more detail before posting

[draco888]

Without sight of 'the fixed penalty charges' and unless you knew you were flashed by a speed camera or similar. I would challenge the vehicle hire company to provide this information to you. As these offences always come with points on your licence if your a UK driving licence holder. Hence the police will try and make every effort to contact you in person, so they can send you notice of intent to prosecute the driver (which in their eyes will be the person who hired the vehicle).

Until the vehicle hire company can provide you with this information, I would explain the situation to the credit card company, and instruct them to reverse the paymnet, as they can do this quite easily if instructed to do so.

There has been no payment made to reverse according to OP

[superman]

I need to get this sorted out as each time I receive a letter from the hire company they charge me 25 Quid, plus VAT = 30 Quid x 2, so far. They quote this in their letters:-

On demand, all fines and court costs for parking, traffic or other offences (including any costs which arise if the vehicle is clamped). Renter must pay the appropriate authority any fines and costs. If he does not, Renter will be responsible to pay Avis’ reasonable administration charges which arise when Avis deals with these matters.

It's this clause, I believe, that enables the hire company will use to continue taking money from my account. Until I can find out about the issuing of the Penalty Charges, and sort it, then I'm bollixed as I see things. And currently Avis are not forth coming with the answers.

[DrAndy]

They say if I use the internet to give my Debit Card details then the hire company can take extra charges against it at a later date. Nothing they can do to prevent it.

maybe so, but they can be taken off again

I disputed some payments that had been made, and had them taken off with no problem

[DrAndy]

It's this clause, I believe, that enables the hire company will use to continue taking money from my account.

if you are really woried their empty threats could actually happen, ask the bank to freeze the card because you are worried that someone has access to the info

ask them to reissue another, if they can do it straight away

(If you say you have lost it, it can take a long time to get another, as noted above)

[Albert Shagnastier]

Question 1. Can the hire company take the 'administration fee' from my Debit card? Question 2. What happens if I don't pay the fines? Question 3. How do I find out where I got the fixed penalties?

1: If they have taken it already call your bank - say they've scammed you and you want the money back immediately and them blocked from accessing it again.

2: Do nothing. It sounds like they're scamming you anyway.

3: Don't waste your time.

Do nothing and call them as scammers till they show you the paperwork.

[superman]

Thanks for all the reassurances. Dr Andy you may well be right in that it's empty threats. Letters are dated 9 November, and still no money taken from my account even though it says in the letters

The amount shown above has been processed to your credit card account.

. I highlighted the "has"

1: If they have taken it already call your bank - say they've scammed you and you want the money back immediately and them blocked from accessing it again.

Bank says that once a Debit Card transaction has been authorized then there's no claw back unless I can prove overpayment or double charging. Any payment error has to be taken up with the seller.
As it stands it looks like I have to just sit tight and then react once money has been accessed from my account. Thanks for all replies.