Another Obama radical outed.

**Cujo** · 07-09-2009, 08:29 AM

How people with such 'out there' views get so deep into the administration in the first place is the wonder.

Barack Obama aide resigns over claim that 9/11 was a pretext for war

Van Jones, a senior adviser to President Barack Obama, has resigned after it emerged that he had signed a petition stating that the Bush administration may have allowed the September 11 attacks to happen as a pretext to go to war.

By Toby Harnden in Washington
Published: 7:57PM BST 06 Sep 2009

Van Jons resigned from his position as an environmental advisor Photo: GETTY IMAGES

The ousting of Van Jones, a Left-wing activist appointed by Mr Obama as his "special adviser for green jobs", is a victory for Republicans and a sign of growing weakness within the White House.
It was a major scalp for the Fox News host Glenn Beck, who brought Mr Jones's past to prominence and for weeks has been citing his presence in the Obama administration as evidence that the president is guided by a cadre of radical lieutenants.
Mr Jones was reported to have signed a petition saying that Mr Bush "may indeed have deliberately allowed 9/11 to happen, perhaps as a pretext for war".
In an angry statement issued on Sunday, Mr Jones spoke of a "vicious smear campaign against me" and blamed Republicans for "using lies and distortions to distract and divide".
He said: "I have been inundated with calls - from across the political spectrum - urging me to 'stay and fight'. But I came here to fight for others, not for myself. I cannot in good conscience ask my colleagues to expend precious time and energy defending or explaining my past.
"We need all hands on deck, fighting for the future."
David Axelrod, a senior Obama adviser, praised Mr Jones for the "great deal of commitment on his part" in "removing himself as an issue".
Mr Jones apologised twice last week, for signing the petition and for describing Republicans as "assholes" in February, before he joined the Obama administration.
When asked before the weekend whether Mr Jones enjoyed the confidence of Mr Obama, Robert Gibbs, the White House press secretary, would say only that he "continues to work in the administration".
The White House chose the very early hours of Sunday morning on the Labour Day holiday weekend to make the resignation announcement, a sign that it wanted to bury what had become a major distraction to the battle over health care reform.
Mr Jones's links to a group called Standing Together to Organize a Revolutionary Movement (Storm) led to allegations from the Right that he was a communist.
After the September 11 attacks in 2001, he attended a vigil at which "US imperialism" was blamed for the al-Qaeda strikes on New York and Washington.
In a 2005 interview, Mr Jones said that after the acquittal of the assailants of Rodney King, the black victim of a vicious beating by white police officers in 1991, he was transformed from a being "rowdy nationalist" into "a communist".
The racial overtones of many of his past utterances were a particular liability for a president whose election campaign was nearly derailed by the rantings of his former pastor Jeremiah Wright and has since been anxious to distance himself from black extremism.
Mr Jones had accused whites of using pollution as a weapon against blacks, stating that "the white polluters and the white environmentalists are essentially steering poison into the people-of-color communities, because they don't have a racial justice frame".
The episode has drawn attention to the large number of czars appointed by Mr Obama - many more than in previous administration - and a haphazard system of vetting appointees that allowed such an obviously controversial figure to get through.
"Curious how he made it that far into the administration when a google search could have told you he believed that the Bush Administration had allowed 9/11 to happen," Dana Perino, President George W. Bush's press secretary, told the Politico website.

Barack Obama aide resigns over claim that 9/11 was a pretext for war - Telegraph

**barbaro** · 07-09-2009, 08:36 AM

The term "radical" is being overused.

I don't know if he's a "radical" or not. I do believe that he's an idiot.

"Radical" is a politically loaded word. I consider GWB to be one of the most radical Presidents in the last 100 years, and yes, I'm piggy-backing off of Bernstein on this.

Same goes for Ashcroft and Cheney.

We ALL need to dump the term, "radical."

**AntRobertson** · 07-09-2009, 08:40 AM

"Another"? Who are the others?

**sabang** · 07-09-2009, 09:09 AM

Seems there is an awful lot of insecurity amongst the crowd that watch Glen Beck. As an Adviser on green jobs, Jones was hardly an 'inner circle' guy in the Obama admin. I suppose it was easier to dump him, although I think Obama should have just raised a single digit to the Fossils and said 'so what'.

Senator Bernie Sanders is an avowed Socialist
The senior Senator, Robert Byrd, was a senior member of the Ku Klux Klan
Ashcroft was a total nutjob
The minister for the Environment, Peter Garrett, in Australia was a lead singer for a rock band and involved in several protest movements

Only thing is, they're all white.

**AntRobertson** · 07-09-2009, 09:19 AM

The minister for the Environment, Peter Garrett, in Australia was a lead singer for a rock band and involved in several protest movements

Peter Garrett was a minister? No shit?? That's brilliant!

How on earth did I miss that, Midnight Oil rock!

**Cujo** · 07-09-2009, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

"Another"? Who are the others?

That's the spirit, ignore the article altogether, well done.

**AntRobertson** · 07-09-2009, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by Dug

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

"Another"? Who are the others?

That's the spirit, ignore the article altogether, well done.

I'm not ignoring anything, I'm asking who the 'others' are.

**Cujo** · 07-09-2009, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

Seems there is an awful lot of insecurity amongst the crowd that watch Glen Beck. As an Adviser on green jobs, Jones was hardly an 'inner circle' guy in the Obama admin. I suppose it was easier to dump him, although I think Obama should have just raised a single digit to the Fossils and said 'so what'.

Senator Bernie Sanders is an avowed Socialist
The senior Senator, Robert Byrd, was a senior member of the Ku Klux Klan
Ashcroft was a total nutjob
The minister for the Environment, Peter Garrett, in Australia was a lead singer for a rock band and involved in several protest movements

Only thing is, they're all white.

You think it's something to do with him being black??
paranoid??

Dan · 07-09-2009, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by Dug

How people with such 'out there' views get so deep into the administration in the first place is the wonder.

I guess it shows that there's still a microscopic speck of hope left.

**sabang** · 07-09-2009, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by Dug

You think it's something to do with him being black??

Definitely. It would be tempting, but intellectually lazy, to simplify it by calling it overt racism- although of course this does exist at the margins. But it is more complex than that. Simple example- would there be all this 'Birther' nonsense if Obama had exactly the same background, but was white? You know there wouldn't.

Originally Posted by Dug

paranoid??

A better term. There is a large degree of cultural paranoia running through what could loosely be termed 'white middle America'. It has very much emerged to the fore following the election of Obama, and it is both fascinating- and a bit concerning- to watch.

If you look at the 'heart' of this paranoia, it is sociologically predictable actually. Mainly blue collar, elderly, often Christian Conservative too, mainly from the more 'conservative' states- which, in a manifestation of the times, are those states which have somewhat fallen behind the more progressive and in the main affluent coastal states. Those who feel the most threatened and disadvantaged by change, in short- and it is Change that is at the heart of this paranoia.

It is impossible for me to adequately address in a small soundbite such as this what could hardly be broached in a 5000 word Thesis. Vulgar imagery will have to suffice.

The America of the 'Andy Griffith Show' is long gone. The cultural icons presented by square jawed 'good guy' hero's such as John Wayne and Clint Eastwood- who always win the war or save the day- is an anachronism, superseded by social, cultural and international trends and of course recent history and current events.

But anachronistic 'self image' lingers for some time after the reality has changed- this is a common theme of every declining Empire (on a relative, not necessarily absolute) basis. And it is at it's fiercest in those sections of society that are, or feel, the least benefitted by these changes- they feel threatened by it, and psychologically 'close in' to comforting stereotypes and self images. In this case 'White, middle America' and Christian conservatism. Stereotypes of an aggrandised past.

Of concern though, is that the GOP and various corporate and conservative interest groups are stoking this paranoia- and in several cases making it ugly (eg Fox & Beck). Demographically, they are marginalising themselves- which should be of great concern to forward thinking conservatives. But in the meantime, they are exploiting an easily manipulated, paranoid (but declining) Demographic- for their own selfish interests.

The study of declining Empire is a particular interest of mine btw, and the USA is exhibiting most of the classic symptoms.

**Norton** · 07-09-2009, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by sabang

The study of declining Empire is a particular interest of mine btw, and the USA is exhibiting most of the classic symptoms.

Beginning to parallel the post Hadrian era of Rome.

**Boon Mee** · 07-09-2009, 02:34 PM

^
No, more like a flashback to Boss Hog and the Tea Pot Dome Scandals of not-too distant Democrat administrations...

**sabang** · 09-09-2009, 07:12 AM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

Peter Garrett was a minister? No shit?? That's brilliant! How on earth did I miss that, Midnight Oil rock!

^ Peter Garrett IS the Federal Minister for the Environment, Heritage & the Arts.

He has been involved in many protests, including to chuck out the US military base at Pine Gap, Greenpeace, protests against the Howard govt for refusing to apologise to the Abo's, many more.

Controversy when he was appointed a Minister? none. Street protests? none. Who really gives a rats arse? nobody.

So here I am, an adopted Aussie, a nation that federated in 1901 and with a population of 24 mill or so, looking at the USA somewhat aghast and wondering- why is it so immature?

I realise it is a (noisy) minority we are talking about, but why is the visible face of the nation these days the archetype of the ugly American? With the possible exception of Hawaii, I really do not want to set foot there again- just too much damn ugliness.

Minister Garrett-

Quite a contrast to 'modern' America n'est ce pas?

**MustavaMond** · 09-09-2009, 08:57 AM

And of course there's the possibility that Cheney really did allow 9-11 to happen.
( Cheney and not Bush actually calling the shots for 8 years in America )
As for this " radicalism" I think a large percentage of people in the world consider it true.

Hang Bush and Cheney at the Hague for crimes against humanity.

**Muadib** · 09-09-2009, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by Norton

Originally Posted by sabang

The study of declining Empire is a particular interest of mine btw, and the USA is exhibiting most of the classic symptoms.

Beginning to parallel the post Hadrian era of Rome.

I also believe we have lived through the peak of western civilization and are on the down-side of the bell curve... I just didn't realize the slippery slope would be so steep... Glad I won't be around for the final demise, unless it happens on 21/12/12...

**AntRobertson** · 09-09-2009, 09:13 AM

^^^There is/was an MP in the New Zealand parliament named Nandor Tucket (or something like that). He has dreads, openly admits to smoking weed, and has been known to ride his skateboard to parliament sittings.

Electable in the US... Not frigging likely!

**sabang** · 09-09-2009, 09:43 AM

Well, you've got Bernie Sanders, an avowed socialist and long term Independent senator. And Barnie Frank, who says he's well used to being a minority because he's a left handed jewish poove.

But they're old, pudgy and white. Kinda cuddly.

But this guy comes along who's lean and black and becomes (gasp!) adviser on green jobs or sumfin- and all hell breaks loose.

Something very wrong in the kingdom of Denmark.

**El Gibbon** · 09-09-2009, 09:49 AM

While I am in basic agreement with Sabang there are signs the populace is not quite as idiotic or bombastic as either the left wingers or the right wingers. Yes, Beck and Limbaugh and their ilk have their loyal followers but don't be so quick to lump the majority into either camp, left or right.

I recently spent a little over a month in the US. Having attended a funeral, several birthday parties and a couple of social functions, I met a lot of people from across the social spectrum, (many more than I really wanted to meet.). A couple of perceptions emerged from this variety of people.

None of them seem to spend a lot of time watching Network News, either CNN or FOX or NBC or MSN... they just don't have time and talking heads put them off. They can think for themselves.

Seldom do they read news on the internet either, some read a magazine or two they have subscribed to for years. The primary sources of new are local newspapers (yep even though they are failing left and right) and the local TV channel which focuses more on local news than national or international.

Most, but not all were/are pro Obama, thinking the Bush administration had done enough damage and a change was needed and it wasn't an old Senator from Arizona, they do respect McCain's dedication but not his views.

What concerns them now is the value of the dollar and the taxes coming down the road to pay for the bail outs. Almost unanimously they were against bailing out the banks, manufacturers were OK but not the big banks. They are very concerned about the future tax bite and who is going to pay it and how much it will be.

Next was the health care issue that everyone agreed was a mess. They also were pretty solid in that a "NEW" health care system was the wrong way to go at the wrong time. Overwhelmingly they thought tort reform was a much higher priority. Without Tort reform the health care issue cannot be resolved.

My daughter's gynecologist just quit his practice. With the high malpractice insurance rates he would have to see/treat six women every hour at his current rates which are high to begin with... so he quit... too bad for his long list of patients that have been with him for years. Just one example of why Tort reform should be a priority. But with most congressmen being lawyers what are the chances?

The most striking perception was that they really don't care what the Feds do, they are much more concerned with the issues they deal with everyday; getting kids to school, soccer practice, dance lessons, etc. etc. The know that a fucked up administration can't totally ruin the country, if it screws up enough they will be out in four years. Plus there are the mid-term elections that can severely impact the senate and house.

The issues we think are earth shattering or of serious note, largely go unnoticed by folks that are busy and not sitting in front of computers on web sites such as TD. I do think that with having time on our hands and a keyboard in front of us we make mountains out of mole hills, much the same as the radio heads do to gather listeners. Yes, they know this dingbat has been outed, but so what, another will step into his shoes.

Of more concern is the subornation of the US Constitution. The numbers of "special xxx to the President", many fear that these un-vetted advisers are a way to slide around the constitutional duties of Secretaries of departments and undermine the government to the advantage of the incumbent. Why did Obama need a Green Jobs CZAR when he as a Department of Energy with a staff of thousands... If this guy was that good why was he not nominated as the Secretary of Energy?... me thinks they new he would never pass muster and slid him in as a Special Advisor/CZAR.

This has become a problem over the years and is not due to one party or another, they all do it when in power. There is a movement, strong one at that, to begin to curb these abuses.

There are serious problems in the US, but it runs and works, with all its warts. Not many countries would pass up the opportunity to equal it.

As an aside:

An Australian friend recently quipped " I love the American attitude, just throw money at it. If you can't fuck it, or eat it, just chrome it"

Laughed my ass of at that one.

E G

**sabang** · 09-09-2009, 10:07 AM

^ yeh, why aren't these people being heard right now?
I've spent loads of time in the US- how come i never came across these loonies? (well, coupla religious loons, and a few proud TX rednecks, nice guys actually- but prolly birthers

).

But I'm afraid, currently, I'm blaming the Conservative/ republican machine for this.
Thing is, the lefty moonbats will follow suit, with all this baiting. It's already happening with the town hall protests.

Why is it all so polarised, extremised? most amerkins aren't like that.

good post mate.

**AntRobertson** · 09-09-2009, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by sabang

Well, you've got Bernie Sanders, an avowed socialist and long term Independent senator. And Barnie Frank, who says he's well used to being a minority because he's a left handed jewish poove.

But they're old, pudgy and white. Kinda cuddly.

But this guy comes along who's lean and black and becomes (gasp!) adviser on green jobs or sumfin- and all hell breaks loose.

Something very wrong in the kingdom of Denmark.

I've always been somewhat bemused at the premium the US electorate seems to place on military service (or the converse for the lack thereof) as being a prerequisite for top office.

And so-called 'flip-flopping'. What's wrong with changing your mind if presented with more facts / a better option? Seems to me that rigourously staying the course in the face of such is the wrong thing to do yet politicians are pilloried at the merest hint of a change of mind.

Dan · 09-09-2009, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

What's wrong with changing your mind if presented with more facts / a better option? Seems to me that rigourously staying the course in the face of such is the wrong thing to do yet politicians are pilloried at the merest hint of a change of mind.

Not something unique to US politics, but I don't understand the criticism either. Surely politicians - or anyone, for that matter - should be praised if they're prepared to revise their opinions in the face of evidence that they're wrong.

Dan · 09-09-2009, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by El Gibbon

The most striking perception was that they really don't care what the Feds do, they are much more concerned with the issues they deal with everyday; getting kids to school, soccer practice, dance lessons, etc. etc.

I know bugger all about the internal dynamics of the US but I think that this is probably true, to a greater or lesser extent, across the West. Sadly, it's a deeply conservative, reactionary impulse.

**AntRobertson** · 09-09-2009, 10:54 AM

Originally Posted by Dan

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

What's wrong with changing your mind if presented with more facts / a better option? Seems to me that rigourously staying the course in the face of such is the wrong thing to do yet politicians are pilloried at the merest hint of a change of mind.

Not something unique to US politics, but I don't understand the criticism either. Surely politicians - or anyone, for that matter - should be praised if they're prepared to revise their opinions in the face of evidence that they're wrong.

True, correct on both counts.

**Jet Gorgon** · 09-09-2009, 11:52 AM

I see nothing has changed here. But, great post, EG. Yep, the couch critics here are still chewing up the carpet.

**AntRobertson** · 09-09-2009, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

I see nothing has changed here. But, great post, EG. Yep, the couch critics here are still chewing up the carpet.

Ditto your time away for you, apparently.

Thread: Another Obama radical outed.

Thread Tools

Display

Another Obama radical outed.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

Posting Permissions