Swiss Experiment: pay $2,500 for doing nothing

[Cold Pizza]

Some articles about this phenomenon have appeared occasionally, in part due to the expansion of Artificial Intelligence (AI) Millions upon millions of people could lose their jobs through no fault of their own.

The concept of paying a "base salary" to people in lieu of welfare benefits that do nothing.

It needs to be tested. Switzerland is holding a plebiscite June 5th. $2,500 usd per month in Switerzerland is considered subsistence.

Is this a possible solution? Logical? Or, foolish?



In a social experiment watched by the world, Swiss may pay people $2,500 a month for doing nothing

http://business.financialpost.com/n....-doing-nothing

The Swiss are discussing paying people $2,500 a month for doing nothing.

The country will vote June 5 on whether the government should introduce an unconditional basic income to replace various welfare benefits. Although the initiators of the plan haven’t stipulated how large the payout should be, they’ve suggested the sum of 2,500 francs ($2,500) for an adult and a quarter of that for a child.

It sounds good, but — two things. It would barely get you over the poverty line, typically defined as 60 per cent of the national median disposable income, in what’s one of the world’s most expensive countries. More importantly, it’s probably not going to happen anyway.

Switzerland’s People Power

Plebiscites are a common part of Switzerland’s direct democracy, with multiple votes every year. The basic income initiative is taking place after the proposal gathered the required 100,000 signatures, though current polls suggest it won’t get any further. The idea of paying everyone a stipend has also piqued interest in other countries, such as Canada, the Netherlands and Finland, where an initial study began last year.

[​IMG]

The initiators say the sum they’ve mentioned would allow for a “decent existence.” Still, on an annual basis, it would provide only 30,000 francs — just above the 2014 poverty line of 29,501 francs.

Nearly one in eight people in Switzerland were below the level in that year, according to the statistics office. That’s more than in France, Denmark and Norway. Among those over 65, one in five were at risk of being poor.

“It’s not like you see abject poverty in Switzerland,” said Andreas Ladner, professor of political science at the University of Lausanne. “But there are a few people who don’t have enough money, and there are some people who work and don’t earn enough.”

In a social experiment watched by the world, Swiss may pay people $2,500 a month for doing nothing | Financial Post

[Dillinger]

$2,500 usd per month in Switerzerland is considered subsistence

No wonder Patsy's always fukkin hammered

[pseudolus]

Clever buggers.

So, private bankers create money out of nothing and basically flood the market creating mass inflation, but covered as "shrewd fiscal management". The price of everything goes up due to the "world economy" (shushhhhh don't ever mention the flooding of market with paper and electronic money), so to balance this they nicely decide to give everyone 2500 bucks a month. Great. So where does the money come from they are going to hand out? the magic money government fairy? The Government has no money, so all of this will be doled out and added to the ever growing 1.6 trillion swiss national debt.


Genius from bankers and their puppet politicians. If it increases the debt by $1 Trillion, expect to see it in a country near you soon.

[sabang]

$2,500 a month for doing nothing

That is a lot more than I spend a month for doing nothing.

[jamescollister]

It really is giving money with one hand and taking back with another, what welfare benefits does it replace.
Don't know the Swiss system, but the Australian welfare system, most people on wages receive some form of welfare, a short term gain could well be a long term loss.

Devil will be in the detail, children paying for their schools, medical welfare for the poor, all the other government services which are covered by taxes, you really need to know what welfare means and what gets cut.

[Hans Mann]

Swiss voters reject 'money for nothing' income plan

Swiss voters rejected by a wide margin on Sunday a proposal to introduce a guaranteed basic income for everyone living in the wealthy country after an uneasy debate about the future of work at a time of increasing automation.

Supporters had said introducing a monthly income of 2,500 Swiss francs ($2,563) per adult and 625 francs per child under 18 no matter how much they work would promote human dignity and public service.

Opponents, including the government, said it would cost too much and weaken the economy.

Projections by the GFS polling outfit for Swiss broadcaster SRF showed nearly four out of five voters opposed the bold social experiment launched by Basel cafe owner Daniel Haeni and allies in a vote under the Swiss system of direct democracy.

Haeni acknowledged defeat but claimed a moral victory.

"As a businessman I am a realist and had reckoned with 15 percent support, now it looks like more than 20 percent or maybe even 25 percent. I find that fabulous and sensational," he told SRF.

"When I see the media interest, from abroad as well, then I say we are setting a trend."

Conservative Switzerland is the first country to hold a national referendum on an unconditional basic income, but others including Finland are examining similar plans as societies ponder a world in which robots replace humans in the workforce.

Olivier, a 26-year-old carpenter who works on construction sites and runs a small business where he designs and builds furniture, said he voted "yes" to the initiative.

"For me it would be a great opportunity to put my focus on my passion and not go to work just for a living," he said.

SUSTAINABLE SOLUTION?

Champions of the plan had painted just such a future in a poster bigger than a soccer field asking "What would you do if your income was secure?" They had also marched as robots down Zurich's high street and had handed out free 10-franc notes.

A Bern man who gave his name only as Stephan said he supported the idea as a "sustainable solution for society".

"I think people will go on working because it is a human need to be useful, to do meaningful action. In fact, I have the impression that people would be even more productive if they are productive by themselves instead of being obliged to be productive," he said.

A woman named Meleanie said she reluctantly voted "no".

"I find that it is a real danger that once people just get their basic needs covered society doesn't feel responsible anymore to look after the ones who can't really handle the situation on their own", she said.

Employers also heaved a sigh of relief that Switzerland, where unemployment is only around 3.5 percent, had not become the first country to embrace such a path-breaking measure.

The Swiss government had urged voters to reject the campaign, saying the scheme would cost too much and undermine societal cohesion.

The plan included replacing in full or in part what people got from social benefits.

The government estimated the proposal would have cost 208 billion Swiss francs a year, significantly weakened the economy and discouraged people, especially low earners, from working.

Much of the cost could have been covered by existing social security payments, but sharp spending cuts or tax increases would have had to make up a remaining gap of 25 billion.

An advanced social safety net already supports people who cannot pay themselves for their livelihood. Fewer than seven percent of people lived in poverty in 2014, official data show.

In a separate vote on Sunday, Swiss voters also clearly rejected a proposal to require state-controlled companies, such as Swisscom, not to seek to make a profit.

The government had warned that accepting the initiative would hurt the companies' competitiveness and could lead to higher taxes.

(Additional reporting by Michael Shields; Editing by Toby Chopra and Stephen Powell)

Swiss voters reject 'money for nothing' income plan | Reuters

[Cold Pizza]

If it passed that would encourage mena immigrants to make it to Switzerland, IMO.

Universal Base pay is not necessary now.

[baldrick]

100 people in oakland will be testing this idea

Y Combinator is running a basic income experiment with 100 Oakland families ? Quartz

Universal basic income is a growing obsession in Silicon Valley. Wherever founders and venture capitalists gather or TED talks are given, there is likely to be speculation about an automated future where technology takes over most occupations (except theirs of course), and the jobless forever outnumber the jobs.

Given that the engine of this future economy will be in Silicon Valley, it’s fitting that the region’s top startup accelerator, Y Combinator, would do some research on the subject of what will happen to us humans in the age of automation. On Tuesday, Oakland was selected as the site of Y Combinator’s pilot experiment, in which it will give about 100 families a minimum wage. The city was chosen for its social and economic diversity, alongside concentrated wealth and inequality—a good starting point for the US at large.