Thread: Rememberance Sunday

I just watched the last post being performed at the Gabba during the Australian v South African test match.

Perhaps: ... To Roland Aubrey Leighton (27 March 1895 – 23 December 1915 )

Perhaps some day the sun will shine again,
And I shall see that still the skies are blue,
And feel once more I do not live in vain,
Although bereft of You.

Perhaps the golden meadows at my feet
Will make the sunny hours of spring seem gay,
And I shall find the white May-blossoms sweet,
Though You have passed away.

Perhaps the summer woods will shimmer bright,
And crimson roses once again be fair,
And autumn harvest fields a rich delight,
Although You are not there.

Perhaps some day I shall not shrink in pain
To see the passing of the dying year,
And listen to Christmas songs again,
Although You cannot hear.'

But though kind Time may many joys renew,
There is one greatest joy I shall not know
Again, because my heart for loss of You
Was broken, long ago.

Vera Brittain

Funeral Appeal After WWII Veteran Dies Alone

Several hundred people are set to turn up at the funeral of a 99-year-old RAF veteran who died without family or friends.

7:16pm UK, Saturday 09 November 2013


Hundreds of people are expected to attend a funeral of a war veteran they never knew after it emerged he died with no close friends or relatives.

Harold Jellicoe Percival served as RAF ground crew and helped with the famous Dambusters raids during the Second World War.

He died last month aged 99 in a nursing home.

Mr Percival's funeral will be held at 11am on Armistice Day at a crematorium in Lytham St Annes, Lancashire.

The veteran never married, had no children and has no close family members able to go to the service.

A request for servicemen first went out in a local newspaper
But after publicity in local newspapers and social media, funeral directors say they are now hoping for a good turnout.

The RAF Association tweeted that its "Northern area will be in attendance" so Mr Percival "won't be alone".

Afghanistan veteran Rick Clement, who lost both legs in 2010, has been using Twitter and Facebook to urge people to turn up to pay their respects.

"Need a big favour from any military or ex serving members. This fallen soldier at 99 years old is having a funeral on Monday," he said.

"It says he has no family to attend in Lytham St Anne's. If your in the area can you give him the send off he deserves."

He later thanked all those who had supported the appeal, saying: "Harold is going to get an amazing send off."

Comedian Jason Manford has also got behind the campaign.

Mr Percival lived in Penge, south London, before joining the RAF.

He was based in northwest England and became part of the ground crew which helped the Dambusters, the squadron which was initially formed to destroy dams in the Ruhr valley in Nazi Germany.

Mr Percival helped support the Dambusters' daring raid during World War Two
After working in Australia, he later retired to England and lived at a care home in Lytham St Annes.

Matron Janet Wareing said: "Harold was a lovely character, very strong-willed and independent.

"He was quite a private man, and he loved reading his Daily Telegraph every morning.

"We have already been contacted by military veterans who are intending to come, even though they have never met him.

"We've been told one group is looking to bring around 200 people to the service, which would be fantastic."

Mr Percival does have a nephew, David Worsell, but he is not able to attend so his son - Mr Percival's great nephew - will represent the family.

He was a distant relative of former British Prime Minister Spencer Perceval, the only PM to have ever been assassinated.

Funeral Appeal After WWII Veteran Dies Alone

Originally Posted by news.sky.com

WWII Veteran Dies Alone

Rest in Peace Harold Jellicoe Percival

What will I tell my daughter?
What will you tell your son?
Where were all the doves?
That we were nothing but a shadow,
A faceless generation?

What are we fightin' for?

source


youtube.com

Rest in peace old mate and thankyou for your service.

A Soldier

He is that fallen lance that lies as hurled,
That lies unlifted now, come dew, come rust,
But still lies pointed as it plowed the dust.
If we who sight along it round the world,
See nothing worthy to have been its mark,
It is because like men we look too near,
Forgetting that as fitted to the sphere,
Our missiles always make too short an arc.
They fall, they rip the grass, they intersect
The curve of earth, and striking, break their own;
They make us cringe for metal-point on stone.
But this we know, the obstacle that checked
And tripped the body, shot the spirit on
Further than target ever showed or shone.

Robert Frost

Just finished watching the Service of Remembrance from the Albert Hall on UK T/V as usual very moving and well organised. It makes one realise just how lucky we are to have had service men from many many nations who fought and in some cases died for our freedom today. By stopping the power hungry maniacs in Germany and Japan from literally taking over the world in the 1940's.

Having been a child in UK during the German blitz on England not knowing if tomorrow will be them same I wonder just how today's materialistic society would cope with literally loosing everything they own (as our family did twice) in one single explosion with no insurance or credit or compensation to replace it. It also pays to remember that German civilians were put in the same situation by allied air forces between 1940 and 1945.

If it had not been for Nations standing up to the Germans and Japanese we would not be taking part in any forum in Thailand today, the Thais would be used as slaves by the Japanese and not trading partners.

Makes the Rice Pledge scheme and the Amnesty Bill look very small change!

That's a very interesting question. Most of the world in the 1940's was rural, or not far removed from it. People could build a fire, butcher an animal, cook over a fire, and deal with many of their medical issues.

People also didn't have a lot of 'stuff'. They could, and did, carry on with a few cook pots, a blanket and maybe an extra set of clothes.

Today's entitled, self-absorbed residents of 'first world' countries would probably die out fairly quickly.

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

That's a very interesting question. Most of the world in the 1940's was rural, or not far removed from it. People could build a fire, butcher an animal, cook over a fire, and deal with many of their medical issues.

People also didn't have a lot of 'stuff'. They could, and did, carry on with a few cook pots, a blanket and maybe an extra set of clothes.

Today's entitled, self-absorbed residents of 'first world' countries would probably die out fairly quickly.

UK and Europe during the early 1940's had a lot more heavy and dirty industrialisation than today (coal mines/steel works/foundries/shipyards/factories etc) but workers in those days usually had only the bare essentials in their homes, which most only rented as they could not afford the £360:00 to buy a house. UK average wage was in the region of £4:00 per week for 12 hours a day six days a week. Mortgages were not even heard of for blue collar workers or even skilled manual workers.

Heating was by coal fire in one room of the house it was not uncommon in mid winter to have to scrape the ice off the inside of a bedroom window in the morning. Only the 'posh' had any form of water heating system for toiletries other than a galvanised bucket on the gas stove or fire.

As for credit (hire purchase as it was known) only white collar workers were even considered for these loans usually after grovelling to their respective bank manager.

Also a family had to provide for their medical medical bills,of all types, as there was no NHS in those days. Teeth were often pulled by either the local barber or ones self as dentists were way out of most of the population available finances.

Not too many of us around now that remember what people call "the good old days".

I was born in '49, but my grandparent's house still had an ice house, where blocks of ice cut from the lake in the winter and covered in sawdust from the mill were used to keep produce cool in the summer months.

Originally Posted by Brian Stocks

Just finished watching the Service of Remembrance from the Albert Hall on UK T/V as usual very moving and well organised. It makes one realise just how lucky we are to have had service men from many many nations who fought and in some cases died for our freedom today. By stopping the power hungry maniacs in Germany and Japan from literally taking over the world in the 1940's.

You know, I think this freedom thing is a post-war addition to British propaganda. I have here speeches of 3 celebrity time witnesses, and they use 'freedom' only once. Between them. 'British Empire' in contrast countless times. Seems they were concerned about that. Now that didn't work, and it really wasn't Hitlers fault that it crumbled. Rather America's. So how comes you adopt their propaganda, sort of adding insult to injury? To produce the illusion you got something out of this war?

Romancing war and militarism.
How lovely.

Civilised.

Quite why we are all expected to commemorate past wars is probably worth some examination.

The first world war is now 100 years ago, as near as dammit. It was a catastrophe for all concerned and marked the last fling of competing empires clinging to the notion that there had be a balance of powers. Stupid, utterly pointless and without any merit whatsoever. That millions went willingly through that mincing machine is a matter of profound regret but is possibly only worth remembering as an example of just how stupid humanity can be when in the thrall of idiot generals and pompous politicians. Frankly, not worth remembering any more than the war in the Crimea.

The second? Well, it was simply a fight for survival against perverted doctrines propounded by demagogues pandering to sheep. The allies won and the rest is history. So why do folk, particularly the Brits and Antipodeans, keep harking back and praising the combatants et al in such a slavish manner? Lest we forget, is it? Well, there is an entire generation growing up who haven't a clue about it and couldn't give a flying toss, not least because it has no relevance. Oh, we should honour those who sacrificed themselves so that we can loll about in democratic freedom, you say. What utter bollocks. They fought for themselves and their own interests, the same as we all do now. Wittering on about some higher purpose tending the candle of freedom etc is just tawdry editorialisation serving the purposes of the redundant, the sentimental and establishments capitalising on nostalgia.


Nothing matters very much and very little matters at all.

More Vietnamese were slaughtered by our American partners than all the British soldiery and civilian deaths since 1900.

Possibly worth more pause for thought, n'est - ce pas?

Lest we forget, is it? Well, there is an entire generation growing up who haven't a clue about it and couldn't give a flying toss, not least because it has no relevance.


It has relevance gents, as this post of yours would be written in German without it

Originally Posted by pompeysbroke

Lest we forget, is it? Well, there is an entire generation growing up who haven't a clue about it and couldn't give a flying toss, not least because it has no relevance.

It has relevance gents, as this post of yours would be written in German without it

All the lovely myths are in this thread already. That it was about freedom. That you would be speaking German if he won. That Hitler was after world domination. What with? He had no fleet. He did nothing to try and control the French empire after France's defeat, he couldn't. You can comb his writings and speeches, and there is not a single time the desire to control the world mentioned. He didn't have issues with the Brits, and no desire to wage war on them. He had grievances with the Poles, and they were justified.

To supply East Prussia seperated from the main body of Germany in particular with coal, the trains had to pass trough Poland. The Poles had cut the connection for years.

The Poles conducted pogroms against the German minority in the lands that had fallen to them after WW1. About 5,000 were killed, 80,000 refugees lived in camps behind the German border.

And they invaded another German enclave, the city of Danzig.

The negotiation with Poland led nowhere, there was no option left but war. We have the benefit of hindsight knowing that Hitler ran Poland over and that was it. It looked differently for the contemporaries. Poland had waged war on every neighbour between WW1 and 2, and won them all. In size and population not much smaller than Germany, and it was them who had stopped the advance of the Red Army in 1923. They had a strong military and were confident, also hoped for a 2 front war against Germany with France and UK attacking from the West. They didn't. Instead, Poland was also invaded by the USSR, and curiously, neither France nor UK declared war on them.



Hitler proposed peace to the UK and retreat from Poland more than 25 times, amongst them when he let the British corps escape at Dunkirk. Churchill wasn't interested. That's one of the guys who were more after world domination than Hitler. Stalin was another.

In The Pink

So Davies wrote: ‘This leaves me in the pink’.
Then scrawled his name: ‘Your loving sweetheart, Willie’.
With crosses for a hug. He’d had a drink
Of rum and tea; and, though the barn was chilly,
For once his blood ran warm; he had pay to spend.
Winter was passing; soon the year would mend.

But he couldn’t sleep that night; stiff in the dark
He groaned and thought of Sundays at the farm,
And how he’d go as cheerful as a lark
In his best suit, to wander arm in arm
With brown-eyed Gwen, and whisper in her ear
The simple, silly things she liked to hear.

And then he thought: to-morrow night we trudge
Up to the trenches, and my boots are rotten.
Five miles of stodgy clay and freezing sludge,
And everything but wretchedness forgotten.
To-night he’s in the pink; but soon he’ll die.
And still the war goes on—he don’t know why.

Siegfried Sassoon Feb 1916

I have recently visited some memorials in France to pay respects to family members who never made it through Somme/Arras/Cambrais. Some were jolly unlucky chappies, having survived the Somme first time round only to fail the second time in 1918.

The cemeteries are still beautifully preserved and hats off to the French for keeping them that way.

I watced the Remembrance on tv. from the Cenotaph at 11 am. and it was a superb tribute to all the present and past.
Places like Fiji who supply so many of our SAS and the Gurkhas, none braver.
I wasn't very happy to see the Pakistani ambassador laying a wreath though.

^^
Europe might have been a better place if we did?

^
Not sure they supply that many SAS soldiers and even less Gurkha's. I certainly never met any and I was even less happy to see politicians in general laying a wreath, despicable creatures they are.

If We where all speaking German now,without ever knowing another language,it would not be an issue,would it.

Having read some of the posts made I just wonder just where some of these people are coming from.
War and the destruction and misery it causes to anyone involved is not romantic but utter sheer purgatory. No one is ever the real winner, it is not like the movies, as for the descenters about British and American intervention through out the centuries (I will admit mistakes were made) yes in many cases their present FREEDOM of speech and actions has evolved because of this intervention. I just fervently hope that these people, who seem to dismiss others sacrifices, never have to face the same situation.

Services of remembrance such as this should never be abandoned as irrelevant they should remind all nations of the futility and misery of any war in the long run.
Also the need for vigilance by every one to see that predatory maniacs can never prevail again.

^The extermination of all non-aryan types might be though