Thread: How much is a fair bribe?

^ you need to up the stakes (steaks?). Every time he asks for somethimg ask for something in return - some piece of legislation or some sort of tax code etc. he will soon get bored.

Revenue Department is a huge pain in the ass the first year and waste a lot of time better spent during the critical startup phase of your business. The good news is they are less meddlesome after that.

In our case we worked through it without paying any bribes. Some Thai 'facilitators' (accountants/lawyers, etc) are quick to suggest tea money when often that isn't going to be as effective as it should be, or used to be.


My wife is a manager at an accountants and they do not pay 'under the table' they just make sure they know what they need to produce. She deals with foreign business and she said the best way is to get the Farlang to sign the paperwork and never go in person to the Rev Dept. If they need they can go to the business address.

"when often that isn't going to be as effective as it should be, or used to be"

My wife said that the above is true, the Government has moved forward regarding backhanders At least in the rev Dept.

I'm far from saying under the table doesn't happen and I'm no William who posts here with some great advice. I've not got a clue as I leave it all to the wife.

In my 12 years working in Thailand's legal industry I was only once approached about the subject of a bribe. I told them I didn't do it (pay bribes) and that was the end of it.

I did, however, know a lawyer in BKK who regularly told his clients that the government would expect to be paid a bribe. Client paid lawyer and as far as I am aware, lawyer never paid government.

Lawyers sometimes tell you things because they think that's what you want to hear - not necessarily because it s true. And in one form or another, I saw a lot of that in Thailand to the extent I felt dirty working in the profession in the end.

IMO, if they're in a position of trust, you can't trust them. If they're not in a position of trust, there's a chance they might be above board. I seriously doubt if anyone in Thai government has gotten ahead by being honest, hardworking and proud.

timber, PM me your number. Let's see if I can help...

Poor lad, trying to do everything by the book and getting fucked over by the very people who are supposed to make the law. My advice is to keep your cool and as politely as you can muster say you will get everything he wants after you have consulted your family lawyer or some high ranking official family member because you do everything that way and have done since you arrived in Thailand.

I hope this works... either way, karma will get him.

Originally Posted by Anchovy

Poor lad, trying to do everything by the book and getting fucked over by the very people who are supposed to make the law. My advice is to keep your cool and as politely as you can muster say you will get everything he wants after you have consulted your family lawyer or some high ranking official family member because you do everything that way and have done since you arrived in Thailand.

I hope this works... either way, karma will get him.

Alternatively you've got a good sized mortar an pestle !

Don't pay if you're 90% in compliance, just finish it up.
Most of what they had me do in my massage shop was a good idea away. Such as emergency lights and proper fire extinguishers and such. We went around and around a bit about our uniforms.(they thought they were too sexy)
After we complied and got licensed some young Thai twats(undercover police) were sent around to pose as customers to spy. We thought it was a weak ruse.

Thanks for all the help guys, good advice here. I'm going to stick to my guns and not pay the bribe, and get some help from the family to clear it up. My biggest fear is them coming in here and trying to press some obscure rule that will cause me to either spend alot more money or have to temporarily close, I guess we'll see. One thing that blows my mind is the fact that the "revenue" department is coming in here and telling me to change certain aspects of my kitchens, dining room etc. What does it have to do with their department? When I finish with these guys will there be another department knocking on my door?

Without reading through their website, what actually are the Revenue Dept, responsible for?

I was under the impression this department was there to register my business, and set up my taxation. Not to tell me to put in more grease traps.

Originally Posted by Timber

One thing that blows my mind is the fact that the "revenue" department is coming in here and telling me to change certain aspects of my kitchens, dining room etc.

Very good point. Whathe FK do they know about kitchens?

Originally Posted by jandajoy

Originally Posted by Anchovy

Poor lad, trying to do everything by the book and getting fucked over by the very people who are supposed to make the law. My advice is to keep your cool and as politely as you can muster say you will get everything he wants after you have consulted your family lawyer or some high ranking official family member because you do everything that way and have done since you arrived in Thailand.

I hope this works... either way, karma will get him.

Alternatively you've got a good sized mortar an pestle !

I'm sure Timba has also.

Timber, if your business is in order and you have the documentation of what the compliance issue are and you meet the requirements + if you and your family is strong in the community I'd sit it out.

The LOS is full of Tb5,000 gangsters, when push turns to shove they also have families and careers at stake.
Unless the whole department is rotten to the bone , most of these individual "entrepreneurs" tend to back off when the going gets a bit tough.

Originally Posted by Timber

I just got out of a meeting with the Revenue Department to finish setting up my business. The guy came in and looked around my restaurant and proceeded to tell me things that need to be changed and added some more requirements to the constantly expanding list of documents I need. This is my 3rd meeting with them, each time I come up with the required documents they come up with some more. My interpreter informed me that this will go on until I pay a bribe. "How much then?" I ask. "I don't know, he'll tell us next week." I've been avoiding paying these guys off because I don't want to start a trend of this and that office coming here to get paid off. I'd rather do it all legit but it appears that this is impossible, they'll just make up requirements until I succumb to the payoff. Allegedly if I pay these guys off no one else will come in here to "inspect" etc. So my questions are; how much should I allow myself to be pillaged for? Has anyone else had to jump through these hoops and how did you fare in the end? Is there anyone running a business here that hasn't been extorted? Where does it end? Thanks for the feedback.

There is no fair bribe.
Because there should not be any bribe in the first place.
I, for one, will lose some business but will never pay any.

Well, in this case, you might lose all business if your license to operate depends on it ...

I agree with you in principle, though.

Don't pay any bribes if you can. The Thais perceive this a sign of weakness.

What I do is buy a nice fruit basket and the look on their face when you hand it to them is priceless.

It's kinda like "What the fcuk is this farang giving me, with a stupid grin on his face and with his teeth clenched". Then you step away from him and give him a very proper Thai wai and the cnut is in your hands then. He has to wai back and through shear frustation that his not gonna get his wedge, will settle with his nice fruit basket and fcuk off.

Works for me everytime and the Thais don't know how to handle it.

Very rarely come back and if they do I will have another fruit basket at the ready.

About 350 Baht the last time I brought one.

^, I like that, I'm going to have one when he gets here.

Originally Posted by Timber

^, I like that, I'm going to have one when he gets here.

Timber it really, really works.
Act more Thai then they are and it completely stumps em.

I have been asked to video it and for sure I will next time. Got the CCTV in place already.

^ I tried chocolates once at the FDA and was refused. But I love the fruit basket idea!

I also thought about trying to get a certain obstructivist bureaucrat 'reassigned' by bringing some lavish gift directly to their office, like a case of Johnny Black, or 2 mil in a snack box...

Originally Posted by johnbkk

^ I tried chocolates once at the FDA and was refused. But I love the fruit basket idea!

I also thought about trying to get a certain obstructivist bureaucrat 'reassigned' by bringing some lavish gift directly to their office, like a case of Johnny Black, or 2 mil in a snack box...

Even in the best of circumstances 2 mil in a pasty bag does not seem to alleviate the bureaucratic headaches encountered LOS.