Thread: Mud, bamboo and alternative building materials

What about a steel or aluminium roof?

Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog

What about a steel or aluminium roof?

How guache.

What about a steel or aluminium roof?

Could do. Because the roof is not going to be done by me and because it's going to be a standard shop-bought solution, it doesn't really excite me and I haven't - probably stupidly - given it a lot of thought.

Thanks for your answers very intriguing and informative! I think they call what your doing with the bags and rubble super adobe, so this will be your foundation wall (stem wall) which will give you a rain barrier between your adobe and ground?

Yes, exactly. It's basically super adobe for the foundations. And yes again. It's there to get the adobes off the ground and away from water and termites.

Or are you thinking more in lines with bigger bag easier to lay quicker to lay etc(is there a reason you're not using blocks like durox or for that matter just stone)?

I bought the smallest bags I could find. I don't have one here but I think it's about 30 cm x 50 cm when packed. I wouldn't want to go any bigger because they weigh a fucking ton when they're full of rubble. I think that - at least for me - the advantages of doing fewer bags would be seriously outweighed by getting shagged out moving big bags around. I'm sure what durox is but I guess it's some kind of manufactured block. As far as I can judge, gravel has the least emboddied energy which is why I'm using that.

Have you had any more thoughts on the possibility of rammed earth, i think a building like this in thailand would certainly stand out it would be some achievement. sometimes hobbies become reasons to think about doing things as a business, do you think this could be done(you seem fairly active and highly informed on the subject)?

I would love to do rammed earth - I think it looks beautiful - but I'm just not sure of my technical abilities; this is my first foray into building and rammed earth is much more technical than adobe. I'm also not sure whether it would be possible to get the pneumatic tampers in Thailand. I've done some hand-tamping and for small areas it's possible but doing a whole house by hand would be a horror. Perhaps when everything is done, I might build a rammed earth sala in the garden. As I said above, I'm sure there's a market for natural building in Thailand, though it won't be huge, but I can't see myself taking advantage of it. I've decided that being poor but idle is the way forward; as long as I have enough money for cow shit and cabbage seeds, I'll be happy.

You certainly seem to have the right temperament and understanding, more then most your practicality demonstrates this in your reasoning and method!

Thank you but a lot of this stuff really isn't that difficult. Building - at least on the domestic scale - has been done by regular people for millennia. Unfortunately, we've allowed others to take over and commercialise this and many other areas of our lives when we're quite capable of doing it ourselves.

I am wanting badly to be in a position you are, and this is sometimes reflected in my short naive comments about such and such a thing. However its not for a lack of knowledge though only theory in reading which is why sometimes i come up a bit short on practical through put and what indeed are real conclusions to building in this way!

I hope you can get building soon!

Originally Posted by Rural Surin

Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog

What about a steel or aluminium roof?

How guache.

How ignorant.

Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog

What about a steel or aluminium roof?

Steel/colorbond is good, lighter than tiles, which means less materials and labor. With insulation it's also much cooler. I'd been thinking about using coconut fibre as insulation and today I read it's already being done in wall cavities. This is a very sustainable material, but I'm not sure how you'd use in in a roof.

Over the weekend I saw a matting made from palm oil fiber, this stuff is being used as a mulch for laying on top of soil, but it also looks very suitable for insulation.

Is the matting expensive....compared to straw say ?

Originally Posted by Texpat

Wondering how bamboo will hold together after 10 years of moisture/drying cycles.

A well built house made from borax treated bamboo should last decades. Take a look at your average Thai concrete house, they generally look pretty shite after 20 years.

Originally Posted by Texpat

What do you figure the strength might be?

Pound for pound bamboo is stronger than mild steel. It can handle hurricanes better than timber and earthquakes better than concrete.

Originally Posted by Texpat

I'm no engineer, but this thread has provided more than a few laughs.

Obviuosly not an engineer, most I've spoken to are impressed with bamboo. What really cracks me us is when ppl build western style houses over here. After building a place that costs over a million baht, the family ends up spending all their time under a bamboo and thatch lean-to because the house is too hot!

Originally Posted by Texpat

Why don't the metropolitian authorities of Bangkok, KL and Singapore build their bridges and high rises and landmarks from bamboo?

Bamboo scafolding is common through out Asia. In China they have made a prefab bamboo bridge that can handle 8 ton trucks. The stuff has played a major role Asian cultures, so using it to build landmarks would be fitting.

Originally Posted by Texpat

Perhaps they're missing something.

Construction grade bamboo only needs to be three years old and because the mother plant isn't killed it can be harvested every year. Realizing the need for sustainable resource the world is starting to catch on to the potential of this material.

Although I think it'll be a while before it's common in Texas, judging from the politicians, appears their a little slow down there!

Originally Posted by Nawty

Is the matting expensive....compared to straw say ?

I have no idea, I'm keen to find out, looks a little like those rough door mats. Apparently it's made in Krabi, that's all I know. Over the weekend I went to a royal project in NN where they had a sample. If you have time the place is worth a look, nice organic vegie gardens and other stuff like bio-diesel.

Smithson -

What type of bamboo do you plan to use?

Will you use specialized builders or are you comfortable in your plans to use any mother and their uncle?

Are you going to just be using bamboo or will it be coupled with other materials like for the roof or foundation wall?

are you going to be connected to mains water electric or go solo and collect and generate yourself?

look forward to your plans!

Originally Posted by benlovesnuk

Smithson -

What type of bamboo do you plan to use?

Will you use specialized builders or are you comfortable in your plans to use any mother and their uncle?

Are you going to just be using bamboo or will it be coupled with other materials like for the roof or foundation wall?

are you going to be connected to mains water electric or go solo and collect and generate yourself?

look forward to your plans!

At this stage I have no firm plans, it's just an idea I'm toying with, as I'm impressed with some of the stuff I've seen on the net. Considering most Thais struggle remembering their way home, putting them in charge of anything is scary.

^ Here's their site ศูนย์à¸[at]ูมิรัà¸�ษ์ธรภ£à¸¡à¸Šà¸²à¸•à¸´ - Home

Basically, head for the big dam where they do the rafting. It's right near there. They also have the compressed bricks ppl where talking about earlier. I've noticed a lot of them being used in NN, no need for mortar. They are selling close by for 11B each.

Originally Posted by Dan

Why not make a small panel, plaster it with earth and see what happens? It shouldn't take long.

I don't even have the time to do that. Even if I did, it seems ridiculous to spend time laboring when I could pay someone a fraction of what I earn. The problem is finding someone willing to give it a go. Thais are lazy, most of all they hate exercising their brains. They may be willing to work with concrete, but mixing mud and sand would be below them.

If I was living in the north, I would hire someone who was doing adobe and then supervise their work. Have you considered that?

I guess it depends what one's motivation is. I could certainly go to work, pay someone to labour and come out on top but that's not really what I want. I've never seen one's life as being amenable to some kind of time-and-motion/cost-benefit analysis (though I realise it's a common enough stance); part of the reason for doing this is precisely so that I can do it myself. It may turn out that I have no option but to pay someone but really I'm more interested in the process than in the product.

Its like Lily said...she got all hoity toity asking why we bother to have a maid or a nanny.

Simply cos why would you want to wash dishes when you can pay someone to do it for 200b a day.....sheesh.

Originally Posted by Smithson

Thais are lazy, most of all they hate exercising their brains. They may be willing to work with concrete, but mixing mud and sand would be below them.

strange, I have found the opposite to be true

I did work in a factory in the Uk once, and they were a really lazy bunch. As soon as the boss went out, they would all play cards. They hated to think or do anything different.

Originally Posted by DrAndy

Originally Posted by Smithson

Thais are lazy, most of all they hate exercising their brains. They may be willing to work with concrete, but mixing mud and sand would be below them.

strange, I have found the opposite to be true

I did work in a factory in the Uk once, and they were a really lazy bunch. As soon as the boss went out, they would all play cards. They hated to think or do anything different.

I guess most ppl working in factories are/become lazy thinkers. I've got a heap of staff in Bkk, they're good workers, but will never make a decision or think for themselves. Thais love repetitive work and hate responsibility and deadlines.

I think they're are a lot of smart hard working ppl here, but they're all self employed.

I am getting more and more enthused to build a bamboo house.

Smithson - maybe this is could be of interest to you as it demonstrates rammed earth and bamboo construction.
LIFE

Here is a reply from the organizer of the event:



Dear Ben,

Thanks for your interest in our project.

For this project, the rammed earth was to have a characteristic strength of 1 MPa to support the roof structure. The structure itself is one-storey and so the gravity loads where not excessively high.

The local soil was used and can be classified as sandy with the size between coarse to medium.
The proposed mix comprises of: (a) 10 parts by mass of earth; (b) 1 part by mass of cement; and (c) 1 part by mass of water.

When compressive strength tests were carried out, strengths of 2 MPa were observed.

On site, mechanical tampers were used to ram the earth as powered by a generator.

Regards
Chee Leong

We've just completed our first bamboo building.



Joints were made using nuts and bolts.







The guy standing on top was the leader, we didn't have a plan, just a small scale model made from bamboo skewers. Considering it was his first time working like this I think he did a pretty good job.



The size of the slab is 3m x 7m, bamboo was used in the place of most rebar, although there is still some steel. I'm hoping to use this 'shed' to treat bamboo over the coming months.

Around NY we will be removing the roof and timber sections of our small house, only the concrete columns will remain. The main purpose of the building was to get some hands on experience and provide storage/workspace.

Looks pretty f*cking good. Was the bamboo pressure-treated with borax & varnished? Is that what you're doing for the roof on your house? What did you learn about building with bamboo? Questions, questions,....

This gave me an opportunity to put theory into practice. Bamboo is labor intensive, but with a bit of practice I think you could get pretty fast. The guy doing the work is very cluey, he figured out the bolting thing very quickly, the other two weren't so fast to catch on.

Some of the bamboo was treated, but not all. Even though it's been varnished, the beetles will attack it. I'm not too worried though, my main aim was to get the experience and see if the workers could get a grip on it. Eventually I'll build something nicer there using the same concrete slab and column support.

The poles were sanded a varnished, I'd like to find a natural finish, like tung oil. Sanding back the bamboo also seems a waste, besides being more work, the outer skin of bamboo is very hard so it's a shame to remove it.

^ Also, yes, this sort of style is what we plan for the roof of the house, but nicer. Exposed bamboo trusses on a 45 pitch with rooms and a balcony in the roof space to give views over the mountains and provide a cool area to sleep at night.