Thread: President Obama News Thread

"Q&A: Obama's birth certificate"


BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate
Page last updated at 07:47 GMT, Tuesday, 4 August 2009 08:47 UK

Hes a bloody Yank!

Originally Posted by robuzo

Originally Posted by venturalaw

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, since both of his parents were not US citizens, if he were born outside of the US, he was not a natural-born citizen and therefore not eligible.

I thought his Ma was from Kansas. So, Da is from Kenya. If BO was born there, would he be an alien?

When you say born there, you mean Kenya? He would not be eligible to serve as the President, or Vice President of the US. There are those who argue that since only one parent was a US citizen, he is not considered natural born even though born in the US. The arguement is based upon his father being a Kenya citizen. However, his mother being only 18 at the time of his birth (a naturalized citizen must reside in the U.S. for 10 years, with 5 of those years being after age 16, before giving birth), arguably under the law at that time was not a citizen for the proscribed 5 years prior thereto. In any event, due to BO's father being a citizen of Kenya, an alternative jursidiction (Kenya) conceivably could lay claim to BO as it's citizen. Therefore, at best his citizenship, if ever acquired, would be via naturalization if he were born in Kenya - ergo he would not be deemed a 'natural-born' citizen and therefore ineligible to serve as President or Vice President.

He was born in Hawaii- no intelligent person questions this- but I would like to encourage the idiot right-wingers to continue obsessing with this. Post as many messages to as many boards as you can, write and mail letters to editors of every paper, spend a lot of time talking amongst yourselves. Stay busy with this, please. Remember, a black man (half-black anyway) is president- this is unacceptable!

If we are such idiots, why would it matter how we 'obsess' or waste our time? Your logic is flawed. Why state concern about how we are spending our time? It makes no sense since, according to you, we are 'idiot' right-wingers and therefore could never effect your way of thinking or political positioning.
However, I'm not advocating one way or the other regarding where he was born or if he is eligible to serve as President. He was sworn into the Office by the Chief Justice. Therefore he IS the President. At least for now.

Originally Posted by venturalaw

If we are such idiots, why would it matter how we 'obsess' or waste our time? Your logic is flawed. Why state concern about how we are spending our time? It makes no sense since, according to you, we are 'idiot' right-wingers and therefore could never effect your way of thinking or political positioning.

My "logic is flawed"? (seriously, you made me LOL, cheers! Nobody on TD does self-parody quite like you, VL!) Anyway, it's because it keeps you from causing real trouble. Better for you to be chasing ghosts, or your own tails.

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, I'm not advocating one way or the other regarding where he was born or if he is eligible to serve as President. He was sworn into the Office by the Chief Justice. Therefore he IS the President. At least for now.

"However, I'm not advocating one way or the other" That's a good thing, because in the face of your intellectual powers Obama would be doomed. Just kidding. . .I kid you, VL. But you should stop pretending to play both sides of the fence, it's a silly and transparently false attempt to try to seem even-handed.

Originally Posted by Panda

"Q&A: Obama's birth certificate"

BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate
Page last updated at 07:47 GMT, Tuesday, 4 August 2009 08:47 UK

Hes a bloody Yank!

Well, I dunno. Why not release the whole doc then? Just coz this chick official says she "saw" the real thing is OK with y'all? If this was about a Republican Prez, you lot would be foaming at the mouth.
I quote from Panda's BBC linkie:

Has the Certificate of Live Birth been released?
It has not. But Dr Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health, has released a statement confirming that she has "seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen".



That's nice. Who the fek is she?

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Has the Certificate of Live Birth been released?
It has not. But Dr Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health, has released a statement confirming that she has "seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen".



That's nice. Who the fek is she?

Director of the Hawaii Department of Health. Hope that helps.

^ 555 Ya, I believed Clinton and Bush, too. Sorry, I don't believe anybody no more. If the doc is there, just fekin show it. No harm in that is there? Unless a little lie is behind it all.

Originally Posted by robuzo

Originally Posted by venturalaw

If we are such idiots, why would it matter how we 'obsess' or waste our time? Your logic is flawed. Why state concern about how we are spending our time? It makes no sense since, according to you, we are 'idiot' right-wingers and therefore could never effect your way of thinking or political positioning.

My "logic is flawed"? (seriously, you made me LOL, cheers! Nobody on TD does self-parody quite like you, VL!) Anyway, it's because it keeps you from causing real trouble. Better for you to be chasing ghosts, or your own tails.

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, I'm not advocating one way or the other regarding where he was born or if he is eligible to serve as President. He was sworn into the Office by the Chief Justice. Therefore he IS the President. At least for now.

"However, I'm not advocating one way or the other" That's a good thing, because in the face of your intellectual powers Obama would be doomed. Just kidding. . .I kid you, VL. But you should stop pretending to play both sides of the fence, it's a silly and transparently false attempt to try to seem even-handed.

I appreciate your humor, truly, but I'm not attempting to be even handed or play both sides of the fence. I make it no secret that I don't care for the man, and I wish he were not President. But my analysis (which some quesiton as worthy of posting) regarding citizenship was purely that - analytical, not in the spirit of advocacy.
I don't have the answer as to whether BO is a natural-born citizen - that is a factual distinction at least regarding one element of the issue (where he was born is subject to speculation since the original certificate of birth has never been produced, merely a computerized document). As I said, he is the President, for now. There is no arguing that fact.

BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate

"Have campaigners attempted to air their concerns in the courts?

A number of lawsuits have been filed by people who question Mr Obama's eligibility, but all of them have been dismissed at the earliest stages.
In July, Stefan Cook, a major in the US Army Reserve who was due to be deployed to Afghanistan, filed a lawsuit seeking to block his deployment, on the grounds that his orders were invalid, because President Obama was ineligible to serve as commander-in-chief. His case was dismissed."

The US courts seem to be satisfied that Obama is really a Yank by birth.

Could be the Dems are sitting back and having a bit of a laugh watching these Republicans run round in circles chasing their tail.

I want to talk about those two chickies released from N Korea. If they were captured at the border, and were in prison, how come they have major pieces of luggage to bring home? Carrying souvenirs, a baby, food?

Originally Posted by Panda

BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate

"Have campaigners attempted to air their concerns in the courts?

A number of lawsuits have been filed by people who question Mr Obama's eligibility, but all of them have been dismissed at the earliest stages.
In July, Stefan Cook, a major in the US Army Reserve who was due to be deployed to Afghanistan, filed a lawsuit seeking to block his deployment, on the grounds that his orders were invalid, because President Obama was ineligible to serve as commander-in-chief. His case was dismissed."

The US courts seem to be satisfied that Obama is really a Yank by birth.

Could be the Dems are sitting back and having a bit of a laugh watching these Republicans run round in circles chasing their tail.

You can hide anything.

Originally Posted by Panda

BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate

"Have campaigners attempted to air their concerns in the courts?

A number of lawsuits have been filed by people who question Mr Obama's eligibility, but all of them have been dismissed at the earliest stages.
In July, Stefan Cook, a major in the US Army Reserve who was due to be deployed to Afghanistan, filed a lawsuit seeking to block his deployment, on the grounds that his orders were invalid, because President Obama was ineligible to serve as commander-in-chief. His case was dismissed."

The US courts seem to be satisfied that Obama is really a Yank by birth.

Could be the Dems are sitting back and having a bit of a laugh watching these Republicans run round in circles chasing their tail.

The lawsuit was dismissed because BO is the President, not because he was eligible or not eligible to be sworn in as President. Do you understand the distinction?

Originally Posted by Panda

BBC NEWS | Americas | Q&A: Obama's birth certificate

"Have campaigners attempted to air their concerns in the courts?

A number of lawsuits have been filed by people who question Mr Obama's eligibility, but all of them have been dismissed at the earliest stages.
In July, Stefan Cook, a major in the US Army Reserve who was due to be deployed to Afghanistan, filed a lawsuit seeking to block his deployment, on the grounds that his orders were invalid, because President Obama was ineligible to serve as commander-in-chief. His case was dismissed."

The US courts seem to be satisfied that Obama is really a Yank by birth.

Could be the Dems are sitting back and having a bit of a laugh watching these Republicans run round in circles chasing their tail.

The Republicans seemed to have a good. . .chortle at the Democrats continuing to complain about the very dodgy, as in nakedly illegitimate way that Dubya was selected for the presidency by the Supreme Court. A lot of them, even loons like Pat Buchanan, are trying to do damage control re the birthers, but it is difficult because a) They don't want to alienate the "base," whom the elite despise but need, and b) The infotainment cable news networks love to put clowns like Orly Taitz on the teevee, because they are funny/crazy. It isn't as if there are serious problems to worry about, or that Obama deserves serious criticism for his craven obequiousness toward the Masters of the Universe (aka, Goldman).

I'm afraid that what the Straussians (and if you don't understand Leo Strauss you don't understand the lords of the Republican Party) fail to appreciate is that history shows that, once unleashed, the mob can be very difficult to get back under control.

Anyone interested in learning more about Strauss and his influence on the neocons should read this excellent article:
http://www.embeddedlive.com/pdfs/Harpers.pdf

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

^ What was the exchange? Nobody's saying anything about that.
And sending an ex-prez for two journo chicks? So, is Billy going to Iran next to get the three "students"?

Completely agree he must be our new kiss ass in the admin... Have temper tantrum, do our more 'notable' citizens wrong and we'll send our ass kisser daddy to get them back.. Great message it sends to "children throwing temper tantrums" as his wife put it..

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, since both of his parents were not US citizens, if he were born outside of the US, he was not a natural-born citizen and therefore not eligible.

I thought his Ma was from Kansas. So, Da is from Kenya. If BO was born there, would he be an alien?

Possibly pre 1986 which is what I tried in vane to explain to the counselor last night.. The term "natural-born" is being confused with "naturalized" in this conversational instance..

Originally Posted by Muadib

^ That isn't the law... If it were, the Terminator would be the president by now...

What?? Another attorney not well versed in his profession, do tell.... I wish you would have quoted him though as I had to open his post to see the focus of your objection..

In my previous debate with Ventura Law he used typical attorney speak and diversionary tactics to focus on the trivial use of the word "ability" over "eligibility" in my post instead of the important wording which was not trivial to the topic that being "naturalized" and not "natural-born" it seems that is occurring again today..

In summary, the issue with Obama is that post 1986 a citizen born outside of the states to one or more American citizens is considered "natural-born" just as if they were born in the US or eligible territories with all of the rights and privileges afforded them including running for President.

If born pre 1986 however as Obama was though, apparently there is some sticking points to this issue based on past law and the contention is that he is "naturalized" and not "natural-born"..Hence the debate..

Originally Posted by panama hat

Originally Posted by robuzo

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, since both of his parents were not US citizens, if he were born outside of the US, he was not a natural-born citizen and therefore not eligible.

So being born in Kansas means his mother isn't American?

There's reality and then there's venturalaw

This ridiculous myth has been debunked countless times. Both versions of the birth certificate have been produced.
Some people will never be satisfied because they are driven by hatred and racism.

Originally Posted by venturalaw

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

Originally Posted by venturalaw

However, since both of his parents were not US citizens, if he were born outside of the US, he was not a natural-born citizen and therefore not eligible.

I thought his Ma was from Kansas. So, Da is from Kenya. If BO was born there, would he be an alien?

When you say born there, you mean Kenya? He would not be eligible to serve as the President, or Vice President of the US. There are those who argue that since only one parent was a US citizen, he is not considered natural born even though born in the US. The arguement is based upon his father being a Kenya citizen. However, his mother being only 18 at the time of his birth (a naturalized citizen must reside in the U.S. for 10 years, with 5 of those years being after age 16, before giving birth), arguably under the law at that time was not a citizen for the proscribed 5 years prior thereto. In any event, due to BO's father being a citizen of Kenya, an alternative jursidiction (Kenya) conceivably could lay claim to BO as it's citizen. Therefore, at best his citizenship, if ever acquired, would be via naturalization if he were born in Kenya - ergo he would not be deemed a 'natural-born' citizen and therefore ineligible to serve as President or Vice President.

Now that's sensible, but we must not forget to add that this is pre 1986 law when the law was changed.. Though much of that criteria is still in place today...The primary determining factor here is the one American parent issue coupled with her age....

Haven't seen the pre 1986 version yet but assuming your contention is correct then the primary difference between the previous law which carries jurisdiction over Obama is that he had only one American parent at the time which in his case due to her age both parents would have to have been American for him to be considered "natural-born" if he was born in Kenya...
If that's the case and there is any Kenyan birth certificate even in existence it seems cut and dried, he's not a "natural-born" citizen and "INELIGIBLE" to be president..

So why is it such a mystery still?? Why is the birth certificate not being displayed?? Transparency?? .. Very dubious....

Jerome Corsi perpetrated a fraud, for which I would like to see him jailed.
In an interview with Obamas Kenyan auntie (or sumfin) conducted in Swahili, he deliberately had the transcript mistranslated. The Lady stated that Obama was born in the USA, in Hawaii. He translated that she said he was born in Kenya.

Originally Posted by Humbert

This ridiculous myth has been debunked countless times. Both versions of the birth certificate have been produced.
Some people will never be satisfied because they are driven by hatred and racism.

link? but even still, photo shop is your friend...

Originally Posted by Humbert

This ridiculous myth has been debunked countless times. Both versions of the birth certificate have been produced.
Some people will never be satisfied because they are driven by hatred and racism.

I agree. But there's a less nefarious factor at play too: plain, old, garden-variety, idiocy:

Originally Posted by DrivingForce

Originally Posted by Humbert

This ridiculous myth has been debunked countless times. Both versions of the birth certificate have been produced.
Some people will never be satisfied because they are driven by hatred and racism.

link? but even still, photo shop is your friend...

Besides the missing number, I didn't know Honolulu was a country.

??? don't see your point Jet, are you being facetious? Honolulu is only listed under "city, town or location of birth" it says nothing about Honolulu being a country?