DECISION AMERICA 2016: The Election Results Thread

[Cold Pizza]

The truth is people like scapegoats whether it's progressives in pantsuits, professionals bossing them around, the liberal media or minorities taking their jobs.

That attitude is dismissive of their concerns. A working class guy making $50K a year after years of hard work just wants to be left alone. After taxes he's making, what ... $40K a year at the most? Spends $20K of that on his mortgage and $6K a year on his truck payment. Now what's he down to? $14K a year to feed his family, maintain his vehicle to get back and forth to work? It's not a lot of money. It's so easy to apply labels to these people and ignore what their station in life really is. They raised 2-3 kids and were responsible adults. They pay their bills. They do the right thing most of the time. And then when they disagree with a progressive on something all we got is ... Bigot! ... Misogynist! ... Racist! ... Nah man, that shit doesn't cut it.

My cousin is one example (among others I know in this situation).

Education is irrelevant, but he's got an MA and makes $50K gross. There is *nothing* left at the end of the year to save and he have a used car (not a car payment guy) and one son.

Same of the buddies I grew up with that went into skilled job / vocational / Trades, etc.

Took time to get to $50K or so, and are saving basically nil, and they are not shoppers and don't buy gadgets or toys.

The HRC campaign + media ran a campaign theme will not resonate with many of these people.

[Cold Pizza]

It seems a lot of people who are provided healthcare through the ACA don't have the same opinion.

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

That's a high monthly payment for most people.

And are their deductibles?

[redhaze]

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

Or a small mortgage. For the wife and I, cheapest plan (Bronze) is $840. Two of us, both in our thirties. And it is absolute garbage insurance. $13,000 deductible between thee two of us before they kick in a nickel. For anything.

I'm afraid that's an inevitable consequence of having a Healthcare industry that can dictate policy and prices.

True, although a doubling or even 50% increase in a single suggests something unique about the recent increases that are better explained by problems with ACA.

[Dragonfly]

all this was predictable before it was voted on the floor, but for some reasons the Dems choose to ignore it as they were getting desperate to have it passed at all costs

costs now paid by the American public,

[Storekeeper]

It seems a lot of people who are provided healthcare through the ACA don't have the same opinion.

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

That's a high monthly payment for most people.

And are their deductibles?

The price was shocking enough I didn't want to know the deductible.

Seriously ... When I supported ACA I thought they were going to come up with something like TRICARE Prime. Naive me.

[Sumbitch]

$13,000 deductible between thee two of us before they kick in a nickel.

For every year? Ei that's disgusting.

[Dragonfly]

those costs seems a bit high, in France for that monthly cost, you would have full coverage no matter how many people in the family and no deductibles

[SKkin]

They feel like they're being punished for being responsible adults while irresponsible people are being rewarded for irresponsible behavior.

This...

btw SK, my daughter you think is so cool on FB, is one of the irresponsible ones. But I guess that's a failure on my part.

so, a lament for Eso, then...may he keep on truckin'...

Nope, no longer a mortgage and no 6k truck payment, just an irresponsible daughter with 4 children, the latter more expensive than the former. Some of the latter having to do with a working class ex-SIL who was not able to make an income that would support a family. But irresponsibility on his part as well.

[Cold Pizza]

It seems a lot of people who are provided healthcare through the ACA don't have the same opinion.

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

That's a high monthly payment for most people.

And are their deductibles?

The price was shocking enough I didn't want to know the deductible.

Seriously ... When I supported ACA I thought they were going to come up with something like TRICARE Prime. Naive me.

The ACA does not work and would fail on its own, but BO did DO something. I think (correctly?) That it was a start to doing at least something, as in alternative programs.

US healthcare is a shameful disaster, obviously.

[harrybarracuda]

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

Or a small mortgage. For the wife and I, cheapest plan (Bronze) is $840. Two of us, both in our thirties. And it is absolute garbage insurance. $13,000 deductible between thee two of us before they kick in a nickel. For anything.

I'm afraid that's an inevitable consequence of having a Healthcare industry that can dictate policy and prices.

True, although a doubling or even 50% increase in a single suggests something unique about the recent increases that are better explained by problems with ACA.

There's plenty wrong with it, primarily because the GOP gutted the legislation that was supposed to fund it, some GOP governors refused to allow it, and the Healthcare companies just want premiums from healthy people, they don't actually want to have to pay for sick people.

[tomcat]

The Republican motto for old-fashioned self-reliance: don't get sick if you can't afford to. That notion comes from a Congress where every member has generous government- provided health insurance. The goose has taken care of itself; the gander can go to the emergency room.

[Farangrakthai]

There's plenty wrong with it, primarily because the GOP gutted the legislation that was supposed to fund it, some GOP governors refused to allow it, and the Healthcare companies just want premiums from healthy people, they don't actually want to have to pay for sick people.

the system wasn't designed to work, IMO.

single payer like bernie was proposing (the u.k. has) would work and opening up the insurance markets so there is more competition might work.

but, someting in the middle won't work and bernie didn't win (thanks wikileaks/russia? for showing why he was at a disadvantage),

so, let's see what the republicans can do with the presidency and two houses.

b.t.w., it was dubya who expanded medicare and trump has said he's against lowering funds for s.s., medicare, etc.

[RPETER65]

Cheapest plan for my family of three using the WA state exchange site would be $931 a month.

Or a small mortgage. For the wife and I, cheapest plan (Bronze) is $840. Two of us, both in our thirties. And it is absolute garbage insurance. $13,000 deductible between thee two of us before they kick in a nickel. For anything.

I'm afraid that's an inevitable consequence of having a Healthcare industry that can dictate policy and prices.

True, although a doubling or even 50% increase in a single suggests something unique about the recent increases that are better explained by problems with ACA.

There's plenty wrong with it, primarily because the GOP gutted the legislation that was supposed to fund it, some GOP governors refused to allow it, and the Healthcare companies just want premiums from healthy people, they don't actually want to have to pay for sick people.

What would you expect, the healthcare companies wrote the legislation.

[Farangrakthai]

b.t.w., isn't it probably true that trump (the opposite of p.c.) won the white house because this politicial corrrectness (like safe spaces and triggier warningss) was taken too far and mainstream america wasn't having it (what was the new law debated about whether there should be a separate restroom for trannies and even small businesses would have to fork out the money to construct them). w.t.f.?

anyways, as you've probably read, without california, trump won the popular vote by 1 million (just saying that cali and ny aren't america, obviously).

[raycarey]

anyways, as you've probably read, without california, trump won the popular vote by 1 million (just saying that cali and ny aren't america, obviously).

anyways, as you obivously didn't read, you can't just subtract the votes of citizens in certain states because you don't agree with how they voted.

but let's just pretend it is possible....i want to subtract the votes of citizens in TX and TN.

what does that do to your absurd little game of fake math?

[raycarey]

As you've repeatedly said, Trump won the election, it's up to him to deal with the shit storm.

these trump worhshippers are the like the dog that chases a car every morning and then doesn't know what to do when it stops one day.

[Farangrakthai]

anyways, as you obivously didn't read, you can't just subtract the votes of citizens in certain states because you don't agree with how they voted.

that wasn't my main point which was:

b.t.w., isn't it probably true that trump (the opposite of p.c.) won the white house because this politicial corrrectness (like safe spaces and triggier warningss) was taken too far and mainstream america wasn't having it

anyways, regarding trump winning the popular vote without california is just pointing out that the country isn't what many liberals perceive it to be.

not that i care, but the democrats have now lost the senate, house, white house and the republicans control 2/3 of state legislatures and governorships.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.af89c6a183d5

it looks like Republicans will still control an all-time high 69 of 99 state legislative chambers. They'll hold at least 33 governorships, tying a 94-year-old record.

That means that come 2017, they'll have total control of government in at least 25 states, and partial control in 20 states. According to population calculations by the conservative group Americans for Tax Reform, that translates to roughly 80 percent of the population living in a state either all or partially controlled by Republicans.

raycarey, don't you think the democrats have taken this p.c nonsense too far?

[raycarey]

raycarey, don't you think the democrats have taken this p.c nonsense too far?

i have no idea what you consider to be "PC nonsense". although i would guess that most thoughtful people would consider it to be considerate and tolerant behavior.

ever notice that the people who cry about "PC" are straight, white, christian males (who are more of than not poorly educated)? why do you think that might be?


and to claim that trump won because political correctness "was taken too far" is ridiculous. while it may have been a contributing factor to some voters it by no means swung the election.

trump won for several reasons (fear, ignorance, income inequality, dislike of HRC, etc...) but again it doesn't matter.

he won....and now he (and you) own it.

enjoy.

[Cold Pizza]

not that i care, but the democrats have now lost the senate, house, white house and the republicans control 2/3 of state legislatures and governorships.

I have told Americans this dozens of times to dozens of different people -- not one of them said, "Yes," or "perhaps" when I said: the Dems need to change direction in some way.

[Cold Pizza]

trump won for several reasons (fear, ignorance, income inequality, dislike of HRC, etc...) but again it doesn't matter.

Ray, those voters were a small number of voters.

You're still missing the point, like almost every Dem supporter I know.

What was the number #1 issue for 18-34 year-old voters who voted for Trump:

the economy.

This was a very complex election with complex reasons for American Electoral Behavior

It's not that simple. It's very complex.

[raycarey]

What was the number #1 issue for 18-34 year-old voters who voted for Trump:

the economy.

clinton won 18-34 year olds by approximately 15 points.

and i specifically included income inequality in my reasons that people voted for trump.

[Topper]

and i specifically included income inequality in my reasons that people voted for trump.

People voted for Trump for the same reason they voted for Hitler...a resounding set of promises coupled with chants that his people could easily repeat....

Build that wall

Crooked Shillary

Earl Drinks Piss

[Cold Pizza]

What was the number #1 issue for 18-34 year-old voters who voted for Trump:

the economy.

clinton won 18-34 year olds by approximately 15 points.

and i specifically included income inequality in my reasons that people voted for trump.

I know.

My post - re-read it - was about the number #1 concern for 18-34 year olds that voted for Trump.

[Cold Pizza]

People voted for Trump for the same reason they voted for Hitler...a resounding set of promises coupled with chants that his people could easily repeat....

Take history.

Perhaps you can study online - if you can afford it.

Comparing Germany and it's economic conditions post WW1 to the USA today is exremely shallow, incorrect, and misguided.

[Humbert]

Take history.
Perhaps you can study online - if you can afford it.
Comparing Germany and it's economic conditions post WW1 to the USA today is exremely shallow, incorrect, and misguided.

Says the forum's self-proclaimed expert on history and politics with wide ranging connections in the halls of power who thinks the PM of Canada is Pierre Trudeau.

Trump won because of his appeals to nationalism, isolationism, patriotism, religious bigotry and his ability to lie without blinking.