Thread: REAL PIES

The pie floater is as South Australian as frog cakes, Haigh's and Coopers.
Once the staple of the late night (and often bleary-eyed) reveller, it has forged its place in the state's history and earned a spot with the National Trust as a heritage icon.
So what is it about the sometimes soggy pastry delight that has captivated generations?
It is a question that has been bugging Tanunda local Rhi O'Geraghty, who said her ex-husband had always turned up his nose at the pie and pea soup concoction.
"How did the iconic Adelaide cuisine, the pie floater, happen?"
Curious Adelaide thought reporter and former New South Welshman Nathan Stitt would be best placed to take an unbiased eye to the pie.
See what our readers had to say about the iconic South Australian pie floater in the comments below.

What is it?

To our south Aussie readers, feel free to skip this section because we don't want to tell you how to suck ... errr ... pies.
But for those uninitiated few and the rest of the country, put simply a pie floater is a meat pie inverted in pea soup with tomato sauce garnish. Yummy!
PHOTO: Pie floater with the sauce yet to be added. (YouTube)
Clearly, culinary licence is taken over the degree to which the pie is submerged, and consistency of the soup.
The floater was originally served 'fresh' from a mobile pie cart on the streets of Adelaide.
It is a connection which would ultimately help launch the dish into history.
To this day, most Adelaideans of a certain generation would have an enduring memory of the Balfour's Pie Cart outside the Railway Station on North Terrace in the CBD.
PHOTO: Late night revellers at the North Terrace pie cart in 1974. (Trove: Australian Women's Weekly)
Walter Marsh from the National Trust of SA conceded the dish must sound odd to outsiders.
"The really unique South Australian creation might sound strange in other parts of the country, but it is really beloved here," he said.
In his weekly newspaper column, ABC Adelaide personality Peter Goers has described pie floater consumption as a rite of passage.
"Pie floaters taste better if you're drunk," he said.

"Some would say you'd have to be drunk to eat one.

"It's always a sobering and moving experience requiring courage."
Phrases like "unique creation", "rite of passage" and "really beloved" reflect the food's historic significance.
The origin of pie

Whether it is an original South Australian creation or an idea borrowed from abroad, there's no question it has become "Adelaide's own".
History tells us pastry-cook James Gibbs emigrated to Adelaide from Scotland in the 1880s and set up one of the original pie carts on the corner of King William and Rundle streets.
He had worked at a brewery by day for six years to pay for his venture.
PHOTO: James Gibbs standing outside an early pie cart. (thepiecart.com.au)
The sudden popularity of his floaters meant he was able to expand with new carts quickly, prompting other new vendors and competing carts.
Further north, about the same time in the mid-north town of Port Pirie, baker Ern Bradley used a newspaper advertisement to invite movie-goers to "have a good supper" involving "hot pies ... and floaters".
PHOTO: A newspaper advertisement promoting pie floaters as a treat to enjoy after the movies. (Trove)
Australian food historian Jan O'Connell penned the book A timeline of Australian food.
In it, she suggested the inspiration for the floater likely came from northern England, where pea and pie suppers were a traditional form of "entertainment".
Whether Mr Gibbs or Mr Bradley or someone else was responsible for the curious combination, its popularity on the streets of Adelaide was clear from the start.
Carte Blanche

Despite a love affair that's endured almost 150 years, pie cart numbers actually peaked in the late 1800s with about 13 or so dotted about the city.
But pre World War I, that number started to drop, leaving 10 servicing the city.
During the depression, it was commonplace for dozens of unemployed to converge on the pie carts at closing time, seeking the generosity of pastry cooks willing to give away their unsold pies.
And by 1938, the ongoing decline in cart numbers was being lamented publicly by at least one journalist in the afternoon daily tabloid, The News.
"Hungry citizens will no longer know the warm intimacy of these sheltered canvas retreats ... honest hearts and sturdy stomachs will mourn the passing of these of the floater — and institution apparently peculiar to Adelaide — a hot pie launched on a sea of peas."
It was once the only way to get a cheap meal after hours.
The city's original late night drive-thru, if you will.
Pie carts a thing of the past

But by the late 1950s, just three carts remained and endured, at Norwood Parade, the GPO, and on North Terrace.
And by 2011, all three had vanished from our streets, with the North Terrace cart making way for the tram extension.
While two pie carts do operate temporarily outside Norwood Oval and the casino during football games, the permanent, late night pie cart is a thing of the past.
The nostalgia for the comfort food has inspired, some would say, questionable acts of devotion.
PHOTO: Police believe the thieves were only after the pies. (Trove)
At least one South Australian has spent time at a pie cart on his , while a pie floater craving apparently drove a group of starved bandits to commit a daring robbery.
A 1930 report in The Register said two would-be thieves chased a homeward bound pie cart.
Police later said while the piemen assumed the crooks wanted money, they were probably after the pies instead.
And then there has been the connection to local football.
Many a Redlegs supporter has popped out of the Norwood Oval in the city's inner east to nab a floater from the pie cart parked just outside the grounds.
Modern day meat

There is no doubt pie floater numbers have been in decline, but a devotee can still find the traditional fare on some bakery and pub menus.
There are also new interpretations of the icon.
PHOTO: An Adelaide pub has put a modern spin on the iconic pie floater dish. (ABC News: Nathan Stitt)
Adelaide's King's Head pub on King William Road has been inspired by the original floater served from the early pie carts, but head chef Lachy Cameron has given it a modern twist and flavour profile.
There's no off-cuts in this pie.
Instead the floaters hold braised wagyu beef and the soup is traded for a pea puree.
Mr Cameron reflected on why the pie floater has remained so popular.
"It's a bit different for South Australians," he said.
"I think because it's been here for such a long time, it's a nostalgic thing for a lot of people, it's a bit of a comfort food."
The verdict?

The conflicting claims to the floater's origin story make it difficult to bite down on where the very first floater was served, but it is likely it coincided with the first pie carts being licensed.
Australians' love of the humble pie coupled with the convenience of the pie cart probably fuelled its initial popularity and don't underestimate the role it played during the depression, lining the stomachs of the unemployed.
But its role as the only late night fast food option, uniting drinkers, truckers, cabbies and workers from all walks of life clearly cemented the humble floater in the collective consciousness of the state.
I

HomeLifeFood & Drink


THE BEST PLACES TO GO FOR A PIE IN BELFAST

Graeme Cousins
March 10, 2016



Pies have a pretty bad rep in terms of being the number one type of food associated with weight gain. You don’t hear fans at football matches singing, “Who ate all the chocolate fudge cake?”
Following extensive research we’ve found that there isn’t a massive pie culture in Belfast. Pies are not a regular fixture on most menus here.
However, that’s not to say you can’t get a great pie in Belfast – you just need to know where to look.
To that end, we’ve picked our top 7 pie makers and sellers in the city…
1. JOLLY PIES

Morning Star and other locations throughout Belfast

Jolly Pies are mainly event based but they also provide pies, quiches and sausage rolls to The Morning Star and also The Pantry Cafe & Kitchen at Crescent Arts Centre.
You’ll also find them at the Kingspan for Ulster Rugby matches or in the VIP section (should you be lucky enough to get in) at Tennent’s Vital.
Grass Fed Beef & Hilden Stout Pie is a big seller, but they’ve also got some mouth-watering seasonal specials including Pheasant, Smoked Bacon & Belfast Whiskey Pie and Venison, Red Cabbage & Dark Chocolate Pie.
They’ve also recently teamed up with Gallopers Ale to produce a pie for the Cheltenham Horse Racing Festival. The Gold Cup – Beef Cheek, Mushroom & Gallopers Ale Pie.
2. BARKING DOG

33-35 Malone Rd

It’s hard to look past the Beef Shin burger in the Barking Dog, but if you choose to cast your net a little further, this amazing Fish Pie will not let you down.
3. JAMES STREET SOUTH BAR & GRILL

21 James Street South

Especially for British Pie Week they’ve put together this amazing pie featuring the best of local meat and beer – Glenarm Steak & Gallopers Ale. This Gallopers stuff appears to be ready made for pies!
4. MADE IN BELFAST

1-2 Wellington St

You’ll not always find pie on the menu in Made In Belfast, but when you do it’s worth the wait. Highlights – or should that be pielights – include their Venison Pie, Sustainable Fish Pieand the slow cooked Shepherd’s Pie with County Antrim lamb and pinenut crust pictured above.
5. WHITES

2-4 Winecellar Entry

You’d expect to get old favourites in one of Belfast’s oldest pubs, and you’ll not be disappointed to see the menu is topped with a Steak & Guinness Pie. Best enjoyed beside the fire!
6. SWEET AFTON

12 Brunswick St

It says a LOT for the quality of the Fish Pie on offer that we’re willing to forgo our usual order of burger and chips. This gluten free offering is topped with a delicious combo of cheddar mash & poached egg and served with herb peas. And yes, the runny yoke of the egg mixes in perfectly with the mash…
7. LAVERY’S

12-18 Bradbury Pl

There’s a couple of pies on the menu in Lavery’s. For meat lovers there’s a Steak & Guinness Pie (one of those excellent ones with the detachable lid), but the good news for vegetarians is you can get a meat-free Shepherd’s Pie made with Quorn mince.

When I want a meat pie, I just ring up Marie. She's working for ConAgra now...

Mmmm?

Ingredients: Filling: Water, Beef and Binder Product (Beef, Water, Contains 2% or less of: Dextrose, Salt, Natural Flavor, Maltodextrin, Dried Whey, Dried Cauliflower, Sesame Oil, Soybean Oil, Modified Corn Starch, Sodium Phosphate, Caramel Color, Spice Extractives), Potatoes (Potatoes, Calcium Chloride), Beef Crumbles ...

Marie Callender's Beef Pot Pie, 16 Ounce - Walmart.com

^I'm not the "healthy eater" here @ TD...

Creampie Thai pic deleted by Flouncy. :/

Originally Posted by david44

Marie Callender's Beef Pot Pie, 16 Ounce - Walmart.com

@ that link:

Premium USDA beef. Just Like Home: Golden flaky crust made from scratch. From my kitchen to yours since 1948. Marie's Promise: No preservatives. No artificial flavors. US inspected and passed by Department of Agriculture. No. 1 selling premium pot pie brand.

Originally Posted by david44

Sodium Phosphate

Isn't sodium phosphate a preservative?


a review from "Miss Fallacy"

Best pot pies EVER
1/21/2018

Average rating:5 out of 5 stars, based on reviews

by MissFallacy

These pot pies are flat out awesome. I literally eat one every single day. They have lots of flavor, and the crust is DELICIOUS! I've tried other pot pies, but none come close to being as good as these. I highly recommend them!

Someone's taking the piss...

Originally Posted by SKkin

Isn't sodium phosphate a preservative?

Probably but it is also a stain and grease remover.

Tony Naylor
Tue 6 Mar 2018 17.08 GMTLast modified on Tue 6 Mar 2018 17.22 GMT

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Pie perfectionist Stosie Madi, chef-owner at the Parkers Arms, is running through a list of things she won’t have in her kitchen: “We don’t have any machines. We could have a pastry roller and a dough mixer. Most people order in meat already cut up from the butcher, then cook it off. But we don’t.”
Instead, the pie-making at this handsome rural inn near Clitheroe, Lancashire, is reassuringly laborious. Madi buys whole animals, butchers them and renders fat from the carcasses to use in her pastry. Non-premium cuts, such as the shoulder, are then seasoned, marinated and cooked on-the-bone: “Otherwise, the flavour is too sanitised.” The meat sits in its juices overnight, before being broken down into pie filling. Co-owner Kathy Smith then uses a hot-water pastry, spiked with egg yolk to give it a light, melting quality, to hand-shape, crimp and seal every meat pie.

A pie from the Parkers Arms, near Clitheroe, Lancashire. Photograph: Parkers ArmsIt is a mammoth task. Parkers can sell up to 500 pies in a busy week, such as British Pie Week (until March 9). But pies have put Parkers on the map. It was ranked eighth in last year’s Estrella Damm Top 50 Gastropubs, while the Observer restaurant critic Jay Rayner described Madi’s venison and pork pie as: “A true thing of beauty.”
Madi was born in Africa to British-Lebanese and French-Lebanese parents, and she quietly explores that heritage in her pies. A Lancashire cheese and potato pie in a buttery puff pastry is layered like dauphinoise, while Parkers’ seasonal game pie riffs on terrine en croute. A Middle Eastern-spiced pie of turnip, beetroot and spinach tops, kale and caramelised onion was inspired by Lebanese fatayer parcels.
However, Madi never forgets that she is cooking at a pub in Lancashire. The Parkers’ pies come with a choice of mash or (excellent) chips, and wear their pastry kinks with pride: “We don’t use fine moulds to make the pies look absolutely gorgeous. We’re not anti-that. But if the pie becomes too manicured and uniform, it just wouldn’t go with what we do. We’re a pub and, as Smith says, we mould with love.”
In this age of clean eating, smashed avo and spiralised veg, you may imagine that the pie’s fortunes are in terminal decline. By weight, savoury pastry consumption has fallen sharply in recent years. Greggs now sells only two pies, regionally: a savoury mince pie in north-east England and a scotch pie in Scotland. Worst of all, in 2016, the British Pie Awards – which announces its 2018 winners tomorrow – crowned a pasty (yes, a pasty!) its supreme champion.
Yet, even so, the pie is proving resilient. Not just in what is lazily perceived as its northern heartland (what data there is suggests that, actually, the Midlands is pie central), and not just among chefs such as Calum Franklin, whose ornate, architecturally staggering pies at London’s Holborn Dining Room have achieved cult fame on Instagram (@chefcalum).
Certain sub-sections of the pie market, such as meat-free pies, are flying. National brand Pukka announced “record-breaking sales” earlier last month, although, in the past decade, the value of what Mintel estimates is a £1.2bn-a-year total pie market has, undoubtedly, been bolstered by the rise of posh pie-makers such as Pieminister and Higgidy.

Pie and mash from Pieminister, which turns over £14m annually. Photograph: Mike Cooper/PieministerFourteen years ago, says Pieminister co-founder Tristan Hogg, the UK pie market was in a slump of soggy pastry, “mystery meat” and aging consumers: “No young people were eating pies. The market was dying.” Today, Pieminister turns over £14m annually and is growing at around 16%. It sells pies in supermarkets (for around £3.50), but is also opening hip and reasonably affordable pie and mash restaurants nationwide, as well as installing small purpose-built kitchens into pubs and bars that, historically, did not have the space to serve hot food: “We now have over 200. It’s been big for us.”
A quality product has been key to all this. Pieminister is the most visible manifestation of a larger network of small pie-makers, who, with their buttery shortcrust pastries, tasty, casserole-like fillings and emphasis on provenance and seasonality, are taking great pride in this once neglected staple. “You don’t want to eat pie every day, so it’s got to be a treat when you do,” says Neil Broomfield, founder of Cheshire’s Great North Pie Co, whose minced beef pie is laced with Bovril and beef dripping. “I still oversee everything. This isn’t about being the next Holland’s (the ubiquitous Lancashire pie company), but about taking a classic and doing it really nicely.”
Next month, Holborn Dining Room will open its Pie Room, where punters will be able to take away Franklin’s remarkable creations, such as his curried mutton pie (from £6). Born in south London (so much for the north-south pie divide!), he is “obsessive about design and proud of our British food heritage. Pies are a great outlet for both.”
Franklin finds it “quite amusing” that his work may be giving pies a certain trendy cachet. He stresses his pies are practical. They are designed to be portioned and sold in a busy restaurant. They are not exhibition pieces: “I don’t make things for Instagram. But, at the same time, it’s really cool because it means everyone’s working on hand-raised, free-standing pies and elevating what they’re doing.”

Chef Calum Franklin (centre) of the Holborn Dining Room in London Photograph: John CareyBut are they? Really? Unusually, there is no great snobbery in pies. Artisan pie-makers refuse to be drawn into slagging off their mass-produced rivals. Ultimately, different pies suit different situations. A cheap, factory-produced chicken balti pie may hit the spot on a freezing Saturday afternoon at the football, even if you would send the same pie back in a restaurant. But it is also true that, in the chippy, down the pub or at the match, such everyday pies are often poorly prepared and expensive.
Rob Spurling, a Wycombe Wanderers fan and part of the team at the review site pierate (which includes a dedicated football pie league), argues that, in his wide experience at away games, slipshod, profiteering catering firms are undermining that simple pleasure, the match-day pie: “I don’t mind a Pukka, if it’s cooked well, but football pies are generally not served at premium quality. Often, they’ve been heated for a long time and they’re dried out or burned, and paying £3.50 for a pie you could get for £1.50 at a takeaway seems overpriced.” Increasingly, Spurling finds himself drawn to “fancier, better value pies”. For instance, he rates Piglet’s Pantry, which supplies Brighton & Hove Albion, among others: “It might cost £4, but you’re getting a top pie.”
Meanwhile, the controversy of the pretend pie – a pot of casserole topped with puff pastry – rumbles on in pubs across Britain. “I always ask: ‘Is it a proper pie?’ If they say no, I don’t have it,” says chef John Molnar. “The real bottom-end is when you get pre-made microwaved pie mix and, on top, a pre-baked lid that’s like eating sawdust. Pie, mash, greens and gravy is a great pub dish, but only if it’s done well.”
Molnar’s three east Midlands’ Moleface pubs serve real pies. It is more labour intensive – did you know fresh pies need turning periodically to stop the bottoms going soggy? – and stressful. “You’ve got to grease the pie mould and hope to God it doesn’t stick,” says Molnar, but his regulars demand it. “People ask: ‘Has it got a pastry bottom?’”
Accepting anything less, particularly in British Pie Week, is sacrilege. Wherever you are and however much it costs, the least we can expect from a pie is value-for-money … and a complete pastry case.
Life of pie: five places of pie pilgrimage around the UK

Great North Pie Co, Altrincham and Ambleside

Neil Broomfield is one of the pickiest men in pastry – his slow-braised Swaledale rare breed beef and ale pie is a masterpiece. From £3.99
From Ben’s Kitchen, Gloucestershire
Ben Sibbald’s chicken, leek and parmesan pie won two gongs at the 2017 British Pie Awards. Find him at Tetbury (Wed) and Cirencester (Fri) farmers’ markets. £5
Galloways, Wigan

A pie barm, from Galloways bakers, Wigan Photograph: Galloways Bakers‏For connoisseurs of the classic pie barm – yes, southerners, a peppery meat and potato pie in a buttered roll – a visit to a Galloways’ bakery is a must. £2.10
Morecambe Football Club
Morecambe may be hovering above the relegation places in League Two, but the club’s pies top the Pierate Pieremiership. Pastry chef Jackie Simpson confidently entered five into the 2018 British Pie Awards. £3.50
Piebald Inn, Hunmanby
This Yorkshire pub serves more than 50 types of pies, including its braised lamb Welsh Cob, once described as “the perfect pie” by chef Tom Kerridge. From £10.25
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Originally Posted by SKkin

I'm not the "healthy eater" here @ TD...

Probably scarfed down one or two of these I bet...



Nasty ones these are!

Best pies in the world.. NZ.

FACT!

Not rocket science to make a decent pie although many seem to fook it up.

Its all about the pastry.

Best pie I enjoyed was when I landed at Johannesburg airport after a long flight from Germany.

While waiting for a connecting flight to Durban I noted a pie shop within the departure lounge.

Absolutely superb pie.

^Nice..

Just looking at this thread, makes me gain weight.. lol.


My grandmother who almost raised me, used to bake the best pies in the world. She would make so many that she would freeze them in her deep freezer in the basement. I lived with her and my grandfather during college and everyday for lunch she would feed me (light lunches she would call them), and many days ask me what pie I would like. She made apple, rhubarb, date, and pumpkin mostly. Darn, I miss those days, now that they have both passed away.

Originally Posted by Thailandbound

My grandmother who almost raised me, used to bake the best pies in the world. She would make so many that she would freeze them in her deep freezer in the basement. I lived with her and my grandfather during college and everyday for lunch she would feed me (light lunches she would call them), and many days ask me what pie I would like. She made apple, rhubarb, date, and pumpkin mostly. Darn, I miss those days, now that they have both passed away.

You do realize that the thread is about MEAT pies dont you? TMI by the way...

Alright.. well my grandma also made the best meatpie ever. She called it tortiere, as she was from a French background.

Feasts abounded especially during New Year's ! Her tortiere looked like this and tasted quite amazing.

Keep yer Wig on PB , all pies welcome
Fish Meat Trans fruit even Fish
I think the finest "Pie " I ever had was in Otigueira a small Galician fishing port, seafood only



British Pie Week 2018: Why there's no such thing in Wigan | The Independent

The humble pie shop may have dwindled in many places but it’s still ingrained in everyday life in others – so do we need a seven-day celebration? Of course not, says David Barnett

• David Barnett
• 9 hours ago
• 3 comments

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Click to follow
The Independent Online


Feeling sad? Have a pie. Happy? Celebrate with a pie. Hungry? A pie. Not so hungry? Maybe just a small pie. Aliens have invaded the earth? Save the pies! AlamyGo to Wigan and tell them that it’s British Pie Week and you’ll no doubt receive a volley of blank looks. That’s because every week is pie week in Wigan.
Pies are inextricably entwined with the DNA of the folk in this town, nestling midway between Manchester and Liverpool, home to more than 100,000 souls in a wider borough of more than three times that population.
Boundaries become blurred when we talk of pie consumption; also within the Wigan borough is Leigh, birthplace of journalist Paul Mason and the Buzzcocks’ Pete Shelley, represented in Parliament by Jo Platt. Only seven miles or so from Wigan, yet half the world away; Wiganers are known the world over as Pie Eaters while in Leigh they’re called Lobby Gobblers, due to their preference for lobbies, a kind of sloppy potato stew.
From maternity ward to funeral parlour, a Wiganer comes into this world with nothing and leaves with nothing, but in between is given sustenance, comfort, solace and pleasure from pies. The pie is the go-to snack, the default dinner, the looked-forward-to tea. Sometimes it’s even the breakfast of champions. There is no occasion for which a pie will not suffice or, indeed, not be welcomed.

• READ MORE

Where to eat the best pies during British Pie Week


Weddings, funerals, christenings, birthday parties. A Wigan buffet will always have a proud selection of pies. Feeling sad? Have a pie. Happy? Celebrate with a pie. Hungry? A pie. Not so hungry? Maybe just a small pie. Aliens have invaded the earth? Save the pies!
If Pie Eater is a regional slur, it’s one that’s embraced in Wigan. There will be those that try to tell you the appellation has its origins in the 1926 General Strike, when the General Council of the Trade Union Congress got everybody out in support of striking miners who were protesting against low wages and poor conditions.


Pies from anywhere other than Wigan, simply put, aren’t real pies (AFP/Getty)

The General Strike lasted nine days, with Britain brought grinding to a halt in the way that we only see a few snowy days achieve in modern times. Everybody was on strike, from the railway workers to the dockers to the factory staff.
But in Wigan, the miners went back to work early, before the General Strike was called off. They and their families were literally starving and the colliery bosses persuaded them to go back – on a pay cut. That’s where people will tell you the terminology comes from, because the shame-faced miners were forced to eat humble pie.

So the history books tell us, but the truth of the matter is, in Wigan we just like pies. Before we proceed, however, a word on what constitutes a pie. It has to be round, baked in its tinfoil dish, and hot. It has a pastry top, and seamless circular walls, and a base. We can’t be doing with the things that call themselves pies but are just stew with a lid on.
Pies can be meat and potato, or steak. Steak and kidney, or even cheese and onion. Maybe even a butter pie. I vividly remember in the long summer holidays of my youth seeing my grandad most mornings walking past our house, a mile on from where he lived, a mile and a half to go to Wigan town centre. He would go for a morning swim (in the Olympic-sized pool!) and return with a netted shopping bag groaning with pies. He once informed me that meat and potato pies now had to be legally called potato and meat pies, because there was more potato than meat in them. I’m still not sure whether he was joking or not.
One of the most famous pie brands in Wigan is Pooles. It was established in the town in 1847 – almost 80 years before the General Strike – by Margaret Poole. She opened a shop on Wallgate in the town centre, when she was just 26, assisted by her sister and later her daughter.


Wiganer’s nickname originates from the 1926 General Strike, when miners in the town were starved back to work and forced to eat ‘humble pie’ (Getty)

By 1903 the Pooles empire was expanding, with its own bakery and three shops. The business would grow over the following century, becoming ubiquitous in the town and eventually the chain would be bought by Dave Whelan, the former footballer (he broke his leg playing for Blackburn Rovers in the 1960 FA Cup Final) turned entrepreneur. Whelan would also buy Wigan Athletic and create the DW Stadium, home to both the town’s football team and Rugby League side, Wigan Warriors.
When I was a boy, our nearest pie shop was a Rathbones, which seem to have disappeared from the high street now. There was a story that used to do the rounds in our family that a great-great-grandfather or beyond once had a controlling stake in Rathbones, but gambled it all away. I was never able to establish whether this, like the potato and meat pie story, was true.
As I reached my twenties I worked for the Wigan Evening Post, the office situated upstairs in the town’s Makinson Arcade, right above Hampson’s pie shop. On summer days with the windows open, the beguiling scent of freshly-baked pies would rise maddeningly from below. On cold winter days, the return of a reporter or photographer to the office would be heralded by the comforting aroma of a pie, drifting up the staircase ahead of them.
Once there was a fire at the Pooles Pies factory. We put it as the front page splash on the Wigan Evening Post. We had a serious discussion about whether or not it was appropriate to headline it Black Wednesday, but in the end we didn’t. Pooles got in extra shifts to work through the night on the surviving production lines, pulling out all the stops so the shops could get their deliveries of pies on time the next morning.


Margaret Poole opened her first pie shop 170 years ago, and the company went on to become the UK’s leading pie manufacturer (Dennis Seddon)

Despite the close relationship, through Dave Whelan, between pies and sport, no one is under the misapprehension that pies are healthy. Last year, Wigan was named by Public Health England as having well above the national average in obesity, especially among children; 11 per cent of four- and five-year-olds were classed as obese by the time they started school.
At the age of about 20 or 21, recognising I was in a downwards spiral marked by way stations of pie shop and pub, I joined a gym in Wigan. I was put through my paces by the owner, which resulted in me doing a bit of sick in my mouth and having to stand by an open window to regain some measure of normality. The owner glanced at my expanding gut and said: “If you want to make a go of this, you know, you’re going to have to ditch the pies.” I never went back.
Pies are not healthy, but that’s not to say pies can’t be sport. Every year, just before Christmas, the World Pie Eating Championship is held at Harry’s Bar on Wallgate, just a stone’s throw from where Margaret Poole opened her first pie shop 170 years ago. The winner in 2017 was Martin Appleton-Clare, who retained his title from the previous year by disposing of a meat and potato (potato and meat?) pie in 32 seconds, shaving more than 13 seconds off his 2016 personal best.
This year will be the 26th year of the World Pie Eating Championship, which attracts competitors from as far afield as Skelmersdale. There are rules, of course; the pies have to be regulation dimensions of precisely 12cm in diameter and 3.5cm in depth. In 2006, in recognition of changing attitudes, a vegetarian pie option was added following pressure from the Vegetarian Society to allow a more equitable field.
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The following year a dog entered, Charlie, who belonged to former champion Dave Williams, by then an official in the competition who had stored that year’s match pies in his house. There was a twist, however; the night before, while Williams was distracted by a pigeon flying up his chimney, bichon frise Charlie broke into the fridge and scoffed practically all the pies for the next day’s contest.


Pies are not only somewhat of a delicacy in the region, but also a sport. The town holds the World Pie Eating Championship every year (Getty)

Unsurprisingly, though he had shown his pie-eating prowess the night before, Charlie failed to win the competition, presumably having a literal bellyful of pies.
When I met the woman who was to become my wife, I was eating a pie barm. That’s a pie in a bread roll, just in case you don’t get enough carbs from the pie. She married me anyway. Not long after, we moved to Yorkshire, ostensibly for work, but, now I look back, perhaps it was a subconscious cry for help from my own body.
They’ll tell you in Yorkshire that they make a good pie; they don’t. Not a Wigan pie. Pies consumed anywhere other than Wigan are like tap-water down south or American chocolate. They look the same, but they aren’t.
Perhaps it’s for the best. Save for when I visit my mum, and she’ll suggest a quick pie, I barely think about them at all, these days. But it’s good to know that they’re there. Just like a dog isn’t for Christmas, a pie habit isn’t just for British Pie Week. It’s for life.

Originally Posted by david44

all pies welcome

Well there's the Upper Michigan pasties aka "Yooper pasties." Meat veggies and rutabaga...yummy.



Traditional Yooper Pasties ? The Yooper Girl

This gal in video uses Crisco but traditionally pasties made with lard.

Great yoopies, called Oggies in Cornwall UK

Originally Posted by david44

Great yoopies, called Oggies in Cornwall UK

I think that's the origin of the "yoopers." Cornish miners or "Cousin Jacks" immigrated to the iron and copper districts of upper Michigan...and brought their pies with them.

nope the Finns of UP upper peninsula opp ThunderBay in MI

Think the Fins came after the Cornish...

History of the Pasty

When the Cornish came to the copper mines of the Upper Peninsula, they brought with them a lot of mining knowledge which the other ethnic groups did not have. The other ethnic groups looked up to the Cornish and wanted to emulate their mining successes. Many Cornish practices were then copied by the other ethnic groups, including the pasty as the standard lunch for miners. The pasty became popular with these other ethnic groups because it was small, portable, was very filling, and could stay warm for 8-10 hours. Pasty rivalry occurred between the Finns, Swedes, Irish, Poles, Germans, Scots, Italians and French with each group contributing something in the way of seasoning and other ingredients. All groups agree that pasties must contain two things, potatoes and onions. The portability of the pasty not only made it easy to carry, but if it should get cold it would be relatively easy to heat up. This was done by putting the pasty on a shovel and holding it over a head-lamp candle. Miners never ate a pasty with a fork, they ate it end to end, and held it upright to keep the juices in. Since entire Cornish families worked in mines and each member of the family wanted different ingredients in the pasty, the Cornish wife would stamp the bottom corner of each pasty with an initial. According to the Cornish Recipes Ancient and Modern, "The true Cornish way to eat a pasty is to hold it in the hand, and begin to bite it from the opposite end to the initial, so that, should any of it be uneaten, it may be consumed later by its rightful owner. And woe betide anyone who take's another person's corner!" There was a superstition among the Cornish miner's that the initial corner should not be eaten, instead it was dropped on the ground for the mining gremlins to eat. These "gremlins" caused mischief in mines, causing accidents and mine collapses, feeding them supposedly kept them out of trouble. There is some truth to this rumor, because the early Cornish tin mines had large amounts of arsenic, by not eating the corner which the miners held, they kept themselves from consuming large amounts of arsenic.

The pasty survived the collapse of mining because it became extremely popular with the major ethnic group to remain after the mines closed, the Fins. In 1864 a small wave of Fins came to the UP, well after the Cornish were established, when the big mining wave of Fins came 30 years later, they probably learned pasty making from the older Fins, not the Cornish. The pasty resembles the Finish foods, piiraat and kuuko, so when the new Fins saw their countrymen carrying it in a pail, they thought that it was the Fins who invented the pasty. Since there was a similar food in Finland, it was easier for the new Fins to adopt it. During Finish "ethnic" celebrations the pasty is often featured as a "Finnish" specialty.

https://www.history.com/news/hungry-history/miners-delight-the-history-of-the-cornish-pasty

On my way into the UP across the Mackinac bridge 2009...from a throwaway film camera.



Lake Michigan on the left, Huron on the right.

Originally Posted by SKkin

Cornish miners or "Cousin Jacks" immigrated to the iron and copper districts of upper Michigan...and brought their pies with them.

The earliest recorded recipe for Cornish pasties comes from Devon. True story, I heard it on QI just a few days ago.