Russia in nuclear threat to Poland

[jandajoy]

Catherine Philp and Tony Halpin in Tbilisi

Russia threatened Poland with a nuclear strike yesterday as the ripples of the Caucasus conflict spread through Europe and pitched West against East along new borders.
In a chilling echo of the Cold War, Russia gave warning that Poland was “exposing itself to a strike — 100 per cent” after signing a deal with the US to set up a missile shield on Polish soil.
The threat, the strongest since the fall of the Soviet Union, came as President Saakashvili of Georgia was forced to accept defeat as he signed a truce giving the Russian Army the right to patrol Georgian soil.
General Anatoli Nogovitsyn, the deputy chief of the general staff in Moscow, said that Russian military doctrine sanctioned the use of nuclear weapons “against the allies of countries having nuclear weapons if they in some way help them”, as Poland had done in signing the deal.

At a tense press conference with Angela Merkel, the German Chancellor, President Medvedev of Russia attacked the timing of the deal, saying that it exposed the “fairytale” that the shield was a defence against rogue states. “The deployment of new antimissile forces has as its aim the Russian Federation,” he said.


Condoleezza Rice, the US Secretary of State, had flown to Tbilisi, while Mrs Merkel flew to Sochi to press for an end to the conflict that began last week.
It was a day of intense diplomacy, high tension and raw emotion. Dr Rice was visibly uncomfortable sharing a podium with a reluctant Mr Saakashvili, who gambled and lost when he sent his troops to put down pro-Russian separatists in South Ossetia, provoking a full-scale Russian invasion. Mr Saakashvili came close to tears as he vowed that he would “never, ever surrender” in the show-down with Russia. He accused his Western allies of inviting Moscow’s aggression by denying Georgia a foot on the road to Nato membership last April. “We told the world this is about starting an invasion,” he said. “We screamed to the world: stop it.”
Dr Rice’s visit was a show of support for Georgia’s pro-Western Government after President Bush vowed not to cast aside his ally in the face of Russian “bullying and intimidation”.
She condemned Moscow for not honouring its verbal promise to halt military operations and called on Mr Medvedev to effect an immediate withdrawal. “This must take place and take place now,” she said. “This is not an agreement about the future of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. This is about getting Russian troops out.”
She said that Russia’s actions called into question what role it really planned to play in international politics.
Earlier in the day, Reuters reported that a Russian military convoy had advanced to within 30 miles of Tbilisi from the Russian-occupied town of Gori inside Georgia proper.
President Bush said in his weekly radio address that Russia’s invasion of Georgia was “completely unacceptable to the free nations of the world”.


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4543744.ece

[good2bhappy]

first test for the system?

[chitown]

My predictions is World War 3 with Russia, China and some Arab states like Iran on one side and Europe and the US on the other side. Who knows, maybe some South American countries will throw their hat in the ring too along side the closet communists.

I have said it for years that communism never really fell, it just put on a new set of clothes.

[Butterfly]

The Bush administration should focus on fucking up the Middle East instead of putting his nose in European affairs and also fucking things up,

The Russians are on a roll, why stop ? Bringing former soviet states into NATO and the US is complete madness, what were they thinking ?

[Butterfly]

I have said it for years that communism never really fell, it just put on a new set of clothes.

It will rise from the ashes again and eventually beat Capitalism at its own game.

My predictions is World War 3 with Russia

I don't see it happening, too much to lose for every one, above all the Russians and the Chinese.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Childs play.

[chitown]

The Bush administration should focus on fucking up the Middle East instead of putting his nose in European affairs and also fucking things up,

Like when the US stuck its nose in European affairs when the Germans were banging all those French girls and drinking all their fine wine back in World War 2?

Your appreciation is well noted.

[chitown]

It will rise from the ashes again and eventually beat Capitalism at its own game.

Communism is a failed system that can't beat what is right.

Capitalism will shine.

Democracy will prevail.

[Butterfly]

Like when the US stuck its nose in European affairs when the Germans were banging all those French girls and drinking all their fine wine back in World War 2?

note that I said the Bush administration, not Americans, your pro-America "Ra Ra" bias is blinding your judgment again, no surprise here

Communism is a failed system that can't beat what is right.

no it's not, Capitalism is about looting by the elite at the expense of society, can't let that happen in the long run.

Capitalism will shine.

Communism little brother "Socialism" is right around the corner and will soon take over, there is really no alternative.

Democracy will prevail.

Terrorism will kill that one eventually, they will also win that around.

[britmaveric]

Communism never works - people don't share in the wealth only an elite few do. This is always what dooms it. So once again Butterfy is wrong.

[Butterfly]

^ wait 20 years, and we will see who was wrong

[good2bhappy]

LOL in 20 years I will be dead

[Butterfly]

^ you are that old ?

[Jet Gorgon]

Communism never works - people don't share in the wealth only an elite few do. This is always what dooms it. So once again Butterfy is wrong.

Yep. Any govt has an elite, and the commies have theirs with no accountability. Propaganda and armies keep the ants working for the social good while the elite rakes in the finery. China, North Korea, and Burma are the prime examples.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Communism never works - people don't share in the wealth only an elite few do. This is always what dooms it. So once again Butterfy is wrong.

Go to China Brit - I can see you haven't.

[Jet Gorgon]

^ Go back to vid making, Scamps.

[britmaveric]

Communism never works - people don't share in the wealth only an elite few do. This is always what dooms it. So once again Butterfy is wrong.

Go to China Brit - I can see you haven't.

Scampy - I've been all over China and its an utter shi*e hole. Most of the people outside the major cities are in dire conditions, barely making ends meat. They are completely miserable lot - never seen so many sad people. China's massive population will be their undoing. Try getting around a bit more and open those eyes - have a look outside the major cities and you will be shocked.

[Butterfly]

Propaganda and armies keep the ants working for the social good while the elite rakes in the finery.

Yeah, that's the definition of Facism, capitalism brought to its limit

Once again, Jet, you are confusing the Soviets with real Communism and the abuses of an elite over a system, same as capitalism,

One could argue that the Soviet system was nothing more than a form of Capital Elitism (Facism) and that's why it failed. Not because of the poor working class.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Communism never works - people don't share in the wealth only an elite few do. This is always what dooms it. So once again Butterfy is wrong.

Go to China Brit - I can see you haven't.

I've been to China Scampy and its an utter shi*e hole. Most of the people outside the major cities are in dire conditions, barely making ends meat. They are completely miserable lot - never seen so many sad people. China's massive population will be their undoing.

So are you saying that they are better than us?

[britmaveric]

^ Go back to vid making, Scamps.

I agree leave the Politics to the big boys!!!

[sabang]

Communism is a failed system that can't beat what is right.

Russian Communism (or at least the state totalitarianism that arose - quite different to pure Marxism) is indeed a failed system. Chinese Communism is not.

But- what is 'right'? One has to question the sustainability of our current system, in which the gulf between rich and poor increases every year.

Capitalism will shine.

Capitalism is the best way of doing business (I think) - free markets, free trade, free competition, private ownership of the means of production and the rewards therefrom. But is it a 'social system'?

Democracy will prevail.

I believe and hope so. But there is more to democracy than our existing system- a Socialist society, or a syndicated Anarchy can in fact be more democratic than our current system. We have no monopoly on the term 'Democracy', in spite of what was drummed into us at school.

So, which is the best way forward? Taking two democratic societies that are actually quite different, there is Norway (indeed all of Scandinavia) style social democracy, and there is USA style capitalist democracy.

Which is best? Which countries people are happier, and/or enjoy a better quality of life?
Where would you rather be born, live, and die?
Which model is more sustainable, and benefits it's members the most?

These are very subjective questions, and of course countries are different also. But I can't help but feel that an affluent country like the US has to move closer to a social democracy (or to use the dreaded term, a 'Liberal democracy') going forward.

The obvious question being- the inflation adjusted or 'Real' wage of the 'working man' has remained the same now for about 30 years in the US. Meanwhile the Rich have become enormously richer. Is this an indefinitely sustainable model?

[pickel]

I agree leave the Politics to the big boys!!!

Did you just refer to Jet as a "big boy"?

[barbaro]

Catherine Philp and Tony Halpin in Tbilisi

Russia threatened Poland with a nuclear strike yesterday as the ripples of the Caucasus conflict spread through Europe and pitched West against East along new borders.
In a chilling echo of the Cold War, Russia gave warning that Poland was “exposing itself to a strike — 100 per cent” after signing a deal with the US to set up a missile shield on Polish soil.

I think this is just posturing by Russia.

Nonetheless, the potential for problems is there.

[Jet Gorgon]

Propaganda and armies keep the ants working for the social good while the elite rakes in the finery.

Yeah, that's the definition of Facism, capitalism brought to its limit

Once again, Jet, you are confusing the Soviets with real Communism and the abuses of an elite over a system, same as capitalism,

One could argue that the Soviet system was nothing more than a form of Capital Elitism (Facism) and that's why it failed. Not because of the poor working class.

What a joke. BF. Sure, any political theory in its pure form is good, including communism. But, then you throw people and their mores and greeds into the equation and it never works the way it's planned. As I noted, North Korea, China, and how about Venezuala's socialist Chavez? At least in a capitalist society where there are checks and balances, and where small businesses are promoted, there's a better chance of everyman succeeding. Commies are the worst elitists, and you know it if you have any brains. Nepotism, cronyism, dictatorial leaderships. Absolutely no fair judiciary and immediate shot in the head for dissidents. Where you been, BF?

[sabang]

Russia threatened Poland with a nuclear strike yesterday as the ripples of the Caucasus conflict spread through Europe and pitched West against East along new borders. In a chilling echo of the Cold War, Russia gave warning that Poland was “exposing itself to a strike — 100 per cent” after signing a deal with the US to set up a missile shield on Polish soil.

Of course Poland now becomes a target under a doomsday scenario- it has accepted powerful missile batteries on it's soil so, just like Turkey, it becomes a first strike target. That isn't a threat- thats stating the bleedin' obvious. If Poland or Nato does not realise that, they are living in Cuckooland.

Lies, lies and damned Politicians- this Whopper is just so blatant, it could only come from a Pollie-

The shield was endorsed by all 26 NATO member states earlier this year and Washington insists its objective is to prevent potential missile attacks by "rogue states," a phrase regarded as including Iran...

US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, speaking en route to the Georgian capital Tbilisi, said the United States hoped to sign a deal soon and described Russia's concerns as "ludicrous."

Full Article- Russia furious as Poland joins missile shield plan - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Oh, so they are not primarily for countering Russia? Gimme a break.
Do they really think we are so stoopid we can't even read a map?
Or is it to counter the threat from, umm, Lithuania, or Finland. Jeezus H.

Of course Russia will station more missile batteries adjacent to Poland in response- thats as obvious as night following day. And of course Nato, and Poland, will respond with Righteous Outrage. Boring Twats.