Thread: Trump to announce Jerusalem as capital of Israel

Originally Posted by Fluke

More wrong things .
Israel was created by the U.N

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Without that bunch of Zionist Europeans there would not have been an Israeli state.

Originally Posted by Fluke

No Palestinians in Israel were displaced, they were all given Israeli citizenship , there are now 1 million Palestinian Arabs living happily in Israel

We've been over this. The Arab Israelis are far from happy being treated as 2nd class citizens.

Originally Posted by Fluke

Syria, Egypt and Jordon, who ruled those lands simultaneously attacked Israel

Get your history right. Israel attacked first. So-called "preemptively" but it was with great relish that they took over the land.

Originally Posted by wasabi

The main aim of the Israelie people is to rebuild the Jewish Temple that Solomon originally built back in the same exact place in Jerusalem .
Trouble is, a Mosque is squatting on the mount.

Yes. It's going to get nasty because the ultra-orthodox has Bibi compliant, and Bibi has no regrets in being compliant to them.

Originally Posted by Maanaam

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Without that bunch of Zionist Europeans there would not have been an Israeli state.


We've been over this. The Arab Israelis are far from happy being treated as 2nd class citizens.




Get your history right. Israel attacked first. So-called "preemptively" but it was with great relish that they took over the land.




Yes. It's going to get nasty because the ultra-orthodox has Bibi compliant, and Bibi has no regrets in being compliant to them.

No it wasnt a bunch of Zionist Europeans that created the Israeli state , it was the U.N. who cast the vote to create an Israeli state , if the vote would have been "no, then there would not have been an Israeli state created .
Israeli Palestinian Arabs are NOT treated as second class citizens , they are treated exactly the same as Jewish Israelis .
Six Arab countries amassed 230 000 soldiers on Israeli borders, or close to them and its intentions were to wipe Israel off the map . That is a declaration of war, it doesnt matter who fired the first bullet

Israel is now what...one-third the size of Ireland. Not an argument, just a fact.

Geronimo complained in 1848 about his and other native indigenous people losing their lands in what is now Southern California, Arizona, New Mexico and southern Utah. (Not so funny that.)

Yup. The Ottomans ruled for centuries. "Palestinians ?"

Brits have a lot to answer for since 1922 orchestrating "West of the Jordan River a Jewish State, East of the Jordan an Arab State" (Transjordan) and then totally farking up their 25-year Mandate in 1947.

Many "Palestinians" who weren't "Jewish" (ie: people living under British rule) got shafted.
Sadly for them the citizens of a State founded 70 years ago aren't walking away.
Sadly their Arab and Islamic brothers knowingly would rather leave the majority stateless on Israel's hands in economic hardship as opposed to accepting them throughout the Arab world.

Trump announcing his "intention" to move the US Embassy to Jerusalem. Well, well the Art of the Deal...trying to 'strong arm' a path forward.
Does this news change history ?
No. But it might move the goal posts.

The Assyrians in 7th-century BCE and then the Roman in 1rst-century AD decimated the Kingdom of Israel and the Jews residing in Samaria, Judea and vast parts of what is now known as Israel with Jerusalem.
Time marches on.

Originally Posted by Fluke

No it wasnt a bunch of Zionist Europeans that created the Israeli state , it was the U.N. who cast the vote to create an Israeli state , if the vote would have been "no, then there would not have been an Israeli state created .
Israeli Palestinian Arabs are NOT treated as second class citizens , they are treated exactly the same as Jewish Israelis .
Six Arab countries amassed 230 000 soldiers on Israeli borders, or close to them and its intentions were to wipe Israel off the map . That is a declaration of war, it doesnt matter who fired the first bullet

Read again and try to understand. If it were not for a bunch of European Zionists Israel would ne ver have been created by the UN.
Israeli Arabs are certainly treated in practice and in law as 2nd class citizens...we've been over this.
Israel attacked. No question. Couched as pre-emptive, it was nonetheless Israel that attcked and in doing so created war.

Enough of your spin.

Originally Posted by Maanaam

Read again and try to understand. If it were not for a bunch of European Zionists Israel would ne ver have been created by the UN.
Israeli Arabs are certainly treated in practice and in law as 2nd class citizens...we've been over this.
Israel attacked. No question. Couched as pre-emptive, it was nonetheless Israel that attcked and in doing so created war.

Enough of your spin.

Maybe that is true, who knows, but the fact is that Israel was created by the U.N.
No one can say how history would have panned out without the Balfour declaration , Israeli Arabs live by the same laws as Israeli Jews , there is no difference .
Israel, like most other Countries has one law for everyone .
Israel was taking defensive measures against the quarter of a million hostile troops on its borders .
The hostile troops were there for a war , its was the massing of troops which caused the war , Israel just obliged with their wish for war

Haven't bothered to read the thread, which is really of no interest to me, but how does the US get to choose the capital of another nation? What if Israel declared Hog Holler, Arkansas the capital of the US? (Actually, might be an improvement over DC).....

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

but how does the US get to choose the capital of another nation?

It's more the case that they just recognized it officially.

Israel has long claimed Jerusalem as the capital but to avoid being seen to be taking sides and inflaming the issue the US had its embassy at Tel Aviv.

And then, well, Trump.

Originally Posted by PeeCoffee

Israel is now what...one-third the size of Ireland. Not an argument, just a fact...

Size does not matter, it was dar al-Islam which means it cannot legally be ceded without a fight and subsequent efforts for recovery. Same goes for most of Iberia, southern France and Italy, Switzerland, Malta, Sicily and every other part of dar al-Islam that according to scripture was stolen by the infidel.

While there is no discernible jihad directed at recovery of the stolen lands in Europe, due to military and political realities, these are still on the agenda for later on. In the case of Palestine, however, it is right in the middle of dar al-Islam, does not enjoy international support, and many other factors also make it a realistic target for recovery.

If the message distresses you don't blame the messenger, leave that to the usual subjects.

Originally Posted by Davis Knowlton

Haven't bothered to read the thread, which is really of no interest to me, but how does the US get to choose the capital of another nation? What if Israel declared Hog Holler, Arkansas the capital of the US? (Actually, might be an improvement over DC).....

Israel chose Israel's capital, not the US. As Ant said, Trump just recognised it.

^^^ & ^ Got it, thanks. Obviously Israel isn't high on my interest list.

The message you wrote Jabir doesn't distress me in the least.

Surely "Bring It On" has been discussed as well (probably behind closed doors).

This article basically says that if you were ever going to do it, now is the time. The author makes some good points.

(And before our resident whackjobs go off on one, I would prefer to give the Israelis and Arabs a month to clear out and nuke the fucking place. Let's see them fight over it then).

There's something cathartic about acknowledging an obvious reality that you've had to deny for years for the sake of peace. You refuse to go to your in-laws for the holidays because your father-in-law is a bore and your mother-in-law is a terrible cook. Your mother is never going to have grandchildren because you are gay and don't want to raise a child that isn't biologically yours. Your kid has no interest in fulfilling your long-abandoned dreams of being a musician, and when he admits it, you realize you love him less for it.
And Jerusalem is the capital of Israel.
The diplomatic landscape is littered with unresolved conflicts, and in many cases the United States has resolutely refused to recognize the obvious. We have never acknowledged that there are two Koreas, for example; there is no American embassy in Pyongyang. For decades we claimed that the only legitimate Chinese government was on Taiwan; then we claimed it existed but were agnostic on where it lived; then we acknowledged it was in Beijing, but refused to say that Taiwan was either a province of China or an independent state. We recognized Kosovo, but not Abkhazia or North Cyprus — or Palestine.
Jerusalem has, for decades, held a similar officially indeterminate status — though the fiction was paper thin. Presidents routinely visited Jerusalem on their trips to Israel, politicians across the American spectrum professed their support for Israel and the indivisibility of Israel's sovereignty in Jerusalem (including ), and, since 1995, the official policy of the United States Congress has been that the American embassy should be moved to Jerusalem. But the official positionhas been that the status of Jerusalem is subject to final negotiation between Israel and the Palestinian Authority.
Not anymore.
President Trump's declaration on Wednesday that the American embassy would be moved to Jerusalem was somewhat less momentous in formal terms than is generally being suggested. President George W. Bush had already acknowledged that "facts on the ground" had to be taken into account in final status negotiations, which was generally understood to be an endorsement of the Israeli position that large settlement blocks would have to be incorporated into sovereign Israel as part of any deal. It's inconceivable that Ma'ale Adumim would become part of Israel while Jerusalem would revert to a corpus separatum. And Trump himself left open negotiation over the boundaries of Israeli Jerusalem.
But the declaration is not meaningless. At a minimum, Trump's candor deserves to be matched by candor in return. The United States has, for decades, postured as something resembling an honest broker, or at least a power that stood sufficiently above the fray to look after the interests of both sides to the conflict to some degree. This fiction has also seemed paper thin at times, and should now be discarded.
Why make this change now? On one level, the answer is obvious. President Trump's contempt for diplomacy has been manifest for some time, as has been his disdain for "losers" — and the Palestinians are certainly not famous for winning. His entire political brand is the catharsis of unpleasant truth-telling, with the catharsis and unpleasantness far more central than the truth. So why wouldn't Trump do this? Isn't it harder to imagine him doing the opposite, and earnestly explaining why he was upholding America's traditional diplomatic position?
But the objective reality of the Israeli and Palestinian situation has also changed, and that is an ugly truth also worth recognizing. The Arab world hasn't been this fractured since Israel's creation, nor has the Arab-Israeli conflict been less central to politics in that part of the world. Saudi Arabia has been actively pursuing a tacit alliance with Israel against Iran. Egypt is under the thumb of a military dictator who is more friendly to Israel than any Egyptian since Sadat. Syria and Iraq are still in the throes of civil war, and both the Sunni-Shia conflict and the threat of Sunni extremism are of far greater concern across the region than the status of the Palestinians.
The larger international context has changed as well. Earlier this year, Russia recognized West Jerusalem as Israel's capital — which, while coupled with a declaration that East Jerusalem should be the capital of an independent Palestine, was still a surprising shift in the Israeli direction. The emergence of explicitly anti-Islamic far-right parties as serious political forces across Europe complicates mainstream parties' traditional concern for the Palestinian cause. If there is violence in response to the American move, it's probably fair to say that it will meet with far less international sympathy than would have been the case only a few years ago.
All of these are reasons why any administration inclined to support Israel's position more strongly might make a move of this kind at this time. But the Trump administration itself represents a far more meaningful change to the international landscape than the relatively minor adjustment represented by this one speech. And that has some bearing on the likely consequences of this move and its effect on the region.

The ugly truths about President Trump's Jerusalem declaration

Nice as it is to see you posting someone actually on topic, it is a shame that it is your typical garbage. A neocon wank mag? Well, hardly surprising with your tenuous grip on world affairs due to your CNN addiction. There are no good points to that article. It is all bollocks.

Originally Posted by pseudolus

Nice as it is to see you posting someone actually on topic, it is a shame that it is your typical garbage. A neocon wank mag? Well, hardly surprising with your tenuous grip on world affairs due to your CNN addiction. There are no good points to that article. It is all bollocks.

Fuck knows how you'd know that, you can barely understand something unless it's written in crayon.


Here's a picture, perhaps you can understand that, little whackjob.

Can't see what the problem is. ??????

The Donald is only gunna be around another 3 years and then when a new guys gets in they can just move it back again.

Originally Posted by terry57

Can't see what the problem is. ??????

The Donald is only gunna be around another 3 years and then when a new guys gets in they can just move it back again.

As the article I posted said, the GCC, who are the biggest funders of the Palestinians, have bigger fish to fry right now, so I doubt they give a shit. In fact they're surreptitiously cozying up to the blue suede shoes to try and stop Iran stirring this shit as usual.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

As the article I posted said, the GCC, who are the biggest funders of the Palestinians, have bigger fish to fry right now, so I doubt they give a shit. In fact they're surreptitiously cozying up to the blue suede shoes to try and stop Iran stirring this shit as usual.

The shit from Tehran have enough shit to deal with dealing with the shit from Riyadh , they dont need any more shit dealing with this shit about Jerusalem , if the shit from shit get involved with this shit, then the shits really going to hit the shitty fan

Originally Posted by Fluke

The shit from Tehran have enough shit to deal with dealing with the shit from Riyadh , they dont need any more shit dealing with this shit about Jerusalem , if the shit from shit get involved with this shit, then the shits really going to hit the shitty fan

You're a just a fucking simpleton really, aren't you?

I mean too-mind-numbingly-dull-and-stupid-to-even-keep-a-fucking-bar-slapper-interested simpleton.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

You're a just a fucking simpleton really, aren't you?

I mean too-mind-numbingly-dull-and-stupid-to-even-keep-a-fucking-bar-slapper-interested simpleton.

After this story broke last week, all the Worlds dimwits asked on-line "What right does Trump have to name other Countries Capital city"
Everyone with any understanding of World affairs all replied"Jerusalem is already the Capital of Israel" The whole World seemed to understand that.........then three days later, you come and ask the same question, which makes you the last person in the world to know, which makes you the worlds stupidest person .
7 Billion people in the world, and there you are , last in the queue

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Actually, I don't totally blame Trump for this. For sure, he's an idiot with no thought for anybody but himself and his ego but the trigger was set by the US Congress in 1995.

So Trump can share the blame with these 92 senators: https://www.senate.gov/legislative/L...n=1&vote=00496

and these 374 congressmen: http://clerk.house.gov/evs/1995/roll734.xml

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Originally Posted by Fluke

After this story broke last week, all the Worlds dimwits asked on-line "What right does Trump have to name other Countries Capital city"
Everyone with any understanding of World affairs all replied"Jerusalem is already the Capital of Israel" The whole World seemed to understand that.........then three days later, you come and ask the same question, which makes you the last person in the world to know, which makes you the worlds stupidest person .
7 Billion people in the world, and there you are , last in the queue

Harry don't listen to him you're not last in the queue, yesterday I asked a bg what she thought of it and drew a blank, same for her opinion on the chances of a fair Brexit trade deal. Flukey stop exaggerating.

Originally Posted by Fluke

After this story broke last week, all the Worlds dimwits asked on-line "What right does Trump have to name other Countries Capital city"
Everyone with any understanding of World affairs all replied"Jerusalem is already the Capital of Israel"

No they didn't, only silly little fuckers like you.

Most countries will not recognise Jerusalem as the capital of Israel unless it is part of a negotiated settlement between the Israelis and Palestinians, you fucking moron.

No wonder your bargirl left you, you must have driven her crackers with your endless torrent of nonsense.

Originally Posted by Neverna

Actually, I don't totally blame Trump for this. For sure, he's an idiot with no thought for anybody but himself and his ego but the trigger was set by the US Congress in 1995.

So Trump can share the blame with these 92 senators: https://www.senate.gov/legislative/L...n=1&vote=00496

and these 374 congressmen: http://clerk.house.gov/evs/1995/roll734.xml

You dismiss TRUMP at your peril. He is not an idiot. He is simply in the employ of israel. A lot of CEOs take the flack for the decisions of the board / major share holders. That's all he is doing. His reward will be to be properly rich and all his dodgy dealings and rape to be forgotten about