English teaching in LOS - I deon't get it...

[Sir Burr]

I've lived in SE Asia since 1982 and in Phuket since 1985.
I'm one of the lucky ones, I work offshore and earn hard currency and put away money each year for retirement.

Over the years in Phuket, I've seen many, many people, some of them good friends forced back to their home country due to lack of money.
Once home, they get depressed and find the adjustment very hard and start coming up with desparate schemes to get back to LOS.

I have a few friends that are still in Phuket, usually with a modest business that makes enough money for their needs. Most of these guys are very worried about what they are going to do for money when they get old.

OK, now for the bit I don't understand....

There are obviously some English teachers on this forum that could maybe shed some light.
For those English teachers that are earning say less than 40,000 Bt a month, why do you do it?

If you are in it for the joys of teaching, wouldn't it be more rewarding to teach attentive, inquisitive students? If so, wouldn't it be more rewarding to teach in your own country?

If you are in it to be able to live in LOS, then what are you going to do for retirement funds. One thing I learnt early on, was that it isn't how much money you earn that is important, it's the money you save.
Surely, English teachers in LOS just don't earn enough money to put aside enough for retirement? Isn't this just postponing the inevitable?

The only good reasons that I can see to teach English in LOS, is to partly fund a year, or, two of travelling before you go back to your home country and start work for real money.
Or, if you have other means of making an income and teaching is a top up.
Or, if you are retired, financially independant, but bored.

[stroller]

The 60.000 figure seems unrealistic, that's more than I made back in the UK, and I'd become an English teacher in an instant here if someone made me an offer in that region.

[poolcleaner]

Hmm....now here's a chap who's asking exactly the same questions that Smeg poses.

I wonder if the usual suspects will descend on this thread and do their best to provoke the OPer into an slanging match.

Over to you Squirrel, Cantona, Lily, agingone, who's first?

Sir Burr, you have put up some pertinent questions indeed and I too, am interested in the sensible answers that should follow.
Unfortunately, the above will only do their best to ruin your thread.

I, myself intend sponging off my numerous girlfriends in my later years.

That, and planning to die young!!

[Sir Burr]

^^^
OK, I've changed it to 40,000 Bt/month.

[poolcleaner]

The 60.000 figure seems unrealistic, that's more than I made back in the UK, and I'd become an English teacher in an instant here if someone made me an offer in that region.

But what about the afterlife?

Retirement?

Are you well sorted already?

A lot of TEFLers aren't. What are they planning to do?

As Smeg has often said, what happens when the bubble bursts?, what do these people think will happen then?

[Sir Burr]

I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm genuinely interested in why people do it. To me, it just doesn't make any sense financially (putting off the inevitable repatriation), or, from a job satisfaction angle.
I must be missing something.

[stroller]

I am not teaching so not the best one to chip in here, but I'd think it's all relative to what you would expect to earn 'back home'.
A good wage by Thai standards in Thailand might be preferable to life on the dole in England.

Or, in my case, having a basic moderate something to live on, one might prefer to spend it in Thailand where it does go further, while supplementing with teaching or whatever.

[poolcleaner]

I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm genuinely interested in why people do it. To me, it just doesn't make any sense financially (putting off the inevitable repatriation), or, from a job satisfaction angle.
I must be missing something.

You're not missing anything Sir Burr.

You pose a very relevant question. Normal people would ask the same question and with good reason.

One of our higher profile posters has been asking similar questions for quite some time but he justs gets shouted down by a pack of imbeciles who care not for the argument but find safety in numbers ganging up on a single poster.

With your untarnished reputation, I hope that the question can be answered with some semblance of intelligence.
Maybe it should have been posed in 'Issues' that way Stroller could weed out the crap as they post.

I don't know the answer, but I know a hell of a lot of TEFLers and I haven't heard one plan for retirement other than head home when the time comes.

[Sir Burr]

I guess you could try and save up enough money for seed capital to start a business here, though this route seems a bit risky.

[poolcleaner]

I imagine the TEFLers could pool their resources, good long term employment, with their GF/wifes respectable job and get a loan together to buy a small but nevertheless viable business if one could but the problem is part-time at AUA with no work permit and a pole swinger from Cowboy doesn't add up to a good collateral situation.

Also pissing one's pay at the Cathouse every Friday for all-you-can-drink Heinies is hardly having an eye on the future.

I'm still calculating how much white powder will comfortably stay up my bum.

[Sir Burr]

Maybe they buy a lot of lottery tickets?

[dirtydog]

I think if they come over with the money to buy a condo and car and bike then take it easy on the hoes they can have a good life, although my mate from Hong Kong spends more money every time here in thailand on his 7 days visits per month than I do in a month, then again his apartment rent in HongKong costs more money than I spend per month, foking rich bstards......

[danbo]

The only good reasons that I can see to teach English in LOS, is to partly fund a year, or, two of travelling before you go back to your home country and start work for real money.
Or, if you have other means of making an income and teaching is a top up.
Or, if you are retired, financially independant, but bored.

If you add to that list people who are happy for the moment and not particularly concerned about planning for the the 'future' then you have pretty much captured everyone.

I don't really understand the attraction of these threads, or poolie's defence of them. If the forums were full of threads by TEFLers crowing about how great they are then fair enough - but they aren't - As far as I can see these people get on with their lives and don't bother me or anyone else.

This constant harping goes nowhere;

A: Why do like wearing that hat?

B: Dunno, just do.

A: But why - it's a horrible hat.

B: So - I like wearing it.

A: Why?

B: I don't really think about it - I just wear it - It's a hat.

A: But why do you wear it - it's horrible.

B: It's not hurting you is it - I like wearing this hat.

A: But why are you wearing that hat?

B: It's my hat - I'm wearing it.

A: But why?

Carry on like this for a few hundred pages and you're gettng close to how interesting this is.

As my old postman Desmond used to say, 'What's it got to do with you big nose?'

[Sir Burr]

^^^
I'm not one of those guys who live for the moment and let the future take care of itself.
I tried putting myself into an English teachers shoes, not being able to save for retirement. For me it would be like having the Sword of Damocles over my head and would ruin any enjoyment of the present.
But that's just me. There are many English teachers out there, I'd just like to know what their motivation is.
If they can't give a simple answer and get defensive, I'll just have to assume that they don't want to be reminded of a certain reality. ie. eventually having to go home. Course, if going home eventually is all part of the plan, all well and good, but, it really fucks up your CV if you have been in LOS for a few years (unless you are at some respected international school).

Have just been browsing at Ajarn.com, my first time over there. Seems like you can earn between 80k and 120k if you are willing to work in BKK and using every hour God sends you. With this kind of money, it would still be hard to save enough for a comfortable retirement, unless you were in your twenties; then, it might be possible.

[danbo]

Would you ask a street-sweeper in your home town how they are planning for their retirement on their low income?

I just assume that the people doing the job are happy with what they're doing else they wouldn't do it. I don't really bother with it much more after that.

[Sanuk Canuk]

The only good reasons that I can see to teach English in LOS, is to partly fund a year, or, two of traveling before you go back to your home country and start work for real money. Or, if you have other means of making an income and teaching is a top up. Or, if you are retired, financially independent, but bored.

I haven't even made it to Thailand yet but I fall between #2 and #3. I think I will likely teach because I am getting tired of working in heavy industry. After I move to SE Asia (early in 2007) I plan to give teaching an honest try. If I decide I hate it I might try get into the oil and gas industry as my education and background would provide some access to this job market. If it wasn't for the fact that I have my retirement squared away already I doubt I would be considering a move to the region. I would more likely try get some conventional oil experience in the ME and then try transfer to SE Asia. On the other hand thats just me.... I am sure there are as many different stories as there are people.

[Sir Burr]

Would you ask a street-sweeper in your home town how they are planning for their retirement on their low income?

I just assume that the people doing the job are happy with what they're doing else they wouldn't do it. I don't really bother with it much more after that.

I wouldn't have to, he'd be getting a good old-age pension from the government. Besides, he's a local.
We are talking about people who have by choice come to a foreign land and have chosen a path that will ensure that they either have to go home one day (and if you haven't been paying contributions to your government whilst you've been away, no old-age pension), or, will have to continue working until they drop.

"I just assume that the people doing the job are happy with what they're doing else they wouldn't do it"

I'd have to disagree with this statement. Most people are not lucky enough to do a job that they enjoy. The majority of people work for money, yes, job satisfaction and other stuff comes into it, but money is the main reason.
I'm not happy doing the work I do, but, it's the only thing I know and it brings in the money.

[Sanuk Canuk]

Out of curiosity ...you mentioned you work offshore, what industry do you work in? Oil industry in the gulf? Banking? Internet porn (j/k)?

[Sir Burr]

Seismic surveys. We try and locate the oil/gas before a rig moves in.

[Sanuk Canuk]

Well in that case ... if the teaching craps out... are you hiring mining engineers . (sorry for the thread jacking)

[danbo]

^^But every comment on their choice of employment is laced with criticism (I'm not commenting specifically on your thread here Sir Burr - it's more a collective moan on the 12,721 that have preceeded it). Why pick on Teflers - what about smokers, heavy drinkers, those without life insurance, people who don't wear a crash helmet, traffic wardens.....The world is full of people making their own lifestyle decisions - My point is that as long as the decisions these people make affect only themselves I don't see what it has to do with me and I don't see why I should be concerned about the subject - It's up to them - If some posters want to be kind enough to reply to your enquiry then all well and good ....I do suspect though that any reply they give will very soon descend into:

B: I like wearing this hat.

A: But why are you wearing that hat?


You posted;

If they can't give a simple answer and get defensive, I'll just have to assume that they don't want to be reminded of a certain reality. ie. eventually having to go home.

Now doesn't that sound just a little pompous....

[Sir Burr]

^^But every comment on their choice of employment is laced with criticism (I'm not commenting specifically on your thread here Sir Burr - it's more a collective moan on the 12,721 that have preceeded it). Why pick on Teflers - what about smokers, heavy drinkers, those without life insurance, people who don't wear a crash helmet, traffic wardens.....The world is full of people making their own lifestyle decisions - My point is that as long as the decisions these people make affect only themselves I don't see what it has to do with me and I don't see why I should be concerned about the subject - It's up to them - If some posters want to be kind enough to reply to your enquiry then all well and good ....
....

Yes, I agree with you entirely. For instance, I'm a smoker. The reason I started smoking at fourteen years old, was that if I didn't start smoking, I would have been labled a queer and been beaten up. In other words peer-pressure.
If someone does give me an answer (three pages in and not a direct answer yet) then I'll be grateful that someone has taken the trouble to give one.

You posted;

If they can't give a simple answer and get defensive, I'll just have to assume that they don't want to be reminded of a certain reality. ie. eventually having to go home.

Now doesn't that sound just a little pompous....

My apologies, it wasn't meant that way.

[danbo]

I started off by saying how much I hated the subject and I've never posted so much in one thread

[friscofrankie]

traffic wardens

Yeah now that's a wierd group ain't it? Why would someone... What the fuck's a Traffic warden?
Is like a crossing guard? I mean Ithink I've seen on brit TV or ina movie dunno. But they look like crosiing guards. Ain't got no gun anyway

[Sanuk Canuk]

Maybe it is like the dudes in Bermuda with the white gloves and pith hats.