Thread: The politics behind Thailand's floods

^ Hmmm, not quite the same as a political party.....you do appreciate the difference, right?

Originally Posted by Gerbil

Originally Posted by Calgary

And if anyone even suggests for one second that these local Red Shirts delivered fifteen truckloads from any motivation other than from their heart, had better not meet me in a back alley.

Oh look! Nugget Ferret is a keyboard warrior now!

Glad you quoted that, I'd have missed that little gem.

What a tool he is.

Originally Posted by Dan

Where's those fucking photo's?

Is this what you wanted?

The ongoing struggle for the soul of Thailand has plunged to murky new flood-ridden depths, with the latest arena for battle being the labeling of goods to be donated to flood victims. The opening salvo was fired with reports claiming that trucks were delivering aid packages declaring ‘with love and care from Thaksin Shinawatra’, which caused an uproar in Bangkok due to the perception that Thaksin was attempting to hijack relief efforts to benefit his own public relations.

However, on Thursday 10th November, the following picture was taken at the Chulalongkorn University flood volunteer centre, which has been coordinating relief packages:




It translates as “Princess-Pa Foundation and Chulalongkorn [University]”

The rest at New Mandela

The more general point is that there is politicization all round and you can't make intelligent comments if you don't have at least some understanding of the general situation. Did you see Chulaborn's homily about the King and how stressed he was over the floods? Did you read commentaries on it? No to both, right. You should, they're very funny but translating them - or even posting the links - would be massively illegal so I'll leave it you to find yourself.

Struggling a bit, aren't you?

How many votes do you think that label will swing for the Princes-Pa foundation?

Originally Posted by Moonraker

How many votes do you think that label will swing for the Princes-Pa foundation?

The point is, which I made before at length but you chose to ignore... that it is culturally the norm in this Thai patronage based society to give gifts in the name of the group/patron; everyone does it all the time.

The red trucks are delivering supplies they donated. That is normal and accepted in Thai society.

BTW, have you ever seen Red Cross packages or Worldvision packages or Hurricane Katrina packages, etc - they are all branded by groups with politically active ideologies forwarding those ideologies...





Hurricane Katrina supplies from Worldvision



Hurricane Katrina supplies from American red cross.



More Hurricane Katrina supplies.

It's endless.

Providing relief supplies is a political act in itself, to pretend otherwise is stupid and naive. None of these supplies pictured are from the US government funds, they are from other groups with politically active ideologies, and they are all branded...

Fuck me Betty.

I thought Calgary would be my main source of amusement in this thread, now I'm not so sure.

Comparing political slogans on relief supplies with a fed-ex badge? Have a word with yourself.

^ Indeed, again, it appears some people don't understand the difference between doing things for political gain and what the reasons were in the examples Dan and BB have cited so far....

It is bizarre.

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

She is a supporter of anti-Thaksinites, she says so, clearly.

Where?

Whether she is pro or anti makes no difference, the piece is about women's rights and the lack of response to an attack on Yingluck from the feminists here.

That's it.

Non sequitur

You're just making no sense now BB

^^BB, Sorry, what has this got to do with the discussion that has been ongoing?

^ What's the name of this thread again???

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

She is a supporter of anti-Thaksinites, she says so, clearly.

Where?

In the same sentence that you cut this ^ quote from. Can you read?

Whether she is pro or anti makes no difference, the piece is about women's rights and the lack of response to an attack on Yingluck from the feminists here.

1) It does make a difference; 2) I've clearly highlighted why it's a political piece against Y - can you read?

That's it.

When DrB attacked you for being moronic, I tried to defend you and your right to an opinion. But, the way that you total ignore, refuse to read, analyze or accept anything that doesn't fit into your version of the world is truly moronic.

BB

Has Calgary hacked your account?

Originally Posted by Moonraker

You're just making no sense now BB

To people, who by their own admission only read the Bkk Post and the nation; scanning for the pictures; ignoring the article text, I'm not surprised that you struggle to understand actual words, critical analysis, creative opinion making that comes out of my own brain rather than lapping up what a picture and headline editor offer you...

I think the cheese has slid off the boy's cracker

Critical analysis from the School of Betty: Read something and decide upon its merits according to whether or not it says what you want it to say.

^ I have explained why over several posts (including the one to Hazz today), at length.

You have done nothing other than offer superficial opinion, refused to read or attempt to understand my clear and simple explanation then just repeated that "I am right!!! I am right!!!" in your usual manner.

Let's make it very very very simple for you:

In an article that is about, as you claim, 'a lack of reaction from feminists over this incident', do you think it is normal (or lacking political bias and manipulative ideology) to bring in quotes time after time after time that highlight Y in a bad light?

BB, here is the section you quoted about Thaksin, I have included the entire section. To me the author is making a mildly amusing point, that a self-confessed anti-Thaksinite is in fact someone who was on the run from criminal (fraud for a ponzi scheme) charges for some 20 years....something which is amusing when you consider just how anti-Thaksin types allege that Thaksin was corrupt. It is ironic. You do understand irony, right?

It really puts down (slanders?) Akeyuth. Pretty much saying that he is the lowest of the low....

I've included the context, because as you so rightly claimed earlier in the thread, the context is all important....

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

Bangkok feminists, where are you? | Asian Correspondent

Bangkok feminists, where are you?

By Siam Voices Nov 13, 2011 11:11PM UTC


By Kaewmala

A week and a half ago many in the Thai social networks were stunned by a comment made on Facebook. A number of people were outraged, especially people from the North. Here’s the comment that started the brouhaha:

“I really don’t want to say this because it will seem like I look down on women… but the truth is… Northern girls who are uneducated or lazy and intellectually retarded will look for an easy job that normal women won’t do… Mainly it’s prostitution … Therefore, the Northern woman who is devoid of intelligence and extremely stupid yet thick-faced enough to take up the position, you should know what profession suits you.”

That was what Mr. Akeyuth Anchanbutr, a “self-made” businessman, aspiring political pundit and relentless anti-Thaksin crusader, wrote on his Facebook wall on 2 November 2011.

Of course, which particular “Northern woman” Mr. Akeyuth alluded to was not lost to anyone with a functioning brain. Thailand’s first female prime minister is a woman from the North and a kid sister of Mr. Thaksin. Mr. Akeyuth has raised his profile in the Thai political world ever since he accused Mr. Thaksin of manipulating the stock market in 2005. He founded a “No color, no camp, but have the truth” and anti-anything-Thaksin-related website called Thaiinsider.com.

But this article is not about Mr. Akeyuth. As mind blowing as his comment was, for all its crassness and thoughtlessness, more interesting are the reactions to it.

Mr. Akeyuth’s Facebook comment has by now been shared by more than 1,200 people directly from his Facebook wall. This number has probably multiplied by many factors. Judging by the reactions on the original post, most readers didn’t like the comment one bit, though of course it has received 31 “Likes” on Mr. Akeyuth’s wall and probably more elsewhere. Most thought the comment was “too strong,” many pointing to the unfair stereotype, lack of substance in the statement, insult on others’ humanity and dignity, etc.

After much flak and little praise, Mr. Akeyuth reiterated his original comment. The gist of it was, he “did not accuse or look down on anyone but merely spoke the truth,” nor was he looking down on any profession, sex work included. Annoyed by the still nagging critics, Akeyuth put it plainly once and for all: “I already told you that I hate lazy people who want to have it easy, that’s all… Like it or not, it’s up to you.”

And that was from a man on the run for twenty years (until the statute of limitation ran out) from fraud charges for allegedly masterminding a ponzi scheme back in the 1980’s. If anyone should have sympathy for Thaksin, you would think it’s Akeyuth. But self-awareness seems to be missing here.

The author in the next paragraph goes on to show a direct comparison to public reaction to Akeyuth...

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

No surprise that there was a public outrage especially from Northerners. An anti-Akeyuth Facebook page went up in no time. The page now has over 4,000 “Likes” and over 3,500 people talking about it.

If you have the wherewithal to compare this to the earlier paragraph on Akeyuth's Facebook page, it is easy to see what is being said.

^ The author then goes on to detail reactions from various feminists and feminist groups, including a red shirt group in the north...

Originally Posted by StrontiumDog

A day after the comment was made civil society groups in Chiang Mai gathered to condemn the man. Representatives from Northern women’s groups, Empower the NGO for sex workers, Red women’s group, Chiang Mai City organizations and Lanna University joined to condemn his comment. They said it was a “denigration and dehumanization of sex workers and an insult on the dignity of Northern Thai women.” The group demanded that Akeyuth take the responsibility for his comment. A Lanna women’s group filed a complaint with the police against him for defaming Northern Thai women.

The statement by the Lanna University pointed out the economic structure that exploits poor rural women from the North and other regions as a reason for regional inequity that should not be ignored:

“To say that Northern Thai women are lazy and stupid is to ignore that fact, and to speak of the prime minister in such a way is to insult the majority of people in the country who elected her… Lanna University faculty calls on all parties to condemn … the view that supports gender oppression, the view that looks down upon the people in a democratic system, and the view that denigrates the leader of the country.”

On 4 November, the Phayao women’s networks also came out to demand an apology from Akeyuth.

As a Northerner, I myself was outraged and condemned Akeyuth for his blatantly sexist and racist remark as soon as I saw it on Twitter . Many others—women and men, Northerners and non-Northerners alike—were doing the same on social media. Some were calling the comment a “hate speech.”

And the piece continues looking at the reactions of some and the lack of reaction from others over this comment from Akeyuth.

It really isn't difficult to understand.

Why you have completely failed to grasp the point of the piece is beyond me and somewhat troubling.

^ no, that was not the section. The section was:

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

"As I was about to lose all hope, a long-awaited opinion finally came on 10 November from the feminist journalist whom I have admired for many years, Sanitsuda Ekachai of the Bangkok Post: "Despite having a big team of babysitters handpicked by her fugitive brother, her inability even to read a scripted speech correctly had made her a laughing stock. Her management of the current flood disaster is simply disastrous.Criticise her poor performance if you will. That is what democracy is about."

The author says she is an admirer of this columnist then quotes her anti-Y rant at length; a rant that has nothing to do with the subject of the article... Can you see yet? Do you think that including such a rant, the author CHOOSING to include such a rant directed the the PM, is needed, adds to the topic?

I will repeat the very easy question from above (that you didn't answer) then add one more; they're both very easy:

1)

Originally Posted by Bettyboo

In an article that is about, as you claim, 'a lack of reaction from feminists over this incident', do you think it is normal (or lacking political bias and manipulative ideology) to bring in quotes time after time after time that highlight Y in a bad light?

2) In an article that is about Akeyuth's comments and 'a lack of reaction from feminists over this incident' (as you have stated), do you think it is normal to highlight:

Akeyuth = 28 times.
Thaksin = 6 times.
Yinluck = 31 times.

Yinluck, as can be seen from various methods (this simply but highly effective method counts the number of times the names are used), is the focus of this article.

Let's ask a third, easy question:

3) If you read a football report, and football was mentioned 28 times, while Rugby Union was mentioned 31 times and Rugby League 6 times (both Rugby's ALWAYS mentioned in a bad light), then would you say the piece was about football or rugby? Woudl you say that the author was using the 'football' article to whinge and complain, to attack, Rugby? Most people would...

How many votes do you think that label will swing for the Princes-Pa foundation?

If you think the palace is not a factor in Thai politics and that this stuff doesn't have consequences, you know nothing at all about Thai politics.

But perhaps you meant something like this:



It says:

Democrat Party helps flood victims. Abhisit.

The guy in front looks like he's wearing a navy shirt.

Is it a fake? Could be. These, though, are certainly genuine. They're Democrat volunteers wearing the Asa (volunteer) Democrat shirts and sorting through donations.



Here are bags from the Democrat Party



Here's another lorry with a Democrat banner



And here's Abhisit giving away some boats (which have the Asa Democrat logo on the front).

Betty

You are making a fool of yourself.

Originally Posted by Dan

How many votes do you think that label will swing for the Princes-Pa foundation?

If you think the palace is not a factor in Thai politics and that this stuff doesn't have consequences, you know nothing at all about Thai politics.

But perhaps you meant something like this:



It says:

Democrat Party helps flood victims. Abhisit.

The guy in front looks like he's wearing a navy shirt.

Is it a fake? Could be. These, though, are certainly genuine. They're Democrat volunteers wearing the Asa (volunteer) Democrat shirts and sorting through donations.



Here are bags from the Democrat Party



Here's another lorry with a Democrat banner



And here's Abhisit giving away some boats (which have the Asa Democrat logo on the front).

Well if the dems are doing it as well, then they too are a bunch of kunts. Just like PTP are a bunch of kunts for doing it.