Thread: why I have come to despise these loser, fake "educators"

Probably for the first time I agree with DJ Pat. The reason? I have a MA-TESL along with a elementary certification.

I HATE fakes...

^ Definitely understand and completely agree with what you have said here. Firstly, about the cost, I remember seeing a local university in Scotland charging more than 700 quid for students looking to receive a TESOL certificate. Paying a little bit less in Thailand but with a similar degree, I decided to take a TESOL course.

Building on what you said, I met two people that struck my interest during my course. One person took the course with me and the other had completed it within the previous month. The person who took the course with me was not a native speaker of English. That is not the problem I had, but when it came to learning and as the month progressed, I realised that this person's level of English was a great deal lower than I had expected. I was suprised that someone who didn't have a strong grasp on English was able to complete and pass a TESOL course! I guess it is hard to charge people a bundle of money and fail them. The other man, who completed the course and merely passed is now an English teacher. I see him every night drinking and barely waking up the next morning to teach at school - without a doubt heavily hungover.

It is sad to see that people's intentions to come to Thailand and teach English are far from the teaching reasons but to have the ability to live in Thailand long term and pay for their alcohol. I, too, must admit that I was naiive in thinking that there were a greater amount of people in Thailand teaching English for the right reasons. Upon taking this TESOL course, I not only learned how to teach students but realised this problem.

Am I wrong in saying that in at least Bangkok based schools, it is getting harder to teach without certificates. I know that elsewhere in Thailand there really is not too much need...

I saw myself as providing 'English conversation classes' - I didn't see myself as a lifelong 'educator'.

.......but you shouldn't get so worked up about it. You're making yourself upset unnecessarily.

And, yes you can get on a high horse about the nitelife - but, do you indulge? Only if you don't can you cast the first stone.

Your photos of the 'English teachers' in Topshop shoes were funny - but there seems to be some self-hate exercise afoot here.

Would you rather be in another profession?

But why do the 1-2 month trained ESL teachers seem to settle in Thailand? The answer is easy. Women, booze and or drugs...

Seen this happen way to many times.

^ So whats your bottom line here.

They should be sent home?
Teachers should pass an ongoing ethical probity test (lie detector) to maintain employment?

DJ Pat is preaching bland utopianism based on a set of correlated personal recollections.

Originally Posted by hillbilly

But why do the 1-2 month trained ESL teachers seem to settle in Thailand? The answer is easy. Women, booze and or drugs...

Seen this happen way to many times.

Can't be talking about quality TEFLer's like John Michael Karr are ya?

What is qualified? I have a degree in the subject which I teach, but I don't have an education degree or a PGCE (or other equivalent). Most teachers back in the UK do NOT have a degree in their subject, but do have a PGCE or education degree.

I am at the moment wondering if I can face a year or two back in the UK to get some qualifications....

Originally Posted by hillbilly

I really dislike 1 month teachers.

No doubt you are much more "qualified" that the rest of the TESOL one month teachers. But, in my opinion, there is a lot more to teaching than getting a degree/certificate. The actual teaching and experience is just as important as learning how to do it. More so, it is the teacher's personality which plays a large role. Something that many "teachers" in Thailand fail in - experience, the want to teach and correct personality.

Also, despite what I said before, there are still those who are in Thailand for more than drugs, sex and/or alcohol - maybe not as many as I hope but there are those few!

NickA, you hit the nail on the head.

If you want to make the money here in Thailand, you must have a piece of paper stating such. No, it is not right. A degree don't mean shit, common sense wise, nor a good teacher.

But, if you want to make the money, it does. Not that different from the UK or USA.

^ But weigh the prices...It is easy to go back to the UK/USA get a degree and pay a small fortune and then move to Thailand for what? You will be paying off the degree for ages.

With that said, I would not consider a teaching career in the USA/UK. The reason being is that teachers are not looked highly upon there but, in my belief, they are looked much more highly upon in Thailand...

^not a degree, but a PGCE, which is only a year long and in the UK is paid for by the government (they even give you a bit of pocket money)... then maybe a years experience in an English school.

Another point - in general fully qualified teachers are unable to handle teaching in a Thai school - I've seen two 50+ year old lifelong American teachers who have thrown the towel in after only 1 term. Even if Thai schools paid the same money as international schools, most of the better teachers would still go to international schools because of the better organisation and greater will to educate.

The key is to make at least B100,000 per month.

^or to work as little as possible (a la CMN)

^ I have to apologize to thaibook. Maybe I hit the wrong button. I did not mean to nor did I want edit anything. Please resubmit and accept my apologies.

Regardless, I have never in my year or two in BKK ever seen such ESL positions. Take, that back. If one had a teaching credential and a top international school, was needy, well then maybe.

But if you can, good luck!

^ No problem at all. Not looking for a teaching job - just thought it be interesting to take the TESOL course. Still have to deal with my own Uni studies first (not a teaching major though). You and the others have made some good points though...

^I know ESL (or EFL) teachers who earn that kind of money by working two jobs or a lot of overtime, but not any that earn it by working normal hours.

Originally Posted by hillbilly

Probably for the first time I agree with DJ Pat. The reason? I have a MA-TESL along with a elementary certification.

Wow! You must be the best teacher in the world.

And you're right. ALL other 'teachers' are only here for cheap whores.

Originally Posted by DJ Pat

I honestly think that Smeg has some kind of point.

I'm a TEFL-er myself and well proud of it. But, my origins of getting my TESOL certificate were quite accidental and unothordox.

I got grade "A"s at my school in both GCSE English language and literature and also did very well on the communication side of it, I was very good at speaking and explaining stuff to the class, and revelled in my ego trip at being up there in front of a crowd talking and presenting my topic.

No, I didn't want to be some teacher I wanted to be a chef, and also scored a grade A in the Home Economics food course at the same school.

Anyway, in 1997 I had what some alcoholics refer to (and to quote Samuel L. Jackson in Pulp Fiction) as "a moment of clarity", and amidst my drunkeness and alcoholism of 1997 decided to return to the church our family had frequented when I was a kid.

At the church at the time they were well into 'community projects', and one of which was "teaching" basic english to the first wave of Kosovan refugees that had descended upon London and to enable their status to appear more geuine, many of these refugees enrolled at English classes in the evenings to appear more favourable to the Home Office who would be assesing wether they would be allowed what is known as "indefinite leave to remain", ie can stay in the UK forever as an immigrant and claim benefits.

Anyway the church, being the do-gooders that they are, drafted volunteers to go and teach basic english greetings to classfuls of these badly dressed refugees and I volunteered enthusiastically, hoping that I could get them writing stories about mysterious black cars and football heroes (my fave subjects as a kid).

How naiive I was at 23.

The deal was that you did the voluntary work, and in return they would send you each weekend to the Friends' (quakers) Meeting House in Euston Road to study a TESOL course, which was designed to help brush up on grammar and the finer points and qualities of being an english tutor. To me, the course was easy, the only part I found hard was the phonetic alphabet which to this day, I fucking hate explaining.

(I say 'tutor' because when I was a kid, part time teachers at school were reffered to by other teachers as 'tutors')

Anyway, after almost four months I and several others came out with TESOL certificates to show we'd completed and passed the course, and this certificate, along with my City and Guilds in electrical installation and Radio studio course ended up in the box that also contained my swimming medals, football medals, GCSE certifiates and judo belts until 2002, when I was moving stuff out after my divorce.

I was totally unaware of the significance of a TEFL / TESOL certificate and what it meant until I travelled alone for the first time and realised that the course I had taken was worth over 500 quid and was recognised worldwide.

I had seen some old ****s at the Central School of English in London I worked at after I did the course and wondered why this particular course appealed to such older types of men who appeared to be lonely, 40-something conversation-less anoraks.

My first choice was to go and do some teaching in Portugal as a mate of mine had a huge house there and I wanted some sun and sea after a gloomy marriage.

Anyway, after assessing my options, I ended up in Thailand for the first time alone without the chaperone of family of my ex-wife.

The point being, that I constantly came across very badly dressed guys who were obviously teachers and many of the ones who I have had conversations with expressed their desire to "exist" as lomg as possible under the guise of being a "teacher" so they could enjoy their honeymoon life of staying in Thailand where many females are pretty and for a small cost, can relieve oneself whilst straddling over some useless whore from a bar for ten minutes.

Firstly I thought to myself, is sex that important that you would eke out an existence and live hand to mouth just to fulfill this desire? Then I told myself I was being naiive and that these guys must have savings or property to fall back on to be so cavalier in their attitude towards their "career".

But no, I was being even more naiive.

Then after some experience in Thailand teaching, which I will add that I was very lucky to get some really 'cushy numbers' that included being employed full time at a chemical factory in Samut Prakan, and working at a gold factory in Charoen Nakorn.

I then realised that these guys wouldn't know a noun or a verb if it came up and kicked them in the teeth, and there I was working my bollox off while these clowns pissed it up night after night whilst doing their meaningless duties at ECC or some godforsaken Govt school where they were lauded as 'heroes' purely for having blonde or brown hair and being a native speaker. No certificates, no pre-prep, not an ounce of knowledge and not any ambition to actually educate.

I will say it again, I was well naiive, but I, like Smeg, have come to despise these losers who can exist as 'educators' while they themselves probably spent half of their education stahding outside the headteachers office for being disruptive wankers in class.

Glad I've got that off my chest.

Fair enough. However it is a odd that someone like you that left school at 16 or so educates post graduate executives . Does the subject of your education ever come up? Do you tell the truth or lie like Bangkok Phil?

^ what do you think?

Originally Posted by obsidian

^ what do you think?

Well he's been honest about his level of education on the web... Shill has lied through his yellow teeth for years.