Thread: China Issues

How much do foreigners really know about China?

How much do foreigners really know about China? [angrychineseblogger.blog-city.com]
posted Friday, 2 May 2008


When reading what foreigners have to say about China ACB often finds them selves asking two important questions. 1) Is this person talking about the same China that ACB knows, or some other place entirely? 1) Based on what experience does this person make such statements. After giving thing some thought ACB has reached their own tentative answers to these important questions. 1) No, 2) None.

It would appear that ACB isn't the only person whom has reached their conclusion.

From the pen of Xu Wu: Assistant Professor of Strategic Media and Public Relations, Walter Cronkite School of Journalism and Mass Communication, Arizona State University.

The real US deficit with China - knowledge

Americans are out of touch with today's China. It's a knowledge deficit that carries more weight in the long-term bilateral relationships between China and the United States than the ballooning US trade deficit with China. And as China makes a comeback on the world stage, it's one that the US should address.

Chinese visitors to the US have shared the shock of witnessing a severe dichotomy between how much Americans seem to talk about China and yet how little they know about it. The US status as the world's superpower, coupled with its location, warrants people this type of benign negligence.

But what about those experts who have the power to impose their perceptions of China on others? All too often China experts in the US cannot even speak the language. How can they claim to understand a culture without knowing how its people communicate?

This knowledge deficit accounts directly for widespread and deep-rooted misperceptions about China.

There are three faulty, recurring talking points in the American media.

First, China is a rising power, and a rising power is dangerous. The first part of this argument is incomplete, and the latter part is misplaced. China is not only a rising power; it is a returning power. China, as a united continental power, has existed for more than 2,000 years.

As a returning player, China is composed, restrained, and mature, just like a former champion returning to the title game after a short lapse. Also, if history is any guide, Chinese-ruling regimes have not been considered aggressive or expansive; they were famous for building walls. This fact alone should call into question the comparison of China's current resurgence with Japan's and Germany's disastrous rising path before World War II.

Second, China is a Communist country, and Communism is evil. Repeatedly placed upon China by media commentators, most notably CNN's anchorman Lou Dobbs, this characterization is both simplistic and utterly misleading.

To today's China, Marxism is as foreign as liberal democracy. When you look back at China's past, no alien cultures have uprooted Chinese tradition; instead, they were either localized, or submerged. China can still be Chinese without the Communism title.

Likewise, today's ruling Chinese Communist Party (CCP) could easily be renamed the Chinese Confucian Party (CCP) without changing much of its ideological belief or organizational structure, or even its acronym for that matter.

Both the "ruling by virtue" policy promoted by former President Jiang Zemin and the "harmonious society" guideline proposed by current leader Hu Jintao were derived more from the Confucian doctrine than from the Marxist ideology. Singling out "Communist" as the definer confuses the reality.

Third, Tiananmen Square in 1989 is an iconic image that lingers in the minds of the Chinese. American observers' obsession with this tragic event reflects how deep their perception gap about China runs. There is no question that what happened that summer was historic. However, it was a generation ago, and sea changes have occurred since then.

Those who were born in 1989 are turning 19. What this new Chinese generation cares about is not the guy who blocked those tanks, but the Chinese Super Girl Singer and Yao Ming. America's unyielding interest in Tiananmen is out of touch. Is the Watergate scandal still the dominant issue facing the US today?

This lack of updated information about China becomes more problematic in a larger context. Chinese students are required to study English beginning in primary school. Students are exposed to both American culture and the Western way of thinking by college. For at least two decades, tens of thousands of the best and the brightest Chinese students attend American's top-tier graduate schools, channeling back the most updated perceptions and information about the US.

Although the number of American students studying in China witnessed a huge jump over the past few years, the accumulated knowledge deficits and language barriers are still immense.

This imbalance of knowledge, just like the imbalance of trade, is unsustainable. With the trade problem, Chinese leaders outlined a "win-win partner" scenario, and American policymakers have mapped out the "responsible stakeholder" blueprint. However, no strategy will be feasible if the two parties cannot understand each other well enough to weather the uncertainties ahead.

It is highly probable that the next generation of Americans will live in a world where China is the largest economic power. Are they prepared? When and how are they going to fix this current knowledge deficit with China?


While ACB doesn't agree with everything said here, and notices that there are some strategic exclusions and whitewashings, this blogger does agree with the writer on a number of key points. Most significantly, that there exist a significant number of misconceptions about China that are held at every level of society, from the man on the street to leaders in their seats of office, and that these misconceptions are based largely on a lack of understanding of China today and China in the past.

Don't give me a hard time as I'm not wise enough to debate you guys, but I reckon the Chinese are bad people.

They execute more people than I can count & I've seen on televison factories of kids being trained to death in the pursuit of sporting supremacy & such. They are ruthless bastards & can't be trusted. They are best mates with all the worst regimes in the world. If there's a genocide or some horror going on, you can bet China's fingerprints are all over it somehow, such as providing guns or political clout.

In the interests of balance - I'm sure there are some nice ones, too.

But I don't trust them as far as I can throw one.

Propaganda has a lot of excuses...so does brainwashing by the media.

Chinese interests in Sudan...

Or Zimbabwe

Moss

America's unyielding interest in Tiananmen is out of touch. Is the Watergate scandal still the dominant issue facing the US today?

A mite Chalk and Cheese don't you think?

Moss

China is like a blod-sucking Chupacabra, there is nothing great in what they are doing, keep defending them Momo....

The basic premise of the article, that foreigners in general, Westerners in particular, do not understand China or the Chinese is true.

It is also true that they are automatically viewed as a threat because of their (re) emerging superpower status. No secret is made about that.

Similarly to the US, China seeks to guarantee it's long term sources of energy, minerals and food. So it competes with the West in these arenas, as you would expect. This also means that, just like the West, it does business with less than savoury regimes in the pursuance of these strategic aims. No surprises there.

Expansionism, in the old colonial sense of the world, is a thing of the past. The Chinese have no expansionist plans as such, their ambitions could be better described as Imperialistic in the same manner as the West- securing future sources of essential commodities through a combination of foreign investment, foreign aid and deal making with foreign regimes.

Other than petty civil or regional conflicts, tomorrows geo political wars will come about due to competition for strategic commodities such as oil, food, water and minerals. Free trade is preferred, by all parties, but lets face it if Saudi Arabia turned around tomorrow and said they would supply China at the expense of the West (which it is their right to do under trade laws), a NATO alliance would invade tomorrow. That is the limit of free trade.

Originally Posted by sabang

The basic premise of the article, that foreigners in general, Westerners in particular, do not understand China or the Chinese is true.

It is also true that they are automatically viewed as a threat because of their (re) emerging superpower status. No secret is made about that.

Similarly to the US, China seeks to guarantee it's long term sources of energy, minerals and food. So it competes with the West in these arenas, as you would expect. This also means that, just like the West, it does business with less than savoury regimes in the pursuance of these strategic aims. No surprises there.

Expansionism, in the old colonial sense of the world, is a thing of the past. The Chinese have no expansionist plans as such, their ambitions could be better described as Imperialistic in the same manner as the West- securing future sources of essential commodities through a combination of foreign investment, foreign aid and deal making with foreign regimes.

Other than petty civil or regional conflicts, tomorrows geo political wars will come about due to competition for strategic commodities such as oil, food, water and minerals. Free trade is preferred, by all parties, but lets face it if Saudi Arabia turned around tomorrow and said they would supply China at the expense of the West (which it is their right to do under trade laws), a NATO alliance would invade tomorrow. That is the limit of free trade.

Absolutely SPOT ON !

China is a difficult country for anyone to understand without spending a lot of time there, not just reading about it or listening to the opinions of others.

However, I will say that I do not agree with the article insofar as businessmen and women go. I've met many, many sophisticated American, European, Australian and other foreign people who do business with China and do understand it to a much better degree than most others.

And, there has been a sea change in the number of foreigners in this category. I started my first business in 1986 specifically to conduct China business. Up until even that time, China experts were called "china hands" or "old china hands." And there were only a handful of such people.

With China's tremendous growth and opening for investment and trade in the intervening 22 years, the sheer numbers of China experts have risen dramatically.

And, many China experts are in fact returned overseas Chinese, so they have the best of both worlds. They went to the states to get an education and live, and then later returned to China. I know many people in this category.

Chinese are rude and competitive, hardly representing a social model of any kind, and that lead to their ruthlessness,

do we want to be dominated by those cocksuckers ? We were doing and they were doing better under Communist China,

^Yes, your point of the China sophisticates being too busy to write about it, and spending time developing and nurturing relationships in China is right.

I do find though, that many smart newcomers do not really understand how to influence deals. They think it's simply not corrupt, or that conversely, everybody is on the take.

Without the benefit of knowing how things have changed over the years, but still understanding the basic Chinese nature of greed, it's hard to find the right balance in dealing with Chinese in China.

And, yes, it's always best to have a 'compradore' trusted Chinese partner/advisor, (that is a quaint term, not really used anymore). Really, nobody should do business in China without a trusted Chinese partner of some kind.

How much do foreigners really know about China? [angrychineseblogger.blog-city.com]

cry me a river

a free press would fix this one , next ......................

OK, I finally read this ABC blogger's diatribe and the view from the ass prof Xu.
Chinese go to America and are astounded that Americans don't understand Chinese? I'd also say, most Chinese don't know diddly about America except for Big Macs and Hollywood. I translated for a Beijing lady at a clothing store not long ago -- hey, didn't this guy say they ALL spoke Engrish? Propaganda.
Yes, Chinese culture swallowed all its historic aggressors, that being the Manchu Khans.
Never mind the Tiananmen (Heavenly Gate) square massacre, how about the cultural revolution and Mao's little red book waving brigands who sold out their parents and families and threw all the educated folks into rice paddy work? Oh, very Confucian.
Chinese learning American ways? English maybe, lots of Brits and Aussies over there teaching. Are they teaching them not to spit on the street?
How bout the neighbourhood police in China with spies everywhere to report any minor transgression?
The Chinese are into long-term strategies. They mostly don't give a f*ck about human rights, even for their own people. Hey, check out the recent news where wreckers are tearing down homes with people inside -- hey, get rid of the old houses coz the Olympics are coming.
Never mind the Chinese going to suck up natural resources in Africa while the local govts kill off their own natives. Oh, shemma? Mei guanxi. And then bringing in Chinese labourers and infrastucture like noodle makers and cheap t-shirt hawkers to meet their tastes.
When I was in Asian studies in the early 80s, we were exotic. Me and a guy were the only graduates from the program. We both went to Asia to study. Beida he Heida. Then to Japan for me.
This trite crap your posting about China Momo is just that. Crap.
There are many Americans and Brits and other nationalities who speak fluent Chinese and are clued into the score over there. To say otherwise is stupidity.

Originally Posted by Jet Gorgon

This trite crap your posting about China Momo is just that. Crap.

I refrained from comment as I was posting an article by the Angry Chinese Blogger who has some insightful blogs about China.I thoght it was an interesting read along with many others on the blog city website who have widely differing views about China.I agree with a lot of things said in it but that doesn't mean I support 100% all things Chinese.

Why post it then if you don't have a comment?

It's an interesting read and many here in issues have a lot to say on the topic,just an extra angle.

I've heard this "angle" for more than 20 years.

^ Judge Judy.

^ 20 years, paddy labour.