HIV Infection risks

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by kingwilly

still retains a 100% fatality rate....

So does life....

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

But HIV isn't absorbed through the pores of the skin so no problem

You have splattered that mossie over the hole she had just drilled into your ankle.....

**Dalton** · 17-02-2008, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by kingwilly

really? still retains a 100% fatality rate.... and 25-30 million infections is a fairly big number, no?

It dosent change the fact that if medication was given to those people, then the death rate would drop very quick.....But who cares....it's mostly in Africa, just the blacks..right...Sometimes I'm really a-shamed of being a human-being.

**kingwilly** · 17-02-2008, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by Dalton

It dosent change the fact that if medication was given to those people, then the death rate would drop very quick.....But who cares....it's mostly in Africa, just the blacks..right...Sometimes I'm really a-shamed of being a human-being.

actually i suspect it has more to do with the fact of their socio-economic well-being than skin colour,

but other than that, i do agree its a crying shame.

**chinthee** · 17-02-2008, 07:51 PM

[quote=kingwilly;536874]

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

Originally Posted by chinthee

unprotected oral sex is highly unlikely to be a risk for HIV

tell that to the Indian truckdrivers who are all contracting it....

Who better to consult than the many, many gay studies that have been undertaken on this subject in the US and elsewhere. They all say the chances are low. I'm not sure where the Indians are getting it from, but not just oral, I'll bet. AND, I'll also bet whatever data collection exists in India cannot be relied upon for veracity.

**AntRobertson** · 17-02-2008, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by dirtydog

You have splattered that mossie over the hole she had just drilled into your ankle.....

Well if HIV's not aborbed through the pores of the skin it ain't going in through any hole made by a mosquito proboscis either.

And don't forget that a mosquito 'bite' isn't actually that - they inject a painkiller and blood flow does the rest. Blood's coming out, not going back in.

**kingwilly** · 17-02-2008, 07:54 PM

^ Jaysus, have you read anything about this topic??

I'm referring to the recent phenomon of heterosexual truckdrivers and the prostitute villages they visit along the way contracting the same disease.

do a google search

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

Well if HIV's not aborbed through the pores of the skin it ain't going in through any hole made by a mosquito proboscis either

If that was true then it could be quite happily stated that mossies can not carry the hiv virus as if it is too big to go in the hole the mossie has created then it would be too big to get into the mossie in the first place when it was sucking the blood, aint seen it stated as hard fact that mossies cannot sup down the hiv virus whilst drinking blood.

**AntRobertson** · 17-02-2008, 08:04 PM

Originally Posted by dirtydog

If that was true then it could be quite happily stated that mossies can not carry the hiv virus as if it is too big to go in the hole the mossie has created then it would be too big to get into the mossie in the first place when it was sucking the blood, aint seen it stated as hard fact that mossies cannot sup down the hiv virus whilst drinking blood.

Nobody said anything about it being too big or that mosquito's can't carry it in contaminated blood.

But think about the logistics of it... A mosquito 'bite' doesn't inject blood and HIV can only survive in human cells. So the moment a mosquito ingests HIV it is digested and killed in the stomache of the mosquito.

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

A mosquito 'bite' doesn't inject blood

Huh? you have splattered and killed the mossie over the wound site on your ankle, yes smeared it's tainted blood all over the wound..

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

the moment a mosquito ingests HIV it is digested and killed in the stomache of the mosquito.

Is this a fact or a thought?

**November Rain** · 17-02-2008, 08:30 PM

Note to self - don't go away for a whole day & then come back to a thread that you're interested in. It will be 10 pages long & you won't have enough greens & reds to go around to those that deserve them.

**obsidian** · 17-02-2008, 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Is this a fact or a thought?

option 3.

bkkandrew · 17-02-2008, 09:01 PM

I am quite interested in DD's mossie theory.

In the event of HIV diagnosis, sexual partner(s) might be tested, children (of infected mother) would be etc. etc. Evidence of cross infection would then be blamed on the above links, but what if it was a mossie in the house? This is where the 'no recorded instances of mossie infection' argument fails. How do they know when/where/how the transmission of the virus occurred? Given the low %ages I originally quoted at the top of this thread, it follows that infection can only occur (on average) after prolonged sexual contact (100's or 1000's of times). How many 100's or 1000's of occurances of mosquito bite of both infectees have occurred during the same period?

Similarly so, how many people diagnosed HIV+ have not nailed down the cause of the infection? OK, some may have simply shagged so many people that they can't remember their names, but could there be another view?

Finally DD is again right when pointing out that there doesn't seem to be much research into this alleged process of mosquitos killing the HIV virus, which, if true could yeild an insight into HIV cure. Give the Billions spent on AIDS research, it is unlikely that noone would think to investigate how a mosquito 'cures' HIV and try to apply such a cure to the human body. They have been doing this as a matter of course since Flaming's nose ran into the petri dish in the run-up to discovering Penicillin....

**blackgang** · 17-02-2008, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by kingwilly

I'm referring to the recent phenomon of heterosexual truckdrivers and the prostitute villages

Now where is this posed to be happening at, Hyway 95 in Nevada is the only place I know of in the states that has Whorehouses that are legal, but being legal the whores are checked weekly.
And there are no whores in Thailand to check cause it is illegal here.

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 09:07 PM

People in areas like South Africa and thailand get bitten by more mossies perday than sex they get perday, Ok i agree your more likely to get hiv if you let 10 blokes with hiv bugger you everyday as opposed to 10 mossie bites everyday, UK we don't have many mossies most of the year, have a load of pooves and drug users, but the hiv problem is no where near as bad as say Thailand or South Africa.

**AntRobertson** · 17-02-2008, 09:07 PM

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Huh? you have splattered and killed the mossie over the wound site on your ankle, yes smeared it's tainted blood all over the wound..

Calling it a wound's a bit dramatic. Besides which it's pumping blood, not suctioning it.

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Is this a fact or a thought?

Fact, according to the info CMN posted.

End of the day I'm not claiming to be an expert on any of this, far from it. All that I'm saying is that to me logic seems to dictate that HIV cannot be contracted via mosquito's. For one there doesn't seem to be any correlation in the stats - why aren't there higher incidents of children, elderly or otherwise sexually inactive and non-hypodermic using people being infected. There's a correlation with other mosquito bourne diseases such as malaria so why none for HIV? It sounds to me like the immaculate conceptions of infection theories.

It's one thing to lay it at the feet of some grand conspriacy, quite another to explain this absence.

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 09:13 PM

Children are generally well looked after in 3rd world countries, ie always in their mothers arms etc, tucked up in bed at night, people of say 20 to 40 would then be sitting out on their verandha of the evening drinking a few bottles of whatever their local looney juice is, if mossies do transmit hiv then that would make those people high risk.

bkkandrew · 17-02-2008, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

End of the day I'm not claiming to be an expert on any of this, far from it. All that I'm saying is that to me logic seems to dictate that HIV cannot be contracted via mosquito's.

What logic?

Originally Posted by AntRobertson

For one there doesn't seem to be any correlation in the stats - why aren't there higher incidents of children, elderly or otherwise sexually inactive and non-hypodermic using people being infected. There's a correlation with other mosquito bourne diseases such as malaria so why none for HIV? It sounds to me like the immaculate conceptions of infection theories.

HIV infection does not show symptons for between 5 and 15 years, malaria causes instant illness. Hence you can tell cause of infection far easier in malaria than HIV... The 'infected' non-sexually active children may be diagnosed later when sexually active. The old folks may have died from other causes...

**Mid** · 17-02-2008, 09:16 PM

Mosquitoes
Aug 21, 2000 Can a person be infected with AIDS by mosquitoes that had contact with an AIDS victim's blood? If yes, how can we prevent ourselves from getting infected? If no, why don't researchers find out why it doesn't and then perhaps find a cure for AIDS with research on mosquitoes and how the insect prevents itself from getting infected?

Response from Mr. Kull

There are several reasons why scientists believe that HIV cannot and is not spread by insects, like mosquitoes.
1) Epidemiology: there is no evidence that HIV has been spread by insects in areas where there is a high incidence of AIDS and large populations of insects.
2) Insects inject their own saliva as a lubricant to assist feeding. They do not inject their own or a previously bitten persons' blood. Malaria and yellow fever are transmitted through insect saliva. HIV isn't.
3) HIV does not survive nor reproduce in insects.
4) HIV generally does not survive long enough outside of its host to be spread by the insect's mouth area. Insects also do not generally feed on two people in immediate succession. There is usually a rest period in between feedings.
5) The reasons why HIV does not survive or reproduce in insects does not have any significance for humans. HIV (HUMAN immunodeficiency virus) is only fatal to humans.
No need to run out for the bug repellent. HIV is not transmitted this way.
RMK

thebody.com

**AntRobertson** · 17-02-2008, 09:17 PM

Originally Posted by dirtydog

Children are generally well looked after in 3rd world countries, ie always in their mothers arms etc, tucked up in bed at night, people of say 20 to 40 would then be sitting out on their verandha of the evening drinking a few bottles of whatever their local looney juice is, if mossies do transmit hiv then that would make those people high risk.

But again that fails to account for the high incidence of malaria in those very same children. If they are contracting malaria then why aren't they contracting HIV? That's the part that doesn't gel with me.

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 09:20 PM

They probably aint being tested for hiv at this time?

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 09:25 PM

Originally Posted by Mid

Insects inject their own saliva as a lubricant to assist feeding. They do not inject their own or a previously bitten persons' blood. Malaria and yellow fever are transmitted through insect saliva. HIV isn't.

But when you see that mossie biting you whack it and smear the blood all over the wound.

Originally Posted by Mid

HIV does not survive nor reproduce in insects.

I think they have found that HIV can survive for up to 3 days in medical instruments.

Originally Posted by Mid

Insects also do not generally feed on two people in immediate succession

If someone see's a mossie biting them they brush it away or try to splat it, think of your average 3rd world village and an evenings activities, maybe cooking over a fire, it bites the HIV guy or girl but he she then moves away from cooking, the mossie flies onto it's next victim, he splats it a few seconds after it has bitten him.

**Mid** · 17-02-2008, 09:27 PM

want to worry bout mozzies ?

try this MCOT English News : Health officials on alert for dengue fever after 4 deaths

bkkandrew · 17-02-2008, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by Mid

There is usually a rest period in between feedings.

But on the occasions when there is not???

Just strange that this point is not scrutinised to the nth degree as other infection causes are....

**dirtydog** · 17-02-2008, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by Mid

Epidemiology: there is no evidence that HIV has been spread by insects in areas where there is a high incidence of AIDS and large populations of insects.

Lets look at the first iraq war where maggie kicked their butts in 15 days, the soldiers were given the wrong clothing, as it is considered desert they just assumed it was hot, they didn't have clothing for night times when it is bloody freezing cold, so how much do these American or UK doctors etc know of other countries, their lifestyles etc etc etc.

**Mid** · 17-02-2008, 09:31 PM

I think they have found that HIV can survive for up to 3 days in medical instruments.

Response from Mr. Sowadsky

Hi. Thank you for your question.
There has been a lot of misunderstanding (and misinterpretation) of the scientific data looking at survival of the HIV virus outside the body. Studies that looked at HIV survival, used concentrations of HIV at least 100,000 times higher than concentrations normally found in nature. Using these extremely high concentrations of HIV was used out of necessity, because of scientific and technical limitations. In studies using these extremely high concentrations, HIV was able to survive for 1-3 days after drying, but inactivation of the virus was extremely rapid (90-99% within several hours). Now, does this mean that HIV at normal concentrations will survive for up to 3 days? No! Remember that these are concentrations of HIV that are at least 100,000 times higher than that found in nature. When we extrapolate this data down to natural concentrations of HIV, we can determine that HIV can only live for several minutes outside the body. If HIV were to be able to survive outside the body for many hours or days (at natural concentrations), we would have seen cases of HIV transmission through casual contact. In the over 15 years that we have been studying HIV transmission, we have never seen any cases of transmission through casual contact worldwide.

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