Ukraine war mega thread

[bsnub]

Why hasn't Ukraine taken Donetsk, or Luhansk?

It has. Taken big swathes of it over the last several months, but you live in a fantasy world, so I imagine you may have missed that.

(P.s:- war porn phot's are the domain of you and ilk, and have little to do with me- not to mention no impact.}

That's because you are an idiot and clearly explains why you have no idea what you are talking about and are always completely clueless as to what is going on.

https://original.antiwar.com/Ted_Gal...-faces-defeat/

Oh look more propaganda from your shit source.

[bsnub]

At least he's more credible than Intel Slava Z.

Once again, Sabang makes an utter tit of himself.

[sabang]

We will see who is credible and who is not over coming months. Little baby squeals from infants have absolutely no effect on the matter.

I believe you got owned.

Oh, so in the pickled world anonymous pro-Ukrainian tweets are more reliable than quotes attributed to real people. I think you have proven yourself an eejut.

[pickel]

Oh, so in the pickled world anonymous pro-Ukrainian tweets are more reliable than quotes attributed to real people. I think you have proven yourself an eejut.

I made no mention of those though, right.

I merely took up your challenge of disproving the article you posted. And you got owned.

[bsnub]

Oh, so in the pickled world anonymous pro-Ukrainian tweets are more reliable than quotes attributed to real people.

Go back and reread his post. Your propaganda source was caught posting lies, you idiot. The quotes were fake and fell for it hook, line, and sinker.

And you got owned.

[sabang]

When even General Wesley Clark is alluding to the horrendous Ukrainian casualties being entailed, amongst multiple other sources, then why don't you go and tell him to his face that he is lying junior recruit?

[bsnub]

Quit repeating yourself. You are just making yourself look more desperate.

Own up to the beat down Pickle just gave you and move on. Snivelling helps nothing.

[sabang]

YOU are making yourself look more desperate, palpably. And you accuse me of repeating myself, what cheek- you do it day in, day out. As I have said before (yes, repeating myself) anything you NAFO junior recruits say behind the feverish anonymity of your jerkwad keyboards makes not one iota of difference to what happens on the ground. So lets just wait and see.


^ Cease being such a squalling little baby. A quote sourced from a real person- name provided- commanding a real Ukrainian regiment is attributable, and able to be Fact checked, unlike an anonymous tweet- as likely as not from some bot or NAFO wanker. Any person with an ounce of grey matter knows that, so grow up. A bunch of sulky babies who are clearly wrong saying "Owned" just shows how utterly pathetic you are.

[pickel]

A quote sourced from a real person- name provided- commanding a real Ukrainian regiment is attributable, and able to be Fact checked

Why don't you backcheck the articles you post when they reference other articles? Then you might see where it has been sprinkled with bullshit. It's a common propaganda technique and you have fallen for it.

[bsnub]

Then you might see where it has been sprinkled with bullshit. It's a common propaganda technique and you have fallen for it.

He really is a dense buffoon, isn't he? Still refusing to admit that he was exposed for posting lies and falsehoods when you nailed him dead to rights.

[harrybarracuda]

Why don't you backcheck the articles you post when they reference other articles? Then you might see where it has been sprinkled with bullshit. It's a common propaganda technique and you have fallen for it.

I wouldn't say he fell for it. He knows he posts mostly utter bullshit.

[sabang]

We will see in coming months, won't we.

[bsnub]

We will see in coming months, won't we.

You have already suffered epic levels of humiliation as the Ukrainians continue to kick the Russians teeth down their throats. But you have much more coming.

[sabang]

^^ Yeh sure junior recruit.

"Now Ukraine has had great success, but Kherson and Kharkiv are relatively small. So in terms of probability, the probability of a Ukrainian military victory, defined as kicking the Russians out of all of Ukraine, to include what they claim is Crimea…is not high, militarily,"

General Mark Milley, Chairman Joint Chiefs of Staff

[helge]

the Ukrainians continue to kick the Russians teeth down their throats.

You forgot the ass on a plate

In other news/rumours/propaganda :

Ukraine are rotating troops/retreating/ regrouping in Bakmut. (take your pick).


Angela Merkel has done an interview with Die Zeit, where she reveal that the Minsk Accord was an attempt to buy more time for the ukranians.

She talks too much

[sabang]

Maybe snubski should be handed a plate on an ass.

[sabang]

I didn’t think the blame game would come this fast — And the NY Times had the most embarrassing podcast on the subject



Most of my recent pieces have been leaning towards media analysis. I find it fascinating how the wording, framing, and subtle inferences in headlines completely shape Americans’ and Europeans’ perspectives on any subject and then the world at large. I see it firsthand all the time.

The war in Ukraine has put all of that into propaganda overdrive. I wrote an article about how the narratives were shifting from ‘gung-ho hurrah hurrah the good guys are winning, let’s send them bigger guns’ to preparing the ‘Western’ public for the inevitable settlement and loss of territory.

Things that were obvious and true in February were not allowed to be uttered in the mainstream until late May or June.

At the beginning of the invasion, I wrote multiple pieces on a negotiated settlement and my curation rate tanked, but now my articles about peace are getting picked up once again — could be a coincidence, but I find it very strange.

As the invaders took control of some twenty percent of the country and slowly chipped away town after town, the ‘Western’ media had to reluctantly report some truths. The words ‘negotiated settlement’ were finally put in the headlines.

Everyone from Henry Kissinger to the NATO chief has started talking about a diplomatic resolution. They’re even reporting that Pope Francis said the war was ‘perhaps somehow provoked’ and that NATO was ‘barking at the gates of Russia.’

All three men could have said the same things back in March, but they would have been condemned, shouted down, and calls for their resignations would be flying everywhere — not that the 99-year-old Kissinger is still in office, thank God.

Unfortunately, nothing stops delusional Medium writers from continuing the cause in the face of mountains of evidence and long after mainstream media has come to terms with reality. I hate to call people out and create drama on this platform, but there are certain writers, one in particular, who’s written multiple pieces detailing the ‘next game-changing weapon’ and constantly repeats how the invading army ‘is on the brink of collapse’ and how Ukraine ‘must never give up territory.’ It’s been absolutely delusional.

I see the headlines, scan the pieces, see how many thousands of freaking claps and cheerleading comments there are, roll my eyes, debate leaving a comment, but then bail, wondering if this guy is ever going to retract these articles that have no basis in reality or if he’ll make excuses as to why they aged so poorly.
It’s very very very easy to passionately parrot mainstream narratives, get a ton of attention, and fail upwards — or maybe I’m the one way off base and will need to explain myself.

In either case, the mainstream press has finally started to give ‘Western’ minds a more realistic picture of the war and prepare them for the ugly, unfair, and heartbreaking resolution that’ll probably come in a month or a year or five.

But they need to give readers a reason why it went south.

Why, after months of non-stop propagandistic spin on everything, has the war not turned out the way pundits and analysts were implying?

Why are the sanctions not working? How come most of the world is still doing business with Moscow?

How, after reporting on Ukrainian win after Ukrainian win after Ukrainian win, have the invaders taken control of twenty percent of the country?

The press needs to give an answer. And so the articles blaming Ukraine are starting to be disseminated.

Unfortunately, nothing stops delusional Medium writers from continuing the cause in the face of mountains of evidence and long after mainstream media has come to terms with reality.

The shift from purely pro-war propaganda to ‘this might not be going well’ to ‘they should probably negotiate’ to the now ‘Ukraine messed it up’ has been slow and steady. The latest iteration kicked off with Biden’s speech last Friday.

Speaking to a fundraising reception in LA, he said “I know a lot of people thought I was exaggerating, But I knew we had data to sustain (the assessment). (Russian President Vladimir Putin) was gonna go into the border. And there was no doubt, and Volodymyr Zelensky didn’t want to hear it, nor did a lot of people. I understand why they didn’t want to hear it, but he went in.”

The headlines whipped around the globe: ‘Biden Says Zelensky ‘Didn’t Want to Hear It.’ Articles from outlets like The Guardian create the impression that America and NATO did what they could but those stubborn Ukrainians wouldn’t listen and bear the brunt of the blame.

In that Guardian piece, they even quoted a British general who said Europe and America have no strategy and they ‘ought to be considering if there was an opportunity to “persuade a weakened Russia to align with the west” rather than be drawn into China’s influence.’

That’s a bananas statement on so many levels. ‘It turns out we couldn’t cripple Moscow with sanctions so maybe we should put aside the fact they invaded their neighbor, completely shift course, and get them on our team to defeat their ally in Beijing.’ It is nice to see the mask fully come off in a mainstream outlet, but I keep imagining the reaction if all of these statements were made back in early March.

The shift from purely pro-war propaganda to ‘this might not be going well’ to ‘they should probably negotiate’ to the now ‘Ukraine messed it up’ has been slow and steady.

Then there was this unbelievable podcast episode from The Daily, which is, unfortunately, one of the most-listened-to podcasts in the world.

The title and episode description are a sight to behold: The Incomplete Picture of the War in Ukraine. This summary takes some balls:
In the nearly four months since the Russian invasion of Ukraine, the United States has been giving officials in Kyiv a steady stream of intelligence to aid them in the fight. But what is becoming clear is that the Ukrainians are not returning the favor.

The US is giving ‘a steady stream of intelligence,’ and the Ukrainians are ‘not returning the favor?’ Jesus.

The freaking New York Times has been consistently spreading dubious reports on the war, uncritically repeating Ukrainian military statements, and routinely spreading baseless CIA press releases. Now they’re blaming Ukraine for the faulty information?

I wish I could post the whole twenty-minute transcript, but it doesn’t exist so I tried to play stenographer for some of this ridiculousness and really wanted to write every word.

National security reporter Julian Barnes, who covers US intelligence agencies for the paper, which means he repeats anything the CIA tells him to, contributed some ‘insights’ into this ‘unusual war’ while gently placing the blame on Kyiv for withholding information. Barnes claims he was ‘nervous’ that he ‘was getting an incomplete picture.’ He says we were only receiving information about improbable and impressive Ukrainian victories and stories of a Russian ‘military that didn’t know how to fight.’

In some ways, we hear a lot more about Ukrainian successes and Russian failures than we do the opposite. — J.B.

Yeah, Julian, that’s called war propaganda. Anyone with a semi-impartial view could see that the ‘Western’ media was giving a highly distorted narrative of the invasion, the NY Times included. That’s not to say there weren’t really impressive victories by the defenders or huge losses and strategic blunders by the invaders, but it was so freaking obvious the coverage was biased, slanted, and one-sided.

In the podcast, they talk about how much intel the US is sharing on command posts, movements, and targets and then claim that somehow magically American intelligence agencies have no idea what the Ukrainian defense forces are thinking or doing. Pretending US intelligence isn’t aware, involved, or informed throughout is ridiculous.

I lean towards the Georges Malbrunot perspective, the French journalist who went to Ukraine and came back saying the Americans are ‘in charge’ of the war. Sure, Ukraine is probably making some moves without Pentagon approval or knowledge, but I have a hard time believing they’re out of the loop.

After all, even


on MSNBC says this is America’s proxy war. If it’s a proxy war, US intelligence is balls deep in every aspect.

…they blame Ukraine for the failures, like the whole thing wasn’t a military-industrial complex money-laundering operation that was bound to be a catastrophe anyways.

The episode gets worse as The Daily host Sabrina Tavernise went on to say she, “remembers that same pattern when I was in Ukraine all those weeks. That we would get a press release from the Russian Ministry of Defense, and we would look at it and say obviously that’s not right…but then we get a press release from the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense and we’d think, hold on a second, that’s not right either.”

Hey Sabrina, if you’re reporting in Ukraine and don’t think the information is accurate, how about you freaking report that in real-time and not months later on a podcast? Did she tweet or write from Lviv about how we’re not getting an accurate picture of the war? Maybe but I seemed to have missed it.

The whole episode had me stopping rewinding, furrowing my brow, shouting to myself as I walked down Prague streets, and shaking my head in crazed frustration.
They big up the ‘amazing’ and ‘sheer amount of money,’ generous military aid, and then actually acknowledge that many of the weapons can’t even be used by the Ukrainian military while at the same time blaming them for not ‘returning the favor’ with accurate information.

Again, I could have transcribed the whole freaking thing because I was aghast after every sentence. Here’s a chunk of a few minutes of back and forth:

Is this normal? Is it normal that an ally would withhold information like this?… The US is not seeing the full picture…and the implications are massive for the United States…it matters because of all of that aid, all of that military assistance. We don’t know how much Ukraine can absorb, how quickly they can absorb it, where they need it most, or what will be the most effective help at the current time…we’re giving them equipment they don’t know how to use. We talked about this pair of high-tech binoculars, right? That comes with English language manuals that they have to use Google Translate to try and figure out how to do. The problem could only get worse with the rocket artillery that President Biden has promised. When that arrives at the front line that could very well be a game-changer, but are they going to know how to use it?

These two work for one of the most influential news outlets in the world. If they were hesitant or thinking these things, why wouldn’t they write about it BEFORE the US pledged fifty-four freaking billion dollars in aid? From day one, everything they said in this episode was incredibly obvious to teenage Twitch streamers, pothead comedians in their garages, and my dumbass over here in Central Europe.

How do these two journalists justify coming to these very obvious conclusions so late or not reporting if they felt this way before? Tavernise goes on to say:

When it comes to the money that the US is giving, I would imagine, if I’m the US, I would want to know where that money was going. I mean, I would want some accountability for it… And there’s another problem here, right, which is that if the Ukrainians don’t tell the US what they’re about to do, then the US does not have a clear picture of the war and where the war is going.

Again, where was this coverage when only a tiny handful of right-wing-loony lawmakers opposed the $40 billion aid package or when libertarian-doosh-but-sometimes-has-morals Rand Paul was asking for oversight of that money?

Maybe I missed it — I don’t follow either journalist on Twitter — but the articles before the bill passed from the NY Times about the need for discretionary oversight of such a sum of money seemed to have escaped me.

And again, they blame Ukraine for the failures, like the whole thing wasn’t a military-industrial complex money-laundering operation that was bound to be a catastrophe anyways. Nope. For the NY Times, this is all because Kyiv is not sharing accurate information. Julian Barnes has a direct line to the CIA but is pretending he’s just scanning Bloomberg headlines like the rest of us and had no idea the war wasn’t going the way CNN and the team said it was.

It’s all chalked up to a lack of information from Ukraine.

Barnes then had this gem: “Nobody likes to put good money after bad and it becomes harder to make another massive package of aid if the first one wasn’t effective.”
I have to assume they’re both educated enough to know the answer to all of these conundrums and are speaking down to the isolated upper-middle-class audience that consumes this rubbish.

America loves to put good money after bad, and Congress has all the patience in the world for military adventures. The American people have no say so they don’t matter, and Congress is largely funded by military contractors, so they’re more than down to continue writing fat checks to Raytheon and Halliburton that the taxpayers will be responsible for.

‘The West’ needs an excuse, and so Biden threw Zelensky under the bus saying he ‘didn’t want to hear the warnings.’

The good money after bad is not a problem, but it is becoming harder to hide the fact that ‘the West’ is losing and that there’s no strategy. On the ground, Ukrainians are battling hard, but they were never going to match the might of Moscow. The sanctions are swinging back and smashing Europe and America in the face with inflation while the ruble is the strongest performing currency this year.

‘The West’ needs an excuse, and so Biden threw Zelensky under the bus saying he ‘didn’t want to hear the warnings.’ The NY Times is throwing the Ukrainian military under the bus by saying they aren’t ‘returning the favor’ and sharing accurate information.

The media blame game will continue. The narrative around the war will evolve.

It is only a matter of time before the ‘democratic values’ in Ukraine will start to be questioned. The war will slide off of the front pages. Readers will be reminded that Ukraine is one of the most corrupt nations in the world and that Zelensky was implicated in the Pandora Papers.

Having sold tens of billions of dollars of weapons and locked European nations into further weapons contracts, Uncle Sam will wash his hands of this affair, dumping whatever piece of Ukraine is left at the end onto the EU to rebuild and admit into some sort of economic agreement.

It doesn’t matter to Washington DC because it never really mattered. As Obama once said, Ukraine is a core issue for Moscow; for America, it’s not.

The US will leave Europe to squander and shift its focus to the real target: Beijing.

The media will dutifully play along, blame Zelensky, Ukraine, and a weak Europe, and wipe this whole thing from the collective American memory.

The United States of Amnesia will move on, a power-drunk mafia don who won’t realize until it’s too late that he’s turned all the other families and most of his own capos against him, his greed and domineering leading to his inevitable downfall.

https://mitchellglennfrommichigan.me...e-b17cc5a89687


Nice work.

[sabang]

This makes the UK an enemy combatant, under International law:-


Royal Marines were confirmed by one military head to have previously been deployed to Ukraine in 'high-risk covert ops' of a 'hugely sensitive' nature as the war in the besieged country rages on


Royal Marines have taken part in covert operations in Ukraine as Russia's war wages on, a source for the British armed forces has admitted.

Lieutenant General Robert Magowan is the first official to admit to the covert operations that have previously taken place in Ukraine under British leadership.

The former commandant general of the Royal Marines made it clear these "discreet operations" were of a "hugely sensitive environment" and that the missions carried "a high level of political and military risk".

It would appear 350 marines - part of the 45 Commando unit - were sent to escort diplomats and Government workers from the British embassy.

Official publications showed commandos were responsible for evacuating the British Embassy at the start of this year as well as a push to protect the embassy re-established in April.

Although the Ministry of Defence had acknowledged the British military presence earlier in the year, Lt. Gen. Magowan's comments are the first to be made on so-called "special operations".

Writing in the official Royal Marines publication, Globe and Laurel, Magowan wrote of a "hugely sensitive environment" from which a group of commandos engaged with.

He wrote: "In January this year, 45 Commando Group deployed at short notice - from the depths of a dark, north Norwegian winter, to evacuate the British embassy in Kyiv to Poland. The go-to 999 international emergency force, if you will."

Lt. Gen. Magowan continued: "Then in April, they returned into the country to re-establish the diplomatic mission, providing protection to critical personnel.

"During both phases, the commandos supported other discreet operations in a hugely sensitive environment and with a high level of political and military risk."

The former Royal Marines commandant general also praised the troops for their training of "hundreds" of Ukrainian military personnel, The Times reported.

He added: "Alongside wider defence, we have been heavily involved in training hundreds of Ukrainian military personnel throughout this summer. We are also planning to train Ukraine marines."

Royal Marines deployed to Ukraine for 'high-risk covert ops' against Russia - Daily Star

Of course, it was Brit special operatives that carried out the Nordstream pipeline bombing, on behalf of their masters.

[pickel]

It would appear 350 marines - part of the 45 Commando unit - were sent to escort diplomats and Government workers from the British embassy.

Official publications showed commandos were responsible for evacuating the British Embassy at the start of this year as well as a push to protect the embassy re-established in April.

Not exactly "high risk covert ops". And what do you find odd about a nation's troops protecting its embassy? It's quite common.

[sabang]

Not exactly- but do you think babysitting diplomatic staff were the "high risk, covert ops" being referred to? I don't think so.

[pickel]

Not exactly- but do you think babysitting diplomatic staff were the "high risk, covert ops" being referred to? I don't think so.

So you use a story sprinkled with bullshit and sensationalism to justify your assumption? Sad.

[sabang]

So when a LTGEN refers to "high risk, covert ops" of a "hugely sensitive" nature, you reckon he is referring to babysitting Embassy staff? Beyond sad. But I appreciate you were never a commando.

[bsnub]

So when a LTGEN refers to "high risk, covert ops" of a "hugely sensitive" nature, you reckon he is referring to babysitting Embassy staff?

So what do you think they were doing, Dippy? Do elaborate.

[Norton]

So what do you think they were doing, Dippy? Do elaborate.

Of course, it was Brit special operatives that carried out the Nordstream pipeline bombing, on behalf of their masters.

Objection your honor. Asked and answered.

[bsnub]

Objection your honor. Asked and answered.

Oh, he didn't.