Thread: Romanization of Falong/Farang/Farung

One thing that should be remembered......

When King Rama V came up with a system of transliteration he did not write it from the point of helping a Westerner to pronounce Thai words.

He did it to help a person who understood the different origins of the letters of the Thai alphabet to understand which of the two was being used in the Thai spelling.

A brief example is the tramsliteration of the word Suwarnabhumi and the unused vowel at the end. The vowel at the end of it helps the knowledgable person (of which I do not claim to be one) identify the actual consonants used in part of the word. Same with Shinawatra and many others.

The system is far more complicated that just phonetically spelling words to aid a Westerner.

When RickThai spells it a way that means something to him and his ears, what actual harm is he doing?

Originally Posted by charleyboy

I'm not picking on anybody. When I first came to live here, I decided to learn Thai because I couldn't get my head around the romanisation of the language.

I've added a word to my post so you don't think that I am referring to you when I say about people hounding RickThai.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

When RickThai spells it a way that means something to him and his ears, what actual harm is he doing?

Because, as you note in your previous posts, the system IS a mess. Pointlessly adding to that just seems inane.

Fair enough although I didn't say it was a mess, I just said what it was. To me it generally seems logical when you read about why and how it was developed.

Just be aware......I'll be hot on your tails from now on........55555... you could say I'll be a pedantic bastard.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Fair enough although I didn't say it was a mess, I just said what it was. To me it generally seems logical when you read about why and how it was developed.

Just be aware......I'll be hot on your tails from now on........55555... you could say I'll be a pedantic bastard.

But it IS a mess. Go on any trip of any distance, and you will see the same city spelled multiple ways. There are a dozen (if not more) ways of spelling my full work address - all used by different people.


For you being on my tail - no problem, you are more than welcome to pull me up if I ever use the term "falong".

[quote=RickThai;2458227]I always like to use “falong” as the English transliteration for the Thai word (slang) commonly used to refer to a Western foreigner.

Is this a word you use frequently? Not being Thai, it's a word I don't recall using in the six years I lived there.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

people picking on RickThai may just have had an additional agenda?

Hmm so Bobcock has an agenda against nidhogg then? Interesting.

[quote=Davis Knowlton;2458756]

Originally Posted by RickThai

I always like to use “falong” as the English transliteration for the Thai word (slang) commonly used to refer to a Western foreigner.

Is this a word you use frequently? Not being Thai, it's a word I don't recall using in the six years I lived there.

'Falong'?

Never heard that word before.

Lazy people tend to say 'falang' instead of the correct 'farang' as pronouncing the 'R' is difficult for them. The word is spelled with a roo rua vs a lo ling.

Sorta like some in the States pronounce Florida "Florider"

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Rightly or wrongly that is the system in place. You can spend hours picking it apart, people picking on RickThai may just have had an additional agenda?

Nobodies been picking on him. Some people simply said he was wrong, and he is.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

When King Rama V came up with a system of transliteration he did not write it from the point of helping a Westerner to pronounce Thai words.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

The system is far more complicated that just phonetically spelling words to aid a Westerner.

But that's what we use it for today is it not? I don't really see the importance of this constant reference to King Rama V and the system he devised. We use it to communicate what Thai words we are referring to as best we can. If Rick wrote Falong down for a first time traveller to Thailand, and told him that's how to say it, the traveller would be running around Thailand saying a word that not one single person understood. Where's the point in that?

Originally Posted by Bobcock

When RickThai spells it a way that means something to him and his ears, what actual harm is he doing?

No harm, unless as I just mentioned, he's trying to help somebody else understand how the word is spoken, but nobody gets hurt if that's what you mean. He is however, completely wrong as this thread proves somewhat conclusively, and no amount of saying other people have low self esteem, or are in need of inflating their egos will change that.

Originally Posted by Aberlour

We use it to communicate what Thai words we are referring to as best we can.

Are you referring to here on Teak Door?

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

I remember the first time I landed at swampy I was rather concerned to hear the pilot say we were landing at Soowannapoom. Where the hell is that, I thought?

Originally Posted by Aberlour

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

I suppose that communication is esentially an "agreement". We agree that these sounds, characters or whatever mean certain things.

If everyone unilaterally decided to use their own system it would end in crambledosh.

(Funnily enough, crambledosh is pronounced exactly like "chaos").

Originally Posted by Aberlour

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

Obviously not between us.....

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

Originally Posted by nidhogg

If everyone unilaterally decided to use their own system it would end in crambledosh.

(Funnily enough, crambledosh is pronounced exactly like "chaos").

Excellent.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Originally Posted by Aberlour

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

Obviously not between us.....

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

There are times it's a must. What if someone asks what it is someone posted in the dinner thread, and how to order it. What good would it do if you told them in such a way that when they tried to order it, nobody knew what they were talking about?

Two real life examples. If my wife wants me to buy her something while I'm out, and I don't want to just hand the person a piece of paper with it written in Thai as I once would have done, but practice my Thai by ordering it myself. I would write it on a piece if paper so I could remind myself of how to say it just before I order. I need to read it exactly as it sounds.

Recently I had brief chat with someone via PM about the word pee-set, as in special sized portion. I needed to communicate with him the best I could so that when he tried to use it himself, he was understood. What would have happened if I had decided to spell it pee-sot just because I wanted to be different?

Nobody is picking on Rick, and nobody really cares how he spells it. He is, and will remain to be wrong though, everytime he writes the word Falong, because that simply isn't how the word sounds.

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Originally Posted by Aberlour

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

Obviously not between us.....

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

I do that from time to time to posters whom I know have a 'handle' on the language (Thai) - like Tham Jai Khun.

Also, the German word Schandenfreude is a jolly good one to interject in the appropriate discussion as it does not have a direct English equivalent.

Good example.... kreng jai is another.....

But when someone writes.... "so I said to my tilac we need to go kin khao".... I cringe.

Originally Posted by Aberlour

There are times it's a must. What if someone asks what it is someone posted in the dinner thread, and how to order it. What good would it do if you told them in such a way that when they tried to order it, nobody knew what they were talking about?

If that is the example you can come up with you obviously don't understand the words "when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose"

Originally Posted by nidhogg

If everyone unilaterally decided to use their own system it would end in crambledosh.

or even a salmagundi ?

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

yup.

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Originally Posted by Boon Mee

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Originally Posted by Aberlour

^Anytime we are trying to communicate something by the written word, in an unofficial capacity. I'm sure there times when two people who both know king Rama's official method, may use that strictly, but how often is that likely to be.

Obviously not between us.....

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

I do that from time to time to posters whom I know have a 'handle' on the language (Thai) - like Tham Jai Khun.

Also, the German word Schandenfreude is a jolly good one to interject in the appropriate discussion as it does not have a direct English equivalent.

Good example.... kreng jai is another.....

But when someone writes.... "so I said to my tilac we need to go kin khao".... I cringe.

Me too.

The other thing that makes me cringe as well is hearing a Farang speaking 'baby-talk' to pooying Thai. Like if the guy can't speak normal English he resorts to some sort of communication that makes him look stupid and the gal's IQ isn't considered.

Exactly... don't get me started on baby talk

Originally Posted by kingwilly

Originally Posted by nidhogg

If everyone unilaterally decided to use their own system it would end in crambledosh.

or even a salmagundi ?

That would be prandelish.

Originally Posted by kingwilly

Originally Posted by Bobcock

Personally I don't know why people don't just speak English together..... always makes me cringe when people insert a Thai word into a sentence when typing on a forum when it has no purpose than to show they know the word.

yup.

Are we allowed any? I would probably use "soi" out of habit rather than "side street"......

Originally Posted by nidhogg

Are we allowed any? I would probably use "soi" out of habit rather than "side street"......

fair call.

Originally Posted by nidhogg

prandelish

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Originally Posted by nidhogg

Are we allowed any? I would probably use "soi" out of habit rather than "side street"......

indeed....excepotions that always prove the rule....My Rule.