Thread: Malaysian Airliner shot down over Ukraine

Ukrainian Security Official Says Ukraine Shot Down MH-17

Paul Craig Roberts

298 Passengers and crew were murdered by Ukraine in order to create a propaganda attack on Russia. The filth that comprise the Western media and governments hid the truth for the sake of Washington’s anti-Russian propaganda.

The security official says that his suspicions were aroused by “the amazingly prompt reaction of the Ukrainian leadership,” which “indicated prior knowledge of the affair.” Perhaps readers will remember that at the time I pointed out that the event was clearly staged as the same propagandistic accusation against Russia appeared everywhere instantly long before any investigation. Indeed, the investigation was stillborn as it could not be concocted to indicate Russia’s guilt.

Don’t be surprised. Western governments and media only lie. Never do they tell the truth. Remember: Russiagate. Weapons of mass destruction. Iranian nukes. Assad’s use of chemical weapons. Gulf of Tonkin. 9/11. Russian invasion of Ukraine. JFK assassination. MLK assassination. Bobby Kennedy assassination. Skripal poisoning. Maduro starving his own people. An endless list of lies. The entirety of the West is nothing but a lie factory.

https://www.fort-russ.com/2019/03/br...de-in-donbass/

https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/201...ot-down-mh-17/

MH17 SURVIVORS SHOCKED BY DUTCH NATIONALIST’S CRASH CONSPIRACY THEORIES
May 24, 2019

The relatives of the victims killed in the MH17 disaster were shocked by statements made by FvD leader Thierry Baudet in his debate with VVD leader Mark Rutte on Wednesday. Baudet questioned the independence of the Joint Investigation Team's investigation into the downing of the plane. He also said that Ukraine may be behind the attack.

"I have my doubts about the investigation by the JIT. Ukraine is also one of the possible perpetrators of this attack." Baudet said. Almost every time the JIT published some of its findings, Russia quickly responded by questioning the independence of the investigation and pointing the finger to Ukraine. According to Baudet, it is up to the judge to decide who was responsible for the MH17 disaster, and not to politicians to anticipate a verdict and blame Russia.

These statements shocked Stichting Vliegramp MH17, the foundation set up to support the relatives of the MH17 victims. "To be honest, I thought they were scandalous. Mr. Baudet is a representative of the people and apparently excludes a group of many thousands of relatives", Piet Ploeg of the foundation said to RTL Nieuws. "He certainly has not supported us with his story. He said things that are incorrect, without any knowledge about the things he is saying. And what he has done with his comments about the Joint Investigation Team is that he in fact discredited the independence of the JIT."

"We also know that the results presented so far by the JIT enjoy worldwide support. What Mr. Baudet does is soiling his own nest. He makes the Netherlands unbelievable and that does not suit him a s chairman of a large party", Ploeg said.

Flight MH17 was shot down over eastern Ukraine on July 17th, 2014. All 298 people on board, including 196 Dutch, were killed. Investigation by the Dutch Safety Board and the Joint Investigation Team (JIT) so far revealed that the Malaysian Airlines flight was shot down by a BUK missile system from the 53rd Anti-aircraft Brigade of the Russian Armed Forces, fired from a field in Ukraine that was under the control of pro-Russian separatists at the time.

The JIT tracked a convoy of nearly 50 military vehicles, including the BUK that shot down MH17, from a 53rd Brigade parking area in Kursk to the border of Ukraine between June 23rd and 25th, 2014 - a few weeks before MH17 was shot down. Australia and the Netherlands officially held Russia accountable for its role in the MH17 disaster - providing the missile that shot down the plane - in May last year.

In September Russia held a press conference in which the country said that the BUK missile was indeed made in Russia, but was in Ukrainian hands at the time of the disaster. Russia has been pointing the finger to Ukraine since the disaster happened. In October the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that it is willing to discuss MH17 liability with the Netherlands, "partly with the goal of looking professionally at the responsibility of Ukraine". The first meetings happened in March.

https://nltimes.nl/2019/05/24/mh17-s...iracy-theories

Thierry Henri Philippe Baudet (born 28 January 1983) is a Dutch politician. He is the founder and the current political leader of the right wing political party Forum for Democracy (FvD, Dutch: Forum voor Democratie). He has been a member of the House of Representatives since 23 March 2017.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Netherlands took note of Malaysian PM’s statement on MH17 crash, media report

I think they "took note" because the ole 94 year old geezer hasn't accomplished anything yet in his country and everyone is surpised that he can still talk.

Originally Posted by Klondyke

Flight MH17 was shot down over eastern Ukraine on July 17th, 2014.....
In September Russia held a press conference in which the country said that the BUK missile was indeed made in Russia,

It took them 5 years to find out that the missile was indeed made in Russia

It will take them another 100 years to find out "Indeed Putin was a shithead".

Originally Posted by OhOh

lack of proof of any entry into Ukraine, of the Russian forces

maybe to you - tell us a story about crimea

Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

It took them 5 years to find out that the missile was indeed made in Russia

Unlike to others, it took just 5 minutes them to know who did it... (same as May about Skripals)

Originally Posted by Klondyke

(same as May about Skripals)

To be fair she only suggested it was "highly likely", which unfortunately to some regimes these days is regarded as factual proof.

Originally Posted by OhOh

It has a long history, which century/decade did you have in mind?

you said russian forces which means after the breakup of the USSR

Originally Posted by OhOh

Please tell your version of factual truth.

MH17 was obviously shot down by the same fcukers using the BUK missile system to shoot down other Ukrainian air force jets - and they thought it was an AN-26

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rainian_crisis

Originally Posted by baldrick

you said russian forces which means after the breakup of the USSR

Or prior to it's creation.

Originally Posted by baldrick

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rainian_crisis

My apologies if wiki has it on one of it's pages then we must believe it.

Originally Posted by Klondyke

Unlike to others, it took just 5 minutes them to know who did it... (same as May about Skripals)

Of course those Russian ex agents just wanted to see a cathedral while they had a spare day. Makes perfect sense to me. Coincidentally its only anti Putin journalists or opposition politicians that get murdered.

Originally Posted by OhOh

My apologies if wiki has it on one of it's pages then we must believe it

it is a list of ukrainian aircraft that have been shot down - you may believe that it is strategically advantageous to go around shooting down your own aircraft , that is up to you

Originally Posted by Hugh Cow

Coincidentally its only anti Putin journalists or opposition politicians that get murdered.

Ever heard (read) something like (please no name here) "...body count"? All of those bodies "anti Putin" journalists?

(didn't know that Kashoggi was anti-Putin...)

And what about these lists:
https://cpj.org/data/killed/?status=...&group_by=year

https://rsf.org/en/journalists-killed

https://www.theguardian.com/media/20...-panama-papers

Originally Posted by baldrick

you said russian forces which means after the breakup of the USSR

MH17 was obviously shot down by the same fcukers using the BUK missile system to shoot down other Ukrainian air force jets - and they thought it was an AN-26

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rainian_crisis

There is no point presenting facts to OhOh, he will only ever peddle the Putin or Winnie the Pooh line, the snivelling sycophant.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

There is no point presenting facts

That aircraft were shot down prior to MH17 appears to be factual.

Have you factual evidence, you can produce, that Russian military forces under the control and direction of the Russian government did the dastardly act for these prior successfully completed attacks?

Originally Posted by OhOh

Have you factual evidence, you can produce, that Russian military forces under the control and direction of the Russian government did the dastardly act for these prior successfully completed attacks?

who has said that ? are you moving goalposts ?

the seperatists are being supported by the russian military or their preferred private contractor - the wagner group

they were given the BUK system which they used to shoot down several aircraft and ultimately the airliner

if you do not believe that happened - that is up to you

it is the highest on the list of probablilties , so likely is the most probable explanation of events

Originally Posted by baldrick

who has said that ? are you moving goalposts ?

the seperatists are being supported by the russian military or their preferred private contractor - the wagner group

they were given the BUK system which they used to shoot down several aircraft and ultimately the airliner

if you do not believe that happened - that is up to you

it is the highest on the list of probablilties , so likely is the most probable explanation of events

Just remember that we had lots of silly HoHo fairy tales before the Buk was proven.

Ukrainian fighters, bombs on board, etc. etc.

He'll spout any old bollocks to support the Putin line.

Originally Posted by OhOh

That aircraft were shot down prior to MH17 appears to be factual.

Have you factual evidence, you can produce, that Russian military forces under the control and direction of the Russian government did the dastardly act for these prior successfully completed attacks?

Russia is a dictatorship and uses a weapon called censors.
Your BS with factual evidence can not be applied to this country.
Maybe one day you will figure it out.

In the meantime you have the "Freedom" to inform yourself which most russian don't. That's the factual evidence my son.

^
"Freedom"?

To that is what I posted yesterday what John Swinton - a prominent journalist, also in the New York Times - said on a press banquet in 1883:


There is no such a thing in America as an independent press, unless it is out in country towns. You are all slaves. You know it, and I know it. There is not one of you who dares to express an honest opinion. If you expressed it, you would know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid $150 for keeping honest opinions out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for doing similar things. If I should allow honest opinions to be printed in one issue of my paper, I would be like Othello before twenty-four hours: my occupation would be gone. The man who would be so foolish as to write honest opinions would be out on the street hunting for another job. The business of a New York journalist is to distort the truth, to lie outright, to pervert, to villify, to fawn at the feet of Mammon, and to sell his country and his race for his daily bread, or for what is about the same — his salary. You know this, and I know it; and what foolery to be toasting an "Independent Press"! We are the tools and vassals of rich men behind the scenes. We are jumping-jacks. They pull the string and we dance. Our time, our talents, our lives, our possibilities, are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes.

Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

Russia is a dictatorship and uses a weapon called censors.
Your BS with factual evidence can not be applied to this country.
Maybe one day you will figure it out.

In the meantime you have the "Freedom" to inform yourself which most russian don't. That's the factual evidence my son.

You also have the freedom to inform other people without being fed a glowing cup of tea.

Originally Posted by baldrick

they were given the BUK system

Are you suggesting the Russians supplied BUK systems and others AA systems? No other sources are possible, none of the eastern Ukrainians had the skills, from being in the Ukrainian military prior to the MH17 attack? No Ukrainian arms were located in the eastern area prior to the illgal regime change?

Originally Posted by baldrick

so likely is the most probable explanation of events

But obviously not the only possibility available to answer the MH17 attack question.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Ukrainian fighters, bombs on board, etc. etc.

As the "evidence" has not been publicly tested or even confirmed their, currently, is no conclusive evidence to confirm any cause of the MH17 crash. The old "highly likely" suggestion again.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

He'll spout any old bollocks to support the Putin line.

As opposed to your wiki version of the truth.

Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

Russia is a dictatorship and uses a weapon called censors.

THE LORD won a democratically arrived at position. You may disagree with the election system, but then other, alleged, election systems are questioned.

Many countries censor "free speech", aint you noticed

Originally Posted by HermantheGerman

That's the factual evidence my son.

My, you must be very old. Your "factual evidence" in unproven and tragically, along with a plane full of innocent passengers, has been shot to pieces.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

without being fed a glowing cup of tea.

Or late one night be bundled into a car, hooded, drugged and wake up with a dozen other naked prisoners, being filmed for the "folks back home" safe and sound in their cardboard box, surrounded by last weeks shit under a bridge.

But I digress from the thread topic.

Originally Posted by OhOh

THE LORD won a democratically arrived at position.

Stop being so fucking silly.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Are you suggesting the Russians supplied BUK systems

of course they did