The Thailand expat forum for Travel, Lifestyle and Fun.

pompeybloke

How arrogant and condescending you are. Know a few chords do ya? Nice weather up there on your higher ground is it? Us laymen are still entitled to an opinion even though it's not as 'enlightened' as yours....Get over yourself!

Marmite the Dog

^ I see you're in cock mode tonight.

Even Jimmy Page is allowed to have the occasional crap concert, and this was one of them. Even you could've played better that night than he did. He was truly awful. But you know better, despite not being there.

chinthee

On my best night, and I'm not bad, I could never approach Jimmy's worst night.

Tell us more about your expertise to analyze guitarists.

chinthee

the gent,

Do you play guitar...? No, I thought not. Guitar players appreciate all great players.

Ry Cooder is a great influence, as is Chuck Berry. What's your point. It's obvious you've never picked up a guitar, or if you did, found it too intimidating or difficult to continue, or found the cost prohibitive.

peterpan

Cool it lads, excellent thread, brings back memories and inspiration, don't enure it demise into MKP.

chinthee

There remains, of course, the huge debate between Strat players and Les Paul players. I have both, but prefer the Strat (it's tuned and has pickup changes to Stevie Ray specs). My favourite players played both, and there is a definite difference in sound and feel between the two.

The SG is of course a different animal, and others, such as VOX were played by the Kinks and other great bands.

So many choices, so much debate and so much personal preference. Today, Ibanez and others make great copies of these classics too.

And, of course, today the ultimate guitar is the PRS. Joe Santana plays one, and they are a thing of beauty. In fact, they are the most beautiful electric guitar ever produced. However, I find hard cores still either prefer a Strat or Les Paul.

Loy Toy

Agree with PP wholeheartedly.

I think I heard that the designer/ founder of Fender or Gibson Guitars said that Dave Gilmour's (Pink Floyd) playing style was perfect for his guitar set up.

Can't remember which guitar and was he correct in his assessment?

For you guitar experts!

Camel Toe

I play a Chinese SG and a Chinese Strat. Love them both. Being able to play means a whole lot more than what guitar you play. The guys in the band always making fun of my Chinese shit. One guy is from a rich family, father a judge. He plays the SRV Strat. It cost about as much as a house. He studied music in school. He can pick up cord changes to all the Endorphin and T-Bone stuff far faster than a Bluesman ever could, but when it comes to a solo he's just like the recording and always will be. And he takes the piss out of me for playing knock-off guitars.

One thing I hate about playing in a Thai band is introducing a new tune. They'll ask for a CD. Without a CD they're lost. You can't just tell them, look, it goes like this... No imagination at all.

chinthee

^Yeah, the Mexican Strat is better than the Chinese strat. Of course, a US-made is the best, but very expensive. You're right, talent always wins out over gear.

chinthee

^I've been playing for 40 years. I'm nothing special relatively speaking. How 'bout you, pompeybloke?

Milkman

Oh, dear......

zedhex

re. the Strat vs. Gibson debate. I spent many years playing Telecasters, then Strats, and then I finally managed to purchase a decent Les Paul. The different in workmanship is significant. To put it mildly, Fenders were always built to a much cheaper standard than Gibsons. In the end it all comes down to taste, but after years of bouncing between the ringing treble of a Fender and the ballsier fuller tone of a Gibson, I finally found a solution - Paul Reed Smith. Kind of half way between the two, gorgeous tone and playability, but pricey as hell.

re. Jimmy Page on a bad night? I was once in a TV studio in London where Jimmy was playing. He must have been having a very bad night, because my little cousin has played better than that. Even the best have bad nights - has anyone seen that horrible "Claption Shreds" video on You Tube? It's Clapton playing the most God-awful row.

chinthee

^Yes, I will agree that the workmanship of a Gibson Les Paul exceeds that of the Fender. And, I've also played the PRS, which is the most incredible guitar ever made. In the end, I would still take my SRV strat. It's all about soul.

Marmite the Dog

Gibson for me. Used to play a lovely LP Sunburst.

Camel Toe

Does workmanship sound good?

Guitars for me aren't trophies, they're tools. The Strat is the most copied model guitar in the world. Did you ever stop to think of Leo's genius? What improvements has a Stat gotten in these past 55 years? Fixed tremolo? He got it right the first time. The Les Paul didn't sell that well in the early years, that's why the SG LP was designed. Then there was a need for them again .. strange.

My favorite guitar of all times was the LP double cutaway standard with P-90s. Screamin fuckers they are. Second to that is the Goldtop with P-90s. Then a C-neck Strat, then a Tele. SGs are neck-heavy.

Playing the Gibson I always find times when I miss the Strat, and vice verse. The problem for me is the scale changing so quickly. I need a few minutes to re-coop myself to a new feel. Seems no problem for Gary Moore tho.

zedhex

To me the difference in feel is mainly the scale length. Fenders 25" 1/2 again Gibson 24" 3/4 (although there is some variation between models). This is one reason I like the PRS's 25". It's has a very similar Gibsonesque feel to the hands, but with a brighter tone. I generally find Fenders better for rythm work, but for solos they just sound too thin to me. I think workmanship does translate to better tone - thats why some of those older classic guitars sound so good: they were just made better and from better quality woods. Modern guitars have waaay better electronics but the quality of the wood just doesn't seem to be there.

Camel Toe

Most Fenders:

Alder is light in weight with soft tight pores like Basswood. But there is a large swirling grain pattern to it with harder rings and sections. So imagine a Basswood type texture but with harder rings peppered throughout. That adds to the stiffness, and the complexity of the tones. It retains more of the highs that Basswood softens, but also gives some room to the lows. You have a broader spectrum of tones, which leads to the perception of a little less mids than Basswood.
Production notes: Not much difference between factories, production.

Swamp Ash:
Not to be confused with Northern “Hard Ash” Swamp Ash has huge, open pores with hard and soft layers within each ring of the tree. So you basically have a very rigid skeleton with open and softer pores throughout. It is very resonant across the whole frequency spectrum. It has clear bell-like highs, pronounced mids, and strong lows. It has some random combing away of mid frequencies, which will vary the sound per guitar more than Alder or Basswood. Two Ash bodies are more likely to sound more different from one another, whereas Basswood and Alder are more consistent. A heavier piece, or a piece from higher up on the tree will be more dead and lifeless. More dull sounding, because the wood is harder and more uniformly dense. So the sweetness of the soft open pores is gone, and left is the compressed sound of a rigid, non-responsive wood, without all the brightness and sustain of a harder wood or the openness of a softer wood.

Most Gibsons:

Mahogany:
Open grained with large pores, Mahogany has a more uniform grain pattern and density than Swamp Ash. Its density is constant within the ring and from one ring to the next. So it’s rigidity is inherent in its composition, not in a “skeleton” with soft sections in between. It’s constant density compresses the mids a little, and this can be considered a thick sound, because it does still produce good lows and low mids. Without the mids popping out, being responsive to dynamics, its more of a “wall of sound” Its not that it isn’t midrangey, because it resonates those guitar frequencies well, but its not as responsive to them as an Alder or Ash. It also combs away more upper midrange frequencies for a more nasal sound. It has a good balance of fundamental and overtones for higher register soloing. High notes are richer and thicker than Alder or Ash.
Production notes: There are many different kinds of Mahogany, and unless it has a sparkle to it like some of the Japanese and US guitars it will have a similar sound from one piece to the next. A nicer piece of mahogany has an iridescence to it usually combined with what looks like wide stripes, almost as if it’s been pieced together by multiple 1” strips. Catalog photos often reveal that the endorser gets a better piece than the production line.

Maple top on Mahogany:
The staple of vintage construction, the Maple adds crispness to the mahogany, but the lows and low mids of mahogany are still as apparent. The Maple combs out some of the upper mids, not because Maple lacks in these areas, but because it is vastly different from mahogany in its handling of the upper midrange. There is fighting going on in that range between the two pieces that results in a canceling out of some of those upper midrange frequencies. That’s part of the “smoothness” associated with the Les Paul & PRS types.

pluto

I like both gibsons and fenders but have a preference for gibson. Fender strats for that bluesy vibe and excellent clean sound....though the single coils do get noisy at times. Les Pauls for that straight up your ass classic rock tone, creamy sound on neck pick up for leads....fat neck and frets closer together but heavy after 2-3 hour session. Sgs' are awesome for their tonal versatility..... its size,weight and design are awesome. Having said that, there is an article by some Guitar luthier in Las Vegas( top guy in the industry), I think he worked for Gibson and Heritage...he also designed the headless Steinberger guitars...Anyhow he said that standards at these two companies have greatly lowered...and all the hardware comes from the same company(Samick)....quality has gone downhill...parts come from all over the world but are just assembled in the USA...You would be better off building your own..

chinthee

I'm amazed and delighted that so many guitar guys have shown up on this thread. I agree about materials and workmanship, and both of my beauties are classic originals from the late 60s.

thegent

Oh good, does this mean you will not be such an arse again?