Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 70
  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107

    help needed for engineer's material specifications

    hi

    as it is, i'm sort of overbudget for the house plan with the part about the engineer's material specs still not done.

    i'm trying to find a cheap or free solution to this problem.

    some posts i read suggest that the builder would not be able to come up with the material specs and advise to hire a structural engineer.

    i would like to ask if the material specs are much more than about the type and quantity of rebar used in the column and beams, and if not, would any members here be able to offer some advice based on their own or professional construction experience

    thanks

  2. #2
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    You can't build till you have plans to submit for planning permission, these plans have the basic specs on them.

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    hi DD

    the land does not have chanote title so it does not require submission for approval

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    You can't build till you have plans to submit for planning permission, these plans have the basic specs on them.

  4. #4
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    I can't imagine many builders taking on a job without plans, it takes about an hour to get a rough guesstimate of materials needed using a rough plan.

  5. #5
    lom
    lom is offline
    Thailand Expat lom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Trapped in an old mans body
    Posts
    8,352
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post
    hi DD

    the land does not have chanote title so it does not require submission for approval

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    You can't build till you have plans to submit for planning permission, these plans have the basic specs on them.
    AFAIK you need to have an architectural and structural plan approved by your Tessaban in order to register the house.
    No post address, no house book, no electricity (except for construction power/meter)
    if the house in not registered.

  6. #6
    Thailand Expat
    Humbert's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Last Online
    Today @ 04:47 PM
    Location
    Bangkok
    Posts
    12,306
    If you proceed with building using only the services of a Thai contractor you open your self up to big problems down the road. You should have a proper set of plans and a BOQ drawn up. If you just verbally give the contractor a vision of what you want and negotiate a price, he will cut corners everyplace he can to squeeze you.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by lom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post
    hi DD

    the land does not have chanote title so it does not require submission for approval

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    You can't build till you have plans to submit for planning permission, these plans have the basic specs on them.
    AFAIK you need to have an architectural and structural plan approved by your Tessaban in order to register the house.
    No post address, no house book, no electricity (except for construction power/meter)
    if the house in not registered.
    hi lom

    yes i have that part sorted out already

    thanks

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    I can't imagine many builders taking on a job without plans, it takes about an hour to get a rough guesstimate of materials needed using a rough plan.
    hi DD

    i will contract with the builder for labour only. after agreement on the labour costs, then i will ask him for calculations on material based on his experience

    possible to be done this way?

  9. #9
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    So you will be at your builders beck and call to order everything and pick up odds and ends that are forgotten everyday, hope you don't expect to have a lot of spare time over that period

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    So you will be at your builders beck and call to order everything and pick up odds and ends that are forgotten everyday, hope you don't expect to have a lot of spare time over that period
    yup i will be onsite 24 hours

    if the builder calculates correctly, then the number of runs can be minimised

    maybe 1st phase is the cement, rebar, pipes to be buried....

  11. #11
    Thailand Expat
    splitlid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Last Online
    21-08-2019 @ 07:52 PM
    Posts
    1,044
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    So you will be at your builders beck and call to order everything and pick up odds and ends that are forgotten everyday, hope you don't expect to have a lot of spare time over that period
    yup i will be onsite 24 hours

    if the builder calculates correctly, then the number of runs can be minimised.
    hahahahahah comedy classic.

    how far is the builders merchants?

  12. #12
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    If only life was that simple, half the time not all your order will come or they will forget something, could just be a kilo of nails or something, someone has to go and get them

  13. #13
    Cacoethes scribendi
    Loombucket's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Last Online
    15-06-2015 @ 08:51 AM
    Location
    Lanchester and Nong Bua Deng
    Posts
    3,310
    Wanna, it is possible to do it that way, but I strongly advise against it. You will be stressed up to the eyeballs in a very short while. If you intend to be there 24/7, you will need a runner. Apart from which, if you know the precise quantities, you can buy in bulk, which is much cheaper than bit by bit.

    Just my four pence worth.

  14. #14
    anonymous ant
    tsicar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    03-10-2016 @ 11:05 PM
    Location
    isaan/south africa
    Posts
    2,895
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    I can't imagine many builders taking on a job without plans, it takes about an hour to get a rough guesstimate of materials needed using a rough plan.
    hi DD

    i will contract with the builder for labour only. after agreement on the labour costs, then i will ask him for calculations on material based on his experience

    possible to be done this way?
    i know that i am going to collect some flak for this, but:

    depending on where in thailand you are building, i would say that this is the way to go, or you could end up paying "farang prices " for materials, paying for more materials than were actually used, etc.
    if you have any construction experience, you can kick their arses when you see them adding too much water to the concrete mix, etc.
    i would strongly advise doing progress payments, too. (pay only after certain predetermined milestones have been reached)
    never pay the buggers in advance for labour and materials, or they will blow the money and you will wait for them to get the next deposit from the next sucker who pays in advance before you get any work done.
    they will probably use enough rebar, but they WILL fuck up the concrete mix.
    better to be there ALL THE TIME

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by splitlid View Post

    how far is the builders merchants?
    20km to the mom and pop's shop

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    If only life was that simple, half the time not all your order will come or they will forget something, could just be a kilo of nails or something, someone has to go and get them
    yes so there has to be a balance. something expensive i'll order 5% more. for nails, i'll buy 1 kg extra

  17. #17
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by Loombucket View Post
    .....You will be stressed up to the eyeballs in a very short while. ....Apart from which, if you know the precise quantities, you can buy in bulk, which is much cheaper than bit by bit.

    Just my four pence worth.
    hi loombucket,

    i am very stressed as it is already so i'm trying to test where my breaking point is

    yes i intend to buy in bulk. so if i have 1 supplier selling both water and drain pipes, i buy it together early on rather than split the purchase till i have to use it

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by tsicar View Post

    i know that i am going to collect some flak for this, but:
    ........
    i would strongly advise doing progress payments, too. (pay only after certain predetermined milestones have been reached)
    hi tsicar

    i think you have hit the nail on the head with this one.

    never make advance payment.

    but it seems to be the norm to pay something before the commencement of foundation works, something like a resettlement fees for the workers to come onsite.

    i dont really fancy doing that, but how to go about not paying when everyone is paying is quite a problem.

  19. #19
    anonymous ant
    tsicar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    03-10-2016 @ 11:05 PM
    Location
    isaan/south africa
    Posts
    2,895
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post

    i dont really fancy doing that, but how to go about not paying when everyone is paying is quite a problem.
    everyone else is NOT paying up front.
    if the guy can't run his business well enough to finance the start of his next project, and he builds your house the way he runs his business, i think you are in shit before you even started.
    you will find that these guys will start a project on your deposit, go quite well for a week or so, then slow down, probably not pitch up for a week or two. at that stage he is spending your money keeping the previous customer happy, by doing a few days' work, at your expense, cos he partied the first guy's money away. soon he will start another project, and do the same to that guy, occasionlly pitching up at your site to try keep you placated.
    the whole thing is just a great big pyramid scheme.

    ask him what materials he needs for the first stage, compare and negotiate prices, pay for the materials and have them delivered to site. let the builder pay his own labour, perhaps letting him have a little money,but always in arrears against his first scheduled "progress payment" according to progress made, to pay his staff from time to time until the first stage is reached, after which he must finance his own operation.

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    [quote=tsicar;1088005]
    Quote Originally Posted by wanna View Post

    ask him what materials he needs for the first stage, compare and negotiate prices, pay for the materials and have them delivered to site. let the builder pay his own labour, perhaps letting him have a little money,but always in arrears against his first scheduled "progress payment" according to progress made, to pay his staff from time to time until the first stage is reached, after which he must finance his own operation.
    yes this is what i had in mind. thanks for the advice and affirmation

  21. #21
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    So not only do you want him to build it for you, you want him to finance it as well and also be a quantity surveyor for your material orders, damn thats one hell of a guy you have found, especially as he also doesn't need plans or anything like that, maybe time to rethink what you expect from this guy.

  22. #22
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtydog View Post
    So not only do you want him to

    1. build it for you, you want him to
    2. finance it as well and also be a
    3. quantity surveyor for your material orders,
    4. damn thats one hell of a guy you have found, especially as
    5. he also doesn't need plans or anything like that, maybe time to rethink what you expect from this guy.
    hi DD

    4. nope havent found him yet
    5. yes i have architect plans currently, but not foundation and shop drawings
    1. have to find the right guy
    2,3. this part i'm not so sure whether it's the norm in thailand. for 2. maybe you could advise if some sort of deposit before commencement is the norm? for 3. whether the contractor should do some sort of cross-checking to ensure the amount of material calculated is adequate, even when he has the BOQ?

    thanks

  23. #23
    Thailand Expat
    splitlid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Last Online
    21-08-2019 @ 07:52 PM
    Posts
    1,044
    dear wanna, i think you really need to start from the beginning.
    firstly you need to get your archiect to sort out all the issues with your drawings, and supply you with the foundations and beams/columns etc. that will then be a 'full set' of working drawings.
    without these the builder cannot build the house!!! (well he may, but it will be wrong).

    secondly you need a boq, this can either come from you architect, or your builder.
    your builder may not give you a boq, especially as you are a labour only job.
    so you may have to do it yourself!!!!
    i know, i know, seems daunting doesnt it, but it is possible. start today by working out how many sqm of blocks you will need. post ya answer here.

  24. #24
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    Why should he check what materials you need when it is you that will be ordering them, if we reckon thats 15 hours work per week working out material orders etc why should he waste his time doing that when his time can be more profitably spent actually running the site?

    I don't no of any Thai contractor that will start building a house without a deposit, I am sure there must be some, you will find a few of the big farang building companies will start work without deposits etc, obviously their profit margins are higher so they can afford to do this, to start the job is just land clearing and digging holes, a bit of cement, some wood and a few blocks, so the initial deposit is only a small amount anyway, if the contractor was paying for materials I would say give him a down payment of 40k baht and with that he also gets the first delivery of rebar in for the girls to start putting together, next payment will be for more rebar and shuttering and the cement pours so probably another 40k baht would be needed.

  25. #25
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    04-07-2009 @ 02:12 PM
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by splitlid View Post
    dear wanna, i think you really need to start from the beginning.
    firstly you need to get your archiect to sort out all the issues with your drawings, and supply you with the foundations and beams/columns etc. that will then be a 'full set' of working drawings.
    without these the builder cannot build the house!!! (well he may, but it will be wrong).

    secondly you need a boq, this can either come from you architect, or your builder.
    your builder may not give you a boq, especially as you are a labour only job.
    so you may have to do it yourself!!!!
    i know, i know, seems daunting doesnt it, but it is possible. start today by working out how many sqm of blocks you will need. post ya answer here.
    hi splitlid

    1. for wallstones, i need 15m x 4m x 4 walls = 240m2

    2. similar amount for red bricks, but to get the number of red bricks, i have to find out the lateral surface area of each brick. then use 240m2 to divide by the surface area to get the number of bricks needed

    3. for floor area, aproximately 225m2 x 2(both storeys) = 450m2 of sandstone/marble/granite

    these are i think the superficial parts.

    1. more important is the m3 of sand, cement, stone.
    2. plus the length of water pipes with the associated number of t and u joints.
    3 and of course the rebar

    pls mark my answers

    thanks

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •