Thread: Airline News

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

The problem is that with all of this automation, pilots are relying on possibly erroneous digital readouts to understand the aircraft behaviour, and they don't always know what are the appropriate actions.

Which I think is the case here.

A possible consequence of moving to a 2-man crew. The lost third crew member, flight engineer, was responsible for knowing the aircraft systems inside out and many of them did.

As I mentioned earlier, I am not familiar with the detailed 737 modifications post 3/4/5 series so can't comment on the actual changes made.

Originally Posted by Troy

A possible consequence of moving to a 2-man crew. The lost third crew member, flight engineer, was responsible for knowing the aircraft systems inside out and many of them did.

The 737 has flown for over 20 if not 30 years with a two person cockpit..

^ I don't believe the 737 ever had an engineer station, certainly not from 300 series onwards. However, the point I was making was that aircraft systems have reached a level of complexity whereby the pilots are struggling to know all the systems. Perhaps stepping back to a 3-man crew, especially for certain airlines, might be a good approach.

Another Boeing crash, this time a 757.

Six passengers suffered non-life threatening injuries when a Canada-bound plane crashed shortly after take-off outside of Guyana's capital.

The Fly Jamaica flight made an emergency landing at Cheddi Jagan International Airport, in Timehri, at about 02:00 local time (06:00 GMT).

It had taken off not long before heading for Toronto.

The Boeing 757, carrying 126 people, including two infants, returned after experiencing hydraulic problems.

A spokesman for the airline said it "suffered an accident on landing", but all 118 passengers and eight crew were safe.

Guyana's Transportation Minister David Patterson said those hurt in the incident had been taken to hospital.


"They are all stable and are being looked at," he told reporters. "There were no reports of broken bones."

This is the second Boeing aircraft to crash in two weeks. A Boeing 737 MAX 8 operated by Lion Air crashed into the sea soon after take-off on 29 October, killing all on board.

Boeing said it was looking into the incident.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46154179

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand............. another Boeing goes up in smoke.

Air France Boeing-777 Makes an Emergency Landing in Irkutsk, Russia due to Smoke

11:27 11.11.2018(updated 11:38 11.11.2018)Get short URL



The plane was en route from Paris to Shanghai when the smoke appeared inside the aircraft.


An Air France Boeing 777 en route from Paris to Shanghai with 280 on board changed its course and made an emergency landing at the Irkutsk Airport in Russia after smoke appeared inside the plane.

The plane landed safely with the reason being smoke inside the aircraft. The reasons behind the incident are currently being investigated, a representative from the Irkutsk Airport told Sputnik. According to him none of the 280 people on board, including crew members, was hurt in the incident. All of the aircraft’s passengers have been settled in the airport and city’s hotels.



https://sputniknews.com/europe/20181...gency-landing/

Originally Posted by OhOh

Were there no ATC comms with the plane after they requested an emergency landing. Or have these all been scrubbed,per usual it seams.

Oh shut up with your fucking nonsense.

Originally Posted by aging one

The 737 has flown for over 20 if not 30 years with a two person cockpit..

One should be looking at only this particular model not the others. The others do not, allegedly, have the same systems.

Something seriously amiss when a twat like this can keep flying.

An Air India flight from Delhi to London has been delayed after the pilot of the carrier was found unfit to fly. Passengers of the Air India flight AI 111 to London have been left stranded at the Delhi airport.

The flight was delayed as the senior pilot and Director (Operations) Arvind Kathpalia failed the pre-flight breath analysis test for alcohol. The test deemed him unfit to fly.


"We have grounded Captain A K Kathpalia as he failed twice in the breath analyser test. He was to operate the London flight from New Delhi, but he failed to clear the pre-flight alcohol test," a senior airline official told news agency PTI.


"He was given another chance, but the second test was also found positive following which he was grounded," the official said.

Rule 24 of the Aircraft Rules prohibits crew members from partaking any alcoholic drink 12 hours prior to the commencement of a flight, and it is mandatory for him or her to undergo an alcohol test both before and after operating a flight.

Sources in Air India have said that Kathpalia is a repeat offender. The flying licence of the senior pilot was suspended for three months in 2017 for allegedly skipping a mandatory pre-flight medical test.

According to rules of the Directorate General of Civil Aviation (DGCA), a pilot who fails the breath analysis test must be suspended for three years.

He was appointed as the executive director of operations, a decision which was challenged by a pilot's association in the Delhi High Court. He was subsequently removed from the post.

However, he was later appointed to the post of director (operations) in Air India Ltd for a period of five years.

Kathpalia has previously been under investigation. He was suspended from flying for three months in February 2017. In August 2018, a Delhi court directed the police to lodge an FIR against the Air India pilot for alleged violation of Aircraft Rules, tampering with evidence and intimidating a doctor working with the airlines in January 2017.

According to the complaint filed by Indian Pilots Association, on January 19, 2017, Kathpalia was scheduled to operate a flight from New Delhi to Bengaluru and he proceeded to operate the flight without undergoing the mandatory pre-flight breath analyser test.

Later, even at Bengaluru, he refused to undergo a similar test.

When he returned to New Delhi, he allegedly went to the pre-flight medical examination room and made a false entry in the pre-flight breath analyser examination register for the flight he had operated.

Kathpalia also issued threats and intimidated Dr Nitin Seth, DDCA's doctor on duty, coercing him to retract his statement given in inquiry conducted by the DGCA, where he had alleged that the Captain had manipulated the record in the register.

It was also alleged that there was a violation of Aircraft Rules apart from tampering of evidence, coercive intimidation.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/stor...278-2018-11-11

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

Oh shut up with your fucking nonsense.

Whilst ever you continue to mock the absence of the pilots "chats" during this disaster, you will be questioned. You illustrate a marked disregards for airline passenger's safety.

Not a position one, who purports some knowledge of the industry, should hold.

The pilots and passengers are dead and hence cannot speak for themselves. Boeing Corp has he resources internally and externally to suggest anything they wish, to protect themselves and their shareholders, it doesn't automatically prove their currently held position is the correct one.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Whilst ever you continue to mock the absence of the pilots "chats" during this disaster, you will be questioned. You illustrate a marked disregards for airline passenger's safety.

Not a position one, who purports some knowledge of the industry, should hold.

The pilots and passengers are dead and hence cannot speak for themselves. Boeing Corp has he resources internally and externally to suggest anything they wish, to protect themselves and their shareholders, it doesn't automatically prove their currently held position is the correct one.

Look you fucking moron, they had the ATC recordings before they even found the FDR. It's common procedure.

How the fuck can Boeing scrub Indonesian ATC comms? Let alone it being "per usual".

It might be the sort of thing your Russkie or Chinky pals might do to cover their arses, but it is virtually unheard of in air accident investigations.

If you can't offer anything useful to the conversation, STFU with your stupid waffling.

Originally Posted by OhOh

Whilst ever you continue to mock the absence of the pilots "chats" during this disaster, you will be questioned. You illustrate a marked disregards for airline passenger's safety.

Not a position one, who purports some knowledge of the industry, should hold.

The pilots and passengers are dead and hence cannot speak for themselves. Boeing Corp has he resources internally and externally to suggest anything they wish, to protect themselves and their shareholders, it doesn't automatically prove their currently held position is the correct one.

Going to be hilarious if you spout any of this shit when you get to the USA. TD does get the kind of posters that have no other place to espouse their views. Which is a given because they are wack jobs..

Originally Posted by aging one

Going to be hilarious if you spout any of this shit when you get to the USA. TD does get the kind of posters that have no other place to espouse their views. Which is a given because they are wack jobs..

The whack is strong in that job.

Originally Posted by harrybarracuda

but it is virtually unheard of in air accident investigations.

TWA Flight 800


Former investigators 'break silence' about NTSB cover-up of TWA Flight 800 crash - NY Daily News

The investigators - in a conference call promoting an upcoming documentary, "Flight 800" - charged the original probe ignored testimony from nearly 700 eyewitnesses and included evidence tampering.

https://nypost.com/2016/07/04/was-tw...sive-cover-up/

Author Cashill doesn’t offer a definitive alternate cause, but the strongest portion of his book are reprints of multiple witness statements, taken by the FBI and CIA in the immediate aftermath. Over 700 of these have since been made public; in them, 258 witnesses told investigators they’d seen a streak of white light approaching the aircraft before the explosion. A few witnesses used the word “rocket” or “missile” in describing what they saw.

https://www.amazon.com/TWA-800-Crash.../dp/B01F1G7LOA




https://www.amazon.com/Downing-TWA-F.../dp/0821758292




https://www.c-span.org/video/?414407-1/jack-cashill-discusses-twa-800

Jack Cashill talked about his book TWA 800: The Crash, the Cover-Up, and the Conspiracy, in which he takes a critical look at the official story surrounding the crash of TWA flight 800, which went down in the Atlantic Ocean on July 17, 1996. [video at C-Span link]



Do not question what the "authorites"(and their corporate media mouthpieces) tell you or you risk being labeled a wack job. I don't fucking care anymore if I'm thought of as a wack job.

Sick of the lies...

That's OK, people that write these fucking fairy stories rely on mugs like you to line their pockets.

Originally Posted by SKkin

TWA Flight 800

Closer to this case, in terms of aircraft, would be the Boeing reluctance to accept there was an issue with the 737 rudder causing several losses with rudder reversal and hard-over. e.g. Colorado Springs Flight 585.

The CVR doesn't just record the Pilot mics, there is also a cockpit mic that records cockpit sounds such aural warnings and stab trim motor, It has been a useful crash investigation aid in many investigations. However, with 737 grandfather rights, I'm not sure what FDR and CVR information is available for the Max.

Originally Posted by Troy

Closer to this case, in terms of aircraft, would be the Boeing reluctance to accept there was an issue with the 737 rudder causing several losses with rudder reversal and hard-over. e.g. Colorado Springs Flight 585.

The CVR doesn't just record the Pilot mics, there is also a cockpit mic that records cockpit sounds such aural warnings and stab trim motor, It has been a useful crash investigation aid in many investigations. However, with 737 grandfather rights, I'm not sure what FDR and CVR information is available for the Max.

Except Boeing have virtually admitted the problem and are probably going to try and parlay it into poor pilot training.

With today's tech they should never need to search for a FDR. Cockpit voice/video + systems/controls/displays + every other aspect of the plane's performance and condition could easily be relayed to the ground in real time; only a matter of time before some smart guy makes millions figuring that out. While the FDR records up to 700 parameters on a commercial airliner, this is nothing in digital terms and can be sent in packets every few seconds from first move to standstill.

The CVR is another joke, as it runs on a continuous 30-minute loop; what if a critical situation arises in the cockpit 31 or more minutes before the plane actually goes down? And even Boeing have probably hear of video.

CVR record time has been 2 hours since 2003.

Originally Posted by jabir

With today's tech they should never need to search for a FDR. Cockpit voice/video + systems/controls/displays + every other aspect of the plane's performance and condition could easily be relayed to the ground in real time; only a matter of time before some smart guy makes millions figuring that out. While the FDR records up to 700 parameters on a commercial airliner, this is nothing in digital terms and can be sent in packets every few seconds from first move to standstill.

Already discussed: The airlines don't want to spend the money, and the FAA are in the airlines collective pocket.

Originally Posted by Troy

CVR record time has been 2 hours since 2003.

Uh, google answers said 30 mins as of 2016...bastards!

Another one almost bites the dust, no deaths reported

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel...-a8629491.html

Originally Posted by david44

Another one almost bites the dust, no deaths reported

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel...-a8629491.html

“Being an Embraer 190 pilot myself, I think they probably turned it off and on again,” wrote “SigWit”.
“That usually fixes any problem on the plane.”

Really?